Mouseguns

[glocklight]

I've gone through specs on more or less mouse size guns for years and have tried many. Best one I've found is the newest Ruger LCP Max although the LCP II was nice but for barely any more size or weight the LCP Max was worth the ability to carry more rounds.

New here but not to guns or other gun forums - I have favor to ask anyone who might be on the Seecamp forum as I recently got one of them at a price too good to pass up. I've been trying to get on their forum but their registration auto-responder for verification is not working. I've contacted Seecamp a couple times but all I got was 'check your Spam folder' which is empty and not the problem. I've tried with gmail and also with an email from my own domain email server but nothing ever arrives so I can complete registration. At this point I don't know if they are too busy to respond or don't care but I'm not getting any help from them and I'd really like to get on that forum for some questions and discussion unless there are some serious Seecampers here ;) So if anyone is on the Seecamp forum could you maybe ask an Admin or Moderator there for help with this. As a retired computer / network tech I'm fairly sure the issue is not on my end. Thanks to anyone who can help with this!

[glocklight]

Just wanted to say the Kahr CM9 which I believe was the smallest Kahr in 9mm but maybe not quite mouse gun size was one of the shortest lived guns I've had. Sold it soon after trying it out as it had a serious problem for CC. That was some years ago and I can't detail the exact problem but it was bad enough I would not use it as a CCW. I couldn't find any resolution in online searches for the problem so it was a quick turnaround.

[Totem Polar]

Today was Mousegun Monday. :)

I shot the 640P, the G42, and especially, the recently-adopted Seecamp. Good stuff. The small holes are from the LWS .32 at *roughly* 12 feet; for some reason, using the slide to aim produced high hits. :rolleyes: At least the grouping was good, all things considered, and I was stoked to find the little thing completely reliable, within its design constraints (JHP only). For a no-sights gun that looks a lot more like something that a first grader would leave under their pillow for the tooth fairy than a real pistol, I’ll take it. There’s a reason that God invented sights, however.

Those pin prick .32 holes are dwarfed by the G42’s 380 ball hits though. :D

[Binkius]

Beretta Tomcat .32 ACP.
Utter trash.
Consistent, predictable malfunctions at 4 or 5 rounds. Sent back to Beretta. They did a brutal looking polish on the ramp and chamber, put three firing pin indents into the barrel lug and it still has consistent, predictable malfunctions at 4 or 5 rounds.
Cartridges nose-dive in the magazines. I've tried 4 OEM Beretta mags (all cleaned before use). Same problem on all of them.
I don't think it's ethical to sell it to anyone, so it lives in the back of the safe.
The experience really soured me to semi-auto pocket guns, so now I pocket carry a Ruger LCR 327. Better sights, 100% reliable.

[hk45]

Oh why can’t HK come out with a mouse gun or mouse gun-like that is utterly reliable. Come on HK, you’ll make millions!

[MattyD380]

I had a new production (Southwick) seecamp .32. It was nifty. And it was 100% reliable the one and only time I took it to the range. But it needed a lot of special attention to work right. If you lubed it to much, the slide might fly off. Seecamp insisted on using this Eezox stuff for lube. You had to use JHPs. If you pulled trigger while the mag was out, the trigger spring would bend in. You can’t rack the slide with the mag out. Plus, one time the slide locked up after cleaning it. No idea why. I got it working again and it seemed fine. But… just too much effort to make it do basic gun stuff. Plus… it was still too heavy to carry in the pocket of gym shorts.

Smallest gun I have now is a Pistolet Makarova. Which I find accurate, reliable and easily carryable.

[Evil_Ed]

Oh why can’t HK come out with a mouse gun or mouse gun-like that is utterly reliable. Come on HK, you’ll make millions!

They did...the HK4 :)

[jandbj]

They did...the HK4 :)

I’d love a P7k3… in .22 with a can.

[ccmdfd]

Beretta Tomcat .32 ACP.
Utter trash.
Consistent, predictable malfunctions at 4 or 5 rounds. Sent back to Beretta. They did a brutal looking polish on the ramp and chamber, put three firing pin indents into the barrel lug and it still has consistent, predictable malfunctions at 4 or 5 rounds.
Cartridges nose-dive in the magazines. I've tried 4 OEM Beretta mags (all cleaned before use). Same problem on all of them.
I don't think it's ethical to sell it to anyone, so it lives in the back of the safe.
The experience really soured me to semi-auto pocket guns, so now I pocket carry a Ruger LCR 327. Better sights, 100% reliable.

I didn't experience the malfunctions that you did, but boy do I hate that gun. Very uncomfortable to shoot, both in terms of recoil impulse as well as the fact that the slide wood slice the back of my hand open routinely. Also a fairly horrendous double action trigger which led to bad accuracy.

I too migrated to an LCR .327 and couldn't be happier, well except for the lack of ammo availability currently.

[Polecat]

Oh why can’t HK come out with a mouse gun or mouse gun-like that is utterly reliable. Come on HK, you’ll make millions!


No kidding, it would seem a nice pocket .32 / .380 from HK, steyr, CZ, Walther is wide open for the taking.

[rcbusmc24]

Gotta go old school. I love this little Colt 1908 in .25ACP. Always seems to work, fits any where. I like it as a off hand side pocket gun mostly. Traded a buddy some unneeded 5.45 ammo for it. Only ever carry it in support of a "bigger" (recently its been a Ruger LCR in .327 FedMag aiwb, so I guess I've been going full gun hipster recently...) gun though.

90358

[MattyD380]

Nice Colt 1908. Very cool.

How does the 1908 compare to the Baby Browning? Both .25 autos. Both John Browning designs. Is one... "better"?

[sharps54]

I’m very happy with my .327 LCR but there are times the smaller Keltec P32 can’t be matched. There is a thread on this site with some recommended spring changes to help reliability, I’ll see if I can’t find it and add a link.

Edit to add this post (#9) and the following (#10) are the ones I was thinking of
https://pistol-forum.com/showthread.php?39466-Kel-tec-P32&p=956666&viewfull=1#post956666

[Lex Luthier]

No kidding, it would seem a nice pocket .32 / .380 from HK, steyr, CZ, Walther is wide open for the taking.

But they would have to make them here in order to sell them here. GCA '68 is a thing.

Any one of their earlier designs adapted for modern manufacturing materials and methods would probably fill the bill.

[jh9]

Kahr has updated the recoil springs, and they are absolutely required for reliable functionality. These springs are very stiff, and require “man strength” to rack, making this a poor choice for many people. Installation of new springs is not easy, because the resting length is much greater than the guide rod. A table edge helps and safety glasses are a must.

Do you know if this is also true for the CT380? I would think the longer slide would accommodate "more spring" from the beginning.

[ECK]

I like carrying mouse guns but don’t like shooting them at distances greater than 5 yds.

Back when my EDC was a 4” 1911 on an Officer frame my go-to mouse gun was a Colt Mustang in .380. Now that my EDC is a 365XL, the ‘need’ for a mouse gun has kinda gone by the wayside.

[Clusterfrack]

Do you know if this is also true for the CT380? I would think the longer slide would accommodate "more spring" from the beginning.

I’m not sure about this. Maybe?

[Polecat]

Thanks to our local enabler Clusterfrack I just picked up a CW 380! Kinda nervous, but I owned a P380 when they first came and it was great. So what current serials are safe? I hooe they resolved their issues. Can / can’t wait to try it.

Does anyone know what came of Ruger bringing out a .32 LCP? I think there was talk about it then LCPII .22 came out and then nothin?

I think higher cap .32 true pocket gun would be awesome.

[Clusterfrack]

Polecat, I’m not sure about serial numbers, but fresh recoil and mag springs seem to help a lot. Also see my post above about polishing the lower barrel lug.

[awp_101]

Bump for a hypothetical question.

If the options are a Remington RM380 or a SCCY CPX-4, which would you pick?

[Velo Dog]

If the options are a Remington RM380 or a SCCY CPX-4, which would you pick?

The SCCY CPX-4

It is in current production, so it should be easier to obtain replacement parts and accessories or have warranty work performed.

[Clusterfrack]

Bump for a hypothetical question.

If the options are a Remington RM380 or a SCCY CPX-4, which would you pick?

I'll choose the other door: The Rem RM380 looks very interesting (https://www.thetruthaboutguns.com/gun-review-remington-rm380/). If I weren't already satisfied with my 2 Kahr p380s, I would buy one.

Parts are available (https://www.midwestgunworks.com/remington-rm380/parts.html).

https://cdn0.thetruthaboutguns.com/wp-content/uploads/2015/12/D7C_1275_1.jpg

[awp_101]

Ok, what if I said the Remington is $150 more?

Both have the box, SCCY has 1 mag, the Rem has 2, round count on both is under 175.

Personally I’m leaning toward the SCCY (hypothetically of course) for the reasons Velo Dog mentioned. I’ve handled the SCCY but have not handled the Remington yet.

And the SCCY frame is PF orange. 😄

[Clusterfrack]

Ok, what if I said the Remington is $150 more?

Both have the box, SCCY has 1 mag, the Rem has 2, round count on both is under 175.

Personally I’m leaning toward the SCCY (hypothetically of course) for the reasons Velo Dog mentioned. I’ve handled the SCCY but have not handled the Remington yet.

And the SCCY frame is PF orange. [emoji1]

What are the prices?

A new LCP1.2 is around $275. I would take that over the SCCY.

[awp_101]

$200 and $350.

Based on the LCP Max9 and Max380 I’ve handled and shot, the LCP isn’t a contender.

[Clusterfrack]

$200 and $350.

Based on the LCP Max9 and Max380 I’ve handled and shot, the LCP isn’t a contender.

The original LCP1 (gen2) is worth a look. It's a hammer fired DAO, and very reliable.

[Clusterfrack]

There's a p380 for sale (https://pistol-forum.com/showthread.php?56278-3-Kahr-380-and-9mm-pistols-for-sale) here on the forum. I believe I have figured out the secret sauce (https://pistol-forum.com/showthread.php?50494-Mouseguns&p=1294974&viewfull=1#post1294974) that makes these reliable.

[Velo Dog]

Both have the box, SCCY has 1 mag, the Rem has 2


Looks like the SCCY should have shipped with three 10-round magazines.

https://www.thetruthaboutguns.com/gun-review-sccy-cpx-4-380-acp-pistol/amp/

[spyderco monkey]

There's a p380 for sale (https://pistol-forum.com/showthread.php?56278-3-Kahr-380-and-9mm-pistols-for-sale) here on the forum. I believe I have figured out the secret sauce (https://pistol-forum.com/showthread.php?50494-Mouseguns&p=1294974&viewfull=1#post1294974) that makes these reliable.

What is the secret sauce? I always like the looks of the P380, but have been concerned with reliability.

[Clusterfrack]

What is the secret sauce? I always like the looks of the P380, but have been concerned with reliability.

Here's what I've learned and figured out:

1. Series A serial numbers may be irredeemable. Some series B p380s may need to go back to the factory, but both of mine are reliable after the below modifications:

2. New, updated recoil springs (RS) are a must. The p380 seems to require very heavy recoil springs, and only the updated ones work. As well, they need to be replaced regularly--maybe as often as 500-1000 rounds. Buy extra. Installation of the updated springs is a challenge because the resting length before "set" is much longer than the slide. Use eyepro! I held the slide over the edge of a table, and that helped. Because the springs are so stiff, no female has succeeded in racking my p380s.

3. New mag springs. If you have FTFs after replacing the RS, that's probably the cause. Buy extra.

4. Polishing the inside of the lower barrel lug (https://pistol-forum.com/showthread.php?50494-Mouseguns&p=1293083&viewfull=1#post1293083), and the slide stop rod where they interface. I used a Q-tip with polishing compound spun in a drill. Make sure to lube this area. I use a small amount of Lucas grease.

5. While superficially Glocklike, the p380 requires 1911 levels of lubrication.

6. The following parts may help, but are probably not needed:
Tool steel striker
https://lakelinellc.com/shop/ultimat...r-380-pistols/

Striker guide
https://gallowayprecision.com/kahr/c...d-p380-pistols

After all this, I have not had any malfunctions of any kind.

Is the p380 worth it? I think so. In my hands it shoots like a much bigger gun (https://pistol-forum.com/showthread.php?50494-Mouseguns&p=1295471&viewfull=1#post1295471), and way better than a LCP.

[45dotACP]

Here's what I've learned and figured out:

1. Series A serial numbers may be irredeemable. Some series B p380s may need to go back to the factory, but both of mine are reliable after the below modifications:

2. New, updated recoil springs (RS) are a must. The p380 seems to require very heavy recoil springs, and only the updated ones work. As well, they need to be replaced regularly--maybe as often as 500-1000 rounds. Buy extra. Installation of the updated springs is a challenge because the resting length before "set" is much longer than the slide. Use eyepro! I held the slide over the edge of a table, and that helped. Because the springs are so stiff, no female has succeeded in racking my p380s.

3. New mag springs. If you have FTFs after replacing the RS, that's probably the cause. Buy extra.

4. Polishing the inside of the lower barrel lug (https://pistol-forum.com/showthread.php?50494-Mouseguns&p=1293083&viewfull=1#post1293083), and the slide stop rod where they interface. I used a Q-tip with polishing compound spun in a drill. Make sure to lube this area. I use a small amount of Lucas grease.

5. While superficially Glocklike, the p380 requires 1911 levels of lubrication.

6. The following parts may help, but are probably not needed:
Tool steel striker
https://lakelinellc.com/shop/ultimat...r-380-pistols/

Striker guide
https://gallowayprecision.com/kahr/c...d-p380-pistols

After all this, I have not had any malfunctions of any kind.

Is the p380 worth it? I think so. In my hands it shoots like a much bigger gun (https://pistol-forum.com/showthread.php?50494-Mouseguns&p=1295471&viewfull=1#post1295471), and way better than a LCP.Would these fixes also apply to something like the CW380 or do those suck?

Sent from my SM-A326U using Tapatalk

[Clusterfrack]

Would these fixes also apply to something like the CW380 or do those suck?

Sent from my SM-A326U using Tapatalk

Not sure, but from a few reports I’ve read they may just suck.

[iWander]

Bump for a hypothetical question.

If the options are a Remington RM380 or a SCCY CPX-4, which would you pick?A rock

[awp_101]

A rock

Although I don’t fully disagree: Invalid choice, please try again. 😄

[Duelist]

Bump for a hypothetical question.

If the options are a Remington RM380 or a SCCY CPX-4, which would you pick?

In a world full of Jframes, Taurus 85s that actually work, G42s, and where the P32 exists, why on earth would I pick a gun I know can’t get through a magazine of JHP (SCCY) that is super uncomfortable to shoot, or an unproven Remington?

[chances R]

My first SCCY CPX2 would not cycle a HP. Called SCCY and they sent prepaid label. Gun back to me in 1 week and feeds 5 different brands HP perfectly. Fantastic result and CS. I have one other I bought used and has worked flawlessly. IMO, for the money hard to beat.

[iWander]

My first SCCY CPX2 would not cycle a HP. Called SCCY and they sent prepaid label. Gun back to me in 1 week and feeds 5 different brands HP perfectly. Fantastic result and CS. I have one other I bought used and has worked flawlessly. IMO, for the money hard to beat.I'm truly glad you've had that experience with their products. I can tell you I didn't see a single student's SCCY make it through my 50 round CCW course... to be fair, they were Gen1 guns, but that was enough for me.

[chances R]

I'm truly glad you've had that experience with their products. I can tell you I didn't see a single student's SCCY make it through my 50 round CCW course... to be fair, they were Gen1 guns, but that was enough for me.

I've seen 3 SCCYs through the carry classes I've taught....no problem. Mine are 'fishing or truck guns' however. I did shoot one in a BUG match without issue. For the money and after one is wrung out, see nothing wrong with it being in the sock drawer. I've got others for endurance runs that are better choices for sure.

[awp_101]

In a world full of Jframes, Taurus 85s that actually work, G42s, and where the P32 exists, why on earth would I pick a gun I know can’t get through a magazine of JHP (SCCY) that is super uncomfortable to shoot, or an unproven Remington?

Absolutely a fair question. Honestly, it wouldn't be anything other than a fun gun that I go into with low expectations and zero expectations it would replace my Shield or 442. The Security-380 is the leading contender for that role once others have proven they're reliaiable. The Kahr offerings are intriguing if I was looking for something to truly pocket carry but I haven't been able to shoot one to see if it would be a squirrelly and squirmy in my hand as they look. Ongoing hand issues are a major pain (so to speak :rolleyes: ) and tiny pistols are problematic.

[JJN]

Bump for a hypothetical question.

If the options are a Remington RM380 or a SCCY CPX-4, which would you pick?

No.

[Duelist]

Absolutely a fair question. Honestly, it wouldn't be anything other than a fun gun that I go into with low expectations and zero expectations it would replace my Shield or 442. The Security-380 is the leading contender for that role once others have proven they're reliaiable. The Kahr offerings are intriguing if I was looking for something to truly pocket carry but I haven't been able to shoot one to see if it would be a squirrelly and squirmy in my hand as they look. Ongoing hand issues are a major pain (so to speak :rolleyes: ) and tiny pistols are problematic.

I’d probably put the money on a G44 or a case of 9mm.

[Up1911Fan]

Bump for a hypothetical question.

If the options are a Remington RM380 or a SCCY CPX-4, which would you pick?

A clinch pick.

[ARgon]

I like and have over 500 rounds through a RM380, with no malfunctions. That said I have carried a Seecamp 32 for close to 40 years and. Seecamp 380 for close to 20 years. Larry Seecamp was a friend, and built both guns for me I use Gold Dots and Hydra shok through the 32, PMC Bronze JHP at the range. The 380 likes Hrdra Shok for carry, and my reloads at the range. It is, indeed a mouse gun, and considered that by me. In the last couple of years, I have carried a Sig P365 over the 1911.

[Blades]

In a world full of Jframes, Taurus 85s that actually work, G42s, and where the P32 exists, why on earth would I pick a gun I know can’t get through a magazine of JHP (SCCY) that is super uncomfortable to shoot, or an unproven Remington?

I saw a P32 today at Raeford Hardware (https://www.raefordhardware.com/departments/).

[Moped]

Bump for a hypothetical question.

If the options are a Remington RM380 or a SCCY CPX-4, which would you pick?

Doubt I'd pick either. The Remington intrigued me for a bit, but after they went out of business, I lost interested.


$200 and $350.

Based on the LCP Max9 and Max380 I’ve handled and shot, the LCP isn’t a contender.

What were your issues with these pistols? I actually carry both as my mine carry pistols and have had no issues with either, other than the trigger safety on the LCP Max tends to pinch my finger. I have the CTS1550 mounted on the Max 9 and it co-witnesses with the iron sights.


I saw a P32 today at Raeford Hardware (https://www.raefordhardware.com/departments/).

To be honest, this would be what I would choose over the SCCY and the Remington.

[gale155]

Bump for a hypothetical question.

If the options are a Remington RM380 or a SCCY CPX-4, which would you pick?

The RM380 all day long for me. Mine has been flawless and is a pleasure to shoot, although I've only got around 100 rounds through it. It's been my EDC here in my sleepy little area for a while now. It's the same basic design and size of the Rohrbaugh R9 and R380, but without the lofty price tag. It's a shame they're no longer in production, IMO.

[ARgon]

The RM380 all day long for me. Mine has been flawless and is a pleasure to shoot, although I've only got around 100 rounds through it. It's been my EDC here in my sleepy little area for a while now. It's the same basic design and size of the Rohrbaugh R9 and R380, but without the lofty price tag. It's a shame they're no longer in production, IMO.

I agree, it is an overlooked gun, many would find it a good gun if they could get their hands on it, replacing the springs and doing some upgrades make it even better.

This is fun to watch, stupid, but fun! :)

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KdSv59xsXJo

[gale155]

I agree, it is an overlooked gun, many would find it a good gun if they could get their hands on it, replacing the springs and doing some upgrades make it even better.

This is fun to watch, stupid, but fun! :)

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KdSv59xsXJo

That review is definitely a hoot...that gun store is located here in Missouri. I've read that the RM380 was the most tested gun in Remington's history, mainly because they couldn't afford another R51 fiasco. They had a head start, of course, since it's based on the Rohrbaugh design. I think the guys doing the review wanted to reinforce the notion that the RM380 is robust and totally reliable. I upgraded mine with M-Carbo springs as well, which resulted in a slightly smoother and lighter trigger, although I had no issues with the factory springs.

[Clusterfrack]

I shot an IDPA match in CO, but also shot with my carry Kahr p380 in the BUG-s division. It was fun to see people's WTF reaction to a tiny mousegun. The p380 ran flawlessly for the 90 round match, other than sometimes not locking back on empty with PMC Bronze ammo. I even beat my CO score on one stage (a 1-per prone stage). It took me a little while to adjust to the hyper-visual and kinesthetic focus that the p380 requires for down-0 hits. I really liked it as an exercise, but also makes me feel REALLY good about carrying this gun when I do.

I shot a solid Novice on the 5x5 classifier with the p380. I know I can bring that up, but it would take a miracle to score Ex or M with that gun. The p365 type guns people are shooting in BUG-s are just too much of an advantage, and reloading the p380 is tricky.

https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20230730/d927c3c18c477ee64496adc45002500b.jpg
https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20230730/585d5b83f5ed29911aff4c78ccfef935.jpg
https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20230730/ef1ace7825f0f1728781fc51c32aa359.jpg

[rmfnla]

I’m pretty late to this party, but I’m getting a kick out of y’all calling .380s mouse guns.

My normal EDC is a 9mm Shield but my favorite mouse gun is the Beretta Jetfire, the .25 acp.

Small, light, reliable, holds 9 rounds and is surprisingly accurate; I figure 4 or 5 to the face is better than nothing.

[Clusterfrack]

I’m pretty late to this party, but I’m getting a kick out of y’all calling .380s mouse guns.

My normal EDC is a 9mm Shield but my favorite mouse gun is the Beretta Jetfire, the .25 acp.

Small, light, reliable, holds 9 rounds and is surprisingly accurate; I figure 4 or 5 to the face is better than nothing.

Nice!

But the Tomcat is not more mousy than some of the .380s...
P380 L 4.9, H 3.9, W 0.75". 9.97 oz
Tomcat L 4.92, H 3.7, W 1.1". 14.5 oz (https://www.handgunhero.com/compare/kahr-p380-vs-beretta-3032-tomcat)

[Clusterfrack]

Here's what I've done for a minimalist/NPE AIWB rig:

Kahr p380 with reliability mods (https://pistol-forum.com/showthread.php?50494-Mouseguns&p=1318209&viewfull=1#post1318209).
Badger Concealment holster. $30 from Amazon (https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B00SQFW5OA/). I used a heat gun and flattened the ridiculously huge wedge under the clip. I threw the clip away and replaced it with a narrow DCC Monoblock clip from Tulster (https://tulster.com/1-5-dcc-monoblock-metal-clip-profile-holster/). I had to Dremel the holes to fit and align the clip to my liking. Then I added a tiny homemade Junk Carry Pillow.

Very comfortable --and invisible under a sMedium t-shirt.

https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20230811/e76ccd9e40540abe11574f2612dd9caf.jpg
https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20230811/6b04836c01325fb55a267397d3984a2b.jpg
https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20230811/db5b90227a3e5ceb0f62b366fa73dbc3.jpg

[MattyD380]

I lack a mousegun, presently. And I feel it would be a worthwhile addition.

I had a Seecamp .32 for a while. It never had any malfs in the few boxes of bougie, expensive .32 JHPs I put through it. But... it only fired bougie, expensive .32 JHPs. It was annoying to disassemble and clear. And it basically required this weird dry lube called Eezox, per the manual. I felt it was a little too much of a diva for what it offered in terms of actual utility. But hey... it seemed to work fine. Though I will say the slide locked up on one time while I was reassembling after cleaning. Then it never happened again.

I've been thinking of a Tomcat, for front pocket duty. We often lament the dearth of small DA/SA pistols; I guess we forget about the Tomcat. Seems like it would be just enough larger than some of the very smallest options, lest it might handle/shoot a little better. Perhaps.

The frame/slide issues have been resolved in the latest iterations, right?

[Clusterfrack]

Here's a video from that IDPA match to give an idea of what's possible with a good mousegun (and what's difficult). Points: Down Zero + 5 (non-threat edge hit that just broke the perf).


https://youtu.be/GaiMyZsLQrY


I shot an IDPA match in CO, but also shot with my carry Kahr p380 in the BUG-s division. It was fun to see people's WTF reaction to a tiny mousegun. The p380 ran flawlessly for the 90 round match, other than sometimes not locking back on empty with PMC Bronze ammo. I even beat my CO score on one stage (a 1-per prone stage). It took me a little while to adjust to the hyper-visual and kinesthetic focus that the p380 requires for down-0 hits. I really liked it as an exercise, but also makes me feel REALLY good about carrying this gun when I do.

I shot a solid Novice on the 5x5 classifier with the p380. I know I can bring that up, but it would take a miracle to score Ex or M with that gun. The p365 type guns people are shooting in BUG-s are just too much of an advantage, and reloading the p380 is tricky.

[Clusterfrack]

I lack a mousegun, presently. And I feel it would be a worthwhile addition.

I had a Seecamp .32 for a while. It never had any malfs in the few boxes of bougie, expensive .32 JHPs I put through it. But... it only fired bougie, expensive .32 JHPs. It was annoying to disassemble and clear. And it basically required this weird dry lube called Eezox, per the manual. I felt it was a little too much of a diva for what it offered in terms of actual utility. But hey... it seemed to work fine. Though I will say the slide locked up on one time while I was reassembling after cleaning. Then it never happened again.

I've been thinking of a Tomcat, for front pocket duty. We often lament the dearth of small DA/SA pistols; I guess we forget about the Tomcat. Seems like it would be just enough larger than some of the very smallest options, lest it might handle/shoot a little better. Perhaps.

The frame/slide issues have been resolved in the latest iterations, right?

I haven't shot a Tomcat. I like the concept of a TDA mousegun, but it's on the large side--especially for a .32. I'm not sure I'd choose it over a Glock 42.

I think DAO makes a lot of sense for a mousegun.

Edit: I had a Walther TPH .22, and recently sold it. It was a great little gun--except for the flat-out worst DA trigger I've ever owned.

[Totem Polar]

I haven't shot a Tomcat. I like the concept of a TDA mousegun, but it's on the large side--especially for a .32. I'm not sure I'd choose it over a Glock 42.

I think DAO makes a lot of sense for a mousegun.

Edit: I had a Walther TPH .22, and recently sold it. It was a great little gun--except for the flat-out worst DA trigger I've ever owned.

The Tomcat shoots fine. Cool little gun. But I’d indeed take a G42 over the TC. That said, I’m a G42 fan, as you might recall.

:)

[MattyD380]

Yeah, I can see the logic/wisdom in DAO for a teeny gun. The Seecamp’s DAO wasn’t too bad, I suppose. I had a Kahr K9 and while the trigger was very, very nice, it didn’t feel as DAish as I was hoping. Not a big fan of Glock triggers for various reasons—but the 42 seems like it is a sweet size.

The RM380 is another one that’s crossed my mind. I did dry fire one and I thought the DAO was very nice, actually. I suppose I’d consider one of those as well.

[Totem Polar]

As an aside, MattyD380, I’ve had a couple of different Seecamps over the years. Very cool little guns for what they are, but I just can’t get past the lack of real sights.

108297

[Clusterfrack]

As an aside, MattyD380, I’ve had a couple of different Seecamps over the years. Very cool little guns for what they are, but I just can’t get past the lack of real sights.

108297

That is a sexy picture.

I’m a strong believer in sights on mouseguns.

[TGS]

I’m a strong believer in sights on mouseguns.

I recently traded into a NIB Ruger LCP 2. A buddy wanted a PM9, and I had one with all the accoutrement that I haven't carried since 2018...so I figured what the hell. I traded for it just for his sake, and because I felt like I've missed out on apparently being the only person who carried through the 2008-2012 timeframe but has never owned an LCP.

Anyways, it needs orange paint on the front sight. I seem to remember you suggesting a specific orange paint, but I can't find it now.

Suggestion?

[Clusterfrack]

I recently traded into a NIB Ruger LCP 2. A buddy wanted a PM9, and I had one with all the accoutrement that I haven't carried since 2018...so I figured what the hell. I traded for it just for his sake, and because I felt like I've missed out on apparently being the only person who carried through the 2008-2012 timeframe but has never owned an LCP.

Anyways, it needs orange paint on the front sight. I seem to remember you suggesting a specific orange paint, but I can't find it now.

Suggestion?

I had to dig for it. This thread has gotten nearly as long as the 1301 thread (not quite)...



P380 front sight paint job. Testors fluorescent orange enamel.

https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20211210/005ebb31b2f3050323063b8cb34b1457.jpg

https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20211210/c05c91e762e352c84656e0500e786804.jpg

[Up1911Fan]

A Beretta 3032 Tomcat has always been a gun I'd like to have. But I want better sights. Anyone know of a shop that could install a better set similar to what Innovative Arms does the the Keltec's and LCP's?

[Totem Polar]

That is a sexy picture.

I’m a strong believer in sights on mouseguns.

Tiniest mouse gun
Carries great in the pocket
Lack of sights blows chimp

[jandbj]

That is a sexy picture.

I’m a strong believer in sights on mouseguns.

The Autauga Arms knockoff of the Seecamp .32 had sights… but I’ve never seen one in person.

https://www.guncollectorsclub.com/autauga-arms.htm

[Clusterfrack]

Tiniest mouse gun
Carries great in the pocket
Lack of sights blows chimp


The Autauga Arms knockoff of the Seecamp .32 had sights… but I’ve never seen one in person.

https://www.guncollectorsclub.com/autauga-arms.htm

Interesting. The Seecamp is a blowback action? I guess that makes sense in a .32.

[Totem Polar]

Interesting. The Seecamp is a blowback action? I guess that makes sense in a .32.


Technically, it’s a retarded blowback.

The little thing uses a chamber ring that effectively sees the front of the case mouth expand slightly more than the back, which then causes the front of the case to drag a bit on the way out, delaying the action.

Louis Seecamp was smart enough to not go full retard. :D

[Totem Polar]

As an aside, NAA used to do custom mods to their own Seecamp knockoff, including a sight package:

[Glenn E. Meyer]

I am tempted to shoot a 30 target USPSA stage with my NAA 22S Mini just to watch the others go up in flames with my reloads. I will carefully plan them before I shoot. It might take me a half hour to complete the stage.

When we had our carry gun match, I shot my G42 pretty well. The comments - OH, you could get an extended magazine - not the purpose of the gun. The reloaders - hey, the 380s are screwing us up! They got confused.

[SCCY Marshal]

A Beretta 3032 Tomcat has always been a gun I'd like to have. But I want better sights. Anyone know of a shop that could install a better set similar to what Innovative Arms does the the Keltec's and LCP's?

How hard is it to track down an Alleycat, these days? A 3032 with factory big dot front sight. Which implies that if Beretta could do it, a decent smith can.

[Up1911Fan]

How hard is it to track down an Alleycat, these days? A 3032 with factory big dot front sight. Which implies that if Beretta could do it, a decent smith can.

None on gunbroker.

[Gater]

None on gunbroker.

https://www.guns.com/firearms/handguns/semi-auto/beretta-usa-3032-tomcat-32-acp-single-double-action-7-rounds-2-4-barrel-used?p=940919

That looks like one. Not sure the description matches.

[wmu12071]

108348

This is my .32 with sights and mouse gun solution. I came to the realization that I have carried this little gun for more major life events then any G19, 1911, or P229. My main carry gun is now a P365xl but I still love this gun. Upgraded sights are a must though.

[SouthNarc]

A rather large mouse gun.

2017 Beretta 81FS unfired and new in box in .32 ACP.

[SouthNarc]

And a small mouse gun that’s fairly unique and rare in the U.S.

CZ45 in 25 ACP. Great shooting little DA gun that’s safe to carry chamber hot and holds 8 rounds of 25 ACP BBS. Elegant little purse gun.

[Moped]

A rather large mouse gun.

2017 Beretta 81FS unfired and new in box in .32 ACP.

Nice looking pistol! Really wanting one of these!

[Clusterfrack]

A rather large mouse gun.

2017 Beretta 81FS unfired and new in box in .32 ACP.

108408

[Totem Polar]

Capybara cannon.

[MattyD380]

As an aside, MattyD380, I’ve had a couple of different Seecamps over the years. Very cool little guns for what they are, but I just can’t get past the lack of real sights.

108297

Very nice. Yeah, I thought mine was neat. And very classy. But... for a range of reasons... it just didn't really seem like a completely practical solution for me. Mine was one of the newer Southwick MA guns--as opposed to the OG Milford CT guns. Don't really know if one generation is/was "better" than the other.

[MattyD380]

And a small mouse gun that’s fairly unique and rare in the U.S.

CZ45 in 25 ACP. Great shooting little DA gun that’s safe to carry chamber hot and holds 8 rounds of 25 ACP BBS. Elegant little purse gun.

Oh, man! I've always wanted one of these.

I've read that these things were kind of the basis for the Seecamp design. But seems like the CZ45 is just a bit bigger, a bit more shootable and maybe a bit less finicky in terms of ammo, maintenance, etc.

They made an updated version called the CZ92--which of course was never imported, per the 1968 Gun Control Act.

[Totem Polar]

I’m still a sucker for a German-made TPH. At some point, I might find one.

[Clusterfrack]

Testing MagGuts +1 spring/follower kits in p380 mags. If these work, I’ll have 7+1 in the gun and 8 in the spare mag.

https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20230820/7a160abdfabca2710688d109dc916f11.jpg

[Evil_Ed]

A few months ago (https://pistol-forum.com/showthread.php?48184-Bottom-Feeding-32-Popguns&p=1479087&viewfull=1#post1479087) I picked up a Mauser HSc in 32, and this thread was one of the catalysts for the purchase. It more or less worked at the range; honestly it shot like it had never really been broken in at all, so...

I can't shoot it for shit with two hands, so I guess I need to learn how to shoot it one-handed; you know, like it was designed to be fired, I guess :rolleyes:

[Polecat]

The Mausers are really cool. I think the HK4 was modeled after them. I love the .32, mild recoil. I wish there more pocket guns offered in .32 ACP today.

[Evil_Ed]

The Mausers are really cool. I think the HK4 was modeled after them. I love the .32, mild recoil. I wish there more pocket guns offered in .32 ACP today.

The guy who was responsible for designing (or at least participated in the design of) the Mauser landed at HK post-war, and the HK4 was essentially a product improved HSc...some updates from experimenting during the war on shortening production time and resources (like using a stamped slide; didn't work so well for Walther during wartime resource crunches but perfected post-war), with some other updates.

[idahojess]

I picked up a Beretta 21A in 22LR last week and ran about 70 CCI Tactical 22s (the ones that are designed for MP-15-22's) through it on Friday. After the Beretta rebate, the gun will be pretty cheap. It is really just a fun gun at this point.

It ran pretty well, with one odd malfunction with (I think) about four rounds left in the magazine. I pulled the trigger, the hammer dropped with no bang. When I flipped up the barrel, the chamber was empty. I'm not sure whether I bumped the magazine release (I'm a lefty), or whether there was rimlock keeping the round from loading.

As I've mentioned in other threads, I do have an injured right hand. I did find the magazine to be a pain to load, especially to 7 rounds. I think I'll get a magazine tool to assist, and maybe just load 6 in the magazine. Racking the slide with the hammer down is a bit of a pain, too, but I don't think there is much need to do it.

For a mag loading tool it looks like maybe this would work?: https://hilljak.com/shop/ols/products/beretta-21a-bobcat-neon-green. Anyone have any other magloader choices?

[Evil_Ed]

Funny that this thread popped back up. Yesterday at the funstore I stopped in to check on some things I had consigned; had zero intention of actually spending money.

Then I saw this in one of their out of the way "overflow" cases, and threw my credit card like a ninja star at the guy behind the counter.

...and PF's photo uploads are broken; can't upload anything, even 3x3px 5kb files. :confused:

Anyway...it was a 1967-made Walther PPK in 7.65/32ACP, with a little bit of carry wear, and the front sight was painted orange (not that it helps), but otherwise in great condition and shape. Being pre-GCA, it was in all it's unmolested and un-PPK/S glory. And the price was IMO ridiculously good...if it had been a couple hundred more expensive I would have passed on it.

Can't wait to find some time and get it to the range..

[Evil_Ed]

Funny that this thread popped back up. Yesterday at the funstore I stopped in to check on some things I had consigned; had zero intention of actually spending money.

Then I saw this in one of their out of the way "overflow" cases, and threw my credit card like a ninja star at the guy behind the counter.

...and PF's photo uploads are broken; can't upload anything, even 3x3px 5kb files. :confused:

Anyway...it was a 1967-made Walther PPK in 7.65/32ACP, with a little bit of carry wear, and the front sight was painted orange (not that it helps), but otherwise in great condition and shape. Being pre-GCA, it was in all it's unmolested and un-PPK/S glory. And the price was IMO ridiculously good...if it had been a couple hundred more expensive I would have passed on it.

Can't wait to find some time and get it to the range..


111189

111188

Finally let me add them..

Comparing it to my Mauser HSc - the Mauser is more in line with the Walther PP it seems (I don't have one of those to compare it to)...the PPK is a good bit smaller. I always kind of thought the HSc would be more comparable to the PPK, but nope. Now I know why the PPK was a prized BUG/hideout piece for as long as it was...I didn't really understand how concealable it was until I got my hands on one.

[BN]

You're all a bunch of enablers. ;)

I saw that a LGS had a Beretta Tomcat for a very reasonable price. I bought it.

I rummaged around in my closet and I have everything I need to load 32ACP on my 550. I have loaded it in the past with Unique and a 71 grain jacketed bullet. I need to make some empty brass.


Awaiting your review on the Tomcat. I hate to drop that much, but it’s on my short list.


I've probably shot around 200 rounds so far. This is a nice little pistol.

I've been looking for a pistol that I can pocket carry in my draw string sweat pants without it pulling my pants off. :rolleyes:

I've shot Prvi Partizan 71 grain FMJ, Magtech 71 grain JHP, WW White box 71 grain FMJ flat point and my hand loads with 71 grain Berry RN and Unique powder. It has been 100% on function with all round nose ammo. It's had a couple of failure to feed with JHP and flat point. Velocity was around 750+ FPS with most ammo. My hand loads are a little lighter.

The sights aren't too bad. I painted the front sight orange. The rear is a square notch in a dovetail, so it is possibly changeable. It hits low with all ammo I've shot so far. At 20 yards, I am getting 5" groups about 4" low. 7 yards it's 1.5" low with a nice group. Windage is good.

I shot the Wizard Drill from a pocket holster couple times. The first run was a fail because the shots were low. I ran it again and held the front sight a little up out of the rear notch and it was a pass. The gun is pretty easy to shoot.

Reviews I've read about the Tomcat say that it's chunky. I agree. It weighs 16.55 oz loaded. That's heavier than a loaded 442. It is much more compact though. The butt of a J-Frame will stick out of the pocket of my sweats. The Tomcat will make a nice pocket pistol for regular pants, but a little too heavy for my drawstring sweats. I carried it for a while yesterday and it's not too bad in the sweats, but I could tell it was there.

[jandbj]

Reviews I've read about the Tomcat say that it's chunky. I agree. It weighs 16.55 oz loaded. That's heavier than a loaded 442. It is much more compact though. The butt of a J-Frame will stick out of the pocket of my sweats. The Tomcat will make a nice pocket pistol for regular pants, but a little too heavy for my drawstring sweats. I carried it for a while yesterday and it's not too bad in the sweats, but I could tell it was there.

KT P32 or the gen1 LCP really are the best sweatpants guns. Add a CT laser and/or real sights, along with an Aholster pocket holster, and they are both baller AF for that role.
https://ruger.com/products/lcp/specSheets/3755.html
https://www.gunbroker.com/item/1017882246

[SCCY Marshal]

https://tacticalprofessor.files.wordpress.com/2023/11/lagerfeld-sweatpants.jpg

[Leroy Suggs]

* People of WalMart* wear sweatpants.

[BN]

People with sciatica wear sweatpants. :rolleyes:

Sometimes real life gets in the way of being cool. I really would rather load the pockets of my cargo pants with cool self defense stuff, but it is what it is. :(

[Notorious E.O.C.]

Where do Utilikilts fall into this debate?

[feudist]

Where do Utilikilts fall into this debate?

A Trans...itional step between despair and surrender.

[BobM]

I’m lifting in my garage gym so I’m wearing sweatpants. No mouse gun around though. M&P9 nearby in a fanny pack.

[BN]

Continuing with my mousegun sweatpants adventure. ;)

LCP II 22. I've had this for a while and had light primer hits when I first shot it. I installed a Galloway spring kit and that seemed to fix it. I fired 180 rounds before I installed the spring kit with 15 or so light primer strikes. Since the spring kit i have fired 570 rounds with 1 light hit on a Stinger. Most of the rounds have been 40 grain Mini Mags in the 100 round box with Target marked on them. An assortment of Stinger, Velocitor, Punch and misc others.

I chronographed ammo and Mini Mags were 918 fps, Velocitor was 917 fps and Punch was 1087 fps. I also ran some std vel CCI at 839 fps. Ruger says they are best with high velocity ammo so I will use Mini Mags instead of the hyper velocity ammos.

I ran the Wizard Drill a couple of times with passing scores, but the holster that comes with the LCP is horrible. I ordered an AHolster pocket holster for it.

Pictures are a 60 round group at 7 yards shot over the chrono and a 5 shot group at 20 yards. It seems to hit to the sights pretty well.

111213111214

[DDTSGM]

Where do Utilikilts fall into this debate?

"I'll take one foot out of the closet for $500, Alex."

[BN]

Continuing with my mousegun sweatpants adventure. ;)

LCP II 22. I've had this for a while and had light primer hits when I first shot it. I installed a Galloway spring kit and that seemed to fix it. I fired 180 rounds before I installed the spring kit with 15 or so light primer strikes. Since the spring kit i have fired 570 rounds with 1 light hit on a Stinger. Most of the rounds have been 40 grain Mini Mags in the 100 round box with Target marked on them. An assortment of Stinger, Velocitor, Punch and misc others.

I chronographed ammo and Mini Mags were 918 fps, Velocitor was 917 fps and Punch was 1087 fps. I also ran some std vel CCI at 839 fps. Ruger says they are best with high velocity ammo so I will use Mini Mags instead of the hyper velocity ammos.

Continuing with my LCP II 22. I now have 760 rounds through it since installing the Galloway spring kit. Mostly Mini Mags. I think it's ready for carry. I got the A-Holster and it works well.

Today I shot 4 mags at my steel in the back yard. The far target with the orange stripe was about 43 yards and I only missed 1 shot. The others are 12 yds and about 20 yds.

112869112870

[Clusterfrack]

https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20240103/f0a7b476b32a8369c3968fafaae329fa.jpg

[SouthNarc]

How about the mouse gun that ignited WWI?

Close but this is a Browning stamped version and not an FN. This is a rare one that was probably a special order that came into the states as a .32 and not a .380. Not QUITE brand new but damn is it clean.

[SouthNarc]

Definitely 32

[Moped]

How about the mouse gun that ignited WWI?

Close but this is a Browning stamped version and not an FN. This is a rare one that was probably a special order that came into the states as a .32 and not a .380. Not QUITE brand new but damn is it clean.

Gorgeous pistol!!! I have always loved this and the their Colt counterparts!

[D-der]

This and the compliance pistol thread prompted me to dig my 1.5 gen LCP out of the safe after being dormant for a dozen or so years then digging around for some 380 rd's and battery for the CT laser, I never really spent much time with it...thought it sucked but, after shooting DA snub' s over the last few months the trigger only seemed half as long / bad as I'd remembered, I shot it fairly well @ 3-7 yds, which would be my intended application as a bug or extremely light carry npe, got to get some more 380 ball though.

[BillSWPA]

This and the compliance pistol thread prompted me to dig my 1.5 gen LCP out of the safe after being dormant for a dozen or so years then digging around for some 380 rd's and battery for the CT laser, I never really spent much time with it...thought it sucked but, after shooting DA snub' s over the last few months the trigger only seemed half as long / bad as I'd remembered, I shot it fairly well @ 3-7 yds, which would be my intended application as a bug or extremely light carry npe, got to get some more 380 ball though.

Try it in poor light or at an indoor range where you can see the laser. You will find the combination to be much more capable than 7 yards.

[BN]

I'm surprised that lasers don't get more love on here. I have laser grips on several of my snubbies and I just put a laser on my LCP II 22. I'm more accurate slow fire with the laser and equal with both at speed.

[D-der]

I can get good solid 25yd hit's with the laser on my 642, certainly better than with the sights on that gun, I was able to pick up the laser on the LCP at 5yds and got good quick hit's on a 3x5 card out of my pocket

[Dog Face Gremlin]

any love here for the NAA Guardian 380....I know, it's heavy metal and practically no sights....but it works in a Crossbreed Rocket in your back pocket....omo.

[BillSWPA]

any love here for the NAA Guardian 380....I know, it's heavy metal and practically no sights....but it works in a Crossbreed Rocket in your back pocket....omo.

20 years ago I would have told you that the Guardian .380 is the best choice available for pocket carry. That stopped being the case once the Kel-Tec P3AT became a proven design.

I have a Guardian .380 which has the miniature Novak tritium sights which were installed by the NAA custom shop as well as a Teddy Jacobson trigger job. It is my single most heavily customized gun. It also has a Crimson Trace LaserGrip.

I also have a 2nd generation P3AT with a Crimson Trace LaserGuard, and no changes other than heavier recoil and magazine springs and +0 magazine extensions.

Shooting both side by side in bright sunlight which completely negated both lasers showed me how much easier, more accurately, and faster I could achieve hits with the essentially stock P3AT as compared to the customized Guardian. Even the significantly better sights and improved trigger of the customized Guardian were not enough to make up for the superior stock P3AT trigger, even with the unusably small P3AT sights. The significantly reduced felt recoil of the tilt barrel design also helped as compared to the straight blowback of be Guardian.

The Guardian also weighs close to the same as a P365 when both are fully loaded.

[mmc45414]

I'm surprised that lasers don't get more love on here.
I think I am going to start experimenting with them. I think the TLR6 for my Shield Plus is the same form factor as the Streamlight with or without, and JMCK makes a holster.
Might fiddle with something on my AR pistol, and maybe not have sights...

[Dog Face Gremlin]

20 years ago I would have told you that the Guardian .380 is the best choice available for pocket carry. That stopped being the case once the Kel-Tec P3AT became a proven design.

I have a Guardian .380 which has the miniature Novak tritium sights which were installed by the NAA custom shop as well as a Teddy Jacobson trigger job. It is my single most heavily customized gun. It also has a Crimson Trace LaserGrip.

I also have a 2nd generation P3AT with a Crimson Trace LaserGuard, and no changes other than heavier recoil and magazine springs and +0 magazine extensions.

Shooting both side by side in bright sunlight which completely negated both lasers showed me how much easier, more accurately, and faster I could achieve hits with the essentially stock P3AT as compared to the customized Guardian. Even the significantly better sights and improved trigger of the customized Guardian were not enough to make up for the superior stock P3AT trigger, even with the unusably small P3AT sights. The significantly reduced felt recoil of the tilt barrel design also helped as compared to the straight blowback of be Guardian.

The Guardian also weighs close to the same as a P365 when both are fully loaded.


Hmmm.....I was led to believe the Kel-tec was not a reliable pistol....also read and spoke with some that said it was tipically a jamb-O-matic....guess they were pullin' the wool over my eyes.

[Dog Face Gremlin]

20 years ago I would have told you that the Guardian .380 is the best choice available for pocket carry. That stopped being the case once the Kel-Tec P3AT became a proven design.

I have a Guardian .380 which has the miniature Novak tritium sights which were installed by the NAA custom shop as well as a Teddy Jacobson trigger job. It is my single most heavily customized gun. It also has a Crimson Trace LaserGrip.

I also have a 2nd generation P3AT with a Crimson Trace LaserGuard, and no changes other than heavier recoil and magazine springs and +0 magazine extensions.

Shooting both side by side in bright sunlight which completely negated both lasers showed me how much easier, more accurately, and faster I could achieve hits with the essentially stock P3AT as compared to the customized Guardian. Even the significantly better sights and improved trigger of the customized Guardian were not enough to make up for the superior stock P3AT trigger, even with the unusably small P3AT sights. The significantly reduced felt recoil of the tilt barrel design also helped as compared to the straight blowback of be Guardian.

The Guardian also weighs close to the same as a P365 when both are fully loaded.


Hmmm.....I was led to believe the Kel-tec was not a reliable pistol....also read and spoke with some that said it was tipically a jamb-O-matic....guess they were pullin' the wool over my eyes.

[Havoc1967]

I primarily pocket carry, and it is a j frame 99% of the time. However I sometimes do carry an auto loader so have a nice collection of various pocket pistols. Two of best in my opinion have “quirks” (or design flaws) that annoy me.
One is the Beretta Pico which I have wanted for a very long time. Despite its odd appearance it shoots great and has proved to be very, very reliable. However, the Pico has a documented problem with firing pins. Depending on the model (as they upgraded it at one point) the firing pins are prone to break with dry fire use. Now I don’t dry fire. But it does make me nervous to have such a fragile firing pin that dry fire will kill it. That just makes no sense to me. In my opinion modern firearms should be able to be dry fired with risking hard to the weapon. So unfortunately that is always in the back of my mind and makes it hard for me to trust a weapon that seems so awesome in every other way.
The other is the Remington rm380. Been looking for one for a long time as I am a huge fan of pocket pistols with hammers and a heavier trigger. Shooting it is great and thus far it has been very reliable. However that locking pin falls out very easily when tilted to the side and has locked up the gun on more than one occasion when I was quickly racking the slide. According to the manual they added a note about applying grease to the pin when reassembling which supposedly will prevent that from happening. So I did that, and it does seem to move a little bit less. I’m no firearms engineer but it seems to me that this particular issue should have been addressed and remedied.

Having said all that I would have to say that so the 3 “best” pocket pistols for me are the S&W Bodyguard, the Pico and RM380. I am a big fan of hammer fired double actions and I wish there were more to choose from.

As a side note, I just recently ran across this site and am already a big fan 😁

[Corse]

So of course I see this thread after I get a CW380. Mine is a A serial number and it was NIB. I have a little less than 200rds of FMJ through it and so far no issues.

[Clusterfrack]

So of course I see this thread after I get a CW380. Mine is a A serial number and it was NIB. I have a little less than 200rds of FMJ through it and so far no issues.

Good to hear. The CW series is Kahr's budget line of guns, and the CW380 was released later than the p380. So, I don't think A serial numbers are of similar concern. That said, there are plenty of reports of issues with CW guns. I'm guessing recoil and mag springs are common problems with both models.

[Tannhauser]

Hmmm.....I was led to believe the Kel-tec was not a reliable pistol....also read and spoke with some that said it was tipically a jamb-O-matic....guess they were pullin' the wool over my eyes.

It’s not so much that every Kel-Tec is or isn’t a jam-o-Matic, It’s that it’s certainly a known issue Across the product line.

I remember reading sticky posts in a forum That talked about a”fluff and buff” Process for in users to try and resolve issues with jamming in certain models. Certainly not uncommon for people to have problems with certain Kel-Tec pistols. But I am certain there are quite a few users, whose guns ran fine out of the box. It’s more like you just need to be prepared for what you may get.

[BillSWPA]

It’s not so much that every Kel-Tec is or isn’t a jam-o-Matic, It’s that it’s certainly a known issue Across the product line.

I remember reading sticky posts in a forum That talked about a”fluff and buff” Process for in users to try and resolve issues with jamming in certain models. Certainly not uncommon for people to have problems with certain Kel-Tec pistols. But I am certain there are quite a few users, whose guns ran fine out of the box. It’s more like you just need to be prepared for what you may get.

The fluff and buff resulted in a lot of people starting with in-spec guns and taking them out of spec The problem became so common that Kel-Tec had to stop covering pistols under warranty if the owner had messed it up.

Kel-Tecs have their issues, some of which can be fixed with simple changes. Switching to a recoil spring which is 2 lb. Heavier than factory standard is often an easy fix. If the recoil spring guide rod is polymer, do not switch to metal. The flexing of the polymer avoids interference with slide movement.