G20 Vs G29 , reliability for a woods gun.

[flux]

Reading through the 45 super thread, and various 10mm threads on the forum, I have got a few questions.
1.) When using 10mm loads loaded to full power 10mm spec, is there a difference in reliability between the G29 and G20?
2.) Does the shorter length of the G29 sacrifice much in terms of velocity? Will I end up with .40 performance out of the shorter length barrel?
3.) Do the Gen 4 Glock 10mm need any additional modifications to reliably shoot hotter 10mm loads.
Is the G29/G20 still a viable 10mm option? Would ideally like to stay with Glock, HK is not exactly available here. I will most likely be reloading for it.

[Oldherkpilot]

Reading through the 45 super thread, and various 10mm threads on the forum, I have got a few questions.
1.) When using 10mm loads loaded to full power 10mm spec, is there a difference in reliability between the G29 and G20?
2.) Does the shorter length of the G29 sacrifice much in terms of velocity? Will I end up with .40 performance out of the shorter length barrel?
3.) Do the Gen 4 Glock 10mm need any additional modifications to reliably shoot hotter 10mm loads.
Is the G29/G20 still a viable 10mm option? Would ideally like to stay with Glock, HK is not exactly available here. I will most likely be reloading for it.

Be aware that the partially unsupported chamber on the Glock barrel can be a problem for reloading. The bulge in the case can be resized but that area will still be a weak spot. This is especially a problem with hotter loads. If the weak spot lines up with the bottom of the chamber (bad luck) the case may rupture. In my case, the magazine blew out of the mag well and the extractor flew out. No damage to me or the pistol, but it was a bit scary.

I would recommend an after market barrel if you plan to reload for your 10mm (which you should). Even with a fully supported chamber, I would still start with virgin brass. Since Glock is the most prevalent 10mm, a lot of once-fired brass went through a Glock. Some folks find reliability issue with AM barrels, but I cannot speak to that personally. The Glock I "disassembled" was a friends.

If your situation allows the larger version, I think you'll find it more enjoyable with the max loads in the 10. Good luck to you-the 10 rocks!

[GJM]

The 29 runs factory 10mm loads of modest (.40) power factors. I haven't heard of folks doing the work to make the 29 reliable, like they have with the 20.

[steve]

If size is a factor then a G23 might not be a bad choice. Hotter .40 loads are on the heels of 10mm and some exceed the 10mm lite that is out there. 13 rounds vs 10 in a package that is very reliable.

[Gun Mutt]

GJM has done much to change my perspective on field pistols. I highly recommend his G23.5 thread (https://pistol-forum.com/showthread.php?49682-Gen-5-23-MOS-field-pistol-project).

I'll never get rid of my beloved, decades old, G20, but my nagging urge to try another G29 has been quieted, probably permanently. The G29 that I owned was miserably unreliable with the heavy loads my G20 gobbled up. Two trips back to Glock failed to remedy its malady.

[HeavyDuty]

When I moved to moose country last year I seriously considered picking up a 10 - I do railroad and other photography off the beaten track. In the end I decided I was better served with a 27.5 and a reload or two.

[vcdgrips]

Outside of my lane:

For a woods gun where concealability is not a concern, why not go with the G20 and the drop in 6 inch barrel to get even more oomp pah pah?

Alternatively, if one already had a .40 cal platform, the work done by GJM would be my starting point.

Gladly would defer to others in this realm.

[the Schwartz]

Outside of my lane:

For a woods gun where concealability is not a concern, why not go with the G20 and the drop in 6 inch barrel to get even more oomp pah pah?

Alternatively, if one already had a .40 cal platform, the work done by GJM would be my starting point.

Gladly would defer to others in this realm.

Another option is the Glock 40 (for those who'd feel weird about having a barrel that protrudes significantly past the end of the slide).

If someone has not yet already come up with a conversion barrel that will allow the 40S&W to be fired in the G40, I'll bet that eventually someone will.

[GJM]

My understanding is that ammo manufacturers worked with gun makers to develop defensive loads in 9/40 that performed and functioned. To my knowledge, that hasn't been done in 10mm. Manufacturers come up with a 10, and we become the test pilots to try to find field loads that penetrate and function. There is a significant opportunity for an ammo manufacturer to develop field loads and test them in different platforms, to achieve a reliable combination of penetration and function.

[Clusterfrack]

1.) When using 10mm loads loaded to full power 10mm spec, is there a difference in reliability between the G29 and G20?


As GJM said, we haven’t seen anyone put in the effort to test a G29 with full powers 10mm loads. I’m skeptical it would work well. My testing suggested that as loads get hotter, slide velocity increases and outpaces the mag spring, causing FTFs. With a compact G29, that should be more problematic.

Regarding chamber support: G4 barrels have good support. G3, not so much.

https://pistol-forum.com/showthread.php?25552-10mm-200gr-Hardcast-Load

[flux]

Thanks , some informative responses here. With regards to barrel replacements, not really an option at al for me, I am not based in the states.
The Gen 5 23 thread has just opened up some options for me...
Linked to this thread, but not wanting to start another thread, with regards to 45 super, do any of the .45 Glocks have the potential to manage it with minor upgrades without barrel replacement?

[Lester Polfus]

Linked to this thread, but not wanting to start another thread, with regards to 45 super, do any of the .45 Glocks have the potential to manage it with minor upgrades without barrel replacement?

Based on all the research I did a couple years ago, it doesn't look like. Things may have changed since then, but I doubt it.

I think you run into the same issue you do with the G29/20. The only thing you can really change is the recoil and magazine spring rates, and that doesn't get you where you need to go.

With a 1911 platform (or other hammer fired gun) you can change the mainspring rate and the firing pin stop geometry, which does much more to retard the slide as it moves backwards.

[FPS]

I messed around with full power loads in the G29 using an after market KKM barrel. Chamber was too tight to reliably feed hardcast with wide meplat. Perhaps the issue with the slide velocity was a factor as well. This was before introduction of the Lehigh all copper load. I spent quite a bit of time at the 10mm-firearms.com forum trying to get things to work. Going back to the Glock barrel I got the ammo to work but I did not do extensive testing due to the cost of the round. I never saw any Glock bulges on the brass but definitely an issue as it is widely reported.

I've since liquidated 10mm and moved on as I just don't have the patience to work it out due to the very little time I spend in Grizzly country.

[UNM1136]

I'm hanging on to my G20.3 as a bowhunting companion. I have a .40 barrel for it, and am very passively looking for .357 Sig and 9x25 Dillon barrels. When I get around to reloading a more supported chambered 10mm barrel will be in order.

But while all Glocks are undersprung, I suspect the 10s would benefit from spring tuning the most. My first armorer's course there was no recommended prgrammmed replacement of parts. A boss's G23 wore out at about 4,000 rounds. We basically rebuilt it. The next armorer's course I took recommended prophylactic RSA relacement, among other things at 2,500 rounds.

pat

[JonInWA]

GJM and I had some good discussions on thias day coinciding with his Underwood Lehigh thread. The upshot was is that I feel very comfortable with my Gen4 G22 with the 140 gr Underwood Lehigh Xtreme Penetrator cartridges here in the Pacific Northwest against black bear and cougar; similarly with my Gen 3 G21 and Underwood Lehigh Xtreme Penetrators or (in my case) with Xtreme Defense cartridges.

For controllability, I prefer the full-size Glocks, and my suspiscion is thet the Gen5 G22 would be even better than my Gen4 G22 in that regard.

I haven't personally tried the Gen5 G23, so I can't comment, but for size and controllabilty I'll probably stick with the G21/G22 formats, or alternatively with my HK P30/VP40. If I wanted an HK selection in .45 ACP. I'd select an HK45/45 Compact. or HK .45 USP.

For woods use, I prefer a stable thigh tactical rig, or a tanker chest configuration. With the Glocks, a butt plug is a standard piece of equipment for mine, so that when I sit down in dirt/mud/ash residue it doesnt get concurrently thrust into the receiver cavity if the but of the gun makes contact with the ground. Mine are all from Pierce.

Best, Jon

[GJM]

A woman, good shooter, who shoots CO at our local club, told me that she and her husband were spending the summer in Alaska. That led to a discussion of field pistols, and she told me she had been trying, unsuccessfully, to make Buffalo Bore run reliably in her new Glock 20. I suggested she get some Underwood Lehigh penetrators and run a Glock 9 or 40.

[Lester Polfus]

A woman, good shooter, who shoots CO at our local club, told me that she and her husband were spending the summer in Alaska. That led to a discussion of field pistols, and she told me she had been trying, unsuccessfully, to make Buffalo Bore run reliably in her new Glock 20. I suggested she get some Underwood Lehigh penetrators and run a Glock 9 or 40.

I've cautioned so many people about reliability issues with Glocks and Buffalo Bore ammo, I'm surprised Sundles hasn't put poison bait for me out in my yard.

[pastaslinger]

I am looking at magna porting a G20 since I think it should help the gen 4 recoil spring be more reliable and more controllable with top end loads.

I have also wondered, are there any mag extensions that work reliably for the G20? Or any extended mags like the ets or sgm 30 rounders?

[Lester Polfus]

I am looking at magna porting a G20 since I think it should help the gen 4 recoil spring be more reliable and more controllable with top end loads.

I have also wondered, are there any mag extensions that work reliably for the G20? Or any extended mags like the ets or sgm 30 rounders?

Not a direct equivalent, but a member here gave me a Glock OEM 6" hunter barrel he'd had ported by a gunsmith. It made the gun no more reliable with heavy loads.

ETA: I've no experience with extended magazines, but I'd note that one of the issues that causes problems is shoving the column of cartridges up quick enough for the round to properly present itself to be fed. A bigger column of ammo is not going to help that.

[Lost River]

A woman, good shooter, who shoots CO at our local club, told me that she and her husband were spending the summer in Alaska. That led to a discussion of field pistols, and she told me she had been trying, unsuccessfully, to make Buffalo Bore run reliably in her new Glock 20. I suggested she get some Underwood Lehigh penetrators and run a Glock 9 or 40.


I've cautioned so many people about reliability issues with Glocks and Buffalo Bore ammo, I'm surprised Sundles hasn't put poison bait for me out in my yard.


I will just say that sometimes some people go a bridge too far. The sweet spot I have found has been a 200 grain hard cast at 1150. That runs great in every 10mm I have tried it in. You are not outrunning your mag springs, and you can hammer controlled pairs with some practice.

It also penetrates extremely well. I had the opportunity to shoot some steer skulls and they might as well been water balloons. The 200 grain slugs went right through them.



https://i.imgur.com/xmmuKwj.jpg?1

[Lester Polfus]

I will just say that sometimes some people go a bridge too far. The sweet spot I have found has been a 200 grain hard cast at 1150. That runs great in every 10mm I have tried it in. You are not outrunning your mag springs, and you can hammer controlled pairs with some practice.

It also penetrates extremely well. I had the opportunity to shoot some steer skulls and they might as well been water balloons. The 200 grain slugs went right through them.



https://i.imgur.com/xmmuKwj.jpg?1

That bullet looks like a smaller meplat than what I was trying to run too. I probably could have made it all work out, but I finally said "f it" and got heavily into .357s, which re-ignited my Passion Of The Gun, so it all worked out.