Ghost lettering and/or minimally marked vehicles for traffic stops

Am I the only one who doesn’t get the whole fad of having patrol vehicles with “ghost lettering”?

For those of you who don’t know what Ghost Lettering is, it’s a particular style of lettering where you almost have to be directly perpendicular to the broad side of a patrol car to be able to read the writing.

Here in Georgia we have a section of our code which dictates that any vehicle used for traffic enforcement must be conspicuously marked.

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O.C.G.A. 40-8-91

(a) Except as provided in subsection (b) of this Code section, any motor vehicle which is used on official business by any person authorized to make arrests for traffic violations in this state, or any municipality or county thereof, shall be distinctly marked on each side and the back with the name of the agency responsible therefor, in letters not less than four inches in height.

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The code section goes on to talk about marking requirements for the state patrol and a few other tidbits.

So then today I see this on Facebook for a Sheriff’s Department I mean OFFICE (had to Jlw).

Attachment 29724
Attachment 29725

It does conform to the requirements set forth by O.C.G.A. 40-8-91

My gripe is this:

There are plenty enough incidents of folks impersonating officers using their own rigged up unmarked cars, why add to the confusion? I would think some admin would step back and go “For the safety of our officers and the public, let’s have our traffic units marked so as there’s no mistaking them for a potential impersonator”.

The last part of of 40-8-91 states:

(f) An otherwise lawful arrest shall not be invalidated or in any manner affected by failure to comply with this Code section.

The law is meaningless.

That aside, I see no reason to be sneaky. I've published in the paper, put up electronic signs along the road, and sent out Nixle alerts as to where we were running speed detection and still had deputies run through a ticket book in less than an hour and get people at more than 30MPH above the limit.

The issue that I seen with agencies doing such things is that ultimately it leads to either bad statutory or case law.

I'm not LE.

Where should a citizen draw the line on when it is appropriate to pull over for a vehicle that is not distinguishable as a marked car?

I'm not a fan of unmarked cars or officers out of uniform.

I'm really curious for the rationale here. One municipality near me does this and often has people not stop for them. I've had a few yellow light runners go past my home and continue driving until the second, marked, vehicle shows up.

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Originally Posted by littlejerry

I'm not LE.

Where should a citizen draw the line on when it is appropriate to pull over for a vehicle that is not distinguishable as a marked car?

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Neither am I and that's a real good question. Maybe find the closest public area with lots of people or traffic just like if you were meeting someone to sell something? If that's not an option, maybe call the local PD or 911 to see if it's legit first? Just don't make it look like you're trying to run.

I like my police cars to be conspicuously marked and easily distinguishable. Not so I can hide or stop whatever nefarious activity I'm engaged in but because if I need a cop, I don't want to have to guess which cars is his!

Follow the $$. When folks see a bright yellow Crown Vic with search lights atop they tend to slow down and obey the rules for a short stint. That means no ticket. No idea how effective tickets are at changing driving habits, so I can’t comment on what’s more effective keeping people safe from speeders. But it’s hard to justify stuff to political hacks without stats.

Personally, I don’t like the ghost marks, nor the use of common paint colors and schemes for anything other that UC work, and plain clothes guys. There are plenty of folks out there who impersonate cops and do bad things to folks unfortunate enough to stop for them. Why make that easier? Why not make it insanely easy to prove criminal intent/pre meditation with the whole he had to paint his car bright pink and blue polka dots...

Want to issue tickets, use remote radar/laser with camera and have a visibly marked cruiser issue the ticket down the road.

Better yet, get more officers in vehicles visible from orbit patrolling on a more routine basis. Maybe tell chiefs, colonels, majors and all the other office staff to get in a car for half the day.

The first issue I have is for the safety of the officers. IF you are out of the car on a traffic stop, or investigating an auto accident, or just about any call for service for that matter, the marked vehicle helps to prevent other drivers from hitting your vehicle and/or you.

I haven't done traffic enforcement in over 20 years (it never really has been my thing), but from what I remember, you really didn't need ghost markings on your car to find traffic violations.

Note: I work plainclothes for a federal agency, so with regards to patrol tactics/practice, the basis for my opinion might stem for reasons closer to a regular joe than a cop. Another way of putting it is that I don't know jack squat about uniformed patrol operations.

With that being said, I don't like the idea of unmarked vehicles for patrol, and I absolutely despise the idea of plainclothes cops conducting routine traffic stops. Reason being pretty much what you guys have already touched on.

There's a reason that when conducting enforcement ops, it's common for federal agencies to ask for local uniforms to assist. At my last job on the warrant squad, we did it pretty much every time we hit a house. A trooper I talked with at one point had performed countless "directed stops" for feds, and after a spate of highway robberies by plainclothes cop impersonators they seemed unequivocally supportive of doing such. They "got it", and didn't consider it a nuisance.

Even when stopping at houses to conduct interviews in smaller towns, I usually at least called the local PD (if not stopped by for a call history/introduction) to let them know where we were, who we were, what we were doing, and our contact info....and then I'd check out with them at the end. My best friend (prior cop for 8 years in a very aggressive anti-crime plainclothes unit) thought it was a little weird at first, but the local PDs always appreciated the heads up (as well as it showing some sort of deference/respect) and my buddy really got the point when somebody called the cops on us during a field stop. "No, mister, it's okay. Yes, we know who they are, they're real federal agents, and it's probably in your best interest to open the door and talk to them." After that he started doing the same thing.

All of this is just to point out that there are certain considerations to being of reduced profile in LE operations, and it behooves us and IMO better serves the community for us to be as easily ID'd/verifiable as possible. I don't see any reason that routine traffic duties should be performed by an unmarked car, but I might be missing something given I'm not a street cop and would appreciate any input on the pros outweighing the cons.

As a profession, I build police vehicles for a living. I've done so since 1997. Witnessed the swap from rotators, to halogen to LED's, to now the 4th gen LED's.

The first 'low profile' vehicle I built was without a lightbar, and all hide-aways; something mainstream and common today, but for the early 2000's.....whew!!!!!:cool:

"Now a days", we install lightbars only about 40% of the time, the rest is the low profile style.

Recently, the ghosting of the lettering is becoming very popular, well at least here in NH. NHSP and a few others have 'ghost vehicles' that mostly patrol highway and interstates.

A lot of it is black vehicles, with retro reflective black lettering and emblems.


Y'all be safe out there.

No need to be sneaky.

I used to sit on the side of the freeway with my lights on, and could tag speeders all day long at a minimum 30mph over. People would get so pissed and think I was pulling a fast one on them, because I was on the side of the road, with my lights on and running radar.

This has always been a bur under my saddle. A patrol vehicle should be highly visible for several reasons: deterrence by way of visible presence and quick recognition by the public. In other words, the bad guys need to know the cops are around and the good guys need to be able to recognize a cop if they need one. If there's one thing I've learned in a quarter century of uniformed patrol work it's this: the general public largely moves through life with their heads up their ass. If you want to catch traffic violators you don't need an unmarked car to do it. You can paint your cruiser tangerine orange with lime green door panels and most of them won't see you until it's too late. In twenty seven years I've made exactly one stop in an unmarked car. I was in plain clothes and driving an unmarked car at the time, while going home from an assignment. The only reason I made the stop was due to the hazardous nature of how the vehicle was being driven. It was one of of those, "stop it now before it kills someone" situations. As soon as I was able I radioed for a marked unit and handed it over to them. The whole process made me very uncomfortable and I felt strangely exposed the whole time.

Officers themselves like unmarked cars and low profile graphics because they think they look cool and tough. They may give you some kind of bull shit tactical excuse, but that's really the underlying answer if we're being honest. They like cruisers that look tough and blacked out because they fall victim to the cool kid syndrome just like everyone else.

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Originally Posted by Trooper224

Officers themselves like unmarked cars and low profile graphics because they think they look cool and tough. They may give you some kind of bull shit tactical excuse, but that's really the underlying answer if we're being honest. They like cruisers that look tough and blacked out because they fall victim to the cool kid syndrome just like everyone else.

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The worst offenders near me have some pretty badass looking cars. I get that appeal. Black on black is fucking cool as hell, no doubt about it.

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Originally Posted by orionz06

The worst offenders near me have some pretty badass looking cars. I get that appeal. Black on black is fucking cool as hell, no doubt about it.

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It certainly is, but we're there to protect and serve, not look cool as hell.

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Originally Posted by txdpd

No need to be sneaky.

I used to sit on the side of the freeway with my lights on, and could tag speeders all day long at a minimum 30mph over. People would get so pissed and think I was pulling a fast one on them, because I was on the side of the road, with my lights on and running radar.

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I saw a guy do that last night. I slowed and pulled into the opposite lane, as required by state law.

Another driver did neither (and he was going a *lot* faster than I was as well). And the trooper promptly pulled out and pulled him over.

That kind of Karma makes me giggle.

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Even when stopping at houses to conduct interviews in smaller towns, I usually at least called the local PD (if not stopped by for a call history/introduction) to let them know where we were, who we were, what we were doing, and our contact info....and then I'd check out with them at the end. My best friend (prior cop for 8 years in a very aggressive anti-crime plainclothes unit) thought it was a little weird at first, but the local PDs always appreciated the heads up (as well as it showing some sort of deference/respect) and my buddy really got the point when somebody called the cops on us during a field stop. "No, mister, it's okay. Yes, we know who they are, they're real federal agents, and it's probably in your best interest to open the door and talk to them." After that he started doing the same thing

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That’s our SOP for out of town operations. It’s surely better for the local agency and you if it hits the fan they know you’re there. I don’t know how E-calls I’ve heard about men with guns at so and so that turned out to be plainclothes cops doing an operation where no notifications were made.

And that includes my own agency in our city where all it takes is a radio transmission on the patrol districts channel.

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Originally Posted by TAZ

Follow the $$. When folks see a bright yellow Crown Vic with search lights atop they tend to slow down and obey the rules for a short stint. That means no ticket.

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Has not been my experience. Plenty of HUA drivers don't notice me until long after I'd have ticketed them if I cared to.

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Originally Posted by Trooper224

You can paint your cruiser tangerine orange with lime green door panels and most of them won't see you until it's too late.

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Yup.

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Originally Posted by Trooper224

It certainly is, but we're there to protect and serve, not look cool as hell.

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You can do both. Like it or not, LE needs to be a bit sexy if you want to recruit. I don't think anybody in LE is experiencing an increase in recruiting.

Anyway, I don't see the big deal for traffic enforcement, particularly highway patrol. Impersonators aren't pulling people over during rush hour or in construction zones. At night in a more rural area? Different considerations. Our state police have used Mustangs, white trucks that look like DOT trucks for construction zone enforcement, and even ridden in the cab of tractor-trailers and radioed marked units. It's never been an issue, and it's certainly not new here. Need a cop? In the day and age of cell phones I'm having a hard time thinking the best plan is to drive around looking for a marked car.

Not something I have strong feelings about either way. Now sedan vs SUV...that's a more interesting question we're going to have to answer now that Ford's done with the Interceptor.

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Originally Posted by BehindBlueI's

Has not been my experience. Plenty of HUA drivers don't notice me until long after I'd have ticketed them if I cared to.



Yup.



You can do both. Like it or not, LE needs to be a bit sexy if you want to recruit. I don't think anybody in LE is experiencing an increase in recruiting.

Anyway, I don't see the big deal for traffic enforcement, particularly highway patrol. Impersonators aren't pulling people over during rush hour or in construction zones. At night in a more rural area? Different considerations. Our state police have used Mustangs, white trucks that look like DOT trucks for construction zone enforcement, and even ridden in the cab of tractor-trailers and radioed marked units. It's never been an issue, and it's certainly not new here. Need a cop? In the day and age of cell phones I'm having a hard time thinking the best plan is to drive around looking for a marked car.

Not something I have strong feelings about either way. Now sedan vs SUV...that's a more interesting question we're going to have to answer now that Ford's done with the Interceptor.

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The big deal? Ever dealt with local and district courts concerning their opinions of such things and experienced how such perceptions effect their professional judgements? Ever fought with state legislators over budgetary issues and experienced how their perceptions of such things effect their votes? If you'd ever done any of those things you might see the deal, or have stronger feelings about the issue.

There are plenty of ways to increase the visual appeal of an agency without appealing to the inner man child of prospective applicants.

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Originally Posted by BehindBlueI's

Has not been my experience. Plenty of HUA drivers don't notice me until long after I'd have ticketed them if I cared to.



Yup.



You can do both. Like it or not, LE needs to be a bit sexy if you want to recruit. I don't think anybody in LE is experiencing an increase in recruiting.

Anyway, I don't see the big deal for traffic enforcement, particularly highway patrol. Impersonators aren't pulling people over during rush hour or in construction zones. At night in a more rural area? Different considerations. Our state police have used Mustangs, white trucks that look like DOT trucks for construction zone enforcement, and even ridden in the cab of tractor-trailers and radioed marked units. It's never been an issue, and it's certainly not new here. Need a cop? In the day and age of cell phones I'm having a hard time thinking the best plan is to drive around looking for a marked car.

Not something I have strong feelings about either way. Now sedan vs SUV...that's a more interesting question we're going to have to answer now that Ford's done with the Interceptor.

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If an unmarked Mustang or white DOT truck tried to pull me over... I wouldn't. Would you pull over for an ice cream truck? A UPS truck? Would you want your wife or daughter to? At some point you cross a line. For me that line is clear markings on the vehicle and recognizable uniforms.

In my city we have a designated traffic car painted white with ghost lettering. On limited access roadways (no place to pull over and do stationary work) this car rules. Much easier to find distracted drivers, red light violations... When the ghost car is behind you with it's lights on you can't tell it from a marked cruiser. except for the light bar but there are so many lights on the ghost car it's still hard to tell the difference.

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Originally Posted by Sammy1

In my city we have a designated traffic car painted white with ghost lettering. On limited access roadways (no place to pull over and do stationary work) this car rules. Much easier to find distracted drivers, red light violations... When the ghost car is behind you with it's lights on you can't tell it from a marked cruiser. except for the light bar but there are so many lights on the ghost car it's still hard to tell the difference.

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Wait, you actually pull over distracted drivers?

That would be amazing if that shit actually happened around here.

In my experience, I was much more successful in finding meth and thieves at night with the black/ghosted slick top than I have been with my “new” reflective striped crown Vic. Observation of known drug locations was a lot easier too.

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Originally Posted by littlejerry

If an unmarked Mustang or white DOT truck tried to pull me over... I wouldn't. Would you pull over for an ice cream truck? A UPS truck? Would you want your wife or daughter to? At some point you cross a line. For me that line is clear markings on the vehicle and recognizable uniforms.

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They are in uniform. State law says one or the other to write tickets, marked car or uniform. Non-traffic enforcement (ie a traffic stop but for a theft suspect) doesn't require either. Do whatever your big enough to get away with, but it's not caused a bunch of issues here. A vehicle with emergency lights and sirens? Yeah, I'd pull over. I'm not scared of an impersonator if it turns out to be one.

Yes, I'd want my wife to pull over for the ISP Mustangs or F-150s as I'd rather she not go to jail for felony fleeing or get a ticket for failure to yield. Again, the answer might be different in different circumstances. I'm not real worried about impersonators working rush hour traffic for some nefarious reason.

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Originally Posted by fwrun

In my experience, I was much more successful in finding meth and thieves at night with the black/ghosted slick top than I have been with my “new” reflective striped crown Vic. Observation of known drug locations was a lot easier too.

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When we first merged with the sheriff's dept we went to gray cars with a black stripe package so we wouldn't have city white or county brown with the "new" department. Guys loved them for alley creeping. They lasted a few years, then we went back to white and a much simpler gold stripe package because $$$.

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Originally Posted by BehindBlueI's

Impersonators aren't pulling people over during rush hour or in construction zones. At night in a more rural area? Different considerations.

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Originally Posted by BehindBlueI's

I'm not real worried about impersonators working rush hour traffic for some nefarious reason.

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Why the focus in your commentary on rush hour traffic?

Impersonators don't only operate in rural areas at night. Impersonators have been impersonating LEOs in broad daylight. Just because it doesn't happen in rush hour traffic....or better put, hasn't happened in your area......doesn't mean that it has not happened in the US or will not happen in your area. It's certainly happened in other areas of the country, so I don't see how, "yeah but it hasn't happened here" is a reasoned response to an obviously bad idea with known consequences.

Wow, who would have ever thought there would be so much discussion on unmarked and/or ghost stripped vehicles.

I have driven marked vehicles, motors, and now an unmarked vehicle. We have a ghost vehicle in the budget and I hope it’s mine. In N.C., it doesn’t matter if an unmarked or marked vehicle is behind you...you need to pull over. Worried about a BL bandit? Call 911, turn on your hazard lights, and slow down until you get to where you “feel” safe :rolleyes:.

While attending a class in Georgia I was driving my unmarked and one of the guys from Georgia asked why I had a radar. I told him to write tickets! LOL. He told me that in Georgia local municipalities couldn’t stop anyone on an unmarked vehicle unless it was a serious felony...otherwise the had to get a marked unit to stop a car. However, he stated that GSP could have unmarked...? I couldn’t understand why a state agency could and a local agency couldn’t...politics?

Whatever. If you really do not want to be seen jump onto a motor. Emergency Lights on with siren blaring they will not see you. Drivers do not see motor cops...they just assume it’s a regular motorcycle.

Unmarked/ghost stripped vehicles have their uses. I’d rather have a ghost graphics car than an unmarked simply because at night it can be seen better. As has been stated most people don’t pay enough attention to notice if you’re marked...but an unmarked cruiser grabs almost no attention... especially from violators who are looking for a glimmer of sun reflecting from a bar light or a reflection from stripping at night, etc.

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Originally Posted by Beat Trash

the marked vehicle helps to prevent other drivers from hitting your vehicle and/or you.

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Only if they're sober and paying attention, which are rare conditions these days.

One city here has ghost marked units for the traffic unit, but they seem to work only as a unit, meaning 4-5 cars, and they favor a few speed trap areas. On main thoroughfares traffic moves at 10-20mph over the posted limits with impunity. The SO traffic/DUI cars are marked, and I see them make a lot more stops. This might have nothing to do with markings and everything to do with the ambition, or lack of it, of the officers/deputies.

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Originally Posted by TGS

Why the focus in your commentary on rush hour traffic?

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Because that's where the ISP Mustangs that I was referencing are used. Day time traffic enforcement. DOT trucks, construction zones. They don't use the unmarked at night.

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Originally Posted by TGS

Impersonators don't only operate in rural areas at night. Impersonators have been impersonating LEOs in broad daylight. Just because it doesn't happen in rush hour traffic....or better put, hasn't happened in your area......doesn't mean that it has not happened in the US or will not happen in your area. It's certainly happened in other areas of the country, so I don't see how, "yeah but it hasn't happened here" is a reasoned response to an obviously bad idea with known consequences.

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Oh we've had impersonators. Some people have even been robbers. None of them were driving a Mustang, pickup truck, etc. They were in Crown Vics or SUVs made to look like police vehicles. More often then not they had some BS "uniform" on as well. Security guards and volunteer firefighters seem to be drawn to it more often then other professions, for some reason. However that's the element being missed here. You want to play odds/stakes then get actual data on which is more likely to be the impersonator...and it's one that looks mostly like a "cop car" for the area.

Local impersonators:

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The woman says she stopped after what looked like a police car came up behind her with lights and sirens on.

The driver was wearing a campaign hat but took it off before getting out to talk to her.

She says she felt even more uneasy when she noticed his belt only had a holster on it and the pistol looked fake.

His badge also just said "sheriff" and he didn't give his name, asking her instead, "Do you know what you did wrong?"

The woman took off when the man told her to get out of the car for refusing to hand over her ID.

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And this genius who showed up at a police funeral for one of my department's fallen offices and claimed to be with our department:

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In police uniform, with a badge and a duty belt with firearms holstered, Nguyen...a black 2012 Dodge Charger equipped with a siren, flashing lights and a two-way radio

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And these guys (along with another that's now defunct) doing traffic stops, etc.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Dewv4RcdQpE

So, yeah. I'm not worried about the Mustangs, F-150s, etc. and in the 20 years of their use (June of 1988 was when the Mustang program started) I know of zero issues related to the program and it's been successful enough for multiple changes in brass and political leadership to keep it going. I also understand that realistically I'm not going to get out and examine the markings on the door and the black/white Crown Vic is more likely to be an impersonator than someone buying an ice cream truck and putting lights on it. Oh, and for those passing through Indiana, Conservation officers have green and black trucks and SUVs and they are real cops who can really pull you over, write tickets, arrest, etc.

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Originally Posted by KeeFus

Wow, who would have ever thought there would be so much discussion on unmarked and/or ghost stripped vehicles.

I have driven marked vehicles, motors, and now an unmarked vehicle. We have a ghost vehicle in the budget and I hope it’s mine. In N.C., it doesn’t matter if an unmarked or marked vehicle is behind you...you need to pull over. Worried about a BL bandit? Call 911, turn on your hazard lights, and slow down until you get to where you “feel” safe :rolleyes:.

While attending a class in Georgia I was driving my unmarked and one of the guys from Georgia asked why I had a radar. I told him to write tickets! LOL. He told me that in Georgia local municipalities couldn’t stop anyone on an unmarked vehicle unless it was a serious felony...otherwise the had to get a marked unit to stop a car. However, he stated that GSP could have unmarked...? I couldn’t understand why a state agency could and a local agency couldn’t...politics?

Whatever. If you really do not want to be seen jump onto a motor. Emergency Lights on with siren blaring they will not see you. Drivers do not see motor cops...they just assume it’s a regular motorcycle.

Unmarked/ghost stripped vehicles have their uses. I’d rather have a ghost graphics car than an unmarked simply because at night it can be seen better. As has been stated most people don’t pay enough attention to notice if you’re marked...but an unmarked cruiser grabs almost no attention... especially from violators who are looking for a glimmer of sun reflecting from a bar light or a reflection from stripping at night, etc.

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GSP has to be marked for traffic. The same code referenced in the OP has specific sections which dictate how GSP has to be marked.

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Any motor vehicle, except as hereinafter provided in this subsection, used by any employee of the Georgia State Patrol for the purpose of enforcing the traffic laws of this state shall be distinctly painted, marked, and equipped in such manner as shall be prescribed by the commissioner of public safety pursuant to this Code section.

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The above is just a small portion.


As others have noted, some folks are oblivious enough to not pay attention if you’ve got a billboard telling them the po-po are right there in a bright neon car.

I get unmarked has its uses, but for a plain ole traffic stop it seems unnecessary.

Columbus, GA PD pissed off the locals recently by dressing up officers as “construction crew” and standing at the corner of a busy intersection and radioing the marked units to grab distracted drivers.

More than one way to skin a cat and all.

It’s been over 8 years since I’ve had a marked car or worn a uniform. I’ve stopped many cars in my unmarked wearing blue jeans and a T-shirt, but we wear our raid vests. Normally, if we’re stoping someone, its for an interdiction or pre-textual stop, and all the bad guys know what’s up when the bearded-police are stopping them.

For us to do a “normal” traffic stop, it would have to be for something pretty serious, but I’ve never had anyone not stop for me (because they thought I was an impersonator) or question who I was during the stop.

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Originally Posted by KeeFus

While attending a class in Georgia I was driving my unmarked and one of the guys from Georgia asked why I had a radar. I told him to write tickets! LOL. He told me that in Georgia local municipalities couldn’t stop anyone on an unmarked vehicle unless it was a serious felony...otherwise the had to get a marked unit to stop a car. However, he stated that GSP could have unmarked...? I couldn’t understand why a state agency could and a local agency couldn’t...politics?

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That officer didn't understand the law. There is absolutely nothing in GA giving the GSP the authority to make stops in an unmarked car but not municipalities. The applicable code section is published in the OP.

The only difference is this:

https://thatweemsguy.com/2010/09/20/...eed-detection/

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Originally Posted by jlw

That officer didn't understand the law. There is absolutely nothing in GA giving the GSP the authority to make stops in an unmarked car but not municipalities. The applicable code section is published in the OP.

The only difference is this:

https://thatweemsguy.com/2010/09/20/...eed-detection/

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So why will the GA legislature not allow LE agencies to use unmarked vehicles? I don’t get it. Blue light bandit from way back? Did Lester Maddox not like LE?

Locally, NCSHP has a fleet of unmarked vehicles used for speed enforcement. We have several as do just about every jurisdiction in NC. Wake county (Raleigh) even had a corvette for speed enforcement, among other things.

Just an ignorant, softass civvie mouthing off here, but I assume all Dodge Challengers are LEO until proven otherwise, just as I assumed all crown vics were back in the 80s.


The 300hp version of the Focus would be a heck of an LEO stealthmobile.

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Originally Posted by KeeFus

So why will the GA legislature not allow LE agencies to use unmarked vehicles? I don’t get it. Blue light bandit from way back? Did Lester Maddox not like LE?

Locally, NCSHP has a fleet of unmarked vehicles used for speed enforcement. We have several as do just about every jurisdiction in NC. Wake county (Raleigh) even had a corvette for speed enforcement, among other things.

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It's government. It doesn't have to make sense.

I have a challenge:

We will have three cars: a "ghost" marked police car, a marked police car (with light bar in the windshield), and an unmarked police car.

You will drive on the roadway and one of these cars will activate their lights and sirens behind you. You must figure out which car it is before the Officer exits the vehicle.

I predict an accuracy rate of 33%.

What type of paint used on the side of the car is irrelevant. Very few departments have anything facing forward identifying them as police vehicles, aside from their lights. I've seen cars that have "POLICE" in backwards letters at the top of the windshield....but it is impossible to see at night due to the brightness of the emergency lights.


If you get stopped by a vehicle and you feel something is weird, call 911. Dispatch will be able to verify the stop. The Officer, when he approaches, should have a badge visible and identify himself and his department in the initial contact. "I'm Officer Jones from the Nifty Police Department. You were stopped for XYZ. May I have your driver's license and insurance, please". He may or may not be in full uniform, depending on his assignment. Fugitive hunters, for instance, often will be in "plain" clothes so they can blend in when they're doing their jobs. When they take official action, they should have something identifying themselves as officials visible.

Our biggest problem with police impersonator’s vehicles are police agencies that let their old vehicles go to auction without removing the lights and controllers, and cutting the wiring harnesses. It’s not that impersonators’ cars look like police cars, it’s that their cars are police cars.

We've had problems with serial rapist posing as cops over the years. If they are in cars it's always been equipped police vehicles bought from auction.

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Originally Posted by txdpd

Our biggest problem with police impersonator’s vehicles are police agencies that let their old vehicles go to auction without removing the lights and controllers, and cutting the wiring harnesses. It’s not that impersonators’ cars look like police cars, it’s that their cars are police cars.

We've had problems with serial rapist posing as cops over the years. If they are in cars it's always been equipped police vehicles bought from auction.

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Agreed, especially since the crown vic is still the universal "cop car". We've seen some dumb ones - had one kid who was using an app on his iphone that blinked blue and red, and he would just hold it up in his windshield. Had another guy with construction-like yellow and red lights that was pulling people over in a police t-shirt, no badge, and an uncle mike's holster. I can see where people who see cops once a year might doubt, but for those of us in the business it's glaringly obvious they're not legit.

PS: In Texas, ask the Officer to see his department ID. It will have their picture, badge of office, title, and a "TCOLE PID" number on it, usually on the back. They should be carrying it.

Everyone's operating under the assumption that "ghost-lettering" and all the other cool-guy cop-car stuff discussed here has a stack of well-thought-out reasons attached to it.

Having observed various law enforcement administrators up close for a couple of decades, I'm pretty sure a lot of places went with these marking schemes because Chief Bob or Sheriff Bill, from the next county or town over got one, and damn, does it look cool. Therefore, they need some just like it.

Local Sheriff's department here has a habit of using unmarked cars to sit at problematic intersections to....prevent accidents, catch speeders unaware? I'm not sure of the rationale, but we all know what the unmarked cars look like now.

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Originally Posted by Baldanders

Just an ignorant, softass civvie mouthing off here, but I assume all Dodge Challengers are LEO until proven otherwise, just as I assumed all crown vics were back in the 80s.


The 300hp version of the Focus would be a heck of an LEO stealthmobile.

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I figure you mean Chargers. Around here if it's got a spoiler, it's almost certainly not an LE car. If I'm curious if it's a pace car or not, I look at the plate before passing. Unmarked cars often still have police plates, and if not there's a sorta-secret way to tell if it's a gov't registered car. When I was in Investigations I had an unmarked but it had a police plate and a spot light, plus the LEDs mounted on the fenders, visible in the windows, etc. Stevie Wonder could see it was a police car. People would still be retarded around me in traffic.

I took the family on a day trip today and saw ISP snagging folks near a rest stop with an unmarked gray Charger. It lights up like a damn UFO, any impersonator using one is going to have to have a decent budget for lights. Then on the way back traffic went from the normal 10 over to the speed limit. Some tinted out black Crown Vic with antennas in the slow lane. I knew it wasn't a police car because nobody here runs all those antennas any more. Saw the plate, knew it wasn't a pace car, and got back to the "real" speed limit.

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Originally Posted by Horseman

Everyone's operating under the assumption that "ghost-lettering" and all the other cool-guy cop-car stuff discussed here has a stack of well-thought-out reasons attached to it.

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I think very few of us are laboring under that assumption. Particularly the cops. We've worked for our bosses for awhile, you know.