Let the panic buying begin...

[F-Trooper05]

Goodbye 9mm and 5.56. See you in 6 to 12 months...

[JConn]

Yep this is gonna suck.

[CCT125US]

!@#$%^&*()!@#$%^&*()

[LOKNLOD]

!@#$%^&*()!@#$%^&*()

My feelings exactly.

[GJM]

Glock 17 mags on sale for 19.99:

http://www.natchezss.com/product.cfm?contentID=productDetail&prodID=GLMF17117&src=tpSlrHm

[Chemsoldier]

smeg...

glad I did my panic buying weeks ago

[JConn]

smeg...

glad I did my panic buying weeks ago

Lol same.

[fuse]

Yep this is gonna suck.

Says the guy who just took delivery on a XL650.

Smart move btw. Welcome to the club.

[Cookie Monster]

I really should of stocked up.

"Hi, Dry Practice, my name is Cookie Monster and we are going to hang out a bunch and become friends."

We'll see how this will roll....

C. Monster

[TCinVA]

***CENSORED***

[JConn]

Says the guy who just took delivery on a XL650.

Smart move btw. Welcome to the club.

Yeah, that empty spot in my wallet doesn't hurt quite as badly now.

[orionz06]

I get to send in the forms for my can tomorrow. Maybe I will panic buy at work.

[Joe in PNG]

Kind of makes me glad I'm overseas for the next couple of years. I can't have a gun to shoot anything in anyway, so no real loss.

[Alaskapopo]

Really nothing changed tonight. We have the same president, the same republican house, and the same democrat house. I know this is a naive concept but it would be nice if everyone in politics put aside their differences and decided to work together for the benefit of the nation and not themselves. But your right some people will freak out and start buying all the ammo and guns they can. I have a good enough supply to keep reloading through then next shooting season.
Pat

[Ed L]

Really nothing changed tonight. We have the same president, the same republican house, and the same democrat house. I know this is a naive concept but it would be nice if everyone in politics put aside their differences and decided to work together for the benefit of the nation and not themselves. But your right some people will freak out and start buying all the ammo and guns they can. I have a good enough supply to keep reloading through then next shooting season.
Pat

There is a belief that Obama moderated himself during his first term, fearing that any antigun efforts on his part would cost him re-election. Now that he has been re-elected he has nothing to worry about--especially since while runnign for relelection he expressed an interest in renewing the assault weapons ban with who knows what new provisions.

This is a person who while in the Illinois house indicated that he was in favor of outlawing all handguns and all semiauto longarms, so these concerns are quite valid. This is something that I feel McCain & the Republicans should have made a big election issue in 2008. Perhaps then we wouldn't have had people in Ohio & Penn showing up to vote for Obama wearing NRA hats. I also think it is an issue that Romney should have pursued more strongly in 2012.

[JV_]

There is a belief that Obama moderated himself during his first term, fearing that any antigun efforts on his part would cost him re-election. Now that he has been re-elected he has nothing to worry about--especially since while runnign for relelection he expressed an interest in renewing the assault weapons ban with who knows what new provisions.

We kept the House and Boehner is still the speaker. He has done a good job of suppressing anti-gun bills for the past few years. And while the Obama may become suicidal about guns, the members of congress aren't term limited and won't be so eager.

[MichaelD]

We kept the House and Boehner is still the speaker. He has done a good job of suppressing anti-gun bills for the past few years. And while the Obama may become suicidal about guns, the members of congress aren't term limited and won't be so eager.

This.

[NETim]

Unfortunately, several USSC justices are scarey old. Heller was only a 5-4 decision. How many more Kagans and Sotomayors will it take to remake the BOR?

[JConn]

Unfortunately, several USSC justices are scarey old. Heller was only a 5-4 decision. How many more Kagans and Sotomayors will it take to remake the BOR?

In the end, this is what it is all about. As soon as they get another justice, firearms rights will somehow make their way to the SC faster than you can say furious.

[fixer]

Goodbye 9mm and 5.56. See you in 6 to 12 months...

I'm seeing ammo prices jump as much as $10 per 50 rd box of 9mm--overnight.

[cclaxton]

Gun rights are no longer a partisan issue since public positions have changed over the past 10 years.
- 46% of Democrats strongly support the right to get a concealed carry permint;
- 72% of Democrats support the right to get a concealed carry permit;
- 47% of Republicans think there should be more gun regulations;
- 59% of Democrats support the right to use deadly force to defend yourself in public places;
- 94% of Republicans support background checks for purchase of firearms.
Source: http://www.ipsos-na.com/download/pr.aspx?id=11545

Based on these public positions it just doesn't make sense for Obama to start a fight over guns. Obama doesn't have a fight with the gun lobby on his agenda. He is more interested in cementing ObamaCare, regulating Wall Street (Which I happen to agree with), and helping to insure Democratic votes in the future by helping the middle class, as well as creating his legacy. Taking on a fight with the gun lobbies is not something that helps him. Unless he is forced into it by a major event, he will stay out of it. Besides, Congress is not in the mood to pass gun regulation, either. I am not worried about it.

Rather than focusing on National issues, the States and Local laws are the ones that we need to reform...they have a much bigger impact on our freedom of movement and freedom to carry.

CC

[cclaxton]

I'm seeing ammo prices jump as much as $10 per 50 rd box of 9mm--overnight.

I don't see it.
http://gun-deals.com/ammo.php?caliber=9mm+Luger

CC

[Chemsoldier]

I don't see it.
http://gun-deals.com/ammo.php?caliber=9mm+Luger

CC

http://www.bulkammo.com/1000-rounds-of-223-ammo-by-pmc-55gr-fmjbt

I bought one of these cases about 6 weeks ago. There were 45 cases then. There were 37 cases last night. There are no cases now. It will take prices some time to go up but the buying has ensued.

[pr1042]

I was going to buy some anyways, just doubled up on my order on aguila 124g from Sgammo. Looks like thy have sold about 30 cases of it in the past 3 or so hours.

[ChrisG]

I'd be interested to hear from some of our members with contacts inside the industry on how things will play out this time around. It seemed to me that last time the industry was caught relatively flat-footed, leading to a lot of opportunistic profiteering by dealers and speculators. I would imagine this time, with the precedent set and four years to prepare, big players like Freedom Group have well-laid plans to maximize profits during the scare, and have invested accordingly. I expect the big guys with the capital to prepare will make a killing, while smaller businesses in the industry will be hurt by the boom-bust cycle. As a consumer, that means I expect prices on things like ammo and components to rise, but not to experience the outright shortages we had last time around. On the other hand, guns and products from boutique builders are likely to be scarce and expensive. However, this is an outsider's perspective, and I'd like to get some inside opinions.

[WDW]

Exactly why I get one of every caliber in my platform

[orionz06]

It would not shock me to see some fat wallet companies having ample stock of things suddenly but on the other hand who in their right mind would sit on product when it was selling anyway?

[ToddG]

The big ammo companies have already been operating at capacity. They're fearful of increasing capacity further because the mid- and long-term future is so uncertain.

It took me six months to get an order for 115,000 rounds of 9mm fulfilled directly from ATK. They're not sitting on anything that they can sell today.

[ChrisG]

The big ammo companies have already been operating at capacity. They're fearful of increasing capacity further because the mid- and long-term future is so uncertain.

It took me six months to get an order for 115,000 rounds of 9mm fulfilled directly from ATK. They're not sitting on anything that they can sell today.

Interesting, thanks. Any idea on how well foreign manufacturers are poised to pick up the slack? Obviously imports are much more vulnerable to executive-branch shennanigans than domestic production, but hopefully that won't come in to play, at least not immediately.

[ToddG]

I don't really follow it because I don't use it. But I'd guess they're no better prepared than they were five years ago.

I don't think we'll see the same level of panic buying unless BHO starts making real noise about another AWB or some other anti-gun legislation/regulation.

[YVK]

I came to this country in late 1994 and was far removed from anything political at that time. The notion that AWB hurt Democrats during those elections, is it really credible and true, or where there other factors in play and AWB just happened to be there? There is a persistent saying that Democrats "remember what AWB did to them and are afraid of repeated experience". I am curious if this was in fact true, or wishful thinking mostly.

[ToddG]

It is definitely true. While other factors were certainly in play, the huge pro-gun turnout that swept otherwise conservative Dems out of office was obvious. We all know BHO's opinion on guns from his earlier political career. It's no coincidence that he's mostly steered clear of the subject for the past four years.

In all all-or-nothing electoral college system he can pull enough support in swing states to win. But when you break things down to the congressional district level, those folks won't sacrifice themselves to push the agenda.

Though in fairness, the huge anti-healthcare backlash didn't manifest. The simple reality is that the country has passed the tipping point. There are now enough voters who take more than they give to keep the Dems (and growing socialist programs) in power.

[MEH]

Though in fairness, the huge anti-healthcare backlash didn't manifest. The simple reality is that the country has passed the tipping point. There are now enough voters who take more than they give to keep the Dems (and growing socialist programs) in power.

Sadly, this coincides exactly with my analysis.

[TGS]

I don't really follow it because I don't use it. But I'd guess they're no better prepared than they were five years ago.

I don't think we'll see the same level of panic buying unless BHO starts making real noise about another AWB or some other anti-gun legislation/regulation.

I don't know, from the looks of this thread it sounds like it's already starting to some degree. I bet all he has to do is make a mention of gun control again, not even real noise.

As for foreign manufacturers, I think they certainly stepped up to the plate. It appears that Aguila, GECO, RUAG, all of Russia, MFS, PPU, S&B all have been putting out tons of ammo at a level they did not previously. It looks like they're willing to capitalize on the ammo market that American manufacturers have not. It's not like it's just a surge.....it's been going on a couple years. I hardly imagine that American manufacturers couldn't have paid off their investment into more production capability, but I'm also pretty clueless on that stuff.

[YVK]

OK, thanks. My perception was that Dems learned that they couldn't do it with an impunity, but are still undeterred given an opportune moment.



The simple reality is that the country has passed the tipping point. There are now enough voters who take more than they give to keep the Dems (and growing socialist programs) in power.

This is a self-correcting problem. Those programs are de facto bankrupt even without any further expansions, and painful correction is going to happen when they are announced to be formally bankrupt. No amount of extra taxation can keep them viable and while everyone will feel the pain, the givers are still better positioned to handle this than the takers.

[Sparks2112]

Today has been stupid retarded busy.

[ToddG]

I don't know, from the looks of this thread it sounds like it's already starting to some degree.

I'm not suggesting there won't be an increased demand. But compared to Election'08 through '09? It won't be more than a blip.

As I said, if he starts pushing it as part of his agenda all that could change. But for now I think there are more folks regretting their '09 expenditures than there are folks willing to repeat it.


I hardly imagine that American manufacturers couldn't have paid off their investment into more production capability, but I'm also pretty clueless on that stuff.

Ammo companies have taken steps to increase production. That's not how huge companies make business decisions, though. It's not a matter of whether an expenditure will break even. It's a matter of trying to figure out which expenditures will return the biggest investment. Getting new ammo production lines up and running is likely an expensive and time consuming process. While they might be able to afford even more increases that doesn't necessarily mean it's the most efficient use of their resources.

[ToddG]

This is a self-correcting problem. Those programs are de facto bankrupt even without any further expansions, and painful correction is going to happen when they are announced to be formally bankrupt. No amount of extra taxation can keep them viable and while everyone will feel the pain, the givers are still better positioned to handle this than the takers.

That is only true if the money is finite. Short of total government collapse a la much of Europe, we'll keep printing and borrowing. The deficit is meaningless to the people who don't pay taxes... or at least they think it is.

The only way to fix this country is to change our idea of who should be eligible to make decisions for this country (i.e., vote). And I don't see that being viable because you'd need the support of the to-be-disenfranchised. Like I said, we're past the tipping point.

Days like today make me happy that I don't have children who'll have to live in the America of 50 years from now.

[JV_]

The only way to fix this country is to change our idea of who should be eligible to make decisions for this country (i.e., vote). And I don't see that being viable because you'd need the support of the to-be-disenfranchised. Like I said, we're past the tipping point.

We can't get voter ID laws, or even talk about them without being called racists, let alone a simple requirement that you must pay income taxes to vote.

[ToddG]

We can't get voter ID laws, or even talk about them without being called racists, let alone a simple requirement that you must pay income taxes to vote.

Yeah, because DMV cameras don't take as pretty a picture with non-white folks.

[ford.304]

Problem is, as strong as the issue is of people voting themselves a raise, limiting the franchise doesn't work well, either. Anyone who the politicians don't have a reason to pander to pretty much gets crapped on. We've had plenty of bad experience with that to not want to mess with it.

The real problem is the lack of limits on borrowing and printing money. It doesn't matter how many handouts you want to give, if you can't afford it you have to stop at some point. Even the rich only have so much money - eventually you have to start hitting the middle class hard, too.

It's probably one of the biggest reason everything being pushed to the federal government now (other than national media) -- states aren't allowed to conjure additional money out of thin air.

[ToddG]

Just take kids as an example.

The 18yo kid of today is not the equivalent of his 18th century counterpart. He's more idealistic, more protected from reality, less likely to be close to financial independence, etc. But he gets a vote.

A 20 year old can't buy beer because society and the government fear he's not responsible enough to avoid driving drunk. But he can vote for President.

[BaiHu]

That is only true if the money is finite. Short of total government collapse a la much of Europe, we'll keep printing and borrowing. The deficit is meaningless to the people who don't pay taxes... or at least they think it is.

The only way to fix this country is to change our idea of who should be eligible to make decisions for this country (i.e., vote). And I don't see that being viable because you'd need the support of the to-be-disenfranchised. Like I said, we're past the tipping point.

Days like today make me happy that I don't have children who'll have to live in the America of 50 years from now.

This!!



Where I bolded is the real problem we're facing. The deficit is [I]meaningless until inflation outstrips the rate at which employers can increase paychecks and the bond market can pay savers. Now the last half of that, about the bond market is already true; the final component, which will be confirmed shortly, is the rate of wage increases. Once that thread is cut, the sword falls.

No one will want to work for a 100k and only come home with 40k when they can stay home and get 20k for free and work a side job for cash.

If you know anyone in the restaurant business, you'll find that they're all forcing more people into p/t hours so that they have less f/t people and therefore less exposure to costs via health insurance. If you squeeze the payer, the payee winds up with less and less. Eventually, w/o a job. http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2012/10/09/darden-restaurants-obamacare-part-time_n_1951103.html

In the future, when the children of successive generations grow up and see that 100k jobs and up don't exist, b/c they've been automated or outsourced and the one percenters have slowly moved out of the country or simply moved their money out of the country.

Only then will these children realize the damage we've wreaked upon them yesterday, when we had a chance to stem the tide (of course the last few decades didn't help either). These children will then be fighting their own parents for the 20k in social security benefits. But they'll be highly educated arguments with their multi-six-figure-degrees :confused:

[littlejerry]

That is only true if the money is finite. Short of total government collapse a la much of Europe, we'll keep printing and borrowing. The deficit is meaningless to the people who don't pay taxes... or at least they think it is.

The only way to fix this country is to change our idea of who should be eligible to make decisions for this country (i.e., vote). And I don't see that being viable because you'd need the support of the to-be-disenfranchised. Like I said, we're past the tipping point.

Days like today make me happy that I don't have children who'll have to live in the America of 50 years from now.

That is part of the problem. We need your kids (and others on this forum) to be here voting in 20 years. Certain demographics are expanding while others are shrinking.


To put it plainly we need more babies and we need them to be brought up with the right values.

[JConn]

There has to be a way to stop it, but I can't see it.

[ToddG]

Demographics have nothing to do with values.

My brother and his wife have a 2yo daughter. They also have a giant poster of BHO in their family room. Their daughter is going to be raised the same way regardless of her demographic.

[JConn]

Demographics have nothing to do with values.

My brother and his wife have a 2yo daughter. They also have a giant poster of BHO in their family room. Their daughter is going to be raised the same way regardless of her demographic.

Same with my brother minus the kid. Brought up the same way with the same ideas. Raging liberal.

[cclaxton]

Just take kids as an example.

The 18yo kid of today is not the equivalent of his 18th century counterpart. He's more idealistic, more protected from reality, less likely to be close to financial independence, etc. But he gets a vote.

A 20 year old can't buy beer because society and the government fear he's not responsible enough to avoid driving drunk. But he can vote for President.

I was born in 55...graduated HS in 73, and just missed the 72 election. I saw this history happen. A little history here: 18yo were being drafted and were dying for their country but could not vote...nor were they supposed to drink...although the military allowed it on base. "Old enough to fight, old enough to vote" was the refrain. The 26th Amendment was passed in record time....just four months...by the States.

There was a time that most states lowered the drinking age as well until too many died in alcohol-related incidents. The, most States started raising the drinking age.

But this does prove that IF the country is united in getting a Constitutional Amendment done, it can be done....it just takes compromise and political and social willpower.

Thanks,
CC

[ToddG]

I'd happily allow an exception to an increased voting age that enabled active full time military personnel to vote even if they were otherwise "underage."

[cclaxton]

There has to be a way to stop it, but I can't see it.

I have found that if you look underneath the labels and talk specific policies and specifics, people can find common ground and work together to get things done. I think the political parties and some ambitious politicians have poisoned the well of compromise and civil discussion to the point where people become alienated just based on the label. (Republican, Democrat, Liberal, Conservative, etc.) In fact, they even use the labels to berate those of their own klan (you are not a true Republican unless you believe in FILLINTHEBLANK__________, etc.)

We could make changes in firearms and concealed carrry laws at the State and local levels if we are just willing to get past the labels and work with those on gun laws even though we may have strong disagreements with them on other issues. But if we get stuck in the label (He's a liberal, She's a Democrat), we are missing those opportunities.

Just my opinion.
CC

[Alaskapopo]

Gun rights are no longer a partisan issue since public positions have changed over the past 10 years.
- 46% of Democrats strongly support the right to get a concealed carry permint;
- 72% of Democrats support the right to get a concealed carry permit;
- 47% of Republicans think there should be more gun regulations;
- 59% of Democrats support the right to use deadly force to defend yourself in public places;
- 94% of Republicans support background checks for purchase of firearms.
Source: http://www.ipsos-na.com/download/pr.aspx?id=11545

Based on these public positions it just doesn't make sense for Obama to start a fight over guns. Obama doesn't have a fight with the gun lobby on his agenda. He is more interested in cementing ObamaCare, regulating Wall Street (Which I happen to agree with), and helping to insure Democratic votes in the future by helping the middle class, as well as creating his legacy. Taking on a fight with the gun lobbies is not something that helps him. Unless he is forced into it by a major event, he will stay out of it. Besides, Congress is not in the mood to pass gun regulation, either. I am not worried about it.

Rather than focusing on National issues, the States and Local laws are the ones that we need to reform...they have a much bigger impact on our freedom of movement and freedom to carry.

CC

I am with you. I abaondoned the Republican party a while back but I also can not warm up to all the issues the Democrates support. I am an independant and I vote based on the individual and the issues. I tend to vote more democrate on a local and state level and more repulican on the national level. If both parties don't change and stop going to the extremes (left and right) we are doomed for failure. I voted for Romney over Obama only because of the gun issue. Again both parties need to start working together for the betterment of the country.
Pat

[NickA]

Same with my brother minus the kid. Brought up the same way with the same ideas. Raging liberal.

Same here, Mom and sister vs me and Dad. Probably be an interesting thread topic of its own.

[YVK]

That is only true if the money is finite. Short of total government collapse a la much of Europe, we'll keep printing and borrowing. The deficit is meaningless to the people who don't pay taxes... or at least they think it is.
.

Money is finite though. Printing devalues the money sooner or later, usually sooner. Doesn't much matter how much they hand out if you could only use it as a toilet paper. Soviet Union couldn't print its way out of default, which I lived through. Getting the value of monetary instruments drop by factor of 10 would be a powerful election platform for opposition to run on..
Likewise, incessant borrowing makes one run out of creditors, just ask Greece.

My biggest concern is how long the decay is going to continue until the governmental bankruptcy. Much like any normal parent, I don't want to leave this mess to my son to deal with, and I don't want to face during my retirement years.
The projections for Medicare Part A insolvency range between 2016 and 2024. This is with continuing projected massive cuts in reimbursements, so they have to print and borrow for that. If special interest groups are able to counteract reimbursement cuts, then it'll happen faster. The Part B and D projected obligations are not often talked about, but they are huge too. So, print and borrow. The Social Security. The welfare programs. I just hope it happens sooner than later.

[TGS]

I'd happily allow an exception to an increased voting age that enabled active full time military personnel to vote even if they were otherwise "underage."

Sounds like the roots of a meritocracy.

[JConn]

Sounds like the roots of a meritocracy.

Service guarantees citizenship.

Do you want to know more?

[Zhurdan]

Service guarantees citizenship.

Do you want to know more?

LOL'd

[Joe in PNG]

Sounds like the roots of a meritocracy.

'Duke' and 'knight' were originally military ranks.

[VolGrad]

I work as an election official in a left leaning university town known for it's arts & music community. Strangely, it also also boasts a 28%+ poverty rate. I spent 14+ hours on my feet yesterday helping people vote for "the other guy". When they were finished I thanked them for coming out.

I am so exhausted I can barely focus enough to put two sentences together. I was zoned out for most of the day (at my real job ... because I have one). I took annual leave yesterday to help folks, many without jobs of their own, vote for someone simply because of the color of his skin. Why would I say such a thing? Because they told me so.

So today I am exhausted, my feet & legs ache, and I think I'm coming down with a sore throat in spite of using hand sanitizer religiously yesterday every hour on the hour AND any time I touched someone else or touched anything someone else had touched. Today came straight home and am lying on the sofa under a blanket looking for perspective.

I found it. One of my former co-workers was moved to hospice today. She has no more than a couple of weeks to live. Her husband, children, and grandchildren no doubt have not a care for who won the election right now. I'm trying to focus on that.

I am still proud to live in the United States. I still believe it's the greatest country on earth. I just wonder how long that will last given the folks I saw making poor, uninformed decisions based not on issues or beliefs, not on life experiences ... just because of race. I can respect someone having a different political opinion than my own so long as they can string together a couple of coherent sentences in a row to articulate why they believe as they do. That I can deal with. When someone looks at me and asks, "Which one of these is Obama?" or "Who is this WRITE-IN person?" I get a little depressed. Yes, I am stating there were MORE THAN ONE (prob a dozen or so) that actually thought WRITE-IN was an actual candidate's name. Of those, at least half of them actually pressed the button. Once I realized they were stumped and asked if they would like a list of qualified WRITE-IN candidates ... and I explained what that was ... they would say, "No. I just want Obama?"

[WDW]

I personally have spent almost $3k on guns/ammo in the last week. Mostly though because I am transitioning back to Glock.

[NickA]

I work as an election official in a left leaning university town known for it's arts & music community. Strangely, it also also boasts a 28%+ poverty rate. I spent 14+ hours on my feet yesterday helping people vote for "the other guy". When they were finished I thanked them for coming out.

I am so exhausted I can barely focus enough to put two sentences together. I was zoned out for most of the day (at my real job ... because I have one). I took annual leave yesterday to help folks, many without jobs of their own, vote for someone simply because of the color of his skin. Why would I say such a thing? Because they told me so.

So today I am exhausted, my feet & legs ache, and I think I'm coming down with a sore throat in spite of using hand sanitizer religiously yesterday every hour on the hour AND any time I touched someone else or touched anything someone else had touched. Today came straight home and am lying on the sofa under a blanket looking for perspective.

I found it. One of my former co-workers was moved to hospice today. She has no more than a couple of weeks to live. Her husband, children, and grandchildren no doubt have not a care for who won the election right now. I'm trying to focus on that.

I am still proud to live in the United States. I still believe it's the greatest country on earth. I just wonder how long that will last given the folks I saw making poor, uninformed decisions based not on issues or beliefs, not on life experiences ... just because of race. I can respect someone having a different political opinion than my own so long as they can string together a couple of coherent sentences in a row to articulate why they believe as they do. That I can deal with. When someone looks at me and asks, "Which one of these is Obama?" or "Who is this WRITE-IN person?" I get a little depressed. Yes, I am stating there were MORE THAN ONE (prob a dozen or so) that actually thought WRITE-IN was an actual candidate's name. Of those, at least half of them actually pressed the button. Once I realized they were stumped and asked if they would like a list of qualified WRITE-IN candidates ... and I explained what that was ... they would say, "No. I just want Obama?"

I really want to make a "Not Sure" /Idiocracy joke about "Write-in", but I just don't have the heart.
Thanks for the perspective, hope you feel better, and hang in there dude.

[ToddG]

Service guarantees citizenship.

Do you want to know more?

Read my mind, dude. Awesome reference.

[Sparks2112]

Read my mind, dude. Awesome reference.

He had some really good ideas.

[Kyle Reese]

Service guarantees citizenship.

Do you want to know more?

Sounds like a great idea to make sure people actually pay their fair share and have some skin in the game.

You didn't build that, though. Someone else made it happen (Robert A. Heinlein):D:D:D

ETA: I "panic bought" a 480 round carton of Swiss military issue 7.5x55 GP 11 Patronen for my K31's.

[LittleLebowski]

Service guarantees citizenship.

Do you want to know more?

That movie made my eyes bleed.

[Tamara]

That movie made my eyes bleed.

That movie makes the baby Jesus cry.

To be so gauche as to quote myself (http://thefiringline.com/forums/showpost.php?p=1298088&postcount=15):

Imagine if they made a movie of the Bible, but Satan was the good guy, and the entire populace of the Bronze Age Middle East ran around in sequin-and-feather-covered spacesuits. On rollerblades.

That's about the level of difference between the book and movie. They didn't just juggle a few things; they reversed the ideological meaning 180 degrees.

As far as the tech and stuff goes, the guys in the book were wearing super-advanced combat armor and operated mostly out of visual sight of each other, not lined up shoulder to shoulder like a bunch of Assault Rifle-wielding British Redcoats, but blazing wildly from the hip instead of actually trying to hit anything. "Coming soon to a theater near you: An explosive new science fiction adventure, based on the back cover of a novel by Robert Heinlein!"

[Shawn.L]

4 years ago I was lucky enough to have the forethought to put a years worth of ammo on a 0% interest CC while everyone was buying guns. I also offloaded all my crappy guns for way more than I paid for them (goodbye $75 SKS and AK I got on trade for a surplus CZ).
While everyone was scouring walmarts for a box of ammo that might show up or paying through the nose when ammo did appear I shot my regular 200/week plus the classes I was taking (I actually know guys who dropped out of classes for lack of ammo).

That taught me a lesson.
I always keep a year(ish) on hand.

[Sparks2112]

On Tuesday we had our best in store day ever. Wednesday we beat Tuesday by a couple grand and Thursday we doubled our Wednesday total. At one point I called in 5 checks on seperate individuals all buying KAC rifles. It's getting stupid real fast.

[Vinh]

On Tuesday we had our best in store day ever. Wednesday we beat Tuesday by a couple grand and Thursday we doubled our Wednesday total. At one point I called in 5 checks on seperate individuals all buying KAC rifles. It's getting stupid real fast.
Crap, I was hoping to buy a couple more KAC rifles in the next few months. There goes that plan.

[JSGlock34]

That movie made my eyes bleed.

Supposedly there is a reboot (http://www.empireonline.com/news/story.asp?NID=34394) in the works that will be closer to the book, but I've been burned before...

[EMC]

Supposedly there is a reboot (http://www.empireonline.com/news/story.asp?NID=34394) in the works that will be closer to the book, but I've been burned before...

That would be outstanding.

[dookie1481]

On Tuesday we had our best in store day ever. Wednesday we beat Tuesday by a couple grand and Thursday we doubled our Wednesday total. At one point I called in 5 checks on seperate individuals all buying KAC rifles. It's getting stupid real fast.

My store has been the opposite, as have most of the other stores in Vegas (from what I have heard).

[Kyle Reese]

I just, ah, panic bought some Danish SS109 ammo....... (I'd have bought it anyways). :p

[TommyG]

This!!

Where I bolded is the real problem we're facing. The deficit is meaningless until inflation outstrips the rate at which employers can increase paychecks and the bond market can pay savers. Now the last half of that, about the bond market is already true; the final component, which will be confirmed shortly, is the rate of wage increases. Once that thread is cut, the sword falls.



Been having this discussion with a coworker in a very specific context in the weeks leading up to the election: cost of a new automobile relative to each of our current household earnings. We are both in the market for a vehicle and the figures we have been seeing for a brand new or almost new one are staggering. A 72 month car loan will result in a payment that looks slightly less like a mortgage payment but that is a hell of a long loan on a good that has almost no value at the end of the transaction. Our income has certainly not kept pace with the increase in prices in that market. I suspect we are not the only ones. I agree with the above, it will get everyone's attention when it becomes worse and widespread. It will also be far too late to do anything about it.

[ares338]

#%*€%#....yup it's started. I went to 2 gun shops yesterday to find some small pistol primers and they had been cleaned out...sigh! Human beings are funny animals. Maybe I am in the dark....I am always optimistic that things will be fine. Callme Polyanna I guess! :p

[ford.304]

Kind of got unlucky that my cash flow to stock up on reloading components landed right after the election. I was pretty worried, but *thankfully*, none of the local places were out of primers and brass yet, and Black Bullets International managed to ship same day.

[cclaxton]

No changes at Freedom Munitions, other than keeping up with demand.
No changes in the price of Aguila or CCI Blazer as listed here: http://gun-deals.com/ammo.php?caliber=9mm+Luger

Don't see it yet.
CC

[Kyle Reese]

SG Ammo has lots of 9x19 FMJ in stock.

[Chemsoldier]

Colorado Springs:

Wal-Mart: No change to availability, they are sold out of Federal 100 rd. 55 grain .223 but they have been selling out of that within a day or two or getting it in for months. No increase to prices.

Sportsman's Warehouse: (general purpose sporting goods store focused on hunting and fishing) No price mark-up, all ammo still available, clerk says that they are moving more ARs than normal but still fully stocked with many ARs, a few AKs, a few M1As

Specialty Sports: (a very large gun store, has everything including Class III and prepping supplies though its prices are VERY high) still has plenty of everything. They pre-empted the buying spree by marking up their prices a few years ago (only half-joking). They are doing business, are busy even, but not running out.

It seems to have hit the really cheap ammo available on the interwebs more than the local stores here.

[Mjolnir]

I saw .45 ACP Winchester Ball at... $650 per case this weekend at Gander Mountain.

Holy Crap!

[CCT125US]

I saw .45 ACP Winchester Ball at... $650 per case this weekend at Gander Mountain.

Holy Crap!

FYI that $$ would yield 5K+ in reload components......

[JConn]

Yeah Dick's was selling blazer brass 100 for 200 rounds. 45 acp

[Slavex]

Just got the pricing quote for a group buy I'm doing up here in Canada, thanks to all you greedy and scared Americans the price on primers has gone up $3/1000 and the wait to fill the order went from 1 week to 3-4 weeks.
(please note sarcasm is contained in this post).

[F-Trooper05]

Just got the pricing quote for a group buy I'm doing up here in Canada, thanks to all you greedy and scared Americans the price on primers has gone up $3/1000 and the wait to fill the order went from 1 week to 3-4 weeks.
(please note sarcasm is contained in this post).

Yeah, well you bastards detail strip my car every time I drive to Seattle, so now we're even. ;)

[Slavex]

At which border? Let me know the next time you're swinging through, if it's southern BC you pass through.

Thankfully we've got a good reliable source of quality bullets made here in Canada, so at least we don't have to worry about that problem again.

[F-Trooper05]

AlCan heading south, Peace Arch heading north.

[Slavex]

Peace Arch is about an hour from my house on a bad day. The #1 highway however is about 10 minutes from my house, and my range is even closer to the highway, so if you wanna pop by, need a place to crash for the night, or want to go shoot, let me know.

[F-Trooper05]

Hell yeah, I'll give you a shout next time I'm passing through.

[1 old 0311]

Should have planned ahead. Both CTD, and Lucky Gunner still have a good supply.