"We the People" Holsters: Yea / Nay?

[2xAGM114]

Specific model sought is for HK LEM pistols (P2000, sk, P30, sk) IWB with the claw added for appendix carry. I already own a JMCK (seems wider) and MasterMind Tactics Lumen, both are showing their age.

WTP seems to be a newer player, curious to hear personal experiences.

Thanks.

[JCN]

Specific model sought is for HK LEM pistols (P2000, sk, P30, sk) IWB with the claw added for appendix carry. I already own a JMCK (seems wider) and MasterMind Tactics Lumen, both are showing their age.

WTP seems to be a newer player, curious to hear personal experiences.

Thanks.

They are inexpensive and simple. I have not had any issue with ones I have purchased from them.

I personally am not much of a holster snob as I tend to make small modifications to any holster I buy anyway.

[PNWTO]

They don’t seem to offer DCC clips, or even sell them, so that’s an immediate “no”.

Although in the past few years if it isn’t from DSG, PHLster, JMCK, or Tenicor, then I don’t really pay attention to the “new thing”.

[BK14]

Specific model sought is for HK LEM pistols (P2000, sk, P30, sk) IWB with the claw added for appendix carry. I already own a JMCK (seems wider) and MasterMind Tactics Lumen, both are showing their age.

WTP seems to be a newer player, curious to hear personal experiences.

Thanks.

Their marketing reminds of the low-tier, yet expensive holsters that pop-up regularly on Facebook. The ones I’ve seen were nothing to write home about. They use the POS clips that plague most holsters of that genre, have excess material, and there’s nothing innovative about them.

Personal opinion, with having never owned one, is I’d look elsewhere. I may be dead wrong, but I don’t plan on spending money to find out.

[BK14]

Double tap.

[Totem Polar]

They are inexpensive and simple. I have not had any issue with ones I have purchased from them.


I don’t have one myself, but they seem to be quite en vogue with the crew at my weekly fun shoot. So far, the multiple units I’ve seen tucked into pants work as advertised. FWIW.

[the_tacticallopath]

They're not really new, I've been seeing their ads for years. Meme-tier, sub-par designs with cheap hardware. There are so many better options out there. I'm not aware of any serious industry people affiliated with them or who run their gear.

[JCN]

I don’t have one myself, but they seem to be quite en vogue with the crew at my weekly fun shoot. So far, the multiple units I’ve seen tucked into pants work as advertised. FWIW.

I have to admit I don’t really understand what makes one kydex holster much better than another.

Replacing hardware is pretty cheap and it’s one Philips head and Chicago screw away from swapping it.

WTP makes really inexpensive stuff so for goofing around with guns I play with rather than carry, they’re fine for me.

I have a pile of hardware that I mix and match anyway.

I like to customize cant and angle, but I have a heat gun and drill. Even expensive $140 holsters, I usually still tweak.

So I don’t get it personally.

Kydex thickness is a thing. But barring that, design doesn’t really seem to matter much else.

Literally I have over 100 holsters from the cheapest of the cheap to the most spendy and I still don’t really get it.

[ViniVidivici]

JCN nailed it. They're ordinary, not special.

Have one, IWB, got it as a cheap slap-on for a nightstand pistol w/ wml. Gets carried around the house some too, sometimes.

I did some modifying to it with heat and knife...rounded sharp corners, trimmed for better grip acquisition, etc. It's adequate, but wholly unimpressive, and I wouldn't use it for dedicated carry out and about.

They don't offer anything that great that I'd consider for serious daily carry. Their "claw" looks flimsy as hell.

My opinion, based on what I have on hand, is that other makers like JMCK and even Blade Tech are better designed and higher quality. As an example, JMCK's rounding of bottom and side corners, so conducive to comfort, whereas WTP is sharp, stark "we ended the plastic right here" corners and ends. Fixable with a heat gun, IF there's enough material there to begin with.

So I'd say mediocre. For IWB, or as a slap-on trigger guard, decent, but for comfortable AIWB, or solid OWB, I'd look elsewhere.

[LittleLebowski]

Nay. They've reached out about becoming a paid sponsor and I won't use their stuff, so I've said no a few times. Tenicor, Dark Star Gear, JM Custom, and Mastermind are all sponsors here and I have bought quality holsters from all of them.

[03RN]

Nay. They've reached out about becoming a paid sponsor and I won't use their stuff, so I've said no a few times. Tenicor, Dark Star Gear, JM Custom, and Mastermind are all sponsors here and I have bought quality holsters from all of them.

Kydex is kydex but how the gun is retained, the mold, the edges, etc all make a difference and I can tell the difference in cheap kydex vs the better ones.

Just like leather.

[Ivantheterrible]

My experience is great gun-to-holster fit even for my Beretta APXs. The retention devices (belt clip or paddle), on the other hand, are subpar flimsy plastic.

[mtnbkr]

Kydex is kydex but how the gun is retained, the mold, the edges, etc all make a difference and I can tell the difference in cheap kydex vs the better ones.

Just like leather.

Which doesn't necessarily mean a Tier 1 holster will be better or more comfortable every time. After good success with my j-frame Apollo, I bought the same for my LCR without pause. I couldn't use it. It was horrifically uncomfortable for me (being AIWB means fit is a very personal and subjective thing). I sold it off and bought a generic kydex AIWB holster for my LCR that is far more comfortable. It did need a clip upgrade and a junk pillow, but even with that it was half the price of the Apollo.

I'm with JCN on this, I end up modifying most holsters I buy and my success rate with "good" holsters hasn't been consistent.

Chris

[JCN]

Kydex is kydex but how the gun is retained, the mold, the edges, etc all make a difference and I can tell the difference in cheap kydex vs the better ones.

Just like leather.

The Kydex itself, sure.

But all the rest of the stuff is modifiable by me (because I like to tinker). I can round edges, cut parts off that poke me, add retention by heating and dimpling, loosen it by smoothing etc.


Which doesn't necessarily mean a Tier 1 holster will be better or more comfortable every time. After good success with my j-frame Apollo, I bought the same for my LCR without pause. I couldn't use it. It was horrifically uncomfortable for me (being AIWB means fit is a very personal and subjective thing). I sold it off and bought a generic kydex AIWB holster for my LCR that is far more comfortable. It did need a clip upgrade and a junk pillow, but even with that it was half the price of the Apollo.

I'm with JCN on this, I end up modifying most holsters I buy and my success rate with "good" holsters hasn't been consistent.

Chris

Bingo. I'm with you. I like tinkering and I often make significant modifications to even "top tier" products. Cuts in the hood for certain optics, adjusting sweat guard and knuckle relief for draws, removing and smoothing corners, etc.

These days I've just been buying Glock holsters and heating then pressing them to fit various other guns.

I altered a Glock 21 holster to fit an Alien...

[Elwin]

I will modify JMCK, Dark Star, and PHLster holsters, but while I haven’t had a WTP I’ve had examples from the same tier and there is a difference. My best description is that they’re 90% there but that last and crucial 10% of thought and effort isn’t there. A major issue for me is the holes for attachments being just not quite where they should be, leading to ride height being imperfect, claws being too far outboard, etc. With AIWB especially the tiny differences matter. A JMCK is just quite clearly made by someone who uses the products daily and spends time designing and perfecting them. Things like WTP, it seems they don’t think much beyond just getting the hardware attached and calling it good enough.

The tier 2 stuff is fine if it’s all that’s available for a given gun, but between JM, Dark Star, PHLster, Tenicor, Keepers, and others in tier 1 I’m likely forgetting, if I have a gun they don’t support that’s probably my problem. And I’ve been there and done that - it was my problem.

[ViniVidivici]

Now that I'm thinking about it, I did notice something with mine: it has a striking similarity to a holster body I bought from https://holsterbuilder.com/ a while back for a holster project I did.

They may be, in some instances, buying premade shells and tossing the hardware and clips on and selling. Seems alot of lower tier manufacturers do this.

[Rex G]

The w.t.p. ads on you-tube are excessively annoying, and the belt-specific ad(s) appear to be aimed at buyers who simply do not know much. So, w.t.p. gets a “nay,” from me.

Of course, I started using old-school Blade-Tech, a number of years ago, so started with top-tier Kydex. Every time I tried a Kydex holder from a second-rate maker, well, disappointment happened.

[jh9]

The w.t.p. ads on you-tube are excessively annoying, and the belt-specific ad(s) appear to be aimed at buyers who simply do not know much. So, w.t.p. gets a “nay,” from me.

Of course, I started using old-school Blade-Tech, a number of years ago, so started with top-tier Kydex. Every time I tried a Kydex holder from a second-rate maker, well, disappointment happened.

Yeah, it's cringe-tier marketing.

I'm not so sure that "kydex is kydex". Haven't most places actually been using Bolatron or something like that since the early 00s? It would not surprise me to see some grades of material crack or deform more over time. I have some Ready Tactical holsters from the mid 00s that still appear to be fine despite several years of daily wear. Depending on the attachment style I've seen some kydex holsters crack once you get a few years of daily wear on them. Usage patterns play a part but over the long term I have feels if not data to indicate material does as well.

Just mind-balling it how consistently the manufacturer controls heat could be the difference between a holster that lasts for several years and one that starts to crack after only a few.

[JCN]

I'm not so sure that "kydex is kydex". Haven't most places actually been using Bolatron or something like that since the early 00s? It would not surprise me to see some grades of material crack or deform more over time. I have some Ready Tactical holsters from the mid 00s that still appear to be fine despite several years of daily wear. Depending on the attachment style I've seen some kydex holsters crack once you get a few years of daily wear on them. Usage patterns play a part but over the long term I have feels if not data to indicate material does as well.

Just mind-balling it how consistently the manufacturer controls heat could be the difference between a holster that lasts for several years and one that starts to crack after only a few.

I think that begs the question of whether a holster is a durable good or a consumable.

Remember those Gen 1 and Gen 2 Glocks that are now shiny and slipperier than shit now?

For something like a holster there might be favorable short term characteristics that reduce long term characteristics superficially. Think about car tire shelf life. Short term flexibility comes at a long term durability trade off.

So you have to define what’s your primary metric for success.

The only kydex holster I have ever had fail was an expensive Red Hill Tactical.

Because I was training in sub-zero weather.

[jh9]

I think that begs the question of whether a holster is a durable good or a consumable.

...

For something like a holster there might be favorable short term characteristics that reduce long term characteristics superficially. Think about car tire shelf life. Short term flexibility comes at a long term durability trade off.

So you have to define what’s your primary metric for success.

Yes, that is definitely true. But I don't think a holster should be disposable by default. I think quality holsters have been seen as a durable good for a very long time now and that shouldn't change. There are cases where that's appropriate (if not inevitable). But those are pretty niche. A regular Joe Civilian holster used for regular daily activities should still be serviceable in 20 years. That should be the default, and if that's not true (unless it was explicitly designed to compromise lifespan for some other niche property) that holster should be considered either low quality or defective.

Without getting into the difference between kydex and leather... We could start a thread in the gallery titled "show me your old holsters" and a lot of people could post pics of stuff they have that survived years if not a decade or more of daily use and is still usable today. That's not a big ask, even for holsters that get regular use.

[JCN]

Without getting into the difference between kydex and leather... We could start a thread in the gallery titled "show me your old holsters" and a lot of people could post pics of stuff they have that survived years if not a decade or more of daily use and is still usable today. That's not a big ask, even for holsters that get regular use.

It’s funny but I was just thinking of leather holsters as consumables like boots.

There was a semi-famous Glock leg in a worn leather holster where the leather had gotten so soft and floppy that it knuckled in and grabbed the trigger when he sat down in his car chair.

[jh9]

It’s funny but I was just thinking of leather holsters as consumables like boots.

There was a semi-famous Glock leg in a worn leather holster where the leather had gotten so soft and floppy that it knuckled in and grabbed the trigger when he sat down in his car chair.

Yikes. Neatsfoot oil on the holster, I wonder? I've got a 90s vintage Bianchi 7L that got about a decade of wear before I went to kydex that's still right as rain.

[Crazy Dane]

I think that begs the question of whether a holster is a durable good or a consumable.




Thay are both. When custom producers have lead times that measure out in months*, we need decent, not to expensive off the shelf holsters to fill the gap, these become the consumables.

* The odd bird in this mix is JMCK with their quick ship option.

[JTQ]

There was a semi-famous Glock leg in a worn leather holster where the leather had gotten so soft and floppy that it knuckled in and grabbed the trigger when he sat down in his car chair.


Yikes. Neatsfoot oil on the holster, I wonder? I've got a 90s vintage Bianchi 7L that got about a decade of wear before I went to kydex that's still right as rain.
You don't have to use much neats foot oil, or any, if the holster comes from the maker soft enough.

https://www.itstactical.com/warcom/firearms/safety-warning-worn-leather-holsters-can-cause-accidental-discharges/

[zaitcev]

Did anyone have any issues with the retention dimples being too large and contact the flat trigger on P365XL?

[MTP]

Did anyone have any issues with the retention dimples being too large and contact the flat trigger on P365XL?

Yes, I saw that happen 2 weeks ago or so. Scary.

[Clusterfrack]

Newly stickied thread on the topic of holsters and triggers:
https://pistol-forum.com/showthread.php?56638-Holster-safety-issue-this-is-why-you-check-fit

[DaBigBR]

Meh. They do a lot of social media marketing but I agree with them general consensus here unless one of the really high quality outfits doesn't have the fit you are looking for.

I tend to look at:
Tier 1 Concealed
LAS Concealment
QVO Tactical
JM Custom Kydex
ANR Design
Redhill Tactical

Probably a couple others I've forgotten. I suspect if you made a thread that was "name your top five kydex makers", you'd have ten names account for 75% or more of the responses.