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Dropkick
05-12-2011, 08:38 AM
One of the skills that I would like to improvement on is weak hand shooting. It's part of my dry-fire routine, but I often find myself being disappointed with my performance on the range. However, I found the article below online last night. It's from 2002 and I would like to know if it is still current and useful advice. Are there other techniques?

"The Hidden Strength of the Weak Hand" by Andy Kemp
http://midwesttraininggroup.net/wp-content/uploads/2010/06/WeakHand.pdf

Some excerpts:

"If you are in only one gunfight in your life and you need to use your weak hand, then 100 percent of your gunfights required you to shoot with your weak hand."

"Why is it that training one hand makes the other stronger at the same task?"

"Shooting a few rounds weak hand only at each range session will get you on the right path. Regularity is more important than launching boxes of ammo downrange in one session."

"curl the thumb down and crush the grip in a fist. This is a stronger hold and will prevent you from limp-wristing. The dominant hand is in a tight fist, palm up, tight against your chest. Ideally, the gun side leg should be forward with your shoulder forward off your hip, putting more of your body weight into the recoil. Lock the elbow!"

"the sights will not be aligned with your eye. Either bring the chin to the shoulder or slightly cant the can to correct this."

"One of the great secrets of weak hand training is "mirror image" shooting. It's just what it sounds like... reverse the roles of your strong and weak sides and your stance and hold will look like a mirror image of your normal shooting stance."

ToddG
05-12-2011, 08:50 AM
Unless you have a neurological issue with your weak hand, there is nothing more involved in becoming a good WHO shooter than there was to become a good SHO shooter.

Unfortunately, many people start to get serious about WHO well after they've achieved some proficiency with their 2H (and possibly SHO) shooting and they mistakenly believe that their WHO shooting should be up to par. It won't be. Start from scratch. Think about how long it took you to reach a point where hitting a 3x5 @ 7yd was easy 2H. Go slowly. Build up fundamentals.

In a sense, teach yourself to shoot all over again.

In the end, it's all about the same thing: holding the sights steady on target while you press the trigger without disrupting your sight picture.

Tamara
05-12-2011, 09:05 AM
Y'know, I have to wonder about the advisability of learning all your WHO (and SHO, too) with the empty hand "in a tight fist, palm up, tight against your chest".

Sure, it improves your shooting, but wouldn't the main reason you'd find yourself shooting one-handed be because your other hand was busy holding something? Or all shot up?

JV_
05-12-2011, 09:13 AM
but wouldn't the main reason you'd find yourself shooting one-handed be because your other hand was busy holding something? Or all shot up?

Many folks grab their collar with the weak hand to prevent it from dangling. I've been though some pretty bad shoulder dislocations (required a doctor intervention), and I instinctively did that to relieve pressure on the joint.

I don't do it while shooting SHO.

Dropkick
05-12-2011, 09:18 AM
In a sense, teach yourself to shoot all over again.
That's pretty much what it sounds like. Guess it's time to do the work.


Sure, it improves your shooting, but wouldn't the main reason you'd find yourself shooting one-handed be because your other hand was busy holding something? Or all shot up?
Yes, I noticed this the first time I tried out flashlight techniques during live fire. Being able to shoot SHO helps a lot with many methods.

41magfan
05-12-2011, 12:36 PM
Y'know, I have to wonder about the advisability of learning all your WHO (and SHO, too) with the empty hand "in a tight fist, palm up, tight against your chest".

Sure, it improves your shooting, but wouldn't the main reason you'd find yourself shooting one-handed be because your other hand was busy holding something? Or all shot up?

That's a marksmanship technique that may or may not be useful in a real world event.

A good friend of mine had to end a gunfight WHO after having sustained a .357 Magnum hit to his strong hand in the initial exchange of gunfire. (Kinda like the FBI Miami thing ....)

It's fairly common for someone to get injured in the hand and/or arm that's holding the gun (especially handguns) since it's ususally inline with body mass - which tends to be the focus of incoming fire.

Tamara
05-12-2011, 12:43 PM
Yeah, for years, I always did the "fist-clenched-to-chest" thing because I'd seen it in the magazines and lots of other people did it, and it really did help. And then in a class, it was pointed out to me that I might not have that aid available in real life. (Not to name names, but this piece of advice was preceded by the phrase "Here's a clue for you...")

So it's a habit I've been trying to break myself of, but I still find myself unconsciously reverting to it under any kind of pressure or if I'm not paying attention. :eek:

41magfan
05-12-2011, 12:54 PM
I don't think the technique is necessarily a bad thing, it's usefulness just needs to be kept in some relative context. Like many other techniques, it's practice can easily become the end, instead of the means to an end.

As a side note, doing something with your "flailing fin" becomes much more critical when you're moving, whereas the "fist on chest" thing is generally practiced when the shooter is static.

MDS
05-12-2011, 02:25 PM
I'm spending a lot of my dry-fire time WHO and SHO, experimenting with ways to get the most out of limited practice time. The first thing I've noticed is that when I do a drill SHO and WHO first, I do really well when I go to 2H. So my routine usually involves doing a drill SHO, then WHO, then 2H.

The second thing I'm realizing is that "uncomfortable" positions make the drills harder, too. Inspired by Slavex's TactiCat dry-fire aid, I've been experimenting with various silly things. I'm not ashamed to admit I did some reps of Wall Drill last night while balancing a book on my head. Specifically, I was working on keeping my head up, since I have a strong tendency to tilt it down and look at the target through the very tops of my eyes. But all these awkward positions seem to challenge the fundamental movements in different ways, and I can't imagine that mixing it up that way would do any actual harm.

My conclusions are that a) confidence in your SHO and WHO shooting opens up a lot of options in a real-world situation, whether it's to hold your light, carry your child, or whatever; b) at least for me, practice SHO and WHO also helps my 2H shooting; and c) therefore, SHO and WHO shooting should be a significant (25%? 50%?) of my practice.

That said, I don't do nearly as much SHO or WHO in live-fire as I do in dry-fire. Need... more... range time!

jthhapkido
05-12-2011, 03:02 PM
Yeah, for years, I always did the "fist-clenched-to-chest" thing because I'd seen it in the magazines and lots of other people did it, and it really did help. And then in a class, it was pointed out to me that I might not have that aid available in real life. (Not to name names, but this piece of advice was preceded by the phrase "Here's a clue for you...")

So it's a habit I've been trying to break myself of, but I still find myself unconsciously reverting to it under any kind of pressure or if I'm not paying attention. :eek:

I'm thinking that is actually a good thing, really. :) (Unconsciously reverting, that is.)

If you _are_ needing your other hand to do something such as block or grab, it isn't likely that you'll just stop and fold your arm in. (Seriously---under stress you are going to reach out toward a close opponent anyway.)

Given any other situation (even if wounded) given a choice, pinning the other limb to your body is going to 1) give you the best stability for shooting, and 2) not leave anything wounded hanging out.

You may not be able to pin your other arm in, whereupon it isn't an issue. :) Practicing doing it for all other circumstances isn't going to hurt anything, IMO.

Tamara
05-12-2011, 04:15 PM
You may not be able to pin your other arm in, whereupon it isn't an issue. :) Practicing doing it for all other circumstances isn't going to hurt anything, IMO.

That's a good point, actually.

Al T.
05-12-2011, 05:24 PM
Interesting this thread came along. My nephew does not have a right hand (amputation) and wants to shoot. One goal of mine for the summer is to shoot a few matches and many practice sessions left handed only, using a rig set up for his needs. I need to get that skill set down so I can work with his issues.

As regards the chest grab with the non-firing hand, Tom Givens made the point that if you could get that second hand to support the firing hand or arm, do so. But for his one handed drills, he wanted the non-firing hand down by the side to simulate grievous damage.

JodyH
05-13-2011, 10:28 PM
Jeff Gonzales stated something to the effect of, if you can hold your hand against your chest, you can get it on the gun.
My own experience with taking a round to the left forearm was that I had zero use of that arm. It was dead weight.
I've broken a lot of bones in various endeavors and very rarely was that appendage able to support itself after suffering trauma (with the gun shot being the worst).

WDW
05-20-2011, 01:44 AM
With regards to One Hand Shooting in general, an instructor once told me to cant the shooting hand slightly inward to give a more natural alignment of the arm and therefore steadier hold. Any input on this technique? Just thought I would mention it because I hadn't seen it mentioned yet.

Al T.
05-20-2011, 07:57 AM
Seems to be a matter of individual body mechanics. Works for some folks, not for others. :)

IMHO, best to try for yourself and see what works.

Dropkick
05-23-2011, 01:46 PM
With regards to One Hand Shooting in general, an instructor once told me to cant the shooting hand slightly inward to give a more natural alignment of the arm and therefore steadier hold. Any input on this technique? Just thought I would mention it because I hadn't seen it mentioned yet.

I found myself doing this for weak handed shooting at first, but now know other ways to help correct the sight picture and manage recoil... so I've been trying to figure out which way works best.