Lives of Mentally Ill, Police Collide

[Chuck Haggard]

Can you give me a synopsis of this?

National model; http://www.nami.org/template.cfm?section=cit2 and http://www.citinternational.org/

At my job; http://www.topeka.org/tpd/cit.shtml


Memphis;
http://www.memphispolice.org/crisis%20intervention.htm


It grieves me that a bunch of LE agencies are not yet on board with this idea.

Hell, one of my buds near where Tam lives replied "What's that?" when I mentioned the number of excited delirium cases we have had over the past year. Seriously? It's 2013, people need to get some training.

[Tamara]

Hell, one of my buds near where Tam lives replied "What's that?" when I mentioned the number of excited delirium cases we have had over the past year.

Srsly? 'Cause we had a classic right here in Naptown not too long back.

[Chuck Haggard]

Srsly? 'Cause we had a classic right here in Naptown not too long back.

Yup, serious as a heart attack. But he is in a well known hole of a town just about an hour north of you.

[fixer]

The "on the street" issues with the modern mental health "system" are off the chart. People outside of LE, jailers or mental health folks have very little idea how broke the system really is.

I can only imagine...However I've had my own run in with a "mental healther" with a large butcher knife at a friend's church... and because of it, I can seriously empathize with Todd's comments above.

After the incident was over, I asked the officers what was gonna happen and they simply indicated "not much." He will be processed and then probably released unless they can get a homeless shelter to take the guy.

[ToddG]

I don't carry a less lethal option.

This.

I wouldn't criticize someone for carrying OC but the vast majority of people running around with pepper spray have no idea what it's like to be in the vicinity when it goes off, especially indoors. Most of those same folks also have far, far too much confidence in the efficacy of OC.

[jlw]

Private citizens have no duty to detain a mental subject. They have the option to leave. In many cases, badge-toters just don't have that option.

In my own personal experience that there is a lot more pucker factor going through the door with a pick-up order for a mental evaluation than there is for a arrest warrant. It's even worse when it is a field contact and all of the decisions are squarely on the back of the responding cop.

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On another note, I am not one that believes in the efficacy of OC for ending violent encounters.

[BLR]

Adrenaline, or in the case of the handicapped/mentally ill a poorly working neurological feedback system, can be a very potent factor. Which can render lethal or less lethal options for the instance at hand, ineffective. My mind returns to DocGKRs example of the dude in the hallway soaking up a chest full of 45s finally being put down by an 870 IIRC.

The physiology and psychology of the handicapped/mentally ill do not mesh well with "normal" people.

[JFK]

Adrenaline, or in the case of the handicapped/mentally ill a poorly working neurological feedback system, can be a very potent factor. Which can render lethal or less lethal options for the instance at hand, ineffective. My mind returns to DocGKRs example of the dude in the hallway soaking up a chest full of 45s finally being put down by an 870 IIRC.

The physiology and psychology of the handicapped/mentally ill do not mesh well with "normal" people.

In the article one of the example shooting states the officer fired twice, but the subject advanced still, leading the officer to believe he missed, and fired twice more. I am just so shocked at the "movie" ideas that some of the comments garnered. Not to get too far off topic, but he shot hime twice, then twice again, and popular opinion thought that was excessive.

If I was scared and defensive, I think I would have shot more. 2 rounds + 2 rounds seems very hesitant to me, unless you guys are trained that way.

[Chuck Haggard]

In the article one of the example shooting states the officer fired twice, but the subject advanced still, leading the officer to believe he missed, and fired twice more. I am just so shocked at the "movie" ideas that some of the comments garnered. Not to get too far off topic, but he shot hime twice, then twice again, and popular opinion thought that was excessive.

If I was scared and defensive, I think I would have shot more. 2 rounds + 2 rounds seems very hesitant to me, unless you guys are trained that way.

Could be, but I don't know anyone who is trained that way. Much more likely that the officer was hesitant to use force and risked their own safety trying to use less than more. That is way more common in LE circles than most people know.