Technical question on S&W 3rd Gens...

[MattyD380]

If you're familiar with Smith 3rd gens, you might know something about the "trigger play spring." It's a tiny little brass leaf spring that tensions the trigger against the drawbar in single action. When it gets loose or bent... you get an annoying click in the SA trigger.

The guns work without it, apparently. You just have more slack/play in the SA takeup. The CHP, for instance, ordered their 4006TSWs without it. But my question is this: If I just rip the little spring out, will the click go away? Or will it get worse? Or stay the same?

The only answer I can get on the Smith Forum is "the guns work without it." No context on how removal of the spring affects the click itself.

This is in reference to a new-to-me 4506-1, by the way. Which is a lovely specimen, save for the trigger play issue.

89966

[Brian T]

My 4506-1 had a broken trigger spring and in SA the trigger would sometimes stick to the rear and I would have to manually push it forward.

I replaced it with a new spring, and Wolff'd the trigger return and hammer springs. Purdy happy.

[farscott]

The trigger play spring, like the name suggests, stops the trigger from moving rearward without any force on the trigger face when the hammer is captured by the single-action notch. It fundamentally provides some tension before the actual trigger engagement occurs. If is is broken, bent, or absent, the trigger will flop around, and it can make a clicking sound. The sound is basically the same if the spring is there but bent or if the spring is broken.

The click really has nothing to do with the spring. The click is usually caused by a condition where the front hooks of the trigger's 'ears', or prongs, have slipped up and forward over the top of the drawbar head's V-notch (in which the prongs normally sit to some degree). The clicking noise is usually heard as the tips of the prongs are being snapped back down over the edge of the drawbar's head at the top of the notch. The large frame (10xx and 45xx), like your sample, are more prone to the issue. [Borrowed from "Fastbolt", a S&W armorer for a CA LE agency at http://smith-wessonforum.com/s-w-smithing/64266-4506-trigger-play-spring.html ]

Brownells has the spring at https://www.brownells.com/handgun-parts/trigger-group-parts/trigger-parts/trigger-springs/trigger-play-spring-prod14780.aspx and the rivet at https://www.brownells.com/handgun-parts/trigger-group-parts/trigger-parts/trigger-retainers/trigger-play-spring-rivet-prod14429.aspx . The rivet is not in stock at Brownells. I did not check Numrich or MidwayUSA.

I would take the spring out as broken pieces of spring can tie up the pistol. It works fine, as noted, without it. But it can make a clicking sound as the trigger moves around without tension unless one replaces the trigger play spring and rivet.

[MattyD380]

The trigger play spring, like the name suggests, stops the trigger from moving rearward without any force on the trigger face when the hammer is captured by the single-action notch. It fundamentally provides some tension before the actual trigger engagement occurs. If is is broken, bent, or absent, the trigger will flop around, and it can make a clicking sound. The sound is basically the same if the spring is there but bent or if the spring is broken.

The click really has nothing to do with the spring. The click is usually caused by a condition where the front hooks of the trigger's 'ears', or prongs, have slipped up and forward over the top of the drawbar head's V-notch (in which the prongs normally sit to some degree). The clicking noise is usually heard as the tips of the prongs are being snapped back down over the edge of the drawbar's head at the top of the notch. The large frame (10xx and 45xx), like your sample, are more prone to the issue. [Borrowed from "Fastbolt", a S&W armorer for a CA LE agency at http://smith-wessonforum.com/s-w-smithing/64266-4506-trigger-play-spring.html ]

Brownells has the spring at https://www.brownells.com/handgun-parts/trigger-group-parts/trigger-parts/trigger-springs/trigger-play-spring-prod14780.aspx and the rivet at https://www.brownells.com/handgun-parts/trigger-group-parts/trigger-parts/trigger-retainers/trigger-play-spring-rivet-prod14429.aspx . The rivet is not in stock at Brownells. I did not check Numrich or MidwayUSA.

I would take the spring out as broken pieces of spring can tie up the pistol. It works fine, as noted, without it. But it can make a clicking sound as the trigger moves around without tension unless one replaces the trigger play spring and rivet.

Gotcha. Thanks for that. Yeah, Fastbolt's posts are pretty much the wellspring of all my 3rd gen knowledge. He's such a resource for people who still have these guns.

So... looks like it will still click even without the spring. Oh well.

Numrich actually has brand new 45XX drawbars with the TPS included/attached. I might just order one of those. I can probably handle swapping out a drawbar. Not sure I wanna deal with rivets. Or, I might just bring it to the Smith down the street with the parts in hand and tell him to do it.

Anyway, thanks again.

[FrankB]

While we’re on the topic, I bought a 5926 two days ago. It looks and shoots like new, but I always wonder about spare parts. The grip is in great shape, but I’m worried that I’ll never find a spare if it breaks from impact or age. Any thoughts?

90030

[UNM1136]

Dunno, but anxiously awaiting input. 3rd gen S&W are kinda important to me...

pat

[FrankB]

Dunno, but anxiously awaiting input. 3rd gen S&W are kinda important to me...

pat

Numrich has all the fiddly little parts needed for maintenance, but nobody seems to have grips.

[MattyD380]

Numrich has all the fiddly little parts needed for maintenance, but nobody seems to have grips.

Are you Frank Butta on YouTube? I’m Hipster Tactical 😁 Hooray for the Internet!

I dunno, keep an eye out on eBay. I remember seeing some 1076 palm swell grips listed a few years ago. But… that was a few years ago. Sometimes you see parts kits come up on Gunbroker, Slinks gun parts, and Every Gun Part. They’re never cheap, though.

In other news…

I was able to move that trigger play spring forward by pushing on it with the hammer decocked. Mostly eliminated the click. Still might order a drawbar, just to have it.

The gun shoots really well, too:

90032

Shot right on POA and grouped well. I’m surprised—I shoot it better than my 645. 100% reliable with factory, reman and that syntec stuff.

[Willard]

Trigger play spring is best adjusted using a pencil eraser so it doesn't break. You can tune it exactly right using this method. If someone needs a spring and rivet, i will send one (only have a couple to spare though).

[FrankB]

MattyD380 That’s me! I actually carried my 5926 in a DeSantis pocket holster today. The range is only 10 minutes from my home, so I’ll get more shooting time in tomorrow. It ate Sig 124 gr Elite HP’s yesterday, so I’m confident in its ability. Even if it didn’t fire, it would make a fine bludgeoning weapon.

Please watch Hipster Tactical on YouTube. He’s very well spoken guy, and features some great pistols! 👍👍👍👍


https://youtu.be/dhvWqiWH2ek

[MattyD380]

MattyD380 That’s me! I actually carried my 5926 in a DeSantis pocket holster today. The range is only 10 minutes from my home, so I’ll get more shooting time in tomorrow. It ate Sig 124 gr Elite HP’s yesterday, so I’m confident in its ability. Even if it didn’t fire, it would make a fine bludgeoning weapon.

Please watch Hipster Tactical on YouTube. He’s very well spoken guy, and features some great pistols! 👍👍👍👍


https://youtu.be/dhvWqiWH2ek

Thanks, man! I appreciate it. I’ll plug FrankB for his channel, too—here is the lovely 5926 in question:

https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=2R8KNivAeoI&t=92s

He’s got some cool revolvers, too.

But yeah, my 6904 and 5906 have totally reliable, eat-anything kinda guns. Same with my 645 and the 3913 I had briefly. I did have some FTFeed issues with my 1076 and some of the more compact 45XXs. So, I’m thinking I’ll stick with 5 inch for the big bore Smiths. But 59XXs, I think, have a reputation for being dependable and durable.

[medmo]

While we’re on the topic, I bought a 5926 two days ago. It looks and shoots like new, but I always wonder about spare parts. The grip is in great shape, but I’m worried that I’ll never find a spare if it breaks from impact or age. Any thoughts?

90030

anygunpart.com has been has been a great source for me in picking up used parts packages. It was recommended to me by a fellow PF-er about a year ago. Specific 5926 parts might be tough to find as not as many were produced.

[SW CQB 45]

based on my name, I was into Smiths in the 90s into the 2000s.

I learned about the trigger play spring by breaking it with a red rag. Cleaning the magwell by drawing the rag from the top of the frame and pulling it through, it snagged and snapped.

I learned that if you never take your finger off the trigger while shooting, the spring never comes into play.

I believe it was Fastbolt who told me how to change mine and IIRC, the rivet is soft alum and does not take alot of effort to swage. the use of a makeshift anvil that fits in a vise and on the rivet. I think, I used a punch. I bet that info is archived in the swforum.

your good to go without one but it can be annoying w/o one.

good luck

[SW CQB 45]

While we’re on the topic, I bought a 5926 two days ago. It looks and shoots like new, but I always wonder about spare parts. The grip is in great shape, but I’m worried that I’ll never find a spare if it breaks from impact or age. Any thoughts?



I was big into SW 3rd gen for duty carry. I was hard on my stuff and was a regular at SW ordering parts. When SW dropped 3rd gen from its line up to include parts, I got scared that I would not be able to fix my guns down the road but timing was everything. It was about that time Admin changed where I work... I was asked if I wanted to carry 1911 on duty in 2008. Pretty much been there since.

I sold all my 3rd Gen guns and parts.

My opinion: dont go hammering nails and chunking it like a boomerang and you should be ok. 5900 (3rd Gen) series are tanks plus your stuff looks pre MIM. You should be fine.

always be hunting for grips, the decocker grip will be a difficult to find. Maybe buy rubber hogues for shooting and some used wood for carry to protect your valuable grip. might have to mod aftermarket grips for frame decocker.

https://i.imgur.com/6zKGZ7Yh.jpg

[SW CQB 45]

one more thing,

make sure to oil the detent/spring in the slide stop lever. if moisture gets in there and no lube, older guns the spring will rust out.

dump alot of oil in the detent and keep working the plunger. if brown crap comes out, hope it does not break but keep it oiled.

[Jason M]

While we’re on the topic, I bought a 5926 two days ago. It looks and shoots like new, but I always wonder about spare parts. The grip is in great shape, but I’m worried that I’ll never find a spare if it breaks from impact or age. Any thoughts?

90030

Just saw more than a few in Oaks. When the show is back in August, take a look around. You should be able to find both curved and flat backstrap models.