TSA: Thugs Saving America...One Wounded Marine at a Time....

[BaiHu]

http://losangeles.cbslocal.com/2013/07/10/only-on-cbs2-wounded-marine-says-he-was-humiliated-by-state-capitol-security-airport-tsa/


When Kemnitz entered the capitol building he said security guards asked him to remove his blue uniform jacket “because he was wearing too much metal,” referring to his Purple Heart and other medals.

The Pasadena resident explained to the guards that his injuries made it difficult to take off his jacket.

“At first, I was a little shocked and then it went to ridiculous,” Kemnitz said. “It’s almost like they wanted to make a show, like we will search anybody, we don’t care.”

Patti Martin, of the Veterans Resource Center, was traveling with the wounded Marine and took pictures of the encounter.

“They never asked for his military ID to verify whether he was a veteran, if that’s what they were worried about, and they took him to the side, and the way they were patting him down, it was so obvious, as if he was a potential terrorist,” Martin said.

[EMC]

http://losangeles.cbslocal.com/2013/07/10/only-on-cbs2-wounded-marine-says-he-was-humiliated-by-state-capitol-security-airport-tsa/

Well veterans are on the DHS watch list so why wouldn't they profile us?

[TGS]

FWIW........I don't get it.

We're subject to the same measures as any US Citizen. We are not a special class of citizen. We do not hold special privileges over a plebian class. In addition, how about we just let anyone in uniform stroll around doing whatever they want wherever they want, because, gosh, "He's in uniform! How dare you question him!"....it's not like evil persons would ever take notice and use such to their advantage.

Not to mention, if a veteran finds it so disturbing to be patted down for security......well, maybe they can think about all the security checkpoints overseas and massive amounts of cultural faux pas that we've conducted in the name of COIN, yet I've never heard these same veterans speak out against those.

IMO, the appreciation veterans have been shown over the past decade, as opposed to Korea or Vietnam, is quickly becoming an excuse for bullshit just like the "race card." I've personally observed a growing sense of entitlement among military persons, as they read Starship Troopers and suddenly think themselves as a pillar of society deserving special privileges. 1) It's called "service to the nation" for a reason, 2) This is the reason that our founding fathers warned of large standing professional armies. This country was a nation of citizen soldiers until the 1950's, and that's how it should be.

/rant.

[Shellback]

http://www.killthehydra.com/wp-content/uploads/let-us-touch-your-penis-tsa-meme.jpg

[BaiHu]

FWIW........I don't get it....
/rant.

I totally get your point, I'm just always surprised at the treatment of soldiers that are clearly wounded like this guy and this guy (http://www.armytimes.com/article/20130319/NEWS/303190021/Hunter-TSA-8216-humiliated-8217-Marine-wheelchair).

Especially when you're being honored...does no one ask for an invitation or ID and then have a photo/ID registry of guests who are being honored at the Capitol?? Is that some kind of Alien technology?

I get taking security seriously, but seriously, if you need to take it that seriously, ID the guy first, check a list second and then recognize the limitations of the person in front of you. /retort :p

In short, take a page out of Road House:

"Ask him to walk. Be nice. If he won't walk, walk him. But be nice. If you can't walk him, one of the others will help you, and you'll both be nice. I want you to remember that it's a job. It's nothing personal."

ETA: LMFAO Irish!!

[TR675]

IMO, the appreciation veterans have been shown over the past decade, as opposed to Korea or Vietnam, is quickly becoming an excuse for bullshit just like the "race card." I've personally observed a growing sense of entitlement among military persons, as they read Starship Troopers and suddenly think themselves as a pillar of society deserving special privileges. 1) It's called "service to the nation" for a reason, 2) This is the reason that our founding fathers warned of large standing professional armies. This country was a nation of citizen soldiers until the 1950's, and that's how it should be.

Interesting viewpoint and, I believe, a correct one.

On occasion I've observed a similar attitude among a minority of the LEOs I've met and known.

[Kyle Reese]

FWIW........I don't get it.

This country was a nation of citizen soldiers until the 1950's, and that's how it should be.



Would you support a return of National Service?

[TGS]

Would you support a return of National Service?

I'm sort of divided on that one. I think it makes a whole lot of logical sense, but at the same time I'm not sure if I agree that mandating service among free men and women should be part of our social contract.

[WobblyPossum]

As a veteran myself, I have absolutely no problem with veterans having to go through the same travel hassles that non-veterans do. Now, giving a guy trouble because he can't raise his arm over his head for that stupid full body scanner? That I have a problem with. There is absolutely no reason for that.

[Suvorov]

I'm sort of divided on that one. I think it makes a whole lot of logical sense, but at the same time I'm not sure if I agree that mandating service among free men and women should be part of our social contract.

This.

I will also add that one of the primary reasons our military is so good is that everyone in it are volunteers and professionals. I was amazed at how lack luster many of the German conscripts I came across in Germany were, but it is hardly surprising. Two years is just about enough time to get a soldier (at least a tanker) up to the point that they knew their job. A one year conscription? Why even bother. Four year conscription - that is going to be a whole lot of mouths for the military to feed and what are we going to do with them? Non-military national service? Maybe an option and it in theory it could be really beneficial, but do we really think that the folks in Washington would or could turn the theory into a reality? Just look at Americorps.

Then there is the whole thing about freedom. I am not the constitutional scholar that many of you are, but I can no see how compulsory service to the government (AKA the people) would not be 180 degrees contrary to the ideas drafted by our founding fathers.

[PPGMD]

Ok here is the question, they have concierges to get Wounded Warriors through security, but what about people with similar injuries that aren't military? I have to budget an extra 20 minutes to make it through security due to my prosthetic.

I stopped going through the scanner as my leg sets it off anyways so I submit to the groping, that takes about 5 minutes, during which I typically have four people ask me to take my shoes off (I have to explain that in order to do that the leg has to come off which is prohibited) Then at certain airports (like MCO) I spend a good 10 minutes waiting for the TSA to find someone that was trained on the Castscope, then a second person to witness since it was in a private room, and finally through the half a dozen useless scans (it wouldn't be where I would hide a weapon, and at a higher power level than the other scanners as they penetrate carbon fiber) all the while the scanner crashed twice. And to top it off they had no clue what they were looking at since my foot is an uncommon one I had to explain to them how it worked.

I don't complain to the media, I don't complain to my congress critter every time (they are well aware of my dislike of the TSA), or the President. Hell I don't even complain to the TSA unless they deviate from their required procedures in a negative way. Until Congress gets rid of the TSA there is nothing that I can do unless they violate their procedure. But if the process sucks for military with physical issues, then the process equals sucks for civilians with physical issues, shouldn't we fix the process instead of giving military special security exceptions?

And don't give me the "they are military so they are unlikely to be a security threat," I can think of four military terrorists that collectively killed 183 people off the top of my head.

[hufnagel]

Would you support a return of National Service?


I'm sort of divided on that one. I think it makes a whole lot of logical sense, but at the same time I'm not sure if I agree that mandating service among free men and women should be part of our social contract.

I've got my opinions on this but yes, I think there should be a service requirement for all citizens. I especially think there should be a service requirement for all persons applying for citizenship.

[hufnagel]

This.

I will also add that one of the primary reasons our military is so good is that everyone in it are volunteers and professionals. I was amazed at how lack luster many of the German conscripts I came across in Germany were, but it is hardly surprising. Two years is just about enough time to get a soldier (at least a tanker) up to the point that they knew their job. A one year conscription? Why even bother. Four year conscription - that is going to be a whole lot of mouths for the military to feed and what are we going to do with them? Non-military national service? Maybe an option and it in theory it could be really beneficial, but do we really think that the folks in Washington would or could turn the theory into a reality? Just look at Americorps.

Then there is the whole thing about freedom. I am not the constitutional scholar that many of you are, but I can no see how compulsory service to the government (AKA the people) would not be 180 degrees contrary to the ideas drafted by our founding fathers.

I "hear" what you're saying, and the majority of me agrees, but there's the part that looks around and thinks the Founding Fathers would be flogging our behinds for the mess we've made of things. There's 220+ years on and the "pride" and feeling of something hard fought and won of being a Citizen of the United States of America just isn't there for the majority of people walking the streets today. They've forgotten what it is and what it means... and sometimes I'm not too sure I know either (although I hope from the fact I ask that question it makes me try harder to know it and live it.) Sometimes I wonder if the 14th Amendment is against the spirit of Citizenship that was originally intended, that carte blanche granting of Citizenship based on location of birth was a mistake. I don't think we demand enough of our Citizens (not by government means necessarily, but by societal contract) to BE Citizens... but I fully recognize my limitations on what it is that should be demanded.

[Dan_S]

I've got my opinions on this but yes, I think there should be a service requirement for all citizens. .

No taxation without representation, but, what the hell... We'll have mandatory national service...

:confused:

[TGS]

I've got my opinions on this but yes, I think there should be a service requirement for all citizens. I especially think there should be a service requirement for all persons applying for citizenship.

Curious....have you served?

[will_1400]

I'll just leave this here...

http://terminallance.com/2010/12/17/terminal-lance-89-tsa-keeping-america-safe/

[JRB]

FWIW........I don't get it.

/rant.

I see your point, but I emphatically take issue with the notion that stateside civilians should be subject to the same Military COIN doctrine that we use in foreign countries where active insurgencies are present.

It's already happened and I know I might as well cry in the rain because my griping isn't going to change a damn thing, but once we start treating all of our civilians as potential insurgents and we're okay with that something is already terribly, horribly wrong.

The moral panic we've maintained over air travel in the wake of 9/11 has gone from a panicky over-reaction to absolutely ludicrous. If a veteran being honored gets harassed that much for being unable to lift his arms over his head, what can citizens like PPGMD honestly expect?

I would agree there ought to be some way that a citizens disabilites, prosthetics, etc, can be documented in advance in a way that the TSA can trust, and thereby fast-track complications related specifically to that condition or those medical devices with the assistance of a concierge of some kind, ala the wounded warrior method. But ultimately I'd prefer to see the TSA's ham-fisted authority neutered back to the regular days of metal detectors & bomb-sniffing dogs, and spend all that TSA money instead on as many new Air Marshals as possible.