MAC 1911-9 DS

[Tokarev]

I picked this up from my local dealer this afternoon.

Initial impressions are decent. The finish is smooth and even and the gun appears free of any nasty tooling or machine marks. The frame and slide fit is decent. Not hand-fit tight but not loose and rattling either. The barrel fits pretty nicely at the muzzle and does have a little bounce or spring at the ejection port.

The gun is Commander length but the dust cover is a little longer than the usual Commander. A TLR-1 with the 1913 key fits fine. An X300B also seems to fit but the battery cap is right up against the front of the trigger guard. I don't suppose that's a big issue.

The guide rod is one piece and requires a paper clip or little piece of wire poked through the spring guide to take apart. The recoil spring seems a little heavy. I'd guess it is 14 pounds.

The barrel is bull style and is ramped in the Clark / Para style.

The front and rear are both dovetailed. The front is fiber optic. The rear is Novak in appearance. I don't know the actual dovetail measurements of either. Hopefully they aren't something oddball.

The trigger is crisp and measures right at five pounds. The trigger itself could fit a little better. It has a bit of side-to-side as well as up and down play. The safety snaps on and off cleanly but the detent spring seems a little light. Conversely the magazine release spring seems a bit heavier than it needs to be.

So overall fit and finish seems good. I don't see anything alarming yet. The only complaint I have right now is that the iron sights aren't high enough to work with a Holosun 508T. If and when MAC comes out with an EPS plate I'm sure the standard sights will be fine.

The gun ships in a black nylon zippered bag that is basically a knockoff of the Staccato gun bag. It came with an RMR plate, two mags, a bore brush and cleaning rod and a cable lock.

One thing I do see right off the bat is that the mag release is the Gen 2 Staccato style. I don't know if it will actually swap with a Staccato part.

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[Tokarev]

I haven't shot the gun yet, but I did spend a good amount of time dry firing at the TV last night.

The trigger is actually quite good. It is a little on the heavy side but still usable as is. The trigger itself is long and flat with a little bit of texture on its face. It is longer than what usually comes in 1911s or 2011s nowadays. I'd equate it to a current length trigger from other makers with the concave surface removed. Does that make sense? Personally, I'd prefer it to be a tad shorter, but it will work fine for the time being.

The gun is generally devoid of sharp edges and rough spots, although the top edges of the thumb safety could use a little bit more radius. They certainly aren't bad, but I can feel the edges when gripping the gun and working the safety on and off. Cocking serrations are decent and work okay but could stand to be a little deeper and/or more aggressive. But in theory the gun will be reliable and cocking serrations will only be needed to initially load and then unload when on the range.

The grip texture is somewhat smooth and could stand to be a bit more aggressive as well. The mainspring housing is plastic with molded checkering. The front strap is also checkered. The sides of the grip are a sort of interrupted series of lines. It looks okay but doesn't have much tooth.

The gun does not stall on the disconnector like everyone's Prodigy seems to. The slide does not have a Marvel cut but is radiused so as not to hang.

The extractor seems to have decent tension out of the box. A loaded round placed under the hook stays under its own weight and takes a little jiggling to fall off.

The gun is S70 style with a titanium firing pin.

I haven't had the gun apart yet other than to field strip for an initial cleaning and oiling. Once I have a couple hundred rounds fired, I'll take it completely apart to see how things are wearing.

So far, I'd say it compares nicely to the Prodigy in general features and includes an aluminum magazine well that the Springfield lacks. I'd also say it is a much better value than the similar EAA Witness 2311. EAA will have to step up its game or lower the price to compete with the MAC. I'd guess the EAA is actually going to compare more directly to the less expensive and fewer features Tisas than to the MAC. Frankly, there's no reason to consider the EAA over the MAC unless you specifically want the aluminum frame of the EAA for whatever reason.

I have emailed SDS Imports to inquire about other optic plates and to ask about dovetail dimensions. I don't mind running my Holosun 508 here but do want the iron sights to be tall enough to be seen. It isn't a duty gun but I still want the option to use the irons from time to time. I will hopefully have an answer shortly.

I will hopefully shoot the gun sometime this weekend. I'll update as soon as I do.

Happy Saturday!




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[Tokarev]

Regarding the optic plate. I'm going to predict that these will be solid and secure.

Note in this picture I stole off the American Rifleman website that there are two small pin holes in front of the mounting screw holes. These pin holes align with two small pins on the bottom of the plate. There is also a semicircular cut in front of the firing pin stop plate that mates with a corresponding cut on the plate. Then the back of the slide itself has a sort of angled shelf that should serve as a recoil lug.

I haven't mounted an optic yet obviously but I'm confident the included RMR plate will work well once I figure the iron sights out.

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The semicircular cut is kind of hard to see in this photo. I can try to get a better one later.

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[03RN]

Thanks

[Tokarev]

https://youtu.be/hFIJze_fQb4?si=YQeh8m8I8Ob0gglj

[Tokarev]

Here is a look at the pistol bag. It has a faint chemical smell to it. I assume it is the black dye. Maybe it is some kind of mildew treatment.

These is a zippered pocket on the outside. The inside is open with sewn in loops on one side for mags and then moveable straps for the pistol. The two sides are separated by a padded flap. It is a little big and bulky but is actually a pretty decent range bag.
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[Tokarev]

The iron sights. U notched rear with serrations. Fiber optic front with no serrations.

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[Tokarev]

And the pistol this Saturday morning.

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[60167]

This is the post I've been waiting for!

Where does this stand compared to the Prodigy? My hypothesis is that all things being equal, you get a free magwell and a better finish.

[Tokarev]

This is the post I've been waiting for!

Where does this stand compared to the Prodigy? My hypothesis is that all things being equal, you get a free magwell and a better finish.Yes. Free mag well and probably a more secure optic mounting plate. The MAC doesn't have any MIM either for whatever that's worth.

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[Trooper224]

I handled one of these today for the first time. My observations eco Tokarevs. I'm not deep into the 2011 tall grass, but I have spent some time with a Staccato. This is not that, but niether is the price. I'm a bit puzzled by the lack of any texturing on the mag release. I'd also like the texturing on the grip to be a bit more aggressive. But, niether of those seem to be deal breakers. I'd say the trigger on this sample was a clean five pounds. Everything seemed to operate smoothly. I recently handled an LFA Apollo 11 and, IMHO, that's hot garbage. I suspect the Tisas will be the way to go, if getting out of the boat and going all the way with a Staccato isn't preferable or possible.

[Tokarev]

I handled one of these today for the first time. My observations eco Tokarevs. I'm not deep into the 2011 tall grass, but I have spent some time with a Staccato. This is not that, but niether is the price. I'm a bit puzzled by the lack of any texturing on the mag release. I'd also like the texturing on the grip to be a bit more aggressive. But, niether of those seem to be deal breakers. I'd say the trigger on this sample was a clean five pounds. Everything seemed to operate smoothly. I recently handled an LFA Apollo 11 and, IMHO, that's hot garbage. I suspect the Tisas will be the way to go, if getting out of the boat and going all the way with a Staccato isn't preferable or possible.Never get out of the boat. Unless you're getting mangoes.

I'd like to see the MAC and the cheaper Tisas side by side. My guess is the MAC would be the easy button for a shooter wanting essentially a turn key option. The Tisas will probably be the better bet as a builder. Maybe Skinner Precision, LLC can post his thoughts on this.

Hopefully the metallurgy on all these is good. That was one of the things that came up from time to time with the Filipino guns.

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[Tokarev]

I was texting with a buddy who works for a fairly large retail shop and indoor range in AZ. He says the shop has a MAC on order for the rental counter. I'll have to keep in touch with him to see how the gun performs in this capacity.

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[Skinner Precision, LLC]

Never get out of the boat. Unless you're getting mangoes.

I'd like to see the MAC and the cheaper Tisas side by side. My guess is the MAC would be the easy button for a shooter wanting essentially a turn key option. The Tisas will probably be the better bet as a builder. Maybe Skinner Precision, LLC can post his thoughts on this.

Hopefully the metallurgy on all these is good. That was one of the things that came up from time to time with the Filipino guns.

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First blush opinion, the MAC is nicer, it may be because of extra polising before the finishing but there are more machine marks on the tisas (dealer cost is also significantly less). If the Tisas had a bull barrel instead of a bushing barrel, I probably would have already milled in some ports. The tisas had decent fit on the barrel bushing but when you press downward on the hood there is some movement, I would hope with the stated competition emphasis of the MAC that the barrel would fit better. Tisas also has a GI style recoil spring plug (I didn't even check slide to see if it was reverse cut on the slide ) not really good or bad, easier to disassemble than a 1 price guide rod but not as nice as a dawson tooless...

I am well over 500 rounds (probably over 750 in the three range sessions i have had with it) with the only bobble being when my son got a gen 1 sti (Geppeto workshop era) practice mag out of the range bag and had a feed issue. When I realized what he did, I duplicated the feed issue 5 times hand cycling it and declared it a mag issue. With gen 2/3 staccato, old style SVI, and checkmate mags it hasn't bobbled. I still need to detail strip and look at the insides. While I have it apart I will pin gauge the extractor tunnel in the slide as Tokarev asked about it and I never responded.

If your high cap 1911 budget previously only allowed a broke down para or a Ria highcap , either of the TISAS/MAC options is way better IMO. I would take either over a EAA girsan or a Prodigy also but it isn't a staccato or custom. I have more than one friend or acquaintance who wants a STI/Staccato after a couple of runs on the plate rack, right up until I tell them the price.

Deciding between the two, the optics plate vs direct mount, bull barrel vs bushing,longer dust cover, and a better finish all make me lean towards the MAC but I would say either is a great gateway drug for the non 2011 owner. If you really plan on swapping out a lot of parts and or whittling on the slide etc go for the cheaper one...

[Tokarev]

Skinner Precision, LLC can you do me another favor and check the mag catch in the Tisas? Is it the newer Staccato style or the old legacy STI style? I'm also wondering if the polymer frame has the wider material reinforced areas above the trigger guard that Staccato is doing nowadays.

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[Phred]

…If your high cap 1911 budget previously only allowed a broke down para or a Ria highcap , either of the TISAS/MAC options is way better IMO. I would take either over a EAA girsan or a Prodigy also but it isn't a staccato or custom.

Can you expound on this? I’ve been wanting to get into the 2011 world for a little while now. I’m not really interested in spending Staccato money, as this will be a range toy more than anything. I was pretty set on the Prodigy when in was announced, but held off due to the teething issues it exhibited. Was considering pulling the trigger on a Prodigy soon, then the MAC comes on the scene. Why is the MAC a better option than the Prodigy?

[Skinner Precision, LLC]

Can you expound on this? I’ve been wanting to get into the 2011 world for a little while now. I’m not really interested in spending Staccato money, as this will be a range toy more than anything. I was pretty set on the Prodigy when in was announced, but held off due to the teething issues it exhibited. Was considering pulling the trigger on a Prodigy soon, then the MAC comes on the scene. Why is the MAC a better option than the Prodigy?


If there isn't a compelling reason to dive in, it may be safer to sit back another year and see how the Tisas hold up. Given that it is an election year, investing in staccato/atlas/or checkmate magazines now while contemplating the pros and cons of which one you land on may be prudent. I say this not as a fear monger but as someone who was USPSA competitor in the post'94 AWB 90's where mag cost /availability was unthinkable for most who have started more recently.

Initially, I was interested in a Prodigy when they came out but they seemed to all go to high volume dealers first and by the time the dust settled a little , my enthusiasm waned with the teething problems.

As a range toy any of the three (tisas, MAC made by tisas, and SA ) will probably suffice, I am not advocating any of them for "duty" applications. There is a non-insignificant cost delta. SA puts a fair amount of MIM parts in theirs where Tisas has moved away from MIM in their 1911's (yes, I know not all MIM is the same).

I am not ready to declare Tisas DS as superior based on my sample of 1 but I have been happy with the reliability and what I got for what I paid.

I would be less aggravated having to fit a good extractor to a $749 tisas or a $899 MAC than a $ 1334 Prodigy (I used Blackhawk armory retail prices for a apples to apples comparison).

I am not a fan of Prodigy mags (based on the 2 mags I bought to try out when the Prodigy first came out) and prefer other choices so the price delta increases w/getting better mags from the start.

A tricked out Prodigy, the way you like it, after playing with it, may cost you 70-80% of a used staccato but it is hard to sell them for that, with a cheaper base gun you don't price yourself into a tougher resell (1911addicts.com classifieds is a decent place to look at selling trends for this market).

[Tokarev]

I put almost 300 rounds through the MAC this morning. Ammo was a mix of some 90 grain frangible, various weights and brands of JHP and then some 125ish power factor game loads.

The gun is fun to shoot and decently accurate. At 25 yards I can keep five rounds into two and a half or three inches. A few groups were a little better. While not stellar I think that's okay for an off the shelf mass production 1911 style pistol.

The trigger is good but per my earlier comment I think it is a little too long. Most groups were pushed slightly left. The sights appear centered on the gun so I'm likely pushing the gun that way a little when I shoot. I think a slightly shorter trigger may help. Or maybe not.

The recoil spring is too heavy for target loads. I had one failure to feed with an Atlas 20rd and then three or four instances where the slide didn't lock open when empty. This was all with my USPSA stuff. Duty / JHP locked the slide open just fine.

The rear sight plate worked loose around 150 rounds in. I caught it and tightened it before it became an issue. All the other screws stayed tight and are still there. No missing cap screw in the trigger guard, etc.

The gun passes the 10-8 extractor test mostly. It didn't malfunction with no mag in but ejection was a little scattered. I did the test early on and then again at the end of the day. I didn't notice any change in ejection pattern.

I'm pleased. I think I'm off to a good start.

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[Tokarev]

This isn't my pic. But just to give everyone an idea of where the iron sight on the RMR plate falls.

Why, MAC? Why?

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[Tokarev]

MJD posting on socialist media that his grip fits the MAC nicely.

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[Tokarev]

Out of curiosity I used my reloading dial calipers to measure from the grip safety (depressed) to the center face of the trigger.

On the MAC this distance is 2.83 inches. This same measurement on my Prodigy is 2.72 inches. So a full tenth of an inch longer on the Turkish gun.

I don't have a Staccato presently available to make this same measurement. Does anyone have a Staccato P lying around they can check?

Then regarding the sights. The front sight on the MAC measures .186" from the top of the slide radius to the tip of the sight. The Prodigy is .250" at the same spot.

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[Tokarev]

A small update regarding sights.

Since Trooper224 has had good luck getting John Harrison to put sights on a Tisas, I sent Mr. Harrison an email to ask about the MAC. He said he didn't want to be involved with it. He's done two Tisas sights swaps now and doesn't want to mess with a third.

Then regarding different optics plate. I sent MAC an IM through socialist media. The rep told me additional optic plates won't be available until late summer or early fall. In gun time that probably means spring of 2025.



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[Trooper224]

A small update regarding sights.

Since Trooper224 has had good luck getting John Harrison to put sights on a Tisas, I sent Mr. Harrison an email to ask about the MAC. He said he didn't want to be involved with it. He's done two Tisas sights swaps now and doesn't want to mess with a third.

Then regarding different optics plate. I sent MAC an IM through socialist media. The rep told me additional optic plates won't be available until late summer or early fall. In gun time that probably means spring of 2025.

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Based upon the exchanges I've had with him, that doesn't surprise me at all. I'm glad I got in when I did. I made a point of asking if he'd work on a Tisas. His reply was, "no problem". I guess an afternoon with my project was enough to turn that into, "I'm too old for this shit." 😅

Everything else I've installed, on the 1911s, has been pretty straightforward in the fitting. But, the company really seems to have slid into it sideways on the sight specs.

[Tokarev]

the company really seems to have slid into it sideways on the sight specs.

It does seem odd that Tisas would take the time to make a gun that will accept STI grips, use STI mags and then also 1911 hammer and sear parts but then do something proprietary on the sights. I guess it would be different if SDS sold a good variety of sights or if someone like Ameriglo or Night Fision had a good selection.

Now I'm curious if the Glock dovetail on the rear sight plate is actually Glock.

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[Tokarev]

A more detailed response from SDS regarding optic plates:

A change was made to the geometery of the plate from pre-production to final production that allowed greater adjusment to the optics zero, but the down side was we lost the co-witness with the Std. sights. We're working new sights and other optics style plates for Q2-4 releases

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[Tokarev]

Too late to edit. Here's an edited / updated version of the SDS response

Pre-Production models of the MAC-9 Double Stack used an optics adapter plate that had different geometry than what we shipped with the production pistols. This change to the plates allowed better zero with most optics without an extreme adjustment in elevation with more model of optics, than the “flat” style plates that allowed us to get that co-witness with the pre-production models.

As 2024 rolls on, we will explore different options for additional adapter plates to other optic footprints and sights to accommodate the Tisas front dovetail cut that will allow co-witness or use with a suppressor.”

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[Tokarev]

60 rounds fired yesterday, which puts me a tad over 300. The gun continues to shoot well.

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[60167]

Ok here we go.

115570


The gun should be in tomorrow or Friday. I'm replacing the springs and firing pin right off the bat to make sure we are starting off on the right foot. I'll update with round counts like I did with the prodigy thread if anybody cares to follow along. My long term plans involve a new trigger, safety and grip frame to match my prodigy since this will be a less expensive understudy.

[Tokarev]

Ok here we go.

115570


The gun should be in tomorrow or Friday. I'm replacing the springs and firing pin right off the bat to make sure we are starting off on the right foot. I'll update with round counts like I did with the prodigy thread if anybody cares to follow along. My long term plans involve a new trigger, safety and grip frame to match my prodigy since this will be a less expensive understudy.Did you get a new recoil spring guide? I don't think that EGW spring will work with the factory Tisas part.

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[60167]

Did you get a new recoil spring guide? I don't think that EGW spring will work with the factory Tisas part.

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Drat.

[Tokarev]

A semi-interesting thing about the factory guide rod. It is one piece with a small hole for a paper clip. This isn't unusual. What's different is that the rod itself is drilled clear through. In essence, it is just a really long version of the standard GI guide.

The Atlas Gunworks tool-less rod for the 4.25" Prodigy fits in the MAC and hand cycles okay. I assume the gun would run fine with the Atlas and a conventional 12 or 14 pound spring as a replacement.

I'd guess the EGW .25" flat wire guide rod itself would work except the reverse plug is probably not going to bottom out properly in the slide. That's just a guess. The reverse plug in the MAC could be made in someone else's pattern. I do know it has a different shoulder than the Prodigy reverse plug. But maybe there's someone else's plug that will work?

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[Tokarev]

The gun should be in tomorrow or Friday.
60167 any news for us?

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[60167]

60167 any news for us?

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Apparently the shop was closed when they attempted to deliver. Now we wait until next business day/next time I’m available to go pick it up. I feel like I never have a good experience when I order guns online.

[60167]

Apparently the shop was closed when they attempted to deliver. Now we wait until next business day/next time I’m available to go pick it up. I feel like I never have a good experience when I order guns online.

115703

[Tokarev]

I just got a 14# recoil spring from Atlas and swapped it for the factory spring. It made the gun a little easier to cycle but it still seems a bit stiff. I probably could have gone with a 12 pounder but I do want to keep it fairly heavily sprung for JHP stuff. Not that I plan on shooting a ton of defensive ammo but I kind of want to keep that as an option without changing out the spring.

On a related note I also bought an Atlas +1 lockback follower to try. The mag I put it in now holds 19 rounds and can be seated fairly easily on a closed slide. Maybe after a little use I'll be able to cram 20 into it.



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[Tokarev]

Atlas mag.

It will take 20 but it is crammed full and is very hard to seat on a closed slide. Loaded with 19 it seats easily.

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[Tokarev]

I swapped out the factory recoil spring for a 14# spring from Atlas. The gun seems to work better now. I had no failures to lock open now using the same 130-ish power factor ammo I used last time.

The gun, overall, continues to work well. It shoots good and is fun to shoot. Trigger is still a bit heavy. Fine for SD or general carry at around five pounds but a tad heavy for fast and cool splits for an Instagram video.

I did bend in the extractor a bit more. I only tried five rounds with no mag in but ejection seemed consistent.

The only complaints I have at this time involve the optics plates. I still haven't used the RMR plate because I haven't come up with a solution for taller sights yet. If I have to pay a Smith to install some taller sights I might as well wait until I have about 1,000 rounds through the gun to see if it needs any other work. The other complaint is that the rear sight iron sight plate came loose again. It gets loose about every 150 rounds. I put some orange Permatex on the screws this evening. Hopefully they will stay put now until I get something figured out for optics.



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[Tokarev]

Here's a little something I found while dry firing the pistol. Pressure on the exposed bump on the slide stop axle will push the slide stop out of the frame when the slide is forward. I'll take a good look and see if I can't find out what the issue is. Just one more thing to watch out for when inspecting a MAC for possible purchase....

A couple of quick measurements of the MAC and a Prodigy slide stop show:

MAC pin .201"

Prodigy pin .197"

MAC top to bottom of lobe .243"

Prodigy top to bottom of lobe .253"

The Prodigy slide stop fits into the MAC and seems to stay put like it should. The MAC pin's diameter is too large to fit into the Prodigy. It won't even start to fit.

[60167]

115703

STILL WAITING. I have the worst luck.

[Tokarev]

https://youtu.be/MiDQTViCuXY?si=peoXPNtDAlQ2XzbB

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[Tokarev]

https://eleven71design.com/

Eleven71 has a MAC slide inbound. Once he's had a chance to take measurements he'll have optic plates available. Probably three weeks or so before something is available.

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[Tokarev]

Aaron Cowan has one of these. He's working on a 2K review now.

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[Tokarev]

STILL WAITING. I have the worst luck.Surely you've received the pistol by now?

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[Tokarev]

My MAC is back from customer service. All they did was replace the slide stop. I'd have done that had they just sent me the part.

The old slide stop axle was something like .203 and the gun had a pretty tight lock up. The new stop is .199 or .200 so the lock up isn't as tight as before. I didn't measure the lobe that interacts with the slide but the new one is tall enough that it can't be just pushed out of the gun.

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[Tokarev]

AC has his 2k review up for Patreon subscribers. He likes the gun.

No issues with the mounting plate during the drop tests. No feed or extraction issues and his pistol's controls work well and move freely. He does comment several times on the heavy recoil spring. He has numerous failures to lock open on empty that he attributes to the recoil spring. I had the same issues with my sample.

He's going to continue to shoot it and will probably send it to Joe Chambers to get a gunsmith perspective.

Until then, train accordingly. Whatever that means.....

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[Tokarev]

https://youtu.be/v4qwdic7jxg?si=isV3zbA_MkKEwuIu

[Tokarev]

My two budget 1911 hicap guns.

The Apollo is a little tighter overall than the MAC. The trigger is lighter on the Apollo at just under four pounds but it feels a little spongy. The MAC is crisp and comes in at right about five pounds.

Personally I like the styling of the MAC better but there's something to be said about supporting an American manufacturer. If LFA ditched the slide ports and went with a more traditional set of cocking serrations I'd like the gun much more. And they need to ditch the funky 3D printed grip module. It just has a super cheap feel to it.

Another thing I note is that the LFA won't fit (actually it will but I have to cram it in there) my US Duty Gear rotating hood holster. The MAC fits this holster nicely. Another reason not to be excited about the Apollo slide profile.
https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20240420/d0494011d263081b8e47aaf2e104fb35.jpg

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[60167]

Ok. I'll have the gun in hand tomorrow. I ordered it on Feb 21, it was out for delivery Feb 29th... fast forward a BUNCH of silly BS I won't get into.... and it was finally delivered to my FFL yesterday. I tried to pick up today and the shop was closed without reason during scheduled business hours... which is coincidentally why it hasn't been successfully delivered up until yesterday. It's only almost May, but I digress.


After watching the most recent YouTube reviews, I see that I'm on the right track by planning to replace the grip module, trigger and the springs, so I'm hopeful I can get this thing running with minimal drama. We shall see.

[Tokarev]

I'm on the right track by planning to replace the grip module...

I imagine Texaspoff could texture the factory modular pretty easily.

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[Tokarev]

Ok. I'll have the gun in hand tomorrow...

Well?

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[60167]

Well?

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117761
117763


I want the world to know that I generally have categorical hatred for gunshop parking lot lap photos, but I think this is an exception since I'm proving that receipt of a gun that's been "out for delivery" since Feb. Initial impressions are good. Barrel and slide are tight. The small parts seem to be of good quality. No MIM. I like the nitride finish and the optics cut seems promising. They did a good job of applying lube from the factory. The trigger reach isn't quite as bad as it looks, although it will be replaced. Overall, this gun seems like it would probably work out of the box.

However- the gun is way over sprung, the grip isn't grippy at all, and they forgot to clean out the metal shavings when they cut the slide stop hole.

117762

The good news is that the side stop doesn't seem to have the same problems that Tokarev seems to have had.

Overall, I think this gun is worth the $900 I paid for it, and I'm feeling pretty confident that it will work with minimal drama once I get springs changed out. More pics and analysis to come.

[60167]

117777

Iron sight plate was tight. Took some convincing with a mallet to get it off.

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117779

I pulled it all the way apart to swap parts and get a feel for the thing. This is an interesting gun, you can tell that the product development guys made a list of great ideas that the engineering folks didn't quite execute. They got some stuff right and also missed the mark on other things. Here are some random musings:

1. I love that it's nitrided.
2. The slide to frame fit is really good. I can feel it when I'm taking the slide on/off the rails. It's tight.
3. The hammer and sear pins fit tightly in the frame. IDK if that's good or otherwise, but it seems like quality.
4. They didn't clean the metal chips out of the frame when they drilled the slide stop hole, but someone clearly DID hand polish the disconnector head. The finish is polished away and there's no disco bump when I let the slide forward.
5. The hardware for the optics plate is trash. The cap screw heads are neither standard or metric, and there's enough variance that I used two different sizes of Allen key. I bet they will shear off if I don't replace them. The pan head optic screws are the same. I feel like they executed the slide cut and the plate really well and then they fumbled the hardware.
6. It's cute they included a paper clip for takedown. I don't mind the guiderod, it's light years ahead of the two-piece.
7. I really like the look and feel of the Atlas trigger/Prodigy grip combo. It's a winner for me, and I think it's a big improvement over the factory stuff. The factory Magwell won't fit without fitting, and I'm not sure if I'm going to do that yet.
8. Extractor came tensioned properly and is blended pretty well from the factory. Aight then.

I'm going to have my gunsmith buddy to a trigger job before I put some rounds through it.

I know I'm not shooting it in it's factory form so it's hard for me to assess then gun as-is.

[Tokarev]

Mine is 99% stock.

My gun has been reliable and fun to shoot. I did have some failures to lock open with the factory 18# spring or whatever it is. The gun works fine now with an Atlas 14# spring and Atlas or Check Mate mags. I still have an occasional lock back issue with Dura Mags. Maybe Atlas springs and followers would fix that?

I did tweak my extractor a little just for the sake of bending it. Tension seemed a bit light but I didn't have any failures as a result.

The trigger is too long in dry fire but I don't really seem to notice it much when actually shooting. If and when I get around to having a trigger job done and some parts replaced I'll probably have a shorter trigger put in just to keep the general reach and feel on par with my Prodigy.

I haven't seen anything new from SDS regarding the availability of different optic plates or taller sights. Hopefully these aren't too far away.

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[Tokarev]

Eleven 71 Design has some titanium optic plates available. I assume the EPS or EPS Carry could be used by removing the factory rear sight from the OEM RMR plate. But that's just a guess. Maybe a taller front and rear combo will be needed regardless of optic.

https://eleven71design.com/shop/mac-pistols

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[Tokarev]

https://youtu.be/dDfRpNW5YXA?si=up6W7iQADp3LRZUF

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[60167]

My right side thumb safety is wobbly and loose. Not sure if it's long for this world. I forgot to mention in my previous post that the grip screws had loctite on them. That's impressive.

Hopefully I'm training tomorrow so I'll put some rounds through if life doesn't get in the way.

[60167]

First 300.

To recap: I resprung it to 12# recoil 19# hammer. Added a prodigy grip and atlas flat trigger. I tuned the sear spring and checked the extractor. Everything functions with weighted dummy rounds, even when I slow feed the gun. I should have started with the 10-8 extractor test but I decided to just start training. No confirmation whatsoever- just jumped straight in with 10 loaded 2011 mags.

I had 4 failures to feed. I suspected the extractor was a little tight, but I traced the malfunction to a single dirty prodigy mag that's been dropped in the moon dust too many times. I removed that mag from circulation and the problems stopped.

I shoot USPSA and my training reflects that. Lots of moving into and out of position. Shooting with less than ideal stance and grip. I shot it pretty fast (1.80 ish bill drills) and it chugged along minus the mentioned malfunctions. I think this is a very promising start, given that I was ready to chuck my Prodigy into the river at this stage with that gun.

I would have hit 500 rounds but: Whomp whomp.

117961

This was my bad. Totally on me. Life is tougher when you are dumb. The gun came with 3 sets of optics screws. I used the mediums which got me a few threads of engagement, but it wasn't enough. I should have used the long screws cut to length but I decided to use my free time shooting instead of tinkering. I thought this would happen. Don't be me. Do better.

That said, I went to the hardware store and got stainless Torx head bolts of better quality and cut them down to length. These aint going nowhere. These are 6/32 screws if anyone is wondering.

TLDR: Promising start. I'm cautiously optimistic.

[60167]

550 rounds.

I tweaked my extractor and had my gunsmith buddy mess with it a little. He noted that there is a negative sear angle that will require a bit of work to get out. The sear spring was adjusted as much as possible to lighten the trigger, but you can visibly see the hammer rock back ever so slightly before it breaks. I also showed him my worn out dirty Prodigy mag and he laughed at me for thinking anything would function with that mag.

I shot at an indoor range at a pace that broke the rules (it's cool, I'm a regular). I shot all 250 rounds in about 10 minutes or so, and the gun got too hot to handle. Zero stoppages, malfunctions, "almost malfunctions", flaws or anything to note.

TLDR: 500 rounds total, no stoppages today. The 4 yesterday were attributed to an old crappy mag that didn't even come with the gun. Hammer and sear on the chopping block.

[60167]

118002
118003

This Harrison Design safety is realllllllly nice.

[Tokarev]

This Harrison Design safety is realllllllly nice.

It appears to mate well with the color and lines of the gun. Any obnoxious work to fit?

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[60167]

It appears to mate well with the color and lines of the gun. Any obnoxious work to fit?

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There's something called a "down stop fitting pad" that I've never encountered before. It's an oversized part of the blocking lug that you can fit to account for oversized frame cuts. I had to file in this place so that it would fit inside the frame with the hammer and sear removed. Then it was regular fitting on the blocking lug as usual.

118042
https://www.harrisoncustom.com/images/uploaded/pdf/Extreme%20Service%20Thumb%20Safety_June%202016.pdf

It took an extra 10 minutes to figure out and fit, but the end result is -exquisite-

What a part. Oh man. I want everything they sell now.

[Trooper224]

There's something called a "down stop fitting pad" that I've never encountered before. It's an oversized part of the blocking lug that you can fit to account for oversized frame cuts. I had to file in this place so that it would fit inside the frame with the hammer and sear removed. Then it was regular fitting on the blocking lug as usual.

118042
https://www.harrisoncustom.com/images/uploaded/pdf/Extreme%20Service%20Thumb%20Safety_June%202016.pdf

It took an extra 10 minutes to figure out and fit, but the end result is -exquisite-

What a part. Oh man. I want everything they sell now.

Harrison has become my first choice due to things like this.

[60167]

Made it to 1000. No clean, only lube. Some grit has come off, but it has been incidental to a few detail strips to get some parts adjusted precisely to my liking.

The only 4 malfunctions occurred in the first 250-round range trip. I loosened the extractor and it's been solid since. I even had 100% function with two mags of Hornady Critical Duty. I'm satisfied enough to carry this gun or trust it in a match.

Today was a 400 round training session. I ran it pretty hard- I even broke my personal Bill Drill record of 1.67.

[G19Fan]

Made it to 1000. No clean, only lube. Some grit has come off, but it has been incidental to a few detail strips to get some parts adjusted precisely to my liking.

The only 4 malfunctions occurred in the first 250-round range trip. I loosened the extractor and it's been solid since. I even had 100% function with two mags of Hornady Critical Duty. I'm satisfied enough to carry this gun or trust it in a match.

Today was a 400 round training session. I ran it pretty hard- I even broke my personal Bill Drill record of 1.67.

Man a clean all alpha 1.67 bill is no joke. Nice shooting

[60167]

Man a clean all alpha 1.67 bill is no joke. Nice shooting



Thanks! I think this was due to the comparatively lighter commander gun vs a big heavy 5" Prodigy front end. It's the perfect mix between weight and light SA trigger to get this done.

[60167]

118203

1400 rounds. It's been 1200 since last malfunction so I'm feeling pretty good. I won't update again until I hit 5k or if something notable happens. Seems like these posts are of interest to only a handful of you guys anyway.

A this point I think this is a good gun.

[Phred]

60167
I’m definitely interested in your reports. I haven’t posted anything about my MAC, since I only have about 150 rounds through it. I mounted a Holosun 407 to it, and it kept coming loose every 30-50 rounds. I think the screws were just barely too long, and were bottoming out on the plate just enough to prevent them from fully securing the optic. I ground the screws down just a hair, and remounted the optic-so far so good with that.

I swapped the recoil and main spring out for a 14lb and 19lb, respectively, and tweaked the sear spring to clean up the trigger break. I also fit a Staccato “gunsmith fit” flat trigger, to bring the trigger reach back to where I want it. I hope to get some more rounds through it this week.

[officer960]

118203
Seems like these posts are of interest to only a handful of you guys anyway.

Well, I've been lurking. Joined the Forum just to follow this, so it's probably more followed than you're (and Tokarev) aware - which is on us for not acknowledging.


I only have 400 rounds through mine and have had ZERO malfunctions. I sold another one of these to a buddy and he's probably at about the same round count, also with no malfunctions. I have only added a Red Dirt Staccato trigger to mine but plan to change the main spring, guide rod (Atlas)/recoil spring.

Looks like 14lb for recoil spring and 19lb main spring is the way to go?

[officer960]

60167 I joined this forum to follow this and I'm sure there are others. I only have 400 through mine with ZERO malfunctions. Sold one to a buddy/customer and he's had the same results.

Only mods to mine are a Red Dirt flat trigger but plan to replace:
- guide rod (Atlas)
- recoil spring (I'm gathering that 14# is what I want)
- main spring (19#?)

I'm debating getting a Prodigy grip module as you have done - but assume I'd need main spring housing and possibly some other parts? Have also considered just sending off the MAC grip and having it worked (stippled) by someone.

So far I am really liking this pistol.

[60167]

60167 I joined this forum to follow this and I'm sure there are others. I only have 400 through mine with ZERO malfunctions. Sold one to a buddy/customer and he's had the same results.

Only mods to mine are a Red Dirt flat trigger but plan to replace:
- guide rod (Atlas)
- recoil spring (I'm gathering that 14# is what I want)
- main spring (19#?)

I'm debating getting a Prodigy grip module as you have done - but assume I'd need main spring housing and possibly some other parts? Have also considered just sending off the MAC grip and having it worked (stippled) by someone.

So far I am really liking this pistol.

Sorry it took so long to respond. I’m training up for a major match coming up next month and a bunch of non-shooting stuff.

I’m at 1950 rounds. I just replaced and fit a Harrison Custom hammer/sear and extractor/FPS.

I’m running the 12 #recoil/19#hammer spring.

If you go with a prodigy grip you will want to order a mag catch and mainspring housing to go with it.

[Tokarev]

Have also considered just sending off the MAC grip and having it worked (stippled) by someone.
Texaspoff can probably do it for you.

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[Tokarev]

Here's a MAC that's been worked over by Monsoon Tactical. I wonder why he didn't use taller sights while he was doing the work.

https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20240522/5c5220e072ec82f0b15710ff818cfbde.jpg

https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20240522/46c7bc4b9c5b3f44fd0113f487ea2a05.jpg

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[60167]

Updates with shooting log:

118880

118881

So I had 4 FTE on my first range trip. On May 14th, I had 4 failures to feed, but found out that I reassembled my Atlas mag with the spring backward after cleaning (DOH!) so I can't attribute that to the gun.

The original extractor was a little loose in the channel and FPS was loose in the slide. I fit Harrison Custom parts and they lock together like a vault. The ejection and extraction was MUCH better and it passed the 10-8 test with flying colors. I think the FPS is the critical upstream piece that needs be looked at when you get a new gun or replace an extractor on these Turkish guns.

I got a full size FPS and ended up filing 1/8" off the top to accommodate the RDS cut. I think a Bomar height FPS may work but I didn't want to run the risk of that being too short, so "custom fit" it is. The process didn't add a significant amount of time to the whole ordeal so I think it was worth it.

[Bernomad]

Turkatto. That’s funny right there!

[officer960]

Sorry about the previous double post - assumed it was in internet issue, but turns out my posts need to be reviewed as a newb.

Anyway, I got a Prodigy grip module, MSH, mag catch, mag catch spring, mag catch lock and it works perfectly. I did have to slightly modify an X300U to lock on the 1913 rail. Ordered a EGW Prodigy magwell that I'm waiting on.

Should have the Atlas springs and guide rod soon.

118891

Tokarev that Monsoon Tactical gun is chef's kiss. I bought this "Turkatto" to mess with since I don't want to void the warranties on my Staccato's (XC, P, C2). May just send it off and I can always put the Prodigy grip module on my Nightstalker.

[Trooper224]

Updates with shooting log:

118880

118881

So I had 4 FTE on my first range trip. On May 14th, I had 4 failures to feed, but found out that I reassembled my Atlas mag with the spring backward after cleaning (DOH!) so I can't attribute that to the gun.

The original extractor was a little loose in the channel and FPS was loose in the slide. I fit Harrison Custom parts and they lock together like a vault. The ejection and extraction was MUCH better and it passed the 10-8 test with flying colors. I think the FPS is the critical upstream piece that needs be looked at when you get a new gun or replace an extractor on these Turkish guns.

I got a full size FPS and ended up filing 1/8" off the top to accommodate the RDS cut. I think a Bomar height FPS may work but I didn't want to run the risk of that being too short, so "custom fit" it is. The process didn't add a significant amount of time to the whole ordeal so I think it was worth it.


This.