Rotator cuff issues

[LittleLebowski]

I had to get surgery for a SLAP tear (https://orthoinfo.aaos.org/en/diseases--conditions/slap-tears/) after right shoulder issues resulting from competitive swimming (Masters) and a little BJJ. The problem is definitely back, I feel a popping and pain if I raise my elbow above a certain level. The ortho doc said it's not torn, probably just inflamed and gave it a shot of steroids until it heals which worked for a couple weeks, but now it's back worse than ever. Anyone else here ever deal with this? It's a right pain in my ass.

[Willard]

I had to get surgery for a SLAP tear (https://orthoinfo.aaos.org/en/diseases--conditions/slap-tears/) after right shoulder issues resulting from competitive swimming (Masters) and a little BJJ. The problem is definitely back, I feel a popping and pain if I raise my elbow above a certain level. The ortho doc said it's not torn, probably just inflamed and gave it a shot of steroids until it heals which worked for a couple weeks, but now it's back worse than ever. Anyone else here ever deal with this? It's a right pain in my ass.

Yes. Tore both labrums, rotator cuff repairs, removal of portion of the AC joint to address arthritis, and a screw to hold a bicep tendon in place. This has been about 8 years back, and now believe I've re-injured but done with the cutting. Hope you get it addressed properly by good physicians.

[rjohnson4405]

I have beat the shit out of my shoulders.

Smashwerx videos helped a lot, I know Paul Sharp is a fan too.


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nE8SHAKHXSU

The ring pulls I do with a TRX at the gym, but you can get bands (from pat mac) or a travel TRX thing for pretty cheap. Your stance makes it easier or harder, start super light and do it everyday. If you're like me, you will have to pretty much do it forever, but I'm already at the gym/working out so it's a pretty minor sacrifice.

He puts out a bunch of videos, do them all until something works. I have helped several people with shoulder problems by pointing them to him and just try everything. Some work and some don't depending on your injury.

[mmc45414]

Anyone else here ever deal with this? It's a right pain in my ass.
I never really went for a diagnosis, but have been troubled by my right shoulder even since I (AKA: Dumbass..) tried to yank a stubborn honeysuckle bush out with my ATV. The ATV is 4x4 so when it got to the end of the strap and stopped torque steer snapped the handlebars to the right and I was tossed rag doll like with all my weight onto my right shoulder. Just by nursing it I am back to the point of being able to draw a bow again, but it still hurts when I lift the milk out of the fridge. It is a bitch, but not bad enough, IMO, for a surgery.

And as I believe I have mentioned, I am pretty sure I actually did have my wife hold my beer...

[blues]

I've been dealing with rotator cuff issues since a mountaineering injury in the Wind Rivers of your home state in 1974. I manage it with a regimen of rotator cuff exercises performed with bands and kettlebells...and while it is manageable, I feel and hear it daily.

I've never had surgery, but did a lot of self-therapy over the years by purchasing medical volumes, (Travell & Simons, Simons, Travell & Simons), on trigger point therapy in addition to the exercises above. This helped immensely and were worth the cost of purchase.

A more readily available book, (much less expensive), which is based largely on those medical books is this one:

https://www.amazon.com/Trigger-Point-Therapy-Workbook-Self-Treatment-dp-1608824942/dp/1608824942/ref=dp_ob_title_bk

https://images-na.ssl-images-amazon.com/images/I/51Kb2L99ReL._SY498_BO1,204,203,200_.jpg

[Duces Tecum]

Try a series of 30 sec hangs from a pullup bar. Just hanging, no pullups. This has helped me.

[blues]

Try a series of 30 sec hangs from a pullup bar. Just hanging, no pullups. This has helped me.

I do those before every workout as part of my warm up...I can't say it's made a difference, but it hasn't hurt.

[Crawls]

I had to get surgery for a SLAP tear (https://orthoinfo.aaos.org/en/diseases--conditions/slap-tears/) after right shoulder issues resulting from competitive swimming (Masters) and a little BJJ. The problem is definitely back, I feel a popping and pain if I raise my elbow above a certain level. The ortho doc said it's not torn, probably just inflamed and gave it a shot of steroids until it heals which worked for a couple weeks, but now it's back worse than ever. Anyone else here ever deal with this? It's a right pain in my ass.

I can empathize all too F'n well.

I've dealt with a dysfunctional shoulder since my junior year in HS when I dislocated my right shoulder wrestling. Because I was a young hard charging athletic kid, It took me about seven years to get that shoulder working reliably again. Then I utterly destroyed my left shoulder. I've had that labrum reattached twice; been through about three years of physical therapy and to this day have issues. There are days when I struggle to put a vitamin in my mouth with my left hand. Reaching up into the cupboard to put away the dishes is always a Pandora's box of what sort of stupid pain am I going to find. My range of motion is abysmal. Sneezing of coughing while drunk can result in a dislocation. I can work it back in on my own but it's not fun.

I recently gave up trying to appease my shoulder. It hurts regardless of how well I treat it. No amount rest, thera-band exercise or PNF exercises is going to appease it. I've started lifting weights again, but my form and technique are highly questionable as there are things I just cant do. I'm really tired of trying to live my life around my shoulder.

I bought my twins slingshots for Christmas. Would have never guessed that was going to be an issue. I'm now teaching myself to shoot a slingshot weak handed. Currently reevaluating whether or not I can try bow hunting.

Shoulder injuries suck.

[olstyn]

I will be following this thread with interest. I injured my left shoulder while playing raquetball in college. It took weeks/months to heal to where I had full range of motion back, and months/years before I fully trusted it again. (The wall was closer than I thought, I was running full speed toward it, and boom, smashed my shoulder into the wall with my full body weight behind it - I have no recollection of the time it took me to end up on the floor, just instantaneous transition from running to hellacious pain, and then weeks of doing my best not to use that arm at all after I made the mistake of telling the doctor that I could handle the pain.)

In the ~20 years since, it's mostly been OK, but lately I've had more frequent incidences of pain in that shoulder than has been typical, so if I can learn anything here that will bring me back to normal, or potentially even better, I'll be quite happy.

[WDR]

Ages ago, I had a bloody nose during the night, and went to get out of bed. As I put my right arm out while rolling out of bed, I didn't realize my feet were wound up in the covers, and I fell to the floor with my right arm extended, knocking the wind out of me and hyper extending my right shoulder. Initially there was not much obvious damage, and PT helped a lot... I have now been through multiple rounds of physical therapy, and dealt with shoulder issues for fifteen years or more now. The PT helped for quite a while, and injections helped for a short time after each one. I have a torn labrum and a torn rotator cuff, with possible bicep tendonosis. The pain has slowly increased with age, and now I occasionally get very sharp pain, occasional popping,
and the dull ache is constant enough it disrupts my sleep. I still have decent strength and range of motion, but it is for sure weaker than my other side. I'm going for surgery in January.

Shoulder specific PT exercises can be a huge help, and buy you time before you have to get cut on. Waiting too long can be problematic too, from what I understand. I'm hoping I didn't wait too long.

[Duces Tecum]

I do those before every workout as part of my warm up...I can't say it's made a difference, but it hasn't hurt.
blues I think the benefit is in recovering range of motion. First range of motion, then work on strength. At least that's been my experience. Sounds like you've got ROM down.

[idahojess]

This has been a good maintenance exercise for me (Athlean x has a lot of good stuff).


http://youtu.be/l2VQ_WZ8Bto

Edited to add: Sometimes I will just do the pull apart motion without the band, if I'm sore and need some relief.

[Duces Tecum]

Not to thread drift, but has anyone tried Turkish Get-Ups to ameliorate shoulder issues?

[Duke]

Most folks do 10x internal rotation in the course of a day as external rotation

Front of shoulder gets stronger and more imbalanced making impingement and instability worse.

As soon as I started doing external rotation with resistance bands, all weird popping and such went away

[feudist]

Try a series of 30 sec hangs from a pullup bar. Just hanging, no pullups. This has helped me.

I've just watched a couple of vids advocating this for strengthening and eventually healing some issues.

The recommendations was to collect 15 minutes a day for several months.

So, a pretty serious commitment.

[blues]

blues I think the benefit is in recovering range of motion. First range of motion, then work on strength. At least that's been my experience. Sounds like you've got ROM down.

Duces Tecum

My range and strength is fine for pressing and pulling movements...except that I can no longer do dips which used to be, (along with pull-ups), my strongest movement. Now, doing dips is something my shoulders will not abide. I guess getting 40+ good years of dips whether body weight or weighted was enough. Standing presses, kettlebells, bench presses are all okay.

So, basically, I can do all my movements in the weight room...it's just that I can never actually forget that my shoulder is not what it was. (Even if sitting, at the keyboard, or lying in bed on my Tempurpedic, it never forgets to send me a reminder.)

It could be worse...much worse.

[WDR]

Most folks do 10x internal rotation in the course of a day as external rotation

Front of shoulder gets stronger and more imbalanced making impingement and instability worse.

As soon as I started doing external rotation with resistance bands, all weird popping and such went away

This is a big part of what they do in shoulder PT... at least in my case. Strengthening all the muscles of the shoulder can help stabilize it for sure. It wont fix torn bits though.

[rjohnson4405]

No, it won't fix torn bits.

But if you work up to full range of motion with resistance you can get your torn bits stronger than they were pre-torn. But it will likely be slow going. Stretching the pectorals, lats, forearms, and elbows will help a lot too. Quit pulling on the shoulders, especially if you sit at a desk.

[rdtompki]

Just reading this thread hurts. Injured my right shoulder just prior to 9/11 when my horse and I went down as a team slamming that shoulder into the dirt. Left shoulder sometime later in a well rehearsed mirror image crash. No surgery, but 2-3 times/year I'll reach for something in the back seat and regret doing so for about two weeks. Getting old is the pits but the alternate ain't so hot.

[ER_STL]

I hate to say it but this thread makes me feel a little better. I’m sitting in the parking lot of a local urgent care in order to get a script for PT for my left shoulder. I’ve got all the symptoms of a rotator cuff issue.

@LittleLebowksi, the older I get the more of my weekly workout goes to what Mark Verstegen calls “prehab” - all of the various, odd-looking exercises with bands, balls and little pink dumbbells. When I stay vigilant I can slow the inevitable aging process. When I get lazy, as I have recently, I end up in bad shape.

Hope your issue turns out to be easily treatable.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[LittleLebowski]

Not to thread drift, but has anyone tried Turkish Get-Ups to ameliorate shoulder issues?

I really hate Turkish get ups.

[smells like feet]

I am going to preface this post with a disclaimer. I am posting from Canada where peptides are completely legal and I do not compete in a drug tested sport where they are banned as a PED . This may not be the case for everyone and I am not endorsing cheating in athletics or illegal drug use.

Peptides and SARMS are getting a lot of attention in the bodybuilding, biohacking and anti ageing communities. To the extent that you trust anything coming out of those communities is up to you.

There is a peptide called BPC 157 that I and several of my friends have used to deal with tennis elbow, golfers elbow and various shoulder and back pain related problems.

Its not particularly expensive, has no known risk of adverse effects and its pretty effective at healing some of those nagging injuries that plague middle age guys who still do combat sports.

Its injected twice a day from an insulin syringe, subcutaneously or intramuscular usually close to the injury.

You guys might find it useful to look into BPC 157 as a part of your recovery process. Ben Greenfield has a couple of good podcasts on peptides in general and BPC 157 on its own.

[Cory]

In September I fell on my right shoulder and knew I was hurt.

It's taken months of goofing with the VA to find out what's wrong. Grade 2 AC seperation, bone contusions, inflamed rotator cuffs, and inflamed bursa. Essentially my collar bone smacked into my shoulder blade, ripped the ligiment, made stuff hurt, and the bones are rubbing some. That's my understanding.

At this point the inflammation has settled alot I think. I have my first PT appointment early January. My VA ortho told me to accept my body will change, I'll become arthritic soon, never overhead press again, BJJ is never going to happen, yadda yadda. I'm 29. lol.

I got bands, going to see the PT (a non VA doc) and let them know the outcome I want (my normal lifestyle) and do whatever they say to get there. Plus some accessory stuff from Kelly Starret that was recommended by someone I trust.

[EPF]

Most folks do 10x internal rotation in the course of a day as external rotation

Front of shoulder gets stronger and more imbalanced making impingement and instability worse.

As soon as I started doing external rotation with resistance bands, all weird popping and such went away

This is a really great point. Almost everyone needs to add this to their routines. Even if you don’t yet have shoulder issues. The higher the mileage on your body the more you need this. I still deal with some arthritis, but stabilizing my shoulders and building good posture fixed years of issues.

[vsdtrek]

Ages ago, I had a bloody nose during the night, and went to get out of bed. As I put my right arm out while rolling out of bed, I didn't realize my feet were wound up in the covers, and I fell to the floor with my right arm extended, knocking the wind out of me and hyper extending my right shoulder. Initially there was not much obvious damage, and PT helped a lot... I have now been through multiple rounds of physical therapy, and dealt with shoulder issues for fifteen years or more now. The PT helped for quite a while, and injections helped for a short time after each one. I have a torn labrum and a torn rotator cuff, with possible bicep tendonosis. The pain has slowly increased with age, and now I occasionally get very sharp pain, occasional popping,
and the dull ache is constant enough it disrupts my sleep. I still have decent strength and range of motion, but it is for sure weaker than my other side. I'm going for surgery in January.

Shoulder specific PT exercises can be a huge help, and buy you time before you have to get cut on. Waiting too long can be problematic too, from what I understand. I'm hoping I didn't wait too long.

Best wishes for a successful surgery. I've had one on each shoulder. Read some stat that basically majority of us over 40 eventually have some form of RC tear and it's just a matter of if we notice it enough. First one happened falling off a bike when I hit uneven concrete. Honestly, they really were awful. My shoulders never got back to 100% and I had to give up my favorite sport of tennis. Still, I manage decently enough. Hard to complain when there are so many people with far worse conditions in the world who would trade places in a minute.

Some tips:
- If you are right handed, start thinking about what you do with that arm and practice with the left. Activities of daily living and things like driving your car or opening a door can get tricky. Best not to learn on the fly! ;)
- Have a recliner/tilting bed for sleeping during the first few weeks. BTW - most recliners seem to have the control on the right side. I have a wife who was very nice during all this.
- A cheap backscratcher is really handy! Even one of those pincers on a long stick was handy while I had on my huge sling or was sitting in the range of motion chair for rehab.
- I bought some cool looking elastic laces from a running store and put in my hiking shoes because it was winter. Honestly - they looked good and I used them for a few years afterwards.
- For icing, if you have a refrigerator with an icemaker, that is great. If not, I froze a bunch of water bottles and kept reusing because I was icing a lot. Helps that I live where there's snow and had the winter to use for additional storage of them.
- My balance was rather iffy when my arm was in the sling. You don't realize how much arms help when they are always functioning. I hated when it snowed or on stairs. I went backwards down them for awhile because if I fell forward, nothing was going to stop me.
- I hated having my arm against me all day. Shirt always felt wet and skin got really irritated. I really have no one to impress and went with muscle shirts.
- Do your rehab and don't get discouraged. The initial several weeks was rather awful. I still do exercises a few times a week and it's been 4 years since the last one.
- Take it easy and don't overdo it with the left arm while you recover. I ripped my other one three months after the first one and had to wait several months until the first one was semi-decent.

I have been hearing about the use of stem cells for shoulders. Will be interesting to see if this ever pans out. My ortho said he could get into this too and make a lot of money but then wouldn't be able to sleep at night because the scientific data just doesn't support it. I'm in benefits for my job and I still don't see it being covered. That's usually a sign too. A business contact's husband had it recently done and it did nothing.

I'm sort of embarrassed to admit, but the RC tears caused me to go all in on the HK LEM trigger. I had long rehabs and when I finally went to a range again, I started using my usual P30 V3. Even though I had done a bit of dry firing (ambidextrous mag release is awesome when your arm doesn't work), I wasn't used to the DA/SA pull and recoil. I really jerked the first shot and that was it for me with that trigger system. Never fired another shot out of it and used my USP LEM for the rest of the session. That felt fine and I figured since I wasn't getting younger, decided the LEM was best option. Sold the P30 V3 and got another P30 in V1. Hey - at least I didn't hit the ceiling right above me.

V

[olstyn]

You don't realize how much arms help when they are always functioning.

To add on to this point, even outside of balance, you don't realize just how much you use your "weak" arm until you lose the use of it for an extended period of time. It's incredibly frustrating to not think you're doing anything with it only to be notified by pain that you were using it even when you didn't think you were.

[JohnO]

Some beneficial info may be contained within.


https://youtu.be/xFt0IECBwdo

[Robert Mitchum]

My left shoulder has been messed up since the early 80's.
I also ripped my left triceps tendon off the bone when I was 54 years old ..I was getting 405 pounds on the Incline Bench.
I just packed a lot of muscle around my shoulders and workout through the pain.

Now at 68 years old can still bench press 300 pounds... did 315 pounds last Month
I cannot lift my left arm over my head because of the shoulder ..but I have no pain.

I also take natural herbs .. any Doctor who tells you to stop working out leave and find another one.


https://youtu.be/lIyZXJ-I8XA

[Lon]

I just had surgery back in Oct to repair a partial thickness tear of my rotator cuff. First day of real PT (as opposed to at home stretching) was today. Here’s my 2 cents if you end up having surgery:

- be comfy carrying and shooting a pistol weak hand only or strong hand only. In my case it was weak hand only.
- the recliner suggestion for sleeping is a good one. What little sleep I got in the first couple weeks was in a recliner.
- figure out how to wipe your ass if your surgery is on the hand you normally use. 🤣
- cold therapy machines are awesome. Buy the little half bottles of water and freeze them instead of using ice in the reservoir. I bought one off Amazon with HSA $$.
- do whatever your doc tells you to for at home PT and obey any restrictions he gives. That helped me a lot. Therapist told me today I am already beyond what is the norm for my stage of recovery.
- buy a comfy sling. The one they gave me was a POS.

Here’s the cold therapy machine I bought:
https://www.amazon.com/gp/aw/d/B07BDMH2FC?psc=1&ref=ppx_pop_mob_b_asin_title

[FNFAN]

I wish I could go back and explain to 16y.o. me that Daitō-ryū Aiki-jūjutsu is not the best MA for tall kids. I have noticed that working with a heavy steel mace keeps my shoulders nice and limber and helps with posture. Here's a link with some exercises: https://vimeo.com/144006083

[Poconnor]

Lots of good suggestions. Just remember it will not get better with age! If you need surgery ; get it done now. You will heal better at 50 vs 40 If you are 25-30? Take care of it now. You might be able to live with it at 50 but be kicking yourself at 75 when you need the shoulder replaced. That is what happened to my father; but he is now too old to get the shoulder replaced. Remember your injury is only a slip on ice or a minor car accident away from being much worse. I would run from any Orthopaedic doctor that suggested you stop working out. Find an ortho who is an athlete themselves and treats athletes. If they treat professional athlete it is a plus. I would avoid the VA like the plague. Don’t be afraid to switch doctors. If the doctor does not touch you during an exam- drop him. We all are getting older. We all want to be our best. Too many doctors are more worried about the insurance company than they are the patient. Get the ice machine. My insurance would not pay for it so I bought it and it was worth it. Invest now in right hand and left hand holsters. practice drawing a handgun from both sides. After surgery - Get off the pain meds ASAP . Good luck

[feudist]

I wish I could go back and explain to 16y.o. me that Daitō-ryū Aiki-jūjutsu is not the best MA for tall kids. I have noticed that working with a heavy steel mace keeps my shoulders nice and limber and helps with posture. Here's a link with some exercises: https://vimeo.com/144006083

Check out Mark Wildman on YouTube.

He has series based on Kettlebells, clubs and maces. Very clear explanations and demonstrations of proper form.

[WDR]

Almost one week post surgery, and I'm not having a ton of pain. Mostly manageable on ibuprofen/tylenol. Taking a pain pill to sedate myself at night, so I don't toss and turn, but really thinking about trying to stop the pain meds completely. I really don't want to be on that crap. I think the sling/spacer/torture device is worse than the actual surgical pains. Damn things pokes me in the ribs and arm in uncomfortable ways. The incisions are healing well, and I can use my right arm for a few things, as long as I'm not trying to muscle anything in the shoulder.

I was expecting three holes in my shoulder, but when I got the bandages off I have a total of five! Not sure exactly what they did at this point. Doc didn't really inform my wife very well after I was out of surgery (sorta unhappy about that). Post-op appointment this week will hopefully give me some answers, and a better idea when I can get back to work.

I'm already going stir crazy, but I've watched a few movies I had wanted to see, and I'm chugging through Longmire at a steady rate. Trying to decide if I can run my Dillon left handed, and at least use some of this time to make my ammo fort bigger.