Group suggesting reintroduction of Jaguars into SouthWest US

[Joe S]

https://abcnews.go.com/amp/US/wireStory/groups-call-reintroduction-jaguars-us-southwest-77722233


Scientists and experts with the Wildlife Conservation Society, the Center for Landscape Conservation, Defenders of Wildlife, the Center for Biological Diversity and other organizations are pointing to more than 31,800 square miles (82,400 square kilometers) of suitable habitat in the mountains of central Arizona and New Mexico that could potentially support anywhere from 90 to 150 jaguars.

They contend that reintroducing the cats is essential to species conservation and restoration of the region's ecosystem.

[Totem Polar]

https://abcnews.go.com/amp/US/wireStory/groups-call-reintroduction-jaguars-us-southwest-77722233

Introduce them along the border.

;)

[Cheap Shot]

Very cool!

[Duelist]

Um, what?!

They never left. There are just as many jaguars here in the mountains of southern Arizona as want to be here. We had a dominant male for ~10 years that spent most of his time here and only travelled south for mating season. He would kill and consume adult bears, deer, javelina, and pretty much anything he wanted, and didn’t let other jaguars come around. Last time I checked the discussions and websites about border jaguars, there were 4 or 5 hanging around in the Huachucas, Santa Ritas, Dragoons, and so forth. Hunting or shooting them is super bad plus illegal, so unless those folks are talking about grabbing some adult cats from somewhere and setting them loose here (how are they going to make them stay vs run back home?), what more do they want to do to “reintroduce” a species that’s already here?!

[RevolverRob]

'Rewilding' is a fairly common concept in conservation biology. Conceptually, the ecosystem balance is very important, realistically, ecosystems are sufficiently disturbed today that attempting to rewild them may not achieve the balance sought, if the variables in the system aren't as clearly understood as thought.

I'm not sure what balance is trying to be achieved here with the proposed reintroduction of jaguars. I would imagine mountain lions have healthy populations in these areas and are sufficient to take all the large prey in the area.

Are there substantial populations of bighorn sheep, bison, or elk in these areas? If so it makes sense (like the reintroduction of wolves and grizzlies into Yellowstone). But if not, then I can't imagine this would end as well as folks think.

I guess my long and short - whenever folks talk of reintroducing macro-predators to areas, my general thought it, "Ah, they're working to get press and drive donations."

Probably more benefit to boosting gopher tortoise populations in these areas than introducing jaguars.

[Borderland]

I bet the ranchers won't be too thrilled about this. But then the fed will probably pay them for the predation. What's the price of beef on the hook these days, $5/lb ?

I can think of worse things the fed could spend money on. Might thin the herds of starving deer also. I remember ranchers saying there were Jaguars in AZ north of the border back in the 60's.

[revchuck38]

Any E-types included?

[Duelist]

I bet the ranchers won't be too thrilled about this. But then the fed will probably pay them for the predation. What's the price of beef on the hook these days, $5/lb ?

I can think of worse things the fed could spend money on. Might thin the herds of starving deer also. I remember ranchers saying there were Jaguars in AZ north of the border back in the 60's.

What herds of starving deer?!

As RevolverRob said, we have very healthy numbers of lions already, in addition to human hunters, so the deer herds aren’t eating themselves out of house and home and don’t need more thinning.

[RevolverRob]

Um, what?!

They never left. There are just as many jaguars here in the mountains of southern Arizona as want to be here. We had a dominant male for ~10 years that spent most of his time here and only travelled south for mating season. He would kill and consume adult bears, deer, javelina, and pretty much anything he wanted, and didn’t let other jaguars come around. Last time I checked the discussions and websites about border jaguars, there were 4 or 5 hanging around in the Huachucas, Santa Ritas, Dragoons, and so forth. Hunting or shooting them is super bad plus illegal, so unless those folks are talking about grabbing some adult cats from somewhere and setting them loose here (how are they going to make them stay vs run back home?), what more do they want to do to “reintroduce” a species that’s already here?!

There is a pretty bad tendency among some conservationists and conservation groups to want to 'return' to some arbitrary point in the past. It's very unrealistic and not well grounded in strong science.

I say this as someone with a bunch of ecologist colleagues. Some of whom I've had to call out for their lack of quantitative data to support rather ridiculous positions.

These days as evolutionary ecology as a field has really matured a better grounding in understanding how ecosystems change, respond, and evolve in the face of a changing environment is allowing much better management and better thinking to occur. Rewilding as a set of hypotheses was really popular 25-years ago, for the most part it is has given way to much more intelligent and nuanced views, studies, and data collection.

Again, basically these ideas are floated to generate $$$$.

[RevolverRob]

What herds of starving deer?!

As RevolverRob said, we have very healthy numbers of lions already, in addition to human hunters, so the deer herds aren’t eating themselves out of house and home and don’t need more thinning.

One jaguar would probably help the deer overcrowding where Borderland lives.

It would certainly help in east and central Texas, where even long deer seasons cannot control the white-tail populations.

Imagine what kind of field day a bunch of jaguars would have in the tall pine forests of the eastern US chomping down on all those feral hogs? :eek:

I can think of a lot of other places where the introduction of macro-predators makes more sense than Arizona, to be brutally honest. But none of them have the charismatic beauty and draw. I mean, introducing jaguars in Louisiana and Alabama makes far more sense, but doesn't draw the press or donations to do it as it would in Arizona.

Never mind that we have substantial paleontological evidence to support that there were a number of large(r) cat species in the American southeast, including extinct cheetahs and cave lions. Today, with an overabundance of non-native prey, it makes complete sense that we throw in some fresh predators to get their primal on.

Personally, I can't think of anything cooler than watching some introduced cheetahs run down some feral piglets and maybe a sow and munch down on them at the end of a farmer's field in Alabama. Come the fuck on, that'd be AWESOME.

[OlongJohnson]

One jaguar would probably help the deer overcrowding where Borderland lives.

It would certainly help in east and central Texas, where even long deer seasons cannot control the white-tail populations.

The island to the north of the one with the deer problem is much easier to get to from the mainland. It has mountain lions on it and the deer are reasonably under control. Still plenty of them, but not out of control.

In Salado, TX, they stopped allowing bow hunting in town, so the deer just hang out in town. Full herds just bedded down and munching in peoples' yards. The place is overrun with them. Apparently, they're smarter than the local ruling class.

[RevolverRob]

The island to the north of the one with the deer problem is much easier to get to from the mainland. It has mountain lions on it and the deer are reasonably under control. Still plenty of them, but not out of control.

In Salado, TX, they stopped allowing bow hunting in town, so the deer just hang out in town. Full herds just bedded down and munching in peoples' yards. The place is overrun with them. Apparently, they're smarter than the local ruling class.

I bet jaguars don't give a shit about bow hunting regulations or city limits. ;)

Seems like an easy solution.

[Default.mp3]

Um, what?!

They never left. There are just as many jaguars here in the mountains of southern Arizona as want to be here. We had a dominant male for ~10 years that spent most of his time here and only travelled south for mating season. He would kill and consume adult bears, deer, javelina, and pretty much anything he wanted, and didn’t let other jaguars come around. Last time I checked the discussions and websites about border jaguars, there were 4 or 5 hanging around in the Huachucas, Santa Ritas, Dragoons, and so forth. Hunting or shooting them is super bad plus illegal, so unless those folks are talking about grabbing some adult cats from somewhere and setting them loose here (how are they going to make them stay vs run back home?), what more do they want to do to “reintroduce” a species that’s already here?!When did you last check? AFAIK, in the past decade, there's only been 3 active jaguars in AZ, with only two seen with any regularity, and one of them, Yo'oko, was killed a few years ago. El Jefe is still spotted from time to time, but its rare enough that when they caught him on camera a few months back that it made the local news. There's no breeding population, with no females seen in the USA for decades.

[Borderland]

When did you last check? AFAIK, in the past decade, there's only been 3 active jaguars in AZ, with only two seen with any regularity, and one of them, Yo'oko, was killed a few years ago. El Jefe is still spotted from time to time, but its rare enough that when they caught him on camera a few months back that it made the local news. There's no breeding population, with no females seen in the USA for decades.

Lots of critters being reintroduced in AZ. When I was on the Empire ranch (Las Cienega's) a few years ago there was a herd of antelope recently reintroduced there. You probably know about that.

[Borderland]

What herds of starving deer?!

As RevolverRob said, we have very healthy numbers of lions already, in addition to human hunters, so the deer herds aren’t eating themselves out of house and home and don’t need more thinning.

You don't think the drought isn't going to kill a bunch of deer? No rain, no food.


https://www.abc15.com/weather/impact-earth/drought-worsens-in-arizona-over-50-in-exceptional-drought#:~:text=The%20drought%20in%20Arizona%20has ,of%20the%20Phoenix%20metro%20area.

[Duelist]

You don't think the drought isn't going to kill a bunch of deer? No rain, no food.


https://www.abc15.com/weather/impact-earth/drought-worsens-in-arizona-over-50-in-exceptional-drought#:~:text=The%20drought%20in%20Arizona%20has ,of%20the%20Phoenix%20metro%20area.

Probably not.

[Borderland]

Any E-types included?

Almost extinct now also.

[Borderland]

What herds of starving deer?!

As RevolverRob said, we have very healthy numbers of lions already, in addition to human hunters, so the deer herds aren’t eating themselves out of house and home and don’t need more thinning.

You think the drought isn't going to kill a bunch of deer?


https://www.abc15.com/weather/impact-earth/drought-worsens-in-arizona-over-50-in-exceptional-drought#:~:text=The%20drought%20in%20Arizona%20has ,of%20the%20Phoenix%20metro%20area.

[RevolverRob]

When did you last check? AFAIK, in the past decade, there's only been 3 active jaguars in AZ, with only two seen with any regularity, and one of them, Yo'oko, was killed a few years ago. El Jefe is still spotted from time to time, but its rare enough that when they caught him on camera a few months back that it made the local news. There's no breeding population, with no females seen in the USA for decades.

So the question is:

Were they hunted to near extirpation or can the region not actually sustain a breeding population?

Without a clear answer, reintroduction efforts should be held until there is a clear answer. Don't get me wrong, the conservation group in question may well have a good, clear, answer. I don't follow these particular efforts, so I can't say.

If it is the former and there is good reason to believe that their populations can be sustained, then I think cautious reintroduction could be beneficial. Both for the ecosystem and for the endangered jaguar.

But a lot of times, people just want to 'return' to some point where they (usually mistakenly) believe that there were more X, Y, Zs, before humans.

[Shotgun]

He would kill and consume adult bears

I doubted that statement, but here is an article discussing, in part, just that.

https://www.smithsonianmag.com/science-nature/return-great-american-jaguar-180960443/

"Removing the bear skull from its zip-lock bag, he shows it to Neils, an expert on black bears from her years studying them in Florida. “This was a young adult female about 230 pounds,” she says. Bugbee then removes the suspected jaguar scat, spritzes it with water, and reseals it in the plastic bag. He waits for an hour and then hides the moistened scat among the cactuses in the front yard. Then he fetches Mayke from her kennel and gives her the command, “Find the scat! Find the scat!”

Mayke systematically searches the yard, zigzagging back and forth with her nose to the ground, until a breeze gets up and wafts the scent toward her. She trots directly to the scat, sniffs it, sits down, looks at Bugbee and barks twice.

“It’s jaguar!” exclaims Neils. The hairs in the scat are later confirmed in the lab as black bear. This is the first recorded predation by a jaguar on a black bear, and as Neils points out, it occurred where the northern limit of the jaguar’s range reached the southern limit of the black bear’s range. “It was north against south, and south won.”"

[Caballoflaco]

RevolverRob you’re going to be working on sequencing bear sloth genes so we can use grizzly surrogates to grow some new ones and re-introduce them the the Pacific Nortwest right? That just happens to be the arbitrary time and place I would like to turn the clock back to and I would be more than happy to donate some money to that cause.

In addition to the general mayhem it would unleash we have enough members in that area that it would probably lead to a pretty sweet bear-sloth defense thread here.

[RevolverRob]

RevolverRob you’re going to be working on sequencing bear sloth genes so we can use grizzly surrogates to grow some new ones and re-introduce them the the Pacific Nortwest right? That just happens to be the arbitrary time and place I would like to turn the clock back to and I would be more than happy to donate some money to that cause.

In addition to the general mayhem it would unleash we have enough members in that area that it would probably lead to a pretty sweet bear-sloth defense thread here.

De-extinction isn't really my bag. You have to wonder if the solution isn't just to introduce more grizzlies to the area.

This reminds me of a story - This could be apocrypha and I don't have a firm source.

Supposedly back about 20-years or so ago, before a decent captive breeding program was really established for Galapagoes tortoises, there was a big hub-bub by conservation biologists. Some studies had been done that found islands without tortoises were floral depauperate compared to those with tortoises present. Further study identified that Galapagos tortoises are one of the key movers of seeds and spores around their islands. They eat the plants and then transport them and shit them out elsewhere. Helping spread flora around the island. The conservation biologists were really upset, because they needed Galapagos tortoises to do this work on the islands where they once were to help preserve the fragile ecosystems. Apparently, after much arguing, one of the three evolutionary biologists invited to this conference stood up and said, "Why don't you just put a large tortoise, any large tortoise, on those islands?"

As someone who has worked on a lot of turtles over the years. A tortoise is a tortoise is a tortoise, like they really all kind of do the same things.

Apparently, these folks were so adamant that it had to be a Galapagos tortoise, they couldn't fathom the idea of sticking a few sulcate tortoises on the islands, until a captive breeding program got started. So, instead, they hand dispersed seeds around the islands...

To me this is a classic example of what happens when you don't consider that there are real alternatives and you just need to use your brain. Realistically though, they used this hand-dispersed efforts as a way of generating massive dollars to create a captive breeding program. I'm probably a bit cynical about this, but I'm careful when I evaluate conservation efforts and who leads them. There is A LOT of money in this realm and I know quite a few people who do really shitty science to promote pretty sketchy results to raise money and awareness. Which is not to say all efforts are nefarious, nor are these efforts all about money. But when I see an avowed 'conservationist' taking a dozen or more international flights a year to attend conferences at remote resorts, I have a hard time taking those people seriously. I'm being really biased right here, because I'm thinking of one specific colleague, but there are many others like this one.

[Doc_Glock]

https://abcnews.go.com/amp/US/wireStory/groups-call-reintroduction-jaguars-us-southwest-77722233

That would be cool.

[OlongJohnson]

Hell, people in Texas are already all over this program.

[scjbash]

'Rewilding' is a fairly common concept in conservation biology. Conceptually, the ecosystem balance is very important, realistically, ecosystems are sufficiently disturbed today that attempting to rewild them may not achieve the balance sought, if the variables in the system aren't as clearly understood as thought.



I've read suggestions to bring some endangered African species here, and better yet, reintroducing extinct megafauna once they get the whole cloning thing mastered. Prides of lions fighting mammoths would make trips to Yellowstone more exciting.

[Jim Watson]

More jaguars, fewer joggers.

[OlongJohnson]

I've read suggestions to bring some endangered African species here, and better yet, reintroducing extinct megafauna once they get the whole cloning thing mastered. Prides of lions fighting mammoths would make trips to Yellowstone more exciting.

Texas game laws apply only to native species. So there are populations of African and Asian animals in the state where the only restrictions on hunting them are land access. People seem to be happy with that arrangement.

Someone likes to ask the question whether you would support cloning T-Rex or not. I vote no. The way I see it working out is, if you had just one, and it got out, it would do some damage, but we can handle one or a small number. We're pretty good at hunting stuff. However, some a-hole would catch a little one, and instead of killing it, would take it somewhere and turn it loose, then charge people to come hunt it. Rinse, repeat. Before you know it, there would be a breeding population, and people all over would be releasing them here and there to charge people to come hunt them. We'd be overrun because of dumbass "capitalists."

Just like happens with hogs, which are spreading around the country much faster than they would without human intervention because of what I just described.

[Joe in PNG]

Well, we're not too far off from accidentally releasing tigers and hippos.

[Borderland]

More jaguars, fewer joggers.

Jesus, where the hell is your compassion and sense of social responsibility to the trail runners and mountain bikers? They already have enough problems with cougars and you want to introduce a whole new predator species? :rolleyes:

[Borderland]

Texas game laws apply only to native species. So there are populations of African and Asian animals in the state where the only restrictions on hunting them are land access. People seem to be happy with that arrangement.

Someone likes to ask the question whether you would support cloning T-Rex or not. I vote no. The way I see it working out is, if you had just one, and it got out, it would do some damage, but we can handle one or a small number. We're pretty good at hunting stuff. However, some a-hole would catch a little one, and instead of killing it, would take it somewhere and turn it loose, then charge people to come hunt it. Rinse, repeat. Before you know it, there would be a breeding population, and people all over would be releasing them here and there to charge people to come hunt them. We'd be overrun because of dumbass "capitalists."

Just like happens with hogs, which are spreading around the country much faster than they would without human intervention because of what I just described.

You don't have a hog problem there, do you?

https://youtu.be/dhLJ1qWlNp4

[RevolverRob]

So, I'm steadfastly in support of cloning dead things.

However...the clones will never be the real things. Both, because they'll come via closely related organisms AND because evolutionarily genes do not work that way.

Still a hairy elephant or a wooly mammoth basically tomato-tomato.

[OlongJohnson]

Texas A&M studied the issue, and found that heli-hogging is the most cost-effective method of hunting them. It's expensive per hour, but the results are enough better than anything that can be accomplished on the ground to overcome that in the ratio.

[Caballoflaco]

I had my megafauna confused earlier and combined giant ground sloth with short-faced bears. I want someone to clone and release short faces bears into the wild.

[Caballoflaco]

So, I'm steadfastly in support of cloning dead things.

However...the clones will never be the real things. Both, because they'll come via closely related organisms AND because evolutionarily genes do not work that way.

Still a hairy elephant or a wooly mammoth basically tomato-tomato.

So what will be the starting point to get us some daeodons, the buffalo sized horse-legged boar-like creatures of yore?


71626

Picture of short-faced bear and daeodon for those who aren’t familiar.

[Suvorov]

Back when my wife would take me to parties at Berkeley I would often tell people at them how I was strongly in favor in the idea of reintroducing the Grizzly to California. They thought I was a good dude until I suggested we start in downtown San Francisco as it would help with the homeless problem.

[revchuck38]

So, I'm steadfastly in support of cloning dead things.

However...the clones will never be the real things. Both, because they'll come via closely related organisms AND because evolutionarily genes do not work that way.

Still a hairy elephant or a wooly mammoth basically tomato-tomato.

Quit screwing around and get on this! We need mastodon tusks for stocks for our revolvers!

[JAD]

71629

[Shotgun]

release short faced bears into the wild.

Curiosity got me. Looks like these things could stand upwards of 13 feet on their hind legs and run between 30 and 40 mph.

[wvincent]

I had my megafauna confused earlier and combined giant ground sloth with short-faced bears. I want someone to clone and release short faces bears into the wild.

Yes!!!
And please, please, RevolverRob, some dire wolves to round things out?

Thank you in advance for your great work.

[RevolverRob]

Yes!!!
And please, please, RevolverRob, some dire wolves to round things out?

Thank you in advance for your great work.

Unfortunately, it turns out dire wolves are not closely related to any of our extant wolves or canines. Ancient DNA analyses have actually revealed that they are a distinct, extinct, lineage. So alas, we have no organism to manipulate to make one.

https://www.smithsonianmag.com/smart-news/dire-wolves-werent-wolves-dna-analysis-reveals-180976765/

This is actually a very recent development. I learned of it last fall, before the paper was published from one of the authors. I had the privilege of serving as a discussion moderator at a (digital) meeting where this was work presented. Very cool stuff.

[wvincent]

Unfortunately, it turns out dire wolves are not closely related to any of our extant wolves or canines. Ancient DNA analyses have actually revealed that they are a distinct, extinct, lineage. So alas, we have no organism to manipulate to make one.

https://www.smithsonianmag.com/smart-news/dire-wolves-werent-wolves-dna-analysis-reveals-180976765/

This is actually a very recent development. I learned of it last fall, before the paper was published from one of the authors. I had the privilege of serving as a discussion moderator at a (digital) meeting where this was work presented. Very cool stuff.

Although you crushed a little bit of my soul with your post, thank you for the learning, it was actually quite fascinating to read.

[CleverNickname]

Someone likes to ask the question whether you would support cloning T-Rex or not. I vote no. The way I see it working out is, if you had just one, and it got out, it would do some damage, but we can handle one or a small number. We're pretty good at hunting stuff. However, some a-hole would catch a little one, and instead of killing it, would take it somewhere and turn it loose, then charge people to come hunt it. Rinse, repeat. Before you know it, there would be a breeding population, and people all over would be releasing them here and there to charge people to come hunt them. We'd be overrun because of dumbass "capitalists."

Yes, but if there's wild T-rexes out there, then that fact would be the ultimate answer to the "bUt yOu CaNt hUnt WiTh ThaT!!11" objections to over-the-counter sales of anti-tank rockets.

[1slow]

The bull pup semi auto Barret comes to mind, out of production, recoil spring housing sat over your shoulder like a bazooka tube.

[OlongJohnson]

Yes, but if there's wild T-rexes out there, then that fact would be the ultimate answer to the "bUt yOu CaNt hUnt WiTh ThaT!!11" objections to over-the-counter sales of anti-tank rockets.

I reckon a technical with Big Mama mounted would handle a T-rex reasonably well. But I'd want the real thing, for sure. None of that weak Barrett sauce.

[LHS]

*Sasha Siemel liked this post*

[RevolverRob]

T-Rex was just a big bird.

Whatever you'd use to hunt a Sesame Street character is probably ideal.

Of course the correct choice is an M1 Garand modified to accept BAR mags.

[revchuck38]

T-Rex was just a big bird.

Whatever you'd use to hunt a Sesame Street character is probably ideal.

Of course the correct choice is an M1 Garand modified to accept BAR mags.

Still a hipster. :rolleyes:

[Robinson]

Unfortunately, it turns out dire wolves are not closely related to any of our extant wolves or canines. Ancient DNA analyses have actually revealed that they are a distinct, extinct, lineage. So alas, we have no organism to manipulate to make one.

https://www.smithsonianmag.com/smart-news/dire-wolves-werent-wolves-dna-analysis-reveals-180976765/

This is actually a very recent development. I learned of it last fall, before the paper was published from one of the authors. I had the privilege of serving as a discussion moderator at a (digital) meeting where this was work presented. Very cool stuff.

Dire wolves in the modern wilderness would probably not compete well with grey wolves anyway. Grey wolves are probably smarter, are better runners, and therefore more efficient predators. I think both species existed at one time, and grey wolves are still here.

[Borderland]

Back when my wife would take me to parties at Berkeley I would often tell people at them how I was strongly in favor in the idea of reintroducing the Grizzly to California. They thought I was a good dude until I suggested we start in downtown San Francisco as it would help with the homeless problem.

https://komonews.com/news/local/growing-homeless-camp-outside-courthouse-creating-safety-concerns-for-employees-residents

[Jim Watson]

On a couple of trips to Hawaii, I learned of the problem of feral goats vs native wildlife, mostly ground nesting birds, and vegetation. They were then fencing off large areas and watching the natives build back up. My idea was open season and publish BBQ recipes. I see now there is a good deal said in favor of shooting out the goats and pigs that was not PC in 1991 and 2001.

[Caballoflaco]

On a couple of trips to Hawaii, I learned of the problem of feral goats vs native wildlife, mostly ground nesting birds, and vegetation. They were then fencing off large areas and watching the natives build back up. My idea was open season and publish BBQ recipes. I see now there is a good deal said in favor of shooting out the goats and pigs that was not PC in 1991 and 2001.

A Hawaii bow hunting trip for goats is one of my dream hunts.

[OlongJohnson]

T-Rex was just a big bird.

Whatever you'd use to hunt a Sesame Street character is probably ideal.

Of course the correct choice is an M1 Garand modified to accept BAR mags.

But if he brings along his friend Mr. Snuffaluffagusaurus, you'll need your elephant gun. Fortunately, nobody but T-Rex has ever seen Mr. Snuffaluffagusaurus.

[RevolverRob]

On a couple of trips to Hawaii, I learned of the problem of feral goats vs native wildlife, mostly ground nesting birds, and vegetation. They were then fencing off large areas and watching the natives build back up. My idea was open season and publish BBQ recipes. I see now there is a good deal said in favor of shooting out the goats and pigs that was not PC in 1991 and 2001.

So, apparently, on other islands they've had really good success using 'Judas Goats'. The trouble with feral goats is, you jump one and they scatter. But if you radio tag a male, he always returns to the herd. So you can track and systematically murder the whole herd. This is how they have eradicated the feral goat problem on smaller islands in the Pacific.

I have a colleague that has hundreds of jaws and skulls from these eradication efforts on a couple of islands in the South Pacific, really cool dataset overall.


Still a hipster. :rolleyes:

Ahem. (https://www.amazon.com/Time-Safari-David-Drake/dp/0671698125/ref=sr_1_1?dchild=1&keywords=Time+Safari&qid=1621354201&sr=8-1)

[UNK]

Well, we're not too far off from accidentally releasing tigers and hippos.

I see the hippos on those rare occasions I venture to the malls. Domesticated mall hippos seem to love soft furry clothing.

[Joe in PNG]

I see the hippos on those rare occasions I venture to the malls. Domesticated mall hippos seem to love soft furry clothing.

Most of the mall hippos I've seen tend to go more for tight and brief clothing.

[UNK]

Most of the mall hippos I've seen tend to go more for tight and brief clothing.
🤮

[Greg]

Spray the Illegal Aliens with liquefied cat food and let the Jaguars do their thing.

[Totem Polar]

Curiosity got me. Looks like these things could stand upwards of 13 feet on their hind legs and run between 30 and 40 mph.

And some distant ancestors of yours and mine hunted them with a combination of spears, balls, and dirty tactics.

Puts the .357 vs .44 magnum for ‘bear defense’ debate into perspective.