Black Hills Honey badger Ammo

[MolonLabe416]

http://www.black-hills.com/product-category/honeybadger/

[JodyH]

Does not feed well in Kahr pistols with the offset feed ramp. The sharp nose digs into the sliver of exposed polymer and stops it short.
After that experience I'd be leery of using it in polymer magazines as well.

[JohnO]

I received some first hand witness info that the 100 gn. 9mm ammo produced a devastating wound and by far outperformed a 230 gn HST in the test subject. Results seen during military style Live Tissue Trauma Training.

[5pins]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4r7wHMg5Yjg

[ST911]

Does not feed well in Kahr pistols with the offset feed ramp. The sharp nose digs into the sliver of exposed polymer and stops it short.
After that experience I'd be leery of using it in polymer magazines as well.

Which HB load matters. The bullets and OALs are obviously different, with some combinations of sku/gun more compatible than others. (PCCs, long OALs in micros, etc)

I've not seen any indication of a problem associated with polymer mags. One point of reference, the Glock OEM and pmags feed every Lehigh and BHA loading I've tried without issue.

[JHC]

I received some first hand witness info that the 100 gn. 9mm ammo produced a devastating wound and by far outperformed a 230 gn HST in the test subject. Results seen during military style Live Tissue Trauma Training.

That post has really captured the imagination. You probably thought long and hard word smithing that and there's probably nothing else you can say about it. Right . . . ? ;)

[JohnO]

That post has really captured the imagination. You probably thought long and hard word smithing that and there's probably nothing else you can say about it. Right . . . ? ;)

If you know, you know!

[wvincent]

Anybody know of any agencies actually issuing the 9mm round for duty use?
I mean, besides my local SO's?
I cannot imagine what the selection process was.

[5pins]

Anybody know of any agencies actually issuing the 9mm round for duty use?
I mean, besides my local SO's?
I cannot imagine what the selection process was.

The selection process was probably watching this video a few times.


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xytXlgGNdKw

[wvincent]

The selection process was probably watching this video a few times.


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xytXlgGNdKw

Whelp, that solves it, I'm going to go throw all my HST's in the burn pit and switch.
Not really, not until I see the "Papal Blessing" on this from the good Docter Roberts.

[Shawn Dodson]

The selection process was probably watching this video a few times.


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xytXlgGNdKw

Except for the .380's penetration, I'm underwhelmed.

The term "wound cavity," as used in the video (and by others), to describe the disruption produced in gelatin is inaccurate.

There's a permanent cavity and a temporary cavity.

The permanent cavity is the gelatin/tissue directly contacted and crushed by the bullet as it penetrates.

Whereas the temporary cavity produces cracks in gelatin that many folks misinterpret as a depiction of the extent of permanent tissue damage.

The term "wound cavity" reinforces this misinterpretation.

Injecting food coloring into the wound track also reinforces this misinterpretation.

[the Schwartz]

Until there are some solid technical papers confirming the greater destructive effects in human soft tissues being claimed by Black Hills and the manufacturer of the bullet design (LeHigh Defense, LLC), this ammo is nothing more than really expensive ball.

[Thy.Will.Be.Done]

Except for the .380's penetration, I'm underwhelmed.

The term "wound cavity," as used in the video (and by others), to describe the disruption produced in gelatin is inaccurate.

There's a permanent cavity and a temporary cavity.

The permanent cavity is the gelatin/tissue directly contacted and crushed by the bullet as it penetrates.

Whereas the temporary cavity produces cracks in gelatin that many folks misinterpret as a depiction of the extent of permanent tissue damage.

The term "wound cavity" reinforces this misinterpretation.

Injecting food coloring into the wound track also reinforces this misinterpretation.

Correct, permanent crush cavity is not actually correlated to gelatin at all.... if the bullet didn't touch it (.35" diameter) then what you see there is temporary cavitation which is questionable how much effect it might have on living tissue.

[Thy.Will.Be.Done]

So why are these not on DocGKR list?

[SWAT Lt.]

So why are these not on DocGKR list?

I would venture a guess that no LE agency has requested he test it. If they have, I would suspect it has something to do with post #12 above.

[Velo Dog]

91520

DocGKR responds to statements concerning solid copper bullets

"There is an ever growing amount of evidence that the monolithic hydrostatic bullets cause greater wounds than hollow points."

No.

"All bullets do damage through hydrostatic shock."

No. Penetrating projectiles damage tissue by directly crushing it (permanent cavity) and stretching it (temporary cavity).

"I believe based upon gel tests it will rip up tissue better than HP."

Not likely.