AR closed triggers icing up in Winter?

Do ARs perform better in Winter with "open triggers" than with "closed triggers?"

I'm referring to the sidewall material on the replacement trigger - there's less sidewall material, for instance, on a Geissele SSA trigger than on on a CMC Trigger. For the purpose of this question I'd consider the Mil Spec and the Geissele SSA an open trigger and the CMC and others closed. (I'm not referring to "Wide Open Triggers" brand.)

Can the closed trigger walls trap snow and ice and cause more malfunctions than an open trigger would? I'm genuinely curious.

I recall a discussion many years ago about triggers in hunting rifles freezing up in Alaska. The then-open trigger on the Winchester M70 was judged superior to some other models because of that. (The current Winchester M70 has a closed trigger, however, though, interestingly, FN Patrol Bolt Rifle M70 kept the traditional open trigger.)

This is conjecture based upon one internet forum thread probably 15 years ago. It sounds reasonable, but a lot of misinformation starts with that phrase.

The triggers you’re referring to are usually called cassette type triggers. No idea on your question other than the SSFs we had at my last unit we’re never a point of discussion. Lube was the bigger one but everything is freezing at that point.


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Originally Posted by Jaywalker

Do ARs perform better in Winter with "open triggers" than with "closed triggers?"

I'm referring to the sidewall material on the replacement trigger - there's less sidewall material, for instance, on a Geissele SSA trigger than on on a CMC Trigger. For the purpose of this question I'd consider the Mil Spec and the Geissele SSA an open trigger and the CMC and others closed. (I'm not referring to "Wide Open Triggers" brand.)

Can the closed trigger walls trap snow and ice and cause more malfunctions than an open trigger would? I'm genuinely curious.

I recall a discussion many years ago about triggers in hunting rifles freezing up in Alaska. The then-open trigger on the Winchester M70 was judged superior to some other models because of that. (The current Winchester M70 has a closed trigger, however, though, interestingly, FN Patrol Bolt Rifle M70 kept the traditional open trigger.)

This is conjecture based upon one internet forum thread probably 15 years ago. It sounds reasonable, but a lot of misinformation starts with that phrase.

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Cassette triggers in ARs are susceptible to many issues. They trap fouling and other debris causing malfunctions at a higher rate so it’s no a great stretch to see them trapping moisture and freezing Uptmore quickly.

Garand Thumb has a couple videos where is sprays down rifles (and pistols) to simulate a submersion in sub zero weather and then sees if they function after a cold soak. While far from a “scientific” study (and GT admits that), ARs do not fair as well as some other designs with selectors being prone to freezing up and not even getting as far as pulling the trigger. Not sure what triggers he was running in his guns but my hunch from his videos is an AR will face a lot more issues before trigger is one of them. By contrast the AK platforms did pretty well and they have what you would call an “Open Trigger” so take that for what it is worth….

It seems definitive - avoid cassette-type triggers, and not just for the possibility of freezing-up in Winter. I see a Geissele SSA in my near future.

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Originally Posted by Jaywalker

It seems definitive - avoid cassette-type triggers, and not just for the possibility of freezing-up in Winter. I see a Geissele SSA in my near future.

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The advantage with this is the fact the Geissele’s are probably the most proven triggers by far other than the mil-spec.

I have several cassette triggers of varying flavors with no issues, but none of these are likely to be filled with junk and frozen. If I ever thought my weapon might be filled with junk and frozen, I'd have Geissele or Larue in there.

Update: I did purchase and insert a Geissele SSA trigger. The recent sale was just too good to overlook.

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Originally Posted by Jaywalker

Update: I did purchase and insert a Geissele SSA trigger. The recent sale was just too good to overlook.

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Yeah - you really can’t go wrong with this.

I’m seeing SSAs selling today for what I paid for my G2Ss a few years back.

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Originally Posted by Suvorov

Yeah - you really can’t go wrong with this.

I’m seeing SSAs selling today for what I paid for my G2Ss a few years back.

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I thought about a G2S (and the ALG ACT), but I finally decided to go with the more-completely-inspected SSA.

I might as well put this here, for those few people who don't already know how to install a Geissele trigger: installing the SSA was easy. Removing the old MilSpec trigger was moderately difficult. I thought I was going to have to loosen the pistol grip in order to gain some wiggle room in the safety. When I went looking for a pistol-grip-loosener, a friend popped the old trigger out in 10 seconds without having to loosen anything.

FWIW, he pushed down on the front of the Mil-Spec trigger, which levered it up against the safety obstruction, then rotated the safety, which dragged the end up and past the obstruction. Easy-peasy, it was out, and my jaw dropped.