If I decide to buy a new Gen4 G17 what should I look for/upgrade?

[NickDrak]

I am contemplating purchasing a new Gen4 G17. I will obviously be looking to get the most recent production G17 I can find at my local dealer(s), but to be sure what is the most recent recoil spring assembly revision# I should be looking for?

Also what do you all suggest I do with the extractor? Is there a simple test for checking the fit, function, production quality, etc. of the extractors? Is there a specific model extractor (non-LCI?) that I should just order and install to be on the safe side?

Thanks in advance.

Stay safe,
Nick

[VolGrad]

If I decide to buy a new Gen4 G17 what should I look for/upgrade?

A Gen3 G17. Not what you were asking but I'm back to all Gen3 GLOCKs. No sense in me worrying about upgrades, fixes, and the like. I'll re-consider the Gen4 once ALL the bugs are exterminated.

[JV_]

FWIW: I wish I never bought my primary Gen4 19.

[ToddG]

I think the question you need to be asking is, "Is the gen4 G17 the right choice right now?" Because candidly, no one knows for sure how to answer your questions. Glock thought they solved the problems with a new recoil spring. Then there was the promise of simply changing extractors. Now there is evidence that at least some of the gen4 problems revolve around yet another part.

I'm not telling you not to buy a gen4, just understand going in that it may have problems and right now no one, even Glock, understands exactly why some guns run fine and others don't.

[VolGrad]

FWIW: I wish I never bought my primary Gen4 19.

Yup. Same here. I spent 9 months and about 2,500 rounds of ammo before I gave up worrying about it and trying to "fix" it. I don't want to worry and constantly test it. I just want to shoot. I have enough else to worry about rather than if I will have more malfs today.

[NickDrak]

I hear ya, but honesty the amount of rounds that Todd has thru his Gen4 torture test G17 since getting his extractor squared away is probably more than I typically shoot in a year (5000-7500rds).

The big attraction for me with the Gen4 is the shorter grip (front to rear) and the new magazine release.

[NickDrak]

I think the question you need to be asking is, "Is the gen4 G17 the right choice right now?" Because candidly, no one knows for sure how to answer your questions. Glock thought they solved the problems with a new recoil spring. Then there was the promise of simply changing extractors. Now there is evidence that at least some of the gen4 problems revolve around yet another part.

I'm not telling you not to buy a gen4, just understand going in that it may have problems and right now no one, even Glock, understands exactly why some guns run fine and others don't.

Thanks for the feedback Todd. What is the other part in question aside from the recoil spring and the extractor?

[JV_]

I hear ya, but honesty the amount of rounds that Todd has thru his Gen4 torture test G17 since getting his extractor squared away is probably more than I typically shoot in a year (5000-7500rds).

IIRC - I had 10 FTEx or Ejs with my 19 in 5500'ish rounds.

[GJM]

Just to clarify, despite the G17/19 problems, haven't the G22/23 gen 4's been running fine? I would like a G23 .40 cal for areas in the mountain west, with four leg critters, and the combination of the Gen 4 with the small grip and a grip force adapter is attractive.

[fuse]

FWIW: I wish I never bought my primary Gen4 19.

Dammmmn.

My gen4 17 has worked well.

But I use an aftermarket single strand recoil spring, and don't shoot as much as you.

Love the new grip w/ no backstraps, and the new mag release. Soon, my gen4 17 will be my only Glock without a grip reduction.

[BigT]

Look for the 0 2 2 spring if it's the countersunk slide.

[ToddG]

Just to clarify, despite the G17/19 problems, haven't the G22/23 gen 4's been running fine?

Not universally. A major agency purchased over 3,000 gen4 G23s and had so many problems, they returned the entire shipment to Glock.

With a few exceptions, the G22 seems to be running very well. To me, this indicates that once again Glock did all the actual engineering work on one model (this time the 22 rather than the 17) and just shoehorned all the other calibers and sizes to fit.


Look for the 0 2 2 spring if it's the countersunk slide.

There's a 0-2-2 spring now? Last I knew it was:


G17, countersunk recess in slide: 0-2
G17, no countersunk recess: 0-2-1

[BigT]

Not universally. A major agency purchased over 3,000 gen4 G23s and had so many problems, they returned the entire shipment to Glock.

With a few exceptions, the G22 seems to be running very well. To me, this indicates that once again Glock did all the actual engineering work on one model (this time the 22 rather than the 17) and just shoehorned all the other calibers and sizes to fit.



There's a 0-2-2 spring now? Last I knew it was:


G17, countersunk recess in slide: 0-2
G17, no countersunk recess: 0-2-1


I believe 0 2 2 replaces 0 2

Our latest G19s have 0 4 1 as well

[JV_]

Our latest G19s have 0 4 1 as well

There shouldn't be an equal number of factory recoil spring iterations to backstrap configurations, unless the number is 1. I miss my Gen 3 19s.

[BigT]

Dude its an upgrade:o

[LittleLebowski]

I'd get a Gen3 RTF2 at this point.

[Prdator]

For a 9mm right now I'd tell you to get a S&W M&P!! or a 3rd gen.
Having just said that I just bought a new Gen 4 17 as I Hate the way the M&P feels in my hand....

I have a early Gen 4 17 (PFEXXX) and the updates that I see on the new one are, Recoil spring ( 021) Extractor (4) AND.... the Trigger Housing!! they have beefed up the area behind the Ejector!! It also looks like they have tweaked the ejector its self, but not by much at all.

My! Gen 4 .40 are all 100% so far ( taking out the three hand loads that had primers in backwards)!! I freaking LOVE my gen 4 G35's!!!!!! My gen4 G23 has a very low round count right now though.

I SO wish Glock would get off there ASS and get all the Gen 4 issues fixed....

[JHC]

I hear ya, but honesty the amount of rounds that Todd has thru his Gen4 torture test G17 since getting his extractor squared away is probably more than I typically shoot in a year (5000-7500rds).

The big attraction for me with the Gen4 is the shorter grip (front to rear) and the new magazine release.

If you have a Plan B for CCW and your no noob, I'd say go for it. I'm surely influenced by outstanding Gen 4 9mm performance of our four specimens and those of shooting buds but on GT there are lot of happy Gen 4 shooters for each one who ran into a snag.

The Gen 4's smaller grip is not much of a feature to me but it's a major factor for many.
And having a Vickers mag release on a Gen 3 G17 for comparison, I do not understand all the folks that posted hither and yon last year that the Gen 4 mag release was an improvement but not as good as the Vickers Gen 3 piece. BUZZZZZ. Wrong. Gen 4 mag release is a step level better cause it's a scad longer = faster and still very positive and secure.

But you pays your money and you takes your changes like everybody else. Especially those that got a Gen 3 in 2010 with similiarly challenged extractors. ;)

[Shellback]

I'd get a Gen3 RTF2 at this point.

Wish I could find 2 of these. I'd like a spare and wifey has decided she wants a G19 for her first gun. She liked the G much better than the M&P and I just got her a holster for it, now to fill it.

[BigT]

RTF2 is sweet to shoot. It is in my opinion less sweet carried up against my skin.

[NickDrak]

I currently carry a fs M&P9 as my duty pistol and i just recently sold the first M&P9 that i had for two years. Both had Apex DCAEK kits installed. The pistol is fantastic, except i am convinced its accuracy is lacking past 15yds. I have shot it from a solid supported postion on several occasions as have many other more accomplished shooters than myself, and both of my M&P9's would only hold about a 6" group @ 25yds.

I have heard identical accuracy reports from several other well known M&P9 shooters who have vast experience with the platform.

My M&P45's were far more accurate for me @ 25yds.

[JHC]

I've two RTF2s, a G17 and a G21 SF. RTF2 is superb. There are quite a few RTF2 G17s around here lately. In really fast reloads, Duane Thomas' observation of the super high traction hanging up in the hand some is a valid point in my experience but it's not so significant an issue I would use it to make a decision one way or the other.

Gen 3 triggers are easier to "tune" if you can call swapping out connectors tuning. lol
And all I mean by easier is it's not so easy to get as light a pull from a Gen 4 as from a Gen 3. Whether you are really trying to lighten up the trigger, I have no idea.

I have put "-" connectors in multiple examples of both Gen's here and the Gen 3's are a bit lighter. Doc GKR has observed on a M4C thread that this connector has produced roughly 5 lb triggers and I've seen that reported from folks who've measured that as well. My calibrated trigger fingers suggests the Gen 4's similiarly set up are a somewhat heavier. A few ounces heavier would be my guess.

[JohnN]

I currently carry a fs M&P9 as my duty pistol and i just recently sold the first M&P9 that i had for two years. Both had Apex DCAEK kits installed. The pistol is fantastic, except i am convinced its accuracy is lacking past 15yds. I have shot it from a solid supported postion on several occasions as have many other more accomplished shooters than myself, and both of my M&P9's would only hold about a 6" group @ 25yds.

I have heard identical accuracy reports from several other well known M&P9 shooters who have vast experience with the platform.

My M&P45's were far more accurate for me @ 25yds.

Just buy that damn P30, you know you want to:D.

[NickDrak]

Just buy that damn P30, you know you want to:D.

Trust me Brother, I would already have one....if Safariland would make the damn holsters for the P30 w/X300 attached that I need for work:(

[fuse]

I've two RTF2s, a G17 and a G21 SF. RTF2 is superb. There are quite a few RTF2 G17s around here lately. In really fast reloads, Duane Thomas' observation of the super high traction hanging up in the hand some is a valid point in my experience but it's not so significant an issue I would use it to make a decision one way or the other.

Gen 3 triggers are easier to "tune" if you can call swapping out connectors tuning. lol
And all I mean by easier is it's not so easy to get as light a pull from a Gen 4 as from a Gen 3. Whether you are really trying to lighten up the trigger, I have no idea.

I have put "-" connectors in multiple examples of both Gen's here and the Gen 3's are a bit lighter. Doc GKR has observed on a M4C thread that this connector has produced roughly 5 lb triggers and I've seen that reported from folks who've measured that as well. My calibrated trigger fingers suggests the Gen 4's similiarly set up are a somewhat heavier. A few ounces heavier would be my guess.

This is because of the little 'nubin' on the gen4 trigger bar. I have a gen4 17 that I installed a gen3 trigger bar in, much better.

Have no idea why they changed it. Seems, like, really unnecessary. Kind of like, I dunno, a totally new double recoil spring.

[JV_]

That nub is also on the 45GAP triggers, but those don't have the vertical slit where the trigger spring rides (to help with alignment). I thought they were the same trigger, then ordered one, and saw the slight difference. It wasn't worth the return shipping to send it back for a refund.

The bump on the trigger is supposed to keep the trigger bar riding straight back on the striker block. On Gen 3 guns, there is some trigger bar deflection (toward the frame) as it rides across the surface of the striker block. If you take the mag out, and look down the mag well while pulling the trigger, you can see it happening.

I've seen some posts that the plastic connector housing also changes the angle of the trigger bar (a tad), which has some impact on the weight.

[SteveK]

I'd get a Gen3 RTF2 at this point.

I did.

[jslaker]

That nub is also on the 45GAP triggers, but those don't have the vertical slit where the trigger spring rides (to help with alignment). I thought they were the same trigger, then ordered one, and saw the slight difference. It wasn't worth the return shipping to send it back for a refund.

The bump on the trigger is supposed to keep the trigger bar riding straight back on the striker block. On Gen 3 guns, there is some trigger bar deflection (toward the frame) as it rides across the surface of the striker block. If you take the mag out, and look down the mag well while pulling the trigger, you can see it happening.

I've seen some posts that the plastic connector housing also changes the angle of the trigger bar (a tad), which has some impact on the weight.

I've heard some reports of people filing/polishing down the nub and getting pull weights back down the 3rd Gen levels.

[JV_]

I've heard some reports of people filing/polishing down the nub and getting pull weights back down the 3rd Gen levels.a Gen4 with a 4.5# connector and polished surfaces leaves me with a pretty nice trigger.

[JHC]

This is because of the little 'nubin' on the gen4 trigger bar. I have a gen4 17 that I installed a gen3 trigger bar in, much better.

Have no idea why they changed it. Seems, like, really unnecessary. Kind of like, I dunno, a totally new double recoil spring.

:D That just slays me! And I dig the Gen 4s.

[NickDrak]

I went to a local shop today and got to compare a Gen4 G17 to a Gen3 RTF2 (gills), and a Gen3 Talo/FailZero. I really wish I could get a Gen4 grip/TALO-FailZero finish w/the Hackathorn night sights/RTF2 texture. That would be about as good as it gets.

The grip and mag release of the Gen4 felt noticeably better to me. The shorter (front to rear) grip of the Gen4 pointed noticeably better for me. I had to actually unlock my wrist to get the Gen-3 to point flat where I wanted it to. The Gen4 pointed much like my M&P does for me.

I was able to notice the trigger characteristics you guys described on the Gen4 compared to the others. Slightly heavier, but not a big deal.

I am going to wait a while longer to see how all of the extractor and other issues work out on the Gen4, but it will definitely be my next pistol.

ETA: The RTF2's fish gill slide serrations are horrendous. When I went to release the slide my hand slipped right off of the gills the first time.

[IsaacL]

The texture on the Gen4's is awesome but I'll stick with my Gen3 17 for the foreseeable future. I've had no problems and don't expect any. The Gen3's are cheaper(I think?) Which leaves more money for sights, ammo, etcetera.

[LittleLebowski]

There's no appreciable difference in price, SMF.

[JV_]

The Gen3's are cheaperThey're normally 5% more for the Gen 4, about $30, but it comes with 3 mags. A Gen 3 with 3 mags would be equal in price.

[bmg]

Just a comment about my (limited) experience with gen 4 triggers. The trigger on my gen 4 G17 was nice right out of the box...measured maybe 1/4 lb heavier than my typical gen 3's. I dropped a Glockmeister 17 lb recoil spring in it when I first got it, and it's been great for it's first ~1000 rounds...enough to conclude it has no major problems like some people have had, but not enough to say it's got reliability comparable to my gen 3 G17's.

My new gen 4 G19 was a different story trigger-wise. Trigger pull measured at the bottom of the trigger was a good 6 pounds. Measured in the middle of the trigger my gen 4 G17 was 7.25 lbs and the G19 was over 9 lbs (off the scale on my trigger pull gauge). Moving the trigger back and forth with the slide removed showed it had some significant binding where the end of the trigger bar moves between the connector and the frame, especially when I pressed sideways on the "bump". Without the bump the top of the trigger bar can tilt slightly to the right, relieving some of the pressure below where the connector presses sideways on the trigger bar, so it doesn't press against the frame as hard.

I replaced the gen 4 trigger bar with a G17 gen 3 (I like the smooth trigger better than the grooved anyway). Now the bar can tilt slightly as the connector is pushing the trigger bar down, so the pressure on the trigger bar between the connector and frame is lessened (I can still feel it though). Trigger pull at the tip is now 4.75 lbs, compared to 4.5 for my nice gen 4 G17 trigger. Measured at the center of the trigger it's down to 7.75 compared to 7.25 for the gen 4 G17. I can still feel a slight binding between the connector and frame, but it's greatly improved.

It's possible that the G19 connector is bent out slightly more than the G17 connector (pushing sideways on the trigger bar tip a bit harder), although it seems about right when I do the "paper" check with it, or it just might be a variation in tolerances. I haven't disassembled the gen4 G17 to compare.

I haven't fired the gen4 G19 yet. I just finished removing .035" from the ejector and tweaking the tip angles (based on info in another thread here). I prefer the old style recoil springs for my 9mm glocks, so I've got an 18 lb Glockmeister recoil spring assembly on the way. ADK (in another thread here) had good things to say about the White Sound Defense extractor depressor cleaning up his ejection issues (and the description of what it changes makes sense), so I've got one on the way to play with. When those arrive I'll start shooting it and report on any failures I see (hopefully none) and the consistency of ejection.

[Chipster]

Trust me Brother, I would already have one....if Safariland would make the damn holsters for the P30 w/X300 attached that I need for work:(

Try the Glock 21 w/x300 from Safariland. Mine fits like a glove (I am not one to piece stuff together) and I feel 100% confident in the manner it retains the weapon. If it did not say Glock 21 on it I would swear it was made for the HK P30.

[NickDrak]

Try the Glock 21 w/x300 from Safariland. Mine fits like a glove (I am not one to piece stuff together) and I feel 100% confident in the manner it retains the weapon. If it did not say Glock 21 on it I would swear it was made for the HK P30.

I need the ALS 6360 or 6325.

[EVP]

Has anyone reported any issues with the rtf2 g17s with the fish gill serrations? I am making a move to glock and keep researching to insure I don't get a problematic one.

[JHC]

Has anyone reported any issues with the rtf2 g17s with the fish gill serrations? I am making a move to glock and keep researching to insure I don't get a problematic one.

Mine is superb but I have the Midas touch buying new Glocks it seems - Gen 4's and recent Gen 3's.

[canadiangunguy]

Hello there,
I have had my Gen 4 for about 6 months now. It is my first centerfire pistol. I have put about 1500 rds down range and have had zero failures. I run MFS steel case ammo, really cheap stuff! I find that I am not very accurate with this gun but that is improving. I am sure it is the operator and not the gun. I do believe that the trigger is heavy and have ordered a 3.5 trigger assembley from Glockmeister. I will let you know how that is when I receive it.

[the_swede]

Is the grip on Gen 4 without backstraps significantly slimmer than the grip on a Gen 3?

[BWT]

Is the grip on Gen 4 without backstraps significantly slimmer than the grip on a Gen 3?

I would handle one. You can find them at almost all gun stores, Academy's, etc.

Normally an objective question of most firearms you need to get a second opinion on.

I'd go ahead and handle one locally and decide for yourself, to be honest about it.