Flat recoil spring in a Kimber

[Zhurdan]

In order to not step all over a different post...


Quote Originally Posted by Zhurdan View Post
HOLY SMOKES!!! Got an email back from Wilson. For a Bill Wilson Carry pistol... 9-12 months!


Makes me wonder if there's a way to get a flat spring for my Kimber to see if it will add to it's reliability.

BLR said.

It won't. And I've had a Tactical Supergrade on order since March....2010!!!!

From what I have gathered about the reliability upgrades to the Bill Wilson Carry pistol, the flat recoil spring is one of the more important items as it allows for more slide travel. So, I want to know if getting one made (from the folks someone posted about on this forum regarding custom springs) would help.

Now, I know that BLR answered "It won't" and I guess I could accept that at face value and I mean BLR no disrespect when I say this, but often times, people immediately dismiss Kimbers and anything associated with them simply because they don't like Kimbers. I'm not suggesting this is the case, but it was a short answer to a question I'd like more information on.

The Kimber in question is a Raptor II Pro. It's reliable when it is well lubed and with a new-ish recoil spring. Currently, I'm using 22lb springs and replace them every 800-1000 rounds. I had two failures to go into full battery at the AFHF class in SLC last year during day one. I think we were up around 700-800 rounds if I remember correctly. I didn't add any lube during the class, which I probably should have done. Todd mentioned (paraphrasing) that at that sort of failure rate, that gun would go in the trash.

I've had some work done by a 'smith in SLC a couple of years ago and it has run far better than it did when I first got it and was wondering if a flat spring would help with the failure to return to full battery or failure to feed issues. Mainly curious because one, I shoot the 1911 far better than any other gun I own and two, a handful of new springs is a hell of a lot more affordable than a new BW Carry pistol.

Currently, I don't carry the Kimber but I'd like to get back to a 1911 soon for the above mentioned reason of I just shoot it far better than my other pistols.

Whaddayathink?

[LittleLebowski]

Paging BLR.....

[JonInWA]

Try contacting Nighthawk Custom; they're offering flat spring variants for both 5" and 4.25" 1911s, and presumably one of these will either work or could be made to work on your Kimber.

Best, Jon

[_JD_]

EGW Kimber 4" Guide Rod & Spring Kit (http://www.egwguns.com/guide-rod-kits/kimber-4-guide-rod-spring-kit/)

I think I still have one floating around somewhere, it was a nicely built kit and did improve overall function of the CDP Pro I had at the time.

[Mitchell, Esq.]

Stop using Kimber pistols and your 1911s will be more reliable.

[Zhurdan]

Stop using Kimber pistols and your 1911s will be more reliable.

While I appreciate an example of exactly what I posted about in my OP, I have a purpose and a means to an end here. ;)

I've already spend $1100 or so on this gun (with modifications) that I've owned for 4 years or so. It shoots where I point it, I like the way it feels in my hand and IF I can spend... say.... $200-400 to get it running like a top... vs. buying a Bill Wilson for $3200? Well, lets see... I don't know about you, but I'm not made of money, so I thought a little mental exercise with people who obviously know more than me, would yield a thoughtful opinion, some tips, tricks, explanations. You know... thought provoking stuff. On the order of say... $2600.00 worth of savings? AKA $2600 worth of ammo to shoot.

If it can't be done... fine. Please state why. Understand my viewpoint a little. I had a Custom Target that ran like a... ahhhh... molested marsupial. I think I had four FTFeed's in close to 10k rounds while I was doing competition shooting over the course of about 5 years. I know, I know... sample of one, but it ran and ran well. So, I gave them another shot. I'd hate to just throw it in the trash and spend $3+k on a new gun if it can be made to run for ~$400.

[Jason F]

While I appreciate an example of exactly what I posted about in my OP, I have a purpose and a means to an end here. ;)

I've already spend $1100 or so on this gun (with modifications) that I've owned for 4 years or so. It shoots where I point it, I like the way it feels in my hand and IF I can spend... say.... $200-400 to get it running like a top... vs. buying a Bill Wilson for $3200? Well, lets see... I don't know about you, but I'm not made of money, so I thought a little mental exercise with people who obviously know more than me, would yield a thoughtful opinion, some tips, tricks, explanations. You know... thought provoking stuff. On the order of say... $2600.00 worth of savings? AKA $2600 worth of ammo to shoot.

If it can't be done... fine. Please state why. Understand my viewpoint a little. I had a Custom Target that ran like a... ahhhh... molested marsupial. I think I had four FTFeed's in close to 10k rounds while I was doing competition shooting over the course of about 5 years. I know, I know... sample of one, but it ran and ran well. So, I gave them another shot. I'd hate to just throw it in the trash and spend $3+k on a new gun if it can be made to run for ~$400.

That's a perfectly articulated arguement FOR the Kimber in your case Zhurdan. Stick with it.

Try the flat spring. I'm very curious to see what your experiences are. Especially in light of the recent discussions by ToddG & blr about them.

Heck, I may pick up one of the flat springs to try in my new government size 1911.

[LittleLebowski]

That's a perfectly articulated argument FOR the Kimber in your case Zhurdan. Stick with it.

Try the flat spring. I'm very curious to see what your experiences are. Especially in light of the recent discussions by ToddG & blr about them.

Heck, I may pick up one of the flat springs to try in my new government size 1911.

Agreed. Vickers just posted about the benefits of flat springs in Commanders and I'm thinking of getting one for my Kimber Series I Pro Carry, not that I shoot it much.

[SecondsCount]

The spring may help but I think you should send the Kimber to a good 1911 smith and have them do a reliability package on it. The spring might just mask a real issue like a clocking extractor, extractor tension, or how the claw has been dressed, breachface condition, or a tightly spec'd chamber.

Steve Morrison at Mars Armament (http://marsguns.com/Home.htm) here in Utah comes highly recommended.

[Jim Watson]

If the gun will run well for some hundreds of rounds on a fresh regular spring, it is probably mechanically ok.
The 4" sub-Commanders are rather chronically undersprung. Use large diameter wire to keep the load up, and you have few turns for durability.
I think the flatwire spring will last a lot longer.

I have actual Glock springs on shop made small diameter guide rods in an OACP and a 4.5" shortened G.M. that used to be an IPSC Modified gun... until I got into IDPA and took off all my compensators. FLG made them up before ISMI, EGW, and Wilson got into the act. They have outlasted skimpy regular springs by a considerable margin.

[Zhurdan]

If the gun will run well for some hundreds of rounds on a fresh regular spring, it is probably mechanically ok.
The 4" sub-Commanders are rather chronically undersprung. Use large diameter wire to keep the load up, and you have few turns for durability.
I think the flatwire spring will last a lot longer.

I have actual Glock springs on shop made small diameter guide rods in an OACP and a 4.5" shortened G.M. that used to be an IPSC Modified gun... until I got into IDPA and took off all my compensators. FLG made them up before ISMI, EGW, and Wilson got into the act. They have outlasted skimpy regular springs by a considerable margin.

The gun will run fine with a new spring in it until around 500~600 rounds and then it requires lots of lube to avoid issues. Unless of course I just toss in a new spring. I went ahead and ordered the EGW kit with a couple extra springs to try it out. All other springs have been changed out over the years, extractor changed and tuned as well. About the only thing I keep seeing that I haven't done is the oversized firing pin stop. Anybody know what that is supposed to solve? I'm assuming 'oversized' is meaning the thickness and bevel on the bottom to change the dynamics between the hammer and slide during recoil, but that's just what I've gathered from reading a bunch of stuff.

_JD_, I tried sending you another PM but your box is full.

Once I get it installed, I'll function check it with a few hundred rounds, then I think I'll put it to work on the 2k challenge if everything looks ok.

[_JD_]

The gun will run fine with a new spring in it until around 500~600 rounds and then it requires lots of lube to avoid issues. Unless of course I just toss in a new spring. I went ahead and ordered the EGW kit with a couple extra springs to try it out. All other springs have been changed out over the years, extractor changed and tuned as well. About the only thing I keep seeing that I haven't done is the oversized firing pin stop. Anybody know what that is supposed to solve? I'm assuming 'oversized' is meaning the thickness and bevel on the bottom to change the dynamics between the hammer and slide during recoil, but that's just what I've gathered from reading a bunch of stuff.

_JD_, I tried sending you another PM but your box is full.

Once I get it installed, I'll function check it with a few hundred rounds, then I think I'll put it to work on the 2k challenge if everything looks ok.

Saw that, sorry. It's cleared out now. I see you went ahead and ordered the kit. I'll still look for mine. If I find it I'll post up here. Free to a good home for anyone wanting to try the Kimber Pro Flat Spring.

[Zhurdan]

Sweet. Again, thanks for the offer.

[archangel]

About the only thing I keep seeing that I haven't done is the oversized firing pin stop. Anybody know what that is supposed to solve?

I believe that is primarily to prevent extractor clocking (rotating).

[SamuelBLong]

And cutting a smaller radius / bevel supposedly helps with recoil by creating extra tension / friction against the hammer.

I've been thinking about it, but then again I hardly ever shoot my 1911 anymore.

[Bridic]

Have you rec'd your flat spring kit?
Was wondering how it worked out.


Saw that, sorry. It's cleared out now. I see you went ahead and ordered the kit. I'll still look for mine. If I find it I'll post up here. Free to a good home for anyone wanting to try the Kimber Pro Flat Spring.

If you still have this, i would like to take it off your hands.
Let me know how much?

[Zhurdan]

Have you rec'd your flat spring kit?
Was wondering how it worked out.


So far, 704 trouble free rounds without cleaning. I've added a bit of lube every other week, but that's it. It is getting pretty filthy now though, might have to break down and clean it as it seems to get everywhere.

Info - Kimber Raptor Pro II, Chip McCormick 8 round magazines, leather IWB 3 o'clock holster.