Retrieval orders?

[CraigS]

https://www.foxnews.com/politics/fbi-gun-retrieval-orders-failed-background-checks-hits-historic-high-report
I don't understand this. When I buy a gun, I don't get to actually take it out of the store until they get an OK from the NICS check. So what is this about 'retrieval? Are there states where this is different? Thought NICS was a national system.

[Half Moon]

https://www.foxnews.com/politics/fbi-gun-retrieval-orders-failed-background-checks-hits-historic-high-report
I don't understand this. When I buy a gun, I don't get to actually take it out of the store until they get an OK from the NICS check. So what is this about 'retrieval? Are there states where this is different? Thought NICS was a national system.

I'm assuming this is the "Charleston Loophole". Under federal law if a handgun background check does not return a result in 72 hours the FFL MAY release the gun to the purchaser. Many FFL's won't release until the background check clears but at 72 hours it becomes discretionary. In at least some states (Maybe all, I'm not sure) the background check will continue until completed. Obviously some banned persons may end up in possession of a firearm under those circumstances. On the other hand not having a release date in law would allow states so inclined to just slow walk the background checks or defund their background check units.

ETA: and some states may be more stringent than federal law. For instance under Measure 114 (tied up in the courts) Oregon would not allow a firearm to be released until the background check clears period.

[HCM]

https://www.foxnews.com/politics/fbi-gun-retrieval-orders-failed-background-checks-hits-historic-high-report
I don't understand this. When I buy a gun, I don't get to actually take it out of the store until they get an OK from the NICS check. So what is this about 'retrieval? Are there states where this is different? Thought NICS was a national system.

This is nothing new - it’s been part of the process since NICS started in the early 1990s.

NICS is a national system.

Most FFLs only conduct the NICS check after reviewing the Form 4473 and ensuring there are no disqualifying answers.

Under federal law NICS has 3 possible responses: proceed, deny and delay/researching. In the event of a “delay” NICS has 3 business days to provide a response.

If NICS does not provide a response within 3 business days the FFL can release the gun to the buyer.

If the NICS check subsequently reveals the buyer should have been a denial and /or they lied on the Form 4473 ATF goes out and retrieves the firearm.

That’s at the federal level and it’s how it works in states which have no state level requirements for background checks.

Some states have their own state laws requiring a positive background check for a dealer to release a gun.

FFLs also have the option to refuse to sell / transfer/ release a gun, which is their prerogative as a private business.

[MTP]

The ATF explains this specific case in their FAQ (https://www.atf.gov/firearms/qa/what-if-licensee-receives-%E2%80%9Cdenied%E2%80%9D-response-nics-or-state-poc-after-3-business-days-have) (last paragraph)

[Hambo]

That's 2020-2021 data. Record number of sales equals record number of retrievals. Shocking...

[CraigS]

HalfMoon and HCM thanks. I had heard of the 72hr thing but never really looked into it to see how it actually worked. MTP and Hambo thanks also.

[HeavyDuty]

Illinois is one of the states that laugh at this. My personal record was a 43 day delay.

[Chuck Whitlock]

Towards the bottom of the article, naturally, they show that the rate of NICS denials is less than 2%.

[MTP]

Just took the time to read the actual article .. 2020 and 2021 were also record years for firearm sales in general, so it is kind of expected that NICS denials would proportionally increase as well (to historic high numbers, as the news aptly point out :rolleyes: )

“The best thing about statistics is that they give you a good excuse for doing something else that benefits.”– Andrew Langdon

[Hambo]

Illinois is one of the states that laugh at this. My personal record was a 43 day delay.

FDLE does the FL checks, and delays can take months. There is an appeal process for denials, and sometimes FDLE gets reversed. However, most people who get denied know it's coming, often for past domestic violence.

[HeavyDuty]

FDLE does the FL checks, and delays can take months. There is an appeal process for denials, and sometimes FDLE gets reversed. However, most people who get denied know it's coming, often for past domestic violence.

I always got delayed for unknown reasons, and was never denied. I finally found out that I was kicked out for manual handling because I have a similar name to a multiple convicted felon (different race, different DOB) and they were usually so backed up it took time to get eyes on it. It didn’t help that IL doesn’t participate in UPIN.

NH was a breath of fresh air after that, and TX even better since I have a CHL. No waits at all.

[Borderland]

Here in WA the wait is 10 working days. 12 days if you hit it just right or 14 if you don't. The FFL doesn't submit to NICS. They submit to the state. The state does the BC using their own data. They look at your health records, court records and I think they also use NICS.

When the state law was first enacted here the state didn't have the infrastructure in place to do a BC in 10 days. Some of us went much longer than that. My last transfer was 14 days at the FFL before I took the revolver home.

WA CPL never was a pass to avoid a NICS before the state law was changed. I never understood that one.

In a few more days we will probably have AR restrictions on purchase.

[mmc45414]

For the last number of years Ohio has been able to deliver to CHL holders without a NICS call. If you do something that disqualifies you from holding your CHL it is supposed to be surrendered, and I think it is actually supposed to be retrieved by the issuing SO if it isn't. But I am sure all that takes time, plenty of time to run out and buy that blaster you wanted.

[HCM]

For the last number of years Ohio has been able to deliver to CHL holders without a NICS call. If you do something that disqualifies you from holding your CHL it is supposed to be surrendered, and I think it is actually supposed to be retrieved by the issuing SO if it isn't. But I am sure all that takes time, plenty of time to run out and buy that blaster you wanted.

In TX FFLs can scan the back of an LTC to verify it’s validity before accepting it in lieu of a NICS check

[mmc45414]

In TX FFLs can scan the back of an LTC to verify it’s validity before accepting it in lieu of a NICS check
They very well may do that in Ohio also, I forget if they just peek at it or take it for a min while I am always focused on taking the quiz.