Paxton Quigley: Biden is right.

[David Armstrong]

Given previous statements by her I was afraid this would happen. Last night, while on the Piers Morgan show, Paxton Quigley agreed that nobody needs an AR 15 asssault rifle and that Biden was right when he said a shotgun was a better choice for defending yourself.

[Chemsoldier]

Link? Not doubting just being thorough.

[RoyGBiv]

Link? Not doubting just being thorough.

Please don't make me watch Piers any more... Please.

I didn't find the Biden shotgun reference in this video, posted yesterday.
This is the only video that comes up from a search of "Paxton Quigley" on CNN.com
Perhaps it was later in the show and not posted yet?

http://www.cnn.com/video/#/video/bestoftv/2013/02/21/pmt-paxton-quigley-women-with-guns.cnn

[David Armstrong]

I watched the show directly, it's around the 8:45 mark (Central time). Maybe someone else has a transcript or capture link?

ETA: Not from CNN, but I did find this from an interview in The Daily Beast from July 25, 2012:
"She is quick to say that she is not advocating assault weapons. Following the recent tragedy in Colorado, in which the shooter reportedly bought 6,000 rounds of ammunition on the Internet, then used weapons including a shotgun, a pistol, and a semiautomatic rifle to kill 12 people and injure dozens more, Quigley says she believes assault weapons should be banned and that ammunition should not be sold online."

[TCinVA]

She sure as hell ought to know better than to repeat such ignorant blather.

[John Ralston]

She sure as hell ought to know better than to repeat such ignorant blather.

She should, but obviously doesn't. Maybe we can remind her.

[Tamara]

The Nineties called. They want their "Look! A Girl! With A Gun!™" back.

[jetfire]

wtf is Paxton Quigley?

[orionz06]

wtf is Paxton Quigley?

Obviously no one important

[G60]

wtf is Paxton Quigley?

A pseudo-self defense "expert" Fudd of the highest order.
http://www.paxtonquigley.com

[jetfire]

A pseudo-self defense "expert" Fudd of the highest order.
http://www.paxtonquigley.com

Hahahahaha oh man she was Yoko Ono's bodyguard! Yeah, that makes her a self-defense expert on the same level as Paul f***in' Howe right there. She looks like a female version of Iggy P; no actually qualifications, just took everyone else's courses and decided that she was an expert.

[MechEng]

She was famous back in the good old, pre internet, Lenny Magill GunVideo (VHS) days. Just like Lenny she fell off the radar.

[Chemsoldier]

I don't agree with her but I am not going to spend much effort monkey wrenching her either. As long as she keeps getting more and more women on CCW and doesn't take partake in any organized action in favor of gun control I will leave her alone except to reply directly to interview non-sense like this.

I seem to recall a passage in Armed and Female about the fierce and punishing recoil of the .44 Special. She really does harken back to the day when the gun community was overjoyed to get any female to be vocal about firearms. The world has moved on Paxton. There are even women now who shoot .45s *gasp*

[David Armstrong]

I don't agree with her but I am not going to spend much effort monkey wrenching her either. As long as she keeps getting more and more women on CCW and doesn't take partake in any organized action in favor of gun control I will leave her alone except to reply directly to interview non-sense like this.
This. I didn't post to gripe "Paxton bad", I posted mainly because she really has been such a driving force in getting women into shooting, training, and CCW and I thought it important that we know the line she was taking on this subject.

[JHC]

This. I didn't post to gripe "Paxton bad", I posted mainly because she really has been such a driving force in getting women into shooting, training, and CCW and I thought it important that we know the line she was taking on this subject.

Has she? How would large swaths of women know of her leadership unless they read gun magazines? Not disputing, just askin' cause that's the only place I saw her in the '90's.

[pax]

The Nineties called. They want their "Look! A Girl! With A Gun!™" back.

This.

The wonder isn't how well the bear dances. It's that it dances at all.

Lots better role models these days.

pax

[jetfire]

I just conducted an informal poll of 5 women I know that are actually in the firearms industry at a professional level. Each person was asked "Have you ever heard of Paxton Quigley?" Here are their responses:


Nope, who's that?
Didn't Tom Selleck play him in a movie?
Can't say as I have.
What in the hell is a Paxton Quigley?
Sorry, no.


I'm not saying she's bad, although her recent commentary and the godawful teacup grip on the cover of her book would indicate otherwise, but what I am saying is that she's hardly relevant.

[Tamara]

Nope, who's that?
Didn't Tom Selleck play him in a movie?
Can't say as I have.
What in the hell is a Paxton Quigley?
Sorry, no.


n00bs. ;) :p

[rsa-otc]

Hell I guess I have enough gray hair on my head to remember when she was relevant. It looks like the times have past her by just like the teacup grip. The problem is that while we know she's no longer relevant the masses don't and that makes her dangerous. We need a counter to her like our own Kathy Jackson, Julie G, Randy Rogers and Jessie Duff to get the same or more air time showing Ms Quigley's lack of relevance.

Unfortunately the fact that she's spouting what the media wants to hear makes them flock to her.

[Chemsoldier]

Seems like there are some ladies stepping up. Jessie Duff and Taurus seem to be stepping up pretty well, not that we can ever have enough. NBC Sports axing 3 Gun Nation was a real blow to the cause also.

[jetfire]

n00bs. ;) :p

They're all about my age.

[Tamara]

They're all about my age.

That's what I said. Now get offa my lawn! :D

[jetfire]

That's what I said. Now get offa my lawn! :D

No joke, the last time I was carded for booze the gal looked at my ID and said "oh, you're old enough to be annoyed when you get carded now!"

Thanks, lady.

[Al T.]

Buddy of mine is a complete n00b. He's 60 - I don't think it's a chronological event. :p

[Drang]

Has she? How would large swaths of women know of her leadership unless they read gun magazines? Not disputing, just askin' cause that's the only place I saw her in the '90's.
They read her books.


I just conducted an informal poll of 5 women I know that are actually in the firearms industry at a professional level. Each person was asked "Have you ever heard of Paxton Quigley?" Here are their responses:


Nope, who's that?
Didn't Tom Selleck play him in a movie?
Can't say as I have.
What in the hell is a Paxton Quigley?
Sorry, no.


I'm not saying she's bad, although her recent commentary and the godawful teacup grip on the cover of her book would indicate otherwise, but what I am saying is that she's hardly relevant.


n00bs. ;) :p
This.

Mrs. Drang did read her books, when they were fresh out. Which was probably before certain people round here who need to get off my lawn ever held a real gun... :rolleyes:

So, yeah, the Gun Culture moved on and Paxton Quigley didn't.

[jetfire]

Mrs. Drang did read her books, when they were fresh out. Which was probably before certain people round here who need to get off my lawn ever held a real gun... :rolleyes:

Doing something for a long time doesn't necessarily mean you're doing it correctly.

[Drang]

She also needs to shoot more. (So do I, for that matter.)

I was stressing the fact that Ms Quigley is something of a has been vis a vis armed self-defense.

[jetfire]

I was stressing the fact that Ms Quigley is something of a has been vis a vis armed self-defense.

I concur!

[JHC]

I just conducted an informal poll of 5 women I know that are actually in the firearms industry at a professional level. Each person was asked "Have you ever heard of Paxton Quigley?" Here are their responses:


Nope, who's that?
Didn't Tom Selleck play him in a movie?
Can't say as I have.
What in the hell is a Paxton Quigley?
Sorry, no.


I'm not saying she's bad, although her recent commentary and the godawful teacup grip on the cover of her book would indicate otherwise, but what I am saying is that she's hardly relevant.

Yep. I don't think her impact on the expansion of women involved in CCW is that great.

[TCinVA]

Doing something for a long time doesn't necessarily mean you're doing it correctly.

What does it say about my maturity level that immediately after reading that sentence "That's what she said!" was the first thought to cross my mind?

[will_1400]

What does it say about my maturity level that immediately after reading that sentence "That's what she said!" was the first thought to cross my mind?

I'm just thinking what would happen if someone said something like that to a bunch of Viper jockeys (or any aircrew for that matter). Whatever the topic was prior to that sentence would be completely forgotten about for a while.

[GJM]

She is leading edge on technique, and if you don't believe me, see here:

http://www.paxtonquigley.com/?page_id=11

[Chemsoldier]

She is leading edge on technique, and if you don't believe me, see here:

http://www.paxtonquigley.com/?page_id=11

Holy crap Cooper looks young in that pic (well young for Cooper in my lifetime).

[JAD]

Holy crap Cooper looks young in that pic (well young for Cooper in my lifetime).

Her web page misspells "Gunsite."

[YVK]

She is leading edge on technique, and if you don't believe me, see here:

http://www.paxtonquigley.com/?page_id=11

Gun handling too.

[BigT]

Trigger finger discipline. Unnecessary unless you have one ofthose nasty assualt weapons.

[G60]

All Piers or his producer did was say "find me a weapons trainer who thinks assault weapons are bad."

Note how Piers Morgan denied Amanda Collins' (http://www.nraila.org/news-issues/articles/2011/a-fighting-chance.aspx) request to come on his show and tell her story. He's too much a coward to come face to face with the reality that gun control kills innocent people.

[Slavex]

this Paxton Quigley person needs an editor and proofreader. if I can spot errors on her page without even trying, well, that's just sad.
I agree with the above comments about Piers just looking for someone who would agree with his/Biden's view. I know instructors up here who would say the same thing, but they would also follow it up with, "But it's your choice". Just like CCW isn't for everyone, it should be left up to you to decide what's appropriate, FOR YOU.

[Robert Mitchum]

Piers Morgan He's Dead Last in Cable News Ratings.
Plus he is a total #ucking Ass Hole.....

[NETim]

this Paxton Quigley person needs an editor and proofreader. if I can spot errors on her page without even trying, well, that's just sad.
I agree with the above comments about Piers just looking for someone who would agree with his/Biden's view. I know instructors up here who would say the same thing, but they would also follow it up with, "But it's your choice". Just like CCW isn't for everyone, it should be left up to you to decide what's appropriate, FOR YOU.

Choice is fine as long as .gov says it's okay.

[NMBigfoot02]

I have never heard of this woman prior to this thread. Just for reference, I am in the under 30 group.

Has there been any Zumbo type response by the NRA on this?

[Chemsoldier]

Trigger finger discipline. Unnecessary unless you have one ofthose nasty assualt weapons.

Times change and some people dont.

Look at Bill Jordan's book, he had holsters that did not protect the trigger guard area and wanted you to put your finger on the trigger as soon as they establish their firing grip. Of course, Jordan is dead and his book was published in the 60s. I dont know what Paxton's excuse it.

[Tamara]

That Rule Three picture is probably pushing a quarter century old. Other than a brief trip around the talk show circuit in '05, she's largely been out of the media eye since the early '90s, when her book Armed and Female came out, well-timed for the ramp-up of the Shall Issue movement.

She cleaned up well, was an effective speaker and self-promoter, and those talk show appearances probably sold a lot of Ladysmiths, but she never really struck me as a shooter or a gun nut, just an empowerment and security moto speaker who was okay with guns. Like pax said about the dancing bear...

As far as the "teacup grip" and Rule Three photos, hey, given the time period, I can drag out some roughly contemporaneous Gun Digests and the like that show S.W.A.T. teams gripping their High Powers and Security Sixes in a very similar fashion. The state of the industry was a lot different back when every civilian firearms trainer in America could practically have shared the same business cards if they were allowed to print two columns front and back.

[David Armstrong]

Has she? How would large swaths of women know of her leadership unless they read gun magazines? Not disputing, just askin' cause that's the only place I saw her in the '90's.

Yes, she has. Articles in gun magazines, lots of TV appearances, a well-known book, plenty of public speaking engagements, and so on. As others have said, she is a bit out of date, but at the time she was one of the main figures in getting females into the gun world.

[Tamara]

Yes, she has. Articles in gun magazines, lots of TV appearances, a well-known book, plenty of puclic speaking engagements, and so on.

Ah, David! I'd like to have a beer with you some time if a portal ever opens between our universes. ;)

[David Armstrong]

Make you a deal. Come on down, you buy the beer, I'll buy the crawfish, we'll sit around and discuss who would you rather have for back-up...Bill Jordan or Skeeter Skelton!;)

The state of the industry was a lot different back when every civilian firearms trainer in America could practically have shared the same business cards if they were allowed to print two columns front and back.
I can remember when there were four of them, and I'd trained with three. Slim pickings before the 2nd generation disciples started branching out on their own.

[jetfire]

So that was right after Moses handed the designs for the 1911 to John Moses Browning?

[David Armstrong]

Actually a little further down the line, closer to when Browning figured out Moses was just messing with him on the 1911, so he went off and developed the Hi-Power to fix it.:D

[BigT]

Actually a little further down the line, closer to when Browning figured out Moses was just messing with him on the 1911, so he went off and developed the Hi-Power to fix it.:D


Excusem me sir, it would appear your Rhodesian is showing. :)

[Tamara]

Actually a little further down the line, closer to when Browning figured out Moses was just messing with him on the 1911, so he went off and developed the Hi-Power to fix it.:D

Associating Browning's name with the GP35 is dirty francophone propaganda, and that's all there is to it. :p

[Mr_White]

What does it say about my maturity level that immediately after reading that sentence "That's what she said!" was the first thought to cross my mind?

Some people call that immature. I call it young at heart.

[Palmguy]

Late 20s here, never heard of her before this thread.

Sent from my Galaxy Nexus using Tapatalk 2

[jetfire]

Associating Browning's name with the GP35 is dirty francophone propaganda, and that's all there is to it. :p

Google just found this for me: https://twitter.com/johnmbrowning/status/241633308491014144

[jrm]

She is leading edge on technique, and if you don't believe me, see here:

http://www.paxtonquigley.com/?page_id=11

So in that second photo are they reloading as they reload?

[Tamara]

Google just found this for me: https://twitter.com/johnmbrowning/status/241633308491014144

I refuse to believe that the trigger linkage doesn't have smudgy Roquefort fingerprints all over it, too. It has more monkey-motion Goldberg-esque nonsense than any three JMB designs combined. :D

[jetfire]

I refuse to believe that the trigger linkage doesn't have smudgy Roquefort fingerprints all over it, too. It has more monkey-motion Goldberg-esque nonsense than any three JMB designs combined. :D

Unrelated, this twitter feed is mt new favorite thing.

[Tamara]

To the original topic, nowhere in the video or on her web page does she make any reference to being in favor of an assault weapons ban, or that shotguns are better for defense and no woman needs an AR (which would lead to Piers crowing about "Famous and Totally Relevant Self-Defense Instructor Agrees With AR15 Ban!" which I thoroughly believe he would had the topic even come up.)

At one point, while she was speaking on women buying guns, they did flash an abbreviated version Joe Biden's shotgun quote underneath her picture while she was talking, which could definitely leave the viewer with a subliminal impression that she had "gone on Piers and agreed with the Vice President".

This is going in my Snopes file. No Zumboing of Paxton required.

I'm going to hop in my Supra Turbo and crank up "Smells Like Teen Spirit" and drive down to the store to buy a big-ass sweater and some stirrup pants now...

EDIT: Redact all above. Just found the quote in the transcript. David was right. QUIGLEY: "Well, I agree with him that I think an AR-15 is not something that the normal, average citizen should have." (http://transcripts.cnn.com/TRANSCRIPTS/1302/20/pmt.01.html)

Jesus, Paxton, et tu? Let the Zumboing commence.

[Tamara]

To amend my earlier post (http://pistol-forum.com/showthread.php?7135-Paxton-Quigley-Biden-is-right&p=120374&viewfull=1#post120374), I just noticed that the London Sunday Review cover photo, with her standing there with a 686 in half-Sabrina, booger hook firmly on the bang switch, was dated "200?", which leaves her no excuse. She'd been to Gunsite, dammit.

[JAD]

She'd been to Gunsite, dammit.

Gunsight.

[NETim]

To the original topic, nowhere in the video or on her web page does she make any reference to being in favor of an assault weapons ban, or that shotguns are better for defense and no woman needs an AR (which would lead to Piers crowing about "Famous and Totally Relevant Self-Defense Instructor Agrees With AR15 Ban!" which I thoroughly believe he would had the topic even come up.)

At one point, while she was speaking on women buying guns, they did flash an abbreviated version Joe Biden's shotgun quote underneath her picture while she was talking, which could definitely leave the viewer with a subliminal impression that she had "gone on Piers and agreed with the Vice President".

This is going in my Snopes file. No Zumboing of Paxton required.

I'm going to hop in my Supra Turbo and crank up "Smells Like Teen Spirit" and drive down to the store to buy a big-ass sweater and some stirrup pants now...

EDIT: Redact all above. Just found the quote in the transcript. David was right. QUIGLEY: "Well, I agree with him that I think an AR-15 is not something that the normal, average citizen should have." (http://transcripts.cnn.com/TRANSCRIPTS/1302/20/pmt.01.html)

Jesus, Paxton, et tu? Let the Zumboing commence.

5.11 Stirrup pants? :)

[pax]

5.11 Stirrup pants?

Didn't Erik Estrada wear those in CHiPs?

pax

[Drang]

I'm going to hop in my Supra Turbo and crank up "Smells Like Teen Spirit" and drive down to the store to buy a big-ass sweater and some stirrup pants now...
In for pics of Tam in big-ass sweater and stirrup pants.

[Tamara]

In for pics of Tam in big-ass sweater and stirrup pants.

I hated the stirrup pants fad. With my inseam, I always felt like I was standing in the pockets of a pair of slingshots... :o

[David Armstrong]

Excusem me sir, it would appear your Rhodesian is showing. :)
Ja, the green and white still comes out every now and then!;)

[David Armstrong]

Gunsight.
Nope, Gunsite. Started as API in mid-70s, re-named Gunsite (the old nickname of API) in 1992.

[jetfire]

Nope, Gunsite. Started as API in mid-70s, re-named Gunsite (the old nickname of API) in 1992.

He was making a joke, a reference to the fact that Paxton misspelled it as "Gunsight" on her website.

[NETim]

I hated the stirrup pants fad. With my inseam, I always felt like I was standing in the pockets of a pair of slingshots... :o

Well, if nothing else, I would think a bigass sweater would make a great cover garment. :)

[Tamara]

He was making a joke, a reference to the fact that Paxton misspelled it as "Gunsight" on her website.

Multiple times, no less... Obviously very important to her.

[SecondsCount]

This is not the first time she deserves to be Zumbo'd-
LINK (http://www.thedailybeast.com/articles/2012/07/25/do-u-s-women-need-guns-self-defense-expert-paxton-quigley-says-yes.html)


She is quick to say that she is not advocating assault weapons. Following the recent tragedy in Colorado, in which the shooter reportedly bought 6,000 rounds of ammunition on the Internet, then used weapons including a shotgun, a pistol, and a semiautomatic rifle to kill 12 people and injure dozens more, Quigley says she believes assault weapons should be banned and that ammunition should not be sold online.

I had saved the link back in September when I stumbled on it to remind myself to send her an email but forgot.

Thanks for the reminder.

[Ed L]

I think Tam and other people have summed it up quite well.

I remember Paxton Quigley's self-described background was that she had been a liberal antigunner who came to the realization that it made sense to keep firearms for self defense and became a progunner.

I had her book, Armed And Female, which I loaned out to a woman who was new to guns this past December. I remember looking over it before loaning it to her and concluding that some info on armed home defense was decent, while other info was either outdated or wrong. For example, Paxton Quigley mentioned that centerfire handguns like 9mm and .45 ACP were fine for home defense, but .22 Long arms were too powerful. Obvioulsy, Either of the centerfire handguns previously mentioned are certainly more powerful and have more penetration than a .22 LR fired from a longarm. As mentioned, the Sabrina pose with the finger on the trigger of the revolver is an issue.

Anyway, I introduced this person to shooting, helped her buy her first handgun, and loaned her the book with a suggestion to read a certain section regarding home defense and home security. I also alerted her that some of the things were out of date and some things were simply wrong.

The book was to serve as a supplement to info and training that I provided this person.

The problem was, I was trying to find a good book or source that would highlight the info that would be useful at her level, and I really didn't find any on my bookshelf. I did refer her to the cornered cat website.

I do remember visiting Paxton Quigley's website before lending this person the book and wondering what Quigly had been doing for the last decade or so, since she had seemed to have disappeared from mainstream firearms instruction.

[JAD]

The problem was, I was trying to find a good book or source that would highlight the info that would be useful at her level, and I really didn't find any on my bookshelf. I did refer her to the cornered cat website.
.

My book for beginners of either sex is principles of personal defense. I keep two new copies in my desk drawer at work, and top it off when they go out. Once we've established that it's nice to be armed when possible (which is the 90% takeaway from PPD), I use thunder ranch videos (sometimes the gender appropriate stuff, sometimes not) to breach the topic. I wish Modern Technique of the Pistol was cheaper -- I've only ever given one copy away, and that was to a Philippino friend of mine who used to make sure I was armed the minute I landed at Ninoy Aquino.

Is there a better modern primer?

[pax]

The problem was, I was trying to find a good book or source that would highlight the info that would be useful at her level, and I really didn't find any on my bookshelf. I did refer her to the cornered cat website.

< Shameless Personal Plug >

You do know that Cornered Cat is available as a book, yes?
https://www.corneredcat.com/store/products/signed-book/ -- or through Amazon.

</ Shameless Personal Plug >

pax

[Al T.]

Kathy, that's super! :D

[NETim]

Kathy's book is a good start IMHO. Julie Golob's book "Shoot" is one I'd heartily recommend to an absolute newbie shooter of any gender.