Loaded guns found in vacation rentals and hotels

[Amp]

This is what happens when people who aren't serious carry guns:

Police in Kill Devil Hills shared pictures of two guns recovered the same day last month. One, a semi-automatic, was left in a nightstand of a vacation home. The other, a Glock brand pistol, was left under a mattress at a nearby hotel. So far this summer, the department has responded to nine such calls.

https://www.wral.com/loaded-guns-left-in-vacation-rentals-and-hotels/19818686/

[HeavyDuty]

I’m hoping I find a nice 1911…

[Le Français]

I’m reminded of the FAM who left a pistol in the latrine mid-flight, and the member of the British PM’s detail who left a pistol in a restaurant bathroom. Inattention happens—though of course it shouldn’t.

[WobblyPossum]

I’m reminded of the FAM who left a pistol in the latrine mid-flight, and the member of the British PM’s detail who left a pistol in a restaurant bathroom. Inattention happens—though of course it shouldn’t.

Wasn’t there an article floating some years back about a report that came out detailing how many handguns FAMS had forgotten in airport bathrooms? I remember it being relatively a lot.

[Le Français]

Wasn’t there an article floating some years back about a report that came out detailing how many handguns FAMS had forgotten in airport bathrooms? I remember it being relatively a lot.

I don't remember seeing that. Preventing this sort of thing is the real reason to use pistol lanyards. :D

[Sensei]

Wasn’t there an article floating some years back about a report that came out detailing how many handguns FAMS had forgotten in airport bathrooms? I remember it being relatively a lot.

Yes. And then there is the Secret Service that has managed to leave guns in the bathroom of AF1 and in Romney’s plane. I think that both were found by press pool reporters.

https://ladailypost.com/secret-service-agent-left-loaded-handgun-in-bathroom-of-romney-plane/

[ST911]

This is what happens when people who aren't serious carry guns:

Police in Kill Devil Hills shared pictures of two guns recovered the same day last month. One, a semi-automatic, was left in a nightstand of a vacation home. The other, a Glock brand pistol, was left under a mattress at a nearby hotel. So far this summer, the department has responded to nine such calls.

https://www.wral.com/loaded-guns-left-in-vacation-rentals-and-hotels/19818686/

Happens all the time. So often, that if you're an FFL in close proximity to a batch of hotels you can make a tidy sum in transfer fees.

[Clusterfrack]

A while back, a LEO left a select fire MP5 in the range shack, and thankfully an honest person found it and turned it in.

[JohnO]

I don't begrudge LEO's who leave behind their sidearm after a bathroom visit. However I'm not happy the consideration they get isn't equally applied to the civilian population. I've seen plenty of reports of cops leaving a pistol on a toilet and nothing came of it. Yet a regular Joe does the same and it is a way different outcome.

[GJM]

One of my Gunsite instructors left their handgun in the bathroom ahead of me during a Gunsite class. My wife once left her fanny pack with a Glock and her wallet on the bed stand in a rental in the FL Keys, and we were nearly to Jacksonville before she realized it. “Jax Center, we need to divert back to Marathon.”

[Rosco Benson]

I have a friend who puts a weaponlight and extended magazine on his carry pistol at bedtime and takes this stuff off upon arising. After checking out of our motel and getting a couple hundred miles down the road, he became convinced that he had left the extended magazine behind when he put the normal capacity mag in it for carry.


A call back to the motel (in a tiny prairie) caused a good deal of confusion when he asked if they could have the maid check the room for a magazine he'd left behind. The motel owner was happy to help, but thought he was referring to a paper READING magazine. I finally said "tell him it's a CLIP....that had bullets in it....for a PISTOL". NOW the motel owner knew what had gone missing. We had reservations there on the return leg, and were just going to have him hold it there.


No dice. No mag was found. It turned out to be in my friend's luggage.

[Outpost75]

SOP following these types of incidents in my day was a 10-day rip and $500 fine back when that was real money.

[lwt16]

Car rental companies call in weekly with guns found in their vehicles.

Happens all the time. Hotels are the same.

Regards.

[AKDoug]

We don't call the cops. We just call the customer. It's only happened once in our VRBO, but it won't be the last as we are in a rural area with bears. People get in a hurry and shit happens.

Even funnier is that weed is legal up here. The wife has found quite a bit of product in our place while cleaning. Nobody is smoking it in the house, so it seems like they are leaving it behind since they can't fly home with it. Why they don't just toss it in the trash is beyond me.

[BigD]

I don't begrudge LEO's who leave behind their sidearm after a bathroom visit. However I'm not happy the consideration they get isn't equally applied to the civilian population. I've seen plenty of reports of cops leaving a pistol on a toilet and nothing came of it. Yet a regular Joe does the same and it is a way different outcome.

Did it occur to you that the LEOs received internal disciplinary action that you aren’t privy to?

What punishment does regular Joe typically receive? I spent a grand total of 3 minutes googling it, and found references to having misdemeanor charges dropped and another reference to a regular Joe receiving a stern warning. (That wasn’t an exhaustive search so you can probably find examples of civilians being charged.)


https://www.fosters.com/news/20180702/police-warn-man-after-he-leaves-pistol-in-portable-toilet


(The Google search mostly returned instances of LEOs leaving pistols behind. Lots of papers carried the story about Cameron’s bodyguard leaving his pistol in the plane bathroom. )

Ask lwt16 what happens to the regular Joe’s that leave pistols in rental cars and hotel rooms? I don’t know what he’ll say, but I’m getting some days on the beach if I do that with a work pistol. And it might make the papers if I do it depending on who finds it. Same if I let mine get stolen. I face repercussions that regular Joe wouldn’t for improperly securing it.

[JohnO]

Did it occur to you that the LEOs received internal disciplinary action that you aren’t privy to?

What punishment does regular Joe typically receive? I spent a grand total of 3 minutes googling it, and found references to having misdemeanor charges dropped and another reference to a regular Joe receiving a stern warning. (That wasn’t an exhaustive search so you can probably find examples of civilians being charged.)


https://www.fosters.com/news/20180702/police-warn-man-after-he-leaves-pistol-in-portable-toilet


(The Google search mostly returned instances of LEOs leaving pistols behind. Lots of papers carried the story about Cameron’s bodyguard leaving his pistol in the plane bathroom. )

Here in CT you will lose your carry permit and most likely have all your firearms confiscated. Failure to secure your weapon. You don't even have to get charged. Although you probably will get charged. What CT has is a "Suitability Clause" and suitability is not defined it is up to the interpretation of the issuing authority or the court to find you unsuitable. (See below.)

Sec. 29-37i. (Formerly Sec. 29-37c). Responsibilities re storage of firearms. No person shall store or keep any firearm, as defined in section 53a-3, on any premises under such person's control if such person knows or reasonably should know that (1) a minor is likely to gain access to the firearm without the permission of the parent or guardian of the minor, (2) a resident of the premises is ineligible to possess a firearm under state or federal law, or (3) a resident of the premises poses a risk of imminent personal injury to himself or herself or to other individuals, unless such person (A) keeps the firearm in a securely locked box or other container or in a manner which a reasonable person would believe to be secure, or (B) carries the firearm on his or her person or within such close proximity thereto that such person can readily retrieve and use the firearm as if such person carried the firearm on his or her person. For the purposes of this section, “minor” means any person under the age of eighteen years.


I've seen the many of the cases before the CT Board of Firearms Permit Examiners. Failure to secure a weapon gets quite a few folks before the board. If a permit is revoked today the next date in the queue is December 2023 and that date will push out to 2024 soon as Dec. 2023 fills. https://portal.ct.gov/bfpe



Most recent situation I am familiar with: A good friend told me one of his contractor buddies' son was arrested when his gun was stolen from his car. This 29 year old was going into a prohibited location. He chose to leave his gun in the car. When he returned from the location his car was broken into and his gun was stolen. He immediately (as required per the law) reported his gun stolen. He was arrested. His permit revoked and authorities came for his other guns. Had he placed the gun in the locked glove box or a dedicated lock box he would have been golden. He didn't! No matter that a plastic glove box with a lock that could be defeated with a nail file would have conformed to the letter of the law.

SUITABILITY

In a recent Superior Court case, the court quoted an 1882 Connecticut Supreme Court opinion stating that suitability “is not defined by the law so that its application can be determined as mere matter of eye-sight, but it is left necessarily to be determined solely by the judgment of the commissioners based upon inquiry and information. And that the particular manner of exercising such judgment cannot be controlled by any court is too obvious to require the citation of any authorities” (Lepri v. Board of Firearms Permit Examiners, No. CV 96-0055714, Sept. 29, 1998, citing Batters v. Dunning, 49 Conn. 479 (1882)).

One court dealing with suitability stated that the government's interest “is to protect the safety of the general public from individuals whose conduct has shown them to be lacking the essential character or temperament necessary to be entrusted with a weapon” (Rabbit v. Leonard, 36 Conn. Sup. 108, 115 (1979)). Another court stated that the “personal views of the agency members are necessarily a factor in the decision, and similar facts and circumstances will have varying probative force in different cases,” but the facts found by the board should provide a logical inference that the person poses some danger to the public if allowed to carry a weapon outside the home or business (Nicholson v. Board of Firearms Permit Examiners, No. CV 940541048, Sept. 28, 1995).

[msstate56]

Sounds like CT is on the NFE list.

[CleverNickname]

Most recent situation I am familiar with: A good friend told me one of his contractor buddies' son was arrested when his gun was stolen from his car. This 29 year old was going into a prohibited location. He chose to leave his gun in the car. When he returned from the location his car was broken into and his gun was stolen. He immediately (as required per the law) reported his gun stolen. He was arrested. His permit revoked and authorities came for his other guns. Had he placed the gun in the locked glove box or a dedicated lock box he would have been golden. He didn't! No matter that a plastic glove box with a lock that could be defeated with a nail file would have conformed to the letter of the law.

Just out of curiosity, if a car's locked glove box counts as a locked container to satisfy the law's requirements, why doesn't the car itself count as a locked container?

[lwt16]

Typically the owner is contacted to come pick up their property. I am not aware of any criminal charges ever being filed unless the person was a convicted felon or something like that.

[HeavyDuty]

Sounds like CT is on the NFE list.

I think there may be something in the water around here - MA is allegedly much the same.

[mmc45414]

Typically the owner is contacted to come pick up their property. I am not aware of any criminal charges ever being filed unless the person was a convicted felon or something like that.I wonder if it is even a crime in many places?

Sent from my SM-G892A using Tapatalk

[JohnO]

Just out of curiosity, if a car's locked glove box counts as a locked container to satisfy the law's requirements, why doesn't the car itself count as a locked container?


keeps the firearm in a securely locked box or other container or in a manner which a reasonable person would believe to be secure

Apparently a vehicle does not qualify as a box or other container. I suppose I would be talking to a lawyer about the "manner which a reasonable person would believe to be secure" part in regards to a locked car. Then you have the financial side of the equation as in how much will the determination of whether or not you were within your Rights actually cost you? Certainly more than a lockbox.

[BehindBlueI's]

We had a guard fired when I worked for DynCorp for leaving his pistol in a bathroom at CENTCOM.


Why they don't just toss it in the trash is beyond me.

Maybe it's a tip?


I wonder if it is even a crime in many places?


Not here. We don't have any sort of storage law. It can be "neglect of a dependent" if your toddler finds it and shoots himself in the chest or the like, but nothing for just forgetting your gun somewhere.

[TDA]

This is what happens when people who aren't serious carry guns:

Police in Kill Devil Hills shared pictures of two guns recovered the same day last month. One, a semi-automatic, was left in a nightstand of a vacation home. The other, a Glock brand pistol, was left under a mattress at a nearby hotel. So far this summer, the department has responded to nine such calls.

https://www.wral.com/loaded-guns-left-in-vacation-rentals-and-hotels/19818686/

Keeping a Polish Tokarev in (presumably) condition three in the night stand drawer of the vacation home does suggest a certain lack of seriousness.

[HCM]

Here in CT you will lose your carry permit and most likely have all your firearms confiscated. Failure to secure your weapon. You don't even have to get charged. Although you probably will get charged. What CT has is a "Suitability Clause" and suitability is not defined it is up to the interpretation of the issuing authority or the court to find you unsuitable. (See below.)

Sec. 29-37i. (Formerly Sec. 29-37c). Responsibilities re storage of firearms. No person shall store or keep any firearm, as defined in section 53a-3, on any premises under such person's control if such person knows or reasonably should know that (1) a minor is likely to gain access to the firearm without the permission of the parent or guardian of the minor, (2) a resident of the premises is ineligible to possess a firearm under state or federal law, or (3) a resident of the premises poses a risk of imminent personal injury to himself or herself or to other individuals, unless such person (A) keeps the firearm in a securely locked box or other container or in a manner which a reasonable person would believe to be secure, or (B) carries the firearm on his or her person or within such close proximity thereto that such person can readily retrieve and use the firearm as if such person carried the firearm on his or her person. For the purposes of this section, “minor” means any person under the age of eighteen years.


I've seen the many of the cases before the CT Board of Firearms Permit Examiners. Failure to secure a weapon gets quite a few folks before the board. If a permit is revoked today the next date in the queue is December 2023 and that date will push out to 2024 soon as Dec. 2023 fills. https://portal.ct.gov/bfpe



Most recent situation I am familiar with: A good friend told me one of his contractor buddies' son was arrested when his gun was stolen from his car. This 29 year old was going into a prohibited location. He chose to leave his gun in the car. When he returned from the location his car was broken into and his gun was stolen. He immediately (as required per the law) reported his gun stolen. He was arrested. His permit revoked and authorities came for his other guns. Had he placed the gun in the locked glove box or a dedicated lock box he would have been golden. He didn't! No matter that a plastic glove box with a lock that could be defeated with a nail file would have conformed to the letter of the law.

SUITABILITY

In a recent Superior Court case, the court quoted an 1882 Connecticut Supreme Court opinion stating that suitability “is not defined by the law so that its application can be determined as mere matter of eye-sight, but it is left necessarily to be determined solely by the judgment of the commissioners based upon inquiry and information. And that the particular manner of exercising such judgment cannot be controlled by any court is too obvious to require the citation of any authorities” (Lepri v. Board of Firearms Permit Examiners, No. CV 96-0055714, Sept. 29, 1998, citing Batters v. Dunning, 49 Conn. 479 (1882)).

One court dealing with suitability stated that the government's interest “is to protect the safety of the general public from individuals whose conduct has shown them to be lacking the essential character or temperament necessary to be entrusted with a weapon” (Rabbit v. Leonard, 36 Conn. Sup. 108, 115 (1979)). Another court stated that the “personal views of the agency members are necessarily a factor in the decision, and similar facts and circumstances will have varying probative force in different cases,” but the facts found by the board should provide a logical inference that the person poses some danger to the public if allowed to carry a weapon outside the home or business (Nicholson v. Board of Firearms Permit Examiners, No. CV 940541048, Sept. 28, 1995).

I grew up across the sound from you. The fact is NY, NJ, CT and MA’s gun laws are blatantly unconstitutional and have been for at least a century.

Change it, move, or accept it.

There seems to be a lot of naïveté in this thread about how careless snd dumb people in general can be. Forgetting a gun in a bathroom or hotel is not ok but pretty mild compared to the irresponsibility people are capable of.

[mmc45414]

Why they don't just toss it in the trash is beyond me.

Maybe it's a tip?
On our recent motorcycle trip to WV we sorta overstocked on beer and food that we couldn't pack home on the bikes. I am sure some of it might hit the trash, but I would hope some of the housekeeping staff enjoyed the beers and frozen pizza.

[AKDoug]

Maybe it's a tip?



On our recent motorcycle trip to WV we sorta overstocked on beer and food that we couldn't pack home on the bikes. I am sure some of it might hit the trash, but I would hope some of the housekeeping staff enjoyed the beers and frozen pizza.

I'm sure it was just a tip, but we still find it funny. Too bad the missus wouldn't let me keep the 4" 626 that was left behind and consider it a tip :D Beer and White Claws are a pretty much constant being left behind. I give those out to my hardware store employees. I'm waiting for someone to leave a bottle of good bourbon or Scotch.

[Trooper224]

I grew up across the sound from you. The fact is NY, NJ, CT and MA’s gun laws are blatantly unconstitutional and have been for at least a century.

Change it, move, or accept it.

There seems to be a lot of naïveté in this thread about how careless snd dumb people in general can be. Forgetting a gun in a bathroom or hotel is not ok but pretty mild compared to the irresponsibility people are capable of.

True, but acknowledging that prevents us from jumping upon our soapbox to give a safety nazi lecture, or voice our opinion on how the cops get away with everything.

Every day while driving too and from work I see people commit far more grevious and dangerous negligence than forgetting a gun in the john or the roach motel. But, this is Pistol Forum, not Drivers Education Forum. So, I guess our moral outrage has to be selective.

[JRB]

I won't even get started on the dumb places I've seen Soldiers leave their weapons by mistake - often high ranking ones.

JBLM was locked down for a day or three a few summers back because a dumbass joe left his M249 SAW on the front bumper of his truck.... and they drove off. The M249 was never recovered, presumably fell off the truck on a road somewhere.

A unit a friend of mine was in at the time had a group of ~25 headed from Huachuca to Ft Irwin on a military bus with individual weapons. They stopped at a civilian truck stop for snacks and shit so they stack arms. First weapons guard gets relieved by the second weapons guard. First guard fucks off into the truck stop and never comes back, second guard asks another buddy to watch things cause he had to shit. Buddy gets sucked into his phone. The weapons were all stacked *behind* the bus. Everyone got done at the truck stop, including both weapons guards, and they loaded up in the bus and drive off.
Buddy didn't hear it or see it because of his headphones and phone. They got almost 5 miles down the road before realizing they'd left one aloof dumb motherfucker at truck stop with a pile of M4's.

One of my joes left his M249 in a guard tower for three hours. I remember seeing him without his weapon and going 'huh' but I was otherwise engaged at the time.
Thankfully, he was smart enough to find it on his own and never say a damn thing to me, his buddies ratted him out. So I never said a damn thing either.

In Kuwait, I know a full bird Colonel who left her loaded M9 on her bed in her CHU, and left the door wide open. MP's passing by saw the unsecured weapon and that was that. A 1-star came and got her out of the brig before she'd even gotten into the brig. I'm told a stern talking-to happened. Us mere peasants would have suffered far worse. This is the same full bird that got caught by our G2 OIC bringing her cell phone into a SCIF *repeatedly* but hey, whatever. Field-grade magic.

Too many 'the LT dropped his pistol in the porta-john' stories to keep track of. Seriously. I've heard of hundreds, and I've witnessed the 'recovery' of an M9 from a porta john least a half dozen times.

My favorite though is the SPC of mine that dropped an M240B into a porta john. Apparently he stood it up in the corner next to the toilet seat on the upper part of the john where the seat is. I was told he started to pee in the urinal on the side, and the 240 unexpectedly slid right into the open toilet at a perfect angle to completely fall in, buttstock-first. I suspected shenanigans, but the story was told several times exactly the same so I left it be.
It was surprisingly hard to fish out because of the length - we had to get it to just the right angle to get it back up and out of the john, which involved a lot of, well, 'stirring'. We ended up removing the buttstock to make it easier. It was pretty disgusting. That SPC took his lumps like a champ, though, and after hosing it out in a shower he meticulously dried it out and LSA'd and cleaned everything.