.22 TCM as a low recoil defensive cartridge

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12-09-2019, 10:32 AM
spyderco monkey

.22 TCM as a low recoil defensive cartridge

Lately I've been thinking about "what caliber and gun for recoil sensitive shooters." The elderly, some women, and just those who don't deal well with recoil being the target demographic.

And looking at it, it really seems like .22 TCM would be one of the best off the shelf options for a low recoil defensive pistol.

Using a 4" barrel as a velocity basis, we get the following:

.22 TCM = 40gr @ 2000fps = 355 ftlbs / Power Factor 80

.380 = 90gr @ 1000fps = 200 ftlbs / Power Factor 90

9x19 = 124gr @ 1150fps = 364 ftlbs / Power Factor 142

9x19 = 147gr @ 1000fps = 326 ft/lbs / Power Factor 147

With a power factor of 80, .22 TCM would have a bit less recoil then .380, and 45% less recoil them 9x19, while still retaining comparable energy to 9x19. This is born out by reviews, all of which comment favorably on the low recoil of .22 TCM.

In terms of ballistics performance, while we don't have much data, the data we do have is encouraging:
http://mousegunaddict.blogspot.com/2...ugh-clear.html

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v3...psd488b35f.jpg

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v3...ps7e5e6f30.jpg

https://i.ibb.co/d5wwT1t/Screen-Shot...7-15-35-AM.png

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7UZWRsUXZWc

The round produces good penetration and reliable expansion, even through 4 layers denim - something we typically dont see with .380. And of course, thats using the absolute cheapest projectiles possible. Loaded with a 40gr Gold Dot or Federal Fusion JSP, and expansion would likely be even better.

As far as ammo costs, .22 TCM JHP is going for around $0.29-$0.30 per shot. Thats more then 9x19 FMJ, but less expensive then 9x19 JHP. Its right at the point where it would be economically viable to use JHP as your primary training ammo.

The other advantage - especially for women or the elderly - is that the low recoil of the .22 TCM results in a correspondingly light weight recoil spring. Standard Glock is 16lbs; .22 TCM Glock conversion kit uses an 11lb recoil spring, making it that much easier to rack the slide. Similar in concept to the Shield EZ in that regard.

All in all, I think the .22 TCM would make for a really promising alternate caliber for low recoil shooters.

I'd personally love to see a 4" slimline pistol chambered in .22 TCM. Something like the Glock 48, or Kahr TP9:
https://i.ibb.co/XjBcXRx/TP9-NOVAK.jpg
12-09-2019, 12:06 PM
BehindBlueI's

I suppose the counterargument is the .380 is available in a lot more guns the target demographic is more likely to carry or shoot. Are there affordable options the target demographic is willing to invest in, and what's the incentive over something like the Shield .380? Ammunition for a .380 is readily available at brick and mortar locations and there's plenty of data on how it deals with bone, etc. I wonder how many people who couldn't handle a .380 in a given gun could handle the .22 TCM instead? That's a fairly narrow envelope, I think.

I'm not saying it's not an option, just that it seems like an uphill argument.
12-09-2019, 12:38 PM
peterb

How’s the noise and muzzle blast? a quick search found this:

“Recoil was next to negligible, but the muzzle blast was more than magnificent. Fireballs of .44 Mag. proportions were generated, but there was no intense pressure slap in the face. More importantly, I was hitting what I aimed at.”

https://www.shootingillustrated.com/...tcm-cartridge/

Blast tends to increased the impression of recoil, especially for inexperienced shooters.

It does sound fun. :-)
12-09-2019, 02:06 PM
BehindBlueI's

Quote:

Originally Posted by peterb

How’s the noise and muzzle blast? a quick search found this:

“Recoil was next to negligible, but the muzzle blast was more than magnificent. Fireballs of .44 Mag. proportions were generated, but there was no intense pressure slap in the face. More importantly, I was hitting what I aimed at.”

https://www.shootingillustrated.com/...tcm-cartridge/

Blast tends to increased the impression of recoil, especially for inexperienced shooters.

It does sound fun. :-)

I've shot one but it's been awhile. It's a hoot at 100y steel since it's traveling so fast. I don't remember the noise or muzzle blast one way or the other so I left that metric out.
12-09-2019, 04:34 PM
Tokarev

An interesting little cartridge.

Ballistically it looks pretty close to the 5.7X28. One is a stretched out .25 ACP case (the 5.7) while the other is a chopped and trimmed .223 (the TCM). One would have an advantage of higher mag capacity with the other would have the advantage of a smaller grip.

Down side to both is lack of ammo followed by lack of guns. As far as I know, RIA is the only source for .22 TCM pistols outside of having something custom made. And ammo, again as far as I know, is only available from Armscor. The FN is no better although there is a slightly better selection of ammo.

I read somewhere recently that FN had always purposefully kept Five SeveN production to a minimum to keep prices up and market demand high. I don't know if that's true or not. More likely is the gun is oddball enough that higher production rates aren't really needed.
12-09-2019, 10:06 PM
Baldanders

By the same logic, tbe .32NAA (which I poo-poohed here recently) might make sense too, in a PM9 sized gun.

Sans giant fireball, and with more ammo availability, and a PM9-like platform...sure, I'm with you.
12-10-2019, 08:31 AM
Tokarev

Quote:

Originally Posted by Baldanders

By the same logic, tbe .32NAA (which I poo-poohed here recently) might make sense too, in a PM9 sized gun.

I've never messed with the .32 NAA but I do find the little cartridge somewhat interesting. Would a .32 NAA JHP bullet out-penetrate a similar bullet in .380? And would the expanded .32 expand to more than .355" inches?

Here's really the only thing I've ever seen on the .32 NAA. I assume you've seen this?

http://www.brassfetcher.com/Handguns.../32%20NAA.html

And a possible source for barrels:

https://shop.innovativearms.com/prod...ersion-barrel/
12-10-2019, 08:48 AM
the Schwartz

Quote:

Originally Posted by Tokarev

I've never messed with the .32 NAA but I do find the little cartridge somewhat interesting. Would a .32 NAA JHP bullet out-penetrate a similar bullet in .380? And would the expanded .32 expand to more than .355" inches?

Here's really the only thing I've ever seen on the .32 NAA. I assume you've seen this?

http://www.brassfetcher.com/Handguns.../32%20NAA.html

And a possible source for barrels:

https://shop.innovativearms.com/prod...ersion-barrel/

I wish that Brassfetcher would have provided a little more data than what existed in the linked article. Average recovered diameter, retained mass, and impact velocity along with a video of a test in 10% ordnance gelatin would have been nice to see.
12-10-2019, 08:57 AM
Tokarev

Quote:

Originally Posted by the Schwartz

I wish that Brassfetcher would have provided a little more data than what existed in the linked article.

Indeed. Not much meat there.
12-10-2019, 06:48 PM
Velo Dog

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oN0J...e070&index=226

http://www.brassfetcher.com/Ballisti...20Gelatin.html

http://www.brassfetcher.com/Ballisti...20Gelatin.html

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