The mag tube cover is very robust and hasn’t loosened over two range sessions so far.Originally Posted by Pnut
The mag tube cover is very robust and hasn’t loosened over two range sessions so far.
How did they manifest?
There are generally two that show up, usually related to ammunition more than anything else.
Failure to eject - bolt is partially back, shell is stuck between the ejection port and the bolt. Often this is longways, occasionally it resembles a "stovepipe"
Action - Run the bolt vigorously. In some less common cases you may have to grab the shell itself and pull it out while holding the bolt back.
Failure to feed - Bolt has ejected the spent shell, but did not move far enough back to activate the lifter properly.
Action - Run the bolt vigorously.
Both manifest most often on the 1301 due to ammo. I had a client on Sunday who brought Winchester AAA extra-light birdshot loads to run in his brand new 1301. To my great surprise, the gun only experienced three stoppages (spooky, huh!), each was a click on an empty chamber because the bolt had moved enough to eject the spent shell but not far enough to activate the lifter. The client was new to push/pull and so each of the instances where the gun failed to feed were instances where he flubbed or forgot the push/pull technique, experienced more than normal recoil and let the gun move too much.
The 1301 is so forgiving on what it will run that ammo that's on the bubble will seem like it's working just fine most of the time where in other shotguns they will immediately shut down and refuse to run. They make it obvious that you shouldn't be using that ammunition. The 1301 is remarkably un-Italian in how accommodating it is with things it does not like.
3/15/2016
With a quality carbine or pistol, you can count on at least a thousand or more rounds without a stoppage provided proper cleaning, lube, and quality ammo. What kind of reliability can you expect out of a 1301 or other good autoloading shotgun in those terms?
Most of my pistols and rifles easily surpass 2000 mean rounds between stoppages.
Shotguns aren't ARs or Glocks.
Shooting any gun through a case of ammunition without lubrication isn't the best way to guarantee reliable function. It is abusive...and acknowledged as such when Todd put it out there in the 2,000 round challenge for pistols.
Every gun runs better when it has been properly lubricated. A 1301 will easily digest the onboard ammunition supply and a full side saddle without issue even if it is bone dry.
Shotguns leave more fouling in the gun than pistols or rifles do just by nature of how they work.
I've gone more than 1,000 shells without cleaning in my 1301 shotguns. I would add lubrication during that period because I wanted the gun to work properly and lubrication aids in reliable function. I've had the gun out in heavy rain where pretty much any lubrication has been washed out of the gun entirely and it's still run through a couple of hundred shells without problem.
So if you insisted on doing it, it's highly likely your 1301 will go through 1,000 shells without cleaning or lubrication. The prize you'd win at the end of that process is a really unpleasant cleaning job that will take a ridiculously long time. And the gun would likely be a bit difficult to disassemble since the piston would want to get stuck to the magazine tube after the gun had cooled down.
I clean my 1301's once a year, generally around the holidays when my shotgun instruction is basically done for the year. I shoot them and clients shoot them all year in classes. I would like to run a bore snake through the guns when I'm done with a day's use at the range, but I'm usually far too busy trying to maintain safety at the end of the class, coordinate cleanup, packing the range back up, and interacting with clients to be able to proactively punch the bore on my guns. My day starts at something like 4:30 AM and ends usually after midnight the next morning when drive time and everything else is factored in so cleaning my shotguns is the last thing I'm worried about.
My guns work splendidly. But cleaning them requires putting on protective gear just due to the sheer amount of crud I'm scrubbing off of them after that kind of use.
Why do that to yourself if you don't have to.
3/15/2016
You can get wood (butt stock and forend) from beretta that will fit the comp or tactical, but your looking at a $600+ price from beretta ($400 buttstcok $200 handguard) and more expensive if you do even wood from a custom maker. To me that’s not worth the cost.
Yes the 1301 is the same gun internally as the A400 with cheaper furniture.
Oh, I don’t mean 1-2k without cleaning or lube. At the very least, lube. I mean 2k with proper cleaning and lubrication.
I’ve been kind of feeling like itd be more frequent to fumble working a pump action in a stressful situation than for a quality autoloading shotgun with good ammo and lube to have a stoppage. Would you say that’s correct?
Tactical shotguns are the poverty tier of shotguns. $600 for wood furniture is pretty cheap when you start to consider $5k to $10k shotguns. $600 for handmade wood furniture sounds pretty reasonable, especially if it is adjustable.
Yeah, those are just the wood equivalent of the plastic stock without adjustable cheek risers or anything, just the standard shim system. Also, they might be hand finished, but I’d bet dollars to donuts they’re churned out on machines in the beretta factory.
But for anyone interested Beretta has them on sale for $500 right now.
https://www.beretta.com/en-us/gun-ac...a-no-kickoff-/
Assuming you don't try to feed it ammo it hates...which you kind of have to work at with a 1301...easily. You won't even need to replace the magazine spring in that round count, most likely.
A reliable semi-auto like the 1301 will feed itself reliably...except when the ammo doesn't work right or the user makes a mistake. I see user-induced stoppages on even good semi-autos because people don't know the manual of arms well enough.I’ve been kind of feeling like itd be more frequent to fumble working a pump action in a stressful situation than for a quality autoloading shotgun with good ammo and lube to have a stoppage. Would you say that’s correct?
A pump gun requires someone to run it properly. But it is simpler to run properly.
I don't see a significant advantage of one over the other for most people. It's about choosing what subset of problems you want to have. Most of the pump gun short stroking problems that exist are there primarily because pump guns come with stocks that are too long and force normal sized people into positions where they can't reliably deliver power on the pump. Once that is resolved and they learn to run the pump properly problems are usually few and far between.
Put it another way, I see less short-stroking of a pump gun in class than I see people who get their fingers in the way of the bolt closing properly when they hit the bolt release on a semi-auto.
A high quality semi-auto like the 1301 is going to digest a larger number of shells without parts breakage than an 870 or Mossberg 500/590. It will be easier to keep the bore clean enough so patterns aren't impacted due to the chrome lining. Etc. So if one is looking to put volumes of shotgun shells downrange the highest quality semi-autos are a better bet. It's not just speed that keeps most serious 3 gun users and clay busters running high quality semi-autos. High volume clay shooters will tend to migrate to break action guns simply because they don't have as many parts and thus don't break as often as repeating shotguns.
A high end Perazzi or Beretta over and under is probably about as reliable as it gets for shotguns. But they're not terribly useful for self defense. (Although you could do worse than a cut down over/under for defensive use. Even the DEA used a Beretta over and under for some missions)
Now if someone's stature makes a pump not work well for them because they are too small, a semi-auto is a significant upgrade in reliability for them. I see those on occasion as well.
Last edited by TCinVA; 11-16-2022 at 07:33 PM.
3/15/2016
When you flipped your 2563, does it rotate once you seat the mag tube cover?
I have the GGG 2565 mount. When it's mounted "correctly" there is a scalloped portion that sits right up against the barrel to prevent rotation. If I flip it like yours, it'll rotate since the scalloped part is facing the wrong way.
Last edited by shootist26; 11-16-2022 at 08:23 PM.
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