Para P1445S Classic

[JPNIII]

OK, I don't know anything about Para Ord., but I like the write ups on this 45acp.
I need some input on this particular handgun.

[BCL]

Don't buy one. Their lack of reliability is Legen....wait for it.....dary.

[LittleLebowski]

Finish is air soluble, weapon needs gunsmith attention to function.

[JAD]

Finish is air soluble, weapon needs gunsmith attention to function.
Which should not be interpreted to mean that gunsmith attention will actually make it function.

[JodyH]

Friends don't let friends buy Para.

[DanH]

Para, from Dictionary.com

para-1  
1.
a prefix appearing in loanwords from Greek, most often attached to verbs and verbal derivatives, with the meanings “at or to one side of, beside, side by side” ( parabola; paragraph; parallel; paralysis ), “beyond, past, by” ( paradox; paragogue ); by extension from these senses, this prefix came to designate objects or activities auxiliary to or derivative of that denoted by the base word ( parody; paronomasia ), and hence abnormal or defective ( paranoia ), a sense now common in modern scientific coinages ( parageusia; paralexia )

(emphasis mine)

This cannot be a coincidence imo :p

[JDM]

Para, from Dictionary.com

para-1  
1.
a prefix appearing in loanwords from Greek, most often attached to verbs and verbal derivatives, with the meanings “at or to one side of, beside, side by side” ( parabola; paragraph; parallel; paralysis ), “beyond, past, by” ( paradox; paragogue ); by extension from these senses, this prefix came to designate objects or activities auxiliary to or derivative of that denoted by the base word ( parody; paronomasia ), and hence abnormal or defective ( paranoia ), a sense now common in modern scientific coinages ( parageusia; paralexia )

(emphasis mine)

This cannot be a coincidence imo :p

Well played.

[JPNIII]

WOW, and I almost bought one before I came to this sight to ask about them. Thank guys, you saved me.
Now, I want a high capacity (12+ round mags) 45acp. I have a DXM 4.5 from Springfield arm. and fee like it a made in china POS. Mag drops out during rapid or slow fire and the mag release system is a nightmare. I have colt 1911's and have worked on them all my life but they don't make a "high capacity" modle. This is the first time I've looked for anything outside of auto's.
Who makes a good reliable high capacity 45 acp.?

Thanks again for the save!

[BCL]

WOW, and I almost bought one before I came to this sight to ask about them. Thank guys, you saved me.
Now, I want a high capacity (12+ round mags) 45acp. I have a DXM 4.5 from Springfield arm. and fee like it a made in china POS. Mag drops out during rapid or slow fire and the mag release system is a nightmare. I have colt 1911's and have worked on them all my life but they don't make a "high capacity" modle. This is the first time I've looked for anything outside of auto's.
Who makes a good reliable high capacity 45 acp.?

Thanks again for the save!

If 12+1 of .45 is your magic number, then your options are rather limited. Off the top of my head - Glock 21 Gen4 (13+1), HK USP45 (12+1), MAYBE an FNP-45 (14/15+1 - not a lot of samples out there to prove long term reliability/durability). You could also look at the M&P45, as there are factory extended mags for them (14+1).

That being said, any reason for .45?

[ToddG]

Don't buy one. Their lack of reliability is Legen....wait for it.....dary.

http://24.media.tumblr.com/tumblr_lfdq0vljKR1qbeg0no1_500.gif


Which should not be interpreted to mean that gunsmith attention will actually make it function.

Awesome. And true.


Now, I want a high capacity (12+ round mags) 45acp.

How sold are you on those specs? Would a 12+ gun in another caliber, or a 10rd gun in .45, be acceptable?

[DanH]

If you are sold on .45acp, I hear the Glock 21 Gen4 is MUCH better than the 9mm Gen4's but i have no direct knowledge of them.

[Tamara]

Last gun shop I worked at, I stopped stocking Paras altogether due to customer dissatisfaction, FWIW.

If you just gotta have a high-cap .45 for some gun game or another, and want the ability to use the plethora of 1911 parts out there, and don't want to pay STI prices, and don't mind maybe having to tweak the gun out of the box to get it to run right, then the Para P14 is pretty much the only game in town. Other than that, don't bother.

[BigT]

If you are sold on .45acp, I hear the Glock 21 Gen4 is MUCH better than the 9mm Gen4's but i have no direct knowledge of them.


I havent had a bobble with mine yet. Still pretty new sitting on about 1500 rounds. A mates is on about 3000 without any issues yet. Both will run an additional 1500 rounds over the next week or so.

And for some reason I shoot mine (against the clock) better than the 17 Ive been running for 10 years.

[JAD]

And for some reason I shoot mine (against the clock) better than the 17 Ive been running for 10 years.

It makes perfect sense that the two good examples they've made wound up in another hemisphere.

You may be one of those people who shoots a 1911 better than a Glock. I've heard they exist.

[JPNIII]

Last gun shop I worked at, I stopped stocking Paras altogether due to customer dissatisfaction, FWIW.

If you just gotta have a high-cap .45 for some gun game or another, and want the ability to use the plethora of 1911 parts out there, and don't want to pay STI prices, and don't mind maybe having to tweak the gun out of the box to get it to run right, then the Para P14 is pretty much the only game in town. Other than that, don't bother.

OK, so here’s my story:
I was a cobra pilot in Viet Nam in 1970. Air craft got shot up and I had to set it down about 100 yards from an abandon fire base (crunched it a little dew to hydraulic failure). My front seater (Beretta 9mm) and I (army issue Colt .45) weren’t injured, just banged up a little, bailed and headed for the fire base.
We heard Charlie coming (talking) about half way there and hid just off a trail. Saw them moving directly toward us (they didn’t see us, but we couldn’t move), so at about 20 ft. we opened fire. 9mm fired 4 rounds at the first one, I put one round each in the two to his left. Both of mine went down, the second got off one shot into the dirt.
9mm’s went down last and was returning fire as he was falling. I didn’t inspect the bodies (because we were headed to the fire base where a recovery platoon was in bound), so I don’t know how many hits 9mm got or where the target took the hits. My hit (based on where I was aiming and how the targets fell) were probably in the chest area.
I was partial to the .45 before this just because it was a big bullet. Sense this event I’ve been totally sold on the .45 caliber for self defense. I’ve heard that the 10mm/.40 cal. Hit just as hard as a .45, but have never seen it proved. I can shoot a little faster with a 9mm, but with less accuracy (don‘t like the DA long trigger pull).
Anyway, that’s my story!

What is “FWIW”?
How much “tweaking” are we talking about?
Are the Colt part really interchangeable?
I might could live with a 9mm if it was high capacity SA (cocked and locked carry)

[rjohnson4405]

OK, so here’s my story:
...
What is “FWIW”?
How much “tweaking” are we talking about?
Are the Colt part really interchangeable?
I might could live with a 9mm if it was high capacity SA (cocked and locked carry)

FWIW is "For What It's Worth"
See above where even tweaking may not get it running.
Colt parts are not interchangeable.
If it has to be single action Browning High Power is an option, or a custom 1911 9mm like Todd is running but they aren't cheap.

Your story is using ball ammo (I'm assuming since it's military), if you see the ammunition section and read up on what DocGKR is doing with ammo testing for law enforcement you'll see that with modern hollowpoints the difference between 9mm and 45 isn't much.

And that doesn't include shot placement which is most important because you guys couldn't verify where your shots hit.

Your 9mm doesn't have to be DA either, Glock/M&P/H&K all offer a safe action which is somewhere in between, have you shot any of these?

[BCL]

So.....bullets have gotten a little better in the last 40 years, especially when it comes to modern hollowpoints. Read the thread by DocGKR in the ammunition subforum titled: Service Caliber Handgun Duty and Self-Defense Loads.

If, after reading that, you are still only comfortable carrying/shooting a .45, then you are going to have very limited options if you want a minimum of 12+1 capacity.

Most of the .45's with that kind of capacity are going to have the ergonomics of a brick.

If you are willing to go with 10+1 of .45 or 15+1 of .40/9mm then you have some more options.

Are you going to use this gun for carry? If so, then you should take into account that any .45 with a 12+1 capacity or more is going to be gigantic.

Just my $0.02.

FWIW = For What It's Worth.

By the way, what Beretta 9mm was your front-seater using? Just curious.

[BigT]

It makes perfect sense that the two good examples they've made wound up in another hemisphere.

You may be one of those people who shoots a 1911 better than a Glock. I've heard they exist.
I should have clarIfIed G21Gen4 not paInted ordInance.

[JPNIII]

Yep, I was using ball ammo, don’t know what 9mm was using, model Berretta or ammo (he transferred out about 3 days later).
I have shot a High power once in 1985, like it, but it wasn’t a .45 so never considered it at the time. The only other 9mm I’ve shot was a DA Berretta a few years ago.
Let me read this “Service Caliber Handgun Duty and Self-Defense Loads“ write up.
BTW, you guys are a wealth of information. I really appreciate your time and the info. Thanks.

[JAD]

I should have clarIfIed G21Gen4 not paInted ordInance.
Roger, that restores my faith in the natural order, and makes your surprise at running the .45 better more understandable -- but I'm not sure it's the first I've heard of it.

[Tamara]

Colt parts are not interchangeable.

Incorrect. All std. Colt 1911 parts will interchange except (off the top of my head) frame, mag catch ass'y, trigger, and magazine. Also extractor, if it's one of the newer guns with the fruity "Power eXtracTor".

Heck, I'm running a thumb safety out of an old Painted Ordnance LTC in my Sistema right now.

[JPNIII]

I don't know, I might try one of these.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lqtA84eBmPQ

[BCL]

Have at it. There are exceptions to every rule. The fact that Para made one gun capable of going 1k rounds without a stoppage would not convince me to buy one. Statistically you have a better chance of getting a lemon than a Para that can do that.

[Tamara]

I don't know, I might try one of these.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lqtA84eBmPQ

Yes, Para sponsored me a three-day Todd Jarrett course at Blackwater. (Todd, incidentally, no longer shoots for Para.) I've been exposed to the whole dog & pony show.

I still have the "Gun Blog 9 (http://booksbikesboomsticks.blogspot.com/2008/08/parausa-ltc-9-after-action-report.html)" from that course. While it has been a generally satisfactory performer with FMJ, it has been unreliable enough with JHP to turn a 3-day Awerbuck class into a 24-hour-long malf-clearance drill (http://booksbikesboomsticks.blogspot.com/2010/09/notes-from-class.html). (And this is with a gun that showed clear signs of receiving gunsmithing attention before reaching my hands; I've never seen a factory Para feed ramp that shiny.)

My opinion upthread is unchanged. It's your money, dude: Spend it on ParaOrds, beer, Vegas slots, the ponies... whatever tickles your fancy.

[Maple Syrup Actual]

Up here in Canada where ParaOrd is originally from, there is an expression for double stack 1911s which won't run no matter what you do, for finishes which dissolve on contact with anything, and for warranty service which never occurs.

We call that "paranormal".


Sent from my brain using my hands