K6s vs SP101 vs Steel J frame?

[Dov]

I've had an airweight J frame forever but age and health issues are making even light practice loads painful so looking for something roughly similar in size that is heavier.

I'm not adverse to trying a Colt, but only Colt Revolver I've shot much was buddy's Anaconda many years ago I liked that a lot. I've handled a couple of used Pythons but their triggers just felt off to me, probably to many years with J & N frame triggers.

Just looking for a 2" to 2.5" 38/357 probably K frame snub at biggest.

I've handled but not shot K6s and liked them just not sure about reliability and durability.

I've don't like Ruger Security Six, my dad still has one and I had one for few years but traded it for something else. I do like SP101, GP100, and SRH.

I really like J & N frames, unlikely to get rid of those even if I can't shoot them like i used to.

[Duelist]

My Airweight practice loads are 105gr moly coated lead over 2.5-2.7gr BE. They are like a mouse fart, and I can happily shoot them from an airweight or steel gun all day.

My steel J is a 60-9 Ladysmith, supposedly chambered in .357. I wouldn’t know for sure, since I never intend to shoot a .357 through it. It works well as a steel practice gun, or as an IWB belt gun with an airweight in the pocket or on the ankle.

For what you are doing, I would get an SP101 or a steel J, and/or maybe a similar .22.

[FrankB]

You mentioned a Colt, so I have to tell there is always a 2” Colt King Cobra Carry in my pocket. It’s well built, and can handle .357 magnum loads. I had originally bought the 3” King Cobra, but my son has that now. The 2” is just perfect for me.

[medmo]

I think the K6S is worth the money. Incredibly sweet action right out of the box and you have options for changing sights. I have +700 rounds through mine. I haven't been shooting it very much since small pistol primers have become impossible to find. It will handle 357 mag +P rounds without causing me tears or blood with the factory Kimber rubber grip. I've mostly shot my handloads 158gr SWC over Titegroup through it.

[Totem Polar]

I’ve owned all of them: SP101/SPNY, 3 new Colt Cobras, a K6s… what I have left now are 4 all-steel J-frames. I really like the S&W 640 Pro, in particular. Lots of info/reviews on that gun out there.

That said, I’d have no problem with a current production K6s or a Colt Night cobra, either—those were fine. The SP is great, but old school; for the same size and weight, you can get a 6th round from 3 other makers (K6s, Colt Cobra, Taurus executive).

JMO.

[gtmtnbiker98]

I own a 640 and a King Cobra 3". It's hard to beat the King Cobra for a primary since it falls in-between a J and K frame S&W in size. My King Cobra is far easier to shoot than my 640 but the 640 trumps everything when it comes to ease of carry. If you are looking for something a bit more robust in terms of recoil mitigation, I do not feel that the K6S is going to get you to where you need to be.

[gato naranja]

I've had an airweight J frame forever but age and health issues are making even light practice loads painful so looking for something roughly similar in size that is heavier.

People who have fired my DAO SP101 all agree that it is a very a very comfortable snubby to shoot, particularly when compared to something like a 642. I have yet to find anything in its class that is equally "controllable."

[Half Moon]

If K frame is on the table, and you're willing to chance used, the S&W Model 12, round butt, 2", has a lot to recommend it. Slightly lighter than a traditional steel frame J, a good bit lighter than the J magnums. Six shots. Decent concealibility though not so much as a J frame. The full grip, with a grip adaptor, does a lot to mitigate recoil. Trade offs are standard pressure only recommended and they tend to be a bit more fragile than the all steel steel equivalents. At least for me, they hit the sweet spot.

[Hizzie]

Stick with the J. An all steel 3” 60 (23.2oz) with the new hogue 6000’s would be pretty tame with standard pressure 38’s.

https://www.hogueinc.com/grips/grips-for-smith-wesson/j-frame-revolvers/round-butt/standard-full-size/overmolded-rubber-nylon/s-w-j-frame-round-butt-overmolded-rubber-monogrip-black

The Centennial version is pretty awesome.

https://www.hogueinc.com/grips/grips-for-smith-wesson/j-frame-revolvers/round-butt/centennial/s-w-centennial-j-frame-round-butt-polymer-bodyguard-38-overmolded-rubber-tamer-grip-black

[Zeke38]

Spent a year and a couple thousand dollars sorting out the same problem in 2018-19. Purchased a K6 2" with night sights, a Smith 640 Pro and a new Colt Cobra 2" 38. Spent many hours at the range sorting out the strengths of each firearm, compared to the other for MY USE! (time available due to retirement)

Outcome: Loved the Colt for the Hogue grip and liked the trigger, wanted the sixth shot which the Colt has. K6 was utterly reliable and the sweetest DA trigger I can remember in over 50 years of handgunning, and the Smith just had the cool factor, accurate, loved the sights but gun did not shoot to the sights.

What do I carry today for EDC: Colt Night Cobra, with VZ grip. Only downside is the night sight could be a tad bigger and brighter. Great carry piece. Hogue rubber from the King Cobra works well on the NC also. Second choice is the K6. I would kept the K6 but grip selection at the time of testing was poor. I hear there are better grips out there now for the K6. Renting guns is a cheap way to figure out what you like.
38+P is enough cartridge for the job.

https://i.imgur.com/Rpf3WFsl.jpg

[03RN]

Are you pocket carrying or on the belt?
I think k frames snubs are awesome but if you're looking for a gun for pocket carry the I'm not sure the k frame is small enough.

I'd go colt det special if I wanted smaller.

[Dov]

Are you pocket carrying or on the belt?
I think k frames snubs are awesome but if you're looking for a gun for pocket carry the I'm not sure the k frame is small enough.

I'd go colt det special if I wanted smaller.

I pocket carry because of pain issues that are triggered with IWB & grip touching ribs/back trigger debilitating pain, like stuck in bed for day or two pain.

I can wear low ride type duty holsters fine as long as I keep the weight balanced, part of the reason I carry pair of G26's is the balanced weight worked better for my pain issues than one G26 and one Airweight, but low ride duty holsters not ideal for CCW.

I normally pocket carry pair of G26's with the 12 round mags, drop to 10 round flush mags if needed for certain pants, or the J frame when the G26's don't work.

I can still shoot the airweight J frame, just leaves me with severe hand pain for week+ but there are many other things that trigger severe hand pain at this point in my life.

I'm not even sure that its the recoil of the airweight, it might just be the level of grip needed that's triggering the pain based on the non gun things that trigger the problem.

[Buckeye63]

I pocket carry because of pain issues that are triggered with IWB & grip touching ribs/back trigger debilitating pain, like stuck in bed for day or two pain.

I can wear low ride type duty holsters fine as long as I keep the weight balanced, part of the reason I carry pair of G26's is the balanced weight worked better for my pain issues than one G26 and one Airweight, but low ride duty holsters not ideal for CCW.

I normally pocket carry pair of G26's with the 12 round mags, drop to 10 round flush mags if needed for certain pants, or the J frame when the G26's don't work.

I can still shoot the airweight J frame, just leaves me with severe hand pain for week+ but there are many other things that trigger severe hand pain at this point in my life.

I'm not even sure that its the recoil of the airweight, it might just be the level of grip needed that's triggering the pain based on the non gun things that trigger the problem.

Pain from pancreatitis?

Also look at a LCR357… …perfect for 38spl , 38spl +P

97818

A Taurus 856 is a option ( I like mine )

[Dov]

Pain from pancreatitis?




Nope, some of it is from past injuries some of it is from chronic issues, and some they still aren't sure about. The doctors know what some of it is but don't really have a clue at this point on the rest.

I've had some surgeries and lots of testing. And some physical therapy & other exercises that help when I can do them.

If anyone is going to Mayo Clinic in Rochester MN I can probably help with advice on parking, hotels, and good gunshop and decent indoor range.

There is also fair outdoor range outside of town, but I don't think they allow non members there anymore.

Used to live there when I was younger and healthier, that's how I know about the Gunshop, friends with the Gunsmith there.

Also Rochester isn't terribly far from the Onalaska/La Crosse Wisconsin range that DB, Chuck Haggard & can't remember who third instructor was did class at this summer/fall. Its like ~70 minutes Interstate most of the way.

Edited to add: If your there in MN Winter there is at least one hotel that has heated basement garage, that my gf stayed at when I had overnight tests done at Mayo one winter. And pretty much all the hotels have Shuttle service to Mayo.

Also if your in downtown part of Mayo or Rochester there are a bunch of skyways and tunnel systems so you can get around on foot without going outside, think Clancy even wrote about that in one of his novels.

[Totem Polar]

Reading more into your situation, I’d probably buy a 3” all steel J, or that 640 pro to practice with, and just rock on with pocket carry of the airweight Js. It’s not like an all steel understudy/practice gun and an airweight for carry is a new idea or novel solution: that particular combo has been getting it done for decades. JMO.


Now, if you *want* more wheelie variety, I am far and away the last guy to poo poo that idea.
;)

[03RN]

If you can pocket carry a pair of g26s than I think you'll be fine with any k frame

[Joe in PNG]

The one problem I've found with pocketing my K is that you need a really deep pocket, otherwise you'll have the bottom of the grip peeking out.

[42Willys]

97832

The excellent Model 12 has been mentioned. I love carrying mine - it is less than 22 ounces loaded. The K frame grip is actually harder to conceal in appendix mode than I anticipated, but it conceals very well between 3:00 and 4:30 in a leather belt clip IWB holster.

The trigger on the 12 is superb. This one is my first airweight K frame. It is not terribly easy to shoot with heavy loads - with wadcutters or light hand loads - no worries. I thought the bigger grip of the K frame would make it easier to shoot heavier loads compared to an airweight j frame, but that was not as true as I thought. Still, superb weapon, finely crafted.

For a real shooter I would probably pick a SP101 or a steel J frame like a 60 or 640. The extra ounces make a big difference in my opinion, and the modern steel frames will be durable and resistant to rust.

A 640 for range and 642 in the pocket would be a great pair. I think that idea has been floated in this great thread.

Cheers.

[Dov]

Reading more into your situation, I’d probably buy a 3” all steel J, or that 640 pro to practice with, and just rock on with pocket carry of the airweight Js. It’s not like an all steel understudy/practice gun and an airweight for carry is a new idea or novel solution: that particular combo has been getting it done for decades. JMO.


Now, if you *want* more wheelie variety, I am far and away the last guy to poo poo that idea.
;)

Yeah I'd be okay with that, and honestly most of the time when I carry J frame instead of G26 its the size/shape not the weight that's the reason.

If I stick with J frame, even if I go to 3" grips I have and one of the holsters I have would work.

[Joe in PNG]

There was a time when reasonably priced 3" J frames filled the gunshop cases, and like an utter idiot, I didn't buy one back then.

Idiot!!!

[Dov]

The one problem I've found with pocketing my K is that you need a really deep pocket, otherwise you'll have the bottom of the grip peeking out.

Pockets are pretty easy to have altered for depth, that's something I've done in past.

I certainly like K frames, if I'd started with K frame for CCW instead of J frames I probably wouldn't have felt need for the Glocks. The 3" K frame is sort of rough equivalent to the small Glock 9's functionally not literally.. A 3" K frame or G19 served much the same nich, and a 2" or 2.5" kinda matches a G26 with a 10 round or 12 round mag IMHO.

Before my pain issues I was very much revolver and pump 12 gauge person.

Even now if it wasn't for the pain issues I'd be very happy with Mike Pipes approach to CCW, a pair of J frames for each hand plus a spare :)

[Lex Luthier]

There was a time when reasonably priced 3" J frames filled the gunshop cases, and like an utter idiot, I didn't buy one back then.

Idiot!!!

"Steeempy! You Eeediot!"

Yeah, I sympathize there. Several friends I introduced to revolver shooting found 3" pinned-barrel model 36s in the early 90s and still own them. I would have done well to do likewise.

[Dov]

97832

The excellent Model 12 has been mentioned. I love carrying mine - it is less than 22 ounces loaded. The K frame grip is actually harder to conceal in appendix mode than I anticipated, but it conceals very well between 3:00 and 4:30 in a leather belt clip IWB holster.

The trigger on the 12 is superb. This one is my first airweight K frame. It is not terribly easy to shoot with heavy loads - with wadcutters or light hand loads - no worries. I thought the bigger grip of the K frame would make it easier to shoot heavier loads compared to an airweight j frame, but that was not as true as I thought. Still, superb weapon, finely crafted.

For a real shooter I would probably pick a SP101 or a steel J frame like a 60 or 640. The extra ounces make a big difference in my opinion, and the modern steel frames will be durable and resistant to rust.

A 640 for range and 642 in the pocket would be a great pair. I think that idea has been floated in this great thread.

Cheers.

I've drooled over Model 12 at least once in Cabela's is it called Gun Library? Been while since I was in a Cabelas's, whatever the section of the store with the truly interesting guns in vs all the modern production guns.

I just couldn't convince myself that it was smart or good thing to do, I could get 2 maybe 3 J frames on sale for price of one Model 12, not to mention the collector aspect of the Model 12 and I'd have probably worn it out if I had it.

[Buckeye63]

97832

The excellent Model 12 has been mentioned. I love carrying mine - it is less than 22 ounces loaded. The K frame grip is actually harder to conceal in appendix mode than I anticipated, but it conceals very well between 3:00 and 4:30 in a leather belt clip IWB holster.

The trigger on the 12 is superb. This one is my first airweight K frame. It is not terribly easy to shoot with heavy loads - with wadcutters or light hand loads - no worries. I thought the bigger grip of the K frame would make it easier to shoot heavier loads compared to an airweight j frame, but that was not as true as I thought. Still, superb weapon, finely crafted.

For a real shooter I would probably pick a SP101 or a steel J frame like a 60 or 640. The extra ounces make a big difference in my opinion, and the modern steel frames will be durable and resistant to rust.

A 640 for range and 642 in the pocket would be a great pair. I think that idea has been floated in this great thread.

Cheers.

97836

My favorite revolver

[Totem Polar]

Before my pain issues I was very much revolver and pump 12 gauge person.

Even now if it wasn't for the pain issues I'd be very happy with Mike Pipes approach to CCW, a pair of J frames for each hand plus a spare :)

Mike Pipes knows what’s up.

Totally tangential: almost every life-long gun guy/gal has a list of firearms they wish they had not sold. My minty model 12 snub is at the very top of an embarrassingly long, serial monogamist list. The snub 12 is a connoisseur’s dream.

[Joe in PNG]

Mike Pipes knows what’s up.

Totally tangential: almost every life-long gun guy/gal has a list of firearms they wish they had not sold. My minty model 12 snub is at the very top of an embarrassingly long, serial monogamist list. The snub 12 is a connoisseur’s dream.

Along with the "Shoulda Bought" list.

[42Willys]

97836

My favorite revolver

They are pretty great!

[HeavyDuty]

I have three small snubs, and each has a place. A early 2” 640 reissue (one of the +P+ marked ones,) a 2” 442 and a 3” K2s.

Of the three, the Airweight carries beautifully but is absolutely no fun to shoot due to weight and crappy sights. The heavier 640 is better on recoil mitigation but still has those terrible sights. The K6s is soft shooting, has a great action and first class sights.

If I could only keep one it would be the K6s - but I’d fight to also keep the Airweight for those times you don’t need a gun.

[jh9]

Along with the "Shoulda Bought" list.

Robertson Trading Post on gb has a few 2" model 12s. I poke around their used inventory on occasion. They seem to get a lot of interesting older S&W stuff. The 12s range from pretty rough to okay finish-wise but the description of the mechanics sounds like they're still in really good shape.

https://www.gunbroker.com/All/search?IncludeSellers=1006271

My brief "kinda want" phase with the model 12 never got past Internet Research (tm). The thinner frame looks like it might be a problem with using a lot of standard K-frame grips? I guess you could throw a grip adapter on there and roll with it but I never got past thinking it's an $800+ "maybe" to find out I don't really like the one grip option available. I've never seen a -4 for sale which is where they presumably started using a standard width frame.

[JHC]

There was a time when reasonably priced 3" J frames filled the gunshop cases, and like an utter idiot, I didn't buy one back then.

Idiot!!!

They were everywhere! Most that I saw were 3" Model 36s with square butts and just sat in cases or on listings languishing. I picked one up quite a few years ago for used HiPoint money and its just a fantastic shooting small revolver.

[Mike Pipes]

Thanks for the mention fellas. Just tryin to live that J frame lifestyle here in sweaty Louisiana. CYA Mike

[Half Moon]

Robertson Trading Post on gb has a few 2" model 12s. I poke around their used inventory on occasion. They seem to get a lot of interesting older S&W stuff. The 12s range from pretty rough to okay finish-wise but the description of the mechanics sounds like they're still in really good shape.

https://www.gunbroker.com/All/search?IncludeSellers=1006271

My brief "kinda want" phase with the model 12 never got past Internet Research (tm). The thinner frame looks like it might be a problem with using a lot of standard K-frame grips? I guess you could throw a grip adapter on there and roll with it but I never got past thinking it's an $800+ "maybe" to find out I don't really like the one grip option available. I've never seen a -4 for sale which is where they presumably started using a standard width frame.

Yep. They changed the grip frame to standard K width with the dash 4. Prior revisions have a slightly thinner grip frame and won't properly fit regular K frame grips. I've heard of folks modifying standard grips to fit but have never seen any. Haven't seen a dash 4 in years either. With a BK grip adaptor the Round Butt works for me. Really no difference in feel to a standard K grip for comparison sake. The shaved grip frame is just enough to screw up standard grip fit but not really enough to feel a significant difference.

[Totem Polar]

Yep. They changed the grip frame to standard K width with the dash 4. Prior revisions have a slightly thinner grip frame and won't properly fit regular K frame grips. I've heard of folks modifying standard grips to fit but have never seen any. Haven't seen a dash 4 in years either. With a BK grip adaptor the Round Butt works for me. Really no difference in feel to a standard K grip for comparison sake. The shaved grip frame is just enough to screw up standard grip fit but not really enough to feel a significant difference.

This. I found that a J-frame Tyler T worked great on a 12-3.

[358156hp]

Another possibility would be Smiffs 649 357 gun. Single and double action, shrouded hammer , and they're so ugly they're beautiful. I suggest the 357 version because the barrels slightly longer than the 38s. Sample auction linked, Holy smoke, are they really this expensive now?

https://www.gunbroker.com/item/950891707

[Half Moon]

Realized for weight comparisons, other than the Model 12, I've never actually put any of the .38 snub's on a scale. Couldn't find my digital balance in the garage, so going off a kitchen scale (and as much for my own interest as anything):

Model 38 Bodyguard
18.1 ounces
[Airweight J frame, 38 Special, 1 7/8", round butt, Taurus boot grip, 5 x 147 grain wadcutters]

Model 12-1
21.8 ounces
[Airweight K frame, .38 Special, 2", round butt, BK grip adaptor, 6 x 147 grain wadcutters]

Model 60-1
24.1 ounces
[Steel J frame, .38 Special, 1 7/8", round butt, Taurus boot grip, 5 x 147 grain wadcutters]

Model 640-1
25.8 ounces
[Steel J Magnum frame, .357 Magnum, 2 1/8", round butt, Taurus boot grip, 5 x 147 grain wadcutters]

[42Willys]

Realized for weight comparisons, other than the Model 12, I've never actually put any of the .38 snub's on a scale. Couldn't find my digital balance in the garage, so going off a kitchen scale (and as much for my own interest as anything):

Model 38 Bodyguard
18.1 ounces
[Airweight J frame, 38 Special, 1 7/8", round butt, Taurus boot grip, 5 x 147 grain wadcutters]

Model 12-1
21.8 ounces
[Airweight K frame, .38 Special, 2", round butt, BK grip adaptor, 6 x 147 grain wadcutters]

Model 60-1
24.1 ounces
[Steel J frame, .38 Special, 1 7/8", round butt, Taurus boot grip, 5 x 147 grain wadcutters]

Model 640-1
25.8 ounces
[Steel J Magnum frame, .357 Magnum, 2 1/8", round butt, Taurus boot grip, 5 x 147 grain wadcutters]

Great post.
How do you compare shooting the 640-1 to the 12?
Thanks.

[Half Moon]

Great post.
How do you compare shooting the 640-1 to the 12?
Thanks.

Different.

I’m going to hedge a bit here. I’ve had a love-hate relationship with the 640. It likely would have gone to trade long since but it’s the first firearm my wife and I bought as a couple. Even though she is pretty meh on revolvers she is sentimental about this one. I also haven’t shot the 640 since before COVID. With lockdowns and ammo shortages I’ve focused more on EDC’s and .22’s. My recollections may be tinged. I think Lester Polfus regularly carries his 640 and for instance might be a better reference for them.

Grips
The 12 has the classic 3-finger K grip. A little cramped but a 3-finger grip. Filled out with a grip adaptor it does a lot for control and recoil mitigation.

The 640 has a 2-finger grip. Even with the added weight the stub grip leads to more muzzle flip, etc. All J’s are sensitive to grip combo but the 640 seems especially so. With the stock splinter grips the 640 is almost useless at range (though these are the best for concealment). That said the shooting characteristics change a lot with different grip designs. The Taurus boots covering the back strap and adding mild palm swells do a lot for the 640. Groups tighten up etc. Bearing in mind I have large hands and the J’s really aren’t a good fit for them without stepping up to full size grips which kind of defeats the purpose of a J snub.

Triggers and Pull
The 12 has the classic K frame, flat spring going for it. This is the smooth trigger pull that made S&W’s reputation.

The 640 is also very smooth in the pull. It was not so much out of the box but a lot of dry and live fire have made about the cleanest, non-custom trigger I’ve felt in a J. It cleaned up nice. The trigger itself is the smooth face, wide trigger. It has a tendency to pinch when pulling the trigger. I’d call this another hand size thing but it does it to my wife too and she has small hands.

Sights
The 12-1 has the itsy-bitsy 1/10” skinny sights. It indexes well but the sights can be hard to acquire at speed if your index is off. The 12-2 (and later) have the 1/8” sights and pick up well (at least with orange nail polish applied!). I also had a surprise measuring the sight radius this morning. The 12’s are almost ½” shorter than the 640 though I would have guessed them as dead even.

The 640 also has the 1/8” sights but with an oddly shallow presentation. 640’s are also notorious for shooting low: substantially low with some loads but also low with pretty much everything. This one is no different. No one seems to know what load they zero’d for (if any). It almost feels like the 640 wants something more in the 170 grain to 180 grain range. For what it’s worth Revolver Guy has a decent blog entry on filing down the front sight to raise the point of impact.

Recoil
This is one where memories may be tinged. Free recoil of the 640 has to be lower with a ¼ pound more weight. My memory of perceived recoil says the 12 is less. Assuming I recall correctly then it has to come down to the larger grip better controlling muzzle flip and also spreading the recoil a tiny bit more across the palm.

Accuracy
The 640 with Taurus boot grip is OK-ish at reasonable ranges. The 12 is just better. Oddly the Model 38 Bodyguard may be the most accurate of my .38 snubs. I would trust the Model 38 or the Model 12 for a static 25 yard shot (but especially the Bodyguard). I wouldn’t trust the 640 for that. Then again it’s a snub and what is really a reasonable engagement distance for that package?

Anyways this has been a bit of a long ramble. Hope it helped!

[gato naranja]

Recoil
This is one where memories may be tinged. Free recoil of the 640 has to be lower with a ¼ pound more weight. My memory of perceived recoil says the 12 is less. Assuming I recall correctly then it has to come down to the larger grip better controlling muzzle flip and also spreading the recoil a tiny bit more across the palm.

I agree that it isn't just the weight, but the grip size as well that factor into the J-frame equation. The original "Centennial" grips were concealable, but I never got on with them; I still hold older 640s in high regard, but those old skinny wood grips were not part of why I feel this way. Of all the grips I tried, I did like the Uncle Mike's boot grips best for ease of pocket carry, but their combat grips were much the better shooters. Were I to return to the J-frame today, I'd probably put a Hogue monogrip on and try to live with it.

But the J-frame isn't alone in this regard...

What grip a person uses on a Ruger SP101 makes a difference as well. My DAO SP101 snubby with the three-finger Crimson Trace grips weighs weighs 25.1 ounces empty (and probably never over 27.5 ounces loaded with any .38 Specials I use in it). I like the relatively large grips like the CTCs or Hogues on SP101s because small boot-type grips tend to be marginally controllable for me and the factory rubber grip has all the ergonomics of a short length of square-section wood molding with the edges slightly relieved.

So additional weight in and of itself will not always lessen the perceived recoil.

[DanTheWolfman]

Great thread and great advise. Unloaded approbation weights. More weight rubber grips less felt recoil.
Re Half Moon agree Model 12 w BKgrp adapter 17 ounce
OLD COLT DETECTIVE 21 once thicker yet shorter grip is very nice

I really want a 3" k6s 27-28 ounce and king cobra 28 ounce but pricy

The unknown RIA Imported 30 ounce 6shot .357 from alpha proj AL 3.0 and 3.1
Is something different w no recoil even w hot 158 magnums rubber grips soak it up

Easiest is get a 3" Taurus 856 Defender 25 ounce or nicer Executive and a 942 .22lr for cheap fun practice

Hope that helps.

A 3" sp101 is also beautiful and tank like but only 5 shots 27 ounce.

Hope this helps.

Lionquest Fitness and Hrfunk and Gun Sam helped me learn about Revos

[03RN]

Gun sam used to have interesting videos when he used water but please don't have hime "teach" you about revolvers.

[DanTheWolfman]

Just saying....I've shot pistols since childhood a d only got into revolvers a few years ago. There isn't tons of revo content and I've tried to do so and it's made me a better auto shooter