What 22 Do You Use For Extra Training?

[JM Campbell]

I'm looking to compliment my P30 with a 22 for more trigger time, which one do you use? Are there any to stay away from? Are there any with a mag release similar to the P30? The only one I have found to be similar is the Walther P22, anyone with first hand knowledge of this pistol?

Thanks for your time gents.

[MDS]

For general marksmanship practice, I really love my S&W 617 SA/DA revolver. The SA trigger is light and crisp, and the DA trigger is perfectly smooth, but long and heavy - the best example of either that I've ever shot. This makes it so that, if you can shoot just as accurately with the SA and DA triggers, you know you've got some solid trigger control. It's also a great gun for the Wall Drill, because the heavy trigger pull makes it a real workout, and because the target sights and long sight radius (I have the 6" barrel) really highlights any movement induced by the trigger pull.

I'll be interested to hear what others more knowledgable than I have to say about practicing P30 manipulations with a P22, but I would hesitate to choose the P22 for my main 22lr practice pistol. The trigger kind of sucks, and it feels a bit like a toy rather than a real gun; though, it is a fun little plinker, and it fits my wife's small hands really well. Maybe if you had a 617 for practicing trigger control, and a P22 for practicing reloads... OTOH, it sounds like a lot of trouble.

[part-time shooter]

I have a P22 and a Ruger bull barrel 22 with a 6 inch barrell and a RDS for my 22 practice. The Ruger is pure toy as it's just stupid simple to shoot extremely well and it's just plain fun. The P22 is a very fun gun to shoot but it has a few issues that you have to over look. The first are the sucktacular sights, they are "loose" and made that way. I hate them as I always think they are about to fly off, they haven't yet but they still feel that way. I don't think any afternarket sighs exist for it either, I stopped looking a year or so ago though so maybe they exist now.

The P22 is accurate enough for what you are looking for and it's dirt cheap to shoot. It's hammer fired but has a glock like trigger pull. It's nothing like the P30 but it will give you hours of cheap trigger time. Fobus makes a paddle holster for it so you can get some draw and shoot experience with it as well, it doesn't really carry over to your P30 though as there's no recoil to speak of and the size is totally different.

[SLG]

mariodsantana hit it on the head. Nothing beats a good revolver for improving your shooting. Weapons manipulations are best practiced dry fire with your actual gun.

Conversion kits are great, but I still practice things like my reload with the real thing.

[JM Campbell]

mariodsantana hit it on the head. Nothing beats a good revolver for improving your shooting. Weapons manipulations are best practiced dry fire with your actual gun.

Conversion kits are great, but I still practice things like my reload with the real thing.

Sounds good, I'm mainly after trigger control. What 22 revolver do you recommend for this purpose? I have a big gunshow coming up in two weeks so it's on my shopping list.

Thank You for your replies.

[TCinVA]

I use a S&W 317 and an Advantage Arms conversion for the Glock 17. The AA kit is particularly valuable, in my opinion, as it allows you to put the same sights you use on a real Glock and you have the same trigger feel.

The 317 is a .22lr J frame. The trigger and sight skills learned on it translate nicely to .38 J frames and other revolvers. Shooting bullseye with it at 25 yards is a real challenge.

You can't learn recoil control on the .22 pistols, but you can learn what sight picture you need to make a hit and good trigger control.

[MechEng]

Skyline, What trigger system are you talking about when referring to the P30? The LEM or DA/SA?

If you are looking at just practicing pure marksmanship with it, then a S&W DA/SA 22 revolver might be good. You can get various aftermarket spring kits (Wolf comes to mind) that can vary the DA trigger pull to closely match your P30 LEM or DA/SA trigger pull. Just keep in mind that you may get light primer strikes if you go with a really light hammer spring needed to closely match the LEM.

[fuse]

I have heard great things about the Tactical Solutions Glock .22 conversion uppers. I plan to add one to my arsenal, along with a SIRT.

which one should I get first? The .22 involves actual (and very cheap) shooting, but I can use the SIRT at home. I am torn.

[JM Campbell]

I have the V1 LEM on my P30LS. So it will be very hard to match the trigger.

[MechEng]

I have the V1 LEM on my P30LS. So it will be very hard to match the trigger.

True, I doubt you will be able to find or mod a DA pistol down to 4.5 lbs.

[JM Campbell]

I guess it will result into getting a great set of sights Heinies and another trip to the eye doc to update the script since I do know that's a problem of mine. Just need to hunker down and truely dedicate to reloading and a solid training routine with a partner.

Anyone in San Antonio Tx that wants to meet up and point out what I'm doing wrong?
I'm free most Saterdays and every Monday.

I know NickA is local so I'll hit you up soon to head to the range.

Thanks for your time gentlemen.

ETA....I really do not want to switch platforms but the Glock 19/17 with a 22 conversion sounds very tempting. The P30 has been a great firearm so far for me so it just might all be in needed instruction and more practice time.

[joshs]

I have a P22 and I like it quite a bit as a training gun. Most of my previous .22 pistol experience was with a MKIII. I think the P22 has a couple of features that make it better than MKIII as a training gun.

1. The trigger sucks. In both single and double action (the hammer on a P22 can be dropped safely by activating the safety and pulling the trigger) the trigger has lots of creep and is a lot heavier than the weight of the gun. I list this a feature because after shooting the P22 every other gun seems incredibly easy to shoot.

2. It's really small. The P22 and a brick of .22 takes up very little room in my range bag.

3. It's really light. With some hotter .22 loads it is possible to get good sight tracking practice.

4. It malfunctions regularly. This means I get lots of malfunction reduction practice, which is helpful since my P30 has yet to malfunction, so I was getting a little rusty.

[Chuck Haggard]

S&W AR .22 rifle, Advantage Arms .22 kit for my Glock 17, S&W 317 for snub training.

[Wheeler]

CMMG coversion kit for my Bushmaster
Ruger Mk2 for long range trigger control

[45R]

Ruger MKII for those training days I want to shoot .22LR. Great accurate and reliable pistol.

[irishshooter]

s&w MP 15-22......waiting on the .22lr m&p pistol :)

[ABC]

Kimber conversion kit for my 1911, I also shoot it in bullseye club. I shoot a P22 to sub for my others, but I don't use it on club nights.

[Shellback]

I have no experience with it but Tactical Solutions has come out with a Glock conversion (http://www.tacticalsol.com/products/22-lr-conversions?page=shop.browse&category_id=13) as well. It looks pretty slick on their website but I don't know if it offers any advantage to using the AA conversion that was already mentioned.

[Lon]

Advantage Arms kit for my G19.

[David]

Ruger MKIII Target

[Mitchell, Esq.]

AR-15: Spike's Tactical & Black Dog mags
Glock: AA LE kit for a Glock 26

My "Trunk Gun" is a S&W target pistol I bought used that I keep in my range bag for when I just want to go and shoot post-it notes stolen/liberated from work.

[NickA]

I know NickA is local so I'll hit you up soon to head to the range.

Absolutely. i'm not an instructor by any means but will be glad to lend another set of eyes.
as to the topic i have a Ruger 22/45. great gun but has NOTHING in common with my Glocks, I really need to look into a conversion or maybe a DA revolver as mentioned above.
Oh shit just noticed you have a P30...if we go to the range it could end up costing me money:cool:

[JM Campbell]

Absolutely. i'm not an instructor by any means but will be glad to lend another set of eyes.
as to the topic i have a Ruger 22/45. great gun but has NOTHING in common with my Glocks, I really need to look into a conversion or maybe a DA revolver as mentioned above.
Oh shit just noticed you have a P30...if we go to the range it could end up costing me money:cool:

LOL I'll let you shoot a couple 100 threw it if you want.....happy to spread the HK evil. Funny thing I almost bought G17 RFT2...still thinking about it.

[Corey]

I have a Walther P-22 and can agree with what others have said about it. Small, feels cheap, but mine runs good with CCI ammo and after working with it's trigger for awhile everything else is easy. Mine has a suppressor on it pretty much all the time which is convenient when I have my son and I are out in the woods someplace and want to plink a little bit. We don't have to dig out any ear plugs and we don't bother other people.

I normally carry a 1911 and have a Kimber conversion kit for it that works well and is very accurate. I like it when I am working specifically on marksmanship and trigger control. I have found I don't use it as much as I thought I would because when I use it a lot I start using a looser grip and that doesn't help with follow up shots on a .45.

[Mitchell, Esq.]

I added an Advantage Arms Glock 26 .22lr upper to my collection.

(Would have went with the 19, but the dealer was out and more weren't coming in any time soon...)

[David Armstrong]

Ruger 22/45 and my old S&W Model 18 do most of the handgun training in small caliber. For the AR-15 I use a Colt .22 conversion unit.

[Tamara]

I have a pre-Model 18 as a K-frame trainer, a 2" Model 34 as a J-frame trainer, and a base-model fixed-sight 22/45 for a 1911 trainer. I like the fixed sight 22/45, because the gun pretty much lives in my range bag and I don't have to worry about the sights getting knocked around...

I'd personally avoid the P-22. Over the time I worked at CCA, we went through three rental guns. The first two were replaced due to fairly minor parts breakage and the third suffered catastrophic slide failure at the front cocking serrations. After I left, they had two more suffer slide separations and just quit keeping a P-22 in the rental case, since giving a customer a mouthful of flying zinc is bad for business. Supposedly this was a known issue with stress risers and the machining of the FCS has been changed to correct it, but the gun is still just really flimsily built for high-volume shooting.

One of our part-time sales guys was a very mechanically-inclined IT geek, and he had over 10k rounds through his, by dint of lots of tinkering and parts replacement; it's the gun he learned shadetree gunsmithing on.

When they first came out and were pretty cheap, I was very enthusiastic about them, but as the price has climbed, I just don't think they're a good value for the money anymore. Compared to a similarly-priced Ruger, which will last a long long time, the P-22 is practically disposable.

[NGCSUGrad09]

I've been pretty smitten with my Advantage Arms .22 kit for the Glocks. Since the LE models have the same sight channels as the regular Glocks, I put Warren sights on mine. My 19 kit has been running like a top for the past 3 or so years. It's a great tool to for fundamentals of marksmanship and fun for .22 matches.

[NGA Gunsmith]

When I set out to find a decent .22 pistol for practice I found that they just don't make them like they used to. I wanted to find a semi-auto that functioned like my Glock but in a dedicated gun. I ended up getting a Ruger Mark 3 hunter with a 5.5" barrel. It wasn't exactly what I was going for but it is a nice gun. Later I found out that Bersa makes a .22 caliber version of their .380 thunder pistol. This is very similar in size to the P30 and I've read that they are more reliable than the P22's (no slides cracking). They also cost about $100 less than the Walthers. I am interested in picking one of these up. Just my $0.02.

[JodyH]

Beretta 87 Cheetah .22lr
Really nice .22 plinker/practice pistol.

[agent-smith]

S&W 617 (4"), S&W 41 (5.5")

The 617 is the best investment I've ever made in improving trigger control.

The 41 helped greatly with sight alignment, grip consistency, etc. as if I miss, I know it isn't "the gun".

[LittleLebowski]

There's nothing like a good 41. Mine is a 1981 model.

[Joe in PNG]

I've got an ancient High Standard Duramatic 101 6" which is a great target pistol, but pretty useless for anything other than fundamentals. Fun, though.

[John Ralston]

I ordered a 22 upper half from my SIG P229 - wish someone would make one for the P30.

[Bratch]

I'm using a 2" 317 and a 4" Colt MK III.

Waiting on the 22 M&P or something similar to replace the AA kit I was using on my Glocks.

[ADK]

As far as .22 conversions for Glock Gen4s, all I see on the market are:

1) Advantage Arms for G17/22/31 Gen4 specifically (with strident warnings about NOT using their standard conversion kits on Gen4s), and

2) Tactical Solutions for G17/22/31 that may be used on both earlier and Gen4 Glocks.

I've got a G23 Gen4 I'd like to get a .22 kit for.

Advantage Arms website says there is currently no ETA for a compact frame Gen4 kit.

Tactical Solutions doesn't have an ETA for a compact kit either.

Has anyone tried to run the Tactical Solutions kit on a compact frame? Could it work? Could the "spacers" sold by Lone Wolf for "long slide" conversions be used to cover any gap ahead of the dust cover? (I'm asking Tactical Solutions too, just wondering whether any "real people" out there have any experience with this.)

[Al T.]

S&W M&P15-22 w/ Primary Arms RDS for my ARs.

617 for trigger control. Four inch barrel, superb accuracy.

Working a bit with a new Bersa .22, somewhat ammo sensitive and POI/POA is off. Too soon to tell if this one is a keeper.

For 1911s, I find the Browning Buckmark works well, most of the controls are very similar.

Marlin Marauder .22 for my lever guns and a CZ 451 for my bolt action rifles.

[CCT125US]

Ruger MKII.. decent trigger, but I do need some aftermarket sights for it. Great for proper trigger / grip control practice as the gun is lighter than most of my autos and is very easily persuaded off target.

[jslaker]

I'm really hoping S&W offers conversion-only kits when they come out with the .22 M&P pistol they were showing off a while back.

[Super J]

I have an advantage arms conversion kit for my G17 and I love it.

[JV_]

I have an advantage arms conversion kit for my G17 and I love it.

Me too, it's a great addition.

[JonInWA]

Ruger 4.5" slab-sided barrel 22/45, with a Pierce Grip rubber fingergroove frontstrap-all make it a great semi-analog practice gun for my Glocks, 1911s, and Hi-Power.

Plus, it's just fun..

Best, Jon

[Nephrology]

Ruger 4.5" slab-sided barrel 22/45, with a Pierce Grip rubber fingergroove frontstrap-all make it a great semi-analog practice gun for my Glocks, 1911s, and Hi-Power.

Plus, it's just fun..

Best, Jon

Ditto to the above. It is also very cheap - I got mine for $175 barely used - and it works. I have probably 8-10k rounds of .22 through mine and I've sort of cleaned it once (sprayed down the chamber and bolt with CLP, used a Q-tip to quickly scrub off some grime). Never disassembled it. Runs like a top.

[Patrin]

PPQ .22 model...full size...not the p22...reasonable accuracy for trigger work, very reliable...best striker trigger .22 trainer on the market for a Glock, VP9 or any striker.

[MichaelD]

M&P22 full-size. Reliable, good trigger. Perfect trainer for my M&P9.

[HCM]

PPQ .22 model...full size...not the p22...reasonable accuracy for trigger work, very reliable...best striker trigger .22 trainer on the market for a Glock, VP9 or any striker.

I've been looking at these, particularly the threaded barrel version. Range report ?

[Malamute]

Smith K-22, Ruger single six, Colt Ace unit, Marlin 39, old bolt action 22 rifle.

Somebody mentioned a Smith 41. My dad had one for several years, it was prairie dog capable out to around 100 yards with good consistency. Would love to have one. Another Ruger Mark I ir II in the 6 7/8" target model would be good also. The one I had ages ago was easily capable of hitting the 50 rd 22 boxes at 65 yards.

Oh, and a Colt Woodsman, perhaps another Match target model.

And a Colt New Frontier 22 would be a fun practice shooter.

I just need to get out and shoot more again. The K-22 and Marlin 39 were good fun for shooting small stones and sticks and such tossed in the air. I doubt I can still do it.

[Patrin]

I've been looking at these, particularly the threaded barrel version. Range report ?

Yes, I will be doing one when I hit 1K with it.

I have the threaded barrel 'tactical model' and paired it with my Spectre II....first 500 rounds, suppressed, no cleaning and no gun-related malfunctions. Pretty impressive for a .22, particularly considering all the 'gunk' the suppressor throws back in the gun.

[HCM]

Yes, I will be doing one when I hit 1K with it.

I have the threaded barrel 'tactical model' and paired it with my Spectre II....first 500 rounds, suppressed, no cleaning and no gun-related malfunctions. Pretty impressive for a .22, particularly considering all the 'gunk' the suppressor throws back in the gun.

I have a spectre II in NFA jail right now. What ammo are you running?

[LSP552]

And a Colt New Frontier 22 would be a fun practice shooter.



Yep, have one and it's a great plinker and complement to my bigger SAs. For social practice with a .22, I use a SIG conversion top end for my 226R. It's great for DA and DA/SA transition practice, but certainly for recoil control. It's really like dry fire with noise.

For just .22 plinking, I like my old Ruger Mk II target. I NEED a K-22.

[Patrin]

I have a spectre II in NFA jail right now. What ammo are you running?

Very nice, HCM, you chose well, bud.

Given the .22 market, beggars can't be choosers, so I bought a few K of some Federal Target Match, standard velocity. This ammo is quieter with the PPQ/SP II combo than my MP15-22/SP II combo (I have two of the SP II's). Doesn't pick up enough velocity.

Neither are movie quiet with standard stuff....need some sub's for that.

[LSP552]

Yep, have one and it's a great plinker and complement to my bigger SAs. For social practice with a .22, I use a SIG conversion top end for my 226R. It's great for DA and DA/SA transition practice, but certainly for recoil control. It's really like dry fire with noise.

For just .22 plinking, I like my old Ruger Mk II target. I NEED a K-22.

I feel like a dick quoting myself but needed to fix a typo and it's too late to edit. Original should have said the 22 conversion is certainly NOT for recoil control but my fingers and brain apparently don't talk. I really like the SIG conversion for trigger manipulation stuff, but it's still a .22. I'm careful to not over use it.

[UNK]

Hammerilli Xesse has a trigger very similar to the P30.

[CCT125US]

I have moved on to an M&P .22c. It is a fantastic plinker to shoot ping pong balls, hedge apples, walnuts and critters.

[BN]

I shoot a .22 for the fun of shooting a .22, not for training. :)

I have a Ruger Mark ll bull barrel and the kids have been shooting it, but it is pretty heavy for the littler ones. So, I just got a S&W M&P .22 Compact. We only have a hundred rounds through it so far, but it is a keeper. One of the girls shot it and liked it. She could operate all the controls and could pull the slide back.

[hufnagel]

Ruger SR22 has been my go-to .22lr pistol for several years, but it's getting replaced by my Beretta M9 22LR. The SR22 isn't going anywhere though, as the kid loves to shoot it.

[farscott]

I am a high-volume .22 shooter and fire about ten rounds of .22 LR for every round of centerfire. For trigger control, it is hard to beat a S&W K-frame (M17, M18, M617). If you can shoot one of those double-action and consistently hit the target at speed, the P30 trigger is no issue. I like to shoot my metal spinning targets and see if I can keep all four spinners moving with the ten-shot cylinder at distances starting at five yards and moving back until about twenty-five yards.

The Ruger Mark II (now Mark III) is the 1911 of rimfire, with enough aftermarket parts to build an entire pistol with no Ruger parts. I have one in which the only Ruger part is the magazine. That being said, it is hard to beat a Mark II as an all-around .22. Everyone in our family has one, and we all shoot them.

[HCM]

I have a S&W M18 and three .22 Conversion kits:

- Ciener Beretta 92/96 conversion I picked up in the 90's which actually runs well,
- an AA Conversion for a Gen 4 Glock 17/22 which runs well with Plated high velocity ammo
- A SIG 229R conversion which is very picky and only Runs with CCI Mini mags

For those who like Mini mags, Aguila "Super Extra" (yellow and red box) is a clone of the mini mags often available via Academy Sports. I've had great results with it both accuracy and reliability wise. it is the only ammo other than Mini mags which will run in my AA and SIG conversions.

[HCM]

Very nice, HCM, you chose well, bud.

Given the .22 market, beggars can't be choosers, so I bought a few K of some Federal Target Match, standard velocity. This ammo is quieter with the PPQ/SP II combo than my MP15-22/SP II combo (I have two of the SP II's). Doesn't pick up enough velocity.

Neither are movie quiet with standard stuff....need some sub's for that.

I picked up the Spectre II via the SPEQ program. I'm debating a second Spectre II or something lighter.

[Malamute]

I shoot a .22 for the fun of shooting a .22, not for training. :)



This too. ^^^


I have noticed in the past that if I didnt shoot or carry my 1911 for a few months, I was much better with it if I first shot a brick of 22's through it with the Ace kit. I got another Ace kit year later, I dont care so much if its training, I just really enjoy shooting it, along with all the other 22's.

[taadski]

I feel like a dick quoting myself but needed to fix a typo and it's too late to edit. Original should have said the 22 conversion is certainly NOT for recoil control but my fingers and brain apparently don't talk. I really like the SIG conversion for trigger manipulation stuff, but it's still a .22. I'm careful to not over use it.

That's how I read it the first time anyway. :p.

I honestly don't shoot a whole lot of .22 these days. Still have a hard time buying it in quantity in my neck of the woods. Regardless, for me, a 4" 617, a bull barreled and threaded 22/45 and a Sig 226 conversion round out the rimfire pistols needs pretty well.


t

[Trooper224]

If you don't reload you might consider putting that money towards a reloading set up, instead of a new pistol.

[rd62]

I picked up an AA Glock .22 conversion kit and a complete G17 frame a couple years ago and assembled a dedicated pistol with them. I've used it to introduce people new to firearms and maybe recoil/muzzle blast sensitive to shooting. It's been particularly handy working with my kids. Same manual of arms, sights, trigger, holsters, etc when they are ready to step up to a 9mm.

It's also just a hoot to shoot!

[1986s4]

S&W M18 .22 revolver and an AA .22 top end on my Colt Super. Use the recommended ammo and zero malfunctions.

[taadski]

S&W M18 .22 revolver...


[Envy]

[john c]

I second the M&P 22 full size. It's a perfect simulation of a duty sized pistol (other than weight). The trigger is excellent, as well as accuracy. I've had multiple AA conversion kits, but the accuracy was only so-so.

[PPGMD]

I haven't been able to reliably find 22LR in a while. So I only use my stash of 22LR on rifle training (where the savings is still there even in today's market).

[CSW]

I have a Sig Mosquito that my Department members gifted me as I was retiring as Chief of my Fire Department. It's a fun gun, with a HORRENDOUS trigger. Plinking is about it.

My "target" .22 is a Browning Buckmark, 5" with the slabside barrel. The trigger is incredible, and it's way more accurate than I can shoot.
4637

[peterb]

Ruger mkII with a Speedbead II red dot. Set it up to see how a red dot worked with my eyes before investing in something like an RMR and machining for a Glock. The mount fit right into the rear sight dovetail. Great fun to shoot.

[Chuck Haggard]

AA .22 Glock upper for my G17s, a S&W 317 and a Ruger LCR in .22lr

[littlejerry]

Do you prefer the LCR over a S&W 43C?

I just shot a LCR for the first time in .38. I really liked it.

Ever since then I've been thinking of getting one in .22lr for practice. I'd really love to see their 3" model in 22lr.

What is the trigger lime on the LCR 22 compared to the standard 38?

[Chuck Haggard]

Do you prefer the LCR over a S&W 43C?

It's a toss up. The LCR has a better trigger, the 43c is noticeably lighter to carry when I pack a .22 snub.

[PD Sgt.]

Picked up a Smith 622 Target for dirt cheap, great pistol. Also have a Sig/Hammerli Trailside that is nice for bullseye practice.

[Jared]

Beretta 22LR conversion kit on a 92, Smith and Wesson K-22 Combat Masterpiece (pre Model 22)

[Al T.]

Picked up a Smith 622 Target for dirt cheap

:cool:

IMHO, possibly the most under-rated .22s out there. Every one I've seen at the range shot well.

[PD Sgt.]

:cool:

IMHO, possibly the most under-rated .22s out there. Every one I've seen at the range shot well.

And mine is no exception (within the limits of my abilities of course). Detail strip and clean is pretty complex though.