EDC Flashlight Open Discussion

[NH Shooter]

I like the idea of a separate EDC thread for flashlights.

Here it is! Open discussion on any topic regarding EDC flashlights.

[Outpost75]

I prefer a minimalist light as a compact personal illuminator which I can use to find things in my pack or in the cockpit at night, for night trail illumination or to enable me to exit a darkened building during a power outage. MUST have a red, blue or green lens to preserve night vision. I don't want a bright light which presents a clear target for an adversary to aim at and which destroys my dark-adapted night vision. Bad JuJu!

Switch must permit intermittent use, minimal low Iight with long battery life at least 24 hours or optional higher brightness suitable for building searches with battery life to last overnight on a 12-hour shift. Clip to attach to head band, hat or helmet brim for hands free use absolutely essential.

My EDC is a multi-mode Maratec single AAA LED from CountyCom with green filter.

My objective is not to play Rambo, but situational awareness, conflict avoidance, stealthy tactical movement for evasion and concealment. Not engagement.

[JCS]

I want a light that has both low and high available from off. Once I found lights with that it makes all the other ui leave me wanting.

My current go to is a zebra light sc64. Its not the best ui but size to output ratio is great.

For my uses I have found either moonlight or high are the two modes I use 90% of the time.

[littlejerry]

I want a light that has both low and high available from off. Once I found lights with that it makes all the other ui leave me wanting.

My current go to is a zebra light sc64. Its not the best ui but size to output ratio is great.

For my uses I have found either moonlight or high are the two modes I use 90% of the time.

I agree. I want 2 modes, either accessible from off. But I prefer a low/medium(100-200lumen) and high mode(800+)

I've been using a Quark Tactical for the last 10 years or so. Great UI where you tighten the bezel for 1 mode, loosen for a second mode. Tail switch is on/off only.

Need to find a good replacement since SF put him out of business.

[NH Shooter]

JCS and littlejerry

Take a look at the SureFire E2T-MV Tactician (https://www.surefire.com/e2t-maxvision-tactician/).

It uses the head high/low switch UI you like: tight for 800 lumens, loose for 5 lumens. It's a fantastic light - highly recommended!

This is mine with EDCLB Upgrades (https://www.edclightbuilder.com/surefire-e2t-mv-tactcian-upgrades/);


https://i.ibb.co/6Rjjw7V/grk-3-1.jpg (https://ibb.co/XZccLrN)

[littlejerry]

JCS and littlejerry

Take a look at the SureFire E2T-MV Tactician (https://www.surefire.com/e2t-maxvision-tactician/).

It uses the head high/low switch UI you like: tight for 800 lumens, loose for 5 lumens. It's a fantastic light - highly recommended!

This is mine with EDCLB Upgrades (https://www.edclightbuilder.com/surefire-e2t-mv-tactcian-upgrades/);


https://i.ibb.co/6Rjjw7V/grk-3-1.jpg (https://ibb.co/XZccLrN)

Looks like a great option. Will 18650s work in it?


One of the things that I love about the old Quark design was the ability to program the 2 modes. The light has ~7 modes to choose from and you can select any 2 to be usable at one time. Not something you do on the fly, more of a set and forget. But it allows options to customize to your use.

[NH Shooter]

Looks like a great option. Will 18650s work in it?



The Tactician works fine with a 16650 cell (https://illumn.com/batteries-chargers-and-powerpax-carriers/batteries/16650-keeppower-p1665j-2500mah-sanyo-ur16650zta-4-20v-protected-button-top.html)!

I too like the Quark UI, but I think the overall quality of the Tactician is significantly better.


https://i.ibb.co/fQHrzdD/quarkaa-1.jpg (https://ibb.co/CWQV3KP)

[Colt191145lover]

I want something to finally replace my 13 year old Surefire LX2 LumaMax . Dual pressure switch with useful low beam ( NOT 5 Lumens! )of somewhere between 15-50 lumens with a real long run time . High beam somewhere between 400-600 lumens with TIR beam , long throw /high candela. Minimum of 2.5 hour runtime on high. Good pocket clip that allows bezel up carry as I have carried a surefire in my left back pocket for 20 years now. Nothing has come close yet...

[NH Shooter]

My objective is not to play Rambo, but situational awareness, conflict avoidance, stealthy tactical movement for evasion and concealment. Not engagement.

That's a good plan! If active engagement happens, there were likely multiple points of failure beforehand.

Here is a short video I put on YT that discusses the use of an EDC flashlight for enhanced situational awareness;


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cYiSEJrqt1s

[Outpost75]

Good video and refresher. Highly recommended.

[feudist]

That's a good plan! If active engagement happens, there were likely multiple points of failure beforehand.

Here is a short video I put on YT that discusses the use of an EDC flashlight for enhanced situational awareness;


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cYiSEJrqt1s

That's well presented.

[NH Shooter]

I've been using a Quark Tactical for the last 10 years or so.

Funny story about my wife using the Quark Tactical one night to walk the dogs.

For those who are not familiar with the UI, it's two modes via a head switch: either tight for one mode or backed off a little from tight for the second mode. Both modes can be programmed from a selection of about 10 different output modes, which is very cool.

However, the programming mode is entered by a short succession of tight-loose turns of the head (three if I remember correctly). My wife, going between the two modes I had programmed, managed to place the little Quark in programming mode and ended up with some Nordic SOS strobe. When she got back she told me that something is wrong with the flashlight as it keeps blinking.

This ended my infatuation with the Quark programmable user interface, though I remain a huge fan of high/low bezel switches.

I think Streamlight has this best covered with their Ten-Tap programming, which requires a very deliberate effort to enter programming mode. That said, I'm not a fan of any programmable light for serious use.

[NH Shooter]

That's well presented.

Thanks! :-)

[Dennis]

I have owned many many dozens of pretty much every "Tactical" light since my first SureFire 6P back in 1991. My current favorite EDC is the Olight Warrior Mini 3. Intuitive med/high momentary/constant from the rear switch and moonlight and low for admin if you want them. As spotty with flood as a light this size can get. Also as good or better fit and finish than Surefire.

https://www.olightstore.com/warrior-mini-3-portable-flashlight

My previous favorite for years was the Klarus E2 which is the same slim form factor with good tactical UI but floodier and not as easy med/high switching.

My other longtime current rotation lights are the Klarus XT21X on my duty vest because its is 4400lumen in a decent size light with tactical UI and the Klarus E3 on my duty belt as a compromise between size, runtime, and lumens.

Previous EDC lights include the SF EDCLT-2, L2 Aviator, and various fancy customs which were cool but in the end out-evolved by newer, better, lights.

I am also in LOVE with the Olight Marauder Mini as a general use walking around light, especially if you have kids. https://www.olightstore.com/marauder-mini-powerful-led-flashlight

The general flashlight enthusiast market is driving innovation too fast to stick with previously top tier manufacturers who are being left behind faster and faster nowadays. You might as well buy moderately priced great new stuff every couple of years and have plenty of backups as you continually upgrade.

That said, all my weaponlights are from top tier manufacturers.

Dennis.

[NH Shooter]

Dennis, thanks for your post! It raises some great points worthy of discussion. As a note, the following is based on my own views, and I recognize that YMMV.


I have owned many many dozens of pretty much every "Tactical" light since my first SureFire 6P back in 1991.

Based on the countless number of "tactical" flashlights on the market today, it's clear that the use of the word "tactical" is entirely a marketing ploy, and used mostly by Asian makers.

To ground this discussion let's start with this: what is the meaning of "tactical"? Here's the Oxford dictionary definition;

Relating to or constituting actions carefully planned to gain a specific military end.


done or for use in immediate support of military or naval operations.
showing adroit planning; aiming at an end beyond the immediate action.

To honestly label a flashlight as "tactical" we need to start with this question: what is the tactical use of a flashlight?

Much like the traditional military meaning, the tactical use of a flashlight is in support of personal safety operations: (1) enhancing situational awareness; (2) supporting the application of physical force in a self defense scenario

Using a military analogy, radar is used to (1) detect and identify a threat and (2) direct and guide weapons to destroy the threat. For the individual, a "tactical flashlight" is used for exactly the same purposes.


That said, all my weaponlights are from top tier manufacturers.

What I find interesting is that WMLs are rarely labelled as "tactical" yet their use is understood to be exactly that. So what would truly be a "tactical flashlight"?

IMO, it's essentially a WML designed to be held in the hand. As with the typical WML, it embodies the following key features;


one switch (for a hand held light, on the tailcap) for fumble-free operation under stress
single output (all the lumens all the time)
reliable momentary-only operation (avoidance of accidental constant-on)
rugged construction
...and of great importance for a hand held light, ergonomics designed for established techniques (https://surefire.news/handgun-handheld-flashlight-techniques/)
IMO, anything beyond the above only serves to hinder or complicate the handling and operation of a light intended for this use. The original Surefire 6P is truly a tactical light, and IMO remains an excellent example of such.

The challenge with an EDC flashlight is that one that is perfectly suited for defensive use (as described above) is not ideal for the way a typical EDC flashlight is used 99% of the time. To date, I have yet to see a design that effectively bridges these uses without some serious compromise, and remains the reason I carry two lights - especially while carrying a pistol.

[Dennis]

one switch (for a hand held light, on the tailcap) for fumble-free operation under stress
single output (all the lumens all the time)
reliable momentary-only operation (avoidance of accidental constant-on)
rugged construction
...and of great importance for a hand held light, ergonomics designed for established techniques (https://surefire.news/handgun-handheld-flashlight-techniques/)
IMO, anything beyond the above only serves to hinder or complicate the handling and operation of a light intended for this use. The original Surefire 6P is truly a tactical light, and IMO remains an excellent example of such.

The challenge with an EDC flashlight is that one that is perfectly suited for defensive use (as described above) is not ideal for the way a typical EDC flashlight is used 99% of the time. To date, I have yet to see a design that effectively bridges these uses without some serious compromise, and remains the reason I carry two lights - especially while carrying a pistol.

I lived my on and off duty flashlight life for a couple decades by the list above. I still have my original 6P& 6Z bought when they first came out, as well as fancy bored out versions with 18650's and custom LED bulbs as I tried to hold on to the good old days... However, after the advent of usable WML for duty and EDC I no longer see the need for a 100% defensive use flashlight. I still believe in full power as default from a rear tail switch, but I am more than happy to have a sub switch to control power and especially the Olight half/full press UI on their "tactical" line. This allows actual EDC use with lower power levels available but still fulfill 99% of defensive needs easily with some familiarity. Just like with anything, if you are willing to put in the training time you can handle more options.

Luckily or unluckily, I have been able to use dozens of various flashlights in many hundreds of "tactical/defensive" situations mostly on duty and have faced everything from dropped lights, broken bulbs, out of battery, light ND, stuck ON, stuck OFF, too much light, too little light, and probably much more. I have found ways to deal with problems on the fly and understand what I like and what I think is important to me and my needs. Your needs will likely vary and what works for me may not work for you, and defaulting to the list above is a solid starting point.

Obviously, every point on the above list is a given for a WML :cool:

Dennis.

[gringop]

Funny story about my wife using the Quark Tactical one night to walk the dogs.

[Snip]
My wife, going between the two modes I had programmed, managed to place the little Quark in programming mode and ended up with some Nordic SOS strobe. When she got back she told me that something is wrong with the flashlight as it keeps blinking.

[Snip]

This ended my infatuation with the Quark programmable user interface, though I remain a huge fan of high/low bezel switches.


MY 10+ year old daily carry Quark X Tactical started randomly going into strobe mode even when I had it in a different mode. Cleaning it thoroughly seemed to fix it for while, but it would soon wig (Whig?, Mrs. Wiggins?) out again.

Swapping the body with my virtually new Quark (no X) Tactical has restored it to proper functioning. Now it's ready for another 10 years of riding next to my knife, anodizing destroying, pocket carry.

113788

X head (230 lumens, ooh!) vs Non-X head (206 lumens)
113789

Gringop

PS. There was/is a mod for the Quark tail cap switch where you cut off a certain length of an empty 9mm case to end up with a hollow brass tube that you put inside the rubber switch cover. Now, you will have no more inadvertent light ADs, you had to press the switch in a positive manner to get it to actuate.
We were so damn Tactical in those days!

[NH Shooter]

PS. There was/is a mod for the Quark tail cap switch where you cut off a certain length of an empty 9mm case to end up with a hollow brass tube that you put inside the rubber switch cover. Now, you will have no more inadvertent light ADs, you had to press the switch in a positive manner to get it to actuate.
We were so damn Tactical in those days!

That's a new one to me!

The boot is tall and squishy, when pressing it feels like a nipple on a baby bottle. I can see how the mod would address that.

[NH Shooter]

However, after the advent of usable WML for duty and EDC I no longer see the need for a 100% defensive use flashlight.

Yes, I agree with that observation!

The dedicated "fight light" is indeed used in lieu of a WML, which for civilian use offers some advantages - mainly the ability to use it without having to draw the weapon. I believe there's a consensus that LEOs have much more latitude with that than a civvie does.

While it may not be a consensus, there's a line of thinking that for civilian use a light attached to a pistol has much less utility than one that is not. My assertion is that if a second light is carried, a hand held light that is ideally configured for use with a handgun ("fight light") is no more difficult to carry than a WML, gives up little (if anything) in the ease-of-use with the handgun, but provides a lot more utility.

I do concur that this reasoning may not apply to LEOs.

[BillSWPA]

Yes, I agree with that observation!

The dedicated "fight light" is indeed used in lieu of a WML, which for civilian use offers some advantages - mainly the ability to use it without having to draw the weapon. I believe there's a consensus that LEOs have much more latitude with that than a civvie does.

While it may not be a consensus, there's a line of thinking that for civilian use a light attached to a pistol has much less utility than one that is not. My assertion is that if a second light is carried, a hand held light that is ideally configured for use with a handgun ("fight light") is no more difficult to carry than a WML, gives up little (if anything) in the ease-of-use with the handgun, but provides a lot more utility.

I do concur that this reasoning may not apply to LEOs.

I agree. If I am drawing a gun, it is very likely because I have already identified a threat. If I need the light, I am probably not at a point where I am justified in drawing the gun.

I may start carrying a weapon mounted light on some occasions at some point, but do not see it working well for most of my concealed carry.

[NH Shooter]

I may start carrying a weapon mounted light on some occasions at some point, but do not see it working well for most of my concealed carry.

In my typical process of (perhaps) over thinking it, I'm likely to already have the light in-hand in a low-light setting where I need it for SA. If a threat emerges and I'm justified in drawing a weapon, I'd rather use the light already in my hand instead of dropping it and switching to a WML. This also gives me the opportunity to blind and deter a potential assailant without drawing the weapon.

Of course the huge advantage of a WML is that it remains in perfect alignment with the sights on the target. This is why I feel that a dedicated "fight light" has to be (1) ideally configured ergonomically for one's preferred grip and (2) the user must practice shooting with the light. When I go to the range, my first few magazines are with just the pistol, but all the rest are done using the light. It does take regular practice to do this effectively, but no more so than any other aspect of shooting a pistol.

I regularly do "reps" at home drawing the light and pistol, acquiring a two-hand grip and getting both on target. The alignment is not diffcult at all with a flood beam (like my E2T-MV Tactician), but takes a little more precision with a narrow, high-candela beam. Like all else with shooting a handgun, practice makes perfect.


https://i.ibb.co/RpqZJWk/edclights-1.jpg