Dan Wesson Specialist 9mm Review and Impressions

[Sensei]

So, my never ending quest to find a reliable 9mm 1911 has taken a new turn. My search for this white whale has previously led me to disappointments with Colt’s CCU and various Wilson offerings. In fact only, the Wilson EDC X9 series has been sufficiently reliable to carry.

Hence, I decided to auction one of my kid’s kidneys (the other will probably be up on organbroker.com next week) to buy this:

96483

Total cost on GB after fees and shipping was a tad over $1800. It shipped new, inbox, with 2 10-round mags that were strikingly similar to my Cobramags.

Fit and Finish B+
This gun approaches the fit/finish of my Wilson’s and Springfield Pros (A-). The slide to frame fit is nowhere near as tight as as a Les Baer or Pro; it is almost identical to an Ed Brown. The interior of the slide has an etched serial number.

96488
96489


The safeties have no play with the thumb safety being very crisp. Grip has very aggressive texture and the front are 25 lpi. The finish reminds me of Wilson’s; time will tell how it holds up. The mag well is noice and seems well fit but not perfectly blended like my Wilson’s or Pros. I’d prefer not to have front cocking serrations but like the single notched rail.

96486

The barrel/bushing/slide fit is tight and approaches my Pros and Baers. The barrel crown is recessed and blended perfectly to the bushing. The barrel has a feed ramp which should fell with reliability. I suspect that much of my Colt CcU’s reliability issues came from the barrel lacking this feature.

96487

Trigger A-
Crisp 4.3 lbs with very little grit and take-up before the wall. Reset is very positive.

Reliability B+
DW recommends a 300-round break-in with ball ammo and cleaning after every 50 rounds. I put 50 rounds of 124 grain AE though it today with a mixture of factory, Tripp Cobra, Wilson ETM, and Wilson Vickers mags. No failures. The reason for only a B+ is that the cleaning after every 50 rounds is obnoxious. The grade may improve with time. Semi-custom manufacturers often test fire in the factory which earns the A at this point. Tomorrow, I will clean and repeat the 50 round with a 10-8 extractor test.

[TC215]

Reliability B+
DW recommends a 300-round break-in with ball ammo and cleaning after every 50 rounds. I put 50 rounds of 124 grain AE though it today with a mixture of factory, Tripp Cobra, Wilson ETM, and Wilson Vickers mags. No failures. The reason for only a B+ is that the cleaning after every 50 rounds is obnoxious. The grade may improve with time. Semi-custom manufacturers often test fire in the factory which earns the A at this point. Tomorrow, I will clean and repeat the 50 round with a 10-8 extractor test.

I get wanting to follow the instructions, but with my 21 Dan Wessons, I put FP-10 on the rails every 100 rounds or so for the first few hundred rounds and never had any issues. Hope you like the new gun.

[Sensei]

I get wanting to follow the instructions, but with my 21 Dan Wessons, I put FP-10 on the rails every 100 rounds or so for the first few hundred rounds and never had any issues. Hope you like the new gun.

My trials with 9mm 1911s make what Job endured seem like Disneyland. Thus, I’m going to follow the manufacturer’s instructions EXACTLY so that I know I’ve done my part of this gun shits the bed on quality JHPs.

[TC215]

My trials with 9mm 1911s make what Job endured seem like Disneyland. Thus, I’m going to follow the manufacturer’s instructions EXACTLY so that I know I’ve done my part of this gun shits the bed on quality JHPs.

Understood. I had far, far better luck with my 9mm DW's than I did with my 9mm Wilsons.

FWIW, my DW's seemed to like 124gr Gold Dots and HSTs, and 135gr Hornady.

[Sensei]

Understood. I had far, far better luck with my 9mm DW's than I did with my 9mm Wilsons.

FWIW, my DW's seemed to like 124gr Gold Dots and HSTs, and 135gr Hornady.

I’m liking that. 147 gr HST is my preferred round. GDHP at 124 or 147 are a close second.

[TOTS]

I get wanting to follow the instructions, but with my 21 Dan Wessons, I put FP-10 on the rails every 100 rounds or so for the first few hundred rounds and never had any issues. Hope you like the new gun.
Agreed; my Dan Wesson break in procedures include reloading the magazines every ten rnds and adding oil on each range trip (or not 🤷*).

[Ichiban]

I get wanting to follow the instructions, but with my 21 Dan Wessons, I put FP-10 on the rails every 100 rounds or so for the first few hundred rounds and never had any issues. Hope you like the new gun.

Okay, I'm officially jealous. :)

I have had about half that many but usually ran around 200 round per range session when new with no problems. 9mm, 45acp, same same. But then, I tend to clean and lube my guns after every range session.

Gotta say that I think highly of Dan Wessons.

[TC215]

Okay, I'm officially jealous. :)

I have had about half that many but usually ran around 200 round per range session when new with no problems. 9mm, 45acp, same same. But then, I tend to clean and lube my guns after every range session.

Gotta say that I think highly of Dan Wessons.

I’m down to just one. I switched to a Glock agency and got rid of almost all of my 1911’s. I do miss them, though.

[Sensei]

100 more rounds today. First, I performed an extractor tension test by sliding an empty casing under the extractor to make sure that it’s held firm in place when the slide is shaken. It held firm.

Next up was the 10-8 extractor test using 124 grain AE. This is where single rounds are fired without a magazine so that there is minimal support of the case on extraction; 8 are fired 2-handed then 8-single handed. Did great on the first 8 rounds 2-hand grip. It stove piped the last round (#8) on the one handed grip. I cycled another entire test and it did fine on all 16 rounds. All spent brass ejected between 2-4 o’clock. I’m going to give this a pass overall.

I finished up that box firing a DW mags. The only other issue was a failure to lock the slide back on an empty DW mag at around the 95-round mark. This was likely caused by my aggressive, thumbs-forward grip and occasional happens on other 1912 and non-1911 platforms.

After a quick wipe down and relube, I fired 50 rounds of 124 gr Speer Lawman using a mixture of mags. No issues.

So, we are now at 150 rounds. No feeding or extraction issues when using a magazine. 1 stove-pipe out of 24 rounds fired on 10-8 extractor testing.

Overall reliability grade still a B+.

[stinx]

be careful what you use to clean the gun if it has DW duty finish. Read the manual about what cleaners to use The finish is very abrasion resistant, but some cleaners will cause it to become cloudy and distorted. They recommend Kroil. YMMV

[Sensei]

be careful what you use to clean the gun if it has DW duty finish. Read the manual about what cleaners to use The finish is very abrasion resistant, but some cleaners will cause it to become cloudy and distorted. They recommend Kroil. YMMV

I saw that before I bought the gun. Basically, people need to stay away from Breakfree CLP. My cleaning so far has been a wipe down with a rag followed re-lube with Wilson’s oil / Ultima-lube or Weapon Shield. It seems like Weapon Shield, FP-10, Militec are all good to go.

[the Schwartz]

I saw that before I bought the gun. Basically, people need to stay away from Breakfree CLP. My cleaning so far has been a wipe down with a rag followed re-lube with Wilson’s oil / Ultima-lube or Weapon Shield. It seems like Weapon Shield, FP-10, Militec are all good to go.

I don't follow...

Will BreakFree CLP damage the Specialist's finish?

[Sensei]

I don't follow...

Will BreakFree CLP damage the Specialist's finish?

Supposedly. Although discolor is probably a better term than damage. The DW manual states the following in regards to cleaning supplies, “High-quality cleaning solvent (barrel only). Solvents can discolor your Duty Finish. Kroil is also recommended and Duty Finish safe. Oil based cleaner (polymer safe) for the rest of the gun. High-quality gun oil *such as FP-10, Militec-1 or Dan Wesson Rail Lube. We do not recommend the use of Rem oil, CLP or Hoppe’s elite gun oil on the rails of our firearms.”

There is some online debate about BreakFree’s safety, but enough posted pictures of discolored finishes that I’m inclined to stay away since DW specifically mentions it.

[the Schwartz]

Supposedly. Although discolor is probably a better term than damage. The DW manual states the following in regards to cleaning supplies, “High-quality cleaning solvent (barrel only). Solvents can discolor your Duty Finish. Kroil is also recommended and Duty Finish safe. Oil based cleaner (polymer safe) for the rest of the gun. High-quality gun oil *such as FP-10, Militec-1 or Dan Wesson Rail Lube. We do not recommend the use of Rem oil, CLP or Hoppe’s elite gun oil on the rails of our firearms.”

There is some online debate about BreakFree’s safety, but enough posted pictures of discolored finishes that I’m inclined to stay away since DW specifically mentions it.

Thanks.

I'd always wondered about the resistance/durability of such coatings on high end 1911s like that.

[Trooper224]

Thanks.

I'd always wondered about the resistance/durability of such coatings on high end 1911s like that.

It doesn't damage the finish, it just discolors it. I use Ballistol without issue and any run of the mill bore cleaner.

For lubrication I use this......
96542

[the Schwartz]

It doesn't damage the finish, it just discolors it.

I'd beg to differ.

In addition to providing resistance to wear and corrosion, the function of a firearm's finish is aesthetic so discoloration is arguably damage―especially in the realm of high-end 1911s that involve an investment of $2,000 - $5,500...or more.

[Trooper224]

I'd beg to differ.

In addition to providing resistance to wear and corrosion, the function of a firearm's finish is aesthetic so discoloration is arguably damage―especially in the realm of high-end 1911s that involve an investment of $2,000 - $5,500...or more.

Okay Captain Semantics, you can have that one. :)

[the Schwartz]

Okay Captain Semantics, you can have that one. :)

Gee, I'm honored. What do I win? :cool:

Words have meanings. Often, those meanings are very important.

[David S.]

A P-F dollar. ;)

[Sensei]

Let’s add another 100 rounds of Federal 124 grain AE to the break-in today. 1 mag (10 rounds) were fired 2 handed, another mag was fired strong hand. The other 80 rounds were virtually all Mozambique Drill. There were no feeding or extraction issues. There were 2 instances where the slide didn’t lock back on the last round during my series of Mozambique Drills. I loaded each mag with only three rounds so there were about 26 slide lock events and only 2 of those were failures. As state before, these slide lock failures are probably induced by my grip. Tomorrow, I plan to test this theory by shooting 100 rounds of Mozambique using only strong and weak hand grips.

Otherwise, the gun is running great. I’ve been cleaning everything but the bore every 50 rounds (I’m leaving the bore alone for the first 500 rounds) per Dan Wesson recommendations. The slide has become noticeably less tight and easier to rack, but there is absolutely no wobble in any parts.

Still very pleased with this gun. Reliability is still a B+ after 250 rounds. Tomorrow I plan to shoot another 50 rounds of AE to finish the break-in. Assuming that goes well, I’ll shoot 50 rounds of 147 gr HST.

[Sensei]

150 more rounds of 124 grain AE and 50 rounds of 147 grain HST. Lots of FAST drills and some timed 6-plate rack, so plenty of opportunities for reloads. No feeding or extraction issues. There were 3 instances where the slide dropped when an empty mag was ejected and 1 instance of failure of the slide to lock back on an empty mag. 2 of the instances of the slide dropping occurred with Wilson Vickers mags; the other with a Tripp Cobra. I do not recall what mag was involved in the failure to lock back. All of these slide issues occurred during timed drills.

It’s not uncommon for me to have my support hand muck with the side stop lever. The slide dropping with mag release is fairly uncommon for me though. I inspected the lever and there is no abnormal wear. The mags did not appear to be dirty or weak sprung. So, it’s very possible that it was my support hand getting a little sloppy.

Still, I’m encouraged by the results so far. I’m coming up on 500 rounds with no major feeding or extraction issues despite introducing some JHP ammo to the diet.

[Ichiban]

150 more rounds of 124 grain AE and 50 rounds of 147 grain HST. Lots of FAST drills and some timed 6-plate rack, so plenty of opportunities for reloads. No feeding or extraction issues. There were 3 instances where the slide dropped when an empty mag was ejected and 1 instance of failure of the slide to lock back on an empty mag. 2 of the instances of the slide dropping occurred with Wilson Vickers mags; the other with a Tripp Cobra. I do not recall what mag was involved in the failure to lock back. All of these slide issues occurred during timed drills.

It’s not uncommon for me to have my support hand muck with the side stop lever. The slide dropping with mag release is fairly uncommon for me though. I inspected the lever and there is no abnormal wear. The mags did not appear to be dirty or weak sprung. So, it’s very possible that it was my support hand getting a little sloppy.

Still, I’m encouraged by the results so far. I’m coming up on 500 rounds with no major feeding or extraction issues despite introducing some JHP ammo to the diet.

I have had magazines that didn't properly engage the slide stop with the cutout in the frame. Just barely making contact and when the magazine was dropped it would slip out of the cutout. Might have been a weak spring in the magazine or the shape of the follower. It has been a while so I really don't remember the manufacture but I didn't keep them.

[Sensei]

Round count totals: 450

50 Rounds Federal 147 grain HST
50 Rounds Speer 124 grain Lawman
350 Rounds Federal 124 grain AE

FTF 0
FTE 1 on 10-8 Extractor Test (one handed); 0 with mag

Slide Lock Failures: 5 Likely shooter induced.

Reliability grade B (need more JHP rounds to make an A)

[Sensei]

A couple of illustrations as to why the fit and finish are a B+ and not an A. Here are 3 magwells. The top is a Springfield Professional Operator, middle is my Colt CCU cost mixed by Wilson, and the bottom is the specialist. Notice the blending of the magwell into the frame on the top 2 whereas the Specialist has a shelf. That shelf is noticeable on fast reloads. Then, there are sharp corners on the frame’s magazine relief cut that are circled red. Those are rounded on both the Pro and CCU.

97134

Small details like this move from the B+ to A- range at the cost of $500-1000.

[Polecat]

I loved my DW ECO, factory 2.75 Lbs. trigger, one hole accuracy at 10-15 yards, just unreal. Can’t wait for a DWX!

[Sensei]

Wiped down the gun one last time before going to the range. Then, I put 50 more rounds of 124 grain AE and 20 rounds of 147 grain HST. All rounds were fired either strong or weak hand only (50:50 split) with the mags only loaded with 5 rounds at a time. No failures of any kind using a mixture of Cobra, Vickers, ETM, and DW mags. This would strongly suggest that my slide lock/release issues were shooter-induced.

We are now up to 520 round (450 ball; 70 HST). It is now officially broken-in and the action is much smother (Berettaesque) than when I took it out of the box. No unusual finish wear after hundreds of holster presentations. I’m bumping the reliability grade back up to a B+. Accuracy is still excellent and on par with my other semi-custom 1911s. It still needs another 100 rounds of flawless HST before I’ll carry it.

[Sensei]

Another 50 rounds of 124 grain AE without issue. Total round count is as follows:
570 total rounds
-500 124 grain Federal AE
-50 124 grain Speer Lawman
-70 147 grain Federal HST

FTF 0
FTE 1 on 10-8 extractor test; 0 with magazine

I plan on replenishing my supply of HST soon and will try and get some more JHP ammo through it. In the meantime, I plan to get 200-300 more rounds of 124 grain FMJ through it using all factory parts.

Along those lines, I’m probably going to go ahead and order a variety pack of recoil springs from Wolfe. The factory recoil spring is supposedly 10lbs which may be a little light for the 147 grain HST which seems to run just a tad bit hotter than the 124 grain AE. My customized Colt CCU in 9mm really ran better with heavy spring weights and even needed a 14lb to prevent feeding issues when using JHP.

[TOTS]

Another 50 rounds of 124 grain AE without issue. Total round count is as follows:


Along those lines, I’m probably going to go ahead and order a variety pack of recoil springs from Wolfe. The factory recoil spring is supposedly 10lbs which may be a little light for the 147 grain HST which seems to run just a tad bit hotter than the 124 grain AE. My customized Colt CCU in 9mm really ran better with heavy spring weights and even needed a 14lb to prevent feeding issues when using JHP.
Just passing this along. Joe Chambers recommended Sprinco springs in 13 lb for the 5in 1911s in 9mm. I found the factory 10 lbs to be sluggish but reliable on my similar Valor. Changing to the 13lb er, I’m very happy with it.

https://sprinco-com.3dcartstores.com/Tactical-Springs-1911-Chrome-Silicon-Moly-Plated-Cryogenic-Processed-Recoil-Spring--13-Color-Coded-PINK_p_687.html

[Sensei]

Thanks TOTS. I have typically relied on Wolff for all my spring needs and don’t have any experience with Springco. I’m not opposed to giving them a try though if the forum consensus is positive.

I’ll probably get a variety pack of springs between 11-14 pounds and see which runs best with 147 grain HST and 124 grain AE. Hopefully that weight range is close enough to factory spect that I won’t need to change the mainspring.

My observation with the 10lb is similar to yours - feels a bit weak/sluggish but has performed pretty good with standard pressure 9mm in the mid-weight range. In a full-size, all steel 1911, I bet the 10lb is probably perfect for standard pressure 115 grain and light hand loads, while 14lb is best for higher pressure NATO spec and hot +P loads. Everything in between is reasonable for standard pressure defensive and most +P loads.

[Sensei]

50 more rounds of 124 grain AE. No failures. All rounds fired through Wilson black ETM 10-round mags.

Now, we are up to 670 rounds.
-550 with 124 grain AE
-50 with 124 grain Lawman
-70 with 147 grain HST

Malfunctions to date: FTF 0; FTE 1 during 10-8 extractor test, 0 during regular fire.

I’m liking this gun so much that I’ve started stalking 9mm DW Guardians on Gunbroker…

[TC215]

50 more rounds of 124 grain AE. No failures. All rounds fired through Wilson black ETM 10-round mags.

Now, we are up to 670 rounds.
-550 with 124 grain AE
-50 with 124 grain Lawman
-70 with 147 grain HST

Malfunctions to date: FTF 0; FTE 1 during 10-8 extractor test, 0 during regular fire.

I’m liking this gun so much that I’ve started stalking 9mm DW Guardians on Gunbroker…

My favorite gun of all time, more than the Wilsons, Browns, etc.

I’ve had several, but have been without one for some time. I bought one recently because of this thread. :rolleyes:

[gtmtnbiker98]

50 more rounds of 124 grain AE. No failures. All rounds fired through Wilson black ETM 10-round mags.

Now, we are up to 670 rounds.
-550 with 124 grain AE
-50 with 124 grain Lawman
-70 with 147 grain HST

Malfunctions to date: FTF 0; FTE 1 during 10-8 extractor test, 0 during regular fire.

I’m liking this gun so much that I’ve started stalking 9mm DW Guardians on Gunbroker…

Check out the ECP or TCP for that matter, I own the TCP in 9mm and it's as reliable as my Specialist 9mm. Plus, you gain the benefit of the 15,000 round rated flat wire recoil spring.

[Sensei]

I considered the ECP and TCP but prefer a standard bushing system on a 4.25” 1911 chambered in 9mm.

[TC215]

I considered the ECP and TCP but prefer a standard bushing system on a 4.25” 1911 chambered in 9mm.

Took mine to the range a bit ago and put 100 rounds through it (50 124 gr and 50 147gr). They made some changes to the Guardian in 2020, so it’s different than my previous guns, but I like it fine.



https://i.imgur.com/iyN4dXZ.jpg

[Sensei]

Took mine to the range a bit ago and put 100 rounds through it (50 124 gr and 50 147gr). They made some changes to the Guardian in 2020, so it’s different than my previous guns, but I like it fine.



https://i.imgur.com/iyN4dXZ.jpg

You see, now when my wife storms into the house and demands to know what I did with my day, I can reply that I inspired great men to do great things. ;)

Nice that yours cycles 147 grain ball. I’ve steered away from that weight in FMJ due to the flat profile tip. One of my 9mm 1911s doesn’t like it.

BTW, nice grips. VZ? What’s the pattern?

[TC215]

You see, now when my wife storms into the house and demands to know what I did with my day, I can reply that I inspired great men to do great things. ;)

Nice that yours cycles 147 grain ball. I’ve steered away from that weight in FMJ due to the flat profile tip. One of my 9mm 1911s doesn’t like it.

BTW, nice grips. VZ? What’s the pattern?

In the past, I never shot 147gr through my 9mm 1911’s, but I have plenty of it now since that’s what we use at work. I’m glad the gun ran well with it.

I bought this one used off Gunbroker, and the previous owner put those grips on it. I think they might be VZ Aliens but I’m not positive.

[Sensei]

Went ahead and snagged a Guardian in 9mm from GB. Fit and finish on par with my 2 Specialists. Accuracy was excellent with my first 50 rounds of 124 grain AE. It passed the 10-8 extractor test and cycled every round without failure through a mixture of DW factory 9-round, Wilson ETM 10-round, and Vickers 10-round mags. Next up with be Tripp Cobra mags.

[Trooper224]

I want a Vigil Commander in 9mm, in the worst way.

[TC215]

Went ahead and snagged a Guardian in 9mm from GB. Fit and finish on par with my 2 Specialists. Accuracy was excellent with my first 50 rounds of 124 grain AE. It passed the 10-8 extractor test and cycled every round without failure through a mixture of DW factory 9-round, Wilson ETM 10-round, and Vickers 10-round mags. Next up with be Tripp Cobra mags.

Awesome. What year was it built?

[TOTS]

I want a Vigil Commander in 9mm, in the worst way.
I’m still kicking myself for not getting one while they were still making them. I held out as I’m telling myself to wait until DW or the like make factory optics ready options.

[Trooper224]

I’m still kicking myself for not getting one while they were still making them. I held out as I’m telling myself to wait until DW or the like make factory optics ready options.

I kept putting it in the "eventually" category. Then, they dropped the model, the the Corona panic hit.........

[Sensei]

Awesome. What year was it built?

It was purchased as “used” but unfired old stock. It was $450 less than current retail. SN suggests made within past 2 years.

98887

This is the gun after I fired the first 50 rounds. Although probably unnecessary, I follow DW’s recommended break-in of cleaning after every 50 rounds for the first 300 rounds of ball. My luck with semi-custom 9mm 1911s has been so bad that I consider this ritual to be my penance to the Reliability Gods.

[TC215]

It was purchased as “used” but unfired old stock. It was $450 less than current retail. SN suggests made within past 2 years.

98887

This is the gun after I fired the first 50 rounds. Although probably unnecessary, I follow DW’s recommended break-in of cleaning after every 50 rounds for the first 300 rounds of ball. My luck with semi-custom 9mm 1911s has been so bad that I consider this ritual to be my penance to the Reliability Gods.

Nice. DW made some changes in the 2020+ models, but the only thing I miss is the old slide stop. They also changed the shape of the bobtail, which I assume was to stop paying Ed Brown money.

[45dotACP]

It was purchased as “used” but unfired old stock. It was $450 less than current retail. SN suggests made within past 2 years.

98887

This is the gun after I fired the first 50 rounds. Although probably unnecessary, I follow DW’s recommended break-in of cleaning after every 50 rounds for the first 300 rounds of ball. My luck with semi-custom 9mm 1911s has been so bad that I consider this ritual to be my penance to the Reliability Gods.Your finding a 9mm 1911 that's reliable for you is the Christmas miracle we've all been waiting for [emoji1787]

Sent from my SM-A326U using Tapatalk

[Sensei]

50 more rounds of Federal 124 grain AE through the Specialist and Guardian. Both guns fired with a variety of mags including factory DW, Tripp Cobra, and Wilson ETM. That puts the round counts at:

Specialist - 720
-600 with 124 grain AE
-50 with 124 grain Lawman
-70 with 147 grain HST
-Malfunctions to date: FTF 0; FTE 1 during 10-8 extractor test, 0 during regular fire.

Guardian - 100
-100 with 124 grain AE
-Malfunctions to date: FTF 0; FTE 0; passed 10-8 extractor test on first try

[TC215]

50 more rounds of Federal 124 grain AE through the Specialist and Guardian. Both guns fired with a variety of mags including factory DW, Tripp Cobra, and Wilson ETM. That puts the round counts at:

Specialist - 720
-600 with 124 grain AE
-50 with 124 grain Lawman
-70 with 147 grain HST
-Malfunctions to date: FTF 0; FTE 1 during 10-8 extractor test, 0 during regular fire.

Guardian - 100
-100 with 124 grain AE
-Malfunctions to date: FTF 0; FTE 0; passed 10-8 extractor test on first try


How do you feel like they compare to your Wilsons at this point?

[Sensei]

How do you feel like they compare to your Wilsons at this point?

The Specialist has been a bit more reliable than my CQB Elite. However, the CQB Elite is more customized in terms of fit/features and now runs fine once the slide stop lever and barrel link were replaced.

The real problem child of my 9mm 1911 stable was a Colt CCU 9mm that needed an entirely new slide from Colt (took 6 months) and a host of work from Wilson. What finally got that gun reliable with most ball and 147 grain HST in certain magazines was a 14 lb recoil spring. It still will not cycle certain JHPs such as 147 grain Speer GDHP from Tripp mags. However, the Colt doesn’t have a ramped barrel which may have a lot to do with its reliability issues.

If I could d it all over again, I definitely would have passed on the Colt CCU. If DW made a full-size, 9mm 1911 such as a Valor, then I would go with that over the Wilson CQB Elite and save some cash.

[Wake27]

The Specialist has been a bit more reliable than my CQB Elite. However, the CQB Elite is more customized in terms of fit/features and now runs fine once the slide stop lever and barrel link were replaced.

The real problem child of my 9mm 1911 stable was a Colt CCU 9mm that needed an entirely new slide from Colt (took 6 months) and a host of work from Wilson. What finally got that gun reliable with most ball and 147 grain HST in certain magazines was a 14 lb recoil spring. It still will not cycle certain JHPs such as 147 grain Speer GDHP from Tripp mags. However, the Colt doesn’t have a ramped barrel which may have a lot to do with its reliability issues.

If I could d it all over again, I definitely would have passed on the Colt CCU. If DW made a full-size, 9mm 1911 such as a Valor, then I would go with that over the Wilson CQB Elite and save some cash.

I think I remember that mess from years ago.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk Pro

[TOTS]

The Specialist has been a bit more reliable than my CQB Elite. However, the CQB Elite is more customized in terms of fit/features and now runs fine once the slide stop lever and barrel link were replaced.


If I could d it all over again, I definitely would have passed on the Colt CCU. If DW made a full-size, 9mm 1911 such as a Valor, then I would go with that over the Wilson CQB Elite and save some cash.
99174

Kinda like this one?

[Sensei]

Kinda like this one?

Yep. Hopefully they will someday bring back the 9mm Valor.

Also, 50 more rounds of 124 grain Federal AE through the Guardian without a malfunction today. I’m up to 150 rounds. The volume is slow through that gun because I’ve made several 9mm purchases that are all getting vetted over the next 2-3 months. I hope to have 1-2K through each before spring.

[David S.]

Other than the front cocking serrations and magwell, what’s the difference between a Valor and Specialist?

[TOTS]

Yep. Hopefully they will someday bring back the 9mm Valor.

Also, 50 more rounds of 124 grain Federal AE through the Guardian without a malfunction today. I’m up to 150 rounds. The volume is slow through that gun because I’ve made several 9mm purchases that are all getting vetted over the next 2-3 months. I hope to have 1-2K through each before spring.
Expect that DW to be boring. The Valor above has over 7K on it with nothing but a spring change. I can count the malfunctions with a couple of fingers.

[FrankB]

Christmas brought a third Dan Wesson, and a Chris Reeve Large Sebenza 31. The DW was purchased a month ago, and has been perfect so far. I clean my 1911’s and revolvers after even a few rounds, and I use Lucas Extreme Oil. DW recommends Lucas, and even includes a goofy packet of the stuff.

99181

[gtmtnbiker98]

I also use Lucas Extreme on my fleet of Dan Wessons. I've actually resorted to carrying a VBOB in .45 off duty.

[Cheap Shot]

Christmas brought a third Dan Wesson, and a Chris Reeve Large Sebenza 31. The DW was purchased a month ago, and has been perfect so far. I clean my 1911’s and revolvers after even a few rounds, and I use Lucas Extreme Oil. DW recommends Lucas, and even includes a goofy packet of the stuff.

99181

Congrats. Apologies for a stupid question but which DW model is that and what are the specs? (New ? Used? 9mm, 45?) Dont tease me like this! :o Looks beautiful. I sold my valor and have been regretting it ever since.

Very interested in range report and opinion. TIA

[Cheap Shot]

Guardian?
Commander Classic?

[Sensei]

Other than the front cocking serrations and magwell, what’s the difference between a Valor and Specialist?

Specialist is railed; Valor standard frame. The Valor now has a mag well (since around 2020 I think).

[FrankB]

Congrats. Apologies for a stupid question but which DW model is that and what are the specs? (New ? Used? 9mm, 45?) Dont tease me like this! :o Looks beautiful. I sold my valor and have been regretting it ever since.

Very interested in range report and opinion. TIA

I meant to include the name. It’s a new 9mm Guardian, 4.25”. 1911’s were my main carry for several years, and the Guardian has bumped the revolvers off my waist. I am still carrying a J frame in my jacket pocket.

[Sensei]

50 more rounds of 124 grain Fed AE through the Guardian using factory DW 9-round and Wilson 10-round ETM mags. No failures. I’m now up to 200 rounds w/o any malfunctions.

I have a bunch more AE and 147 grain HST arriving Saturday. I will try to put 150 more rounds of the AE through the Specialist and the Guardian this weekend. Then, I plans to switch over to the HST. I also ordered a variety pack of recoil springs from Wolff between 11-15# for the Specialist. I plan to switch out the factory 10# spring to a 12# (maybe 13 or 14 if needed) spring once I start shooting the HST. That factory 10# spring is starting to feel very light and I’m thinking that the gun will do fine with a slightly heavier spring with the hotter ammo.

[Trooper224]

50 more rounds of 124 grain Fed AE through the Guardian using factory DW 9-round and Wilson 10-round ETM mags. No failures. I’m now up to 200 rounds w/o any malfunctions.

I have a bunch more AE and 147 grain HST arriving Saturday. I will try to put 150 more rounds of the AE through the Specialist and the Guardian this weekend. Then, I plans to switch over to the HST. I also ordered a variety pack of recoil springs from Wolff between 11-15# for the Specialist. I plan to switch out the factory 10# spring to a 12# (maybe 13 or 14 if needed) spring once I start shooting the HST. That factory 10# spring is starting to feel very light and I’m thinking that the gun will do fine with a slightly heavier spring with the hotter ammo.

I went with a 14# spring in my five inch 9mm, with excellent results.

[Sensei]

I swapped out the 10# factory recoil spring in the Specialist for 12# Wolff and hit the range with some 124 grain AE and 147 grain HST. First up was the AE and had a FTF on the second round using Wilson Vickers mag. The gun cycled another 58 rounds of AE and 50 rounds of the HST (110 total today) without failure using a variety of mags including DW factory, Wilson ETM, and Tripp Cobra. Perhaps it was just the spring getting broken-in. The Guardian cycled another 50 rounds of 124 grain AE without malfunction.

That puts the round counts at:

Specialist - 830 rounds
-660 with 124 grain AE
-50 with 124 grain Lawman
-120 with 147 grain HST
-Malfunctions to date: FTF 1; FTE 1 during 10-8 extractor test, 0 during regular fire.
-New 12# recoil spring at 720 rounds

Guardian - 250
-250 with 124 grain AE
-Malfunctions to date: FTF 0; FTE 0; passed 10-8 extractor test on first try

[Sensei]

Hit the range again tonight with the Specialist and Guardian. Fired a total of 150 between the 2 guns. The Specialist got 50 more rounds of 124 gr AE and 50 rounds of 147 gr HST with a variety of 10-round mags including DW, Wilson ETM, Wilson Vickers, and Tripp Cobra. No failures.

The Guardian got another 50 rounds of 124 grain AE. I used the 2 factory 9-rounds mags for half the box and the ETMs for the other half. No failures.

I now consider the Guardian to be “broken in” and will give it one more wipe down and lube cleaning before incorporating some JHP ammo into the diet and extending the range sessions without wipe downs and lubes out to 250 rounds. It won’t be carry ready for another 700 rounds.

The Specialist is essentially good to go for carry once I cycle another 50 rounds or so of HST. I’ll give it a good detail cleaning after that next box. Will also probably keep the 12# recoil spring. Overall, this gun has impressed me.

Round Counts

Specialist - 930 rounds
-710 with 124 grain AE
-50 with 124 grain Lawman
-170 with 147 grain HST
-Malfunctions to date: FTF 1; FTE 1 during 10-8 extractor test, 0 during regular fire.
-New 12# recoil spring at 720 rounds

Guardian - 300
-300 with 124 grain AE
-Malfunctions to date: FTF 0; FTE 0; passed 10-8 extractor test on first try

[Sensei]

50 more round of 124 grain AE and 147 grain HST through both guns. No failures using a variety of mags.

Round Counts

Specialist - 1030 rounds
-760 with 124 grain AE
-50 with 124 grain Lawman
-220 with 147 grain HST
-Malfunctions to date: FTF 1; FTE 1 during 10-8 extractor test, 0 during regular fire.
-New 12# recoil spring at 720 rounds

Guardian - 400
-350 with 124 grain AE
-50 with 147 grain HST
-Malfunctions to date: FTF 0; FTE 0; passed 10-8 extractor test on first try

[Sensei]

Ran the Specialist at a local range’s qualification stage for their “Action Shooting Facility” yesterday. There were 14 targets and each required 2 hits so a total of 28 rounds were fired with 124 grain AE using only Wilson ETM magazines. I had a double feed malfunction on the 2nd reload from slide lock where the gun tried to feed 2 rounds when I sling shot the slide. The extractor never got ahold of the top round when it into the chamber, so I had to strip the magazine to clear it. This was a bit of a pain in the ass to clear due to the club’s strict rules that the muzzle never aim across the height of the berm because there are neighborhoods within 1/2 mile’s distance of the range. It got me thinking that I may need to find a new place to shoot if I’m going to undo 20+ years of muscle memory and build training scars by performing reloads and malfunction drills with the muzzle never angled up at all.

Anyway, round counts are as follows:

Specialist - 1058 rounds
-788 with 124 grain AE
-50 with 124 grain Lawman
-220 with 147 grain HST
-Malfunctions to date: FTF 2; FTE 1 during 10-8 extractor test, 0 during regular fire.
-New 12# recoil spring at 720 rounds

Guardian - 400
-350 with 124 grain AE
-50 with 147 grain HST
-Malfunctions to date: FTF 0; FTE 0; passed 10-8 extractor test on first try

[Sensei]

70 more rounds of 124 grain AE without failure through the Guardian. 50 rounds were a dot torture at 4 yards with a -1 on the left hand. Used factory 9-round w/o baseplate and Tripp Cobra 10-round mags.

Guardian - 470
-420 with 124 grain AE
-50 with 147 grain HST
-Malfunctions to date: FTF 0; FTE 0; passed 10-8 extractor test on first try

[Sensei]

50 rounds of 147 grain Federal HST through the Guardian using mostly DW factory 9-round and a 9-round Metalform magazine that I purchased. I believe that Metalform is the OEM manufacturer for DW since the logo is the only difference in the mags. There were no failures.

Guardian - 520
-420 with 124 grain AE
-100 with 147 grain HST
-Malfunctions to date: FTF 0; FTE 0; passed 10-8 extractor test on first try

[Sensei]

Hit the range with some 124 grain S&B FMJ. Brought a couple Wilson ETM mags for the Specialist and DW factory 9-round mags. No failures. Round counts are as follows:

Specialist - 1108 rounds
-788 with 124 grain AE
-50 with 124 grain Lawman
-50 with 124 grain S&B
-220 with 147 grain HST
-Malfunctions to date: FTF 2; FTE 1 during 10-8 extractor test, 0 during regular fire.
-New 12# recoil spring at 720 rounds

Guardian - 570
-420 with 124 grain AE
-50 with 124 grain S&B
-100 with 147 grain HST
-Malfunctions to date: FTF 0; FTE 0; passed 10-8 extractor test on first try

Without a doubt, the Guardian is among the most accurate pistol that I own. This target is 50 rounds of Mozambique Drill at 10 yards. The indoor range does not allow draws from a holster, so I fired them from a press-out at a comfortable pace of under 2ish seconds. Had I been shooting a Glock, I’d have at least a couple C zone (usually left error on the second torso round or a high 3rd round) hits.

107704

[Sensei]

50 more rounds of 124 grain S&B. All rounds fired with Surefire X300U-B attached. No failures with a mixture of Wilson, DW, and Tripp Cobra mags. Shot -2 on Dot Torture at 5 yards (previously cleared at 3 yards), but this was after shooting 120 rounds of 10mm and recoil differences were playing havoc with anticipation.

Specialist - 1158 rounds
-788 with 124 grain AE
-50 with 124 grain Lawman
-100 with 124 grain S&B
-220 with 147 grain HST
-Malfunctions to date: FTF 2; FTE 1 during 10-8 extractor test, 0 during regular fire.
-New 12# recoil spring at 720 rounds

[Sensei]

Brought the Guardian out to the range and fired 50 rounds of 124 grain S$B FMJ on a Dot Torture at 5 yards with a 2.5 second first-shot par time on stages with holster draws (AIWB using Dark Star Gear Apollo). Zero malfunction using Wilson ETM and Dan Wesson mags. Score -4

Round totals are as follows:

Specialist - 1158 rounds
-788 with 124 grain AE
-50 with 124 grain Lawman
-100 with 124 grain S&B
-220 with 147 grain HST
-Malfunctions to date: FTF 2; FTE 1 during 10-8 extractor test, 0 during regular fire.
-New 12# recoil spring at 720 rounds

Guardian - 620
-420 with 124 grain AE
-100 with 124 grain S&B
-100 with 147 grain HST
-Malfunctions to date: FTF 0; FTE 0; passed 10-8 extractor test on first try

[Hstanton1]

Brought the Guardian out to the range and fired 50 rounds of 124 grain S$B FMJ on a Dot Torture at 5 yards with a 2.5 second first-shot par time on stages with holster draws (AIWB using Dark Star Gear Orion). Zero malfunction using Wilson ETM and Dan Wesson mags. Score -4

Round totals are as follows:

Specialist - 1158 rounds
-788 with 124 grain AE
-50 with 124 grain Lawman
-100 with 124 grain S&B
-220 with 147 grain HST
-Malfunctions to date: FTF 2; FTE 1 during 10-8 extractor test, 0 during regular fire.
-New 12# recoil spring at 720 rounds

Guardian - 620
-420 with 124 grain AE
-100 with 124 grain S&B
-100 with 147 grain HST
-Malfunctions to date: FTF 0; FTE 0; passed 10-8 extractor test on first try[/QUOTE]

Wait- DSG makes an Orion for the 1911?

[Sensei]

Guardian - 620
-420 with 124 grain AE
-100 with 124 grain S&B
-100 with 147 grain HST
-Malfunctions to date: FTF 0; FTE 0; passed 10-8 extractor test on first try

Wait- DSG makes an Orion for the 1911?[/QUOTE]

My bad - it’s an Apollo.

113807

Technically, it is for the 2011 but fits all of my railed and non-railed 1911s.

[Elwin]

Technically, it is for the 2011 but fits all of my railed and non-railed 1911s.

That is extremely good to know. I hope Tony keeps making the 2.0 forever but this means there’s finally a backup option from a brand I really like.

Edit - I could be totally wrong, but are we sure the pictured holster is a Dark Star? It looks a bit like a JM and not like the current version of the Apollo from Dark Star’s website, at least. https://darkstargear.com/product/2011apollo/

Not trying to be a dick, thread hijack, or “um actually” anyone, just want to know what other holster options I have.

[Sensei]

That is extremely good to know. I hope Tony keeps making the 2.0 forever but this means there’s finally a backup option from a brand I really like.

Edit - I could be totally wrong, but are we sure the pictured holster is a Dark Star? It looks a bit like a JM and not like the current version of the Apollo from Dark Star’s website, at least. https://darkstargear.com/product/2011apollo/

Not trying to be a dick, thread hijack, or “um actually” anyone, just want to know what other holster options I have.

Ah shit. My bad. It is JM. I bought a bunch of Dark Star and JM holsters last year around the holidays. They all run together in my head. Here are the specs from my receipt:

Q-AIWB-WC2-5
Angular Muzzle Pad Normal (Recommended for 4” barrels and up) $15.00
Pistol 1911 5" Government w/Rail (based on Springfield Pistol)
Belt Loops 1.75" Pull-the-Dot
Carry Side Right
Color Black
Guard Full
Hole Pattern Wide (only works with “Pull-the-Dot” loops)
comments: Pistol is carried condition 1 cocked and locked with safety in the on position. Please have the sweat guard cover the safety in the on position.

[Elwin]

Ah shit. My bad. It is JM. I bought a bunch of Dark Star and JM holsters last year around the holidays. They all run together in my head.

No problem. Still curious to see if the Dark Star stuff works, but they may not since they seem to be 2011 specific.

Ideally, JM just keeps chugging along forever, because among my personal "A List" kydex shops, it's just them and Tenicor for 1911s, and the Tenicor stuff isn't Enigma compatible (though the Velo is currently my favorite AIWB belt holster).

[Sensei]

Took the Guardian for a 50 round spin with 147 grain Federal HST. There was 1 FTF midway through the box caused by a round nose-diving in the magazine using a DW flush fit 9-round magazine. The gun cycled fine for the other 49 rounds using the same magazine and a 10-round Vickers ETM.

Round totals are as follows:

Specialist - 1158 rounds
-788 with 124 grain AE
-50 with 124 grain Lawman
-100 with 124 grain S&B
-220 with 147 grain HST
-Malfunctions to date: FTF 2; FTE 1 during 10-8 extractor test, 0 during regular fire.
-New 12# recoil spring at 720 rounds

Guardian - 670
-420 with 124 grain AE
-100 with 124 grain S&B
-150 with 147 grain HST
-Malfunctions to date: FTF 1; FTE 0; passed 10-8 extractor test on first try

[Sensei]

Another 25 rounds of 124 grain S&B FMJ with the Guardian fired exclusively through a factory 9-round magazine. No failures.

Round totals are as follows:

Specialist - 1158 rounds
-788 with 124 grain AE
-50 with 124 grain Lawman
-100 with 124 grain S&B
-220 with 147 grain HST
-Malfunctions to date: FTF 2; FTE 1 during 10-8 extractor test, 0 during regular fire.
-New 12# recoil spring at 720 rounds

Guardian - 695
-420 with 124 grain AE
-125 with 124 grain S&B
-150 with 147 grain HST
-Malfunctions to date: FTF 1; FTE 0; passed 10-8 extractor test on first try

[Sensei]

50 more rounds through the specialist with 124 grain SB FMJ. No failures using Wilson ETM mags.

Round totals are as follows:

Specialist - 1208 rounds
-788 with 124 grain AE
-50 with 124 grain Lawman
-150 with 124 grain S&B
-220 with 147 grain HST
-Malfunctions to date: FTF 2; FTE 1 during 10-8 extractor test, 0 during regular fire.
-New 12# recoil spring at 720 rounds

Guardian - 695
-420 with 124 grain AE
-125 with 124 grain S&B
-150 with 147 grain HST
-Malfunctions to date: FTF 1; FTE 0; passed 10-8 extractor test on first try

[Bucky]

For those testing this platform, is anyone testing an emergency/slide lock reload?

[Robinson]

For those testing this platform, is anyone testing an emergency/slide lock reload?

By "this platform" do you mean Dan Wesson 9mm 1911s specifically? Or 9mm 1911s in general?

Slide lock reload as in what pretty much everyone always does when practicing/training?

I perform slide lock reloads with my WC 9mm all the time and haven't had any issues, but I'm not sure that helps with your question.

[gtmtnbiker98]

For those testing this platform, is anyone testing an emergency/slide lock reload?

Are you looking for issues with stoppages related to using the slide release as opposed to sling shot? I have north of 8,000 rounds through my Specialist 9mm using ETM magazines, not a single issue with the gun. I use my non-dominant hand to release the slide release on reloads.

My TCP 9mm has periodic magazine induced stoppages when performing reloads with the slide release. I use the sling shot method with the TCP.

[TOTS]

Same. Over 7K rnds through my 9mm Valor using a combination of ETM and the two factory CM mags. No bobbles using the slide release with my off hand thumb or dominant thumb.

[Bucky]

By "this platform" do you mean Dan Wesson 9mm 1911s specifically? Or 9mm 1911s in general?

Slide lock reload as in what pretty much everyone always does when practicing/training?

I perform slide lock reloads with my WC 9mm all the time and haven't had any issues, but I'm not sure that helps with your question.

Specifically single stack 9mm 1911s.

Do you use the slide stop to release the slide? That is the method I use. Also, the issue seems to show itself more likely during a match. I guess under the stress of the timer, I’m probably inserting the magazine a little more aggressively. Still, it’s only the 9 mm 1911 that shows any issues. I owned four different brands, somewhere better than the others, but even the best occasionally show the issue. I’ve also borrowed others and I’ve had the same problem. I typically use my .40 now, with downloaded ammo. No issues.

[Bucky]

Are you looking for issues with stoppages related to using the slide release as opposed to sling shot? I have north of 8,000 rounds through my Specialist 9mm using ETM magazines, not a single issue with the gun. I use my non-dominant hand to release the slide release on reloads.

My TCP 9mm has periodic magazine induced stoppages when performing reloads with the slide release. I use the sling shot method with the TCP.

Slide stop. I can see where slingshot would give it a better release on the platform.

[Robinson]

Specifically single stack 9mm 1911s.

Do you use the slide stop to release the slide? That is the method I use. Also, the issue seems to show itself more likely during a match. I guess under the stress of the timer, I’m probably inserting the magazine a little more aggressively. Still, it’s only the 9 mm 1911 that shows any issues. I owned four different brands, somewhere better than the others, but even the best occasionally show the issue. I’ve also borrowed others and I’ve had the same problem. I typically use my .40 now, with downloaded ammo. No issues.

Ah. Yes I release the slide using my support hand thumb. I've had no problems at all doing it that way, but then I'm still under 1000 rounds with the WC 9mm so it's just getting started.

[TC215]

I sold almost all of my 1911’s off about 5 years ago, but I’ve really been missing them lately. Just bought a brand new 9mm Guardian and put 150 rounds through it today (100 rounds of 147 grain Lawman and 50 rounds of 147 grain Winchester Ranger).

The good:

- Ran great, good ejection.
- Sights were right on. I used to have to put a taller front sight (.180) on all my Guardians because they shot high. Looks like they finally got that fixed.

The bad:

- the slide will not lock back on an empty magazine. When I tried it manually, I could see the slide stop was just barely engaging the notch in the slide. The slide stop has to be physically forced up into the notch.
- the magazine won’t eject most of the time.
- the thumb safety is pretty stiff/gritty when disengaging.

I’m pretty disappointed. I’ve already submitted a warranty claim.


https://i.imgur.com/eYsiiPz.jpg

[Sensei]

I would disassemble it, clean it, reassemble with generous lube, and try 50 rounds with other mags before sending it back.

[TC215]

I would disassemble it, clean it, reassemble with generous lube, and try 50 rounds with other mags before sending it back.

Unfortunately I sold off all my 9mm 1911 mags :rolleyes:. I may be able to find some to borrow.

I think this is Dan Wesson number 24 or 25 for me, and these are the most significant issues I’ve ever had, by far.

[gtmtnbiker98]

I sold almost all of my 1911’s off about 5 years ago, but I’ve really been missing them lately. Just bought a brand new 9mm Guardian and put 150 rounds through it today (100 rounds of 147 grain Lawman and 50 rounds of 147 grain Winchester Ranger).

The good:

- Ran great, good ejection.
- Sights were right on. I used to have to put a taller front sight (.180) on all my Guardians because they shot high. Looks like they finally got that fixed.

The bad:

- the slide will not lock back on an empty magazine. When I tried it manually, I could see the slide stop was just barely engaging the notch in the slide. The slide stop has to be physically forced up into the notch.
- the magazine won’t eject most of the time.
- the thumb safety is pretty stiff/gritty when disengaging.

I’m pretty disappointed. I’ve already submitted a warranty claim.


https://i.imgur.com/eYsiiPz.jpg

If you are using DW OEM magazines, those are the problem. I had the same failures to lock back and terrible follower bind with the slide catch. The follower bind was so bad that it locked the gun up. I switched to Wilson ETM’s, no issues since.

[TC215]

If you are using DW OEM magazines, those are the problem. I had the same failures to lock back and terrible follower bind with the slide catch. The follower bind was so bad that it locked the gun up. I switched to Wilson ETM’s, no issues since.

Interesting. I’ve never had issues with the OEM magazines, but I know they’ve changed a lot of things in the last few years that I got away from 1911’s. I’m going to see if I can come up with some more mags in the next day or two.

I’m really kicking myself for selling all my 9mm magazines, I should have know I’d be back eventually. :rolleyes:

[TC215]

If you are using DW OEM magazines, those are the problem. I had the same failures to lock back and terrible follower bind with the slide catch. The follower bind was so bad that it locked the gun up. I switched to Wilson ETM’s, no issues since.

I just found a 9mm ETM in the back of my safe that I forgot I had. It won’t even seat in the gun. It’s like it starts to engage the mag catch, but not fully.

[TC215]

I just borrowed three other magazines from a friend (DW OEM and Metalform) and none of them engaged the slide stop at all. It was like there no magazine in the gun when I cycled the slide.

[Amp]

A friend was having similar issues with his new DW 9mm. He lightly polished the side of the slide stop that makes contact with the plunger and the issue went away.

[TC215]

I sold almost all of my 1911’s off about 5 years ago, but I’ve really been missing them lately. Just bought a brand new 9mm Guardian and put 150 rounds through it today (100 rounds of 147 grain Lawman and 50 rounds of 147 grain Winchester Ranger).

The good:

- Ran great, good ejection.
- Sights were right on. I used to have to put a taller front sight (.180) on all my Guardians because they shot high. Looks like they finally got that fixed.

The bad:

- the slide will not lock back on an empty magazine. When I tried it manually, I could see the slide stop was just barely engaging the notch in the slide. The slide stop has to be physically forced up into the notch.
- the magazine won’t eject most of the time.
- the thumb safety is pretty stiff/gritty when disengaging.

I’m pretty disappointed. I’ve already submitted a warranty claim.


https://i.imgur.com/eYsiiPz.jpg


I just borrowed three other magazines from a friend (DW OEM and Metalform) and none of them engaged the slide stop at all. It was like there no magazine in the gun when I cycled the slide.

Update—

My Guardian came back from CZ a few days ago. They included a note saying they worked on the slide stop and thumb safety. They also included a CZ Law Enforcement and Military Division challenge coin, which I thought was nice.

I took it to the range and shot it this afternoon. Imagine my surprise when the slide didn’t lock back on the first magazine. I cycled the slide several times and the slide stop never moved. I then switched to the other magazine, which did engage the slide stop.

The thumb safety is still incredibly stiff.

I’m going to borrow some more 9mm magazines to see if they’ll engage the slide stop.

Between this and my frustrating experience with my new 632UC, I’m about over buying new guns for awhile.

[TC215]

Update—

My Guardian came back from CZ a few days ago. They included a note saying they worked on the slide stop and thumb safety. They also included a CZ Law Enforcement and Military Division challenge coin, which I thought was nice.

I took it to the range and shot it this afternoon. Imagine my surprise when the slide didn’t lock back on the first magazine. I cycled the slide several times and the slide stop never moved. I then switched to the other magazine, which did engage the slide stop.

The thumb safety is still incredibly stiff.

I’m going to borrow some more 9mm magazines to see if they’ll engage the slide stop.

Between this and my frustrating experience with my new 632UC, I’m about over buying new guns for awhile.

I sent my Guardian back to CZ last weekend. Multiple CS reps, as well as the gunsmith, reached out to me. They really seem like they want to make it right, so hopefully it comes back good to go.

[TC215]

I sent my Guardian back to CZ last weekend. Multiple CS reps, as well as the gunsmith, reached out to me. They really seem like they want to make it right, so hopefully it comes back good to go.

Got my Guardian back last week and shot it. It’s now going back for the third time. :rolleyes: They told me if they couldn’t get it fixed this time, they’d be replacing it.

[Redhat]

Got my Guardian back last week and shot it. It’s now going back for the third time. :rolleyes: They told me if they couldn’t get it fixed this time, they’d be replacing it.

Makes you wonder what exactly these folks do when they say they "tested" it. And I'm not just talking about CZ.

[G19Fan]

Update—

My Guardian came back from CZ a few days ago. They included a note saying they worked on the slide stop and thumb safety. They also included a CZ Law Enforcement and Military Division challenge coin, which I thought was nice.

I took it to the range and shot it this afternoon. Imagine my surprise when the slide didn’t lock back on the first magazine. I cycled the slide several times and the slide stop never moved. I then switched to the other magazine, which did engage the slide stop.

The thumb safety is still incredibly stiff.

I’m going to borrow some more 9mm magazines to see if they’ll engage the slide stop.

Between this and my frustrating experience with my new 632UC, I’m about over buying new guns for awhile.

Feels like new gun quality has def gone downhill

[CSW]

Carried the Guardian all week.
Finish was not effected by my toxic acid sweat.
Forgot how easy a bob is to conceal.

[Sensei]

What follows is a lesson of cation and guide for those wanting to cut their 1911/2011 slide for a plate system (Atlas, Agency, Nighthawk IOS).

I sent the Specialist slide off to a relatively local shop (near Greensboro, NC) the specializes in optics cuts, and offers the Atlas Gunworks Optics Plate cut. They had generally good reviews on the 1911-specific forums, but it was an overall poor experience for me. I chose this cut and shop because they offered to DLC the ENTIRE slide and cut the optic for $211. Naturally, what sounds too good to be true is just that. The stripped slide arrived at the shop just after the first of the year. In mid-Feb, they called me to say that the cut was complete, but their DLC subcontractor had ditched them. I gave them another 8 weeks to get the slide DLC’ed from an alternative sub-contractor, but eventually had to demand that they return my slide back with a bare cut, or I’d report the slide as stolen. Needless to say, there were multiple unanswered emails, calls, and texts in that 8 weeks, and I can definitely say that there are no shops in the Greensboro Triad, NC region that I’d trust to perform an optics cut, and especially an Atlas cut (this shop still advertises DLC despite telling me that they can’t do it).

Aaaanyway, I got a local shop to cover the bare cut in Cerakote while leaving the rest of the slide in DW’s Duty Treat (basically a nitride from what I can tell) for $30 to give that area a little more corrosion protection since I live in a VERY humid environment. This is the slide with DW Duty Finish exterior except for the cut which is covered in Cerakote:
132213

Notice the firing pin stop plate - one of the little nuggets of knowledge that comes with fucking with your slide. A standard, rounded plate will not work since enough slide material is removed that a standard plate will protrude above an optics plate. I ordered an Atlas flat firing pin stop and it slid in snugly without the need for fitting and didn’t interfere with the pate. Atlas ships their plates with tiny hex head screws - this is fucking retarded. It is hard to not strip a tiny hex head when torquing more than ~10 in-lbs; take your time. Here is the Atlas ACRO plate minus the back-up rear (I’m not sold on the necessity of a backup rear and the Atlas is tall):
132214

The gun looks pretty sharp. I plan to function check it with the plate only (slide weighs about 3/4 oz less than before the cut) and make sure that it goes bang. Provided that it reasonably cycles, I’ll then 242 Loctite and witness mark the screw. I think that I’ll go with a Steiner MPS for the lower profile and larger window.

Knowing what I know now, definitely go with a factory cut whenever possible. I bought this Specialist 2 years before they sold an optics cut version. Otherwise, don’t try to go with a fancy plate system other than the $1K Nighthawk IOS; just get a RMSc/K cut if you must send your 1911 slide to a shop. Trust me, you won’t ever go back to irons, and trying to fit an ACRO, RMR, or DPP onto a narrow 1911 slide is self-defeating…don’t chase unicorns.

Anyway, I’ll report back on the guns performance.

[Serpico1985]

Don't know if this will be helpful to anyone but along the lines of the topic of 1911/2011 optic cuts and DLC refinishing...

I have experience with Nighthawk who did their iOS cut on a bald slide of mine and left all the blending to me. Cost was $245 (minus what I spent to ship it there) and turn around time was around a month. This would be more expensive if the plate had to be finished.

The plate system has been demonstrated to be reliable on various You tube channels most notably Sage Dynamics. I was satisfied with their work. The plate system is very well thought out and provides rock solid lock up between the plate and the slide.

I would love to figure out how to do it on my manual mill. I don't think it would be too complicated.



As for DLC refinish I use and recommend Evolution Armory out of NH. It is hands down the only sure way to get a great outcome with DLC. One of the Evolution Armory guys takes your parts to the DLC place and does all the clean, prep and fixturing of the parts himself. It never touches the hands of the refinisher employees. He is a expert at getting a great finish. Contrast this to other places that ship your parts to the refinisher and you get what you get. I have had a frame damaged by the employees who didn't fixture it correctly. literally dented my frame. I had to fix the damage and pay to send it back to get DLC a second time.

[gato naranja]

Knowing what I know now, definitely go with a factory cut whenever possible.

…don’t chase unicorns.

In two separate instances, I watched people send precious (to them) 1911 slides away for optic cuts and get burned. I have been toying with the idea of getting the slide of my SA 9mm RO Operator cut, but in the two aforementioned cases, the results were somewhere on the spectrum between "this is ******* dog ****" and "got a C+ in 9th Grade shop class." This sort of thing tends to spook an old rescue cat like myself.

[Sensei]

I fired just 10 rounds of 147 grain Lawman through the Specialist equipped only with the Atlas ACRO Optic to make sure that the gun goes “bang” after replacing the firing pin stop (I’ve had out of spec stops keeping the firing pin from contacting the primer). No malfunctions. A Steiner MPS should arrive early next week.

50 more rounds through the specialist with 124 grain SB FMJ. No failures using Wilson ETM mags.

Round totals are as follows:

Specialist - 1218 rounds
-788 with 124 grain AE
-50 with 124 grain Lawman
-150 with 124 grain S&B
-10 with 147 grain Lawman
-220 with 147 grain HST
-Malfunctions to date: FTF 2; FTE 1 during 10-8 extractor test, 0 during regular fire.
-New 12# recoil spring at 720 rounds
-Slide optic cut for Atlas Plate System at 1208 rounds.

Guardian - 695
-420 with 124 grain AE
-125 with 124 grain S&B
-150 with 147 grain HST
-Malfunctions to date: FTF 1; FTE 0; passed 10-8 extractor test on first try

[bofe954]

Knowing what I know now, definitely go with a factory cut whenever possible. I bought this Specialist 2 years before they sold an optics cut version. Otherwise, don’t try to go with a fancy plate system other than the $1K Nighthawk IOS; just get a RMSc/K cut if you must send your 1911 slide to a shop. Trust me, you won’t ever go back to irons, and trying to fit an ACRO, RMR, or DPP onto a narrow 1911 slide is self-defeating…don’t chase unicorns.

Anyway, I’ll report back on the guns performance.

I'm pondering buying an older TRP vs a new one and having the slide machined for this-

https://www.trijicon.com/products/details/ca428-c-600757

They basically just have to machine a flat spot on the slide. Firing pin stop ends up like yours. I've seen a few nice TRP's for sub 1K and I figured I could get the slide nitrided or or some kind of PVD and maybe some other smithing done on the gun and still be around the $1600 I'd pay for the new optic ready TRP. You're making me think.

[Sensei]

I'm pondering buying an older TRP vs a new one and having the slide machined for this-

https://www.trijicon.com/products/details/ca428-c-600757

They basically just have to machine a flat spot on the slide. Firing pin stop ends up like yours. I've seen a few nice TRP's for sub 1K and I figured I could get the slide nitrided or or some kind of PVD and maybe some other smithing done on the gun and still be around the $1600 I'd pay for the new optic ready TRP. You're making me think.

My experience with optics on a 1911/2011 is to always go factory UNLESS it a gun that you are willing to give the “Neil McCauley treatment.” That is to say, don’t let yourself get attached to anything you are not willing to walk out on in 30 seconds flat if you feel the heat.

Keep in mind, cutting a semi-custom 1911 slide is not like cutting a Glock. For starters, there is no low-cost swap if you’re not satisfied with the end-product. Second, 1911s (especially 9mm) are far more sensitive to material removal impacting reliability than a Glock. Third, the 1911 narrow profile can be limiting in your choice of cuts unless you want to make big sacrifices.

My recommendation is that people go with a DW Specialist OR in 9mm or TRP in 45ACP if they want a very good factory optics ready 1911 for around $2K. The SA Operator or Sig offerings are reasonable for those wanting a good gun for around $1K. Only cut an existing 1911 if you’ve got multiple, reliable replacements. Of you decide to cut a 1911 slide, go boutique or be prepared to double what you expect to pay a local shop to actually get the gun up and reliably running.

[Elwin]

I second all of Sensei’s points after having a shop direct mill two .45 slides and ending up with unusable (for serious purposes) slides. One was a Kimber that was cheap to replace the slide on (though since it’s Kimber I ended up with a slide that needed a lot of work to… work). The other is a Baer that I’ll eventually pay to have a new irons slide fitted to and potentially see if someone who knows what they’re doing can salvage the optic cut one by re-cutting it for a plate system. For now the Baer works fine as purely a range toy.

If I ever decide I really need an optic on a 1911 I’ll buy one made that way. Who knows what the market will look like if and when that happens, but my inclination today would be TRP or Alchemy depending on my budget.

[Sensei]

Steiner MPS is mounted. Will zero and begin vetting this weekend.

132642
132643

[Lunker]

Update—

My Guardian came back from CZ a few days ago.
The thumb safety is still incredibly stiff.


I had the same experience. I sent my Valor in 45 ACP to Dan Wesson for an unusually stiff thumb safety, which was especially pronounced on the right side. That’s the one I care about because I’m a lefty.
It came back, incrementally a tiny bit better. But still much tighter than I care for. I was hoping it would loosen over time, but that hasn’t been the case so far.
Strangely, it is always a little bit easier to activate immediately after dropping the slide on a new mag (as opposed to in the middle of a magazine). So I just made sure that was part of my manual of arms on 1911’s.

[Sensei]

Zeroed the Steiner MPS on the Specialist with 124 grain Lawman and then used the remaining rounds in the box to run a steel challenge rack at 15 yards. No failures. Here is my final zero at 25 meters (25 yard line was closed):
132699

Specialist - 1268 rounds
-788 with 124 grain AE
-100 with 124 grain Lawman
-150 with 124 grain S&B
-10 with 147 grain Lawman
-220 with 147 grain HST
-Malfunctions to date: FTF 2; FTE 1 during 10-8 extractor test, 0 during regular fire.
-New 12# recoil spring at 720 rounds
-Slide optic cut for Atlas Plate System at 1208 rounds.

Guardian - 695
-420 with 124 grain AE
-125 with 124 grain S&B
-150 with 147 grain HST
-Malfunctions to date: FTF 1; FTE 0; passed 10-8 extractor test on first try

[Sensei]

Confirmed the zero on the MPS with my 147 grain HST carry ammo that was previously established with 124 grain Lawman. No adjustments were necessary to produce these two 5-round groups at 25 yards from a sandbag:
132924

The first round was hand cycled on each of the 5-round strings. While the 6 o’clock “flier” came came from the first string, I’m not sure if it was the hand cycled round nor was there a significant flier on the second string. Regardless, I’ll take 10-round groups measuring 2.5” at 25 yards - especially when 8 of the rounds are within 1.5”.

No failures with 70 rounds fired today.

Specialist - 1338 rounds
-788 with 124 grain AE
-150 with 124 grain Lawman
-150 with 124 grain S&B
-10 with 147 grain Lawman
-240 with 147 grain HST
-Malfunctions to date: FTF 2; FTE 1 during 10-8 extractor test, 0 during regular fire.
-New 12# recoil spring at 720 rounds
-Slide optic cut for Atlas Plate System at 1208 rounds.

Guardian - 695
-420 with 124 grain AE
-125 with 124 grain S&B
-150 with 147 grain HST
-Malfunctions to date: FTF 1; FTE 0; passed 10-8 extractor test on first try

[maximus83]

My experience with optics on a 1911/2011 is to always go factory UNLESS it a gun that you are willing to give the “Neil McCauley treatment.” That is to say, don’t let yourself get attached to anything you are not willing to walk out on in 30 seconds flat if you feel the heat.

Keep in mind, cutting a semi-custom 1911 slide is not like cutting a Glock. For starters, there is no low-cost swap if you’re not satisfied with the end-product. Second, 1911s (especially 9mm) are far more sensitive to material removal impacting reliability than a Glock. Third, the 1911 narrow profile can be limiting in your choice of cuts unless you want to make big sacrifices.

My recommendation is that people go with a DW Specialist OR in 9mm or TRP in 45ACP if they want a very good factory optics ready 1911 for around $2K. The SA Operator or Sig offerings are reasonable for those wanting a good gun for around $1K. Only cut an existing 1911 if you’ve got multiple, reliable replacements. Of you decide to cut a 1911 slide, go boutique or be prepared to double what you expect to pay a local shop to actually get the gun up and reliably running.

I can't speak to all the other places that will cut your slide, but in the case of Nighthawk, they explained something interesting regarding cutting slides and reliability (my custom 1911 is there now for optic cut + DLC coating). Bob Reeves, the contact in the custom shop, said that often, what impacts the reliability of 1911s where only the slide is sent away, cut, and then recoated, is that the coatings used often affect the tolerances of the fit to the frame. When NH does a cut + coating, in my case and usually, they want to have the entire pistol so that they can re-lap the frame to slide fit, test, and ensure reliability. In their view, the entire gun is a system and needs to be refit to some degree, after such drastic changes. I'll get to test that theory in a few weeks when I have mine back.

[Sensei]

I can't speak to all the other places that will cut your slide, but in the case of Nighthawk, they explained something interesting regarding cutting slides and reliability (my custom 1911 is there now for optic cut + DLC coating). Bob Reeves, the contact in the custom shop, said that often, what impacts the reliability of 1911s where only the slide is sent away, cut, and then recoated, is that the coatings used often affect the tolerances of the fit to the frame. When NH does a cut + coating, in my case and usually, they want to have the entire pistol so that they can re-lap the frame to slide fit, test, and ensure reliability. In their view, the entire gun is a system and needs to be refit to some degree, after such drastic changes. I'll get to test that theory in a few weeks when I have mine back.

That sounds very reasonable and I was essentially told the same thing when NH quoted me for the IOS cut. I recently had a Les Baer TRS refinished in DLC and it’s having some teething issues on feeding JHP ammo from a full magazine. The gun was already tight and came back slightly more so.

As for my specialist, the shop only cut the slide and didn’t attempt to refinish it. I then had a local shop that was willing to Cerakote just the optics cut to offer it some level of corrosion protection. The remaining portions of the slide kept the original DW Duty Finish which is basically nitride if internet sources are accurate. Thus, there are no changes to the slide frame fit.