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View Full Version : My pistol-mounted RDS thoughts...is there something new I'm missing?



ASH556
04-27-2021, 03:56 PM
I've messed with an ACRO (300 rds) and a Gen 2 RM06 (3,000 rds) on my G19.5 MOS. Per this thread, I went back to Ameriglo bold-type tritium irons in November (https://pistol-forum.com/showthread.php?45532-I-went-back-to-just-irons-and-I-might-like-it-better).

I've not been doing much with the gun other than carrying it. I have a class coming up in about a week and so I shot about 100rds yesterday and another 100 today confirming sights and POI 0-25yds. Everything is just like I hoped it would be, so we're good there.

I have very good vision and the main advantage I saw to the dot was the ability to hit at distance (50yds +) compared to irons. Not that it's my everyday, but it sometimes gave me great peace of mind to know that I effectively had a PDW concealed on my person at all times. Going back to irons, I have to work much harder past 25yds to achieve good hits, so I occasionally entertain the idea of an RDS again.

Here are my big hangups:
1. Brightness. Even if you adjust the RMR before holstering, it eventually "forgets" where you set it to and goes back to auto-leveling. Furthermore, It takes a second to auto-level. In practice, I found multiple times when I would present the pistol I'd been carrying all day when undressing at the end of the day or around the house and the dot would not be visible.
2. Use in low light with WML. See above, but exacerbated by being washed out by the WML.
3. Battery Life/re-confirming zero after changing batteries

Is there good tech on the market yet to overcome these issues or are we still waiting? I suppose in some ways the ACRO could overcome #1 and #3 if I just ran it on max brightness, but then I'd be changing batteries every month.

I can see where some of these issues might be different for LEO's who in some ways can plan their need for the gun better than I can, check before going into a house, etc. For me as a concealed civilian, the gun has to stay concealed until I need it and when I need it, I need it to be ready 100% of the time. To me, the above issues make it not ready 100% of the time.

Eyesquared
04-27-2021, 04:14 PM
I think those are all RMR specific problems. AFAIK you can lock in a brightness setting with a SRO or a DPP and neither requires you to remove the optic to change batteries. SRO gets very good battery life, DPP maybe not so much but I'm not opposed to changing batteries frequently. I'm not familiar with the Holosun optics.

Edit: this is a tangent but I think the RMR is really overrated. Honestly I think I'd rather spring for a 6moa DPP. But I'm not very tactical so I don't beat the shit out of my optics.

Adam
04-27-2021, 04:15 PM
Holosun sounds like your solution IMO. I’m anxiously awaiting the arrival of mine so I can do a very direct comparison against my RMR.

Nephrology
04-27-2021, 05:54 PM
Personally, I found the effect on accuracy very pronounced past effectively contact distance.

I don't think there are any truly perfect options on the market, but by feature set, I think GJM is probably right that Holosun is your best bet.

tlong17
04-27-2021, 11:09 PM
Holosun for sure

mrozowjj
04-27-2021, 11:29 PM
If you'd told me 3-4 years ago I'd be recommending a Holosun over a Trijicon RMR I'd have thought you were high but let me be the 3rd or 4th person to chime in here and say the Holosun will address most of your oncerns.

With all that said concerning your point #3 is kind of overblown. RMR battery life is still really good; it's rated at something lke 3-4 years so if you premptively change it once a year you will be perfectly ok and zeroing your gun once a year is not too much to ask.

DacoRoman
04-27-2021, 11:42 PM
I don’t have an RDS, but looking into it.

I was reading that the way to do it is to turn the RMR auto brightness level off, and just run one brightness setting constantly on, with a yearly battery change.
Is this not possible?

Adam
04-28-2021, 07:54 AM
I don’t have an RDS, but looking into it.

I was reading that the way to do it is to turn the RMR auto brightness level off, and just run one brightness setting constantly on, with a yearly battery change.
Is this not possible?

We wish. It switches back to auto brightness mode after 16.5 hours. Theoretically if you bumped it up or down and back once per day you are fine.


If you'd told me 3-4 years ago I'd be recommending a Holosun over a Trijicon RMR I'd have thought you were high but let me be the 3rd or 4th person to chime in here and say the Holosun will address most of your oncerns.

With all that said concerning your point #3 is kind of overblown. RMR battery life is still really good; it's rated at something lke 3-4 years so if you premptively change it once a year you will be perfectly ok and zeroing your gun once a year is not too much to ask.

Agreed. “Adam just buy the best, get what you really want...” *proceeds to stare at RMR shaming it’s lack of evolution and features over time*

JCN
04-28-2021, 08:07 AM
Agreed. “Adam just buy the best, get what you really want...” *proceeds to stare at RMR shaming it’s lack of evolution and features over time*

Optics are like televisions and cell phones. The “best” will be soon obsolete and “buy once, cry once” doesn’t apply. You just have to figure that they’re semi-disposable.

It’s another reason why an interchangeable optics plate can be a good idea if you’re not sure if VHS or Betamax will be the dominant platform in the future...

I’m just happy Holosun used the RMR footprint or else I’d be really bumming.

I have that opinion about Acros as well versus the closed emitter Holosun.

Adam
04-28-2021, 09:35 AM
Optics are like televisions and cell phones. The “best” will be soon obsolete and “buy once, cry once” doesn’t apply. You just have to figure that they’re semi-disposable.

It’s another reason why an interchangeable optics plate can be a good idea if you’re not sure if VHS or Betamax will be the dominant platform in the future...

I’m just happy Holosun used the RMR footprint or else I’d be really bumming.

I have that opinion about Acros as well versus the closed emitter Holosun.

Agree 100%. The 507c with ACSS reticle is an interesting concept that I want to explore and I’m afraid that technology is getting passed by something else while I wait for my backorder. 😀

vcdgrips
04-28-2021, 09:52 AM
"Optics are like televisions and cell phones. The “best” will be soon obsolete and “buy once, cry once” doesn’t apply. You just have to figure that they’re semi-disposable."

A lot of wisdom there it seems to me.

Outside of my Lane:

I have been on water's edge for a while. This comment has me staying on there for a while longer. I keep waiting for the ACRO to get sorted to no avail. I hear all the positive comments re Holosun but am very reluctant to go down that road.

It is starting to sound a bet your life optic + mounting (Milled etc. or Better than OEM plates/hardware etc) is going to be as expensive as the base gun for many (500+ optics /500+ Glock)

Thank you all who are spending the time. talent and treasure such that people like me have the data points to make a solid choice on any given day as red dot optics and their pistol mounting solutions continue to evolve.

WobblyPossum
04-28-2021, 10:07 AM
Why is running the ACRO at a higher brightness setting and just replacing batteries more frequently such a big deal? If you buy a bulk pack, the batteries end up being like a dollar each. What’s $12/year to have the peace of mind that your MRDS will always be at the brightness you want it to be at?

Or you could buy a Holosun like everyone else said. Pick a brightness setting that works for you, turn off the auto-adjust, and swap batteries every 6 months or so just to make sure.

psalms144.1
04-28-2021, 10:09 AM
I'm also "on the waterfront" on this issue. I've tried multiple different optics in the past year, and every single one of them has left me with a non-negotiable issue. The most frequent of these is the brightness adjustment - my 507K was always either too bright (hard to see the target through the glare), or too dim (dot disappeared on light colored targets in even moderate light). The auto-adjust on the Swamp Fox Sentinel actually worked great, but the dot was impossible to find among all the flare and light artifacts once you take the sight outdoors.

A buddy just received and mounted an SRO on his "game" Glock - will be shooting on auto-adjust setting Friday, so maybe that will be the "easy button."

Adam
04-28-2021, 10:29 AM
"Optics are like televisions and cell phones. The “best” will be soon obsolete and “buy once, cry once” doesn’t apply. You just have to figure that they’re semi-disposable."

A lot of wisdom there it seems to me.

Outside of my Lane:

I have been on water's edge for a while. This comment has me staying on there for a while longer. I keep waiting for the ACRO to get sorted to no avail. I hear all the positive comments re Holosun but am very reluctant to go down that road.

It is starting to sound a bet your life optic + mounting (Milled etc. or Better than OEM plates/hardware etc) is going to be as expensive as the base gun for many (500+ optics /500+ Glock)

Thank you all who are spending the time. talent and treasure such that people like me have the data points to make a solid choice on any given day as red dot optics and their pistol mounting solutions continue to evolve.

More agreement here and great points. I believe dots are for sure the future and more and more of the present, but I couldn’t do it without members here and elsewhere doing so much leg work on my behalf. I’ve entered in to the dot world because 1) I’m intrigued by the concept and want to try it out and 2) it’s just cool. I’ve done that same math on guns and for sure think you’d be hard pressed to convince me that MANY would get more out of a good 2 day class and ammo than a quality dot setup. But this is PF, not Reddit, so I don’t need to be speaking to others about skill level etc.

OP, you’ve for sure got some options, and they’re better than they’ve ever been if that is any consolation. 😀

tlong17
04-28-2021, 11:20 AM
More agreement here and great points. I believe dots are for sure the future and more and more of the present, but I couldn’t do it without members here and elsewhere doing so much leg work on my behalf. I’ve entered in to the dot world because 1) I’m intrigued by the concept and want to try it out and 2) it’s just cool. I’ve done that same math on guns and for sure think you’d be hard pressed to convince me that MANY would get more out of a good 2 day class and ammo than a quality dot setup. But this is PF, not Reddit, so I don’t need to be speaking to others about skill level etc.

OP, you’ve for sure got some options, and they’re better than they’ve ever been if that is any consolation. 😀

Easy button, low cost quality dot setup like MOS+507c AND ammo, 2 day course from a vetted trainer specific to using a red dot would give you even more!

Utm
04-28-2021, 11:33 AM
I've messed with an ACRO (300 rds) and a Gen 2 RM06 (3,000 rds) on my G19.5 MOS. Per this thread, I went back to Ameriglo bold-type tritium irons in November (https://pistol-forum.com/showthread.php?45532-I-went-back-to-just-irons-and-I-might-like-it-better).

I've not been doing much with the gun other than carrying it. I have a class coming up in about a week and so I shot about 100rds yesterday and another 100 today confirming sights and POI 0-25yds. Everything is just like I hoped it would be, so we're good there.

I have very good vision and the main advantage I saw to the dot was the ability to hit at distance (50yds +) compared to irons. Not that it's my everyday, but it sometimes gave me great peace of mind to know that I effectively had a PDW concealed on my person at all times. Going back to irons, I have to work much harder past 25yds to achieve good hits, so I occasionally entertain the idea of an RDS again.

Here are my big hangups:
1. Brightness. Even if you adjust the RMR before holstering, it eventually "forgets" where you set it to and goes back to auto-leveling. Furthermore, It takes a second to auto-level. In practice, I found multiple times when I would present the pistol I'd been carrying all day when undressing at the end of the day or around the house and the dot would not be visible.
2. Use in low light with WML. See above, but exacerbated by being washed out by the WML.
3. Battery Life/re-confirming zero after changing batteries

Is there good tech on the market yet to overcome these issues or are we still waiting? I suppose in some ways the ACRO could overcome #1 and #3 if I just ran it on max brightness, but then I'd be changing batteries every month.

I can see where some of these issues might be different for LEO's who in some ways can plan their need for the gun better than I can, check before going into a house, etc. For me as a concealed civilian, the gun has to stay concealed until I need it and when I need it, I need it to be ready 100% of the time. To me, the above issues make it not ready 100% of the time.

I keep my brightness settings 1 down from the highest. When I get up in the morning I bump it up 1 and back down 1. I am good to go for the next 16 hours at that point. I do the same thing in the evening which means I'm good to go until morning

Auto brightness is a no go for me due to unpredictability

Annually battery change isn't that big of a deal

mrozowjj
04-28-2021, 11:39 AM
Why is running the ACRO at a higher brightness setting and just replacing batteries more frequently such a big deal? If you buy a bulk pack, the batteries end up being like a dollar each. What’s $12/year to have the peace of mind that your MRDS will always be at the brightness you want it to be at?

Or you could buy a Holosun like everyone else said. Pick a brightness setting that works for you, turn off the auto-adjust, and swap batteries every 6 months or so just to make sure.

While I think it's kind of shameful that Aimpoint of all companies made a red dot that goes through batteries like a fat kick locked in a candy story over night I do tend to agree that I do not understand the mentality of battery changes being that big of a deal as far as cost is concerned.

People will spend $600 on a pistol, $400 on a red dot, and with the current cost of ammo $500-700 for 1000 rounds of practice 9mm but then suddenly are angry at at $1 for a battery. It sucks that the ACRO is measured in months compared to the RMR or Holosun being measured in years but if you love the ACRO more than everything else as long as that battery life is consistent (as in always lasts 4 weeks or 2 months or whatever.) so that you can properly plan around it just replace the battery at whatever interval makes sense. If you change that battery every month it will cost you $120 for 10 years of use.

DacoRoman
04-28-2021, 11:43 AM
We wish. It switches back to auto brightness mode after 16.5 hours. Theoretically if you bumped it up or down and back once per day you are fine.


Thanks for clarifying that!

GJM
04-28-2021, 11:43 AM
Battery changes also bring the possibility of loss of parts and cross threading caps, so it is more than just cost.

psalms144.1
04-28-2021, 11:44 AM
Battery changes also bring the possibility of loss of parts and cross threading caps, so it is more than just cost.This, and, given some designs, requires a trip to the range and expending extremely hard to come by ammo just to verify zero.

Eyesquared
04-28-2021, 11:49 AM
Can't cross thread a DPP cap. Really hoping these new ones work out long-term durability wise.

DacoRoman
04-28-2021, 12:02 PM
Why is running the ACRO at a higher brightness setting and just replacing batteries more frequently such a big deal? If you buy a bulk pack, the batteries end up being like a dollar each. What’s $12/year to have the peace of mind that your MRDS will always be at the brightness you want it to be at?


Sorry to be such a newb, but I’m taking from this that the ACRO P1 reported 15,000 hrs of battery life, as per their web site is bolshevik?
On the required higher brightness settings?

psalms144.1
04-28-2021, 12:04 PM
Sorry to be such a newb, but I’m taking from this that the ACRO P1 reported 15,000 hrs of battery life, as per their web site is bolshevik?
On the required higher brightness settings?Most users are finding MUCH lower battery life - in terms of weeks, not months or years.

DacoRoman
04-28-2021, 12:06 PM
Most users are finding MUCH lower battery life - in terms of weeks, not months or years.

Oh man, Total Bolshevik! Thanks for the clarification!

GJM
04-28-2021, 01:33 PM
Can't cross thread a DPP cap. Really hoping these new ones work out long-term durability wise.

Ease of changing a battery is the single best feature of the DP Pro.

Casual Friday
04-28-2021, 01:53 PM
Personally, I found the effect on accuracy very pronounced past effectively contact distance.

Word. If I was only seeing improvement in my shooting past 25 yards I'm not sure I'd even mess with a dot.

I'm better from bad breath distance and everywhere in between with a dot so I just live with the little nuances of keeping and maintaining an RMR on a carry gun.

For example. The auto adjust after 16 hours. Every time I go potty in public, which is more frequent than 16 hours, I hit the plus button and then the minus to reset the 16 hour clock.

As far as brightness goes, I keep it at a setting that allows it to be visible during the day and not washout when used with a WML or handheld. I haven't had either of my RMRs kill a battery in a year with this practice, so I continue to change batteries yearly.

To the issue of having to rezero after remounting the optic after a battery change because ammo is expensive etc. It's just the cost of maintaining equipment as far as I'm concerned. If it takes 20 rounds at today's prices, that's what it takes. The better the mill job, the closer to zero it will be when remounted. My carry gun was milled by Battle Werx. The pocket is very tight to the optic, and they use the Zev style threaded posts. The RMR has to be nearly perfectly level when dropping it into the pocket or it won't go. It only took a few clicks on the windage and a couple 5 round groups to get it rezeroed and confirmed.

As far as stripped screws and lost parts, buy quality tools, have a reasonable work area, and take your time. Don't be hogging down on the torx driver because you're afraid to put heat to the screws and loosen up the thread locker. Put some heat on it, the optic will be fine. Use new screws every time and get a good torque wrench and pay attention torque specs.

Rex G
05-01-2021, 12:32 PM
The holster-able/briefcase-able PDW factor was what sold me on a red-dotted pistol. (I am not sold on the idea of toting an AR-ish “pistol” inside a huge sling bag.) I bought a milled G45 slide, with an ACRO P-1, and dabbled with it enough to decide to add a second ACRO P-1, which awaits its matchmaking with a weapon, after I learned that the mount I wanted to use on a Ruger Security Six was not rated for the weight of an ACRO.

The panic-demic stopped our range visits, interrupting all T&E indefinitely, though there is now light at the end of that tunnel.

Short battery life is what it is.

Eyesquared
05-01-2021, 01:28 PM
Ease of changing a battery is the single best feature of the DP Pro.

Bit of a tangent but the new 6 MOA dot option seems to check all my boxes so I'm thinking about picking one up.

1. Window bigger than a RMR
2. No removal from slide or mounting plate to change batteries
3. No low sun angle double dot (I think?)
4. Reasonable size dot for a pistol (say, 5MOA to 8MOA)
5. Has actual adjustment clicks, not just screws.

I'm not really concerned with optic height or BUIS height. Hopefully the new battery contact attachment method holds up. I know you've shot them pretty extensively, are there any downsides I'm not considering here?

joshs
05-01-2021, 03:08 PM
Most users are finding MUCH lower battery life - in terms of weeks, not months or years.

I've been getting at least 4 months. CR1225s are cheap, so I just change every 3 months. If I did something where I used it on setting 9-10 a bunch, I'd probably just proactively change the battery.

Battery changes are super simple, so I don't find it much of a hassle.

Cleaning gunk out of an open emitter optic is more of a pain than changing the battery on an ACRO.

SoCalDep
05-01-2021, 08:27 PM
Optic technology isn’t new, but it certainly isn’t “mature”, and so we will need to look at the options and prioritize our needs based on our dedication, motivation, environment, skill, and perceived job/threat/mission.

Each optic out there has advantages and disadvantages. There is no “best” optic. In my opinion, those who haven’t embraced it are simply delaying the inevitable. I get it. It’s a paradigm shift and we all fear change. It requires a learning curve and some dedication, so people “try” it, don’ t perform as well as something they’ve been working on for years (iron sights), and give up after a short period of time. All learning comes with a period of diminished performance. Getting past that is what makes us better, and the dot makes us better.

Managing the implementation of an optic program at a large law enforcement agency has given me a good perspective on what road bumps can occur, but we’re still learning all the time, so road bumps will still happen, including ones we don’t anticipate. I still think it is the way.

As for the questions posed by the OP, brightness is not consistent across optic platforms so settings and management will vary. Optics set on full brightness with no “shake-awake” type function won’t last as long. Optics with shake-awake will last longer, but it creates a functional complication and I’ve seen the shake awake fail. The ACRO has a short battery life compared to other optics. That makes total sense. It uses a battery with a 55mAh capacity compared to a 2032 with 200-240mAh. Coupled with that is that the RMR uses optical coatings to enhance dot brightness at lower battery power levels and comparing it to the ACRO is comparing apples and oranges. You can have an optic with a serious blue tint and the necessity to remove it to replace the battery (I’m more and more not really excited about this) or an optic with a complicated functional system subject to failure (shake-awake) or an optic with shorter battery life.

I have all of the above and multiple examples of most. During our testing of the SRO I left the optic on lock-in mode at full power. The battery lasted 21 days. I bet it would last much longer with a Duracell but it’s something to keep in mind with all the shit-talking about the ACRO.

As for the RMR’s 16hr timeout to auto adjust, I agree it’s a frustration and I wish it could be locked out, but at the same time, it’s probably contributing to the longer life of the battery. I’m waiting for an RMR with an SRO top-load battery and the SRO’s ability to lock-in the brightness setting. Until then, the three RMRs I have will be the only RMRs I have. That said, my carry gun has an RMR (RM09) and whenever I go to carry it I go to full brightness and then down two steps to my preferred setting. I haven’t had an issue and I carry/shoot/practice at home a lot. I know others who have been “surprised” but the auto adjust because they were unaware the optic reverted to that. That’s not so cool but knowledge is half the battle or something like that.

Use of WML in low light with an optic is simple in manual adjust mode. In auto-adjust it’s not so cool, but worst case, setting the optic prior to bed time or darkness can get past this. Worst case, set an alarm. The cool thing with an RMR is that it can be adjusted over the clothes.

My biggest issue with the RMR is the bottom-load battery. It’s frustrating to have to take it off, replace the battery, re-mount, wait 24hrs for the loctite to cure, and confirm or re-zero. What’s worse is that every time an optic is “mounted”, there’s a potential for failure. The longer the optic is successfully secure, the more likely it will remain secure. Being able to change the battery without removing the optic has become a big deal to me and that’s why I’ve become a big fan of those optics. Add some testing for inclement weather and environmental conditions and the enclosed emitter is another big plus. That’s why I’m becoming more and more a fan of the ACRO and 509T.

GJM
05-01-2021, 08:41 PM
1) I had really good luck with the upgraded DP Pro units until April, when a new board regular and 6 moa failed.

2) last night, I was experimenting with a 508T in auto mode with just the circle reticle and a 1,000 lumen Surefire, and the reticle was always usable. What conditions should I test the 508T in auto with a light in?

Eyesquared
05-01-2021, 09:16 PM
1) I had really good luck with the upgraded DP Pro units until April, when a new board regular and 6 moa failed.

2) last night, I was experimenting with a 508T in auto mode with just the circle reticle and a 1,000 lumen Surefire, and the reticle was always usable. What conditions should I test the 508T in auto with a light in?

With the new board DPP, what does the failure mode look like and what kind of round count did it die at? I assume the contact won't migrate anymore like the old ones but is there anything that one could notice before the optic dies?

SoCalDep
05-01-2021, 09:29 PM
We’ve had good experiences with the new DeltaPoint Pros in terms of function, but several have come loose after being mounted well and to the specified torque. I’ve heard that some of the screws were too soft but no confirmation on that.

When we did the formal low-light testing we did the following:

Ambient light on the highest five settings on five different optics from 30 min prior to sunset to 30 min after sunset - recorded every 15 min.

300, 500, and 1,00 Lumen lights at five yards on highest three settings of several (can’t remember if three or five) optics.

Different color shirts on targets from 3-50 yards with 1,000 lumen light on setting three steps down ( and possibly other settings but I’d have to look to recollect) on a Holosun 509T (dot only).

Patrol Car emergency lights and any effect at various distances.

Intense red-only light at close distance.

All optics were easily usable with a WML at settings of three or less down from full brightness. Some worked well even lower. Since we can’t dim daylight we should have optics set to be acceptable in bright daylight and illuminated low light, and usable in darkness (which precludes good threat ID but in that rare event it’s necessary...).

Of course, all this was with manual adjustment. We’ve had reports that red lights will in certain circumstances wash out an auto adjust, and while most seem to feel auto adjust works well in ambient conditions it’s almost universal that they have issues with illuminated (WML or hand-held light) light conditions. I’ll have to look into that more. My first RMR was auto-adjust and I liked it but I was young in all this and I’m currently a big fan of manual.

GJM
05-01-2021, 10:16 PM
With the new board DPP, what does the failure mode look like and what kind of round count did it die at? I assume the contact won't migrate anymore like the old ones but is there anything that one could notice before the optic dies?

I don’t believe it was the circuit board moving — seemed like the motion sensor. When it happened, I just removed them, as it didn’t seem worth trouble shooting further, as they aren’t my first choice for gaming or carry any more.

GJM
05-01-2021, 10:39 PM
We’ve had good experiences with the new DeltaPoint Pros in terms of function, but several have come loose after being mounted well and to the specified torque. I’ve heard that some of the screws were too soft but no confirmation on that.

When we did the formal low-light testing we did the following:

Ambient light on the highest five settings on five different optics from 30 min prior to sunset to 30 min after sunset - recorded every 15 min.

300, 500, and 1,00 Lumen lights at five yards on highest three settings of several (can’t remember if three or five) optics.

Different color shirts on targets from 3-50 yards with 1,000 lumen light on setting three steps down ( and possibly other settings but I’d have to look to recollect) on a Holosun 509T (dot only).

Patrol Car emergency lights and any effect at various distances.

Intense red-only light at close distance.

All optics were easily usable with a WML at settings of three or less down from full brightness. Some worked well even lower. Since we can’t dim daylight we should have optics set to be acceptable in bright daylight and illuminated low light, and usable in darkness (which precludes good threat ID but in that rare event it’s necessary...).

Of course, all this was with manual adjustment. We’ve had reports that red lights will in certain circumstances wash out an auto adjust, and while most seem to feel auto adjust works well in ambient conditions it’s almost universal that they have issues with illuminated (WML or hand-held light) light conditions. I’ll have to look into that more. My first RMR was auto-adjust and I liked it but I was young in all this and I’m currently a big fan of manual.

I just went and took a 2.0 Compact with a 508T an SF X00, and experimented in a variety of lighting conditions with the circle only reticle in auto. It works in a range of light without the light. It works with a dark or medium background with the X300. With a white wall background, you can make out the circle, but it is faint. In those conditions, the backup iron sights jump right out. With just a single dot, it is extremely hard to see it with a white background and X300 illumination.

Based on this, the auto setting is viable, but especially if you plan to use a WML, I think manual on the 508T is the safest bet with a circle, and near mandatory with a single dot.

SoCalDep
05-01-2021, 10:45 PM
I just went and took a 2.0 Compact with a 508T an SF X00, and experimented in a variety of lighting conditions with the circle only reticle in auto. It works in a range of light without the light. It works with a dark or medium background with the X300. With a white wall background, you can make out the circle, but it is faint. In those conditions, the backup iron sights jump right out. With just a single dot, it is extremely hard to see it with a white background and X300 illumination.

Based on this, the auto setting is viable, but especially if you plan to use a WML, I think manual on the 508T is the safest bet with a circle, and near mandatory with a single dot.

Totally agree. I haven’t played much with the circle, as I’d prefer a smaller one (I really want to try the Holosun 407CO!), but I think the concept certainly has value.