A Quick Review of the Caracal F Pistol.

[Chris Rhines]

http://multigun.wordpress.com/2012/11/09/caracal-f-pistol-first-shots/

Short version - very good build quality, great trigger, good ergonomics minus a few minor glitches, but the long-range accuracy just ain't there. I'm gonna keep wringing these out, but the G34 is going to stay my primary pistol for the moment.

[WDW]

Was it affected by the recent recall?

[Chris Rhines]

Was it affected by the recent recall? Yes. To the best of my knowledge, all Caracal pistols in the United States are subject to the recall.

[Kyle Reese]

Great review, Chris.

Any thoughts about the cause of long range accuracy problems?

[kodiakpb]

Please elaborate on the recall.

[JV_]

I was able to shoot consistent 2″ groups at 10 yards, but the group size exploded out at 25 yards, to over 8″ with significant vertical stringing.

Very interesting, and unfortunate.

What kind of loads did you try?

[JV_]

Please elaborate on the recall.
http://pistol-training.com/archives/7479

[orionz06]

Seems like so many pistols are almost there. Was hoping for a little better out of it, will keep an eye open to see how this evolves.

[Chris Rhines]

JV - I shot USPSA Production Minor handloads, 147grn. Berrys bullet over 3.4grn. Titegroup, Winchester SPP, mixed brass, 1.125" OAL. It's the same load I've been shooting for most of 2012. Todd also floated me a box of CCI M882CF Cleanfire practice ammo (thanks again, Todd!) which ran with similar results.

FredM - That's a very good question, as the demo unit I fired at SHOT displayed pretty good accuracy (though I was only shooting it on steel, so I might be remembering only the hits...) Part of the problem is unquestionably the sights, which suck in many different ways. Part of it may be a mechanical issue with the pistol. I'd love to get ahold of a Ransom Rest and do some testing with it.

[Vinh]

Chris, I can provide you with a Ransom Rest, but you'll have to fabricate the wooden plank it's supposed to sit on, as well as source some inserts to hold your test pistol (I only have the 1911 insert I believe).

[Chris Rhines]

Chris, I can provide you with a Ransom Rest, but you'll have to fabricate the wooden plank it's supposed to sit on, as well as source some inserts to hold your test pistol (I only have the 1911 insert I believe). Vinh,

Want to check out Peacemaker next weekend? I'll contact Ransom and get some grip inserts ordered.

[Ed L]

With a full sized Caracal and Black Hills 124 grain ammo we fired a bunch of 5 shot groups in the 4"-6" range, with one hovering at 3". I was doing the asrticle for SWAT magazine, and since most handgun articles use 5 shot groups, we used 5 shot groups to provide an easy comparison. We did manage one 2.5" 5 shot group with 147 grain Ranger Talon.

I really did not like the sight picture of the gun.

[jar]

I just don't understand how they possibly thought non-replaceable sights were a good idea.

[Smaug]

I just don't understand how they possibly thought non-replaceable sights were a good idea.

I suspect it's cheaper to make a slide plate that doubles as a rear sight than it is to make a seperate rear sight and dovetail it to the slide.

[Vinh]

Vinh,

Want to check out Peacemaker next weekend? I'll contact Ransom and get some grip inserts ordered.
Definitely interested, let me know what day so I can check my schedule. Also, let me know if you're shooting at NRA this week so I can give you the ransom rest. I lost the original instructions, but their website has it posted.

[Ed L]

I just don't understand how they possibly thought non-replaceable sights were a good idea.


The gun was originally designed to be an issue sidearm to the United Arab Emirates and to sell to countries in the Gulf Area and Arab world. Zero thought was given to commercial sales. They made the rear sight integral with the rear backplate of the gun--or whatever the part is called. It makes for less parts, but is horrible becasuse ti locks you into rear sights that I did not care for.

When I got done with my article, I returned the full-sized Caracal to the manufacturer, but bought the compact one with the quick-see sights.

They are great for shooting the FAST drill, but can have issues at longer distances due to the short sight radius and the fact that there isn't much space viewable around the front sight when viewed through the rear sight.

I actually like the compact Caracal better than the Glock 19 because of the trigger and the way it fts my hand, but the Caracal sights are a deal breaker.

Below is a photo of the Quick See sights. I had a white outlined tritium dot installed in the front sight.

http://i102.photobucket.com/albums/m115/edagain/caracal1-1.jpg

http://i102.photobucket.com/albums/m115/edagain/caracal2-1.jpg

[Gary1911A1]

Thanks for an informative review. I have the "C" Model that's part of the recall. At this point I'm not certain if I'll just ask for a refund. Does anyone see any problem in having the rear notch machined to widen the notch?

[Comedian]

I was going to go the refund route with my C model, but i think i will keep it and let Caracal fix it. Overall i like it better than my G19, even with the lousy sights.

[Chris Rhines]

Thanks for an informative review. I have the "C" Model that's part of the recall. At this point I'm not certain if I'll just ask for a refund. Does anyone see any problem in having the rear notch machined to widen the notch?
Nope. I'm going to order a replacement firing pin assembly on Monday, and have the notch widened and thinned, and the top of the sight cut down about 0.040" to lower the POI.

If anyone is interested, I took some quick measurements on the sight. The front sight is about 0.140" wide, and the rear notch is about 0.115" wide. Pretty close to the opposite of what they should be.

[Red Leader]

Chris,

Thanks for your work with this pistol. I have been intrigued with it for some time. Just a few questions based on your experience -

Can you speak to what others have said about the Caracal having a slightly lower tolerance to being dirty (i.e. experiencing stoppages about xxx amount of rounds)

Do you have an idea on the trigger pull weight? I'm not sure if you have a scale, but I'd be interested to know how it compares with others I've read about, which were pretty light, in the 3-4lb range if I recall.

If you have been in contact with Caracal USA, has there been any word about any rear sight redesign where it is not incorporated into the rear striker plate or do they plan to hold onto that design indefinitely?

Also, do you have any insight into the parts supply chain, such as Caracal offering replacement springs, misc small parts, enough to really support the pistol?


Thanks for any insights!

[Urban_Redneck]

Chris,


Also, do you have any insight into the parts supply chain, such as Caracal offering replacement springs, misc small parts, enough to really support the pistol?




Parts are available http://www.caracal-usa.com/shop/caracal-parts.html

Serious pistol shooting is a new(ish) journey for me, so you may wish to add a grain of salt.

I'm close to 4000 rounds without a malfunction through my F , longest cleaning interval has been 500 rounds (VSM basic class +). I have 400+ rounds through the C I ordered a week before the recall was announced, also malf free.

As to the rear sight, the notch is too tight for my 47yo eyes, I find myself "cheating" the front sight up out of the rear notch when shooting past 20y or so. I think widening the notch .010-.012" would be about right, I'll have it done after the recall is complete. In general, good shooting became easier once I put the dots right on top of one another. This also had the affect of bringing my POI down to my POA.

All in all I like the pistols very much as have most everyone I have let try them.

YMMV

[Tamara]

I was very impressed with the way no expense was spared to make sure that the slide release stabbed me exactly on that nerve in my thumb. ;)

[Red Leader]

Parts are available http://www.caracal-usa.com/shop/caracal-parts.html




WOW, awesome!

Honestly, this was going to have a huge impact on a decision to buy or not, and I know it was a big concern when I first heard of the pistols. This is great, great news! It is really nice to know that this relatively unknown manufacturer is getting more ground/traction here, at least to the point of offering spare parts.

Nothing like having a pistol that you really enjoy but ends up taking a dive because a part wears out or breaks and you can't get a spare.

[Urban_Redneck]

I was very impressed with the way no expense was spared to make sure that the slide release stabbed me exactly on that nerve in my thumb. ;)

It's an Arab pistol (thus, designed for men), they don't even let women drive over there :p

[DanH]

It's an Arab pistol (thus, designed for men), they don't even let women drive over there :p

So, what you are saying is, it's a middle eastern safety feature? :p

[Tamara]

It's an Arab pistol (thus, designed for men), they don't even let women drive over there :p

Poor Achmed! He could have been mercifully shot instead of pistol-whipped to his knees... ;)

[Urban_Redneck]

So, what you are saying is, it's a middle eastern safety feature? :p

Exactly!

An institutionalized prenuptial of sorts. :cool: