Gregory Gross case - UOF and medical

[whomever]

I'm posting this here because I'd like to hear from both the resident LEO's and medicos.

A 64 year old man is arrested for DUI. In the process he suffers a cervical injury resulting in paralysis.

Video, apparently compiled by his lawyer (he is suing the police and hospital):

https://vimeo.com/662004332/a456f489f3

One of several news articles:

https://www.sacbee.com/news/local/article257066912.html

As far as the pre-hospital video, what we see was edited by his attorney. Some of the interesting parts have been edited out, so I don't feel like I have a complete picture. I am surprised that a suspect complaining he is paralyzed wouldn't, post Floyd, result in an immediate call for an ambulance. I get it that suspects lie about medical conditions, but just to CMyA...

Once he gets to the hospital ... I'm not a medico, but first aid classes sure hammered home proper handling of possible spinal injuries. I didn't see any concern for that in the video, and hope the resident medicos can shed some light.

[HCM]

I'm posting this here because I'd like to hear from both the resident LEO's and medicos.

A 64 year old man is arrested for DUI. In the process he suffers a cervical injury resulting in paralysis.

Video, apparently compiled by his lawyer (he is suing the police and hospital):

https://vimeo.com/662004332/a456f489f3

One of several news articles:

https://www.sacbee.com/news/local/article257066912.html

As far as the pre-hospital video, what we see was edited by his attorney. Some of the interesting parts have been edited out, so I don't feel like I have a complete picture. I am surprised that a suspect complaining he is paralyzed wouldn't, post Floyd, result in an immediate call for an ambulance. I get it that suspects lie about medical conditions, but just to CMyA...

Once he gets to the hospital ... I'm not a medico, but first aid classes sure hammered home proper handling of possible spinal injuries. I didn't see any concern for that in the video, and hope the resident medicos can shed some light.

The article you link is behind a pay wall.

[Lon]

Gotta pay to read the article so I couldn’t read them.

There’s obviously missing video and without that it’s hard to really give an opinion one way or the other regarding what happened after he got out of the patrol car and ended up on the ground.

I’ve had plenty of arrestees complain about bogus injuries over the years and go limp only to have miraculous recoveries within 5 minutes so I’m not surprised by the Officer’s disbelief. BTDT. Be interesting to see the rest of the story when it comes out.

[Lon]

https://www.abc10.com/amp/article/news/local/california/yuba-city-police-lawsuit/103-9c88010c-46ea-4717-8f5a-6feb66243f4d

The Officer involved is no longer employed by the agency. Doesn’t say why.

[whomever]

"The article you link is behind a pay wall. "

Oooops. I run NoScript, so I miss a lot of paywalls. Searching for 'Gregory Gross Yuba' will find a lot of coverage. I could read these even with javascript enabled:

https://www.newsweek.com/65-year-old-army-vet-files-suit-after-cops-allegedly-break-his-neck-leaving-him-paralyzed-1666467

https://www.ktvu.com/news/california-man-accused-of-dui-says-run-in-with-police-left-him-paralyzed

https://abcnews.go.com/US/wireStory/california-man-paralyzed-police-pain-compliance-82100373

[TGS]

I'm posting this here because I'd like to hear from both the resident LEO's and medicos.

A 64 year old man is arrested for DUI. In the process he suffers a cervical injury resulting in paralysis.

Video, apparently compiled by his lawyer (he is suing the police and hospital):

https://vimeo.com/662004332/a456f489f3

One of several news articles:

https://www.sacbee.com/news/local/article257066912.html

As far as the pre-hospital video, what we see was edited by his attorney. Some of the interesting parts have been edited out, so I don't feel like I have a complete picture. I am surprised that a suspect complaining he is paralyzed wouldn't, post Floyd, result in an immediate call for an ambulance. I get it that suspects lie about medical conditions, but just to CMyA...

Once he gets to the hospital ... I'm not a medico, but first aid classes sure hammered home proper handling of possible spinal injuries. I didn't see any concern for that in the video, and hope the resident medicos can shed some light.

From what I saw, he was already at the hospital when he started complaining that he couldn't feel his legs; looks like it started after the Sergeant took him to the ground on the grass at the hospital. So, you wouldn't call for an ambulance if you're already at the hospital.

Drunk people are absolutely fucking miserable to deal with, and this guy was absolutely in that category. It looked like someone (nurse? doctor? idk) did an evaluation based on his complaint of not being able to feel his legs and determined it wasn't an issue, which is why you saw them not using cervical spine immobilization. Drunks complaining about loss of control of their extremities, being dramatic, etc is fairly common, so that on its own isn't terribly alarming. What's going to make/break it whether the medical staff knew about the potential mechanism of injury (the takedown). At the hospital I worked at, our policy was MOI + drunk = C-spine precautions until ruled out, regardless of complaints. When you're drunk or suffering from any other sort of altered mental status, you're considered an unreliable witness as you can't properly assess and convey your own complaints (obviously he was complaining here, I'm just adding context). Without knowing he was in any sort of traumatic incident (most common being a car accident), there's really not a whole lot of reason to believe he is suffering from a c-spine injury.

So, my opinion based on one brief side of the story: if they didn't know about the takedown, they're fine. If they knew about the take-down, they're toast.

[Coyotesfan97]

I wish I had a dollar for everything time putting handcuffs on someone “aggravated” or caused a back injury, knee injury, arm injury etc. If it was on scene I’d usually call medics for the drama. I’ve also had to call paramedics to the jail for incareritis err back injuries. Depending on what they saw it might result in an ambo ride to the ER.

I had one guy I’d arrested for disorderly conduct/fighting start the my back hurts at the jail. It was around 0200-0300. The paramedics who responded had already been to the jail five times that night. Let’s just say they weren’t happy campers. He told them his back hurt. They put him on a backboard, put him in a spinal collar, and they taped him to the board. They used a lot of tape. I don’t think he could move. He got transported to the VA after I gave him his ticket.

It was hard to tell from the video but I got the impression his complaints started at the hospital. I’d just go in and tell them I needed help bringing a prisoner who was claiming to have a back injury in. It’s up to the ER staff at that point. There’s going to be a general cynicism involved because they see the same things cops do along with people claiming injuries for narcotics.

It’s basically a one sided report from the attorney filing the claim at this point.

[whomever]

"MOI"

Mechanism of Injury???

"if they didn't know about the takedown, they're fine. If they knew about the take-down, they're toast."

There is someone in scrubs (with I think an 'MD' embroidered on the scrubs) discussing what happened with the officer between about 5:30 and 6:30 in the vimeo video.

[Coyotesfan97]

"MOI"

Mechanism of Injury???

"if they didn't know about the takedown, they're fine. If they knew about the take-down, they're toast."

There is someone in scrubs (with I think an 'MD' embroidered on the scrubs) discussing what happened with the officer between about 5:30 and 6:30 in the vimeo video.


https://youtu.be/0HAGMb_jAdU

Yes it’s Mechanism of Injury. The only thing missing is paramedics cutting off her shirt. :cool:

ETA I hadn’t watched this in awhile and it had me rolling a couple times.