Tamara's Ruger P89 review - Like a 9mm Mullet

[Greg]

https://www.recoilweb.com/ruger-p89-9mm-160850.html

:cool:

Tamara

[TC215]

My old department issued those after the switch from revolvers. Kept them for about 10 years before switching to H&K’s. It was before my time, but I’ve heard a ton of stories about problems with them.

[BillSWPA]

Before the Ruger P85 was introduced, every single test report of a semiauto handgun I read in the gun magazines described a few malfunctions per 100 rounds. The first test report I ever read that reported no failures of any kind was a test of the P85. I was too young to buy a pistol or any other gun at that time, but that detail of the test report got my attention.

[Wondering Beard]

Tam never disappoints:" As it slams back and forth under recoil, you notice it; it’s like shooting a Shake Weight.”

[Jared]

It’s a pretty cool review, that I actually first read in Concealment, but I also followed the 2k challenge she did on the gun on her blog. Tam seldom disappoints when it comes to clever turns of phrase that’s for certain. I’ll also admit that the review kicked up enough nostalgia for me to go out and buy a two toned P89 myself. I had one way back when, shortly after my 21st birthday. Back then, you couldn’t swing a cat in any gun shops around here without hitting a P89 or a P90. Back when, I had one of each, at different times.

Shooting one is definitely its own experience. I’m used to Italian crunchentickers these days, so the top heavy Ruger definitely gives up some refinement in comparison. And yet, honestly, after putting a couple hundred rounds through the one I recently acquired, I couldn’t help but think I would’ve feel naked if it was all I had.

[Exiledviking]

Great review. Sure brought back memories. And a couple of chuckles.
Thanks for sharing!
I'm still hoping to buy a lightly used P90 some day, just because. A lot of that is due to Mas' articles back in the day.

[Suvorov]

I became interested in handguns shortly after the P85 was released. I lusted after one for years and the advertisements for it in my International Combat Arms magazine are etched into my late teenage mind. When I got into college and got a group of friends that were all into guns the P85 was by far the most commonly owned simply because it looked cool (to us), was used in Robocop, and could be afforded on a college student's budget. The Beretta 92 was out of my price range (and besides the slides would crack, fly back and kill you) but I wanted to be different from all my friends and ended up spending about $100 more for a Hi Power Mk III at Wal-Mart (because in International Combat Arms, while the advertisements may have been for Rugers, the people between the covers were often times carying Hi Powers). Now it may have been more an issue of none of us knowing how to shoot a pistol and my buddies limp wristing the thing, but I was never too impressed with the P85 in terms of reliability. Years later one of my buddies (who had become a USBP agent) got a P89 and reported that it worked and worked. While I realize this article is on the P89, the P85 was just so much a part of my gun toddler state I got nostalgic. As stupid as it would be - if I were to come across a P85 or P89 for a good price, I'd probably buy it Just Cuz.

The other thing of interest in her article is that Tam said the price for the pistol was 11 ounces of silver. At today's spot price of $23/ounce the silver would be worth $253 while a P89 today is going for over $400 on GunBroker. There may be something to using guns as a hedge after all? Though I suspect Tam has way way better connections than I do.

[farscott]

Looks like she recently bought the pistol and magazines for eleven ounces of silver which had a cost basis of $200. Pretty good deal.


Curious to see if they really were that reliable or if the rep was just hazy nostalgia from a misspent youth, we inquired around and wound up getting one, along with a few magazines, from a dealer in exchange for $200. (Actually, 11 ounces of silver, but that’s another story.)




Price Paid: Six 1-oz. Austrian Philharmonics and five random 1-oz. silver bars (just under $200 at time of purchase)

[ViniVidivici]

My first pistol was a P89. Taught me to hate slide mounted controls. Built like a tank though, I trained with it, carried it, got my first formal instruction with it.

Felt on top of the game, with 15 124gr Hydrashoks onboard. Golden age of the wondernines.....

Miss that gun sometimes.

[Wise_A]

Out of all the gun mags I read, Tam's easily the best, most entertaining writer. Her free content is head and shoulders better than anything in Old White Guy Guns.

As for the Ruger...yeah. It ain't pretty, but it's a tank. A buddy of mine only has one gun--it's a P89. He generally goes through a box or two a week...every week, without fail. He got the gun around 1990 or so. At an average of 50 rounds per week, over the last 30 years, he's put something like 75,000 rounds through that gun. A couple years ago, he finally managed to break it. He sent it in to Ruger, they replaced a couple springs, and it went right back to spitting out ammo.

[john c]

One thing going for the Ruger P-series back in the day is that they were available in decock-only. I had a cosmetically thrashed P90DC at one time that was my most accurate pistol. I miss that thing.

[Hambo]

A friend had a P90 .45, and it was easily the worst DA trigger I've ever felt. If you had to beat someone to death, the Ruger will work, but a hammer is more ergonomic.

[RUT]

>>if you can find a more reliable double-stack 9mm semi-auto pistol than the Ruger p89 for $200, buy it.<<

I think these days are pretty much behind us. :cool:

[Bigghoss]

I turned 21 just days after the AWB expired and I celebrated by buying a Ruger P95DC which I still have. I did manage to wear out the extractor but otherwise the gun has been as reliable as anything. I don't know what the internal differences are between a P89 and a P94 but the barely used P94 I got a couple years ago has a great trigger for a stock budget handgun. Better than a factory Beretta 92FS for sure.

[DueSpada]

I don't have a P89, but just from that excellent picture Tamara used I think I would be more cheerful in the morning if I did.
Heavy duty, raked lines and cuts pointing downrange, and it just reeks of Steeltown, USA. If your contract with Asteroid Heavy Metal Mining just came through, you would surely not forget to stuff this thing in your duffle. Good Luck out in the Belt, Citizen!

[JonInWA]

Here's a more detailed discussion thread I initiated here a couple of years ago.

https://pistol-forum.com/showthread.php?11782-My-DA-SA-Traditional-Ruger-P89&highlight=DA%2FSA+Traditional

The ergonomics of the later P89s were much improved over the initial P85/P85 Mk II/P89, especially with the later slide lever reconfiguration.

Best, Jon

[Baldanders]

I became interested in handguns shortly after the P85 was released. I lusted after one for years and the advertisements for it in my International Combat Arms magazine are etched into my late teenage mind. When I got into college and got a group of friends that were all into guns the P85 was by far the most commonly owned simply because it looked cool (to us), was used in Robocop, and could be afforded on a college student's budget. The Beretta 92 was out of my price range (and besides the slides would crack, fly back and kill you) but I wanted to be different from all my friends and ended up spending about $100 more for a Hi Power Mk III at Wal-Mart (because in International Combat Arms, while the advertisements may have been for Rugers, the people between the covers were often times carying Hi Powers). Now it may have been more an issue of none of us knowing how to shoot a pistol and my buddies limp wristing the thing, but I was never too impressed with the P85 in terms of reliability. Years later one of my buddies (who had become a USBP agent) got a P89 and reported that it worked and worked. While I realize this article is on the P89, the P85 was just so much a part of my gun toddler state I got nostalgic. As stupid as it would be - if I were to come across a P85 or P89 for a good price, I'd probably buy it Just Cuz.

The other thing of interest in her article is that Tam said the price for the pistol was 11 ounces of silver. At today's spot price of $23/ounce the silver would be worth $253 while a P89 today is going for over $400 on GunBroker. There may be something to using guns as a hedge after all? Though I suspect Tam has way way better connections than I do.

If you had bought a bunch of semiautos from the LGS/range I went to as a kid, and held on to them until now, you would have lost somewhere around 80% of your investment. My 299.00 used Taurus PT92 bought in 1989 works out to almost $700 in modern currency.

Beretta 92s are well under 50% of their inflation-adjusted price in `89. Glock/CNC manufacturing brought us into the current Golden Age of handgun value.

Now if you had bought Pythons...

Only high-end stuff is a reasonable hedge....maybe. Or things that will have a solid collector's market forever due to history. And full auto, of course.

[Suvorov]

If you had bought a bunch of semiautos from the LGS/range I went to as a kid, and held on to them until now, you would have lost somewhere around 80% of your investment. My 299.00 used Taurus PT92 bought in 1989 works out to almost $700 in modern currency.

Beretta 92s are well under 50% of their inflation-adjusted price in `89. Glock/CNC manufacturing brought us into the current Golden Age of handgun value.

Now if you had bought Pythons...

Only high-end stuff is a reasonable hedge....maybe. Or things that will have a solid collector's market forever due to history. And full auto, of course.

Yeah - that inflation is a bitch........

[LockedBreech]

Tam's writeups are always good at giving me the itch to buy a gun I never would have otherwise. I looked for a P250C 9mm for months after that write up and now I want a P89.

[Greg]

I saw a photo of a Ruger P series barrel that looked to have a casting seam.

Can anyone confirm if they machined the barrels out of a casting?

[Bigghoss]

If you had bought a bunch of semiautos from the LGS/range I went to as a kid, and held on to them until now, you would have lost somewhere around 80% of your investment.

Yeah but who needs money when you have a milk crate full of cool 80's pistols?

[JAH 3rd]

So a few years back I read where Ruger was discontinuing their Ruger P-90 45acp. So I bought one from Bud's. It was stainless with a safety/decocker. Never wanted one until I read production was ceasing. Heck of a reason for buying a new firearm. It was cheap enough.

The DA trigger pull is heavy. The SA trigger pull has a bit of creep before the hammer drops. The front sight has very little light on either side. Personally I like more light than these sights afford. I really miss front and rear checkering on the grip frame. But it has been 100% with all bullet types. The barrel has a swing link just like the 1911. Having said all this, if the pistol was destroyed by a lightning strike, I wouldn't lose any sleep.

About 3 months ago I called Ruger customer service to see if they still stocked the magazine release spring. I have read that they can be a problem with breakage. The helpful lady asked for the serial number and sent me the spring at no charge. Kudos for that.

I can see maybe why Ruger discontinued the P-series with the polymer revolution in full swing. It is hard for a metal pistol to compete in price with the polymer ones. Glad I purchased one though.

[Tamara]

It was before my time, but I’ve heard a ton of stories about problems with them.

I've heard a ton of stories about problems with everything.

I certainly trust cop stories about guns, though! :cool:

[Tamara]

The other thing of interest in her article is that Tam said the price for the pistol was 11 ounces of silver. At today's spot price of $23/ounce the silver would be worth $253 while a P89 today is going for over $400 on GunBroker. There may be something to using guns as a hedge after all? Though I suspect Tam has way way better connections than I do.

There's a long lead time in articles written for print publications. The prices of pistols and silver have fluctuated wildly since that pistol was sent to me and I mailed the silver to the seller.

[TC215]

I've heard a ton of stories about problems with everything.

I certainly trust cop stories about guns, though! :cool:

Probably about as much as I trust articles from gun writers. :cool:

[Tamara]

I saw a photo of a Ruger P series barrel that looked to have a casting seam.

Can anyone confirm if they machined the barrels out of a casting?

The barrels are not cast, to the best of my knowledge.

[Bigghoss]

When things calm down I'd like to get a stainless P90DC. I got a good price on a P97DC a few years ago to go with my P95DC. I had a P345 but that gun definitely wasn't as well executed as the rest of the series.

[Tamara]

Probably about as much as I trust articles from gun writers. :cool:

Literally LOL'ed. :D

I wouldn't trust gunwriters. They can't shoot and they don't train.

[Joe45]

So a few years back I read where Ruger was discontinuing their Ruger P-90 45acp. So I bought one from Bud's. It was stainless with a safety/decocker. Never wanted one until I read production was ceasing. Heck of a reason for buying a new firearm. It was cheap enough.

The DA trigger pull is heavy. The SA trigger pull has a bit of creep before the hammer drops. The front sight has very little light on either side. Personally I like more light than these sights afford. I really miss front and rear checkering on the grip frame. But it has been 100% with all bullet types. The barrel has a swing link just like the 1911. Having said all this, if the pistol was destroyed by a lightning strike, I wouldn't lose any sleep.

About 3 months ago I called Ruger customer service to see if they still stocked the magazine release spring. I have read that they can be a problem with breakage. The helpful lady asked for the serial number and sent me the spring at no charge. Kudos for that.

I can see maybe why Ruger discontinued the P-series with the polymer revolution in full swing. It is hard for a metal pistol to compete in price with the polymer ones. Glad I purchased one though.Good move on the spring. I had that problem with my P90 that I purchased back in '99 or so mainly due to writings from Mas. It's the only issue I've ever had with it.

It probably hasn't been shot in at least 10 years. Thanks to this trip down memory lane, I think it will go with on the next trip to the range.

Nothing else to say that hasn't already been said above.

[Duelist]

So a few years back I read where Ruger was discontinuing their Ruger P-90 45acp. So I bought one from Bud's. It was stainless with a safety/decocker. Never wanted one until I read production was ceasing. Heck of a reason for buying a new firearm. It was cheap enough.

The DA trigger pull is heavy. The SA trigger pull has a bit of creep before the hammer drops. The front sight has very little light on either side. Personally I like more light than these sights afford. I really miss front and rear checkering on the grip frame. But it has been 100% with all bullet types. The barrel has a swing link just like the 1911. Having said all this, if the pistol was destroyed by a lightning strike, I wouldn't lose any sleep.

About 3 months ago I called Ruger customer service to see if they still stocked the magazine release spring. I have read that they can be a problem with breakage. The helpful lady asked for the serial number and sent me the spring at no charge. Kudos for that.

I can see maybe why Ruger discontinued the P-series with the polymer revolution in full swing. It is hard for a metal pistol to compete in price with the polymer ones. Glad I purchased one though.

The only one of these I've ever actually shot was a P90. All I can really remember was that it was a super accurate gun, it seemed a little bit awkward, but that was like 25 years ago, so I couldn't say one way or another besides that.

[Doc_Glock]

I loved every moment of that review.

[farscott]

It is a good review and reflects the local reality. The Ruger P85, P89, and P94 guns occasionally appear in the used gun cases -- not for very long -- at reasonable prices. The pistols may not be well suited for LE/MIL, but they fit the bill for people who need a good pistol at a lower cost than that of a Glock, SIG, or M&P.

I will even admit to jonesing for a P89 with the optional .30 Luger barrel. After all, how many modern designs are/were chambered in the original Luger cartridge? The SIG P210, the Colt 1911, and the Ruger P89 are about it. The latter is the most modern design and the only one that uses a double-stack magazine.

[medmo]

Quote from article:

Bill Ruger motto, “No honest man needs a handgun smaller than a canned ham.”

Had to wipe up a little coffee spill after reading it. Freakin hilarious, and spot on.

[TC215]

I've heard a ton of stories about problems with everything.

I certainly trust cop stories about guns, though! :cool:

FWIW, I reached out to a couple “gun guys” that were around in the 90’s when the department had the Rugers. They said that the problems manifested after the guns had been around a while and had some age on them. The main issues were failures to fire, and were apparently pretty widespread. I asked them what the cause was, and they attributed the issues to (and this will shock you) a total lack of of routine maintenance and no real support from the armorers.

The SWAT team was issued P94’s, which supposedly had less issues than the P89’s.

[Wondering Beard]

As a side note, I always hated the P89's mag release.

[Tamara]

I asked them what the cause was, and they attributed the issues to (and this will shock you) a total lack of of routine maintenance and no real support from the armorers.

I am stunned and surprised, only not. :D

I'm going to go out on a limb and guess that mainsprings weren't getting replaced at any kind of regular interval. (Although I wonder what the lifespan on them is, assuming fairly regular recoil spring replacement? A lot of manufacturers are surprisingly vague on these sorts of things.)

[JAH 3rd]

This link is to the Ruger forum. Coffee Pot use to work for Ruger. He gives insight into the development of the P-90.

https://www.rugerforum.net/threads/a-little-p-90-history.8570/


http://www.rugerforum.com/phpBB3/viewtopic.php?f=2&t=2479&sid=e78f95611cac0fd65f36bf5d6f682ff4

[Bigghoss]

A 10mm P90 would be fucking cool.

[UNM1136]

A 10mm P90 would be fucking cool.

So much yes! But will never happen....

pat

[Jared]

I have the strangest urge to augment my P89 with a P90, a vanilla GP100, and a 2” DAO SP101 and have some sort of 90’a retro/hipster Ruger set. Now, the autos would probably just be range toys, but the revo’s I’d absolutely use.

Also, I feel oddly old now after typing that 90’s stuff is retro. I may have been a teenager for most of the 90’s, but I remember vividly when all of this stuff was on the covers of gun rags.

[JonInWA]

The barrels are not cast, to the best of my knowledge.

The barrels are made from cast blanks, and are broach-bored. They are are of exceptionally high quality durable steel.

Best, Jon

[Whirlwind06]

I had bought a used P89, the firing pin channel was so full of gunk that it wouldn’t fire. The first pistol I detail stripped to its component parts. Replaced all of the springs, once I did that it ran just fine. Even carried it for a while. The mag releases were problematic with a lot of holsters I discovered that you could remove the right side one which helped. I had couple P95s as well but all the cool kids had 1911s and Glocks. So they got traded for “just as good as Glock” keltecs and XDs [emoji12]

I wouldn’t say that I miss them but if I still had them would be nice to take to the range one in a while.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[JonInWA]

I am stunned and surprised, only not. :D

I'm going to go out on a limb and guess that mainsprings weren't getting replaced at any kind of regular interval. (Although I wonder what the lifespan on them is, assuming fairly regular recoil spring replacement? A lot of manufacturers are surprisingly vague on these sorts of things.)

I'm gonna assume that Tam was actually refering to recoil, not mainsprings in her discussion. However, in the case of both, they were essentially engineered to be "lifetime" springs-the recoil spring generally needing to be replaced much more frequently than a mainspring, my interpretation of the "lifetime" P85/P89 recoil spring would be someplace between 20K and 40K rounds.

The P85/P89s need to be run wet , particularly efarding the slide/receiver rail interface surfaces. Grease, or a cream-type lube like TW25B is strongly advised. I run mine with Lucas Red "N" Tacky #2 grease on metal-on-metal reciprocating surfaces. The anodized receiver aluminum alloy with its hard coating is actually harder than the carbon-or stainess-steel slide, so a thicker lube is pretty necessary.

Correctly lubed, I don't experiece the "Shake Weight" characteristic Tam alluded to.

Best, Jon

[Joe in PNG]

My first centerfire handgun was a P-95DC.

I didn't own it long or shoot it lots, or even carry it. I also don't regret selling it.

[Tamara]

I'm gonna assume that Tam was actually refering to recoil, not mainsprings in her discussion.

No, I was specifically referring to mainsprings, as noted by my wondering whether recoil spring replacement intervals affected that.

In a hammer-fired gun, overrunning the hammer provides a significant proportion of braking force to the slide.

[JonInWA]

No, I was specifically referring to mainsprings, as noted by my wondering whether recoil spring replacement intervals affected that.

In a hammer-fired gun, overrunning the hammer provides a significant proportion of braking force to the slide.

I suppose that's possible, but while not a gunsmith/engineer/manufacturer, in my readings and experiences with semi-auto pistols, the need for mainspring replacement is pretty rare; they seem to be pretty much a lifetime part. Recoil springs on the other hand, need to be replaced with some frequency at forecastable replacement intervals. The longest recoil spring replacment intervals that I'm aware of are HK P30 RSAs, at every 25K rounds, and Ruger's P85/P89s, which are "lifetime" according to a knowledgeable Ruger engineer (who was one of the actual P85/P89 project engineers).

I'd be much more suspect of neglected recoil spring replacement intervals (particularly in organizational pistols) than mainspring replacements or the need for mainspring replacement.

If you've got some information to the contrary, I'd be very interested to hear.

Best, Jon

[Tamara]

I suppose that's possible, but while not a gunsmith/engineer/manufacturer, in my readings and experiences with semi-auto pistols, the need for mainspring replacement is pretty rare; they seem to be pretty much a lifetime part. Recoil springs on the other hand, need to be replaced with some frequency at forecastable replacement intervals.

There are only so many branches on the diagnostic tree for "failure to fire".

I'm not a gunsmith, I've only written up service tickets for gunsmiths for many years, so take my hypothesizations with a grain of salt. I'm a gunwriter and we all know those people are full of shit.

I'll note that, in the process of debugging a failure-to-fire issue that cropped up at around the 750-rd mark in a small DAO hammer-fired .380 pistol I was testing, I contacted someone at the manufacturer to ask about recommended replacement intervals for the RSA and mainspring and was basically given a shrug. When I had a friend contact a large LE agency that issued them as BUGs, I was told that their armorers recommended replacing both at the 250-rd mark.

[Tamara]

Also, I literally LOL'ed at "lifetime".

I had an optics company engineer look me in the eye and tell me how optimistic he was about the durability of a red dot sight because they had examples having gone over a thousand rounds with no issues.

Engineers in this industry are just...man. The more of 'em you meet, the more you wonder how much anyone who actually shoots has input into this stuff.

[Bigghoss]

So much yes! But will never happen....

pat

We'll never even see the return of any of the P series. But I would be so stoked just for that.

[Bergeron]

In one of Rob Leatham's video interviews, he mentions how the eningeers were happy for him to evaluate completed products, but were uninterested in having him involved in actual design efforts. :rolleyes:

[MD7305]

My old department issued those after the switch from revolvers. Kept them for about 10 years before switching to H&K’s. It was before my time, but I’ve heard a ton of stories about problems with them.

JCPD?

[TC215]

JCPD?

Yep.

[Suvorov]

Also, I literally LOL'ed at "lifetime".

I had an optics company engineer look me in the eye and tell me how optimistic he was about the durability of a red dot sight because they had examples having gone over a thousand rounds with no issues.

Engineers in this industry are just...man. The more of 'em you meet, the more you wonder how much anyone who actually shoots has input into this stuff.

Don’t most of them live in countries that virtually ban civilian possession of firearms and even they are among the “anointed few”, 1000 rounds would be a lifetime of shooting?

[john c]

When things calm down I'd like to get a stainless P90DC. I got a good price on a P97DC a few years ago to go with my P95DC. I had a P345 but that gun definitely wasn't as well executed as the rest of the series.

I'm interested in hearing more about the pros and cons of the P345 versus the P97. Since I sold my P90, prices have gone up, while P97s and P345s are still somewhat reasonable.

[BigT]

Don’t most of them live in countries that virtually ban civilian possession of firearms and even they are among the “anointed few”, 1000 rounds would be a lifetime of shooting?


Not in Germany or Austria.

They aren't exactly Indiana when it comes to gun ownership, but you can get them if you want them.

[Joe in PNG]

Engineers are engineers no matter the field, and all are susceptible to being stung by the Good Idea Fairy.

Needless complications, useless useful features, kewlness over functionality, looks over ergonomics, fidelity to obsolescent requirements, concepts that worked better on paper, and so on are pretty common across the design front.

[Whirlwind06]

I'm interested in hearing more about the pros and cons of the P345 versus the P97. Since I sold my P90, prices have gone up, while P97s and P345s are still somewhat reasonable.

The P345 is probably the best looking P series that Ruger produced.
There was something about a mag disconenct that would damage the firing pin when dry firing without a mag installed.
A fair number of owners would "clean" the rear sight, which would remove the disconnect parts.
Other then that I'm not aware of any problems with it.



http://www.rugerforum.com/phpBB3/viewtopic.php?t=286429

[Bigghoss]

I'm interested in hearing more about the pros and cons of the P345 versus the P97. Since I sold my P90, prices have gone up, while P97s and P345s are still somewhat reasonable.

The P345 is a little slimmer and can be had with an accessory rail and also has a much better grip texture. But it has a magazine disconnect which can break and that is not a rare occurrence. It also has an internal lock. I don't recall ever hearing about that breaking but if you're like me you just despise the thought. Both guns use roughly the same internal design so they use the same hammer springs and magazines.

I think both guns can also be had as decock-only (the DC suffix) but the P345DC is very uncommon. If I ever come across one I might pick it up because I did like the gun for the most part but I didn't like all the lawyer features.

[Bigghoss]

This is pretty neat. Ruger is auctioning off a P94DC with built in laser with the proceeds going to the Scholastic Action Shooting Program. Current high bid is $800.

https://www.gunbroker.com/item/879686034#carousel-modal-view-item

[HCM]

Not in Germany or Austria.

They aren't exactly Indiana when it comes to gun ownership, but you can get them if you want them.

Nor Sweden. Didn't aimpoint run an ACRO through 20,000 rounds of .40 ?