Scam Gun supply websites...

[Chomps]

I did a couple quicky forum searches and this specific topic does not appear to be covered anywhere in a single, easily referenced thread, so I thought Id start one. Please feel free to ad any retailers or firearm supply sites of which, you know them to be a scam or mostly disreputable.

Being New to the whole 'pew, pew, firearm community. I'm clueless about a WHOLE lot involving firearms, ammuntion, accessories, and knowing which online outlets for them are legit. Especially now with mid/post pandemic & election panic buying shortages causing the usual, well known, respected sources to be sold out everywhere.

I recently purchased the Walther PDP 4" compact which came with 2-15 round magazines. I Went online to try to find a couple additional ones so Im not constantly reloading my mags @ the range. Naturally,.. SOLD OUT EVERYWHERE! (...or ridiculously jacked up over msrp in price!)

I found a site that had the PPQ M2 15 rnd mags in stock and since they are interchangeable with the PDP I ordered 2. They were even $5 less than the listed $45 msrp.

12 days later, no ship notice,.. No Answer to my e-mails. When I log onto my account/order history, it just says 'New' and 'Paid!' Nothing concerning actual order status. I've since done some Google, review searching and discovered this site appears to be pretty much ALL scam and fake 5 star reviews. So, come Monday, I will be contacting my cc company to see about canceling the charge.

This is the outfit I ordered the PPQ mags from. They're not BBB accredited and LOTS of complaints.
Badger Mountain Supply.



I also recently received an email advertising 1000 round cases of AMMO INC. 115 gr 9mm ammuntion as 'In Stock' and priced @ $549 for the case!!! I was super excited to see that price & I was ALL SET to pounce on the deal. Fortunately, I remembered my issue with BMS and took a beat to search for any negative reviews regarding this outfit. Sure Glad I did. Seems it is yet another site claiming to have stuff in stock but then they almost NEVER seem to getting around to ship them.
This site is:
Locked & Loaded.

So those are the two I've recently run into issues with. Anyone else who wishes to list any problem companies, websites, online outfits they are aware of,… Feel free!

(...mods: if this topic has been covered in another thread? Plz feel free to move or delete!!)

Hope this helps somebody else new to the game, avoid getting suckered.

[rcbusmc24]

Im just gonna go out and say it.... and I'm not trying to sound like a dick, but in the age of online sales and aggregated pricing you are not ever really going to find a smoking hot deal on anything gun related online.....and if you think you did its prolly a scam.... I still find my best deals on things in shops or in person but that has meant developing relationships with people in the industry, behind the counter and such. If you are their boy they will hook you up if they can, if your just a customer then you pay sticker..... thats what I've found works for me for getting stuff... With online sales having to charge sales tax now online shopping for gun stuff can no longer beat brick and mortar pricing around me.

[OlongJohnson]

I have actually had decent experiences with Locked & Loaded. Ordered several times, because they tend to be among the cheapest. Never had the stuff not get here. They may be like Botach, where if something goes wrong, they absolutely suck at fixing it and making it right, but as long as things go right, they're fine. (I've ordered several times from Botach, and only had one bad experience that they did eventually make right.) So it's a take your chance and don't be in a hurry.

I have had bad enough experiences with

https://www.gunsmidwest.com/

https://www.impactguns.com/

https://www.gunsoftx.com/ (a local brick and mortar shop with a know-a-guy-who-knows-a-guy connection)

to never do business with any of them again. In all cases, it crossed the line from bad service to obviously premeditated dishonest and unethical business practices.

[fixer]

Ammoshoponline.com

The absolutely insane shipping prices.

$146 to ship case of 9mm.

[VT1032]

They may be like Botach, where if something goes wrong, they absolutely suck at fixing it and making it right, but as long as things go right, they're fine. (I've ordered several times from Botach, and only had one bad experience that they did eventually make right.)

Botach can be pretty shady, but damnit if they don't have some great deals sometimes. Twice I had them charge my card for items that weren't in stock. I would only learn they weren't in stock when I called because I never received a shipping notification. I haven't bought much from them in a while but they seemed to get better after leaving California.

[blues]

I've only ever had about a handful of purchases with Botach, but I've never had an issue.

[fly out]

I'd be shocked if https://discreetgunsales.com/ is not a scam. They hadn't popped up in my search results for quite some time, but they just resurfaced (for me) when looking for alternate Stribog braces. Beyond sketchy.

[JCN]

Being New to the whole 'pew, pew, firearm community. I'm clueless about a WHOLE lot involving firearms, ammuntion, accessories, and knowing which online outlets for them are legit. Especially now with mid/post pandemic & election panic buying shortages causing the usual, well known, respected sources to be sold out everywhere.

Some friendly advice:
Adjust your expectations. It’s not McDonald’s.

I’ve ordered from a lot of different companies and 12 days without response isn’t out of the ordinary in COVID times.

They even say on their website:

71811

Which should clue you in that they’re probably not scammers, just understaffed.

Also, I’ve had no problem with Locked and Loaded either.

Botach too.

If you want a good deal, you might have to suffer through middling customer service.

I don’t expect the staff at Mickey D’s to wipe my chin after I eat and hand me a towel in the bathroom.

[Chomps]

Some friendly advice:
Adjust your expectations. It’s not McDonald’s.

I’ve ordered from a lot of different companies and 12 days without response isn’t out of the ordinary in COVID times.

They even say on their website:

71811

Which should clue you in that they’re probably not scammers, just understaffed.

Also, I’ve had no problem with Locked and Loaded either.

Botach too.

If you want a good deal, you might have to suffer through middling customer service.

I don’t expect the staff at Mickey D’s to wipe my chin after I eat and hand me a towel in the bathroom.

I read that. I also saw the sparse, 4&5 star reviews for them and for L&L. (...I also read many comments claiming they offer discounts for positive reviews!) However,.. when I researched them, they have an OVERWHELMING number of negative reviews. Pre & post CV19. When the BBB says they are un-accredited and likely a scam site? That's good enough for me.

Sounds like maybe you were one of the lucky ones. That's great! I assume that if they NEVER shipped a product, they wouldn't still be online. (...and isn't it pretty much axiomatic that the criminal always claims to be innocent??)

(...and Im aware that frequently, lone, or rare negative interwebz reviews are often just some Bitchy 'Karen' whining about not getting their asses kissed. But I don't believe that's the case here, not when over 90% of the MANY, MANY reviews say the same thing.)

[Chomps]

I've only ever had about a handful of purchases with Botach, but I've never had an issue.

I read a lot of reviews for them as well. Most stated that while they are SLOW AF, and cust. Svs is almost non existent, they DID eventually get their order at the promised price. I guess Im just not willing to roll the dice.

[VT1032]

I read a lot of reviews for them as well. Most stated that while they are SLOW AF, and cust. Svs is almost non existent, they DID eventually get their order at the promised price. I guess Im just not willing to roll the dice.

This has been my experience, over about 10 years and multiple orders. I eventually got all my orders except for several that I rage cancelled, or they swapped in something similar with my consent (ie magpul instead of ets glock mags, etc). Horrendous customer service, but they sometimes have very competitive deals.

[vcdgrips]

Back in the olden days (1990-2005ish), Botach was very hit and miss. If you really wanted to be sure, you called them and had them hand check if something was in stock before you made a phone order. If it was a bulk order and you were remotely local, I am told you drove over and backed up the truck.

3 things have happened to make Botach much better IMHO-

A. LAPG come on line in 2001ish with solid CS and were almost as inexpensively priced on many items.
B. A few years back, the re-vamped their website which purports to have a real time link to inventory levels.
C. They have made a significant move out of CA.


I never had an issue but I always called until the new website came out.

YMMV Greatly


PS-As an aside 14+ months into this party, I have tried to understand that most people, most of the time, are doing the best they can with what they have. I am blessed to have the health and that of my family as well as a steady paycheck relative to so many others who are literally working their asses of to provide. I am saving my jumping up and down, particularly for things that I do not really "need" for when it really counts. Blessings to all in this time.

[LittleLebowski]

This is a scam site.

https://safegunshop.com/product/ruger-gp100-wiley-clapp-edition-357-mag-3-novak-sights-ss-talo-6rd/

[LOKNLOD]

Early in the course of the pandemic one of my buddies from work/church started to get onto the gun train. I went with him to the range once or twice and helped him him get headed in the right direction, then after buying his first gun he started trying to shop without supervision... and ended up getting scammed by a website who he thought was going to send a gun straight to his house. Poor guy. Showed me the website later and it had more red flags than a Chinese military parade. International shipping, no paperwork, sketchy payment methods, etc. Before figuring out what was going on, he was in a panic and checking with neighbors and stuff looking to see if gun was delivered there by accident...

[beenalongtime]

Early in the course of the pandemic one of my buddies from work/church started to get onto the gun train. I went with him to the range once or twice and helped him him get headed in the right direction, then after buying his first gun he started trying to shop without supervision... and ended up getting scammed by a website who he thought was going to send a gun straight to his house. Poor guy. Showed me the website later and it had more red flags than a Chinese military parade. International shipping, no paperwork, sketchy payment methods, etc. Before figuring out what was going on, he was in a panic and checking with neighbors and stuff looking to see if gun was delivered there by accident...

Was it in Alaska? I think I saw that site recently LOL.

[Chomps]

Just Got an email this morning that my Badger Mountain order was cancelled on me. (...saved me the trouble!) :mad:

I'm unclear on why any of these sites would list things as "In Stock" and take orders when they KNOW they can't fulfill them. You only piss people off and get TONS of lousy reviews. What's their 'Upside' in doing that!!

I know I Most certainly will never order from them again. Of course I will definitely need to double check my cc account to verify that the charges are cancelled.

[JRB]

Just Got an email this morning that my Badger Mountain order was cancelled on me. (...saved me the trouble!) :mad:

I'm unclear on why any of these sites would list things as "In Stock" and take orders when they KNOW they can't fulfill them. You only piss people off and get TONS of lousy reviews. What's their 'Upside' in doing that!!

I know I Most certainly will never order from them again. Of course I will definitely need to double check my cc account to verify that the charges are cancelled.

Basically everything worth buying right now is on perpetual backorder from primary suppliers. So all of these FFL's and businesses have all this stuff on perpetual backorder. Sometimes this gets filled relatively promptly, or with some consistency, such as getting a box of 500 Pmags every other week. That means they list those Pmags as 'in stock' since they're confident they can fill the order in 1-2 weeks.

But when something goes wrong with their supplier, or something expected doesn't show up, or the backorder goes from weeks to months - they end up cancelling orders.

Sadly this is just the state of the whole industry these days, and I think your expectations are very unrealistic for the times.

[Hambo]

Sadly this is just the state of the whole industry these days, and I think your expectations are very unrealistic for the times.

Spot on, brother. l ordered some non-gun stuff from a great company that's 100% reliable. All I got was an email that my order was received. No updates, no shipping info, nada. Two weeks later my stuff showed up. It's all good.

The one thing you better have in the Covid/zero inventory world is patience.

[Casual Friday]

When I need something, I check with Weapon Outfitters (https://www.weaponoutfitters.com/) first because they're only a couple hours away and I typically get my order the next day.

If WO doesn't have what I need, Brownells (https://www.brownells.com/?avad=252061_e21e633d1&aid=199553&cm_mmc=affiliate-_-Itwine-_-Avantlink-_-ale&utm_medium=affiliate&utm_source=Avantlink&utm_content=NA&utm_campaign=Itwine) is next up.

If Brownells doesn't have what I need, I check Primary Arms (https://www.primaryarms.com/?avad=252061_e21e634e5&utm_source=affiliate-referral&utm_medium=social&utm_campaign=199553&utm_content=product-review).

If PA doesn't have what I need, I question how much I actually need what I'm looking for and decide if ordering from some other company is worth the potential hassle. If it's not, I'll just sign up to be notified by email when it's back in stock.

[LOKNLOD]

Spot on, brother. l ordered some non-gun stuff from a great company that's 100% reliable. All I got was an email that my order was received. No updates, no shipping info, nada. Two weeks later my stuff showed up. It's all good.

The one thing you better have in the Covid/zero inventory world is patience.

It’s a little easier if you grew up mailing money orders to Bass Pro Shops with order forms filled out lovingly like some sort of standardized test form, and hoping what you wanted wasn’t out of stock and would eventually show up.

[Doc_Glock]

I almost recently got taken in by a scam website. I actually had the S&W I wanted in the cart and was checking out but they only took applepay or zelle, not usual payment methods. That set off my suspicion, I did some research and it is a pure rip off sight. I should have known because the pistol was out of stock everywhere else. Wish I could remember the place.

[OlongJohnson]

Forgot one.

https://www.armorally.com/

Would only accept a return on a product that the manufacturer had deemed defective if it was in "resellable" condition, as in unmarked, and then would still charge a restocking fee. Implying their intent would be to resell the defective item to someone else.

[Hambo]

It’s a little easier if you grew up mailing money orders to Bass Pro Shops with order forms filled out lovingly like some sort of standardized test form, and hoping what you wanted wasn’t out of stock and would eventually show up.

A week in the mail to get there, and 3-4 more to get your stuff. :D