Irrational Pocket Guns

[TGS]

Slightly off topic: all this gives me an irrational desire for an NAA mini.

Thanks for inspiring irrational thoughts. Starting new thread to keep the other one from going off-track.

So, let's play a game; you get one of the below irrational, eccentric, or unconventional pocket guns. Which do you buy and why?

COP 357

Bond Arms 45/410 Derringer

Heizer Defense PAK1 (7.62x39), or PAR1 (5.56)

NAA Mini in 22 Short, 22LR or 22 Magnum

Lifecard .22LR

USFA 22LR Zip Gun

_____________________________________________

I'd go with the NAA Mini in .22 Short. The NAA Mini has always seemed like a neat little novelty, and I figure if I'm getting a novelty, then it may as well be as novel as possible Plus, I've got 60 rounds of .22 Short sitting around which is basically a life-time supply for one of these....so, with the way my mind works, this is justification alone to buy the gun. YOLO; go full retard. At the very least, it's actually a very accurate modern take on .22 parlor revolvers from the late 1800s, which is neat in its own right.

The runner-up would be the COP 357. I would need more pastel colored clothes and have to wear sockless loafers/boat-shoes to make it work, though.

You?

[Elwin]

NAA in .22lr, based only on the fact that the NAAs are the one thing on the list meeting two bare minimum criteria - 1) at least somewhat likely to work, and 2) won’t destroy my hand when I shoot it. And .22lr just because it’s a caliber I have.

[Duelist]

I have a P32. It’s a real gun, in a reasonable caliber for its size, that actually works. If I need a micro carry gun for something, that’s the one I’ll use.

Nothing on that list would get me to open my wallet, but if someone gave me an NAA mini revolver, I’d probably keep it as a novelty.

[Glenn E. Meyer]

The 22 Mini in 22 mag/22 LR convertible. Having shot it - I mentioned before that I could shoot a 230 on the old TX bottle CHL test. So if not far I could hit something. The 22S - had it - only scored about a 130 ish if I recall correctly. I argue for the classic configuration, not with the huge optional grips - why, if you want that get a different gun.

Now the 22 Mag offers a flash bang like effect!

I would only carry the COP as a CCW on the Battlestar Galactica, where it was used as such. Now the other guns are ridiculous. I have toyed with getting the Bond tactical looking 45 ACP derringer, never to be shot.

BTW, I sold the minis as shipping them to NYS with FFL, shipping and storage fees (till I got my permit) made it like buying them all over again. Now the real question is to put a WML on the mini.

[Clusterfrack]

NAA in .22lr, based only on the fact that the NAAs are the one thing on the list meeting two bare minimum criteria - 1) at least somewhat likely to work, and 2) won’t destroy my hand when I shoot it. And .22lr just because it’s a caliber I have.

Yes, same. NAA mini. .22 LR. Birdshead grips.

I once shot a buddy’s NAA .22 mag and it was loud. Like really WTF loud.

https://northamericanarms.com/wp-content/webp-express/webp-images/doc-root/wp-content/uploads/2016/04/p-901-22lr_1_7.jpg.webp

[JJN]

I think of the NAA's an E&E tool rather than a defensive firearm.

[jh9]

I once shot a buddy’s NAA .22 mag and it was loud. Like really WTF loud.


Si. It's a five shot portable flash bang that can punch .22 caliber holes with at least minute-of-cereal-box precision. The 1990s 'strategy' I had was to disrupt OODA and acquire distance, repeat as necessary.

https://i.imgur.com/Yd29P0U.jpg

That thing's rode a lot of miles stashed in everything from guitar cases to ashtrays before I had anything more appropriate.

[JRB]

The Bond Arms .45LC/.410 derringer. I'd use mouse-fart SWC Cowboy action loads, preferably with black powder, and yell things like 'I'm ya huckleberry' every time I fire it.

[farscott]

I once owned the Bond Derringer and the USFA ZIP Gun. In both cases, I was sorely disappointed. The Bond trigger pull was as much down as it was back and had to be close to fifteen pounds, and the barrels did not have the same POI. Aiming the Bond was an exercise in frustration. I ended up selling it to someone who wanted a "belly gun" for more than I paid.

As for the ZIP gun, the less said the better for all of us. Other than using Ruger magazines, it had no redeeming features.

Of the list, my choice would be the NAA.

[Hambo]

The COP. It has the highest sale/trade value toward a j-frame.

[Seven_Sicks_Two]

I'll probably end up with an NAA Mini at some point.

I've spent a good chunk of the last year working from home and pocket carrying an LCP, so I'm not totally opposed to going heeled with a mouse gun.

[Clusterfrack]

I think of the NAA's an E&E tool rather than a defensive firearm.

About the same size as a folding knife, and less useful.

[Inspector71]

Raven MP-25. Bought one in the mid 80’s for $49.95 OTD. Surprisingly reliable with FMJ bullets for a Saturday Night special. For that price, I just had to buy it.

[JCN]

Yes, same. NAA mini. .22 LR. Birdshead grips.

I once shot a buddy’s NAA .22 mag and it was loud. Like really WTF loud.

This is sometimes in my pocket.

71076

71077

When I sound meter tested it, it was one of the LOUDEST guns I shot that day.

It’s not a very functional gun, but in a pinch it can do okay.


https://youtu.be/JimzGCHy8CQ

[MickAK]

71079

Embrace irrationality with no redeeming Western aesthetic qualities

[Joe in PNG]

Let's see... I have, in the past, pocket toted a pair of Baby Browning .25's, and if I wasn't a bit paranoid now about the safety risk of either it or the FN 1906, would probably do so as a deep BUG.

And if I could find a .25acp Velo Dog revolver in good working condition, I'd happily tote that as a deep BUG.

[peterb]

Of those, the NAA in .22LR.

Is a Colt 1903 too big and/or too practical?

[Joe in PNG]

Of those, the NAA in .22LR.

Is a Colt 1903 too big and/or too practical?

The 1903 is a bit on the big side, especially for modern pockets. But, the antiquated safety system does make for the possibility of an unintended discharge, so maybe not so practical.

[Elwin]

Probably still in a different universe of impracticality than pocket guns chambered for intermediate/assault rifle cartridges.

[Wheeler]

I want a Lifeguard because I am totally enamored with the idea of having a .22 caliber pistol that will store inside an Altoids tin...

[Half Moon]

The 1903 is a bit on the big side, especially for modern pockets. But, the antiquated safety system does make for the possibility of an unintended discharge, so maybe not so practical.

Not as much big as you'd think. The shape and weight distribution actually disappears and carrys better than a j frame in khakis or dress pants. The slide goes back a fair way behind the grip which makes it ride low and breaks up the print. The grip itself is fairly compact for minimal print too. Plus the overall pistol is slender as a young grass blade. The shape and non existent sights also make draws pretty snag free. Back when though I didn't know about their drop issues. Wouldn't do it today or condition 3 only if I had to.

Back on target though: four barrels have to be at least four times more irrational than one. COP or bust.

[Joe in PNG]

Not as much big as you'd think. The shape and weight distribution actually disappears and carrys better than a j frame in khakis or dress pants. The slide goes back a fair way behind the grip which makes it ride low and breaks up the print. The grip itself is fairly compact for minimal print too. Plus the overall pistol is slender as a young grass blade. The shape and non existent sights also make draws pretty snag free. Back when though I didn't know about their drop issues. Wouldn't do it today or condition 3 only if I had to.

Back on target though: four barrels have to be at least four times more irrational than one. COP or bust.

Don't forget that not only do I have a 1903 (& a 1908), but I've also pocket carried it for a bit. Until the day I realized that it was probably not the safest thing to carry in a pocket.

ETA: thread needs photos.
71084

[Caballoflaco]

First choice would be a Russian MSP with silent piston cartridges, double cartridge clip loading and an external cocking lever under the triggerguard. But, the ATF says I can’t have one because nobody will be able to hear me shoot my eye out.


71083

71085

So, I’ll go with the Heizer defense Pak 1 and some “Russian match” ammo with a 124gr bullet loaded to around 500-600 FPS with trail boss.

[45dotACP]

Definitely the bond arms, but spring loaded and up my sleeve with 185 gr SWCs going 700 fps.

Sent from my moto g(6) using Tapatalk

[Half Moon]

Don't forget that not only do I have a 1903 (& a 1908), but I've also pocket carried it for a bit. Until the day I realized that it was probably not the safest thing to carry in a pocket.

ETA: thread needs photos.
71084

:-)

71087

I'm figuring the numbers and we get but one more of us 1903 owners and we're just this shy of forming a squad of trench raiders...

[CleverNickname]

Not having owned or shot any of them, out of your choices, I'd rank them as:

1) COP 357 - not really pocket gun sized, but at least it's multi-shot in a centerfire pistol caliber.
2) NAA Mini in 22 Short, 22LR or 22 Magnum - multi shot, but it's rimfire.
3) Bond Arms 45/410 Derringer - only two shots, but at least it's a centerfire pistol caliber.
4) Heizer Defense PAK1 (7.62x39), or PAR1 (5.56) - a rifle caliber doesn't gain you anything out of that short barrel, and it's single shot.
5) Lifecard .22LR - Probably a fun conversation piece, but if a single-shot .22LR isn't a dumb enough idea for a carry gun, let's make the shooter have to unfold it first!
6) USFA 22LR Zip Gun - apparently it's an unreliable, unergonomic POS.

They'd all be pretty dumb choices to actually carry though.

[JCN]

As long as we are adding to irrational guns not on the original list.

I give you the worst of both worlds!

71093

71094

[Joe in PNG]

Let's see, have I mentioned my idea of taking my rusty top break S&W .38 lemon squeezer, cutting down the barrel, and adding a big dot style front and an actually visible rear lately?

[BillSWPA]

There was a time when less pocket options were available, and at least some choices were more rational than they are today.

Back when the only true pocket semiauto pistol above .22 or .25 caliber was the Seecamp .32, and acquiring one required waiting 3 years or paying scalper's prices, I needed something highly concealable for NPE carry. The .22 and .25 autos available at the time were often big for what they were, and had questionable reliability. Some people I respected carried .22 NAA mini revolvers, so I acquired a 1 1/8" barrel .22 lr.

These guns are built like Swiss watches, and are completely reliable. However, carrying them in a pocket without a holster risks damaging the cylinder bolt, so always use a pocket holster or other holster. With the hammer lowered into a notch between chambers in the rear face of the cylinder, safety is obvious. The intrinsic accuracy is impressive for a gun that size, but the terrible sight (front only, no rear) and short grip make obtaining that accuracy very difficult. Recoil has a definite affect on bullet placement, amounting to several inches at 15 feet. Penetration in wood was better than the .25 I briefly owned, which gave me more confidence in its effectiveness.

The best way I have found to obtain good accuracy is using the "boot" grip. This grip provides just enough hand engagement for good recoil control without significantly increasing the size that must be concealed. I also tried the oversize grip, but the huge increase in overall size negated the purpose of the gun.

The gun served as a backup gun and, when I really had to be discreet, as my only gun, until I acquired a Kel-Tec P-32.

If I were going to buy one today, I would give serious consideration to the PUG, for the .22 magnum caliber, slightly longer grip, and better sights.

While I would not rely on one as a primary gun today, it would be ideal in circumstances where concealment outweighs all other priorities. I have read of a few successful defensive uses of these guns.

[Paul D]

I love miniguns but the small pocket carry I have now is a Glock 42 or maybe my Kel-Tec P32 (which has been surprisingly normal since I got back in 2003).

71100

[TGS]

Just so this is completely clear;

This thread is mostly tongue-in-cheek...just for fun, hence the thread title and statement of, "let's play a game...". The idea of carrying these guns in any serious manner today is laughable, and the point of the thread isn't to explore their usefulness or find reasons to rationalize carrying a gun that otherwise should merit you getting pistol-whipped in the middle of the night by the ghost of Todd Louis Green.

[Joe in PNG]

I too understand the subtle lure of tiny handguns, and would have a seriously hard time passing up a reasonably priced Bayard .32, Walther 5, or other classic mouse gun.

[Paul D]

Just so this is completely clear;

This thread is mostly tongue-in-cheek...just for fun, hence the thread title and statement of, "let's play a game...". The idea of carrying these guns in any serious manner today is laughable, and the point of the thread isn't to explore their usefulness or find reasons to rationalize carrying a gun that otherwise should merit you getting pistol-whipped in the middle of the night by the ghost of Todd Louis Green.

In that case, both of these guns are pocketable. Yes, I wear parachute pants everyday to work. :D


71102

[BillSWPA]

I love miniguns but the small pocket carry I have now is a Glock 42 or maybe my Kel-Tec P32 (which has been surprisingly normal since I got back in 2003).

71100

What is pictured in the right side of the photo?


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[Paul D]

What is pictured in the right side of the photo?


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

LifeCard22 single shot pistol. Link (https://www.lifecardguns.com/product/lifecard-22lr/).

[Glenn E. Meyer]

Wonder if NAA will come out with a Louisville Special edition. Too soon? I also want a 4 barrel Sharps clone. Iver Johnson supposedly makes one but I never see them. HJS did for awhile but folded. The only time I saw one was when I was visiting my Mom in West Palm Beach and went to a local gun show. A guy had a table of them for $80 each. Couldn't buy one as I was out of state and would have had to do an FFL transfer and that wasn't worth the money. I thought about dragging Mom to get one but at 86 years of age, not a good idea.

The reason for wanting one was my love of Yancy Derringer. I would have wanted one up my sleeve. Later I found that Jock Mahoney was Sally Fields' stepdad and she says he was a molester - sigh.

Fun thread. I also like little tiny knifes and have some stupid Spydercos, just because.

[JHC]

As long as we are adding to irrational guns not on the original list.

I give you the worst of both worlds!

71093

71094

Yep, these break top models tempt me for the ancient break top look

https://northamericanarms.com/shop/firearms/sidewinder-ranger-ii/ranger-ii-sidewinder-ranger-ii/naa-22mbctii250/

[wvincent]

Yep, these break top models tempt me for the ancient break top look

https://northamericanarms.com/shop/firearms/sidewinder-ranger-ii/ranger-ii-sidewinder-ranger-ii/naa-22mbctii250/

Yep, that case hardened one would be very, very, nice.

[Caballoflaco]

Just so this is completely clear;

This thread is mostly tongue-in-cheek...just for fun, hence the thread title and statement of, "let's play a game...". The idea of carrying these guns in any serious manner today is laughable, and the point of the thread isn't to explore their usefulness or find reasons to rationalize carrying a gun that otherwise should merit you getting pistol-whipped in the middle of the night by the ghost of Todd Louis Green.

But, if you took a .32 acp shortened the case a bit and necked it down to .223 and used a 60 gr bullet at 950 fps you’d obsolete the devestating .32naa and create a cartridge a tiny gun that could be really useful....:p

[jh9]

Yes, I wear parachute pants everyday to work. :D



https://media4.giphy.com/media/Xdcj75alQutVe/giphy.gif?cid=ecf05e4737j9o13iarcubpyr2cj088vdcu1s sa3rirvo59r3&rid=giphy.gif&ct=g

Please Hammer, Don't Hurt 'Em.

[Glenn E. Meyer]

I had a neck holster for the 22 Short. It pointed up your jaw. I had a neck holster for a John Shirley Ark knife. Couldn't figure out how to get it out of my shirt. If I wore it over a shirt, my wife wouldn't let me out of the house. I did wear it to matches for COS play and our famous knife stages. Always worried if I drew it, I would slice my chest open. Nice knife though.

[Doc_Glock]

I once shot a buddy’s NAA .22 mag and it was loud. Like really WTF loud.

https://northamericanarms.com/wp-content/webp-express/webp-images/doc-root/wp-content/uploads/2016/04/p-901-22lr_1_7.jpg.webp

I actually think some of my tinnitus is from a single unprotected 22 WMR shot out of one of these. Totally forgot ear pro in the forest. Rookie mistake. Sounds like I picked the absolute wrong gun to make that mistake with though. Damn that was loud. Instant ear ringing.

My one NAA example has been extremely reliable.

[wvincent]

I actually think some of my tinnitus is from a single unprotected 22 WMR shot out of one of these. Totally forgot ear pro in the forest. Rookie mistake. Sounds like I picked the absolute wrong gun to make that mistake with though. Damn that was loud. Instant ear ringing.

My one NAA example has been extremely reliable.

YOU SHOULD TRY THAT WITH A FULL LOAD .41 MAG!
YES, I'M YELLING, STILL CANT HEAR A FUCKING THING!!:eek:

[BillSWPA]

Does anyone have any experience with the 4 shot .22 magnum double action derringer which was briefly made by Advantage Arms?

http://www.ponyexpressfirearms.com/products/rare-advantage-arms-422-4-shot-22-lr-derringer-used/

[BillSWPA]

I had a neck holster for the 22 Short. It pointed up your jaw. I had a neck holster for a John Shirley Ark knife. Couldn't figure out how to get it out of my shirt. If I wore it over a shirt, my wife wouldn't let me out of the house. I did wear it to matches for COS play and our famous knife stages. Always worried if I drew it, I would slice my chest open. Nice knife though.

I have a Kydex neck holster made by Newt Livesay. The holster was molded so that the gun could not be inserted unless the cylinder was rotated so the hammer was in the safety notch between chambers on the rear face of the cylinder.

Neck holsters for a variety of small guns are available from Stellar Rigs, although most of them orient the gun horizontally.

http://www.stellarrigs.com/gun_neckchain_rigs.html

[BillSWPA]

When I bought my NAA .22 lr., a Stinger Pen Gun was next to it in the display case. It looks more like a 2AA flashlight than a pen.

https://www.guns.com/news/2020/11/19/pen-guns-mightier-than-the-sword

[JCN]

It's not a pocket gun, but I would love an Umbrella gun...

https://www.atlasobscura.com/articles/the-true-history-of-the-umbrella-gun-a-surprisingly-serious-weapon

[RancidSumo]

I have a Kydex neck holster made by Newt Livesay. The holster was molded so that the gun could not be inserted unless the cylinder was rotated so the hammer was in the safety notch between chambers on the rear face of the cylinder.

Neck holsters for a variety of small guns are available from Stellar Rigs, although most of them orient the gun horizontally.

http://www.stellarrigs.com/gun_neckchain_rigs.html

I believe I saw these featured in a different thread recently . . .

https://pistol-forum.com/showthread.php?47690-Gear-that-should-not-have-been/page2

[BillSWPA]

I believe I saw these featured in a different thread recently . . .

https://pistol-forum.com/showthread.php?47690-Gear-that-should-not-have-been/page2

Yes, and I definitely have a different level of comfort with a gun in a ready-to-fire condition than a gun with the hammer lowered between revolver chambers.

[jandbj]

71100

Always wished they’d make a 21A with real sights off the 3032. Since they didn’t I bought an LCP2 22 for shits and giggles.

[Wondering Beard]

It's not a pocket gun, but I would love an Umbrella gun...

https://www.atlasobscura.com/articles/the-true-history-of-the-umbrella-gun-a-surprisingly-serious-weapon

Well, I'm more of an umbrella sword kinda guy but put a gun in the combo and this thread is won :-)

[Joe in PNG]

I wonder if NAA could make a knuckleduster in .22mag & .32acp?

[Grouse870]

I have an NAA black widow that has found it’s way into my pocket a few times. I put some cvang grips which really help with shooting 71140
Although I’d also love to have some real sights on my beretta 21a something like what the tomcat has would be nice.

[spyderco monkey]

I wonder if NAA could make a knuckleduster in .22mag & .32acp?

I've long wanted NAA to make a 3 shot version of their revolvers 32 ACP.

.32 is rimmed, and the same length as .22lr. So they could build it on their .22lr sized action, and give it a 2" barrel, and end up with revolver the same length as their 1.5" .22 Magnum models. We'd get more reliable 12" penetration, and much less blast then .22 mag.

https://i.ibb.co/bbJ5Hkz/Screen-Shot-2021-05-07-at-9-00-24-PM.png

In terms of knuckledusters, someone on ARFCOM has commissioned a set of knuckle grips:

https://www.ar15.com/forums/Handguns/Just-For-Fun-Project-The-Apache-Pug-NAA-Homage-to-19th-Century-Gangster-Knuckleguns/33-198595/?page=1

Crude concept drawing of how it would work:

https://i.ibb.co/5MWrrYT/NAA-PUG-Knuck-Option-2.jpg

[Joe in PNG]

Even something in .32 roughly the same size as the old 1 1/2 tip up with a solid frame, removable cylinder, modern materials & short barrel might be interesting:
71182

[spyderco monkey]

Don't forget that not only do I have a 1903 (& a 1908), but I've also pocket carried it for a bit. Until the day I realized that it was probably not the safest thing to carry in a pocket.

ETA: thread needs photos.
71084

A 'modern 1903' is another pistol I have an irrational desire for.

https://i.ibb.co/fCgYbWZ/Ruger-LCP-1903-concept.jpg

Super light, super thin IWB/AIWB pistol, but with a decent sight radius and enough velocity for .380's to expand + penetrate 12", while 7+1 grip allows a full hand grip.

A regular LCP is 9.4oz, figure a LCP1903 would be around 11oz. Overall length would be 6.16", making it possible to also be a pocket pistol.

[Joe in PNG]

A 'modern 1903' is another pistol I have an irrational desire for.

https://i.ibb.co/fCgYbWZ/Ruger-LCP-1903-concept.jpg

Super light, super thin IWB/AIWB pistol, but with a decent sight radius and enough velocity for .380's to expand + penetrate 12", while 7+1 grip allows a full hand grip.

A regular LCP is 9.4oz, figure a LCP1903 would be around 11oz. Overall length would be 6.16", making it possible to also be a pocket pistol.

The Shield EZ .380 is pretty much the modern version of the Colt 1908, and is roughly the same size with pretty much the same action & controls.

[spyderco monkey]

The Shield EZ .380 is pretty much the modern version of the Colt 1908, and is roughly the same size with pretty much the same action & controls.

Its close, but I'd still want the 'LCP1903'; the EZ is 1.05" thick, 18.5oz, and 5" tall. So not really slimmer or lighter or shorter then a 9x19 pistol (its comparable in weight and thickness to a G43X.)

A 1903 sized LCP or Kahr .380 would be 0.75-0.82" thick, 4.5" tall, and weigh 11-12oz. So just a much slimmer and lighter pistol.

[Stephanie B]

Let's see, have I mentioned my idea of taking my rusty top break S&W .38 lemon squeezer, cutting down the barrel, and adding a big dot style front and an actually visible rear lately?

You might want to look through this guy's blog (https://tinkertalksguns.wpcomstaging.com/). Over time, he's done projects like that.

[Blades]

I've long wanted NAA to make a 3 shot version of their revolvers 32 ACP.

I like this idea. Now I have a want for an irrational pocket gun.

[Totem Polar]

https://media4.giphy.com/media/Xdcj75alQutVe/giphy.gif?cid=ecf05e4737j9o13iarcubpyr2cj088vdcu1s sa3rirvo59r3&rid=giphy.gif&ct=g


Us Glock owners are getting tired of it always being hammer time. When will it be “Stop. Striker time.”

Just saying.

[Glenn E. Meyer]

NAA's attempt to make a 32 HR revolver is a well known and ugly flop.

[Wheeler]

NAA's attempt to make a 32 HR revolver is a well known and ugly flop.

Apparently not all that well known. Please do tell.

[OlongJohnson]

Us Glock owners are getting tired of it always being hammer time. When will it be “Stop. Striker time.”

Just saying.

You have a Glock? I thought you just had a bunch of cool revolvers.

[Totem Polar]

You have a Glock? I thought you just had a bunch of cool revolvers.

I hate to be the bearer of bad news, but I have more than one.

Nowhere near as many Glocks as cool old revolvers though—I’m not a complete philistine...

;)

[spyderco monkey]

NAA's attempt to make a 32 HR revolver is a well known and ugly flop.

That was a much more ambitious product then the .32 ACP mini would be.

For the H&R they were trying to create a brand new, mini J-frameish single action Revolver:

https://naaminis.com/smf/index.php?PHPSESSID=74915584ad7ccffeb5cacc352eec9c 04&action=dlattach;topic=2715.0;attach=842;image

https://naaminis.com/smf/index.php?topic=2715.0

The gun is being chambered for 32H&R Magnum. I understand that there are a variety of less powerful cartridges which it will safely fire.

It is a single-action configuration, like the minis, but will sport a full trigger guard.

It is a break-top design.

With a barrel of 1 5/8", overall length is approx. 5 1/4"; different barrel lengths will doubtless be available. As a point of reference, this is approx. the same length as a 22WMR mini (with the same size barrel).

Overall height is approx. 3 5/8" allowing for at least a three finger grip. As a point of reference, this is approx.


https://www.handgunsandammunition.com/threads/naa-32-h-r-mag-prototype.1313/

The .32 ACP Mini is by comparison a fairly simple project. Take the .22LR frame Mini, give it a .32 ACP barrel, and produce a 3 shot .32 ACP cylinder for it. The hardest part is getting the hammer timed for a 3 cylinder rotation vs the normal 5.

To my eye, the whole project seems to pose less R&D work then what was required to develop NAA's break top and side gate opening mini .22 magnums.

[Glenn E. Meyer]

Thanks for posting that. The NAA forums have a big discussion of the problems of the round, pressures, etc.

[Half Moon]

Us Glock owners are getting tired of it always being hammer time. When will it be “Stop. Striker time.”

Just saying.

I feel your Glock owner pain. I mean, look around, everywhere you turn is heartache It's everywhere that you go (Look around)... all in all, somehow never quite in Vogue, somehow never, a chance to striker pose...

[Totem Polar]

I feel your Glock owner pain. I mean, look around, everywhere you turn is heartache It's everywhere that you go (Look around)... all in all, somehow never quite in Vogue, somehow never a chance to striker pose...

LoL!

Greta Garbo and Monroe
Dietrich and Gaston’s ‘ho
Marlon Brando, Jimmy Dean
With a polymer magazine

[Glenn E. Meyer]

Back to the topic, every once in awhile some guy comes up with why he carries a black powder snubby. I grant you some of the smaller BPs are cute but I don't have a DeLorean.

[Rex G]

Thanks for inspiring irrational thoughts. Starting new thread to keep the other one from going off-track.

So, let's play a game; you get one of the below irrational, eccentric, or unconventional pocket guns. Which do you buy and why?

COP 357

Bond Arms 45/410 Derringer

Heizer Defense PAK1 (7.62x39), or PAR1 (5.56)

NAA Mini in 22 Short, 22LR or 22 Magnum

Lifecard .22LR

USFA 22LR Zip Gun



Well, the COP is too large to be a pocket gun.

Bond Arms looks interesting, and I have some .45 Colt ammo. I think we may have some .410 ammo. Ammo matters!

Rifle cartridges with pocket-length barrels? No, thanks.

We have a useless NAA Mini, already in the safe. As the premise of the discussion something I would “buy,” well, I will not spend money on another NAA Mini, that will just be sitting in the safe.

The Lifecard and USFA Zipperhead gun, well, just no.

OK, Bond Arms it is.

[Half Moon]

Well, the COP is too large to be a pocket gun.

They said that about the Colt New Service but did John Henry Fitzgerald let that stop him? No, sir! He persevered. And when the Germans bombed Pearl Harbor what was in his pocket, I ask? Innovate, good sir, I say innovate! :-P

[Rex G]

They said that about the Colt New Service but did John Henry Fitzgerald let that stop him? No, sir! He persevered. And when the Germans bombed Pearl Harbor what was in his pocket, I ask? Innovate, good sir, I say innovate! :-P

I think that Fitz innovated his pockets, in addition to Fitz-ing his revolvers. :)

Anyway, I considered this to be a thought exercise, not a serious carry gun discussion. ;)

[T Smith]

They said that about the Colt New Service but did John Henry Fitzgerald let that stop him? No, sir! He persevered. And when the Germans bombed Pearl Harbor what was in his pocket, I ask? Innovate, good sir, I say innovate! :-P

"Germans?" "Forget it, he's rollin."

[revolvergeek]

I had a COP back in the mid '90s and it was horrible; heavy, bad trigger, kicked more than made sense, mostly would fire all four barrels in a row with four trigger pulls but jacked bullets always tumbled out of two of the barrels. Still I loved it and had wanted one ever since I first saw Blade Runner. Think I spent about two weeks pay on it. Sadly I was a broke college student with a dysfunctional girlfriend so it got sold. I wish that I would have kept it now just to shoot shot shells at snakes with (I just have this vision in my head of a kydex chest holster for it from Survival Sheath Systems and a row ofitty bitty blue and silver shotshells on loops :cool:).

Speaking of pocket flash-bang grenades, there were two American Derringer company guns that lingered in a pawnshop near here for years and year in the late 90s; one a .30 carbine and one a .223. With the .223 the bullet tip was right about even with the end of the barrel. We always suspected that either one of those would clear a room with oneround of surplus ammo!

I have had a progression of NAA Minis and they may not be much but all mine always worked and a couple were surprisingly accurate. They are hugely popular down here as second (or third) guns.

[revolvergeek]

Let's see, have I mentioned my idea of taking my rusty top break S&W .38 lemon squeezer, cutting down the barrel, and adding a big dot style front and an actually visible rear lately?

Remind me to show you something in a month or so. I am waiting on my gunsmith ..... :cool:

[Outpost75]

If you wear tight jeans, then maybe you are limited to a mini revolver, but back in the day wearing straight-legged, full cut uniform trousers and a Pea-coat LEOs commonly carried a 6-shot .38 Special wheelgun in the strong-side hip pocket or hand warmer pocket. It's most important to "dress to the gun."

I was taught by the late Harry J. Archer over FIFTY years ago that an EDC pocket gun should not weigh much more than 20-ozs. Harry preferred "Six for Sure" over any 5-shooter, because a Colt D-frame or S&W K-frame are more manageable firing service loads in DA than a smaller J-frame Smith or Charter Arms and are more accurate at beyond "gorrilla in the phonebooth" distances.

Today just try to find a 6-shot .38 Special which weighs less than 20 ozs… A pre-1980 Colt D-frame Cobra or S&W Model 12 are the correct answer, but because they don’t make them anymore, you find a sturdy, unabused, used gun, then have it LTI'ed by your trusted gunsmith/ armorer and blessed for carry. Airweights are sure handy to carry! Just don’t abuse them with hot loads. Post-1960 steel-cylinder guns are durable enough for high volume use with standard-pressure .38 Special ammo.

While not generally considered +P capable, except for “limited use in extremis,” an occasional cylinder full is OK. Limit +P loads in the Airweights to not more than about 100 rounds, spread gently over the life of the gun, if you want it to last. Otherwise it will loosen up. Common practice was to carry +P ammo on duty, and to use standard-pressure ammo for training and practice. You were issued 18 rounds of duty +P ammo (six in the gun and two reloads) and this would be shot up during quarterly requals, the gun inspected by the department armorer, adjusted or repaired as needed, and replacement duty ammo issued.

My summer “shorts and Polo shirt” carry is a 2-inch S&W Model 12-2, round butt made in 1973. It weighs 18 ozs., empty, with Tyler T-grip adapter and Magna service stocks. I carry it in a Mika pocket holster. From fall until spring, it becomes my "New York Reload," being paired with a 2-inch, steel-frame Model 10-5, carried in the barn coat hand warmer pocket. At age 72 I can still quality with it over a Tactical Revolver Course.

A steel 2-inch round butt Model 10 weighs 30.5 ozs, while the alloy-frame 2-inch round butt Model 12 weighs a pound, empty, without its Tyler T-grip.

A steel frame S&W Model 10 with the skinny contour 4-inch "pencil" barrel weighs 34 ozs. whereas the 4-inch S&W Model 12 Airweight of same configuration weighs 20 ozs. A S&W Model 12 is worth seeking out on gun auction sites if you want a light, accurate six-shot, .38 Special revolver for your survival ruck or travel bag. Used guns in sound, shooter-grade, but not “collector” condition run from $300-600 depending upon condition, about half of what you pay for an equivalent Colt "Snake" gun. LNIB guns with the original factory tools and paperwork bring double that!

[TGS]

jesus christ.....

[Joe in PNG]

Another irrational thought- how about a new production snub top break "lemon squeezer" in .380acp (hey JCN!) with modern sights and stronger materials?