I Done Think I Bulged My Barrel (Beretta 92 .22LR Conversion)

[Suvorov]

A few range sessions ago I was running some "odds and ends" old ammo through my Beretta 92 .22LR conversion slide when I had a malfunction. I chambered a new round and it fired resulting in an abnormal amount of "blow back" to the face. The pistol kept chugging along and I didn't pay much attention to it. Yesterday I decided the pistol deserved a cleaning. As I was cleaning the barrel I noticed what appeared to be a bunch of lead about half way down but after some good scrubbing with a wire bore brush it just wouldn't come clean. That's when I took a closer look and noticed that the rifling seems warped at that section. Recalling my "malfunction" a few weeks prior made me wonder if the malfunction was caused by a squib round I did not detect and the next round I fired pushed the squib out, bulged my barrel, and gave me a face full of crud? I think I can feel a bulge close to where the line is and the barrel is not perfectly straight at the point so I see no other possibility.

Below are some photos to illustrate:

67798

67799

So my questions for the hive mind are:

1) Is this in fact a bulged barrel or is it some sort of manufacturing technique or defect?

2) If it is a bulged barrel and most likely my fault, would Beretta "hook me up" or am I on the hook for another barrel?

3) Is it even a big deal or something to worry about? The pistol's accuracy and reliability seem unaffected by the suspected damage and I would figure that by the time the bullet reached the suspect area of the barrel, it has already begun it's spinning and is unlikely to really be affected. Maybe a little more gas might slip around? There is plenty of thick barrel material surrounding the bore since it is the dimensions of a 9mm barrel with a .22LR bore - I seriously doubt the barrel is structurally compromised. Am I missing something?

[JCN]

Do you own a caliper? Might be worth measuring to see if there is a bulge.

[Suvorov]

Do you own a caliper? Might be worth measuring to see if there is a bulge.

No, but I do have a micrometer which should work. Reminds me, I need to get a digital caliper........... If only there was a thread on this forum about them :rolleyes:

[Jim Watson]

Sure looks ring-bulged.
I don't know what Beretta will do but the gun remains usable.

[HTM]

As I have posted before. Bulged barrels are the result of an under charged squibbed bullet getting stuck in the barrel and a fully charged being fired behind it. Often but not always both bullets exit the barrel. The pressure developed between the two bullets in the barrel at once produces the gas ring and thus, the bulge.

Most gun manufacturers see this as an ammo issue (which it is) and not a manufacturing issue. When this happens with .22 the issue multiplies because of the manufacturing process hundreds of rounds will be affected and dispersed over a particular “lot” of ammo.

In addition modern cold hammer forged barrels are generally stronger as a result of proper heat treating and the forging process compared to many, not all, aftermarket barrels that are stainless steel which often separate and or peel open. The pressure has to go somewhere.

I always save lot numbers just in case because you can get help from the reputable ammo companies to when fixing or replacing your gun.


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[farscott]

I would shoot groups on paper with the barrel. If it groups, keep using it as there is no safety concern. If it patterns, time for a new barrel. While the ammo company is responsible, without evidence of which rounds did it, that is likely a dead end.

If you have to buy another barrel, the good news is Beretta runs enough 40% sales so that the pain is not too bad. The threaded barrel is available at https://www.berettausa.com/en-us/beretta-threaded-barrel-for-conversion-kit-threaded-barrel/

[BILLG]

I would shoot groups on paper with the barrel. If it groups, keep using it as there is no safety concern. If it patterns, time for a new barrel. While the ammo company is responsible, without evidence of which rounds did it, that is likely a dead end.

If you have to buy another barrel, the good news is Beretta runs enough 40% sales so that the pain is not too bad. The threaded barrel is available at https://www.berettausa.com/en-us/beretta-threaded-barrel-for-conversion-kit-threaded-barrel/
The ammo company is not at fault for your actions.It is your responsibility to make sure you bbl is free from obstructions before firing.
It is the ammo companies responsibility for the squib.
Pay attention to what you are doing.

[Eyesquared]

The ammo company is not at fault for your actions.It is your responsibility to make sure you bbl is free from obstructions before firing.
It is the ammo companies responsibility for the squib.
Pay attention to what you are doing.

When you're truly going fast you can try to "pay attention" all you want but it may or may not save you from a squib. I've seen several squibs at matches and most of the time the shooter doesn't realize they've squibbed until the RO yells for them to stop.

[farscott]

The ammo company is not at fault for your actions.It is your responsibility to make sure you bbl is free from obstructions before firing.
It is the ammo companies responsibility for the squib.
Pay attention to what you are doing.

In theory, yes, the shooter should know the barrel is clear. But when shooting fast on the clock, the second round is on the way before the mind notes the report was wrong. Too late to stop the trigger press.

[diananike]

I had so much lead built up in my G44 from firing Remington thunderbolts that it went smoothbore
I think if I hadn’t noticed the keyholing I would have been in the same boat as you
Personally I would just confirm it still shoots well and then not worry about using it.
Tiny little groups at long range are not a .22 handguns specialty. Shooting timed combat simulation drills for cheaper then our duty/carry guns are and don’t require much in the way of accuracy.

[Jim Watson]

I had so much lead built up in my G44 from firing Remington thunderbolts that it went smoothbore.

I did the same to my ACE with Thunderbolts in 1994. But they were cheap.

[HTM]

The ammo company is not at fault for your actions.It is your responsibility to make sure you bbl is free from obstructions before firing.
It is the ammo companies responsibility for the squib.
Pay attention to what you are doing.

Whether it’s a major ammo company, Jim Bob’s gun show specials, or your own reloads. Quality ammo companies stand behind their product. Normally they catch the problems before they leave the factory. But it definitely happens. Probably more now than ever.

The worst 22 ammo I’ve seen with leading issues is Winchester Wild Cat. I’ve seen it lead a barrel in under 200 rounds so bad that you couldn’t get a bore brush through it. I’ve seen hundreds of REM Thunderbolt that were near squibs that I checked to make sure the barrel was clear. Meaning they were basically CB rounds.

Save your containers with lot numbers and the offending casing until you’ve depleted the ammo lot. Otherwise you’ll be on your own for repair or replacement.


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[BILLG]

In theory, yes, the shooter should know the barrel is clear. But when shooting fast on the clock, the second round is on the way before the mind notes the report was wrong. Too late to stop the trigger press.

I have shot many rounds in competition and have watched thousands more fired by other competitors including top shooters in USPSA and IDPA..
In that time I have also witnessed several squibs and in each case the RO or the shooter stopped shooting before firing another round.
The ammo company's fault for the squib no doubt.But it is the shooters fault for firing the round behind it.
Will everybody agree with this probably not in this day and age of blame someome else for your mistakes.
If your right then if you shoot one round at a bad guy but he does not go down before you fire the second shot a kid gets in the way and you shoot him in the head with your second shot you are ok with that?
You are responsible for every pull of the trigger and its result.

[Suvorov]

I’m not blaming anyone but myself and made that point clear in the OP. I was shooting old ammo that was mixed and over 30 years old. I did not feel the “squib” and since that ammo had been giving less than normal reliability, so simply performed immediate action and went back to shooting the drill as I have been trained. I will work on my squib detection techniques right away.

I was just looking for confirmation that I bulged my barrel and advice on what to do about it. I appreciate the replies that have helped me out.

As mentioned - the pistol seems to shoot and function fine so I’ll probably just drive on. If I start to see a deterioration in accuracy I’ll pick up a new barrel and suck up the $100.

[Jim Watson]

I think it would be best to take it up with Beretta and the ammo brand soon.
If it deteriorates or you get dissatisfied with it down the road, "I bulged my barrel in the Blizzard of Nought 21." might not get as good "customer service" as a prompt complaint.

[CCT125US]

3) Is it even a big deal or something to worry about? The pistol's accuracy and reliability seem unaffected by the suspected damage and I would figure that by the time the bullet reached the suspect area of the barrel, it has already begun it's spinning and is unlikely to really be affected. Maybe a little more gas might slip around? There is plenty of thick barrel material surrounding the bore since it is the dimensions of a 9mm barrel with a .22LR bore - I seriously doubt the barrel is structurally compromised. Am I missing something?

Like you, I've been using up older ammo. Russian Klimovsk, Thunderbolts, Golden Bullet, Federal Lightning, and Winchester Wildcat. With that comes squibs, hangfires, and ruptured cases. I'm not shooting fast enough to not recognize a failure of some kind. If something seems off, I'll clear the gun and inspect. I carry a foldable dental mirror, and will shine my light in the chamber, allowing me to check the bore.

As far as point 3, gun work, gun good, it's a sturdy plinker.

[HTM]

I just got a .22 barrel with 3 bulges. Same lot of ammo. FYI I have yet to have an ammo company rectify this issue with .22LR ammo. You're likely on your own for the cost of replacement.

[willie]

That looks like a lead ring. If it's bulged, you will be able to feel it with a patch. Rings and even bulges are more common in rimfire barrels than people think. If the barrel shot ok before, it most likely will now. The ring is an area of discoloration.

[vcdgrips]

Note-I am not an engineer or a metallurgist.


True of false- would you spend 100.00 to buy 250 rds of brass cased reloadable 9mm ammo right now?

True or false- can we agree that as the barrel is bulged, it is not as strong as it was in its pre bulged state?

Presuming that both answers are true, it is not about having the money and why take a chance?

Odds v. Stakes and how much I like my hands/fingers/eyes/face has me buying a new barrel and driving on.



If somebody who has the training/education/experience could say that the bulge did not weaken the barrel in ANY way, I suppose I would STFU and drive on.
However, to my simple mind, if the metal moved once, it is more inclined to move again should a similar situation occur i.e. squib/double charge etc.


Let us know what you do and why you do it.

Be safe and well.

[Suvorov]

I called Beretta Technical/Customer service today to discuss my ringed barrel.

The first question I asked is if it was safe to continue using - the reply was that it is Beretta's policy to never say it was safe to fire a damaged barrel even if it was. Their opinion is the barrel needs to be replaced. I expected that and told them that since I am a proletariat of the Republic of California, I would not be able own the threaded barrel and needed the standard barrel. I was informed that they did not have any and that they were no longer getting them from Umarex. The rep did say it might be worth taking up with the ammunition manufacturer but this is simply impossible as I was using a mixed bag of ammo.

So basically my options are:
1) Somehow acquire a threaded barrel and then have it de-threaded and re-profiled.
2) Purchase a new conversion kit and then keep the slide for spare parts or sell it.
3) Disregard Beretta USA's recommendation and continue to use the barrel. A quick search of opinions on the internet seems to indicate most people consider a .22LR with a bulged barrel safe to shoot.

The barrel is most definitely bulged as a patched cleaning rod will reach a point where there is little resistance and then return to normal resistance. Additionally I took the micrometer to the outside of the barrel and the diameter of the barrel is 7/1000 inch wider at the bulge than at other points along the barrel.

At this point I am most likely going to continue to use the kit. Depending on my trust level and any loss of accuracy I will wait for one of Beretta's big sales and replace the unit.

Thanks for all the advice. I will keep you posted with any developments.

[e_stern]

I called Beretta Technical/Customer service today to discuss my ringed barrel.

The first question I asked is if it was safe to continue using - the reply was that it is Beretta's policy to never say it was safe to fire a damaged barrel even if it was. Their opinion is the barrel needs to be replaced. I expected that and told them that since I am a proletariat of the Republic of California, I would not be able own the threaded barrel and needed the standard barrel. I was informed that they did not have any and that they were no longer getting them from Umarex. The rep did say it might be worth taking up with the ammunition manufacturer but this is simply impossible as I was using a mixed bag of ammo.

So basically my options are:
1) Somehow acquire a threaded barrel and then have it de-threaded and re-profiled.
2) Purchase a new conversion kit and then keep the slide for spare parts or sell it.
3) Disregard Beretta USA's recommendation and continue to use the barrel. A quick search of opinions on the internet seems to indicate most people consider a .22LR with a bulged barrel safe to shoot.

The barrel is most definitely bulged as a patched cleaning rod will reach a point where there is little resistance and then return to normal resistance. Additionally I took the micrometer to the outside of the barrel and the diameter of the barrel is 7/1000 inch wider at the bulge than at other points along the barrel.

At this point I am most likely going to continue to use the kit. Depending on my trust level and any loss of accuracy I will wait for one of Beretta's big sales and replace the unit.

Thanks for all the advice. I will keep you posted with any developments.

Suvorov, please PM me your contact information.