Building a Better Stoeger with Stoeger’s Own Parts

[167]

With the apparent success of the Stoeger M3000, as documented by a user here (https://pistol-forum.com/showthread.php?48711-Taking-a-chance-on-a-Stoeger-M3000-Freedom-Series-Defense-Shotgun-opinions) and others that I have spoken to off p-f, I wondered if Stoeger’s equivalent pump gun, the P3000 could pull off the same success, or maybe close. Stoeger’s Freedom Series shotguns are well kitted for their task. Increased capacity and decent sights already being taken care of by the manufacturer. If the guns run, and turns out to be durable, I think they stand a chance. There is really robust parts support for the 3000 series guns. Only thing that is really missing is a decent forend to allow lights to be mounted.

The Freedom Series Supreme (FSS) version of the P3000 also comes with an adjustable, side folding stock. All the dudes here at p-f are probably smart enough to know that is just a stupid idea, but I guess whoever is in charge of this stuff at Stoeger missed the memo. On paper, maybe it sounds cool, but the execution is really poor. The stock’s adjustment range is 14” to about 17”. I am a big dude, but even I don’t need a 17” LOP. The folding mechanism is also really bulky and odd too. It gets in the way of how the hand should interface with the grip. It is really an abomination of a stock, not even designed for the P3000. It is an ATI stock that I am pretty certain is intended for a Ruger 10/22, mated to the P3000 through what looks like a 3D printed stock adapter.

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https://youtu.be/dHDIXlC0x38

Other than the stock, the P3000 FSS isn’t a horrible gun. Fixing the stock would take it quite a ways down the road. Stoeger makes a compact stock for the M3000. It cost about $60 and has a 13” LOP. Stoeger also makes an extended safety button for the M3K that cost about $18. There are also stock adapters for the M3000 to run Magpul SGA stocks from MOA Precision and S&J Hardware. Both MOA Precision and S&J Hardware say that their stock adapters fit both the M3000 and P3000. A smart person might learn that and just decide to run an adapter and Magpul SGA. I never claimed to be smart though. I wanted to know if Stoeger already had the parts to make a baller shotgun and for some reason decided not to. I zipped an e-mail off to Stoeger’s tech support to see if the compact stock for the M3000 would fit the P3000. Official answer was no, it wouldn’t, although the reason why it wouldn’t seemed pretty slim. I didn’t bother asking about the extended safety button.

I opted to ignore the advice from Stoeger’s tech guys and try the compact stock anyway. Turns out, it is a perfect fit. Who would have thought. The LOP is now right at 13”, which is exactly where I want it.

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The safety is also a perfect fit, and relatively easy to install. Works similarly to the safety on an 870. Punch a pin, remove spring, remove safety, put new safety in, return spring, return pin.

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Why Stoeger didn’t make this gun from the start is beyond me. It is a rather well kitted for a “budget” oriented defensive gun. So far I am about 300 rounds in, no issues with function or durability yet. If it holds together, it may turn into the gun I campaign through classes next year to see how well it holds up.

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http://youtu.be/035YlLznne0

Next up is figuring out what to do about the plastic rear sight assembly, and see if an extended M3000 lifter will work on the P3000 too. I have a hunch many of the internal components are the same between the two guns.

[Lex Luthier]

Subscribed.

[diananike]

Great report.
I’ve been pretty tempted to try a M3000 Defense. They are pretty reasonably priced even here in Canada
Of course it would also require a youth stock as the pistol grip stock it comes with is wretched and way too long

[167]

Update

This gun made it through a Symtac Consulting Shotgun Skills class with one malfunction in nearly 400 rounds fired at the class. Early in second day, while shooting two round strings two rounds of Fiocchi birdshot tried to feed from the magazine tube at once. I was able to clear the malfunction without tools while standing on the line and continued the drill. That was the only notable issue.

The gun turned in a 6.23 raw time on Symtac’s skill drill. I dropped a point though, so officially a 7.23. It made it to the final round of the man vs man shoot off in a class dominated by 1301’s. I missed the win because my side saddle reload couldn’t quite keep pace with a well executed match saver reload. Close, but not quite there.

As currently configured the only non-Stoeger parts on the gun are a S&J Hardware follower and a GG&G QD sling mount. Everything else is Stoeger’s own parts still. Additions that may be coming soon are a stock adapter to run a Magpul SGA and a red dot. Because why not.

In total, I am about 700 rounds in on this gun. My hope is to get it to 1,000 rounds soon, then take it on to a few thousand by the end of the year.

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[Whiskey]

I really enjoy your posts on shotguns here and your blog. Thank you.

[LHS]

I was legitimately impressed by how well it ran this weekend. It seemed smooth and you certainly ran it like a boss all weekend. Having gotten just a little time to handle it, my only real issue was how tight the loading port is, especially for guys like us with big/thick thumbs. It felt a lot like trying to load a lever gun through a King's gate. I presume you could open it up perhaps?

Also, the fact that you ran the Skills Gauge that fast with three cloverleafed slug hits on the 10y torso shots was downright impressive, even with the single dropped point elsewhere. I think you've got a good chance at a coin the next time :)


Update

This gun made it through a Symtac Consulting Shotgun Skills class with one malfunction in nearly 400 rounds fired at the class. Early in second day, while shooting two round strings two rounds of Fiocchi birdshot tried to feed from the magazine tube at once. I was able to clear the malfunction without tools while standing on the line and continued the drill. That was the only notable issue.

The gun turned in a 6.23 raw time on Symtac’s skill drill. I dropped a point though, so officially a 7.23. It made it to the final round of the man vs man shoot off in a class dominated by 1301’s. I missed the win because my side saddle reload couldn’t quite keep pace with a well executed match saver reload. Close, but not quite there.

As currently configured the only non-Stoeger parts on the gun are a S&J Hardware follower and a GG&G QD sling mount. Everything else is Stoeger’s own parts still. Additions that may be coming soon are a stock adapter to run a Magpul SGA and a red dot. Because why not.

In total, I am about 700 rounds in on this gun. My hope is to get it to 1,000 rounds soon, then take it on to a few thousand by the end of the year.

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[Joe in PNG]

Was it the class Larry Correia went to this weekend (https://monsterhunternation.com/2023/03/13/back-to-gun-school/)?

[167]

Was it the class Larry Correia went to this weekend (https://monsterhunternation.com/2023/03/13/back-to-gun-school/)?

Indeed the same.

[167]

The final of the man v man at the Symtac class. I made it by a 590, a M4, and a 1301 to get to the final. The match saver is finally what got me.


https://youtu.be/l9cdXxSLsaM

Since the reload is what beat me, I started working on some tweaks. Ran these port loads today. Some of the fastest I have pulled off.


https://youtu.be/45QDX4dATJ8

[LHS]

The final of the man v man at the Symtac class. I made it by a 590, a M4, and a 1301 to get to the final. The match saver is finally what got me.


https://youtu.be/l9cdXxSLsaM

Since the reload is what beat me, I started working on some tweaks. Ran these port loads today. Some of the fastest I have pulled off.


https://youtu.be/45QDX4dATJ8

Albert was a major-league sleeper. He just stayed quiet all class, absorbed what was taught, practiced it, and by the end of the weekend his proficiency with that matchsaver went from OK to great. I watched him do some loads from it on the morning of day 1 and there was definitely some fumbling going on. But as we saw in your video, by Sunday afternoon he had it pretty well dialed in. It was a great final four, honestly.

[167]

Albert was a major-league sleeper. He just stayed quiet all class, absorbed what was taught, practiced it, and by the end of the weekend his proficiency with that matchsaver went from OK to great. I watched him do some loads from it on the morning of day 1 and there was definitely some fumbling going on. But as we saw in your video, by Sunday afternoon he had it pretty well dialed in. It was a great final four, honestly.

He was like an assassin, sent to slay the giants. 🤣🤣

Pretty sure that is the first time I have been at a class and I wasn’t even close to the tallest dude there.

[Whiskey]

Really slick emergency loads. I had to slow down the video on youtube to see exactly what you were doing on the first one. I'm going to give that a try in my dry fire this week.

[LHS]

He was like an assassin, sent to slay the giants. 🤣🤣

Pretty sure that is the first time I have been at a class and I wasn’t even close to the tallest dude there.

I'm pretty sure we had at least four people over 6'5"

[BK14]

I’ve always ran my front two rounds brass up assuming it was a faster port load. After watching you, now I’m not sure. Guess I gotta bust out the shot timer, cause your loads are smooooth.

[167]

I’ve always ran my front two rounds brass up assuming it was a faster port load. After watching you, now I’m not sure. Guess I gotta bust out the shot timer, cause your loads are smooooth.

I was the same, I used to always run brass up and reload over the top of the gun. Then I saw a video of Tim Chandler running reloads underneath the gun really quickly and changed my mind about reloads. In my experience it takes more work to run reloads underneath the gun, but I do think there is a time advantage if reloading the gun while it is still mounted in the shoulder.

[awp_101]

167 based on what you've experienced so far, would you recommend the P3000 with the changes you've made or a police trade in 870 for the average person looking for a defensive shotgun? Or is there not enough difference between them for the average person to notice?

What about the person with a sort of vetted early-00s 870 who has considered having it d&t for a dot mount and maybe a trip to WC for the Remington Steal package even though it's seen less than 250 rounds in the 20 years the person has owned it (because I can't leave well enough alone :rolleyes: ) ?

Also, who is making an adapter for the Magpul stock?

[167]

167 based on what you've experienced so far, would you recommend the P3000 with the changes you've made or a police trade in 870 for the average person looking for a defensive shotgun? Or is there not enough difference between them for the average person to notice?

What about the person with a sort of vetted early-00s 870 who has considered having it d&t for a dot mount and maybe a trip to WC for the Remington Steal package even though it's seen less than 250 rounds in the 20 years the person has owned it (because I can't leave well enough alone :rolleyes: ) ?

Also, who is making an adapter for the Magpul stock?

There are pros and cons to each. The P3000 has better parts support, and Stoeger tech support has been pretty responsive. I personally put a lot of value in both of those. The 870 still has one thing the Stoeger doesn’t have, decades of widespread service and use in large organizations. My P3000 is a sample of one, and could be a fluke. I would put my P3000 up against any 870. I am not sure I would go so far as to recommend the P3000 in general to users who are new to shotguns and not as tuned in for what to watch for.

If you already have an 870 and are debating dropping some big money on it, that gets a little more nuanced. If you want a gun to beat on, get the P3000 and toss a couple upgrades at it. If you want a highly refined heavily gunsmithed shotty that screams performance, stick with the 870 and send it to Vang.

S&J Hardware and MOA Precision both make stock adapters for the P3000. I have not used either yet (it will come eventually), but know they exist. S&J has helped me out with some parts here and there, and I have ordered other parts from them, so I am biased in their direction. I have not ordered anything from MOA yet. Their triggers look interesting though. 🤔🤔

https://sjhardware.us/product-category/stoeger-shotguns/

https://moaprecisionllc.com/product/new-adapter-system-for-magpul-sga-stock/

The factory compact stock is available from Midwest Gun Works.

https://www.midwestgunworks.com/page/mgwi/prod/33599

[awp_101]

Thanks for the info, it gives me something to chew on and for the links! I suspect I’ll end up with the Stoeger and an A300UP before I do anything with the 870 because it’s just nowhere near the top of my project list.

[Rick R]

S&J Hardware and MOA Precision both make stock adapters for the P3000. I have not used either yet (it will come eventually), but know they exist. S&J has helped me out with some parts here and there, and I have ordered other parts from them, so I am biased in their direction. I have not ordered anything from MOA yet. Their triggers look interesting though. 🤔🤔


FWIW I ordered the MOA stock adapter for my Stoeger M3K and it blends the action and Magpul stock like they were made for each other. On a side note I ordered some other parts from MOA with the understanding that they were then currently out of stock. When they shipped the owner threw in a reduced power action spring freebee because HE thought he took too long to get my order shipped.

[167]

The P3000 bumped just over the 1,000 round mark today. Nothing has broken, everything is still tight, only one malfunction.

These are some of the last rounds through the gun on the way to 1,000.


https://youtu.be/ISS2xW0_SVM

My port loads are getting faster too. These are personal best times, and were pretty repeatable with the adjustments I have made. I still have to think about what I am doing to pull it off, so there is still more work to be done.


https://youtu.be/D3-h8zoAUYI

[167]

The Stoeger update. It has been through another class, the ASP 1 day shotgun class. If you are on the ASP app and watch the videos of the shotgun class, you can see the gun in action. It has some changes since I last posted about it. It now has an S&J Hardware M4 safety, and an S&J Hardware optics mount with a Sig MSR mounted. It has been that way for the last few hundred rounds. I sort of stopped keeping specific count once I broke 1,000, but I am guessing it is somewhere around 1,300-1,500 right now. Someone stepped in to sponsor some ammo, so I am putting another 750 through it this fall and winter. Barrel is going away for a few weeks to get some work done, then back after it. Gun has been rock solid, despite spending a couple days at very wet classes as a demo gun and loaner, and no maintenance since before the Symtac class in the spring. A picture of the current setup.

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