holster thigh strap?

[CraigS]

Talked to another shooter two months ago when he showed up w/ drop and offset holster and individual mag pouches set at an angle. So that was when I decided I needed to get better at making kydex holsters. So now my wife and I both have dropped and offset holsters w/ thigh straps. I didn't go to individual mag pouches but did figure a way to mod our double mag pouches to set them at an angle. We are not 100% proficient yet w/ the new stuff, but it is obvious that it is better. A couple weeks ago a competitor thought the drop and offset wasn't legal so I got searching the new rules again and found that YES they are legal (as I was pretty sure). But I can't find anything about thigh straps. We could maybe find a way to work things out w/o them but the retention rule might suffer some. I don't think it matters but we are shooting Beretta 92s in SSP. Any of you have info on these?

[Jim Watson]

Surely you haven't dropped it too far.

8.1.5.12 A dropped and offset (DOH) holster with the butt of the firearm no lower than the top of the belt may be used. Concealment and cant angle rules apply.

Do you have long enough coattails to cover thigh straps?

8.7.1 Concealment garments must hide all of the holster, firearm, ammunition carriers, loading devices and other equipment from view in any direction.

[CraigS]

Jim, wife and I added 2 inches to the bottom of my old 5-11 vest. I was lucky they had some huge internal pocket across the back so I removed that and used the fabric for the extension. We did check that it covers the holster but I don't think I had the strap on at that time. I will check again. The Izaak Walton that we shoot at is pretty loose on regulations so no problem there. But the other club is a bit more stringent. I will find out next Sat if anyone has a problem w/ it.

[CraigS]

Well one of the higher skill guys was away at some upper level matches last month but came to our local match last weekend. I asked about thigh straps and he said not legal. That had been addressed at the other match. Dang, I took mine off right then. I am going to keep experimenting. I find that drop and offset has a downside in that they eccentuate the holster coming up off my leg due to the slight bit of retention the holster has. More retention makes it worse. Good it is adjustable. I like the gun lower but the most important part to me is that the offset lets me get a complete full hand and thumb grip on the gun before it leaves the holster.

[JCN]

Well one of the higher skill guys was away at some upper level matches last month but came to our local match last weekend. I asked about thigh straps and he said not legal. That had been addressed at the other match. Dang, I took mine off right then. I am going to keep experimenting. I find that drop and offset has a downside in that they eccentuate the holster coming up off my leg due to the slight bit of retention the holster has. More retention makes it worse. Good it is adjustable. I like the gun lower but the most important part to me is that the offset lets me get a complete full hand and thumb grip on the gun before it leaves the holster.

Super stiff belt is key to help prevent that.

If you want less retention, you can wax your holster.

[CraigS]

Yes I need to look at belts. I use a heavy leather belt now ( BullhideBelts) and also have version w/ steel between the layers. It doesn't seem to do much though. IDPA requires some kind of a standard belt (I forget the specifics) but I am pretty sure an inner/outer belt rig won't be allowed. Our holsters are kydex and I have been spraying the insides w/ silicone. The last 2 cans of that I have bought both of them are nearly uncontrollable fire hose spray pattern. So I spray, sit it in the top of the trash can to drip, and then do a run through w/ a batch of paper towel. It definitely helps.

[JCN]

Yes I need to look at belts. I use a heavy leather belt now ( BullhideBelts) and also have version w/ steel between the layers. It doesn't seem to do much though. IDPA requires some kind of a standard belt (I forget the specifics) but I am pretty sure an inner/outer belt rig won't be allowed. Our holsters are kydex and I have been spraying the insides w/ silicone. The last 2 cans of that I have bought both of them are nearly uncontrollable fire hose spray pattern. So I spray, sit it in the top of the trash can to drip, and then do a run through w/ a batch of paper towel. It definitely helps.

The other thing you can do is use a little heat to smooth out any of the hang up points.

The best “competition holsters” flare out quite a bit in the middle to upper holster area so you can twist them a little on the way out without binding.

You can do this yourself with any holster with a little heat.

https://www.shootersconnectionstore.com/Browse-by-Manufacturer/Shooters-Connection/Shooters-Connection-Belts/Shooters-Connection-CarryIDPA-Belt

This is a sub-$20 IDPA belt that’s basically like the outer of a USPSA setup.

EDIT: now that I’m thinking of it… wonder if a traditional USPSA outer belt could be IDPA legal if you happened to sew Velcro to your pants in the belt area…

[Mirolynmonbro]

What rule says thigh strap is not legal?

[HCM]

Talked to another shooter two months ago when he showed up w/ drop and offset holster and individual mag pouches set at an angle. So that was when I decided I needed to get better at making kydex holsters. So now my wife and I both have dropped and offset holsters w/ thigh straps. I didn't go to individual mag pouches but did figure a way to mod our double mag pouches to set them at an angle. We are not 100% proficient yet w/ the new stuff, but it is obvious that it is better. A couple weeks ago a competitor thought the drop and offset wasn't legal so I got searching the new rules again and found that YES they are legal (as I was pretty sure). But I can't find anything about thigh straps. We could maybe find a way to work things out w/o them but the retention rule might suffer some. I don't think it matters but we are shooting Beretta 92s in SSP. Any of you have info on these?

There is no rule against thigh straps per se in IDPA.

However, holsters need to either be concealed (or at least concealable) or duty rigs for LE or military.

So an LEO or military member using their duty gear could use a thigh strap. However it’s hard to argue that a holster with a thigh strap is “concealed” or “concealable” with any realistic cover garment.


1.2 Principles of Shooting IDPA

1.2.2.1 Concealable: All equipment will be placed so that it is not visible while wearing a concealment garment, with your arms extended to your sides, parallel to the ground.

1.2.2.2 Practical: All equipment must be practical for all day concealed carry self-defense, and worn in a manner that is appropriate for all day continuous wear.

1.2.3 Participation Principles

1.2.3.1 Competitors will not attempt to circumvent or compromise any stage by the use of inappropriate devices, equipment, or techniques.

[CraigS]

Thanks JCN, I will get 2 of those belts on the way. Surprisingly inexpensive. I will look at holsters more carefully. Do you have a picture of the 'flare out' style. I started making our own holsters this past summer. Thought it would be fun and easier to make than find. Shooting Beretta 92s doesn't help. Mine is standard slide width but wife's is a wide Brig slide. Then I needed one that is light bearing. Then I got the all steel model 92 which has a slide between narrow and wide. I am beginning to think I need one w/ mechanical retention w/ a lever to release it so the holster can be a loose fit but still keep the gun inside. I have a bunch of Serpa holsters which I really like but also understand the thought that the trigger finger release lever probably isn't the best design. So I don't use them. A year ago I tried a Safariland GLS and was not impressed w/it at all.
https://safariland.com/collections/gls-holsters/products/model-578-gls-pro-fit-holster-with-paddle-57800

[JCN]

CraigS

If you @ tag me or “like” a post then I’ll know you responded otherwise it’s at the mercy of wandering back around the forum to realize you responded.

I only know USPSA rules so you’ll have to see what translates over and what doesn’t.

I’ll take some pictures when I get home but if you upload some pictures of your holsters I can show you on your holsters.

The common retention device on some newer holsters is a lever clamp with an eccentric cam.

Like the ones you have on a tripod leg or on a scope mount.

Clamp the lever closed when not running the stage. Open it at make ready.

Use it instead of a traditional screw or thumb screw on the trigger guard area.

I’ll make a quick video later today regarding what makes holsters fast from a geometry standpoint.

You’re a 3 o’clock holster guy, right?

[CraigS]

Yes, 3 oclock.

[JCN]

Yes, 3 oclock.

Dude, you did it again. Haha. Had no idea you replied because you didn’t tag, like or quote me.

Here’s a video regarding holsters.


https://youtu.be/rlgZxlxggPc

[CraigS]

Thanks JCN. I hope my liking the above post does what you were expecting. I never thought of it as a way to help w/ not having to search all around to find a reply before. That extra room at the top inside of the holster is in some of my holsters but not all. I looked at it as being there to keep the attachment screws/nuts from scraping along the side of the gun. But I think your point about freeing up the gun on the way out of the holster is way more important. I also need to start cutting away the top front of my diy kydex holsters. I have not done that yet as I was concerned that the overall strength of the holster might be reduced. I have been concentrating on pulling the gun nearly straight up and then pushing it out so I didn't think that cutting away the front of the holster would make much difference. IE, I don't get the feeling that the muzzle end is trying to pass through that area and getting hung up. But your thought on it being helpful for freeing up the gun is certainly valid. I have been using kydex either .080" or .093" thick and have actually been thinking to go a little thinner to get better definition and make it easier to form. Now I think I need to stay w/ the thicker so I can cut some of it away. Thanks for your video and helpful ideas.

[JCN]

Perfect!

The cut front does help a ton to start angling the muzzle up (more hypotenuse than two sides of a triangle on draw).

I notice it a lot and will often cut away that area on cheaper holsters.

[CraigS]

Perfect!

The cut front does help a ton to start angling the muzzle up (more hypotenuse than two sides of a triangle on draw).

I notice it a lot and will often cut away that area on cheaper holsters.

I did cut some of the front of my diy holster away. I don't notice any real change on my draw as far as the barrel being able to move forward/upward sooner. But what I do notice is this. On a real slow, let's see what is happening draw, the gun becomes much looser in the holster much more quickly. These are obviously not actual measured numbers but, if I start the draw, and as a test, wiggle the gun left or right, or cant it forward or back, as it rises, maybe it needed to rise 3 inches to be loose enough to allow these movements. Now it is loose at one inch of rise. To me this is a huge change for the better. I look at it as, neither of us is anywhere near a pro level shooter, so the more 'off' our draw stroke can be without a significant negative effect, the better it is. I will be cutting away 2 more holsters this weekend.

[KneeShot]

CraigS,

I think that’s super cool you’re making your own holsters!

If you’re willing to try some other gear, I might have some. Free. Thanksgiving P-F love!

One condition - you have to throw any Serpa holsters you own in the trash :)

Gotta look in my locker at work. I think I have a NIB Safariland ALS that will fit your 92, and maybe maybe a Comptac.

If you want to drop and offset the ALS - Safariland makes what you’ll need. The 1” or 1.5” drop might keep the butt of the gun at legal height, anything dropped lower than that might need a thigh strap from my personal experience.

PM your address, please.

Jeremy

[KneeShot]

I forgot to ask…are you right handed?

[CraigS]

Yes right handed.