A few weeks living with Apple Macs

[JodyH]

On my latest computer upgrade at the house I recently switched to Mac.
iMac as the family room computer (replaced a Dell Win XP desktop) and MacBook Air (replaced a Dell dual-boot Ubuntu/Win7 15" laptop) as my personal/business machine.
After using the Macs for a few weeks I thought I'd offer up my impressions.

The iMac is the perfect family computer. The all in one design is a great form factor for a desktop.
OSX is simple and trouble free for my somewhat "computer indifferent" wife and boy. Power on, point and click, everything works.
It was simple to set up multiple user accounts and the parental controls work without being overly aggressive.
Since I'm the only one with Admin rights it's easy to monitor what gets installed and changed, that should keep it running smooth and virus free.
iMac = great computer for the family.

MacBook Air, the hardware is awesome. Sleek and solid at the same time. Mad props on the hardware.
The Magic Trackpad rocks, I found a base that snaps the wireless keyboard and trackpad solidly together and it's the best combination I've ever used for interfacing with a computer.
OSX on the other hand has been somewhat irritating.
I've found no way to attach my Samsung Galaxy 3 to my Mac, even as a USB storage device. Had to break out the Win7 machine to root and ROM it.
Getting Time Machine to backup to my Seagate NAS (supposedly Mac/TM compatible) has been an exercise in frustration. I'm currently backing up to a 2TB external drive attached to the iMac but would prefer to use the NAS attached to the router.
I attached a Apple external CD/DVD drive and went to play a DVD... the DVD Player crashes on startup (internet search reveals this is a common problem). Downloaded VLC Player until Apple releases a patch to get the native player to work.
I have noticed that non-native applications aren't as stable as they are on other OS's. Chromium browser and Open Office have both been rock solid on Linux and Win7 but both crash frequently on OSX.
Probably my biggest gripe with OSX is how hard I have to look to find the "power user" settings and configuration editors. Just like iOS devices the nuts and bolts are hidden and almost impossible to access. OSX is definitely made for two levels of user, the casual user and the hardcore geek. Things are too dumbed down feeling for me, but really getting into the deeper settings takes more research and effort than what I want to put into computers anymore.
Overall I'm happy with my switch to Apple/Mac despite the issues I'm trying to work through.
If I had it to do all over again I'd definitely stay with the iMac as the family machine but might look into a Samsung ultrabook dual booting Win7Pro 64bit/Ubuntu 12.04 instead of the MacBook Air as my laptop.

[Jason F]

...OSX is definitely made for two levels of user, the casual user and the hardcore geek. Things are too dumbed down feeling for me, but really getting into the deeper settings takes more research and effort than what I want to put into computers anymore....

I completely agree.

I was a Windows geek for decades, but 5 years ago or so I decided to finally switch to Apple full time. (I'm a photographer, and most of my industry runs Mac's, so I was definitely a bit of the odd man out before)

At first I missed delving in to the nuts and bolts and tweaking the crap out of everything... but you know what, my life got busy, business got more complicated, and I grew to love that the Mac's just worked for me 98% of the time without having to tear them apart and reconfigure them and the software - and then support the new confliguration I'd created by myself.

My brother is still a hard core PC nerd, as is one of my best friends. But when I consider the annual amount of hours I spend doing real hard core troubleshooting on my systems - versus what they have to put in on an annual basis? - it makes me happy with my setup.

Gosh this kool-aid is tasty... :D

[Vinh]

Thanks for the update. I am one month into my MacBook Pro ownership. I like the hardware, but cannot share my thoughts on the software.

[ToddG]

Jason -- Good explanation and I'd echo the same. After years of customizing and tweaking various flavors of Windows (and OS/2 for those of you who remember such things) now I just run the Mac.

[JodyH]

OCD and OSX are not a good combination.
If something doesn't work, I want to know why and I want to fix it.
With Win7 and Ubuntu there's a mid-level of preferences and settings that usually accomplished what I wanted.
With OSX there's only 1st grade ("Oooh I changed backgrounds! I'm a power user!") and PhD ("Terminal: sudo ~ insertgeek bootinass -getsum").

Take connecting my Samsung Galaxy 3 phone to the USB port.
Windows and Ubuntu both recognized and mounted it as a USB storage device. A quick trip to Samsung's web site and I had device drivers installed that allowed me to upload, download and change phone settings from my desktop.
OSX doesn't recognize it and no drivers exist. I hear that there's a way to access it via Terminal but why would I want to?
Seriously... it's 2012 and mounting a phone as a USB storage device should be a no-brainer.
I know why they do it (*cough* sell me a iPhone *cough*) but it still ticks me off.

The Mac works great as a internet surfing word processor but to indulge my inner geek (root and ROM flash a phone for example) I still have to keep a Win/Linux machine around.

I think the best OS for me will be the next generation or two of Linux Ubuntu. More streamlined and secure than Windows, more open and tweakable than OSX.
:cool:

[Jason F]

Jody-

You're definitely right - if you connect any modern phone via USB to OS X it should at least show up as a storage device. That is kind of dumb. But to Apple's credit, their walled garden is tightly controlled to keep it all nice & tidy, so I can understand their point of view. But it is frustrating where if you try and step just slightly out of their line of thinking, you run in to all kinds of problems trying to get OS X to work nicely with something.

Proof that just like weapons, an OS is a tool. No one OS is perfect, and if you have a variety of needs, perhaps a variety of OS's (and hardware for them) is the best solution. That's not a perfect situation (being forced to have multiple machines), but it may be a point of view worth considering.


And I'm currently in the same boat of "C'mon Apple, WTF?!". Why? I just got an iPhone 5 and I'm digging iOS6 so I want to ugprade my iPad to iOS6 as well for harmony across devices. No dice. Why? Because I have an iPad 1, and it's no longer supported. It is literally 2 years old this Christmas, and it has just been put out as being "too old". THAT is frustrating.

[kmartphoto]

I completely agree.

I was a Windows geek for decades, but 5 years ago or so I decided to finally switch to Apple full time. (I'm a photographer, and most of my industry runs Mac's, so I was definitely a bit of the odd man out before)

At first I missed delving in to the nuts and bolts and tweaking the crap out of everything... but you know what, my life got busy, business got more complicated, and I grew to love that the Mac's just worked for me 98% of the time without having to tear them apart and reconfigure them and the software - and then support the new confliguration I'd created by myself.

My brother is still a hard core PC nerd, as is one of my best friends. But when I consider the annual amount of hours I spend doing real hard core troubleshooting on my systems - versus what they have to put in on an annual basis? - it makes me happy with my setup.

Gosh this kool-aid is tasty... :D

Same story here almost word for word.

[kmartphoto]

Take connecting my Samsung Galaxy 3 phone to the USB port.
Windows and Ubuntu both recognized and mounted it as a USB storage device. A quick trip to Samsung's web site and I had device drivers installed that allowed me to upload, download and change phone settings from my desktop.
OSX doesn't recognize it and no drivers exist. I hear that there's a way to access it via Terminal but why would I want to?
Seriously... it's 2012 and mounting a phone as a USB storage device should be a no-brainer.
I know why they do it (*cough* sell me a iPhone *cough*) but it still ticks me off.

Typically with an android phone you have to tell the phone how you want it to mount. I haven't tried a Samsung but that is how it works on HTC & Motorola.

[DVCPrepper]

I was in the same boat as Jason until 5 years ago. As a hobby, PC tweaking ad Linux tryouts were fun but having something that "just works" is nice. It's the Glock of the computer world.

I still have old Macs that run just fine, all my old PCs died of hardware failure.

[Jason F]

....My brother is still a hard core PC nerd, as is one of my best friends.....


Same story here almost word for word.

You do realize I'd already mentioned you in this thread, right? :p

[SecondsCount]

If I had it to do all over again I'd definitely stay with the iMac as the family machine but might look into a Samsung ultrabook dual booting Win7Pro 64bit/Ubuntu 12.04 instead of the MacBook Air as my laptop.

This is exactly why I run Kubuntu. People that say "I love Mac" typically aren't the type to dig deep into their computers. Perfect for them but I do some light developer work and other things that require me to dig deeper. My wife has Kubuntu installed on her computer as well. She can do all the stuff she did on her Win XP machine and it runs so much smoother and faster. As before with virus prone Windows, I am her IT guy, but a much happier one because it has been a problem free two years since I installed Kubuntu where with Windows it was every six months I was spending an entire evening trying to fix something.

I don't know what the numbers are today but a few years ago there were as many people running Linux desktops in the world as there are Mac desktop users.

My company issued laptop is running Windows 7 and while I find it to be an upgrade from XP, there are still many glitches that I find annoying. Crazy that a company can charge for software that doesn't really work that well. Unfortunately I run about 20 different pieces of native Windows software on it so I must stay with the OS.

[LittleLebowski]

Jody, I am very sure you just need to change how your phone mounts to get its storage visible to OS X. This is not an OS X thing.

[kmartphoto]

You do realize I'd already mentioned you in this thread, right? :p

ohh oops no :p

[jlw]

I switched to Mac three years ago, and I have been extremely happy with them. There is nothing PC based left in my personal inventory.

At one time, I had an issued Droid phone. As kmartphoto states, there is a setting in the phone itself that had to be changed to allow a computer to read it as a storage device regardless of it being a PC or Mac. It was something simple, but I don't remember exactly where it was in the setting options. I think it is under the options for the SD card.

[JodyH]

Typically with an android phone you have to tell the phone how you want it to mount. I haven't tried a Samsung but that is how it works on HTC & Motorola.
I root and flash Android devices for fun, I know my way around Android.
It mounts fine in Windows and Linux, OSX doesn't even recognize when it's plugged in.
Android utilizes MTP protocol, MTP isn't supported by OSX.
"Android File Transfer" allows Android and OSX to communicate but ATF doesn't run on OSX Mountain Lion (neither does Samsung KIES).
OSX Mountain Lion 10.8.2 and Android ICS 4.0.4/JB 4.1.1 do not currently communicate without going deep into Terminal or hacking Android apps.

[jlw]

I root and flash Android devices for fun, I know my way around Android.
It mounts fine in Windows and Linux, OSX doesn't even recognize when it's plugged in.
Android utilizes MTP protocol, MTP isn't supported by OSX.
"Android File Transfer" allows Android and OSX to communicate but ATF doesn't run on OSX Mountain Lion (neither does Samsung KIES).
OSX Mountain Lion 10.8.2 and Android ICS 4.0.4/JB 4.1.1 do not currently communicate without going deep into Terminal or hacking Android apps.

That's far beyond my level of technical expertise, but my Mac wasn't recognizing my Droid phone when plugged in, but once I changed a setting on the phone the Mac began to recognize it so that I could pull files off of it.

[MDS]

I've been a Unix guy for 20 years and I switched to Mac when I started a tech company in 2001. (Yes, my timing was off. :o) I needed a machine that let me run Powerpoint and Word - the real thing, so I could interact with customers and vendors - and I also needed a machine that was real Unix under the hood so I could develop my software on it. There wasn't much in the way of virtualization back then, so I gambled on a Powerbook G4. Holy crap, was I happy!!! I'd spent a significant portion of my career just getting various Unix and Linux flavors to interoperate with a Windows world, and here was a real honest-to-God Unix that interoperated really well right out of the box!

I've been a Mac fan ever since. As my life and career have evolved, I don't get to spend much time developing systems software anymore, but my Macs let me dive in whenever I feel like it, while also supporting my main job of interacting with MS Exchange and MS Office. I keep a Linux and Windows VM around for the odd visio document or whatever, but I rarely fire them up. The best part is that my wife can use the same OS that I use for everything! :D

[MDS]

I root and flash Android devices for fun, I know my way around Android.
It mounts fine in Windows and Linux, OSX doesn't even recognize when it's plugged in.
Android utilizes MTP protocol, MTP isn't supported by OSX.
"Android File Transfer" allows Android and OSX to communicate but ATF doesn't run on OSX Mountain Lion (neither does Samsung KIES).
OSX Mountain Lion 10.8.2 and Android ICS 4.0.4/JB 4.1.1 do not currently communicate without going deep into Terminal or hacking Android apps.

Android phones don't do a standard USB mass storage thing? That's crazy!

[LittleLebowski]

Jody, I had this problem once with an Android phone and a Mac. Changing USB cables fixed it.

[TCinVA]

My biggest gripe with Apple in general is that they have a way they expect you to do things which works great for the low level user who doesn't know any better. Stray outside their pre-defined track and it's a pain in the butt...as seen with the Android phone issue. It used to be that their .x updates were great, but in the last year or so their updates alter the function of a whole lot of stuff in ways that are sub optimal...especially if you are managing multiple machines.

The hardware dependability is light years beyond what it used to be...of course, it used to be in the toilet so there was nowhere to go but up. That being said, my main machine at home is an issued 1st generation MacBook pro. The display had to be replaced in warranty (literally 6 days before the warranty ran out) and the B key is a little bit flaky, but other than that I still prefer it to the newer MBP that was supposed to replace it.

To me these things are all just tools I'm stuck using so I really don't have much in terms of preferences. I can do what I need to do on practically any platform be it Mac OS 7 (Yes...still have one of those alive that I have to deal with) to ESXi. Just as with gun companies I've seen ebbs and flows in the hardware and software. Used to be that Apple hardware was neat but flaky as hell while Dell hardware was unsexy but rock-solid reliable. Now I've got an iMac acting as a server that's never given a second's trouble and a 9 thousand dollar Dell blade that drops at least two drives in the array every couple of months this despite the fact that Every. Single. Part. has been replaced. Oh, and the warranty bought with the server doesn't include the hard drives. Dell informed us of that after the first two disks died. I don't usually use the F word when I'm dealing with vendors, but I used it quite a bit during that phone call. I wouldn't spend my personal money with Dell anymore. Just too many problems.

[JodyH]

For internet, documents and presentations the Mac has been great so far.
OSX works great as long as you don't try to wander off the reservation.

For messing around and interfacing with Android devices it sucks (probably by design).
I could always use Dropbox for syncing my pictures and some files from the SD card, but I don't see any way to reliably interface with Android devices in a way that would allow me to root and flash them.
No big deal, that's what the Dell Win7/Ubuntu machine is for.

btw: those with AT&T Galaxy 3's I highly recommend the kyanROM 1.5, it doubled my battery life, sped up the system considerably and has been rock solid stable.

[ToddG]

Before I ditched my Samsung Charge, it would easily work attached to my MBP via USB. It synced to a music program I had that uploaded all my songs & album art to the phone and even let me make & edit playlists.

I haven't tried attaching my Droid4 to the Mac yet because I haven't found a reason to do so.

[LittleLebowski]

I'll eat some crow here. I haven't had to attach a Droid to my Mac since I got rid of my Thunderbolt for a Galaxy Nexus. MTP does not seem to work. It is not an Apple thing supposedly but rather an Android 4.0 and up problem.

The work around most suggest (I don't need the sync myself) is the free app Air Droid (https://play.google.com/store/apps/details?id=com.sand.airdroid&hl=en).

[LittleLebowski]

Also, I'm very curious as to what system settings you guys are having problems configuring with Macs.

Jody, it would probably be easier to keep an Ubuntu VM on Virtualbox running on your Mac than a separate computer.

[Tamara]

Android phones don't do a standard USB mass storage thing? That's crazy!

My el cheapo LG Optimus V running Froyo sure does. Haven't tried plugging it into a Mac yet.

ETA: Just booted up my newest Mac, an eMac 1.25 running Tiger, and it does not recognize the phone as a storage device.

[JV_]

Are you all using this: http://www.android.com/filetransfer/ ?

For some background:
http://www.androidcentral.com/ics-feature-mtp-what-it-why-use-it-and-how-set-it

[Tamara]

Are you all using this: http://www.android.com/filetransfer/ ?

No, because there's no need for me to connect my phone to my eMac, which is, at the end of the day, really nothing more than an extremely bulky iPod dock and iTunes server... ;)

[Jason F]

...Just booted up my newest Mac, an eMac 1.25 running Tiger, and it does not recognize the phone as a storage device.

I almost spit coffee all over my 17" macbook pro- thanks Tamara! :D

Still running strong? Wow, that's pretty awesome.... though I'm not sure you could get a lot done other serving up some iTunes or light file serving. What does that thing have, 2GB of RAM and maybe a 120GB hd?

[Tamara]

I almost spit coffee all over my 17" macbook pro- thanks Tamara! :D

Still running strong? Wow, that's pretty awesome.... though I'm not sure you could get a lot done other serving up some iTunes or light file serving. What does that thing have, 2GB of RAM and maybe a 120GB hd?

It's a G4/1.25 with half a gig of RAM and a 40 gig internal drive. (All the music is on the external 120GB Far Wahr drive.) It's a racehorse compared to the G3/466 iBook I used as my on-the-road machine since '01 before retiring it in favor of a new HP laptop earlier this year. They fit in with my old Mac collection now, despite being PowerPC machines... :D

...and this post is being typed on a nine-year-old P4 XP box. I tend to fully amortize my hardware. ;)

[C45P312]

Awesome feedback. I was looking to do the same when we were in the market for a house. I have a Mac Pro tower that I utilize for photos and videos and it really got cumbersome to switch between the two so i figured i would make the switch over. With the new iPhones I'm able to do all my updates over wifi so I don't have a need to plug it into the computer anymore.

[LittleLebowski]

OCD and OSX are not a good combination.
If something doesn't work, I want to know why and I want to fix it.
With Win7 and Ubuntu there's a mid-level of preferences and settings that usually accomplished what I wanted.
With OSX there's only 1st grade ("Oooh I changed backgrounds! I'm a power user!") and PhD ("Terminal: sudo ~ insertgeek bootinass -getsum").

Take connecting my Samsung Galaxy 3 phone to the USB port.
Windows and Ubuntu both recognized and mounted it as a USB storage device. A quick trip to Samsung's web site and I had device drivers installed that allowed me to upload, download and change phone settings from my desktop.
OSX doesn't recognize it and no drivers exist. I hear that there's a way to access it via Terminal but why would I want to?
Seriously... it's 2012 and mounting a phone as a USB storage device should be a no-brainer.
I know why they do it (*cough* sell me a iPhone *cough*) but it still ticks me off.

The Mac works great as a internet surfing word processor but to indulge my inner geek (root and ROM flash a phone for example) I still have to keep a Win/Linux machine around.

I think the best OS for me will be the next generation or two of Linux Ubuntu. More streamlined and secure than Windows, more open and tweakable than OSX.
:cool:

I am very curious as to what you need to tweak on OSX that you cannot.

Regarding not being able to find a things, are you not using Spotlight? It's very easy to use and has command completion.

Any true geek would start using automator (http://support.apple.com/kb/HT2488), the built bash shell, X11, etc. No offense but you sound like a guy that just doesn't like the GUI.

As mentioned earlier, the Android 4.0 and up, problem with OS X is an Android problem. Use AirDroid.

Sorry for the late reply but I just reread this.

Regarding your NAS, how are you sharing it out? Can you not see it from your Mac?

[jumpthestack]

With OSX there's only 1st grade ("Oooh I changed backgrounds! I'm a power user!") and PhD ("Terminal: sudo ~ insertgeek bootinass -getsum").


I think using the Terminal is much easier than you think. Usually you can just Google OS X + whatever you need to do and someone will have already written out the commands you need to run. If you want to tweak things using a point and click interface, that's definitely not how Apple does things, since it has to be suitable for Grandma. But if you know how, you can tweak OS X at a finer level than you can on Windows. It's just a different way of doing things.

[LittleLebowski]

I think using the Terminal is much easier than you think. Usually you can just Google OS X + whatever you need to do and someone will have already written out the commands you need to run. If you want to tweak things using a point and click interface, that's definitely not how Apple does things, since it has to be suitable for Grandma. But if you know how, you can tweak OS X at a finer level than you can on Windows. It's just a different way of doing things.

Not to mention that of course, you can run most if not all "Linux" (Open Source, commonly associated with Linux) apps on OS X. Usually when I hear complaints about OS X; it's because people expect it to act like Windows.

[ToddG]

Usually when I hear complaints about OS X; it's because people expect it to act like Windows.

Some people want their computers to crash and get viruses?

[JodyH]

Some people want their computers to crash and get viruses?

Weird, my Windows machines must have been defective.
Very few crashes and no malware on mine since Windows 3.1, and I've browsed the seedy side of the net for years. My wife has managed to junk up a XP machine with Facebook games, but that's not Windows fault.

OSX on the other hand... the first accessory I attach (Apple Superdrive CD/DVD) kills the Apple DVD Player. Force closes as soon as any DVD is inserted.
Apple service admits it's a issue and to wait on a update to fix it.
Good thing VLC Player works.

I have $1700 invested in a brand new laptop that won't even play DVDs with the Apple branded external drive without downloading a third party program because the native program force closes.
That sounds an awful lot like the kinds of issues Mac users make fun of Windows users for having...

Just saying.

Sent from my SGH-I747M using Tapatalk 2

[DocGKR]

All we use are Mac's--primarily MacBook Pro, MacBook Air, and iMac.

We still have several old G3 iMac's running as pt data base servers; heck we even have several ancient (circa 1995) Power PC 7600 and 8500's that are still running...

[orionz06]

It's a G4/1.25 with half a gig of RAM and a 40 gig internal drive. (All the music is on the external 120GB Far Wahr drive.) It's a racehorse compared to the G3/466 iBook I used as my on-the-road machine since '01 before retiring it in favor of a new HP laptop earlier this year. They fit in with my old Mac collection now, despite being PowerPC machines... :D

...and this post is being typed on a nine-year-old P4 XP box. I tend to fully amortize my hardware. ;)

How can you fit all of your music on a 120GB HD?

[ToddG]

Jody -- That DVD player SNAFU is unacceptable and I'd be ticked off if it affected me. Sadly, Apple does seem to be falling to many of the same issues for which we used to make fun of MS/Win, as you said. I still have far more faith in Apple than MS, but Apple is no longer the unsullied brand it once was.

Nonetheless, my MBP continues to run without a hiccup. My wife's has occasional problems... every single one of which is directly related to running either Entourage/Outlook or PowerPoint. I use iWork'09 and have none of her issues.

[LittleLebowski]

Nonetheless, my MBP continues to run without a hiccup. My wife's has occasional problems... every single one of which is directly related to running either Entourage/Outlook or PowerPoint. I use iWork'09 and have none of her issues.

Microsoft apps on OS X seem to only get worse. I love it when Microsoft Update requires you to close browser windows in order to update Office apps.

[Jason F]

Microsoft apps on OS X seem to only get worse. I love it when Microsoft Update requires you to close browser windows in order to update Office apps.

COMPLETE PITA. I hate that.

There's a reason I do an MS Office update about, oh, twice a year. At most. :mad:

[JodyH]

Stand down Applebots... I'm not hatin.
I'm overall happy with my Macs, just some irritating quirks with non-Apple (and Apple) accessories and I need some time to learn my way around the new OS.
The hardware rocks, everything feels well engineered.
Magic trackpad gestures are the best thing for computers since internet porn.
I'm not convinced OSX is anything special, seems like dumbed down, locked down Linux to me but I'm still a newb.
Whether I like it or not I'm a Apple guy for at least a year or two until I can justify another $1500 laptop to the wife so I might as well get used to it.
Maybe the Kool-Aid tastes better after the iLobotomy?
:cool:

[jumpthestack]

Microsoft apps on OS X seem to only get worse. I love it when Microsoft Update requires you to close browser windows in order to update Office apps.

It's because they install some crappy browser plugins without asking you, and that you probably never use, but nevertheless causes irritation every update and probably exposes you to security vulnerabilities.

/Library/Internet Plug-ins/SharePointBrowserPlugin.plugin
/Library/Internet Plug-ins/SharePointWebKitPlugin.webplugin

I deleted them on my system with no problems, and I didn't get asked to close my browsers the next time I did an update.

You can try this:
sudo mv "/Library/Internet Plug-ins/SharePointBrowserPlugin.plugin" ~/
sudo mv "/Library/Internet Plug-ins/SharePointWebKitPlugin.webplugin" ~/

That just moves them to your home directory. If this seems to be working out, you can just delete them from your home directory. If it causes problems, you can move them back.

[MDS]

I'm not convinced OSX is anything special, seems like dumbed down, locked down Linux to me but I'm still a newb.

I've been tinkering with operating systems and writing systems software for longer than most folks on this board have been shooting. (Sold my first device driver in 1983. :cool:) I tend to think of OS's and computers the way many of you think of guns. They all kind of suck, just in different ways. For fun, pick whatever you want and enjoy. For serious social purposes, you pick one of the top three and you get to know it inside and out and you use the snot out of it until its shortcomings don't affect you...much.

OSX is by far the most elegant commercially successful operating system on the planet. It's more elegant than Linux, though not necessarily more powerful. It's like switching from Glock to P30LEM - any whining you do during the first 5,000 live rounds and 50,000 dry trigger pulls is noise... (Not to beat you up on this, JodyH... :p)

For a fun read comparing various OS's see Neal Stephenson's classic 1999 essay In the Beginning... was the Command Line (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/In_the_Beginning..._was_the_Command_Line), updated in 2004 by Garrett Birkel. Maybe it's time to update it again...

[jslaker]

I'm not convinced OSX is anything special, seems like dumbed down, locked down Linux to me but I'm still a newb.

You're not incorrect.

My experience has also been that UNIX utilities are better documented on Linux than OS X.

[JodyH]

Solved the DVD Player crash issue.
The default setting for playing DVD's is "Play from last position".
Changing this to "Play from beginning" allows the DVD player to work.
It seems that the first thing the DVD Player needs when you insert your first DVD is what "Region" you are in and the program crashes because it's trying to compare the DVD's region with the non-existent region setting you haven't been able to enter yet.
Basically the default player setting interferes with the initial player setup.
Ummm... beta testers needed?

[Jason F]

Jody-

Glad you got it figured out - weird issue considering it still hasn't been resolved from Apple. But at least you're back on track.

[NETim]

My life has been infinitely better since I went with OS/X. Macs just work. I ask very little of my home computers but it seemed the MS OS's weren't quite up to the task of even my light workload.

I don't miss Microsoft products at all.

[LittleLebowski]

Those of you talking abut Linux being better than apple from a UI standpoint should try Gnome 3. Bloody awful.

[JodyH]

Those of you talking abut Linux being better than apple from a UI standpoint should try Gnome 3. Bloody awful.
Ubuntu is probably the most polished Linux GUI out there.
Has a "dummy proof" front end, some mid-level tweak tools but the "dangerous" stuff requires you to go look for it.
Grandma can surf the net and get email with about 5 minutes of instruction, yet my 9 year old can't format the hard drive with 3 clicks.

[LittleLebowski]

Ubuntu has Gnome 3 and it's awful compared to Gnome 2. I can't stand it. I've been running Linux on the desktop since Redhat 6 (not to be confused with RHEL). My current favorite is SuSe.

[jslaker]

Ubuntu has Gnome 3 and it's awful compared to Gnome 2. I can't stand it. I've been running Linux on the desktop since Redhat 6 (not to be confused with RHEL). My current favorite is SuSe.

Ubuntu has Unity which is its own DE. Gnome 3 is different; it's currently the default DE on Fedora.

Personally, I vastly prefer Unity over Mountain Lion.

[JodyH]

Mountain Lion seems to be Apple's Vista.
Lucky me I arrived on the Mac scene just in time.

[LittleLebowski]

Ubuntu has Unity which is its own DE. Gnome 3 is different; it's currently the default DE on Fedora.

Personally, I vastly prefer Unity over Mountain Lion.

Right. I forgot about Unity. Can't stand that either.

[Shellback]

I'm contemplating jumping on the Mac wagon as well. I need a new laptop and the wife and I both have iPhones, an iPad and I'm tired of the Windows OS and don't like the looks of Windows 8.

To the uninitiated what are the biggest differences between the Air and Pro? What are the differences I need to be aware of and what's marketing and fluff? Is the Pro worth the extra bucks for the long term?

[TGS]

This thread really reminds me how technologically unconnected I am. I had no idea there were so many pet operating systems out there. I still use my 2009 vintage Blackberry Tour as well, and are not really linked/synched/whatever with other machines. I just bought it so I could have decompression planning software for diving when I'm away from my laptop.

[LittleLebowski]

I'm contemplating jumping on the Mac wagon as well. I need a new laptop and the wife and I both have iPhones, an iPad and I'm tired of the Windows OS and don't like the looks of Windows 8.

To the uninitiated what are the biggest differences between the Air and Pro? What are the differences I need to be aware of and what's marketing and fluff? Is the Pro worth the extra bucks for the long term?

The 13" Retina 8GB/256g hd is the best deal going right now. http://appleinsider.com/mac_price_guide/##

Keep in mind that the Pros are nearly as light as the Airs. http://www.briangardner.com/macbook-pro-retina-display/

[Dan_S]

The 13" Retina 8GB/256g hd is the best deal going right now. http://appleinsider.com/mac_price_guide/##

Keep in mind that the Pros are nearly as light as the Airs. http://www.briangardner.com/macbook-pro-retina-display/


I gotta admit that I'm still pretty impressed with the 11" Air that you talked me into a few months ago.... :D
I thought I was going to really hate the 11" screen, but I've found that I almost don't want anything bigger (well, a 13" with a Retina display would be nice...)

Regarding another comment that was made...
I'm running Mountain Lion OS on this MacBook Air, and honestly, I'm not sure how it compares to Vista in any way. I switched to this laptop from a Vista machine, and there is no comparison, in my opinion. Of course, I don't know squat about computers, so I might just be blowing smoke, but I'm very satisfied with the performance of the Mountain Lion OS.

[JodyH]

My MBA 13" has worked out great for my purposes.
Internet surfing
Keynote presentations
LibreOffice for the occasional spreadsheet or document
iTunes/DoubleTwist for my workout tunes sync to Android.
Still wish there was an easy way to USB sync files from my Galaxy S3 droid to the Mac.
:cool:

[Shellback]

The 13" Retina 8GB/256g hd is the best deal going right now. http://appleinsider.com/mac_price_guide/##

Keep in mind that the Pros are nearly as light as the Airs. http://www.briangardner.com/macbook-pro-retina-display/

Good stuff. Thanks!

Really trying to determine if I need the 15" or if the 13" will suffice. Might be time to wing by the Apple store today and play with them.

Thanks for your input too Jody.

ETA - When will Apple bring out the new machines? Worth waiting for or just punch the button now?

[JodyH]

My 8GB 256 SSD, 13" Air is connected to a 27" monitor at the house so I don't miss the extra screen my previous 15" had.
The 13" is also a great size when traveling.
I just buy what I want when I want it. You'll drive yourself crazy if you're always chasing the latest release.

I am waiting on the 2nd generation Microsoft Surface Pro to come out.
It should be exactly what I want/need in a Win8 work machine.

[Shellback]

I just buy what I want when I want it. You'll drive yourself crazy if you're always chasing the latest release.

Totally get that reasoning but I figured if I was a month or 2 out from their typical release date I'd wait just a little bit longer. Off to the fruit store now.

[LittleLebowski]

Still wish there was an easy way to USB sync files from my Galaxy S3 droid to the Mac.
:cool:

Have you not tried the below?

http://www.android.com/filetransfer

[JodyH]

Have you not tried the below?

http://www.android.com/filetransfer
Thanks, downloaded it and will try it out.

[Shellback]

Went and checked out the Macs... The 13" seems like the best option due to portability for classes, traveling and such. The retina screen is really nice and I think I'll be snatching one up in the near future.

The 15" would be a great option if you didn't have to lug it around much but seemed a bit on the large side for anybody who wants portability.

[Shellback]

What browser are you using with your Mac? I switched from IE to Chrome, on a PC, quite a while ago and it's light years faster and more responsive.

My only experience with Safari is on the wife's iPad so it's fairly limited. Is Safari good to go for Macs or do you use Chrome, Firefox or something else? What do you recommend?

[LittleLebowski]

I like Chrome because if a tab is hung, you can kill that individual tab, not just wipe out the whole browser and restart

[NickA]

iTunes/DoubleTwist for my workout tunes sync to Android.

Jody (or anyone else) - I assume it's fairly simple to use DoubleTwist for moving iTunes music to Android?
I've got tons of music on my (Windows) laptop that I want to move to my S3.
Second part of the question : a lot of those files are DRM protected. I know you can create an MP3 version song by song in iTunes, is there an easier way to do it?

[Shellback]

I like Chrome because if a tab is hung, you can kill that individual tab, not just wipe out the whole browser and restart

Cool, I'll try that as soon as it lands. Expecting the 13" Pro Retina w/3.0GHZ processor. You could land aircraft on the CVN-15" MacPro.

[JV_]

I hate the way Chrome handles user profiles, their file locations, and your inability to easily control them. Firefox got it right.

[PPGMD]

Jason -- Good explanation and I'd echo the same. After years of customizing and tweaking various flavors of Windows (and OS/2 for those of you who remember such things) now I just run the Mac.

The only problem is that Apple has been dumbing things down from version to version.

The allure of OS X was that it jusf worked, but you could still tweak it if you need to. But over the years features that were menu items fo to console commnads, and then finally disappear.

Take all the network troubleshooting options on the Airport routers. Now it is virtually impossible to troubleshoot. They either work or they don't. The user has to spend hours grasping at straws.

[Bigguy]

The only problem is that Apple has been dumbing things down from version to version.

The allure of OS X was that it jusf worked, but you could still tweak it if you need to. But over the years features that were menu items fo to console commnads, and then finally disappear.

Take all the network troubleshooting options on the Airport routers. Now it is virtually impossible to troubleshoot. They either work or they don't. The user has to spend hours grasping at straws.
+1 And I like Macs. Had a similar issue with external display. Driving my HD TV through the HDMI2 port failed. Apple FAQ basically shrugged their shoulders and said some times it works and some times it doesn't and we don't know why. Wound up using the oler HDMI1 adapter and routing sound through the headphone jack.

[Shellback]

After 2 days with the Pro I'm sold. There's still a bit of a learning curve ahead but I'm officially converted.

ETA - The trackpad gestures are really slick.

[JodyH]

Just like every other OS there's some irritating quirks but I've been fairly satisfied with OSX.
Keynote is very nice if you do many presentations, blows away Powerpoint.
The trackpad rocks but the mouse sucks.
I'm still a fan of Linux (Ubuntu) for a internet surfing machine, but OSX seems to be a good personal/light work laptop (as long as the software you use it supported).
I still think Win7/Win8 is better for heavy lifting at work.
:cool:

[ToddG]

Keynote is very nice if you do many presentations, blows away Powerpoint.

The major problem with Keynote is that if you don't have a Mac to run it, you are in trouble. My brother spent two weeks developing a complicated Keynote presentation only to show up to the venue and find they had no way to connect his computer to the presentation system.

Having said that, I use it, Pages, and Numbers almost exclusively. Pages & Numbers are nowhere near as feature rich as MS Word & Excel, but on the Mac I've found the one thing that will cause a system-wide crash is running MS software.

[Shellback]

Having said that, I use it, Pages, and Numbers almost exclusively. Pages & Numbers are nowhere near as feature rich as MS Word & Excel, but on the Mac I've found the one thing that will cause a system-wide crash is running MS software.

Did you find that using programs like this (http://store.apple.com/us/product/HB603/microsoft-office-for-mac-home-and-student-2011)? Or are you talking about running traditional Windows programs parallel to the Mac OS? I was contemplating purchasing it to use for some stuff that I have based in Windows still.

[Dan_S]

After 2 days with the Pro I'm sold. There's still a bit of a learning curve ahead but I'm officially converted.

ETA - The trackpad gestures are really slick.

You noticed that, did you? ;)

I must admit, the more I use this Apple, the more impressed I am with it.

Still haven't done much with the photo editing, but I think that is going to change soon here. Really looking forward to it...

[ToddG]

Did you find that using programs like this (http://store.apple.com/us/product/HB603/microsoft-office-for-mac-home-and-student-2011)? Or are you talking about running traditional Windows programs parallel to the Mac OS? I was contemplating purchasing it to use for some stuff that I have based in Windows still.

I haven't run Parallels or anything like it in years. The native MS apps I've got are the 2008 versions. My wife uses the 2011 since she is regularly needing to share files with people all around the country and her MBP crashes literally a hundred times more often than mine.

[Shellback]

My wife uses the 2011 since she is regularly needing to share files with people all around the country and her MBP crashes literally a hundred times more often than mine.

Good to know. Sounds similar to the reviews on Apple's site.

[JodyH]

The major problem with Keynote is that if you don't have a Mac to run it, you are in trouble. My brother spent two weeks developing a complicated Keynote presentation only to show up to the venue and find they had no way to connect his computer to the presentation system.
Yet another Mac quirk you have to plan around, Mac compatible peripherals are fewer and farther between.
I carry my own projector and screen (if possible) just to be safe.

I use Libre Office for spreadsheets and documents, more stable than MS products on the Mac and as long as you're not going crazy with macros and such the files are pretty universal.

[Bigguy]

Yet another Mac quirk you have to plan around, Mac compatible peripherals are fewer and farther between.
I carry my own projector and screen (if possible) just to be safe.

I use Libre Office for spreadsheets and documents, more stable than MS products on the Mac and as long as you're not going crazy with macros and such the files are pretty universal.

I'm a big fan of NeoOffice (http://www.neooffice.org/neojava/en/index.php) Extremely stable, will open most office suite type of files including docx and Word Perfect files. As with Libre Office, complex macro's don't port over very well.

I don't use many peripherals, but I would have expected this be less and less and issue as most interfaces are going USB. Is the problem drivers?

[cvann]

MBP plus VMware Fusion is the best way to go if you have to live in both worlds. I run a Win7 image in Unity mode, cuts out the OSX lockups with Office 2011.

Sent from my SCH-I535 using Tapatalk 2

[Shellback]

As a follow up I've been using the Microsoft Office 2011 on the new Mac and really like it. I know Todd mentioned having some issues with crashing but so far mine's been 100% and I'm fairly impressed with it.