Looks like somethin is comin from S&W!

[Polecat]

Pic on their instagram site hinting around, shows only a grip. It looks like a grips side from either their bodyguard series. Either a new revo / caliber bodyguard, or redesigned bidyguard? Any clues? Their is no release date mentioned.

[Joe Mac]

Pic on their instagram site hinting around, shows only a grip. It looks like a grips side from either their bodyguard series. Either a new revo / caliber bodyguard, or redesigned bidyguard? Any clues? Their is no release date mentioned.

It does look like the .380 Bodyguard grip pattern. Perhaps a 10-rd .380 is coming.

[Brianjkeene]

Another pic from this morning. 96626

[newyork]

And it has a rail. Hmmmm

[Brianjkeene]

And it has a rail. Hmmmm


Updated shield would make the most sense.

[TheNewbie]

If they are updating the Shield, put a real safety on it.

[Polecat]

Please let it be a DA/ SA micro.

[Noah]

Please let it be a DA/ SA micro.


Good luck.

[MattyD380]

Does the slide look a little wide for a Shield-sized / micro kinda thing? Frame looks polymer.

Maybe it's an M3.0?

I mean, that's kinda what the PDP is; it's basically a third-gen P99. Maybe Smith decided the world needs a third-gen M&P?

[TheNewbie]

Does the slide look a little wide for a Shield-sized / micro kinda thing? Frame looks polymer.

Maybe it's an M3.0?

I mean, that's kinda what the PDP is; it's basically a third-gen P99. Maybe Smith decided the world needs a third-gen M&P?

A polymer take on the 3rd Gen DA/SA and DAO guns would be cool.


In reality it will probably be incredibly underwhelming.

[Lester Polfus]

I bet it's a ground-breaking polymer framed striker fired pistol.

Again.

[MattyD380]

A polymer take on the 3rd Gen DA/SA and DAO guns would be cool.


In reality it will probably be incredibly underwhelming.

Yeah, that would pique my interest. Especially if they put that on the metal frame.

But I doubt either will come to fruition. Sigh.

[HeavyDuty]

I bet it's a ground-breaking polymer framed striker fired pistol.

Again.

A Glock killer!

[Inkwell 41]

A Glock killer!

Aren’t they all?

[Totem Polar]

I bet it's a ground-breaking polymer framed striker fired pistol.

Again.

:D

[Spartan1980]

A polymer take on the 3rd Gen DA/SA and DAO guns would be cool.


In reality it will probably be incredibly underwhelming.

They hit it out of the park with the launch of the Shield 1.0. Even the launch itself was good. They waited until holsters and mags were available and then launched. They been swinging and missing ever since. :(

[Spartan1980]

Updated shield would make the most sense.

Didn't they do that with the Shield Plus?

[MattyD380]

Didn't they do that with the Shield Plus?

Word.

I’d kinda like to see them build out that metal-frame M&P line. I’d personally like a safety… since it’s basically an SAO. And a compact. And a compact .45. And a Performance Center edition. Without a bunch of f_cking goddamn holes in the slide.

I mean I know this isn’t that. But just sayin.

[Navin Johnson]

Shields are on sale from the factory now….

2011?

[GearFondler]

I hope it's something really groundbreaking, like introducing a new S&W 8.75mm pistol cartridge.

/sarcasm

[SWAT Lt.]

Oh. good. It's is a new plastic gun (maybe even in a new caliber that's so much more friggin' awesome than everything else everyone currently owns!) instead of a no-lock, Airweight, K frame, 6 shot, shrouded ejector rod, 3 inch barrel, DAO hammer revolver with decent sights. How exciting.

[Guerrero]

I'm pretty sure they're just breathing hard.

[MandoWookie]

Off the wall guess, updated SD series to compete with the Ruger Security‐9.

[MattyD380]

Off the wall guess, updated SD series to compete with the Ruger Security‐9.

That makes a lot of sense, actually. The fore slide serrations shown kinda look like what’s on the SDs.

Only thing… it’s got those “furrows” in the frame like the current M&Ps. Not sure what those are for. But would they add those to a new SD?

Maybe they’re merging the SD line into the M&P line? Kinda like they did the Bodyguard, a few years back. Which I’m not sure I agree with—just dilutes the M&P sub brand and makes it somewhat meaningless if everything’s an M&P.

But maybe that’s not what they’re doing…

[TheNewbie]

Any release date information?

[GearFondler]

Just show the fucking thing, or don't... This cock-tease form of marketing is so damn annoying. If it's a legit product it will do well even if it didn't create a hubba baloo prior to release.

[TheNewbie]

Just show the fucking thing, or don't... This cock-tease form of marketing is so damn annoying. If it's a legit product it will do well even if it didn't create a hubba baloo prior to release.

Exactly. Maybe the new fashion will be to simply release quality products without out this silliness.

[Wonder9]

Have we all become so cynical that we can't even enjoy new gun releases?

Then again, I remember the Glock 44 and wristwatch releases.

[Lester Polfus]

Just show the fucking thing, or don't... This cock-tease form of marketing is so damn annoying. If it's a legit product it will do well even if it didn't create a hubba baloo prior to release.


Have we all become so cynical that we can't even enjoy new gun releases?

Then again, I remember the Glock 44 and wristwatch releases.

Gun companies survive by selling guns to people who already have guns that most likely do a good enough job of meeting their needs. Plastic People Poppers from the top tier companies have become fungible and the only way to differentiate one from the other is largely via marketing.

[GearFondler]

Have we all become so cynical that we can't even enjoy new gun releases?

Then again, I remember the Glock 44 and wristwatch releases.I'm all about a new release as I'm a geer geek and love to see innovation. What I don't care for is this particular style of marketing... It suggests that there is way more hype than substance to the actual product. If it's truly good shit then it will stand on its own merits regardless of the level of pre-reveal buzz. Then again, I'm not a marketing expert, just a grumpy older man who doesn't care to be jerked around with nebulous marketing voodoo intended to create tactical boners from all the Instagram Couch Ninjas.

[Lester Polfus]

Another pic from this morning. 96626

If you want to see more do you have to join Smith and Wesson's Only Fans?

[wmu12071]

If you want to see more do you have to join Smith and Wesson's Only Fans?

I award you the internet win for today.

[Bolt_Overide]

Full sized version of that 1911/shield bastardization.

[TheNewbie]

Full sized version of that 1911/shield bastardization.



I actually would like that.

A drop safe, poly, M&P/Shield/1911 combo, decent manual safety/grip safety, durable, reliable, affordable, etc. I am one of 128 people worldwide who would be excited.

[MistWolf]

I bet it's a ground-breaking polymer framed striker fired pistol.

Again.

Did you feel just as underwhelmed when gun makers introduced a ground breaking hammer fired pistol DA/SA pistol? Again?

Back in the day, there were so many on the market. It seemed like every week a new Crunchenticker hit the market. I wouldn't be surprised if there had been more variations of hammer fired pistols then than striker fired pistols today.

[MandoWookie]

That makes a lot of sense, actually. The fore slide serrations shown kinda look like what’s on the SDs.

Only thing… it’s got those “furrows” in the frame like the current M&Ps. Not sure what those are for. But would they add those to a new SD?

Maybe they’re merging the SD line into the M&P line? Kinda like they did the Bodyguard, a few years back. Which I’m not sure I agree with—just dilutes the M&P sub brand and makes it somewhat meaningless if everything’s an M&P.

But maybe that’s not what they’re doing…


The SD line was an update to the Sigma to bring it more in line with the M&P, now that we are a generation or two down the line it makes sense to me they would refresh the SD to have it more in line with the 2.0, while still fulfilling the low side of the high-low product offering they have had with the M&P/SD for years now.

[45dotACP]

I actually would like that.

A drop safe, poly, M&P/Shield/1911 combo, decent manual safety/grip safety, durable, reliable, affordable, etc. I am one of 128 people worldwide who would be excited.There are literally dozens of us!

Sent from my SM-A326U using Tapatalk

[Noah]

There are literally dozens of us!

Sent from my SM-A326U using Tapatalk

A larger format, polymer frame CSX would be more exciting than the improved SD9 this probably is.

[spyderco monkey]

Possible wildcard? Although this may be a SHOT 2023 release vs the hinted at current drop. But S&W is doing real R&D, which is nice to see.

https://www.ar15.com/forums/Handguns/MandP-5-7x28mm/16-206872/

Based on S&W patent filings

An action for a firearm uses a rotating barrel on which are mounted lugs and a cam follower. The barrel is positioned coaxially within a tube fixed to the frame of the firearm. A cam, engaged by the cam follower, is also fixed to the frame. A gas space is defined between the tube and the barrel by a thrust surface on the barrel and a reaction surface on the tube. A gas port connects the gas space with the barrel's bore. A slide overlies the tube and defines longitudinally oriented grooves which receive the lugs when the barrel is rotated by interaction between the cam and the cam follower to align the lugs and the grooves. Motion of the barrel is arrested by interaction between the cam and cam follower, and motion of the slide relative to the barrel is permitted when the lugs align and engage the grooves.

Low recoil impulse cartridges such as the FN 5.7×28 mm, .22 Winchester Magnum Rimfire and .17 Hornady Magnum Rimfire generally do not work well in pistols using the Browning short recoil locked breech actions and require use of blowback, delayed blowback or locked breech gas operated systems for reliable operation. There is clearly an opportunity to improve on the reliability of such actions.

https://patentimages.storage.googleapis.com/15/e8/fc/16cf6d87fe3b35/US20220120524A1-20220421-D00000.png

https://patentimages.storage.googleapis.com/c3/bc/43/122ce8a6829f6b/US20220120524A1-20220421-D00001.png

[Brianjkeene]

The more I look at it the more I think it’s an updated Shield EZ. The current EZ has the same slide shape (minus serrations), has a pic rail, has the same cutouts for the serial number like the M&P, has the same looking guide rod. I’m 99% sure this is all it will be.

[FreedomFries]

The more I look at it the more I think it’s an updated Shield EZ. The current EZ has the same slide shape (minus serrations), has a pic rail, has the same cutouts for the serial number like the M&P, has the same looking guide rod. I’m 99% sure this is all it will be.

You'll probably be right. They've been offering $50 gift card rebates for the Shield EZ through December. Maybe they are clearing old inventory.

A new SD9VE would have been more exciting to me. Make it use the better M&P magazines, rougher grip texture, melonite, fix the crappy guide rod, smaller slide stop, and factory optic cut would make it great. I'm in for 2 if someone makes a gadget for it. After other people beta test it.

[TheNewbie]

If this turns out to be a full size EZ shield style M&P, with a grip safety and decent manual safety, I will be happy.

[camel]

If this turns out to be a full size EZ shield style M&P, with a grip safety and decent manual safety, I will be happy.

That would be nice

[willie]

Don't buy one from OlongJohnson's dealer. They send all their culls there. ;)

[OlongJohnson]

Don't buy one from OlongJohnson's dealer. They send all their culls there. ;)

That's every dealer and the manufacturers themselves.

Sig once had a demo gun start going full-auto when I just happened to be shooting in the same bay at a local range.

[MandoWookie]

The more I look at it the more I think it’s an updated Shield EZ. The current EZ has the same slide shape (minus serrations), has a pic rail, has the same cutouts for the serial number like the M&P, has the same looking guide rod. I’m 99% sure this is all it will be.

The EZ is relatively recent product though. Why would they 'update' it when it is already concurrent with the 2.0 models? The .45 line still hasn't been fully brought up to current standard.

The SD still seems more likely to me. Or an SD replacement.

[feudist]

They're gonna bite TCinVA's shit with a production turnkey Stack-a-Toe.
Word to your mother.

[Lester Polfus]

Did you feel just as underwhelmed when gun makers introduced a ground breaking hammer fired pistol DA/SA pistol? Again?

Back in the day, there were so many on the market. It seemed like every week a new Crunchenticker hit the market. I wouldn't be surprised if there had been more variations of hammer fired pistols then than striker fired pistols today.

At least I could tell a Smith, Beretta, HK and SIG apart from across the room. Modern black plastic people poppers are like modern crossover cars, I usually have to be close enough to read the nameplate to tell what I'm looking at.

[MistWolf]

At least I could tell a Smith, Beretta, HK and SIG apart from across the room. Modern black plastic people poppers are like modern crossover cars, I usually have to be close enough to read the nameplate to tell what I'm looking at.

I know what you mean. My eyes ain't what they used to be, either.

[willie]

That's every dealer and the manufacturers themselves.

Sig once had a demo gun start going full-auto when I just happened to be shooting in the same bay at a local range.

I fear you may be correct.

[Bucky]

My Shield Plus is a disappointment. My Smith 1911 was built wrong, IMO. I see the ongoing issues with folks here and their new Smith revolvers. A new offering from Smith these days get an “eh” from me.

[Crow Hunter]

My Shield Plus is a disappointment. My Smith 1911 was built wrong, IMO. I see the ongoing issues with folks here and their new Smith revolvers. A new offering from Smith these days get an “eh” from me.

What was disappointing about your Plus, if you don't mind sharing. (Or a link if you have shared it before. :D)

[Bucky]

What was disappointing about your Plus, if you don't mind sharing. (Or a link if you have shared it before. :D)

It’s not 99.9 percent reliable, like it should be. It’s not a jamomatic by any means, but it’ll hiccup once in a 250 round practice session. Looks like an extraction issue. Also, Arnold Schwarzenegger would break a sweat with the takedown lever. Shame, as my 1.0 Shield is none of this. It certainly needs to go back to Smith, I just need to get on that. I guess I should have vetted it before adding high vis night sights, but I wanted a fair side by side against the G43, and the factory sights aren’t to my liking.

Also, now that my G43 is sporting a 9 round Shield Arms magazine, and has passed multiple function tests, including limp wrist tests, the Shield Plus will wind up being a safe queen anyway.

[awp_101]

My Shield Plus is a disappointment. My Smith 1911 was built wrong, IMO. I see the ongoing issues with folks here and their new Smith revolvers. A new offering from Smith these days get an “eh” from me.

The metal frame M&P looks like a fun range toy and I’m happy with my Shield 1.0 but when it’s time to put optics on my EDC, it’s either mill the Shield or go slimline MOS Glock. I just don’t feel like playing the S&W lottery.

[LockedBreech]

My Shield Plus is fine but frankly I'm standardized to Glock in every other area and it irritates me that I can't 100% standardize. I would love for Glock to come up with a P365/Shield gun with that size and capacity. The 43X is significantly taller and the 48 is a good bit taller and longer.

[Joe Mac]

My Shield Plus is fine but frankly I'm standardized to Glock in every other area and it irritates me that I can't 100% standardize. I would love for Glock to come up with a P365/Shield gun with that size and capacity. The 43X is significantly taller and the 48 is a good bit taller and longer.

Here's one idea: a 26S, with a 43-ish upper. Sure, it would be fatter in the ass, but for those of us with an "ample" supply of G26 mags...

[TCinVA]

They're gonna bite TCinVA's shit with a production turnkey Stack-a-Toe.
Word to your mother.

How fucking dare they.

[Polecat]

Tomorow per Instagram! I shit you not it looks like they are calling it the “ equalizer “ The first S&W yeet cannon!

[Noah]

Tomorow per Instagram! I shit you not it looks like they are calling it the “ equalizer “ The first S&W yeet cannon!

96799
96800

[Joe Mac]

Wow.

[crosseyedshooter]

They couldn't just go with Shield EZ Plus?

[MattyD380]

Man, I would have loved to have been in the meetings where the name was discussed.

Naming products/brands is often part of my job (nothing as cool as guns, unfortunately). I find the name... cheesy... like a cheap infomercial from the '90s. But then again, I'm not the target segment.

I hope.

[Polecat]

Good lord, at least shorten the barrel too if you are going to chop they grip. Man S&W is hitin it out of the park. First the super successful .30 super, and now this.

[Noah]

Good lord, at least shorten the barrel too if you are going to chop they grip. Man S&W is hitin it out of the park. First the super successful .30 super, and now this.

Almost no release is exciting anymore, but this isn't all bad. The EZ series makes some sense and this brings the capacity to 2020 and adds an optic cut. The 380 version is more interesting, the name is dumb but I get what they were trying for, it's an "Equalizer" for people with low grip strength. And hey, it's not striker fired.

[RevolverRob]

Nobody: You know what I want? A gun with a name that is definitely going to make me seem like a psychopath to a jury of my peers.

Smith and Wesson: Hold our beer.

Everyone: What in the actual fuck is wrong with you? EZ was meant to be easy to use the action. A gun meant for elderly and disabled people and people liked them. Now you're saying it's the EqualiZer like some bad '80s action flick*.

*No lie, I'd totally watch The Equalizer bad '80s Action Flick. Starring Arnold and Jean-Claude each carrying a Model 29.

[MattyD380]

Nobody: You know what I want? A gun with a name that is definitely going to make me seem like a psychopath to a jury of my peers.

Smith and Wesson: Hold our beer.

Everyone: What in the actual fuck is wrong with you? EZ was meant to be easy to use the action. A gun meant for elderly and disabled people and people liked them. Now you're saying it's the EqualiZer like some bad '80s action flick*.

*No lie, I'd totally watch The Equalizer bad '80s Action Flick. Starring Arnold and Jean-Claude each carrying a Model 29.

:D

[Joe in PNG]

Maybe they should have called it the "Stack-A-Toe EZ"?

[TheNewbie]

What dummy came up with this name???


The make exactly what I want and then do that. It can’t be that difficult to not be that stupid.

[RevolverRob]

Maybe they should have called it the "Stack-A-Toe EZ"?

Would have been a better name. I bet TC wouldn't have charged them a ton for that name either.


It can’t be that difficult to not be that stupid.

Man...you'd hope that's the case...but it just doesn't seem to be the case. Smith & Wesson has repeatedly snatched defeat from the jaws of victory with stupidity.

Since Smith has moved to Tennessee though I can say this, "The Equalizer, huh? Well bless their hearts."

[LockedBreech]

Christ on a cracker it is hard to defend S&W sometimes. This is Grip Zone level stupid. I've always thought "Shield" and "Shield Plus" were mildly silly and now I feel tremendously fortunate.

And in Spring 2023, check your favorite local gun store for the new M&P BLOODY SWATH 12-gauge shotgun and M&P CARNAGE-15.

[Polecat]

Ugh Jim, hey yeah ugh boss needs to see you in his office… I mean so much low hanging fruit for Smith. Remove all the dumbass locks! Offer the Poly bodyguard revo in . 22s and .32s. Give us humpback bodyguard no lock .32s, .22s. Pocket .32, with 10-12 rounds. And OMG, don’t waste your energy on the 5.7 x 28.

[Kyle Reese]

Reminds me of this classic from the Simpsons.

Substitute “Equalizer” for Love Day”

https://youtu.be/eygsGzLX07A


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[Caballoflaco]

https://youtu.be/g87nDBIyqeU

[LockedBreech]

Ugh Jim, hey yeah ugh boss needs to see you in his office… I mean so much low hanging fruit for Smith. Remove all the dumbass locks! Offer the Poly bodyguard revo in . 22s and .32s. Give us humpback bodyguard no lock .32s, .22s. Pocket .32, with 10-12 rounds. And OMG, don’t waste your energy on the 5.7 x 28.

If I could get a Model 10 classic in the current nice bluing and wood with no lock I would have given S&W one thousand dollars YEARS ago. Instantly. I want a new production 6 shot .38 Special +P with no internal lock that is not a Taurus and does not weight a thousand pounds like a Ruger so very, very much.

But nope. I get the gorram Equalizer.

[Bucky]

https://youtu.be/g87nDBIyqeU

I see your original TV show with a movie adaptation…


https://youtu.be/lmHR1MEBmwQ

And raise you the remake series…


https://youtu.be/u1QU2_NFd9Y

[TicTacticalTimmy]

Aside from the retarded name this looks like a neat gun. I would have preferred an exposed hammer and a couple oz lighter, but overall this could be a very shootable while also safe and high capacity handgun.

I expected something far lamer, so they beat my expectations!

[Elwin]

Agreed on the awful name. Smith FINALLY releases a compact gun with a true subcompact grip (and a longer slide to boot) AND their good manual safety design, and then it gets that name. I’ve basically wanted a Shield with the safety from an M&P for a very long time, and with a barrel closer to 4” than 3” would be even better.

But not if the name gives any lawyer with me in their sights a ready made argument. “Ladies and gentlemen of the jury, we can tell by the defendant’s choice of weapon that he has an inferiority complex and made up for it by carrying a deadly weapon as an ‘equalizer.’ That eventually wasn’t enough, and he had to take the next step and use it on someone.”

EZ-2 would have been fine guys. You can even use that for the dumb marketing if you absolutely must. “It’s even more EZ 2 rack and fire accurately.”

[TheNewbie]

I just can’t believe they are this stupid. Unbelievable. I’m still perplexed.


The same company that put locks in double action revolvers does this.

[Lost River]

You know what I feel bad about.

The fact that S&W has a super talented, very articulate and engaging, shooter/brand rep like Julie Golob, and they put this in her lap.

She is supposed to look the camera in the eye and do the fantastic job that she does, even though they handed her "The Equalizer"...

And you know she will do a great job, because she is who she is.

That poor girl.

[gato naranja]

The name is melodramatic, but you'll sometimes get things like this when you don't stick to alpha-numeric designations. I think it should now be unofficially nicknamed the "Kostmayer" or be re-christened something like the PSEZ123-9A1. But that's just me.

It is actually an interesting and - dare I say - possibly useful newb- or codger-friendly pistol that I might have checked out had the hammer been exposed along the lines of the 3913.

[Noah]

It does use Shield Plus mags and it has a 15 round mag compatible with the Shield Plus.

[Joe in PNG]

I have to admit I'm vaguely interested.

[camel]

Wonder when the gold lettering edition comes out

[idahojess]

http://youtu.be/qV1K0bRosU0


http://youtu.be/41bNkiRDojM

The embargo hath been lifted.

Looks like the ejection is a bit anemic. Maybe that would get better with break in.

[spyderco monkey]

Aside from the retarded name this looks like a neat gun. I would have preferred an exposed hammer and a couple oz lighter, but overall this could be a very shootable while also safe and high capacity handgun.

I expected something far lamer, so they beat my expectations!

Agreed, I think this could end up being a really cool gun.

If someone like Apex can get a Wire EDM hammer + sear combo, it could end up having a fantastic SAO trigger well above any striker fired gun.

https://i.ibb.co/x5N0RXN/Screen-Shot-2022-11-08-at-3-08-25-AM.png

[TCinVA]

Maybe they should have called it the "Stack-A-Toe EZ"?

The Pinky-Toe.

I have one of the Shield EZ pistols I purchased primarily for giving to people who have small hands because most guns on the market don't fit them. It's been fine in the limited shooting it has seen, but it does have more felt recoil...and the kind of person who has small enough hands to be a concern usually is more sensitive to recoil. It's why I'm not a fan of the P365's more diminutive incarnations as they tend to be more like shooting a lightweight J frame.

Some improvements to the design are welcome. Especially if they boost the hammer spring a bit to take a little more starch out of that recoil, make it optics ready, and give it a little bit better trigger.

I don't find the grip safety useful or helpful but some people love having that piece of mind.

Ultimately S&W is in the business of selling guns and the vast majority of people who buy guns know next to nothing about their use, performance, or how they look in court. The "Shield" name has become incredibly confusing so I can see the desire to call this pistol something distinct. The general public might like the name. Rich people seem to have no problem spending $300,000 on a Volkswagen with a beak that sounds like it's named after a tumor in your urinary tract, so who knows.

[gato naranja]

The Pinky-Toe.

I have one of the Shield EZ pistols I purchased primarily for giving to people who have small hands because most guns on the market don't fit them. It's been fine in the limited shooting it has seen, but it does have more felt recoil...and the kind of person who has small enough hands to be a concern usually is more sensitive to recoil. It's why I'm not a fan of the P365's more diminutive incarnations as they tend to be more like shooting a lightweight J frame.

Some improvements to the design are welcome. Especially if they boost the hammer spring a bit to take a little more starch out of that recoil, make it optics ready, and give it a little bit better trigger.

I don't find the grip safety useful or helpful but some people love having that piece of mind.

Ultimately S&W is in the business of selling guns and the vast majority of people who buy guns know next to nothing about their use, performance, or how they look in court. The "Shield" name has become incredibly confusing so I can see the desire to call this pistol something distinct. The general public might like the name. Rich people seem to have no problem spending $300,000 on a Volkswagen with a beak that sounds like it's named after a tumor in your urinary tract, so who knows.

Good points.

All I will add is that among that vast majority of people are a fair number who don't want to know any more about handguns than they do about cars, but they already know that they need the latter to go about their lives as it is slowly dawning on them that TPTB have f'd up their world to the point where they believe they now also need the former. The name may or may not put them off, but some of the features you touch on - or possibly the lack of them - will be important. If the Equalizer is a step towards the modern, semiauto equivalent of the S&W Safety "Hammerless"/New Departure (and it's popularly-priced IJ/H&R analogues), I'm certainly not going to micturate all over it, because I think it ought to be encouraged.

My earlier comment about the lack of an external, visible/tactile bobbed hammer was made because I always liked the ability for my thumb to ride the hammer of my 3913 down when holstering, it being the first spurless centerfire that I actually had around long enough to bond with. All these years later I still like that reassurance on semiautos, and I believe others born with an overactive safety gland might appreciate it too.

[MandoWookie]

Well, not an SD upgrade, so I'm disappointed there, but this is more appealing to me than the regular EZ.

I'm curious if it's compatible with EZ holsters?

And it looks like they include a Maglula, which you are gonna need. Shield plus mags are tough to load without it.

[TCinVA]

I, too, like a hammer I can block while I put the gun away. But cocked hammers make people nervous.

Tom Givens related his days of carrying a 1911 as a duty pistol repeatedly encountering members of the public who would come to him and nervously tell him that the hammer was cocked on his pistol. For a while he tried explaining it was supposed to be, but usually to no avail. So he eventually started returning their silliness by saying "Oh, fuck! What do we do now???" and then they suddenly wanted to be somewhere else.

[Noah]

96828

Looks like no safety will be an option

[Lex Luthier]

I will rent one at one of the local ranges after they’ve been out in the wild for a few months.
Pre COVID, I did get a couple of boxes each through a 9mm & .380 EZ V1.0 and thought they had real promise.
The thumb safety on the well used rental .380 was good, and the trigger beat the pants off of the 9mm Walther CCP M1 I was comparing it to.
I will say I am not a fan of the muzzle end serrations on this new variant, but that’s me.
The quick appearance of good aftermarket parts for the Shield & M&P lines makes me think this one will benefit too.

[Clay]

The company that put a lock on a revolver gives us a pistol called the Equalizer. Can't make it up.

[Kanye Wyoming]

Given the options the marketing team presented, D seems like the best choice.

A. Executioner

B. Defendant

C. Gravedigger

D. Equalizer

[gato naranja]

I, too, like a hammer I can block while I put the gun away. But cocked hammers make people nervous.

I had to take a crapload of psychology classes when I went through the diploma mill, and it opened my eyes to how screwy people (including psychologists) could be. I had a later High Standard .22 with a hidden hammer, and a friend of mine had an earlier HD with the exposed hammer; people tended to treat the former with less caution than the latter, even though the HD was a bit more honest in telling them what state it was in. "Out of sight, out of mind."

Myself and the late Roy Dunlap are apparently the only two people in the world who had much enthusiasm for the CZ 27, and one of the things I really liked about it - besides the grip - was its rowl hammer that was unobtrusive when cocked, and dang near hidden when down. When I first picked up a PX4, I thought that it was a bit similar in that respect.

[Glenn E. Meyer]

Ain't going to move me from my Glocks unless my old age makes an EZ racker necessary. Just my point of view. Safety, grip safety - hammer up or down - yawn to me. Glocks since 1994 - with some diversions to a Kahr (bah), and a 1911 (fun but not EDC).

[Lester Polfus]

I haven't bought a semiauto pistol in over ten years, because I invested heavily in a substantial number of Glock 19s and stuck with them. Now I'm contemplating making a massive switch in platforms, because of optics capability for starters.

This guns ticks quite a few boxes and would earn a spot on the list of candidates, if not for the name.

Calling a gun "The Equalizer" is stupid. I can see that being projected up on a screen at my civil trial in 3' high letters.

I want Smith to make a 3" revolver that is bigger than a J-frame, but smaller than a K-Frame. My fear is, that if they do they will call it something stupid like "The Punisher."

[crosseyedshooter]

I think the 15-round Shield Plus mag (https://gunmagwarehouse.com/smith-wesson-m-p-shield-plus-equalizer-9mm-15-round-magazine.html?avad=211021_a2c07c205)might be generating more buzz than this new pistol.

96836

[LockedBreech]

Given the options the marketing team presented, D seems like the best choice.

A. Executioner

B. Defendant

C. Gravedigger

D. Equalizer

"Defendant" got an LOL from me.

As for the 15-round magazine, after most of a year of ownership my Shield Plus magazines only hold 12, not the advertised 13, so I won't hold my breath.

In fact, the one I was able to get 13 into dented 4-5 my HSTs over about 2 months so severely they went into the "range ammo for beater guns" pile.

I very much enjoy my full size and compact M2.0 pistols, and I very much enjoyed my standard Shield, but I admit I have been underwhelmed by the Shield Plus. It's a lot of intangibles, but I know that the P365 I got my fiancée seemed like a much better conceived product. I may need to just fully standardize to Glock and either live with the longer butt of the G43X or the lower capacity of the G43.

[gato naranja]

This guns ticks quite a few boxes and would earn a spot on the list of candidates, if not for the name.

I was informed by gata naranja - after she saw the e-mail from S&W - that the name matters not one whit to her (at least it rhymed with whit) and she will try the thing out as soon as the local range gets one. She is one of what I believe is the targeted (!) demographic for the (e-word), so if the name doesn't raise an eyebrow with her, then maybe it isn't the stepping-on-the-crank it could be.

(Or not.)

But as you say, this thing really does tick off some boxes... which is a pleasant surprise, what with coming from the Lair of the Locks, and all.

[crosseyedshooter]

"Defendant" got an LOL from me.

As for the 15-round magazine, after most of a year of ownership my Shield Plus magazines only hold 12, not the advertised 13, so I won't hold my breath.

In fact, the one I was able to get 13 into dented 4-5 my HSTs over about 2 months so severely they went into the "range ammo for beater guns" pile.

I very much enjoy my full size and compact M2.0 pistols, and I very much enjoyed my standard Shield, but I admit I have been underwhelmed by the Shield Plus. It's a lot of intangibles, but I know that the P365 I got my fiancée seemed like a much better conceived product. I may need to just fully standardize to Glock and either live with the longer butt of the G43X or the lower capacity of the G43.

I still prefer my Shield Plus and perform better with it than my new P365XL with Wilson Combat grip. The 13-rd mag makes for a quicker reload than the flush 10-rd mag since the extended base pads are easier to seat with the palm of my hand; I just gotta watch out for pinched skin between the grip and mag. I'm not (yet) in the target market for The EQ but I think the 15-rd mag will be a great spare carry mag.

Btw, I load new 13-rd mags with the Uplula and practice ammo to break-in the new mag then eventually load defensive ammo by hand. I've only seen dented casings when using the Uplula.

[Glenn E. Meyer]

The Parolee?
The GeEZer?
The Depender?

[HeavyDuty]

I want Smith to make a 3" revolver that is bigger than a J-frame, but smaller than a K-Frame. My fear is, that if they do they will call it something stupid like "The Punisher."

Call it “Brawno!” including the exclamation mark.

[Joe Mac]

This guns ticks quite a few boxes and would earn a spot on the list of candidates, if not for the name.

Calling a gun "The Equalizer" is stupid. I can see that being projected up on a screen at my civil trial in 3' high letters.


That's exactly it. The gun itself isn't a bad idea, but the name makes it a non-starter for serious folks.

[GearFondler]

Unless I'm misunderstanding how S&W defines "single-action" I'm completely flummoxed by the no-safety option. If a company released a 1911 without a thumb safety we'd all be up in arms over the negligence of such a design, wouldn't we?

[Noah]

Unless I'm misunderstanding how S&W defines "single-action" I'm completely flummoxed by the no-safety option. If a company released a 1911 without a thumb safety we'd all be up in arms over the negligence of such a design, wouldn't we?

On the other hand, how is this any different than almost every non-Glock mainstream striker fired pistol on the market today? Almost every one, including the M&P, is a fully cocked single action only just like a 1911. If anything, the grip safety is a more positive safety feature than the standard striker fired trigger safety. This just happens to be an internal hammer instead of a striker.

[GearFondler]

On the other hand, how is this any different than almost every non-Glock mainstream striker fired pistol on the market today? Almost every one, including the M&P, is a fully cocked single action only just like a 1911. If anything, the grip safety is a more positive safety feature than the standard striker fired trigger safety. This just happens to be an internal hammer instead of a striker.Well that's going to depend on how that single-action trigger actually works.
If it's a 1911 style trigger which is basically sitting at the wall and only requires some pressure to activate it, then that's what I'm questioning.
If it has some legitimate built-in travel before the break then your point stands and I'm just jumping to conclusions without first looking into it.

[revchuck38]

Deleted due to my being a day late and a dollar short. :o

[Noah]

Well that's going to depend on how that single-action trigger actually works.
If it's a 1911 style trigger which is basically sitting at the wall and only requires some pressure to activate it, then that's what I'm questioning.
If it has some legitimate built-in travel before the break then your point stands and I'm just jumping to conclusions without first looking into it.


I'm referring to the mechanical status of the striker or hammer being fully cocked/tensioned, not the characteristics of the trigger pull in isolation. Many factory striker triggers and almost all aftermarket striker triggers are getting less and less pre travel (what youre talking about) and less break weight once you get to the wall, as right or wrong, that is what the market is screaming for.

I'm not defending this current trend. But if you're alarmed by this design, I'm only pointing out you better take a look at the latest M&P 2.0s, Walther PDP, HK VP9, Beretta APX, Caniks, and especially the Sig P320s (no trigger safety).

I'd rather holster this hot with no thumb safety but with my hand off of the grip safety than any of the guns mentioned above.

[TicTacticalTimmy]

Unless I'm misunderstanding how S&W defines "single-action" I'm completely flummoxed by the no-safety option. If a company released a 1911 without a thumb safety we'd all be up in arms over the negligence of such a design, wouldn't we?

Ruger also has a bunch of hammer fired SAO pistols with no safety. Theres also the Laugo Alien, a number of other lesser known pistols, and most dedicated 22lr pistols are hammer fired and the safety is optional.

I doubt the EQ trigger will have as short takeup as a "good" 1911 trigger. It will likely be similar to your typical stock da/sa trigger in SA, which is to say pretty much the same as fully cocked strikers like the HK VP9, Sig P320/365, Smiths own Shield which competes in this same niche, etc....

With the addition of a grip safety, I would say it is inherently less prone to a ND than most of those designs mentioned above, though oerhaps only very marginally less.

[Jim Watson]

The local store/range already had a couple in, one with optic, one with irons. They would not put a new product out for rental but I got to fondle and gymnasticate it.

I kind of like it, reasonable size for a light holster CCW. It handles somewhat similar to my Plastic M&P .22 Compact.
The trigger is decent, an enclosed hammer SAO, with little take-up and kind of a rolling break, better than the .22.
It has a prominent thumb safety, very like the .22's. I did not know it was available without, I think it needs one.
It takes Shield Plus magazines. The 13 round gives me ample pinkie space.

Can't do much about the flutes and toots but you can't see them through the sights.
I would sure prefer it to a CSX.

I don't get calling it "Equalizer", that is an old Colt tradition:

"Be not afraid of any man;
No matter what his size;
When danger threatens, call on me—
And I will equalize!”

[LockedBreech]

Btw, I load new 13-rd mags with the Uplula and practice ammo to break-in the new mag then eventually load defensive ammo by hand. I've only seen dented casings when using the Uplula.

My Uplula couldn't get the 13th round in, the 13th round was me by hand. As hard as it was fighting me, certainly possible the loading caused denting, but frankly that's unacceptable to me when the P365 10-round and 12-round magazines are easy as pie to load. It even made new Beretta PX4 magazines (very tight in my experience) seem easy. One of the magazines still won't hold 13 and I load both to 12 regardless. Mine also came with badly off-center factory night sights that were so skewed they were partially out of the rear dovetail so I had to finally buy a sight pusher to fix that issue.

I'm glad it has worked well for you and I have no bad reliability/performance reports, it just does not seem very refined.

It's sorta like stopping by a 7 out of 10 Wendys on a road trip. It does the job for now but I don't think I'll remember it fondly down the road.

[Lex Luthier]

It will be telling if this thing gets enough traction to be offered in .30 Super Carry as well. A 17-18 round single-action semi with a grip safety and an electro-optic cut is both pleasing to the shade of John Moses Browning (PBUH) and something one of the better sci-fi authors would obsess upon.

If it turns out to be something good, mark my words, I'd carry it, even if it needed a few boosters from Apex.

[MountainRaven]

Unless I'm misunderstanding how S&W defines "single-action" I'm completely flummoxed by the no-safety option. If a company released a 1911 without a thumb safety we'd all be up in arms over the negligence of such a design, wouldn't we?

The Shield EZs are single-action hammer-fired pistols with optional thumb safeties as well. (Just saying.)

[Lon]

The “Equalizer”?!?!? Really? 🤦*♂️ Why must we come up with stupid names?

[Joe in PNG]

The stupid name thing is part of the modern gun culture, along with gun bunnies in spandex and stupid interpersonal internet personality drama.

[gato naranja]

The “Equalizer”?!?!? Really? 🤦*♂️ Why must we come up with stupid names?

"You do know that if you snip the wrong wire, they'll call it the Equalizer."

96864

[Joe in PNG]

What's the optics footprint on this?

Would the M&P SCS fit?

[Noah]

What's the optics footprint on this?

Would the M&P SCS fit?

No, this fits Holosun 407K/507K, EPS carry as well as Sig Romeo Zero and RMSC footprint optics, all direct mount

[Sensei]

Reportedly, these names were also submitted by the design and marketing departments:

Crippler
Foe-Hammer
Goblin-Cleaver

This is what happens when your entire staff spends their day surfing the internet and watching re-runs of Star Wars and LOTR instead of making guns.

[LockedBreech]

This is what happens when your entire staff spends their day surfing the internet and watching re-runs of Star Wars and LOTR instead of making guns.

Hey, hey, friendly fire! I love those and I also think this is cringe!

[Lex Luthier]

I do wonder if they have a senior-citizen/disabled/multi-racial ad campaign coming out soon. They can’t be *that* myopic…

[Zincwarrior]

Given the options the marketing team presented, D seems like the best choice.

A. Executioner

B. Defendant

C. Gravedigger

D. Equalizer

Defender or Protector would have been better, or better no stupid name, but thats me.

[Noah]

Defender or Protector would have been better, or better no stupid name, but thats me.

LEVEL THE PLAYING FIELD!

[Zincwarrior]

LEVEL THE PLAYING FIELD!

Except your target market for this group is not playing a game.

[45dotACP]

Public: "So can we get a 3 inch RB K frame with no lock?"

S&W: "OK We will make you a Scandiun four shot .44 special 3" RB K frame...with a lock."

Public: .......

S&W: "It's called The Buttfucker!"

Sent from my SM-A326U using Tapatalk

[willie]

Defender or Protector would have been better, or better no stupid name, but thats me.

Undertaker would be good. But please, no stupid names.😁

[RevolverRob]

Given the options the marketing team presented, D seems like the best choice.

A. Executioner

B. Defendant

C. Gravedigger

D. Equalizer

Executioner would have been good.

Then we just need Springfield to bring out "The Jury" - and you could walk around with packing The Judge, The Jury, and The Executioner.

[MandoWookie]

I really don't understand the wailing and gnashing over the name.
It's not a hyper aggressive one like Terminator, it follows along with what Smiths current naming convention. Is it any worse than the Python?
I guess the only thing acceptable to yall would be they go back to the obtuse 3rd gen name system, where you need a flowchart to figure out whether you are talking about a gun or the combo for someone's luggage.

[Wonder9]

Except for the name, I can't find any downsides. The fact it uses the Shield Plus magazine is awesome.

[krav51]

I really don't understand the wailing and gnashing over the name.
It's not a hyper aggressive one like Terminator, it follows along with what Smiths current naming convention. Is it any worse than the Python?
I guess the only thing acceptable to yall would be they go back to the obtuse 3rd gen name system, where you need a flowchart to figure out whether you are talking about a gun or the combo for someone's luggage.

I'm with you, couldn't care less about the name, a jury of non gun people deciding whether or not you acted in self defense might however. Worse name since the persuader.

[Hambo]

I really don't understand the wailing and gnashing over the name.
It's not a hyper aggressive one like Terminator, it follows along with what Smiths current naming convention. Is it any worse than the Python?
I guess the only thing acceptable to yall would be they go back to the obtuse 3rd gen name system, where you need a flowchart to figure out whether you are talking about a gun or the combo for someone's luggage.

Great quote. :cool:

I shot an EZ, and I liked it. Not enough to buy it, but it wasn't as bad as I expected. I watched the videos, and I won't buy one of these either, but these are my thoughts:

-If you think the name is a liability (and it could be), look at those forward serrations. :eek: Back in the day I knew of someone who amputated a finger while disassembling a loaded chamber Glock. He was an idiot, but S&W is saying, "Grab those serrations and reload! If you lose a finger tip, you've got nine more."

-Safety/no-safety. Because SIG320, I want something that will definitely stop a fully tensioned striker.

-Equalizer. It's better than Streetsweeper. Maybe S&W will pony up for Denzel and the old English guy to be part of the ad campaign. But I won't be the guy answering this: "So, Mr Hambo, I see that you carry an Equalizer pistol..."

[LockedBreech]

I really don't understand the wailing and gnashing over the name.
It's not a hyper aggressive one like Terminator, it follows along with what Smiths current naming convention. Is it any worse than the Python?
I guess the only thing acceptable to yall would be they go back to the obtuse 3rd gen name system, where you need a flowchart to figure out whether you are talking about a gun or the combo for someone's luggage.

First off, the "flowchart" for 3rd-Gen Smiths made me laugh. Spot on.

I don't like Equalizer for the same reason I didn't like that god-awful Hornady "Zombie Defense" or "Zombie Max" JHP ammo, or the Taurus Judge. It has connotations that might be uncomfortable in the context of being examined by prosecutors or juries. I know that the internet tends to dismiss that concern as a made-up creation of Fudds, and honestly, I used to agree. Then I was a junior prosecutor with less than a year under my belt listening to the senior two prosecutors in the office discuss the fact that a gun used in a recent shooting had a "Punisher" backplate. Was it dispositive or the focus of the case? No, but it was examined and weighed and was not inconsequential. And I was in a heavily pro-gun jurisdiction. I imagine that conversation in the offices of a DA's office in California or New York would probably have been quite a bit more animated.

Something like "Python" is menacing, but it's just an animal. Equalizer, Judge, those sort of names imply a grudge, a score that needs settled, or a verdict being delivered. Things like the Zombie Max ammo and the Hi-Point "Yeet Cannon" suggest guns are a toy and not serious. I wouldn't want a jury hearing that from a hostile prosecutor if I was the one who did the self-defense shooting.

Sorry for the wall of text, just wanted to explain that my dislike of the name went beyond something simple like cringe factor. I think it's perfectly possible to have a cool gun name that isn't so heavily loaded (Beretta Centurion, Wilson Combat CQB, etc.)

[MandoWookie]

I'm with you, couldn't care less about the name, a jury of non gun people deciding whether or not you acted in self defense might however. Worse name since the persuader.

Maybe I'm just obtuse, but I'm just not seeing Equalizer in the same level as Terminator, Executioner, or even Judge.

Maybe it's because it's an extension of the EZ line, we're it is marketed to demos that otherwise be physically compromised compared to the average, so it makes sense from that perspective.

Also because 'Equalizer' or some similar variation goes all the way back to the Colt 1873 and various guns since.

And Smith hasn't exactly had the best track record with names. I mean, Ladysmith? Chiefs Special?



....Sigma?

[krav51]

Maybe I'm just obtuse, but I'm just not seeing Equalizer in the same level as Terminator, Executioner, or even Judge.

Maybe it's because it's an extension of the EZ line, we're it is marketed to demos that otherwise be physically compromised compared to the average, so it makes sense from that perspective.

Also because 'Equalizer' or some similar variation goes all the way back to the Colt 1873 and various guns since.

And Smith hasn't exactly had the best track record with names. I mean, Ladysmith? Chiefs Special?



....Sigma?

again ,im in agreement . but think about how a progressive DA could spin that to a jury of non gun people. " ladies and gentleman ,the defendant could have bought any one of hundreds of models of pistols but he chose the Eeeequalizer" ,what "inequity" was he planning on righting when he made his choice? His choice showed he wanted nothing more than to be a vigilante . blah blah..." why even give them the opportunity to use that in a criminal proceeding, let alone a civil one. Things are hard enough for the good guys already .

[jh9]

3rd gen flow chart. Geez.

Code wheel. It was a code wheel.

https://cdn0.thetruthaboutguns.com/wp-content/uploads/2021/01/Whiz-Wheel-6.jpg

[Lex Luthier]

Considering how many older African-American, Asian and elderly folks in MN were buying up EZ series pistols since the COVID pandemic hit,
they could have stolen a march on the political hipsters by calling it the "Equity Officer's Model".

Maybe I'm a bit feverish at present, but I think that might have been a brilliant prank on S & W's part.

(Maybe Gen 2.0 can have a sleeker, better looking slide with just those words engraved. Something that looks more like a 1st Gen P99 or a CZ 75. And a dull lavender or sage green poly frame.)

[Half Moon]

3rd gen flow chart. Geez.

Code wheel. It was a code wheel.

https://cdn0.thetruthaboutguns.com/wp-content/uploads/2021/01/Whiz-Wheel-6.jpg

96968

Ah, yes, the 3913 was the Sphexi, Humming Gizzy, Spemin of Ladysmith's if there ever was one...

[willie]

All jokes aside, I suggest this name: "Big Mama".

[star-dot-star]

Springfield can officially let out a sigh of relief. Grip Zone is cool now.

[GearFondler]

Springfield can officially let out a sigh of relief. Grip Zone is cool now.You have to wonder if Equalizer was in response to Springfield's stupidly named Hell Cat since that's the direct competition along with the P365.

[SwampDweller]

The shop I work at will not be purchasing any of these. The name combined with being released purposefully on Election Day is bad form, and that is not the name of a defensive firearm you would want brought up in a courtroom. Shame, because a double stack EZ is a good idea. As a matter of fact, any other S&W pistols besides the EZ’s do not sell and just sit on the shelf, they sell horribly to the point where we are clearancing out all S&W pistols and do not plan on buying any more besides the EZs. The .30 Super Carry was a joke. And for selling so few S&W pistols, we sure get a lot of customers coming back with RMA’s (in proportion to sales). I like their revolvers and carry a 642 as a BUG, but I have never been impressed with their semi auto pistols.

They should’ve just called it the EZ+ and followed the same naming convention.

[Lex Luthier]

The shop I work at will not be purchasing any of these. The name combined with being released purposefully on Election Day is bad form, and that is not the name of a defensive firearm you would want brought up in a courtroom. Shame, because a double stack EZ is a good idea. As a matter of fact, any other S&W pistols besides the EZ’s do not sell and just sit on the shelf, they sell horribly to the point where we are clearancing out all S&W pistols and do not plan on buying any more besides the EZs. The .30 Super Carry was a joke. And for selling so few S&W pistols, we sure get a lot of customers coming back with RMA’s (in proportion to sales). I like their revolvers and carry a 642 as a BUG, but I have never been impressed with their semi auto pistols.

They should’ve just called it the EZ+ and followed the same naming convention.

That is all interesting stuff, SwampDweller. Do you mind saying where this shop is located?

[Bucky]

You have to wonder if Equalizer was in response to Springfield's stupidly named Hell Cat since that's the direct competition along with the P365.

Well, if they were looking to up the “Hellcat”, “Demon” or “Redeye” was the next logical choice. ;)

[GearFondler]

Well, if they were looking to up the “Hellcat”, “Demon” or “Redeye” was the next logical choice. ;)Or The Exorcist... That could really be dramatic in court.

[SwampDweller]

That is all interesting stuff, SwampDweller. Do you mind saying where this shop is located?

I would rather not for privacy reasons, but it’s on the gulf coast. That combined with my name might give you an idea.

[Wonder9]

The shop I work at will not be purchasing any of these. The name combined with being released purposefully on Election Day is bad form, and that is not the name of a defensive firearm you would want brought up in a courtroom.

97064

[ranger]

15 pages of discussion yet seems like essentially no one has actually shot one

[JAH 3rd]

On YouTube, scootch00 reviews the S&W Equalizer. First review I've seen.


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ltLVC78_zHM

[Lex Luthier]

Jerry Miculek did a release video, too.


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Gev1Toor8xE

Apparently it takes Shield Plus magazines.

[BobM]

I shot an EZ 9mm a couple months ago. It seemed to have promise as an “old man gun” I might need later in life. The fact that the new gun takes Shield Plus mags makes me happy as I already have quite a few of those. But that name though…

[HCM]

You have to wonder if Equalizer was in response to Springfield's stupidly named Hell Cat since that's the direct competition along with the P365.


Geezer gun named after action geezer - if “The Equalizer” makes you think Denzel Washington or Queen Latifah this gun is not for you.

97125

[Caballoflaco]

Geezer gun named after action geezer - if “The Equalizer” makes you think Denzel Washington or Queen Latifah this gun is not for you.

97125

Took me a second to figure out what was going on with his grip there.

[Crow Hunter]

Took me a second to figure out what was going on with his grip there.

Years ago I had a buddy that came over to try out some handguns before he bought one for himself. He held a Sig P232 like that before I could stop him and sliced his thumb nearly to the bone with the slide. Lots of blood.

Needless to say, he didn't buy one for himself. I think he wound up going with a revolver instead.

Since then, when letting people shoot my guns, I look at their grip before I give them anything loaded no matter what their professed experience with handguns is.

[frozentundra]

I'm really glad S&W is continuing with the developmental trajectory of the EZ concept! The target market is under-served.

HOWEVER, I can't believe they managed to get a decent Holosun K series compatible footprint on the EZ guns before sorting out the footprint on the 9mm Shield guns. The 9mm Shield is rotten garbage in terms of optic footprint.

Shame! Contemptible! (Turns head and spits)

[willie]

My shop has two in stock. The larger grip allowed me to fumble less with the grip safety. I had owned an EZ pistol. Smith should have omitted one of the safeties, probably the grip safety.

[medmo]

Took me a second to figure out what was going on with his grip there.

Right? Plus he has his left booger hook safety on the trigger. ;)

We can put a man on the moon, are getting ready to do it again in a more gender ambiguous way, but S&W cannot put a real life functional thumb safety on a Shield. It's a strange world.

[BillSWPA]

I would be interested in how the recoil compares to the .380 and 9mm EZ. Some comments in other threads indicated that increasing the caliber to 9mm effectively removed the easy part. I know people with hand or wrist issues who might find the felt recoil important.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[Rotundra]

I'm really glad S&W is continuing with the developmental trajectory of the EZ concept! The target market is under-served.

HOWEVER, I can't believe they managed to get a decent Holosun K series compatible footprint on the EZ guns before sorting out the footprint on the 9mm Shield guns. The 9mm Shield is rotten garbage in terms of optic footprint.

Shame! Contemptible! (Turns head and spits)

I thought S&W mentioned that the shield plus 9mm would start to mimic the .30 Super, and adapt the K series footprint going forward.

I haven’t been able to find out when/if that occurred….

[Wooosh]

I've noticed that the Equalizer has a redesigned breech face/block shape after comparing it to the EZ 9. The breech faces for the Equalizer and EZ are casted separately from the slide (probably to save on machining time and cost). The big difference being that EZ breech face incorporates a loaded-chamber indicator while the Equalizer does not. This original breech face design did not cause any trouble in the lower-pressure .380 version, but there have been numerous reports where the breech face on 9mm version had cracked.

http://smith-wessonforum.com/smith-wesson-m-p-pistols/640083-psa-check-your-shield-ez-cracks-breech-face.html

I think the original EZ 9's breech face with the loaded-chamber indicator is structurally weak since the design was originally meant for only .380. The Equalizer breech face has more material that isn't omitted for a loaded-chamber indicator and therefore shouldn't crack from the pressure from 9mm. I hope S&W would eventually incorporate the Equalizer breech face design to the EZ series, but I don't think they will since the .380 version still suffers from its stovepipe-inducing magazine design, something that was fixed in the EZ 9 but was never incorporated to the EZ 380. There is also that sketchy EZ drop safety where the firing pin block is actuated by the grip safety and not the trigger.

[Evil_Ed]

I mentioned this in a couple of other threads, but the Equalizer has the same external dimensions (within a few hundredths) as an old Colt 1903/1908 Pocket Hammerless...except that it's wider by an appreciable amount, with the factory short flush mag. So for those looking for a coat pocket-able automatic, who don't want to spend a lot of money for a 100 year old sub-caliber non-drop-safe example...this could be "the thing". I'm super tempted to get one...and if my inner hipster is being honest, I really want them to make a 30 Super Carry version of it.

[TheNewbie]

I've noticed that the Equalizer has a redesigned breech face/block shape after comparing it to the EZ 9. The breech faces for the Equalizer and EZ are casted separately from the slide (probably to save on machining time and cost). The big difference being that EZ breech face incorporates a loaded-chamber indicator while the Equalizer does not. This original breech face design did not cause any trouble in the lower-pressure .380 version, but there have been numerous reports where the breech face on 9mm version had cracked.

http://smith-wessonforum.com/smith-wesson-m-p-pistols/640083-psa-check-your-shield-ez-cracks-breech-face.html

I think the original EZ 9's breech face with the loaded-chamber indicator is structurally weak since the design was originally meant for only .380. The Equalizer breech face has more material that isn't omitted for a loaded-chamber indicator and therefore shouldn't crack from the pressure from 9mm. I hope S&W would eventually incorporate the Equalizer breech face design to the EZ series, but I don't think they will since the .380 version still suffers from its stovepipe-inducing magazine design, something that was fixed in the EZ 9 but was never incorporated to the EZ 380. There is also that sketchy EZ drop safety where the firing pin block is actuated by the grip safety and not the trigger.


There is an issue with the .380 magazines?

[Wooosh]

There is an issue with the .380 magazines?

From what I've seen and heard, it looks like some of the .380 magazines will induce stovepipes. I think it is due to poor quality control where some of the magazine lips are too far part and out of spec. There have been people who remedied this by roughening the surface of the follower with skateboard tape or sandpaper.

http://smith-wessonforum.com/smith-wesson-m-p-pistols/665292-380-ez-stovepipe-resolution.html

Plenty of people have suggested that all of these failures can be attributed to user error since this gun is marketed to beginners after all. This makes sense, but this wouldn't explain all of the problems people have been reporting, and there's even a hickock45 video where he gets a stovepipe failure with the EZ 380. In contrast, the 9mm EZs don't seem to suffer from this problem. The guns have great potential, so I only wish for S&W to stop using their customers as guinea pigs.

[willie]

Long ago S&W could have saved money and credibility if they had consulted with known pistol smiths. The late Irv Stone, Sr is an example. He pulled Ruger out of the ditch with one of their pistol designs. Another example of a company that should have brought in handgun consultants is FN. Instead they must have used the "committee method".

[Lex Luthier]

Got a chance to handle an Equalizer at the local LGS. It had the 15 rd magazine in place, and seemed a bit long in the grip. Also, it was easy to induce front-to rear movement via the grip sleeve. I was able to compare & contrast with a Shield EZ in .30 Super Carry. I found the grips quite similar between the two, though the grip safety on the .30 SC EZ was a bit less obtrusive.
I look forward to renting one of each and seeing how they shake out especially the Equalizer using a 13 rd mag so the grip comparison is more apples-to-apples.

(I did make my standard observation that S & W should have named the gun “The Alte Kacker”, and only the
middle-aged Viet counter jockey got it. The upper Midwest can be an odd place.)

[GlockenSpiel]

I've been kicking around the idea of a redundant safety featured slim doublestack 9 gun for appendix carry, and this thing with the safety actually felt really good to me. I have super long fingers, and if I ride the safety the p365 is a complete no-go. I thought about a shield with Unk's safety, but the barrel is a little short for me, and its optics cut seems to be in flux right now.

The Equalizer's proportions are more like a 1911 in that I can ride the safety and curl the tip of my thumb down to prevent me from hitting the slide release. That might actually be a benefit over no safety; when I shoot the tiny guns I often don't have a place to put it where it won't touch the slide or the tip of my trigger finger as it wraps around the trigger. I haven't found one to shoot yet, but handling them I'm not seeing an obvious protuberance that would smoke my hand.

I'm trying to think if this is violating my wait-one-year rule for guns, as it's really just a mashup of two other guns. That and I haven't found pictures showing the stock sights can actually usably cowitness through an optic.

Sent from my SM-G781V using Tapatalk

[TheNewbie]

I've been kicking around the idea of a redundant safety featured slim doublestack 9 gun for appendix carry, and this thing with the safety actually felt really good to me. I have super long fingers, and if I ride the safety the p365 is a complete no-go. I thought about a shield with Unk's safety, but the barrel is a little short for me, and its optics cut seems to be in flux right now.

The Equalizer's proportions are more like a 1911 in that I can ride the safety and curl the tip of my thumb down to prevent me from hitting the slide release. That might actually be a benefit over no safety; when I shoot the tiny guns I often don't have a place to put it where it won't touch the slide or the tip of my trigger finger as it wraps around the trigger. I haven't found one to shoot yet, but handling them I'm not seeing an obvious protuberance that would smoke my hand.

I'm trying to think if this is violating my wait-one-year rule for guns, as it's really just a mashup of two other guns. That and I haven't found pictures showing the stock sights can actually usably cowitness through an optic.

Sent from my SM-G781V using Tapatalk


Other than the astronomically absurd name, there is a lot to like about this pistol. A full sized version as a poor man’s poly 2011 would be cool.

[GlockenSpiel]

I don't fully get the fuss about the name. A little dumb, but people act like it's the same as getting an "executioner" gun. I just don't see that any more than getting a shield makes you a vigilante cop wannabe.

This at 9:30 or so is the best I've found in re the cowitness, and the footage is pretty out of focus. I think 3 dot is actually pretty ideal for BUIS, but the stock ones seem really low?

https://youtu.be/9Ffj3ZSJu7U

Sent from my SM-G781V using Tapatalk

[Lex Luthier]

Via Tamara ‘s blog, a review of the Equalizer by our own beloved Mas

https://www.ontargetmagazine.com/2023/07/the-equalizer/

Honestly, his take on the name and reactions to it make me feel a bit silly about my earlier stance. Should I obtain one or more, I will have the slides marked “alte kaker”, though.

[TheNewbie]

Via Tamara ‘s blog, a review of the Equalizer by our own beloved Mas

https://www.ontargetmagazine.com/2023/07/the-equalizer/

Honestly, his take on the name and reactions to it make me feel a bit silly about my earlier stance. Should I obtain one or more, I will have the slides marked “alte kaker”, though.


Kind have the same thoughts as you. It would be silly to let that name get in the way of an otherwise good setup.


This gun, with the TS and Grip safety, would probably make me feel safe carrying AIWB.

[HeavyDuty]

Kind have the same thoughts as you. It would be silly to let that name get in the way of an otherwise good setup.


This gun, with the TS and Grip safety, would probably make me feel safe carrying AIWB.

I agree.

[GearFondler]

It's probably time to add "Equalizer" to the thread title just for Search and clarity's sake.

[Lex Luthier]

So, one Sunday I went to the rental range...

...and rented an Equalizer.
this company tends to clean their rental fleet well; it was just dirty enough to tell me that it gets shot a lot. Ammunition was S & B 115 grn fmj ball. It had the standard 3 dot sights they ship with.
It was equipped with a 15 rd magazine.
My main takeaways were that the front to rear distance on the grip was quite comfortable for my hand size with a surprisingly narrow width for a double stack, and the grip safety* was positive and easy to keep in place while still gripping pretty high.
Also, the trigger, while not amazing, was quite good compared to other striker fired pistols in it's price point. The fact that this example sees a lot of use at a busy suburban range tells me a lot.
It was probably just sub 5 lbs and had a light but tactile reset; I agree with Mas 's take on the trigger. Recoil was quite manageable. I did have one stovepipe on the last round in the magazine. I only loaded 10 at a time.

Good practice habits, a Holosun sealed emitter RDS and a couple of cases of practice ammunition ought to make this a totally viable CCW option.

As for me, wow have I become awful with lack of recency, poor habits, and too little dry fire. Or maybe I ought to spring for a box of HSTs. Heh, yeah, that's it...


*this particular one had no thumb safety.

[GlockenSpiel]

Repeating the request to add "Equalizer" to the thread title, as this is by far the biggest topic on the gun.

I got one and I think it's S&W's best carry option. I see it as the polymer subcompact-ish 1911 equivalent. I had only handled one before buying, but when I handled them I thought that the grip safety was unobtrusive and the manual safety was in a good spot for riding with my thumb, even for my very long fingers. The grip is long enough you can just barely get some pinky on it, it being the same as the Shield grips. That does make the grip slightly long for just a 10-round magazine, a trait it shares with the shield pluses. You are therefore looking at a grip that's a bit longer, but much thinner, than a Glock 26, but also a bit longer than a P365. I will say the magazines are a bit easier to load than I was expecting (it does come with a mag loader, but even considering that it was not too tight), and it was easy to chamber a round off of a full mag, which is not always the case with a P365 in my experience.

A lot has been said about the grip safety, but I really have not noticed it through handling or shooting it. I could see some people having issues if it interacted with their hand under recoil, but not at all for me. I don't see anyone having issues deactivating it though, as any pressure at all seems to work. You would basically need to be clamping just from the sides and not pressing the grip safety at all for it not to work.

I'm able to get a solid grip with my thumb on the manual safety even for single-handed firing. In fact, this particular manual safety helps me by providing a place for me to lock in my long thumbs without interfering with the slide stop or my long trigger finger extending through the trigger guard. It is positive to click on and off and does not hit my knuckle or anything like that. Riding the thumb safety does not interfere with proper pressing of the grip safety.

The ease of overall use was what stood out to me. The slide release works out of the box and is not too stiff to work like other small guns. The trigger is light and just slightly creepy but not bad. The reset is tactile and audible though both are a bit soft. The fact that you basically start the pull right on the wall obviates any concerns about the reset to me, as you just let it out and it's ready to go, there's no pre-wall slop to get lost in, so you can't reset the trigger too far. The smooth trigger face is very nice and enhances the experience of shooting a small gun.

Recoil is very mild, which the internal hammer might contribute to but the decently long slide definitely does. The slide sits lower in your hand than a shield, and the gun lacks the top-heavy short chubby gun syndrome that a lot of subcompacts do. I shot a few hundred rounds of various 115 and 124 ball through it on my first outing without any issues. The accuracy so far for me is between my Glock 19 and my Glock 43, which checks out with the size being between those. The trigger reach is slightly shorter than I am used to so I am working out how to place my trigger finger for best accuracy. Grip texture is pretty aggressive, probably not as much as original M&P 2.0 but should be enough for most people. It is fine and sharp enough that the gun already has sunscreen and the hand dry stuff that I use stuck in it, and presumably will forever at this point, unless I attack it with a toothbrush. No issues with slippage or blistering though.

Overall this fulfills my desire for a very compact, reliable gun that takes a red dot without modification, has a high quality CCW-appropriate finish, has additional safety features for appendix carry, and is pleasant enough to shoot for extended range sessions. I have a JMCK holster on the way, and will probably get an EPS Carry as soon as I decide on dot size.

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[GlockenSpiel]

Doing defensive carry ammo testing today, no issues with 147 hst with fully stuffed mags. Took some Hilton Yam inspiration and tried firing a round off a fully loaded mag plus 1, then dropping the mag and loading to capacity again, as I figure that first round with super tight mags is probably the most challenging. Again, no failures yet.

Almost forgot to take pictures, so here's my last group of the day, 15 rounds of the hst left-handed at 15 yards. I was doing similarly right-handed which is kind of funny. If this is 4" then I'm a little off my goal of 10 shots at 25yd in the black on a b8, which is 5.5" IIRC.
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[GlockenSpiel]

Still going strong, Denzela has earned some fancy accessories. Will do some vetting on those before she takes over primary carry gun duties. 109570109569

[pi3]

From what I've seen and heard, it looks like some of the .380 magazines will induce stovepipes. I think it is due to poor quality control where some of the magazine lips are too far part and out of spec. There have been people who remedied this by roughening the surface of the follower with skateboard tape or sandpaper.

http://smith-wessonforum.com/smith-wesson-m-p-pistols/665292-380-ez-stovepipe-resolution.html

Plenty of people have suggested that all of these failures can be attributed to user error since this gun is marketed to beginners after all. This makes sense, but this wouldn't explain all of the problems people have been reporting, and there's even a hickock45 video where he gets a stovepipe failure with the EZ 380. In contrast, the 9mm EZs don't seem to suffer from this problem. The guns have great potential, so I only wish for S&W to stop using their customers as guinea pigs.

I wonder if there will be a .380 equalizer at some point? I rented the single stack EZs in both 9 and .380. Anyone having trouble racking a slide seems like would also have trouble dealing with how snappy the 9 is.

[frozentundra]

Still going strong, Denzela has earned some fancy accessories. Will do some vetting on those before she takes over primary carry gun duties. 109570109569

Wondering how this gun has performed for you over the last 6 months?

I've been very tempted to pick one up. Been thinking about putting a full size EPS on one if backup sight are still usable. How is the backup sight picture with the EPS carry?

[frozentundra]

I had to pick one of these up to try out. First impressions: to me, its form factor seems quite a bit more like the M&P .22 Compact than a doublestack M&P, with a slightly different grip angle. Its a little bit wider than the .22, with the grip feeling larger mainly in the frontsrap to backstrap dimension. This produces just enough space to get my support hand in good contact with the grip frame. I can't get nearly as much support hand contact on the factory P365 series frames.

The trigger reach is notably shorter feeling than a doublestack M&P. A lot shorter feeling.

I asked to try the controls on both copies that the store had in stock before I purchased. The one I bought had a somewhat cleaner and firmer safety than the copy I didn't select. The other one had a little more play in the detent position, which was noticable when going back and forth between them, so I'm glad I shopped in person and was able to select from multiple copies. The safety is much "snappier" and more positive than on my Gen 1 M&P compact, which takes less force and is somewhat mushy by comparison. It also takes more force to operate than the M&P .22 compact I have. I would say it's the best thumb safety on any polymer gun I've ever handled. Although, the levers are just slightly smaller than the M&P compact.

This thing that really surprises me the most is that, for me, it points much more like the Sig P365 than an M&P doublestack or .22 compact. The P365 indexes quite a bit lower for me than a M&P. Enough that it's annoying to switch between them. When I do presentations with the various pistols, the Equilizer naturally indexes just like the P365 with my default grip. When I switch over to the M&P, and try to perform the same index, I'll tend to have the front sight present way too high. This actually works out for me because the small version of the P365 is my go-to tiny gun for distance running and maximum concealment. I think I may be able to switch back and forth between the Equalizer and Sig much more seamlessly than an M&P.

If one was buying an Equalizer as a smaller understudy for an M&P doublestack, I would try to get hands-on with one and pay particular attention to how they index on presentation of the pistol. For me, the Equalizer points much more like the Sig than the M&P. Conversely, if you are into the p365 guns, the Equalizer may point naturally for you. At least that's how it works out for me.

Some comparison pictures with the .22 compact and M&P Gen 1 Compact (Gen 1 is on the bottom). It's hard to tell, but the grip angle feels different to me on the Equalizer.

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[frozentundra]

This gun has been working extremely well for us. I think Smith hit a home run here.

The most pleasant surprise to me has been reliability testing. It has never malfunctioned in any regard. I've tried to "limp wrist" it as severely as possible without dropping the gun. As close as I can get to free recoil, it still cycles. It is my habit to break in a gun with at least a few hundred rounds of reasonably warm ammo and then see how it tolerates this kind of treatment. This Equalizer has performed as good or better than any gun I can recall, which is impressive for a small, lightweight pistol. This is confidence inspiring to me. It will occasionally eject some empty brass back toward my daughter's head with Blazer Brass 115, but it seems not to do it with 147 Lawman or HST so far. It cycles 147 HST well. We will keep an eye on this.

My daughter is able to shoot it more accurately than our M&P 2.0 Compact 4", even though it does have somewhat more recoil. We think a lot of this is simply due to the much shorter trigger reach and overall ergonomics; it just fits her small hands better in every regard. The slide is remarkably easier to rack and lock back administratively compared to any 9mm I've handled. We haven't been practicing much at all in the last couple years, but she is able to keep rounds inside a paper plate while doing walk-back drills out past 25 meters. I know this isn't very impressive by pistol-forum standards, but considering the lack of practice, I'll take it. We usually use 4x4" colored post-it notes as repair centers on cardboard backers. She has no trouble wearing these out at 10-15 yards or with faster spits at 5 yards.

I really like the thumb safety and grip safety combination for range work. I think it adds extra layers of holstering safety. When you train to put thumb to back of slide, like when using a SCD or thumbing a hammer, it disengages the grip safety. We work out of the holster for 100% of our range time, so I like it for this purpose.



This gun has earned itself a RDS. Looking hard at a full size 6MOA EPS for our application. Does anyone know if that would be a drop-in fit with no adapter on the Equalizer? I think it should be, but not 100% sure. Any other suggestions for RDS to consider? Our application is learning to use a red dot sight with shootability being the main concern over concealabiity. I think Holosun also has an enclosed K footprint SCS with auto adjust, and it looks like Sig just released a new enclosed optic that may fit this footprint and has some decent features. But am I correct in assuming that the EPS will be noticeably larger and somewhat more forgiving about finding/tracking the dot? GJM wondering if you think the EPS would be the best optic for my daughter to learn on with this optic footprint?

[pi3]

It's probably time to add "Equalizer" to the thread title just for Search and clarity's sake.

I rented one. The top of the backstrap safety needs to go higher. It was ok at first, but after 50 or so rounds the top end of the safety started to get uncomfortable. Waiting for a 2.0.

[Elwin]

I rented one. The top of the backstrap safety needs to go higher. It was ok at first, but after 50 or so rounds the top end of the safety started to get uncomfortable. Waiting for a 2.0.

Something some judicious use of an abrasive could fix?

[TheNewbie]

JAH 3rd mentioned in another thread about issues with the EZ SHIELD in 9mm having incidents of cracking at the breech face due to being chambered in 9mm. A quick google search did show this happening, but I’m not sure how prevalent this is.



Would the Equalizer potentially suffer the same issue? Is it just a double stack EZ Shield or has the slide been “beefed up”?

[GlockenSpiel]

There was a post about the breech block design in post 159 in this thread from Wooosh. Basically the EZ has an excessively large portion of the breech cut away for the large loaded chamber indicator, which the Equalizer lacks. I guess only time will tell, but I haven't heard about the issue in the Equalizers. Mine is still going strong.

[frozentundra]

Quick update-

We are somewhere around 1000 rounds on ours now, but haven't kept an exact round count. We shoot drills together simultaneously on a line, and pull ammo out of the same boxes, so it's hard to keep an exact log.

Love this little gun! It's been absolutely great so far. It has yet to malfunction in any way. Today was the first time I did any cleaning or lubrication. I was curious and wanted to test function under sub-optimal maintenance conditions, but I was starting to feel guilty, so I quickly wiped it down with a paper towel, picked the crud off the feed ramp, and lightly lubed with Slip 2000 EWL.

This gun has very mild recoil with PMC Bronze 115. Even though this is very mild ammo, and the gun was reasonably dirty, my daughter had no problems with function while shooting it one hand only quite a bit today. It always cycled and locked back on an empty magazine without fail one handed. It does have some occasional erratic ejection pattern under these circumstances, but function has been 100 percent.

This is my daughter's favorite 9mm pistol of all time. She has small hands, and trigger reach can be an issue. We have a decent sample of doublestack 9mm Glocks, M&Ps, Sig P365s, have had a 9mm Shield 1.0, and a few other odds and ends through the years. She was remarking today that this is the 9mm pistol she feels the most comfortable, consistent and confident with. I saw a few great big smiles today as she realized she's found a gun that actually fits her better than anything we've tried so far.

She beat me on a couple walk-back drills today. We were shooting 4x4" post-it notes. We simultaneously draw from the holster and fire one shot. Start at 7 yards and take two paces back after every round. The first one to miss the target while the other person hits is the loser. I was shooting a P365 with 12 round mag extension and she had the Equalizer. She won two out of 4 of these walk-back drills. I have never been so happy to get my butt kicked in a shooting exercise! I think the closest drill terminated at about 13 yards and the farthest one we got closer to 20 yards.

We both find the gun to be a joy to shoot with PMC Bronze 115. Neither of us have any trouble with the grip safety or thumb safety in terms of comfort or function.

If it proves durable, and remains reliable, this is easily one of my favorite gun purchases ever. Highly recommend taking a look at this for people who struggle with trigger reach. It's a really interesting ratio of size/width/weight/capacity/recoil/trigger reach. The trigger reach is really short, but it still has decent space for support hand grip.