Home security: replacing patio door w regular door?

[Dov]

It will be a while yet before we can stop renting and buy, but its getting close enough I am starting to look at houses more seriously.

One thing that drives me nuts from security side is patio sliding doors, no way to really make them secure IMO. Yeah you can make them harder to open, but they are fragile and people or critters can walk right through the glass.

In our apartment we have essentially "fenced" the inside of the patio door we have with Dewalt shelving that has several hundred lbs on it (bunch of my dumb bells and weight plates on bottom shelf) and gf's craft stuff in totes rest of the way up including piled high on top shelf so totes on top will work as mechanical stop to make it hard to push shelf over in addition to the 700+ lbs total.

Anyway I've always assumed it isn't very difficult to replace patio door with good conventional solid core swinging door.

Is that correct? Or is it a bigger issue than I think?

Tried googling but all I'm finding is turning windows into patio doors not deleting the patio door.

[Totem Polar]

I have the fix-it aptitude of a bridge troll, so I can’t help on the reframing and door swap. However, I’ll offer up this idea on the topic of fragile sliding door glass that burglars and fat kids can crash through:

https://www.amazon.com/Security-Shatterproof-Windows-Shatter-Tempered/dp/B0B2JWXPB2/

[Malamute]

I was going to suggest the security film, but was beat to it. Theres various makers, 3M being perhaps the best known. You can search vids about it on youtube, it is a significant upgrade in window and glass door security.

Theres other things that can help, using a rod inside the track if the opening door is inside the fixed one, being sure the rollers are adjusted up high enough the door cant be lifted out of the track, and good locks. One I had for a time had a pin that was inserted through holes drilled in the frame bodies. No lifting or picking was going to remove it easily.

First thing to do on any doors is replace all the door hardware with 3" screws, its a huge upgrade in security and very cheap. All the latch side and deadbolt, and at least one if not more or all the hinge side screws should also be done. Just dont overdo the torque and flex the frame if its not shimmed tightly at the hardware points.

I dont know if there are security grates for sliding doors, but the security oriented storm doors are helpful also, and dont all look like youre forting up. You may not make it impossible to get in, but if you harden it enough that it becomes too much of an effort, or slows them down enough you can respond in a timely manner, you have succeeded.

[TGS]

Regarding security film, just note that a lot of the advertisements present the security film being applied to tempered glass, whereas the window that gets easily broken is regular plate glass. This is an apples to oranges comparison which gives people a false impression of what security film does.

Security film does not make the glass harder to break. All it does is keep the glass pieces stuck to the film, with the film providing a thin plastic barrier that the intruder has to tear away from the frame after breaking the glass.

Next up, those demos will commonly use an example which has the security film applied to the entire pane of glass, underneath the edges. This makes it a little harder to tear away. Most people do not end up installing it in this fashion, largely because of modern window construction preventing you from doing such.

It'll add a little time for you to react, but it's not going to be a game changer like how switching out the door frame screws to 3" can have a dramatic impact on security. For an entire sliding glass door, you likely already have laminated glass (or tempered) due to safety codes....and if you don't, that's legitimately a huge life-safety issue that needs to be addressed by replacing the entire door, because someone is going to die if they trip and fall into the glass. Adding a security film isn't going to do anything at all for laminated glass, since laminated glass is essentially a factory-built "security film" integrated with the glass from the initial manufacturing stages, and is already much stronger than security film added to plate glass. With tempered glass, it'll give you the same advantage as putting it on plate glass, in that once they break the glass they have to cut/tear through the plastic security film.

Short of being able to order security glass (think bullet proof glass), the only way to meaningfully improve the security of a sliding glass patio door if you're worried about someone breaking through it is to replace it with conventional doors. Security glass is generally multiple layers of tempered glass which is also sandwiched with lamination. This is usually viewed as cost prohibitive for the average joe, but I did it because I'm a fucking geek for security measures. $28k for 8 windows, frame-up restoration, pre-covid. I'm sure the cost has gone up since covid.

ETA: There's a specific sealant (epoxy?) that you can apply to the edge of the glass after applying the security film to bond it to the window frame, which will increase the resistance of the security film being torn away after the glass is broken. However, many people won't apply this residentially due to appearance, and especially with large pieces like a sliding glass door, it won't do anything to prevent the person from punching a hole through the window and tearing it open (as opposed to tearing it away from the frame).

[HeavyDuty]

I’m planning on using that film on a few of my windows after we had two blow out in a tornado associated hailstorm - cleaning up all the fragments and shards has been a real pain in the ass.

[UNK]

My patio door has a spring loaded and locking pin that goes into the bottom of the frame plus a key lock.
I dont think most entries are from breaking glass. Its pretty easy to get a swinging door open with a pry bar.
They make a metal plate that you screw into the door frame from the inside. It goes well above and below the handle/deadbolt. Then you screw it into the 2x4 rough opening. The key is to use long screws. Also long screws for the strike plate and hinges that go into the 2x4s. Be sure to shim securely around the strike plate and deadbolt.

Replacing a door if fairly simple except for if you need metal flashing on the outside. You need to take the trim off and measure your rough opening. Remove the top piece first. From the top. You can reuse your trim so be careful removing it. Thats how you order your new door. Im sure your local hardware store has higher security doors including steel. The problem is they mostly come in wood frames so again long screws. You can also get one of those stoppers screw it to the door then flip it down when you are inside. Dont get fiberglass they will split in the middle if kicked hard enough.

If you want a really secure lock go to a locksmith.

[CraigS]

While this certainly isn't guaranteed to be universal, a good thing is that there are a lot of double doors available that fit right into the rough opening, in place of a sliding door. Our basement has a steel double door. Hinges for both doors are on the outside edges of the opening. The door we don't use that much has a standard looking knob but the is no turning it. It is locked into the closed position by sliders in the edge at top and bottom. These slide into the frame. The normally used door has a standard knob w/ latch and a deadbolt so it latches/locks into the more stationary door. Our deck door is similar, although mostly glass, except that the one door doesn't move at all. If you have done some remodeling, replacing a door assembly is actually pretty easy. The only difficult part is moving the old one out and the new one in. 6ft wide pretty much requires 2 people. But, if you remove the doors themselves from the assembly by removing the hinge pins, then the weight is substantially reduced.

[4RNR]

My sliding glass door is in the walkout basement, which is just to the right and underneath the deck. There are no steps going up to the deck but it also kinda makes the space just outside the door hard to see unless you walk directly out onto the deck. I thought about having it changed, (and I still may change the actual door) but I stopped worrying about "security". I just have an aluminum pole that comes down and a broom handle, cut to size, laying on the tracks as well as a camera on the deck looking down at the area in front of the door. To be "secure" I would have to cinderblock the whole first floor. My front facing window is huge and only about chest high. Anyone with a step stool or upper body strength of a tween can get in.

Im going to guess that a lot of this will depend on where you live.

[Cory]

Specific Answers:
-Film
-Prop Rod Dowel
-Obstructions
-French Door Replacement.

More in depth:

In my opinion home security requires a layered approach. Before the door ever becomes a problem there are other things that need to be considered.

-Selection. Does my house look good to me, but bad to a burglar? If my house is in a good neighborhood, or at least not in a bad neighborhood that's the first step. Next, does my home have too much curb appeal and make me look more affluent than others in the neighborhood? Are there enough houses around for that to even matter? Do I leave boxes for expensive items out at the curb? Does my mail stack up like I might not be home? Look at your house and ask yourself if it would be a target that makes sense. Also recognize that "They are not you" (William Aprill is missed). Meaning that it could be targeted despite any rational explanation.
-Property line. Is there a fence? Is there a hedge row? Is there any physical obstacle? There may not be, and that's fine.
-Exterior. Is it well lighted? Are there visible home security cameras? Real cameras aren't that pricey anymore, and they are a true deterrent.
-Alerts. Is there a security company sticker or sign? Is there a dog? Is it a home where friends and family frequently go and a neer-do-well is likely to be interrupted? Do the neighbors know who belongs and who doesn't?
-Entry point.**You are here** Are the doors secured with longer screws to hold them in place better? Are the doors consistently locked? How much time will getting through the entry point take? Every home CAN be entered. It's just a matter of time, noise, and attention.
-Interior. Firearms secured but accessible? Shooting lanes thought out in advance? If you aren't home are you firearms and other important items secure enough to take to long to steal? Do you have insurance coverage? What if you are home? What if you're home with your wife and kid? In my home, unwanted entry of a stranger is the line of confrontation in the greatest of absolutes.

I have a sliding glass door to a back porch. It has film, a security company sticker, gets locked prop-rodded every night, and half of it is blocked with large plant stands. There is still the risk of outdoor furniture or fireplace bricks being used to break in. If that occurs the person is already on camera and saved online. In addition if I'm home I'm comfortable that the door will provide enough time for me to properly confront them.

[RoyGBiv]

In our apartment we have essentially "fenced" the inside of the patio door we have with Dewalt shelving that has several hundred lbs on it (bunch of my dumb bells and weight plates on bottom shelf) and gf's craft stuff in totes rest of the way up including piled high on top shelf so totes on top will work as mechanical stop to make it hard to push shelf over in addition to the 700+ lbs total.

I hope you don't ever need that door for emergency egress.



While this certainly isn't guaranteed to be universal, a good thing is that there are a lot of double doors available that fit right into the rough opening, in place of a sliding door. Our basement has a steel double door. Hinges for both doors are on the outside edges of the opening. The door we don't use that much has a standard looking knob but the is no turning it. It is locked into the closed position by sliders in the edge at top and bottom. These slide into the frame. The normally used door has a standard knob w/ latch and a deadbolt so it latches/locks into the more stationary door. Our deck door is similar, although mostly glass, except that the one door doesn't move at all. If you have done some remodeling, replacing a door assembly is actually pretty easy. The only difficult part is moving the old one out and the new one in. 6ft wide pretty much requires 2 people. But, if you remove the doors themselves from the assembly by removing the hinge pins, then the weight is substantially reduced.

I was going to suggest this as well.
Not only do I despise sliding doors for the inevitability of them not wanting to slide, the types of locks commonly used on them are inherently crap too. I swapped a sliding door for a double door on my last house (the perfect size door was on the floor at Lowes... it dropped right in with a few shims.) and we immediately went from always using the front door to always using the back door for entry. The keyless entry lock was the Chef's Kiss. Double doors are, as stated above, easier to find with better security.

[Darth_Uno]

We've done it plenty of times. Might need to reframe the rough opening size, which unfortunately may also involve removing/replacing drywall or siding, and/or getting creative with how you trim out the inside or outside.

It's not difficult and any competent carpenter can do it, but might be more involved than you think. It's very rarely as simple as removing one door and putting a different one in.

That said, we have a slider onto our deck because part of why we bought our property is the view (it's not majestic, but we back up to "the woods"). If someone wants to get in when nobody's home, they're getting in regardless. Don't make it any easier for them than you have to, but unless you want to live in a windowless concrete block there's going to be some tradeoffs with security.

[Navin Johnson]

Sliding glass doors are amazingly efficient at access for the owner and outside view and they self store.

The biggest problem is the nefarious can see inside and look at all those computers and TVs, etc.

With an adequate lock, the sliding door is not an ideal target for breaking in as it’s very noisy a size 11 with some velocity on a regular door is quieter and easier.

If they want to get in your house, they’re going to get in your house meaning video cameras, alarms, etc.

Have insurance

A dog is by far your best deterrent unless you want your house to look like a psycho fort

I am not sure if your goal is to get rid of the door cause you don’t like it or to protect you while you’re in the house or to keep people out while you’re out of the house. Those are different goals.


Windows are often a much easier way, and also due to being more hidden And have much easier glass to break

[cosermann]

Another way to prevent lifting the door from it's tracks is to put 2" or 3" screws in the top track and back them out just far enough that the door will slide. Then, they protrude enough to keep the door from being lifted out of the tracks.

When I was younger, my folks had a storm window/door cover over the patio door. They weren't thinking from a security perspective, but it was an additional layer to break through if one wanted to come in that way.

[Dov]

I really don't like the insecurity of Patio doors.

I have plans to improve security of the windows as well, I know people that have had home/business burglarized via window. And really don't want to come home to someone who broke in still in the house, or worse have that happen to the gf. One of my best friends had coworker who was severely injured by ex that broke into her house via basement window and ambushed her after she got home with a hammer.

I don't trust noisy as being a deterrent, just based on personal experience with actual assaults on people in public and no one even calling 911.

Neighbors if they noticed something odd might do something, but not something to rely on IMHO. Most people just are not aware enough and even if they notice something most are not trained and practiced with a good plan.

For bedroom windows most likely will go with Impact Resistant Windows a tougher version of Hurricane windows https://www.aoaconstruction.com/news/content/difference-between-hurricane-and-impact-windows/

If budget won't allow that quickly will just do interior security shutter for sleeping room so emergency egress is not a problem but violent entry is slowed down. I have at least 3 cost effective ways of doing that: Cheapest least aesthetically pleasing would just be plywood with cloth covering so plywood shutter looks like curtains at first glance from both sides.

Windows other than sleeping room ones will get ether security film and/or security shutters.

For more vulnerable widows or potential entry points, the external security can be improved by adding lightning, landscaping (things I've considered: koi pond=moat for one window, flower trellis can be functional fence), or something like fenced in dog kennel.

A Koi pond with night lights can accomplish multiple objectives, the lights at night will attract free food (insects) for the fish if you keep it stocked with fish, as well as the security illumination backlighting intruders. To neighbors it would just be a Koi pond, no more than slightly eccentric. From Disaster Prep aspect it can serve as a reserve of food and water. The depth of the pond would make accessing the window more difficult.