Beretta 92D w/ 92X Grip

[OlongJohnson]

e_stern

Tell us what's up with this, please. My understanding is that it couldn't have happened without going through you. Without knowing more than what's below, I gotta say, "Atta boy!"

https://www.budsgunshop.com/product_info.php/products_id/411559501

Beretta 92D w/ 92X Grip 9mm 15+1

Model: SPEC0668A
Condition: Factory New
Bud's Item Number: 411559501
UPC: 082442940090
MFG: Beretta

92X Full Size Receiver
Standard 92D Slide
Wilson Combat rear sight
Pro-Glo Orange front Tritium sight
Standard 92FS barrel
Vertec Grip panels
Two 15 round mags

Google doesn't show me that UPC anywhere but Bud's. It's not on the Beretta site or gun.deals. Is it a Bud's (or some other distributor) exclusive? Are they going to hit distribution and be more widely available?

The description says "Standard 92D Slide," but the photo looks like a dovetailed front sight.

[WobblyPossum]

That’s awesome if true. Sounds like it won’t be long before jetfire doesn’t have the world’s only 92D LTT.

[Jared]

All I know is.... I kinda want the damn thing. I think I already blew my October gun budget on a Smith Model 60 from back in the good old days.

Maybe this’ll still be in stock in November. Feature set looks awesome to me.

[jetfire]

e_stern

Tell us what's up with this, please. My understanding is that it couldn't have happened without going through you. Without knowing more than what's below, I gotta say, "Atta boy!"

https://www.budsgunshop.com/product_info.php/products_id/411559501

Beretta 92D w/ 92X Grip 9mm 15+1

Model: SPEC0668A
Condition: Factory New
Bud's Item Number: 411559501
UPC: 082442940090
MFG: Beretta

92X Full Size Receiver
Standard 92D Slide
Wilson Combat rear sight
Pro-Glo Orange front Tritium sight
Standard 92FS barrel
Vertec Grip panels
Two 15 round mags

Google doesn't show me that UPC anywhere but Bud's. It's not on the Beretta site or gun.deals. Is it a Bud's (or some other distributor) exclusive? Are they going to hit distribution and be more widely available?

The description says "Standard 92D Slide," but the photo looks like a dovetailed front sight.

Well, now that Bud's leaked this I guess I can talk about it. If you follow me on Instagram I've been hinting about a new product coming from Beretta for a bit, and this is it. This was born from a conversation I was having with Stern about the 92D and how its awesome. This is a super limited run, they're not making a lot of guns because they want to see how they sell, so you people better get your mitts on them while they last.

Oh also it's not a "standard" 92D slide, it's a Vertec-D slide. It's pretty awesome.

[OlongJohnson]

I sold three K frames this spring. This would replace them all - without a reload.

[backtrail540]

So vertec slide as in LTT can cut it for their RDO package?

[jetfire]

So vertec slide as in LTT can cut it for their RDO package?

Correctamundo! Knowing that these were coming is why I didn't send the 92D-LTT to Ernest.

[pangloss]

I'm not sure what sort of hipster value to assign to this gun. Looks fantastic though!

Sent from my moto e5 cruise using Tapatalk

[AdioSS]

My only wish is that it was available in .40

[Jared]

Well, now that Bud's leaked this I guess I can talk about it. If you follow me on Instagram I've been hinting about a new product coming from Beretta for a bit, and this is it. This was born from a conversation I was having with Stern about the 92D and how its awesome. This is a super limited run, they're not making a lot of guns because they want to see how they sell, so you people better get your mitts on them while they last.

Oh also it's not a "standard" 92D slide, it's a Vertec-D slide. It's pretty awesome.

Is it a Buds exclusive or will it be available in other places?

[Suvorov]

Thankfully, the "good" people in Sacramento are keeping my wallet safe from such an indulgence (I got to pay taxes you know.....). :mad:

[TheNewbie]

My only wish is that it was available in .40

My only wish is that I had the extra resources to invest in this.

[e_stern]

Welp, this was our fastest path to satisfy y'alls demand for D guns with what we have in stock in this crazy year.

For now, this is likely the ONLY run of D models in the near future, so I'd suggest jumping on them if you're interested. I know I am planning on it. D models are not really well liked outside of some really specific use case oriented shooters.

Frames are 92X and slides are 92D Vertec.

Barrels are indeed standard 92 4.9", and panels are old school Vertec, although the 92X grips are a direct fit.


Yes, these are 16 shot (out of the box) or 19 shot flush (W/MecGar) K frames. I plan to carry one.


These are a VERY small run also FYI guys.

[JRB]

I missed my chances at a Langdon M9 and the Tennessee Volunteer models that I wanted, because in both cases I was an idiot and assumed I could wait a bit.

I hope everyone that wants one gets these while the gettin's good.

[Suvorov]

e_stern

As Kalifornia resident who had to scramble and pay a little extra for a M9A1 I am wondering if they are still in production or if the model has been discontinued in favor of newer (not Kalifornia approved) models.

Also is there any chance the new compact slide with removable front sight might become available?

[e_stern]

e_stern

As Kalifornia resident who had to scramble and pay a little extra for a M9A1 I am wondering if they are still in production or if the model has been discontinued in favor of newer (not Kalifornia approved) models.

Also is there any chance the new compact slide with removable front sight might become available?

It's 2020.

Not discontinued, just completely swamped.

Definitely not anytime soon.

[Jared]

Welp, this was our fastest path to satisfy y'alls demand for D guns with what we have in stock in this crazy year.

For now, this is likely the ONLY run of D models in the near future, so I'd suggest jumping on them if you're interested. I know I am planning on it. D models are not really well liked outside of some really specific use case oriented shooters.

Frames are 92X and slides are 92D Vertec.

Barrels are indeed standard 92 4.9", and panels are old school Vertec, although the 92X grips are a direct fit.


Yes, these are 16 shot (out of the box) or 19 shot flush (W/MecGar) K frames. I plan to carry one.


These are a VERY small run also FYI guys.

Are these only available through Bud’s or will they hit normal distribution channels also?

[Gadfly]

#Temptation (https://pistol-forum.com/usertag.php?do=list&action=hash&hash=Temptation)

61221
61222

[TicTacticalTimmy]

This is really cool. You've got to hand it to Beretta for actually listening to what customers want. It looks like it comes with good night sights as well.

I believe this is the only true DAO service pistol currently on the market.

[TheNewbie]

I really appreciate Beretta doing this. It's unfortunate it happens when I CAN'T buy it, but I am still impressed.

[backtrail540]

Ordered one...always wanted to play with a d model and this is too tempting to pass on.

[jeep45238]

If this is going to be available through normal channels, I'll grab one up.

I want one, just at wholesale pricing if I can :-)

[CraigS]

If this is going to be available through normal channels, I'll grab one up.

I want one, just at wholesale pricing if I can :-)
Jeez. Get it from Buds and be done.

[jetfire]

Ordered one...always wanted to play with a d model and this is too tempting to pass on.

Did Bud's say what their delivery timetable is going to be?

[backtrail540]

Did Bud's say what their delivery timetable is going to be?

They already updated it to shipping. Not sure if they already had them on hand or if it's just an automated thing though.

**edit** they also had an option to pick your serial number for those interested...i don't give af, but some like that

[Bigghoss]

Just ordered one. I regret selling my 92D centurion. If I could get anything I wanted I would get a 92D Centurion with an M9A1 frame. But for $650 this is close enough.

[OlongJohnson]

They already updated it to shipping. Not sure if they already had them on hand or if it's just an automated thing though.

**edit** they also had an option to pick your serial number for those interested...i don't give af, but some like that

If you were one of those guys who is going to leave multiples in the wrapper in the safe and try to sell them in five or ten years, sequential serial numbers seem to add a little bump in value. I saw another guy on here mention sequential numbers to give to his two sons, which is pretty cool.

[Bigghoss]

I looked at the serial number option but none of the available numbers had any significance for me. $5 is pretty reasonable to choose which number you want from the inventory.

[JonInWA]

Guys, this is huge. Add a LTT TJIB and you've got an exceptional package. The Vertec frame and rounded triggerguard make this an exceptionally well thought-out 92D variant (or an exceptional 92 varient period).

Best, Jon

[oregon45]

I've got two incoming from Buds, very excited!

[e_stern]

My only wish is that it was available in .40

Unless something drastically changes in the market, .40 for defensive use is essentially going the way of the dodo. Even with the shortage of 9MM today (which won't last forever).

I would STRONGLY urge that you check out some of the newer 9x19 defensive loads. My personal favorites being Federal HST or Winchester RA9T. They are exceedingly effective, lower recoil, and yield lessened wear on a 9MM as well as drastically improved accuracy on the part of the shooter under stress.

If you really want .40, I'd suggest checking out the PX4. It's the only .40 Platform I enjoy shooting outside of a full size USP in .40 personally.


FWIW, .45GAP caught my interest recently, and even that is far more pleasant to shoot in a 9MM size platform than .40 IMHO. Of course, you know what they say about opinions and how everyone has them....



Now, if we're talking about USPSA or the like, I can see your desire, but unfortunately a US Made .40S&W 90 series will not be happening in the forseeable future.

[e_stern]

Are these only available through Bud’s or will they hit normal distribution channels also?

Bud's only right now.

[e_stern]

e_stern and/or jetfire, are these guns going to have the same number/configuration of slide serrations as the old 92Ds?

The picture on Bud's shows them stopping at the same location as they do on the safety/decocker equipped guns and not extending back the extra couple of centimeters they do on the old 92Ds.

These are the F/G standard serrations, shorter than the old Ds.

[Doc_Glock]

What a cool gun!

I already have a couple 92Ds if. If not I would be all over this. They are great guns.

I still might. I bet they don’t sell out anywhere near as fast as the begging from Beretta folks would lead you to believe. Sadly Beretta lovers seem to not put their money where there mouth is.

[Matt C.]

Cheaper here.
Gunbroker 880445463
(Don't know how to send a link from my phone)

Sent from my SM-G970U using Tapatalk

[TheNewbie]

What a cool gun!

I already have a couple 92Ds if. If not I would be all over this. They are great guns.

I still might. I bet they don’t sell out anywhere near as fast as the begging from Beretta folks would lead you to believe. Sadly Beretta lovers seem to not put their money where there mouth is.


No question I would have got these had they came out last year, but I went to the P-07. Just not able to do a switch at this time.

I really want one of these.

[Gadfly]

E_stern, thanks for making this project!

I want one badly to go with my 4 other pizza guns... but Covid has cut off my wife’s income for now.😕

My only request if you have stroke/juice with beretta? Forward serrations like on the LTT should be on all 92s! It seems like a no brainer, and minimal extra machine time.

Just a though and one of my only complaints of the 92 series. (I am 90% sure our old issued 96D Brigs had front serrations.)

Thanks for making a run of the D, that gun rocks.

[backtrail540]

When you click on the link, you can view the available serial numbers. I counted 48 but may have been off one or two so we'll say ~50 available at buds. Don't know if that's with the orders already in or total count.

[Doc_Glock]

e_stern. Do these come with the over grip that simulates a standard 92?

If not, are those grips available currently from Beretta.

[Hizzie]

Want bad. Running the numbers now to see if I can swing it.

[OlongJohnson]

e_stern. Do these come with the over grip that simulates a standard 92?

If not, are those grips available currently from Beretta.

https://www.berettausa.com/en-us/m9a3-vertec-g10-wraparound-gri-m9a3-vertec/eu00083/

https://www.berettausa.com/en-us/m9a3-black-wraparound-grips-m9a3/jgm9a3lb/

[Doc_Glock]

https://www.berettausa.com/en-us/m9a3-vertec-g10-wraparound-gri-m9a3-vertec/eu00083/

https://www.berettausa.com/en-us/m9a3-black-wraparound-grips-m9a3/jgm9a3lb/

This is not helping. If that G10 was available in the past I never would have sent the M9 A3 down the river.

[OlongJohnson]

This is not helping.

Nobody ever said enabling was helping.

[AdioSS]

Unless something drastically changes in the market, .40 for defensive use is essentially going the way of the dodo. Even with the shortage of 9MM today (which won't last forever).

I would STRONGLY urge that you check out some of the newer 9x19 defensive loads. My personal favorites being Federal HST or Winchester RA9T. They are exceedingly effective, lower recoil, and yield lessened wear on a 9MM as well as drastically improved accuracy on the part of the shooter under stress.

If you really want .40, I'd suggest checking out the PX4. It's the only .40 Platform I enjoy shooting outside of a full size USP in .40 personally.


FWIW, .45GAP caught my interest recently, and even that is far more pleasant to shoot in a 9MM size platform than .40 IMHO. Of course, you know what they say about opinions and how everyone has them....



Now, if we're talking about USPSA or the like, I can see your desire, but unfortunately a US Made .40S&W 90 series will not be happening in the forseeable future.
I actually have all sizes of the PX4 in .40 & a few .40 Cougars. I have a .45 PX4 & I built a .45 PX4/Cougar Hybrid.

What I like most about the 96’s is that you can simply have a 9mm barrel & have the ability to shoot either caliber. Plus, there’s the option of aftermarket 357Sig barrels :D

[Suvorov]

Nobody ever said enabling was helping.

You are simply directing people to knowledge. Unless you are a certain serpent in an apple tree - what harm could you be doing?

And if he spends a few more bucks, VIP20 will get him $20 off (but only if he buys today).

[Duelist]

Wow, this is something that I didn’t know I needed.


But I’m in the middle of paying off some stuff, so I’ll have to hold off and watch them all sell out.

[revchuck38]

Wow, this is something that I didn’t know I needed.


But I’m in the middle of paying off some stuff, so I’ll have to hold off and watch them all sell out.

Ditto. I'll have to content myself with my PX4 D.

[Vista461]

I saw some on a certain auction site too.
Tempting, but I too am low on funds at the moment

[CraigS]

e_stern. Do these come with the over grip that simulates a standard 92?

If not, are those grips available currently from Beretta.
They sell the rubber overmold grip in brown and black. The G10 wrap around grip even looks pretty good on a tan M9A3.
https://live.staticflickr.com/65535/49058758783_38c39a6c17_z.jpg (https://flic.kr/p/2hK9XNF)20191112_160804 (https://flic.kr/p/2hK9XNF) by craig stuard (https://www.flickr.com/photos/152454123@N04/), on Flickr
I think having all the control levers in black helps it fit in.

[e_stern]

I actually have all sizes of the PX4 in .40 & a few .40 Cougars. I have a .45 PX4 & I built a .45 PX4/Cougar Hybrid.

What I like most about the 96’s is that you can simply have a 9mm barrel & have the ability to shoot either caliber. Plus, there’s the option of aftermarket 357Sig barrels :D

I'd be interested in seeing that Hybrid... I have a spare PX4 .45 slide lying around right now...

As for this model, I can tell you that it will not be made in .40 at all.

[AdioSS]

I'd be interested in seeing that Hybrid... I have a spare PX4 .45 slide lying around right now...

As for this model, I can tell you that it will not be made in .40 at all.

Sad about no mo fo oh

And the hybrid was me making a 45 Cougar upper work & fit on a 45 PX4 lower.
https://i.imgur.com/jd1PBpwl.jpg
I made a thread about it on the Berettaforum https://berettaforum.net/vb/showthread.php?t=145528

[LockedBreech]

Saw this on Bud's the other day and thought I was seeing things. Very cool. As good as it gets for a revolver style trigger in a semi.

[Hizzie]

Does one use the standard TJIAB in the DAO variants? Does you need to mix/match parts? Or just buy LTT trigger bar and springs?

[JonInWA]

Does one use the standard TJIAB in the DAO variants? Does you need to mix/match parts? Or just buy LTT trigger bar and springs?

Actually, since the 92D has no sear or safety/decock levers, you really only need select TJIB components, best ordered a la carte from LTT. I'm thinking the LTT triggerbar, hammer strut, springs; an extended magazine release might also be desirable.

Best, Jon

[Bergeron]

When I was improving upon my 92D Centurion, I just ordered a plain NP3 TJIAB, and didn't install the sear. Everything came out great.

[OlongJohnson]

The Wilson kit is $67 from Optics Planet. Includes trigger bar and an assortment of springs. Deburring and slicking up stuff so there isn't drag that shouldn't be there is all that should be needed beyond that.

[CraigS]

Ernest has worked w/ a couple of D owners and can recommend exactly what you need. One thing I remember is that due to the one piece firing pin the D can generally use a 1# lighter hammer spring compared to a 92 w/ safety/decocker. I think a D w/ a few NP3 parts and an 11# spring would almost unbelievable. I know that the DA pull of my M9A1G IDPA pistol w/ the NP3 TJIB and 11# is almost unbelievable but I have to be real careful to keep it clean as it has about an 400 round life and then I start getting a few light strikes.

[backtrail540]

Standard capacity k frame has arrived

61369

61370


Vertec grip is different. Not bad or good but doesn't feel like a beretta. Trigger is smooth. Sights don't move in the few dry presses I've made. I'll do a real dry practice session tomorrow and get rounds down range this weekend.

Aside from some 18 round mec gars, an extended mag release, and g10 grips, i will probably leave it as is until next year. More thoughts over i actually get time with it tomorrow.

[Bigghoss]

I also see 28 slide serrations (instead of 20) which means it's a "proper" D slide. I'm more happy than I should be to see that. :)

It does add to the aesthetic of the D models. Which is part of the appeal for me.

[Rev579]

Correctamundo! Knowing that these were coming is why I didn't send the 92D-LTT to Ernest.

Has there been any confirmation about if LTT will mill these for RDO? The mod to the slide is more than just milling the slide. There are also patents pending on an adaptor plate, the modified safety plunger, firing pin, firing pin block, extractor pin, and G-Lever, which makes me think there could be an issue.

[backtrail540]

Has there been any confirmation about if LTT will mill these for RDO? The mod to the slide is more than just milling the slide. There are also patents pending on an adaptor plate, the modified safety plunger, firing pin, firing pin block, extractor pin, and G-Lever, which makes me think there could be an issue.

LangdonTactical. Any thoughts on if this can be currently milled for your rdo?

[backtrail540]

Thoughts after first dry practice session -

The vertec grip seems to let my grip slip low, feeling as if it tapers toward the magwell and wants to slip out of my hand, rather than sucking the web of my hand up into the beaver tail like I perceive with a normal beretta grip or cz. Once I shoot it live for a few sessions, I'll probably end up with the g10 conversion grips.

The sights are fine but the wilson is fairly sharp. At some point I may swap it for a Les Pep rear as I have on my previous beretta's. But they are adequate as they come, assuming poa/poi is correct.

Definitely need to grab an extended mag release.

Trigger is fine from the perspective of pull. I would like a bit stronger reset so a stronger trs may be in order. If I do a stronger trs I may play with hammer springs to balance the weight. A lot of time with DA/SA guns and strikers over the last few years allow short stroking if I'm not conscious of it. That will fix over time but I'd still prefer a strong reset regardless.

The slick slide and bobbed hammer are exceptional from carry perspective. No poking bits or anything to snag on clothes or cut hands etc...

The frame needs dehorned. I may consider sending it to Langdon for the carry bevel if he ends up doing the rdo for these. I've been spoiled with my last few Beretta's (brig tac and ltt) but the bottom of the trigger guard on this is sharp!!! Chews up my support hand and my glock knuckle a fair amount.

Oh, I almost forgot. I was concerned that the vertec frame would print more so than the standard 92 being that it has a point rather than the curve of the normal 92 grip. In part this is true, as the round standard grip lets my shirt drape and the vertec is a more defined pinpoint but not at all to the extent that it matters to me. I'm running it from a phlster floodlight at the moment and it conceals fine even with a tlr1 hanging off of it. No plans to get a new holster at the moment.


Certainly excited to get in some live fire with this gun and see what I can (or can't) do with it as opposed to more standard trigger systems. Nice to have a hammer to trap on reholstering again, paired with initial travel.

[Doc_Glock]

Okay I caved and have one coming.

I need the best deal on the G10 grip from Beretta because I hate that rubber one and don't care for the Vertec grip either.

Any discount codes or best times to shop Beretta website?

[Manbearspider]

Looks like that is a Vertec D slide, so LTT should be able to mill it for RDO. As for best trigger setup, my understanding is that for a D gun, you want to go with the Wilson trigger bar (lengthens the DA arc release point), a Cougar D hammer spring, and of course NP3 all the things (trigger bar, hammer, hammer pin, trigger pin).

[buzz_knox]

What is the usual trigger weight on a 92D?

[LangdonTactical]

LangdonTactical. Any thoughts on if this can be currently milled for your rdo?

Not right now. It requires that we make a new firing pin and a different front sight along with a new plate for the Brigadier slide. You don't have those things made in small quantities, so it is not even close to the top of the list to throw money at that we may get back one day.

[CraigS]

Okay I caved and have one coming.

I need the best deal on the G10 grip from Beretta because I hate that rubber one and don't care for the Vertec grip either.

Any discount codes or best times to shop Beretta website?
Doc I am not even sure how I got on Beretta's email list but I am. I get 2-4 emails per week. Right now I have Monday's email offering 25% off if you spend over $150 for one day only. Todays is all about clothing.

[Rev579]

Not right now. It requires that we make a new firing pin and a different front sight along with a new plate for the Brigadier slide. You don't have those things made in small quantities, so it is not even close to the top of the list to throw money at that we may get back one day.
That was my biggest concern, however I thought it would only be limited to the different firing pin. I didn't anticipate needing a different plate too. Bummer. I do get it, but I hoped it would have been less problematic. Thanks for clearing that up.

[Bigghoss]

My example came in today but background checks are taking about a day and a half so I don't get to take it home yet.

For those wondering, it does NOT come with the G10 conversion grips, or any G10 grips like the 92X. Just the classic plastic Vertex grips.

The trigger on mine wasn't terrible bit it did stack a lot. Not a problem because I wasn't going to leave the factory hammer spring in it anyway. There's also a pretty good gap under the back of the rear sight and the slide. Other than being ugly I don't see it being a problem.

For $650 I am happy with it assuming I don't find any other issues.

[Rev579]

Standard capacity k frame has arrived

Vertec grip is different. Not bad or good but doesn't feel like a beretta. Trigger is smooth. Sights don't move in the few dry presses I've made. I'll do a real dry practice session tomorrow and get rounds down range this weekend.

Aside from some 18 round mec gars, an extended mag release, and g10 grips, i will probably leave it as is until next year. More thoughts over i actually get time with it tomorrow.

Any insight as to the finish on the slide? Bruniton?

[Bigghoss]

There's a nice M9A1 on GB right now for a fair price with the buy-it-now option. I'm tempted to buy it and put the D slide and parts in the M9A1 frame...

[Welder]

The trigger on mine wasn't terrible bit it did stack a lot.

That's interesting because the old 92D's I've owned had the nicest triggers of any factory 92's, by A LOT...I guess it's the lack of a sear. They were on par with good S&W revolver triggers and I never saw the need to do anything at all to them.

I wonder what changed.

[Bigghoss]

That's interesting because the old 92D's I've owned had the nicest triggers of any factory 92's, by A LOT...I guess it's the lack of a sear. They were on par with good S&W revolver triggers and I never saw the need to do anything at all to them.

I wonder what changed.

The other 2 92Ds I had had a lot of use on them so it wouldn't be a fair comparison. Now my M9A3 that also has a #16 hammer spring feels a good bit better. Since it's stacking I'm guessing it's because of a sharp end on the hammer spring hanging up. LTT springs have a polished end to prevent that but Beretta factory springs usually don't.


I also did go ahead and buy that M9A1. I don't know if I'll go through with making an M9A1D but the price was fair so I can always sell it and get the money back if I choose not to go through with it. Or maybe I'll just keep it.

[Bergeron]

Any stacking in a DA 92 can be addressed by the LTT Trigger Bar. From my own limited experience, a NP3 TJIAB goes with a D model like smothered meat and rice.

[revchuck38]

Any stacking in a DA 92 can be addressed by the LTT Trigger Bar. From my own limited experience, a NP3 TJIAB goes with a D model like smothered meat and rice.

:)

[Bigghoss]

Any stacking in a DA 92 can be addressed by the LTT Trigger Bar. From my own limited experience, a NP3 TJIAB goes with a D model like smothered meat and rice.

I planned on getting an OP trigger bar and a few other things also so whatever is causing it will likely end up getting replaced anyway. As with any gun, I'll clean and inspect then test fire at least a couple hundred rounds before changing anything. Maybe I'll be able to find the culprit before I hit the range. Hell, maybe it's all the preservative they coat the thing in before shipping. It was oozing some kind of oil or something that I'm assuming is to keep the gun from rusting and may or may not be a decent lubricant. Seen a few guns coated with something that was designed to stay on the gun and keep it from rusting but would cause the gun to choke if it wasn't cleaned off first.

[awp_101]

Help a Beretta dummy out. I’ve never handled a Vertec, is the grip more like a 1911 or Glock?

[oregon45]

What would be lightest hammer spring appropriate for use in one of these 92D's, with only factory (Blazer brass 115/124gr) ammunition or handloads using Federal primers?

[Welder]

Help a Beretta dummy out. I’ve never handled a Vertec, is the grip more like a 1911 or Glock?

It's more similar to a 1911 with a flat mainspring housing. The M9A3 style of Vertec grip with the horizontal serrations in addition to the vertical is the only kind of Vertec that doesn't squeeze up out of my hands during recoil. I've always found it impossible to maintain a good consistent firing grip with the standard Vertec. But my hands are bigger and the original 92 grip profile has always fit me better.

[Welder]

Re: stacking in a Beretta trigger. The only consistent stacking I've ever noticed is when the firing pin block raises. That's across the board on any Beretta 92 regardless of model, and happens near the end of the pull. You can watch the block raise and feel the increase in trigger weight. Still can feel it on heavily modified triggers. Just a part of the design.

[Doc_Glock]

Help a Beretta dummy out. I’ve never handled a Vertec, is the grip more like a 1911 or Glock?

1911. Feels great shoots worse.

[OlongJohnson]

Re: stacking in a Beretta trigger. The only consistent stacking I've ever noticed is when the firing pin block raises. That's across the board on any Beretta 92 regardless of model, and happens near the end of the pull. You can watch the block raise and feel the increase in trigger weight. Still can feel it on heavily modified triggers. Just a part of the design.

Is there such a thing as a lighter FPB spring that is vetted as safe?

[Welder]

Is there such a thing as a lighter FPB spring that is vetted as safe?

I don't know the answer to that.

[OlongJohnson]

I looked through 2-3 pages of google results, and all I turned up was someone on Benos saying he'd shortened the factory FPB spring by 1/16" and polished the block itself. I imagine you'd want to look after the hole, too, if you were going down that path.

[Bigghoss]

Help a Beretta dummy out. I’ve never handled a Vertec, is the grip more like a 1911 or Glock?

It feels kinda 1911 ish.



What would be lightest hammer spring appropriate for use in one of these 92D's, with only factory (Blazer brass 115/124gr) ammunition or handloads using Federal primers?

I've heard as light as 11# for competition if you keep it clean. I plan on trying a 12# in mine.

[oregon45]

Just picked up the first of two I have coming from Bud's. Here it is:

https://i.imgur.com/2sNKONT.jpg

The good: Very nice slide to frame fit, smooth operation, my trigger doesn't stack but it is about as heavy as a standard 92 double-action pull; I suspect it will lighten up with use and I'll likely try a 12# hammer spring as well. There is a gap between the rear sight and the frame but it is not unsightly. The frame doesn't have any sharp edges other than the usual Beretta "hot spots" that are removed on the Elite LTT guns. The gun is also very sleek in appearance, and I think it will become even moreso once I add a 4.7" stainless barrel.

The bad: The front sight is visibly canted to the right. It appears either the dovetail was cut too shallow on one side, or was cut too deeply and the sight tipped to the right when installed. In either event, this one likely will go back to Beretta to have that fixed. I am going to shoot it first to see if it makes a difference--given that the sight is a "drive the dot" tritium ball-in-circle design paired with a U-notch rear sight, it may work fine despite the cant. But I found the sight-picture when dry-firing against a B8 target to be annoying, given that the top of the front blade and the top of the rear blade cannot be aligned.

[Doc_Glock]

Just picked up the first of two I have coming from Bud's. Here it is:

The bad: The front sight is visibly canted to the right. It appears either the dovetail was cut too shallow on one side, or was cut too deeply and the sight tipped to the right when installed. In either event, this one likely will go back to Beretta to have that fixed. I am going to shoot it first to see if it makes a difference--given that the sight is a "drive the dot" tritium ball-in-circle design paired with a U-notch rear sight, it may work fine despite the cant. But I found the sight-picture when dry-firing against a B8 target to be annoying, given that the top of the front blade and the top of the rear blade cannot be aligned.

That is hugely disappointing to hear.

[oregon45]

I'm hoping my second one will have passed through more rigorous quality-control. Should know in a few weeks when it comes in.

[backtrail540]

Re: front sight cant


Damn. Mine too. e_stern will we be able to send in just the slide and have this fixed?

61481

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61483

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[backtrail540]

Re: front sight cant


Damn. Mine too. e_stern will we be able to send in just the slide and have this fixed?

61481

61482

61483

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[awp_101]

It's more similar to a 1911 with a flat mainspring housing.


1911. Feels great shoots worse.


It feels kinda 1911 ish.
Thanks!

[oregon45]

To my hand, it feels like a double stack 1911 with an old style, non-Beavertail grip safety.

[Hizzie]

Those front sight pics certainly cooled my fire. Disappointing to say the least.

[Jared]

I handled one in a LGS this morning. Didn’t see any issue with the front sight and after this thread I was looking for one. Now, I have no idea how they had it in stock since it’s supposed to be Buds only, but this isn’t the first time they’ve had 92s on the shelf that were Buds exclusive. Remember the Langdon M9? I got my copy of that at this same shop.

Anyway, the new 92D is on layaway now with my name attached to it. Whether I’ll make a carry gun out of it or not is up for debate, it at the very least, it is cool.

[OlongJohnson]

I think Bud's must do big buys from manufacturers or distributors, then wholesale some of them out to other dealers. I (OP for this thread) learned about it due to it popping up in my "92D" search on GB, not by cruising Bud's website.

[Bigghoss]

I think Bud's must do big buys from manufacturers or distributors, then wholesale some of them out to other dealers. I (OP for this thread) learned about it due to it popping up in my "92D" search on GB, not by cruising Bud's website.

Must be because I saw one on GB for a starting bid of $650. If someone was buying them from Bud's to scalp I would think they would wait until Buds was out of them and then start it a bit higher.

[Willard]

Thanks OlongJohnson for the heads up. I've been looking for one of these for a long time, but the specimens I encountered were routinely well worn and I wanted a newer one to carry. I just ordered one and if it turns out nice and they are still available may get a couple more. Also thanks to mattC. for the tip on the better price. $599 OTD on GunBroker from Cove Creek.

[Bigghoss]

Picked up my 92D today and gave it a quick clean and lube. I'll take it out and shoot it tomorrow. The stacking isn't as bad as I remember, only noticeable right before the trigger breaks and even then only if you're going slow and looking for it. Normal dry fire you almost don't notice. My front sight looks straight so that's good but it does have a tiny gap under it. The rear sight is way worse.

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[Jared]

Must be because I saw one on GB for a starting bid of $650. If someone was buying them from Bud's to scalp I would think they would wait until Buds was out of them and then start it a bit higher.

Place I bought from definitely was not scalping, I paid $650 out the door. If I’d bought from Buds and paid the transfer fee, it would have been more. I really like that shop (the LGS).

[Bigghoss]

I did find an issue with my gun. One of my grip screw bushings wasn't staked very well and then someone cross threaded the grip screws so that bushing came out when I went to swap the grips. Had to do some questionable things to get the bushing back in and the original grips back on. It'll be going back to Beretta after I test fire it and see if anything else is wrong. The holes for the screws don't line up quite perfect so I'm thinking maybe the holes in the frame are off a bit.

[jeep45238]

These updates are very disappointing for a pistol I was trying to work into the budget.

[Bigghoss]

These updates are very disappointing for a pistol I was trying to work into the budget.

If it weren't a limited run I'd say wait for a bit. If you really want one grab one now and just get Beretta to fix it.

[feudist]

I will be the infidel in this thread and ask: what is this for?

TDA gives you the "threat management" long heavy pull, and then you have the short-light-crisp SA trigger for gunfighting.

:confused:

Is this for the Beretta completest?
.

[Bigghoss]

I will be the infidel in this thread and ask: what is this for?

TDA gives you the "threat management" long heavy pull, and then you have the short-light-crisp SA trigger for gunfighting.

:confused:

Is this for the Beretta completest?
.

1.) You don't have to learn two different pulls and transitioning between them
2.) No decocker is less stuff to break
3.) slick slide and no hammer spur looks cool
4.) Pizza gunz r lyfe
5.) something I'm forgetting.

[TGS]

I will be the infidel in this thread and ask: what is this for?

TDA gives you the "threat management" long heavy pull, and then you have the short-light-crisp SA trigger for gunfighting.

:confused:

Is this for the Beretta completest?
.

People were gunfighting with DAO triggers for a long time, and the DAO trigger wasn't the inhibiting factor but rather capacity and reload speed.

So, there's a subset of people who like the qualities of the DAO trigger and what it offers: exceptional accuracy once you learn how to properly shoot a gun, the extra threat management aspect, and the lack of need to decock. While we all talk about making decocking a subconscious thing, people do funny things under stress and sometimes indeed end up forgetting to decock, which becomes a safety issue. The DAO avoids that.

All you have to do is be at peace with the notion that you won't be looking sUPeR c00l on the square range with mad SpLiTZ on your timer...a pursuit that a growing number of people with experience at gunfighting regard as counter-productive and are actively trying to un-train.

tl;dr: pick your poison of what feels most important to you.

[backtrail540]

I will be the infidel in this thread and ask: what is this for?

TDA gives you the "threat management" long heavy pull, and then you have the short-light-crisp SA trigger for gunfighting.

:confused:

Is this for the Beretta completest?
.

For me, I'm getting ready to do a revolver focused year. I've really enjoyed shooting them and this will allow me to have a similar trigger operation while allowing greater capacity/ease of reloading and save on weight.

The trigger on mine is probably not as nice as a pc wheel gun(feels slightly longer and heavier) but it is adequate and from dry practice I can split it faster than assessment speed, so while I may not be able to meet some of the fun instagram challenges that are out there, I can (theoretically, my first session is later today, but based off prior dao experience) shoot this well enough that I'm not at a disadvantage from a carry perspective.

I like double action triggers, as they help with my anticipation issues. The lack of a wall helps me with the process of a continuous press.

And I'll absolutely admit, i just find dao fun. I find it enjoyable to learn different trigger systems(keeps me going back to the range). If it doesn't work out it is still a cool piece and nice dry practice tool.

[Bergeron]

I will be the infidel in this thread and ask: what is this for?

TDA gives you the "threat management" long heavy pull, and then you have the short-light-crisp SA trigger for gunfighting.

:confused:

Is this for the Beretta completest?
.

In my case, I was looking for a gun I could equip a total newbie with. It’s revolver-simple, with better ergonomics and 3x+ the capacity. It’s also great for more complex forms of dry practice.

[OlongJohnson]

1.) You don't have to learn two different pulls and transitioning between them
2.) No decocker is less stuff to break
3.) slick slide and no hammer spur looks cool
4.) Pizza gunz r lyfe
5.) something I'm forgetting.

I particularly like the slick slide on the Beretta. I've said before that the overall view when sighting a B92 with ambi levers is sufficiently like a beer hat to be distracting to me.

Some people find they actually tend to have better accuracy in DA fire. Which is good for accountability, as well as all the other precautionary aspects that are usually discussed.

[Bigghoss]

Some people find they actually tend to have better accuracy in DA fire. Which is good for accountability, as well as all the other precautionary aspects that are usually discussed.

I have noticed I concentrate harder on the DA and then am a little too quick with the following single action shot. I've heard other people say they do the same thing. Seems to be the natural progression of DA/SA shooting. You suck at double action so you practice the DA until you have it down pretty well and then find out you tend to snatch that second shot and you have to work on the transition from one to the next.


One other potential benefit I noticed, there's a false reset in the trigger and I didn't let the trigger all the way out a couple times. If you ever catch yourself short stroking any other gun, a 92D will force you to let that trigger all the way out.

[backtrail540]

I took mine out for the first session today. I wanted to see if the front sight being visibly off would have a huge impact on it's shooting. It would seem obvious that it would.

I ran it from a phlster floodlight with a tlr1 attached for the duration.

I started off with shooting off my range bag at 25. Ammo was AE 115. 10 rounds cold using top edge to bisect the target.

https://i.postimg.cc/rydQj8NS/20201011-093713.jpg (https://postimg.cc/XXbf76hJ)

Less than stellar but first rounds through a new and different gun. I decided to use a 6 o'clock hold at 25 and see if I could use top edge or drive the dot closer in.


I decided to jump right into my drills and started with a drill I call the Defoor Exam. A Defoor Pistol test #1 but with the first string replaced by a hat qual (10 rounds 20 seconds/90 to pass) and adding in a modified pistol test #2 where I replace the A zone with the b8 and need 5/6 on the b8 to pass(draw 2 in 4 seconds x3). The seven yard strings stay the same.

A miserable hat qual but the 6 o'clock hold seemed to get the elevation right when I did my part.

https://i.postimg.cc/59ZpkZsD/20201011-094037.jpg (https://postimg.cc/0r0pzHRC)

61 is the worst i've done on this part for this year. No excuses. I just didn't deliver here.

The modified Defoor #2 went better.

https://i.postimg.cc/RVHK6hQD/IMG-20201011-205803.jpg (https://postimg.cc/PPdP0t7W)

6/6 on the b8 and all under time.

At seven I had to push for a bit of speed for the first time. The one shot draw at 7 to the 6x6 was a fail. My thumb got caught in my cover garment and fouled my draw which resulted in an OT hit.

https://i.postimg.cc/5yqHgY74/20201011-094716.jpg (https://postimg.cc/YL0qq9BZ)

The ot was a result of me fouling the draw. Not much I can do but make sure that garment is out of the way!

Next was the bill to the 6x6.

https://i.postimg.cc/sfpZsqVk/20201011-094747.jpg (https://postimg.cc/z3GfkdH7)

Totally oofed the first shot high and then shot an extra shot. I ended up 3/4's of a second over par with .51 being the extra split. So just over a 1/4 second over par on the correct number of shots. Definitely takes more work to split a dao gun compared to a striker fired like the m&p's that i've been working with but with some dedicated effort I think I will be able to make this par without much trouble. The miss made it a failing string anyway.

The two to the credit card in 3.5 was a nice solid pair in 3.10. Slower than my average (mid 2's) but solid performance for a day 1 effort.

https://i.postimg.cc/wMdyDck4/20201011-094837.jpg (https://postimg.cc/nj0hJmgq)

Next I jumped right in to an Advanced Supertest. On the 7 yard portion of the Exam, I was driving the dot and it seemed to work fine, so I figured it would be ok to use top edge from 15 and in with the AE 115's. I was wrong.

https://i.postimg.cc/2yPW9NmG/IMG-20201011-205624.jpg (https://postimg.cc/K3D44V13)

An ugly 242. Hits were high until the 5, with two mikes at the 10 that were me breaking the shot too high. I decided to run it again using a 6 o'clock hold on all strings.

https://i.postimg.cc/6pCrSq8v/IMG-20201011-205704.jpg (https://postimg.cc/VJL00YBf)

A 274. My average for the year is 279, so a bit lower than average but that average was made with striker fired guns, some of which had dots, and two da/sa's. I think it's a solid baseline to start from. Unfortunately I hate a gun that uses a 6 o'clock hold and won't tolerate. About this time I ran out of AE 115 and had to use some leftover AE 124. The final drill of the day was the modified LAPD swat qual using a b8 and 3x5, ran from concealment.

https://i.postimg.cc/9XSyQZT9/IMG-20201011-162527.jpg (https://postimg.cc/c6RvDKF1)

My first pair at 25 sent the rounds a bit low using a 6 o'clock hold(3.09 with a low mike) so I switched to a top edge hold since the ammo changed to the AE 124. That change led to a 10/9 and 10/8 under par on the last two runs at 25. Bingo! This gun likes 124's. I kept a top edge hold the rest of the drill. Even with the mike, it wasn't the worst score I've put up on this section of the drill. Can't say the trigger is holding me back here.

https://i.postimg.cc/NFyTxjhL/IMG-20201011-162550.jpg (https://postimg.cc/JHLGrmzW)

All was average hits and under par at 15.

At 10 it was more of the same.

https://i.postimg.cc/JnYZJB29/IMG-20201011-162635.jpg (https://postimg.cc/LYfJFhRT)

All under par and average hits.

https://i.postimg.cc/1t3DfKJG/IMG-20201011-162847.jpg (https://postimg.cc/8Fx7YL8c)

Low end of average at 7.

As the distance got closer, I got into my own head and did what I knew better than to do. I started thinking about time and pushed artificially fast.

https://i.postimg.cc/LsRtMSP0/IMG-20201011-163002.jpg (https://postimg.cc/YvnG1Jb1)

Miked the first 3x5 shot while leaving plenty of time on the clock that I could have used to clean it up.

Same thing at 3.

https://i.postimg.cc/GpQkLfJ3/IMG-20201011-163032.jpg (https://postimg.cc/HJrJ3BhF)

Dropped a damn 3x5 though I only made the par by the skin of my teeth. I find absolute splits key on this string, depending on your draw time, but with the transition to the head I had plenty of time and just dropped the ball. Not much time left to clean things up, just have to drive to the 3x5 hard and make the shot. Cleaned it up with two 10's and a 3x5 hit on the final run as a nice way to end the drill.

Overall I ended up with 3 mikes (1 each at 25/5/3) That resulted in 302. While not my lowest on this drill, it was the most mikes I've had and still within a few points of my average runs with other guns. No excuses for the close misses but i believe that I would have not missed at 25 if I had known the 124's were hitting top edge rather than a 6 o'clock that the 115's were needing.


So a small collection of challenging tests for my first outing with the 92d. Honestly - it takes a bit more effort to shoot as well or close to my striker guns - but with some more time and familiarization I feel I could certainly lessen the gap. As long as it keeps on running then I won't have a problem using this as my primary when I start hitting wheel guns hard, at least from a performance perspective. I'm not worried about blind splits and it can be shot reasonably well at assessment speed. I won't be winning a MSP patch or turbo pin with it but after 1 day and some dry practice, so far i'm happy with it.

I think it will be a fun journey. The vertec grip didn't even bother me. As long as I made sure I was high up on the draw then it stayed put. Not as forgiving of a bad draw (as in low on the grip) as a normal 92, which somewhat self corrects by sucking my hand up into the backstrap thanks to the hump, but I didn't have any complaints about the grip at all. I ordered a set of g10's from lok in the veloce texture anyway. Still want to mess with springs and see if I can get a faster return and balance that out with a lighter hammer spring to keep it near where it's at. But really the only immediate thing I want to change is the mag button.

[Hizzie]

I broke down and ordered one. If it fits the hand well I’ll grab another along with WC TB Kit, extended mag release, 12.5# recoil spring and Lok G10 grips.

[Hizzie]

Ton of 92D info here:

https://pistol-forum.com/showthread.php?26669-Beretta-92D-With-Updates

I’m excited.

[feudist]

Why can't y'all leave me alone? Stop pushing me!

[Bigghoss]

Why can't y'all leave me alone? Stop pushing me!

You mean you haven't bought one yet? All the cool kids are doin' it. You wanna be cool, don't ya?

[TheNewbie]

Were 92 compacts ever made in DAO configuration?

[JonInWA]

Were 92 compacts ever made in DAO configuration?

Hmm, not sure about that one; I know that there was a 92D, 92D Centurion, and a 92D Compact L Type M, so I'd assume that there was, but I can't recall actually physically seeing or reading about the Compact L itself being available as a D.

Best, Jon

[Hizzie]

Were 92 compacts ever made in DAO configuration?

Hopefully the 92DXR is successful enough for Erik to make a Compact version reality.

[Wheeler]

Am I wrong in thinking that the sear can be removed from a 92 Compact and thus converting it to DAO? I realize the slide isn't as sexy like that...

[Bigghoss]

Were 92 compacts ever made in DAO configuration?


Am I wrong in thinking that the sear can be removed from a 92 Compact and thus converting it to DAO? I realize the slide isn't as sexy like that...

Beretta did make 92D Centurions which are the same slide as a compact. If you really wanted a 92D Compact you could hunt down a Centurion and swap the parts around and end up with a 92D Compact and a 92FS Centurion which you could easily sell. I think you could easily render any 92 DAO but then you'd still have the safety levers that could get flipped on by accident. I did see a run of 92D's that had safety levers on the slide but they had been fixed in place and couldn't move.

[perlslacker]

I did see a run of 92D's that had safety levers on the slide but they had been fixed in place and couldn't move.

Beretta sure is a weird company

[revchuck38]

I did see a run of 92D's that had safety levers on the slide but they had been fixed in place and couldn't move.


Beretta sure is a weird company

IIRC, the 92Ds with safety levers were one of the first batches they made.

[Rev579]

I did see a run of 92D's that had safety levers on the slide but they had been fixed in place and couldn't move.

The 92DS was made to be DAO and have a way to disengage the trigger bar. It was like a 92FS that was DAO.

[oregon45]

Just ordered a third gun from Buds; according to their serial number selector it appears there are fewer than 20 left in their inventory.

[OlongJohnson]

My first one won't be here until Thursday. I'm holding off on buying a second until I see if I am one of the lucky front sight winners.

[Bigghoss]

Honestly, I didn't think they would last this long. Although I would probably be surprised to hear how many were made.

[backtrail540]

Beretta did make 92D Centurions which are the same slide as a compact. If you really wanted a 92D Compact you could hunt down a Centurion and swap the parts around and end up with a 92D Compact and a 92FS Centurion which you could easily sell. I think you could easily render any 92 DAO but then you'd still have the safety levers that could get flipped on by accident. I did see a run of 92D's that had safety levers on the slide but they had been fixed in place and couldn't move.

D centurion slide on Ebay currently

https://www.ebay.com/itm/184414488802

[Bigghoss]

Just needs a spurless hammer to complete the look.

I really wish I hadn't sold my 92D Centurion.

[OlongJohnson]

https://www.brownells.com/handgun-parts/trigger-group-parts/hammer-parts/hammers/hammer-m92-96d-sku913100549-28360-56663.aspx

Or just a belt sander if you're not afraid of committment.

[oregon45]

Out of stock at Buds as of this evening.

[Willard]

Out of stock at Buds as of this evening.

Hopefully picking mine up tomorrow. The company (https://www.gunbroker.com/item/881378348) I purchased from, thanks to member here, still has 15 in stock and there seem to be several auctions on GunBroker. Not sure how long they will last, but glad I ordered one.

[boing]

D centurion slide on Ebay currently

https://www.ebay.com/itm/184414488802

That’s tempting, for a complete slide. I converted my FS centurion to DAO and installed a Wilson single-sided low profile G lever. AFAIK, that’s as close as you can get to leverless without grinding. I wonder how blem the slide really is in person. I also wonder why it matters with 9mm at $600/k. :/

[Willard]

Getting slower with age. Just realized my Kramer M9 holster won't work due to rail and likely rounded trigger guard. Anyone have recommendations?

[Jared]

Getting slower with age. Just realized my Kramer M9 holster won't work due to rail and likely rounded trigger guard. Anyone have recommendations?

Boosters for the 92X will work and I’d be more than willing to bet that boosters for the M9A1 will work too despite the differences in trigger guard. JM Custom Kydex has a load of awesome holsters. Keepers Concealment has excellent AIWB holsters also. Dark Star Gear has a holster out there that will work also.

[OlongJohnson]

This is a big bag of disappointment. I have been tagging e_stern to say Beretta should make this gun for years. They finally do it, and do it better than I had imagined, with a Vertec D slide. So I have to buy it. Was close to buying another. And they screw the pooch by machining the front sight dovetail at an angle. I did not transfer the pistol. It's going back to Bud's.

I suspect the majority of people who get these guns and fail to complain are just not noticing it. The defect is subtle, and not something anyone would have any reason to suspect. But once seen, it cannot be unseen, and would be a perpetual distraction.

I miss out on a once-in-a-lifetime chance to own an awesome gun, but I also avoid being sad/pissed off/disappointed/frustrated every time I see that front sight for the rest of my life.

[oregon45]

This is a big bag of disappointment. I have been tagging e_stern to say Beretta should make this gun for years. They finally do it, and do it better than I had imagined, with a Vertec D slide. So I have to buy it. Was close to buying another. And they screw the pooch by machining the front sight dovetail at an angle. I did not transfer the pistol. It's going back to Bud's.

I suspect the majority of people who get these guns and fail to complain are just not noticing it. The defect is subtle, and not something anyone would have any reason to suspect. But once seen, it cannot be unseen, and would be a perpetual distraction.

I miss out on a once-in-a-lifetime chance to own an awesome gun, but I also avoid being sad/pissed off/disappointed/frustrated every time I see that front sight for the rest of my life.

Did it appear to you that there would be enough material to re-machine the dovetail? I haven't removed the front sight on my gun yet, but I'm hoping that I can just file the sight itself to fit instead of having to alter the slide.

[OlongJohnson]

Unfortunately, due to the geometry of a dovetail, the only way to remachine it would be if you had a sight with a massively oversized dovetail base to fit to the new geometry. It's not like e.g. a square slot that can just be leveled. Or maybe the slide could be welded, but that's the kind of thing you do when restoring a valuable, impossible to replace part.

This whole thing makes me wonder whether us DAO dorks are the lucky ones, or are a whole bunch of Vertec/M9A3 slides going out the door with screwed up front sights?

[Willard]

I got mine today and see no issue with the front sight. Of course, I couldn't see it in the photos in this thread.

[Doc_Glock]

This is a big bag of disappointment. I have been tagging @e_stern (https://pistol-forum.com/member.php?u=14962) to say Beretta should make this gun for years. They finally do it, and do it better than I had imagined, with a Vertec D slide. So I have to buy it. Was close to buying another. And they screw the pooch by machining the front sight dovetail at an angle. I did not transfer the pistol. It's going back to Bud's.

I suspect the majority of people who get these guns and fail to complain are just not noticing it. The defect is subtle, and not something anyone would have any reason to suspect. But once seen, it cannot be unseen, and would be a perpetual distraction.

I miss out on a once-in-a-lifetime chance to own an awesome gun, but I also avoid being sad/pissed off/disappointed/frustrated every time I see that front sight for the rest of my life.

Thank you for the reminder to inspect the gun carefully before transferring it.

How is the sight cant best visualized?

Mine arrives Monday. I may accept it if I can be sure Beretta will fix it or replace the slide. They may not have more D slides though?

[OlongJohnson]

It can be seen a couple of ways.

When you're actually sighting with the sights aligned, the front sight being in the notch makes it a little less obvious. But if you elevate the front sight so you can see the sides down to the base, it's pretty clear.

If you look at the fit of the dovetail base in the slide, the left side is higher.

If you take the slide off the gun and sight from the front to back, you can see the base on the left (your right as you're looking at the slide) is definitely higher and protrudes more from the slide.

If you take along a straightedge, with the slide on the gunshop counter (you'll have to hold the rear down or remove the barrel), balance the straightedge on the flat top of the sight, and you'll see the angle of a few degrees.

[Doc_Glock]

It can be seen a couple of ways.

When you're actually sighting with the sights aligned, the front sight being in the notch makes it a little less obvious. But if you elevate the front sight so you can see the sides down to the base, it's pretty clear.

If you look at the fit of the dovetail base in the slide, the left side is higher.

If you take the slide off the gun and sight from the front to back, you can see the base on the left (your right as you're looking at the slide) is definitely higher and protrudes more from the slide.

If you take along a straightedge, with the slide on the gunshop counter (you'll have to hold the rear down or remove the barrel), balance the straightedge on the flat top of the sight, and you'll see the angle of a few degrees.


Thank you. I had a Sig Legion with a similar front sight issue and it shot fine but still bugged me no end.

[OlongJohnson]

I had a Sig Legion with a similar front sight issue...

I like classic Sigs a lot when they're good, but to pay ~30-50% extra for a premium version and find something that would render a base model defective just sours one on the whole mess.

[Jared]

I took the slide off of mine, put it on a bench with the barrel removed and put a bubble level on the front sight. If it’s canted, it is very very slight. I can’t see it, but thought I’d put the level on it to test. Of course, this probably removes any accuracy excuses I was going to have. I’ll also note that the slide had a fair amount of carbon inside it from test firing, more than I am accustomed to.

I will note that I ordered an Elite LTT with a trigger job and NP3 that came with the front sight slightly off center in the dovetail. Found that when I couldn’t understand why my shots were trending to the right (right handed shooter, when I screw the pooch I normally send em left) at ranges of 15 yards and greater. I looked, thought I saw something of center with the front, had a friend confirm. Yup, had to adjust to zero.

[backtrail540]

Last range report to bore you all with, unless something goes wrong. The crooked front sight seems to only be an aesthetic issue, as my shooting today was on par with my previous shooting of these drills.

https://i.postimg.cc/qMnjJvzk/20201018_091821.jpg (https://postimg.cc/SJSWVq65)

I have put a set of Lok grips in the veloce texture on the gun and dropped in a chrome silicone trs and 12 lb hammer spring to see how long it goes before not popping something.

I started with a cold fbi bullseye run. I ran it on a langdon target but overlayed a b8 repair center to make sure my 7's were in. I had a fairly poor start with an 88 to start at 25. Then I pulled out a 49,50,47,49 on the 15 yard strings for a 283, one of my better scores on this test.

https://i.postimg.cc/pLHkpMFK/20201018_092742.jpg (https://postimg.cc/CzcbQtJK)

Next I ran a sweet 16 drill. Starting at 7 yards I made it to 19 yards without a miss, though I called a miss at 12 and shot again but the first called miss was actually a very slight hit upon further inspection (high left nick of the card). At 19 I missed twice then my final shot was a 19 yard hit. That's the best i've done on this drill in a few years.

https://i.postimg.cc/76fnpxFr/20201018_094118.jpg (https://postimg.cc/xJVmmSj6)

The dotw, 10 round assault course was next with a solid 18.95 for 94 points. Pics in the dotw thread.

The 20 hits drill confirmed what I already assumed. It took 11 runs to get 20 hits (two single misses throughout the first 10 runs) for a total time of 28.33. That is a few seconds slower than with my iron sighted m&p's and 1 second faster overall than my rds run but the average run for the 92d was 2.56 where my m&p averages were 2.1-2.24 on the high end. I think it's due to the fact that I draw the m&p faster and a longer trigger press with the 92d. I'm still working on my draw to first shot time with the 92d.

https://i.postimg.cc/dQZ96VR8/20201018_100046.jpg (https://postimg.cc/ThGmYG4w)

I have come to like running a modified 99 drill using the black of a b8, since I have a stack of b8's and it's roughly equivalent to the area of a 4x6 card. I scored a 78, a point off from my highest this year. The da trigger leads to less anticipation for me and made it seem like routine effortless shooting. By the time i reset the target and started the press I could clean up the sights as needed and continuously work the trigger. Certainly happy with this, though the reload stage was easily my worst. I've got trouble hitting the stock mag button and have an extended piece on the way.

https://i.postimg.cc/KzwDb6bk/20201018_101458.jpg (https://postimg.cc/mz3HN6tB)
7 yard stage - d3 in 2.5 for 24/30 points

https://i.postimg.cc/fydjR8WH/20201018_102827.jpg (https://postimg.cc/Pvt86zwZ)
7 yard stage 2 - 1r2 in 5 for 22/30 points

https://i.postimg.cc/Ghkx0g5t/20201018-104147.jpg (https://postimg.cc/F7HL3pmX)
10 yard stage - d3 in 3.5 for 26/30

https://i.postimg.cc/SN0fvbVH/20201018_104539.jpg (https://postimg.cc/qgLKNYPG)
15 yard stage - d3 in 5 seconds for 6/9 points

Finally I ran 3 Fast's

7.16 clean but I had an issue getting the mag to drop then short stroked the trigger during the four body shots

5.90 clean(video in the FAST thread) all went well here. I've never been a coin run shooter, only having 1 or 2 at that performance level in my shooting career, but sub 6 is generally doable.

The last run was a 5.73 raw time but I squeaked one of the 3x5 shots an inch high so it ended up being 7.73. There's always one of the three...

I had 4 rounds of 147 hst left plus 1 ae fmj and wanted to see if the 12 lb spring would light off steel cased tula so I loaded 5 of those. 7 yards at a 2", all were hits except for one called flyer.

https://i.postimg.cc/pLRYPQwZ/20201018_110400.jpg (https://postimg.cc/GHgsQDh8)

I guess that's a long and somewhat detailed way of saying that I dig this gun and that the crooked front sight is simply cosmetic. Maybe a better shooter could notice a difference but in my hands it makes none. I'm going to run the rest of a box of the steel case through it next trip and see if the 12 lb hs will light them all off or not and a few hundred more rounds through it before settling on a 13 lb for carry for a little extra insurance. I'm not particularly worried as I carry hst's and it seems to like them. So far 50 hst 147's, 300 fed fmj's (115 and 124) and a few tula 115's. Dig it.

[Hizzie]

Great write up!

Mine arrived. Slightly wonky front sight but I’m used to using AK’s so not an issue as long as it zeroes. The trigger is t bad but stacks slightly. It needs a clean, polish and lube. WC Trigger Bar Kit SBR springs are on the way. An extended/oversized mag release is also inbound. I just need to decide on grips because these OG Vertec grips suck.

[OlongJohnson]

On the one I handled, the noticeable stacking corresponded to when the firing pin block started to move. As commented earlier by someone else.

[Jared]

On the one I handled, the noticeable stacking corresponded to when the firing pin block started to move. As commented earlier by someone else.

Mine stacks at that point and it is quite noticeable. I may have a look in there at some point and see if there’s any burrs or anything.

[CraigS]

I trim a coil or two off of the firing pin block spring and polish the block. I thought about trying to polish the hole in the slide but decided I might damage it so let it go. It makes a tiny improvement but I figure tiny improvements can add up.

[Doc_Glock]

These are now $589 with free shipping on GB. Bud's has taken about two weeks to get it to me (should arrive today). Wish I had ordered from these guys on GB:

https://www.gunbroker.com/Item/881754894

[Bigghoss]

At that price I might consider buying a second if I hadn't just won something else on GB. I'm out of fun money for the time being.

[JRV]

PSA: PSA also has them listed. Daily Deal for today.

[Doc_Glock]

Picked up my Bud’s gun today. If the sight is canted my 51 yo eyes can’t see it. I asked the 20 yo kid who checked me out and he thought he could see a subtle tilt to the right. I looked again at home and still can’t see it.

I think this thing is the perfect 92. Beautiful visible front sight. Rail. DAO. Smooth long trigger pull with minimal grit or stacking that I can feel. Will see how the Vertec grip works for me but I see little to complain about in this gun.

I stupidly did not realize it comes with very nice Wilson rear sight and that the front is Tritium as well as orange. Both of those were nice surprises.

Highly recommended. I am glad I have another coming from Cove Creek, but I don’t feel like I overpaid for this Bud’s example.

[Willard]

PSA: PSA also has them listed. Daily Deal for today.

FYSA Cove Creek Outfitters (mentioned elsewhere in this thread and doing business on GB -- I ordered from them, but have no affiliation) has them out the door for $589. PSA is $100+ more unless I'm missing a code or something.

[backtrail540]

Would I be able to run a 22 upper on a d lower? Or be able to put a d hammer in a complete 22 m9?

[Doc_Glock]

Adding some more random thoughts after handling this thing last night and this am:

The sights are really much better than I expected.

Trigger 9.25# and will probably settle in around 8.5# with me doing nothing besides shooting it.

I have bought a lot of guns and few have over delivered, but I really feel this one has. I am very impressed with it, especially in the $600 range, but it is not terrible at $700 either.

I have quite a few 92s. I would sell this one last if I were selling (well this or the 92D Centurion).

A few strange thoughts, and not anything I recommend, but: I would be comfortable carrying this gun sans holster in a pinch. The slick sides only add to that ability. Just stuff it in a belt old school. Also, I can see the thing laying in a sock drawer for years loaded with 19 rounds. It is literally a 19 shot revolver in that way. No drop safety worries. No yanking the second light shot worries, no shooting faster than assessment worries, greatly diminished unintended discharge worries. I get that we are all too well trained for that stuff, but I have people in my life aren't and never will be.

[feudist]

Just curious, what kind of splits are y'all seeing?

Also, does anyone have a strong preference for the Vertec grip or the grip adapter?

[Hizzie]

I dry fired mine a bit last night. Really impressed with how steady the sights stay. I love the sights too. I have upgrades on their way:

Wilson Combat Trigger Bar/Tuning Kit
WC Springs
OEM oversized/extended mag release
Lok Grips OD Green Bogies

I even found a WC Mag Guide in my parts bin last night looking for my spare x300u.

Even if this pistol doesn’t make the carry rotation I absolutely see it as a better nightstand gun than my G19.

[TheNewbie]

Will ALS holsters fit this?

[Wheeler]

I dry fired mine a bit last night. Really impressed with how steady the sights stay. I love the sights too. I have upgrades on their way:

Wilson Combat Trigger Bar/Tuning Kit
WC Springs
OEM oversized/extended mag release
Lok Grips OD Green Bogies

I even found a WC Mag Guide in my parts bin last night looking for my spare x300u.

Even if this pistol doesn’t make the carry rotation I absolutely see it as a better nightstand gun than my G19.

I put one of the WC Oversized Mag Releases on my M9. It mad a noticeable, positive difference in mag changes.

[Noah]

Will ALS holsters fit this?

Yes any M9A1 or A3 Safariland will fit this.

[Bigghoss]

Would I be able to run a 22 upper on a d lower? Or be able to put a d hammer in a complete 22 m9?

Conversion upper shouldn't be a problem. I don't know about parts interchangeability between the 9mm and .22lr pistols.



Will ALS holsters fit this?

Yes. I have an ALS/SLS holster and the 92D locks in just fine.

[Doc_Glock]

Just curious, what kind of splits are y'all seeing?

Last I timed myself with a D (not this one) it was around .35s on a B8 at 5 yds will keep it all in black. I split a Glock .20-.23s at this same target, so am not the quickest finger.

[Suvorov]

Will ALS holsters fit this?

Absolutely.

You really have no viable reason not to order one. Do it for those poor souls in Kalifornia who can not.

[TheNewbie]

Absolutely.

You really have no viable reason not to order one. Do it for those poor souls in Kalifornia who can not.

I’ve long thought about going to a DAO for duty. The P-07 is fantastic and I wish CZ had a good DAO/LEM/DAK option that had serious production numbers vs the few floating around from the military’s pistol trial.

With Beretta at least I’m getting a new production gun with serious factory support. It’s really tempting.

[oregon45]

I put a Langdon 12# hammer spring into my 92Dx and it dropped the weight of pull considerably, but the pull still feels a bit rough compared to the DA pull on my Elite LTT Centurion. I suspect that replacing the polymer trigger with a steel unit, and the factory trigger bar with a Langdon Optimized trigger bar (for the improved geometry and surface hardening if nothing else) will go a long way to smoothing out the mechanism. That and a lot of dry firing.

[JRV]

Just curious, what kind of splits are y'all seeing?

Also, does anyone have a strong preference for the Vertec grip or the grip adapter?

I have a 92X (not a D), but I never got used to the Vertec grip. It’s even more vertical than a 1911 and makes the grip feel unusually small.

[TheNewbie]

I have a 92X (not a D), but I never got used to the Vertec grip. It’s even more vertical than a 1911 and makes the grip feel unusually small.

Does the wrap around grip improve this?

[Bigghoss]

Does the wrap around grip improve this?

The G10 grips feel very close to a regular 92 frame. The rubber Hogue grips do not.

[Jared]

Does the wrap around grip improve this?

The rubber Hogues that come with the M9A3 make the gun larger than a normal 92 and aren’t really a great solution. The one that come with the 92X are different and better, but probably still not a 1:1 match with normal 92 dimensions . I’d say the G10 sets are the best if a person wants a grip conversion. I look forward to conversions that match the “thin” panel 92 ergos.

[CraigS]

The G10 grips feel very close to a regular 92 frame. The rubber Hogue grips do not.
I agree. While not a 92X I have the G10 wrap around grip on my M9A3 and it feels very much like a standard 92 grip. And it doesn't even look bad on my tan M9A3.
https://live.staticflickr.com/65535/49058758783_38c39a6c17_z.jpg (https://flic.kr/p/2hK9XNF)20191112_160804 (https://flic.kr/p/2hK9XNF) by craig stuard (https://www.flickr.com/photos/152454123@N04/), on Flickr
This shot shows how much difference there is.
https://live.staticflickr.com/65535/49516875278_6eb8fa8e44_z.jpg (https://flic.kr/p/2irCVSW)20200210_135430 (https://flic.kr/p/2irCVSW) by craig stuard (https://www.flickr.com/photos/152454123@N04/), on Flickr

[OlongJohnson]

This shot shows how much difference there is.
https://live.staticflickr.com/65535/49516875278_6eb8fa8e44_z.jpg (https://flic.kr/p/2irCVSW)

If I was proceeding down this road, I would almost certainly get out the wet sandpaper and a tub of water and slim down the lump at the top part of the back strap to blend the transition to the frame. But I'm just OCD that way.

[RAM Engineer]

If I was proceeding down this road, I would almost certainly get out the wet sandpaper and a tub of water and slim down the lump at the top part of the back strap to blend the transition to the frame. But I'm just OCD that way.

Probably just for durability. I can imagine if it was blended any more, that would be a very thin area of G10.

[WobblyPossum]

Well, I saw that Sportsman’s Supply was selling a bunch of these on Gunbroker so I threw a bid out on one of them. Won it for $500. I’m not a huge fan of the Vertec frame so I’ll probably try to snag one of the wraparound G10 grips the next time Beretta runs a sale.

[Bigghoss]

I agree. While not a 92X I have the G10 wrap around grip on my M9A3 and it feels very much like a standard 92 grip. And it doesn't even look bad on my tan M9A3.
[url=https://flic.kr/p/2hK9XNF]https://live.staticflickr.com/65535/49058758783_38c39a6c17_z.jpg

I actually bought mine for my M9A3. I found someone selling take-offs for $20. I wish I had bought both sets they had.

[TheNewbie]

Do many people prefer the VERTEC grip? Seems everyone likes the traditional grip better.

[revchuck38]

Do many people prefer the VERTEC grip? Seems everyone likes the traditional grip better.

I think it's like a flat mainspring housing on a 1911. It looks cool, but the arched version fits most people better.

[Hizzie]

Do many people prefer the VERTEC grip? Seems everyone likes the traditional grip better.

I’m really digging the Vertec grip angle. Hating the OG Vertec grip panels though.

[paherne]

Do many people prefer the VERTEC grip? Seems everyone likes the traditional grip better.

Some of us have small, beefy, potato-picker hands. Every small-handed or female officer I trained on the B92 system did better with a Vertec frame gun.

[Jared]

Do many people prefer the VERTEC grip? Seems everyone likes the traditional grip better.

Although I prefer the aesthetics of the standard frame, the guns I have that are Vertec framed aren’t wearing any conversion grips. I see very little difference between the two when actually shooting so I just leave them be.

[CraigS]

I think it mostly has to do w/ hand size and especially finger length. Anyone who shoots their 92 w/ the first shot in DA and has smaller hands/shorter fingers is really helped by the Vertec grip. I tried it when I first went to the range w/ my M9A3 and found that I was a couple inches low at 30 ft on quick shots from a low ready position. I popped on the rubber grip and that was immediately fixed so it stayed til the G10s came out. If I had short fingers, I would go Vertec on all our 92s and, if it were there, I am pretty sure the inches low would go away by the second or third box of ammo

[backtrail540]

I don't feel strongly either way on the vertec. It feels off to me but, with a pair of g10 panels, shoots just fine. I do like the beretta hump on the normal grip in that it pulls the web of my hand up into the beaver tail. With the vertec, if i am a touch low on the grip while drawing, it stays low but it is instantly felt but not hard to recover from.

At some point, when the wraparound g10 conversion grows come back in stock, I'm sure I'll try them. I'm in no hurry though as the vertec is serviceable as is for me.

[WobblyPossum]

Has anyone asked LTT if they’ll sell a Trigger Job in a Bag that doesn’t include the sear and sear spring for the DAO models? I’m curious how light and smooth you could get one of these triggers.

[OlongJohnson]

You just need the trigger bar and springs. Or get the Wilson kit with the bar and springs packaged together for $67 at Optics Planet.

[WobblyPossum]

The Wilson kit sounds like a good deal. I think that’s the route I’ll go. The extended mag release probably isn’t a bad idea either. I like the one on my LTT Elite and wasn’t a huge fan of the standard release on my issued M9.

[OlongJohnson]

I have messed with both the oversized checkered release and the one that's just a taller version of the stock button. With the Hogue G10 checkered grips appropriately modified, I went back to the standard button and sold the others. But it seems I have long thumbs.

[CraigS]

Has anyone asked LTT if they’ll sell a Trigger Job in a Bag that doesn’t include the sear and sear spring for the DAO models? I’m curious how light and smooth you could get one of these triggers.
Yes they will. There was a poster here and on the Beretta forum maybe 2 yrs ago who had a D. She talked to LTT, they sent a TJIB specifically for her D. One comment I remember from LTT via her was that, because of the one piece firing pin a D can generally use 1# lower hammer spring. So I kept that in back of my mind. I have been running a 12# in my idpa M9A1 for 3 yrs. So covid stopped matches for months this spring and I decided to try 11#. OMG, a 5# DA pull on a 92 is unbelievable. I can't promise that is available to everyone. I have an NP3 TJIB and have also polished everything that moves including the firing pin. And my firing block is polished and the spring snipped and I did start getting light strikes at about 400 rnds (so I pulled the extractor and spray cleaned it and firing pin) but walking up to a stage where the first shot is a 4" head shot at 25-30 ft and not worrying about it??? Oh yeah!

[CraigS]

I want to add some experience for anyone who hasn't messed w/ G10 yet. It has a no hand slip but not a 'my shirt gets hung up on it and prints' feel to it. It also has very little reaction to heat or cold that may be just a little bit better that way than plastic frames. I am a tinkerer so I often mod stuff like grips. Sorry that flickr has been messed up all day so I will try to add pics tomorrow. Anyway, G10 is kind of like a medium hardwood but w/o the grain. So sanding it is a breeze. If I plan to take off a lot I start w/ 100 grit. Smaller mods I might start w/ 150-220. The key is end w/ 400 or so. That will give a bead blasted metal or satin type finish. 400 w/ water or oil will get close to a gloss. When done sanding, blow or towel away the dust and wipe just a little oil, anything handy is fine, on the sanded area. This will get rid of the white haze. Then wipe it like crazy w/ dry towel or paper to get rid of the oil. I don't try any solvents because the couple I tried brought back the haze. I don't think I will ever buy anything but G10 from now on.

[WobblyPossum]

Yes they will. There was a poster here and on the Beretta forum maybe 2 yrs ago who had a D. She talked to LTT, they sent a TJIB specifically for her D. One comment I remember from LTT via her was that, because of the one piece firing pin a D can generally use 1# lower hammer spring. So I kept that in back of my mind. I have been running a 12# in my idpa M9A1 for 3 yrs. So covid stopped matches for months this spring and I decided to try 11#. OMG, a 5# DA pull on a 92 is unbelievable. I can't promise that is available to everyone. I have an NP3 TJIB and have also polished everything that moves including the firing pin. And my firing block is polished and the spring snipped and I did start getting light strikes at about 400 rnds (so I pulled the extractor and spray cleaned it and firing pin) but walking up to a stage where the first shot is a 4" head shot at 25-30 ft and not worrying about it??? Oh yeah!

I ended up buying the Wilson kit from Optics Planet. I have an NP3 Wilson trigger bar, as part of an NP3 TJIAB, on my LTT and the trigger is very smooth and light enough for me to enjoy it. That’s with a 13# hammer spring. I’ll likely go with the 12# spring for the 92D. While a 5# DA pull sounds out of this world, I’d be perfectly happy with a smooth pull of 7-8#.

[OlongJohnson]

I want to add some experience for anyone who hasn't messed w/ G10 yet. It has a no hand slip but not a 'my shirt gets hung up on it and prints' feel to it. It also has very little reaction to heat or cold that may be just a little bit better that way than plastic frames. I am a tinkerer so I often mod stuff like grips. Sorry that flickr has been messed up all day so I will try to add pics tomorrow. Anyway, G10 is kind of like a medium hardwood but w/o the grain. So sanding it is a breeze. If I plan to take off a lot I start w/ 100 grit. Smaller mods I might start w/ 150-220. The key is end w/ 400 or so. That will give a bead blasted metal or satin type finish. 400 w/ water or oil will get close to a gloss. When done sanding, blow or towel away the dust and wipe just a little oil, anything handy is fine, on the sanded area. This will get rid of the white haze. Then wipe it like crazy w/ dry towel or paper to get rid of the oil. I don't try any solvents because the couple I tried brought back the haze. I don't think I will ever buy anything but G10 from now on.

That's pretty close to my system. I use Johnson's baby oil so I know it's fine on my skin.

[Doc_Glock]

I got mine out for 200 rounds tonight. Good function except four fails to lock back on empty and two double clutches shooting fast. Both due to how I handle it.

I don’t care for this small grip. I find the long ass 92 slide difficulty enough to control without diminishing the surface area of the grip. I noticed the same sort of see saw nose dive I struggle with on these frames and G34s. Which are about the same length interestingly.

Sights are drive the dot out to 15 then switch to tip of front at 25 my example hit left consistently. Inspection at home revealed both the front and rear sights offset to the left (rear more). I centered them and hope it clears it up. The staking on the front sight is weak and actually doesn’t touch the frame at all just a dot on the sight.

Splits were as I remember .3-.4 max for me. And that not for long due to fatigue. And today that was not keeping things in the black on a B8.

I really think I need that G10 grip. If anyone has one they want to sell let me know.

It’s a cool gun but for shooting I shoot circles around myself with a Glock.

[backtrail540]

I really think I need that G10 grip. If anyone has one they want to sell let me know.



Doc or anyone wanting conversion grips, mgw has the plastic conversion grips for the 92x for under $20. While not the g10 grips, they look better than the rubber version and may be a decent stop gap until the g10's become available again. I snagged a set to tinker with.

https://www.midwestgunworks.com/page/mgwi/prod/ud5a1691

[Doc_Glock]

Doc or anyone wanting conversion grips, mgw has the plastic conversion grips for the 92x for under $20. While not the g10 grips, they look better than the rubber version and may be a decent stop gap until the g10's become available again. I snagged a set to tinker with.

https://www.midwestgunworks.com/page/mgwi/prod/ud5a1691


Thank you that is perfect. I didn’t know that grip existed. Plastic works just fine for me.

Sorry to say I picked up the last one.

[Doc_Glock]

So a couple more observations as I am working the crap out of this thing dry:

For whatever reason the trigger has more grit in it than my old police turn in models which are very smooth. Hopefully it is a wear in thing and not a change to the parts finish. I tried a Wilson trigger bar and it is about the same. But the old models I have are really remarkably smooth, like better than a TJIAB smooth.

My older D models with bulky grips are also easier for me to run. I find it easier to pull and reset the trigger with a more hand filling grip again for whatever reason. Looking forward to receiving the larger plastic grip and also looking forward to grip makers starting to support the Vertec more with better over grips since this is the direction Beretta seems to have chosen for the future.

[oregon45]

So a couple more observations as I am working the crap out of this thing dry:

For whatever reason the trigger has more grit in it than my old police turn in models which are very smooth. Hopefully it is a wear in thing and not a change to the parts finish. I tried a Wilson trigger bar and it is about the same. But the old models I have are really remarkably smooth, like better than a TJIAB smooth.

My older D models with bulky grips are also easier for me to run. I find it easier to pull and reset the trigger with a more hand filling grip again for whatever reason. Looking forward to receiving the larger plastic grip and also looking forward to grip makers starting to support the Vertec more with better over grips since this is the direction Beretta seems to have chosen for the future.

I haven't swapped the trigger in my 92D-X yet, but with a few 92A1's I've had the grittiness in the action was solved by installing a steel trigger.

[Hizzie]

Lok Grips (bogies, veloce and full checker)
Hogue (piranhas)

Both are making aggressive G10 grips for the Vertec.

I have Lok Bogies coming although I wouldn’t have thought twice about the Hogue Piranhas had I realized they were available.

[backtrail540]

https://www.hogueinc.com/beretta-m9a3-vertec-wrap-around-backstrap-smooth-g10-solid-black

I couldn't get to it through normal browsing but a search yielded these wraparound conversion grips from hogue. No pic yet though and I didn't see any texture options.

Edit - nm there seems to be one checkered option if you use the search bar. Maybe hogue is the manufacturer for the oem g10 wrap around?

https://www.hogueinc.com/catalogsearch/result/?q=vertec+wrap+around

[Jared]

So a couple more observations as I am working the crap out of this thing dry:

For whatever reason the trigger has more grit in it than my old police turn in models which are very smooth. Hopefully it is a wear in thing and not a change to the parts finish. I tried a Wilson trigger bar and it is about the same. But the old models I have are really remarkably smooth, like better than a TJIAB smooth.

My older D models with bulky grips are also easier for me to run. I find it easier to pull and reset the trigger with a more hand filling grip again for whatever reason. Looking forward to receiving the larger plastic grip and also looking forward to grip makers starting to support the Vertec more with better over grips since this is the direction Beretta seems to have chosen for the future.

Mine stacks noticeably when lifting the firing pin block. I expect it to smooth out with use, but if not, I imagine some careful polishing would probably do the trick.

[feudist]

What does everyone think about the the threat management aspects of the DAO in general?

Someone posted earlier about not outrunning assessment speed, and DB covered the post shooting issues in his LEM article.

I've read Rex's thoughts on the DAK(which is a system you don't hear much about). I handled a P226 DAO back in the 90s that had an incredible trigger.

I've personally had 2 incidents as a wee rookie carrying an issue Model 10. In both, I distinctly recall being aware of the hammer creeping back, and releasing the trigger.

We issued the 92D for a few years and I instructed one rookie class on them. There were certainly some training advantages, but it was a difficult row to hoe.

After a bunch of sniveling about the guns sights being out of whack, I went down the line at 15 yards shooting each pistol.

I put 5 rounds from each one into the head of the B-27 targets. That ended the discussion.

I'd love to hear some elaboration on these issues.

[revchuck38]

feudist - I've got a PX4 D, and for a while, I was thinking about going to it as my primary carry vs. a G model. DB made a strong argument against it, characterizing the DA as a "thinking" trigger and the SA as a "shooting" trigger. He convinced me to stay with the G model, but the DAO idea remains in the back of my mind. It's not helping things that yesterday I shot an autoloader-centric training course with my 4" M10 and did well.

[Willard]

What does everyone think about the the threat management aspects of the DAO in general?


I'd love to hear some elaboration on these issues.

I bought one for AIWB for obvious reasons. I may be defaulting to early years of training (revolver) as I age, but recently I've been very concerned of negligent discharge with striker fire pistols. I don't know if this is subconscious reaction to all the internet posts about 320 and other striker fire failures or something else. Regardless, this has a trigger comparable to a revolver (needs some breaking in though) and I will feel less concerned about negligent discharge in general or unintended discharge during threat management situation. Obviously, this is a personal hang up and others may think I am well off the mark.

[Doc_Glock]

I haven't swapped the trigger in my 92D-X yet, but with a few 92A1's I've had the grittiness in the action was solved by installing a steel trigger.

Thanks for the suggestion. Today I had time to putter so I methodically replaced part after part from a known smooth 92D to see if I could diagnose this.

Metal trigger: nope
Trigger Bar: nope.

Turned out it was the axle that the hammer spins on. Took it apart cleaned, “lapped” it a bit with oil and just working the axle back and forth in the hammer. Cleaned and oiled again, reassembled and the trigger is super smooth. I went ahead and installed the stock trigger bar so mine is totally factory at this point and it is a really nice albeit heavy trigger.

These 92s are really super fun to tinker with as well. Not difficult to disassemble the frame anyway with a little practice.

[Doc_Glock]

https://www.hogueinc.com/beretta-m9a3-vertec-wrap-around-backstrap-smooth-g10-solid-black

I couldn't get to it through normal browsing but a search yielded these wraparound conversion grips from hogue. No pic yet though and I didn't see any texture options.

Edit - nm there seems to be one checkered option if you use the search bar. Maybe hogue is the manufacturer for the oem g10 wrap around?

https://www.hogueinc.com/catalogsearch/result/?q=vertec+wrap+around


You guys are amazing. I searched all over for some wrap around grip options and found nothing. Ordered some Dark Earth Hogues. Hopefully they will do the trick.

[backtrail540]

Regarding splits, running the trigger at assessment speed etc...I ran some more speed oriented stuff today to compare to previous runs with striker and da/sa runs previous.

One of the things I like about this trigger is that while I'm sometimes a tenth or so slower per split, I seem to not be able to outrun my sights with the long trigger stroke and reset so I generally have more clean runs. For example, on the 5 yard stage of the Advanced Super Test, I generally run in the low to mid 3's from the holster. Today I laid down a 4.02. The difference is that the 4.02 was a 98 that felt effortless whereas normally with something like a m&p i will do mid to high 90's and feel like i'm at my limit. For me, the control is worth it. I'll still shoot other guns for pure performance but I certainly won't be upset about a half second over the course of 10 rounds.

https://i.postimg.cc/yYj19XrW/20201025-102242.jpg (https://postimg.cc/BX8ffD3G)
5 yard string of advanced super test

https://i.postimg.cc/5Nb96kgZ/20201025-102310.jpg (https://postimg.cc/RqpxYdjR)

https://i.postimg.cc/fRbwvt6C/20201025-102314.jpg (https://postimg.cc/JG9Vrn7H)

https://i.postimg.cc/7ZQqtP4k/20201025-102317.jpg (https://postimg.cc/pmzNpHyG)

On something like the pistol shooting solutions tests, I've ran that 6 times this year with a best of 20 flat aggregate and a worst of 24.6. With the 92d my time was 23.32 but with a fair amount of clean runs and therefore a decent concealment bonus.

The bill drill is the best example of high% target splits as fast as I can get them shooting for A's. A clean 2.87 isn't anything spectacular, dark pin level, but representative of where i'm generally at looking at the runs i've done this year. Actually that is my exact corrected average for the 12 bills i've ran with striker and da/sa guns this year. So it seems that slower splits is averaging out with better hits via not outrunning my sights and less anticipation issues.

https://i.postimg.cc/jqzdqrHH/20201025-103732.jpg (https://postimg.cc/Lh8Mvw05)
2.87 bill

https://i.postimg.cc/BbGS5h0P/20201025-103743.jpg (https://postimg.cc/ygvCsyW7)

https://i.postimg.cc/D0d2xqvj/20201025-103745.jpg (https://postimg.cc/ZvntRvyp)

I did have a few issues with short stroking today when pushing hard. It turned .3 splits into .6 splits. Not something I believe to be irrecoverable, though your opinion may vary of course. I like this gun from a defensive stand point. If I don't end up carrying it, I certainly would not mind it as a bedside gun that is a bit more forgivable for handling while sleepy/excited/whatever in the middle of the night.



Side note - the 12 lb spring chewed through 50 rounds of steel cased tula today with no light strikes.

[Doc_Glock]

Regarding splits, running the trigger at assessment speed etc...I ran some more speed oriented stuff today to compare to previous runs with striker and da/sa runs previous.

One of the things I like about this trigger is that while I'm sometimes a tenth or so slower per split, I seem to not be able to outrun my sights with the long trigger stroke and reset so I generally have more clean runs. For example, on the 5 yard stage of the Advanced Super Test, I generally run in the low to mid 3's from the holster. Today I laid down a 4.02. The difference is that the 4.02 was a 98 that felt effortless whereas normally with something like a m&p i will do mid to high 90's and feel like i'm at my limit. For me, the control is worth it. I'll still shoot other guns for pure performance but I certainly won't be upset about a half second over the course of 10 rounds.

https://i.postimg.cc/yYj19XrW/20201025-102242.jpg (https://postimg.cc/BX8ffD3G)
5 yard string of advanced super test

https://i.postimg.cc/5Nb96kgZ/20201025-102310.jpg (https://postimg.cc/RqpxYdjR)

https://i.postimg.cc/fRbwvt6C/20201025-102314.jpg (https://postimg.cc/JG9Vrn7H)

https://i.postimg.cc/7ZQqtP4k/20201025-102317.jpg (https://postimg.cc/pmzNpHyG)



Side note - the 12 lb spring chewed through 50 rounds of steel cased tula today with no light strikes.

First: that is some great shooting. I am mid to high 5s range on the 5 yd stage of the AST from concealment and am no where near those splits or score. With a Glock I am around 4.2-4.5s. Agree with your findings that I never outrun my sights with the D.

Second: maybe I need to try a lighter spring if you are getting those results with a 12. I really hate messing with factory triggers usually.

[feudist]

Side note - the 12 lb spring chewed through 50 rounds of steel cased tula today with no light strikes.[/QUOTE]


What pull weight has that resulted in?

[backtrail540]

Side note - the 12 lb spring chewed through 50 rounds of steel cased tula today with no light strikes.


What pull weight has that resulted in?[/QUOTE]

No trigger gauge available.

[jd950]

What does everyone think about the the threat management aspects of the DAO in general? [snip] I'd love to hear some elaboration on these issues.

I am one of a tiny minority of gun folks who believes strongly in either DAO or TDA for LEO/defensive use, and with the exception of Kahr pistols and the Walther P99 AS, I don't include SFA guns in that category. Perhaps it is because my experience with firearms and law enforcement began when dinosaurs walked the earth, and/or because of what I have done and seen in my work, which includes responding to OIS incidents. To me the practical difference between TDA and various forms of DAO, including DAK and LEM, is the question of reliably decocking as necessary under stress and the small additional training issue of transition from DA to SA trigger.

I am just getting home after a long work night so I am not going to be as verbose as I might otherwise, but I think the "safety" of a long trigger pull is significant when the thing in whose direction you are pointing your gun breathes and bleeds instead of being steel or paper. Most cops "cover" people far more often than they draw and fire, but you will rarely see videos on the internet of cops holding people at gunpoint. It is not exciting to watch such things. Similarly, when out in the real world, the "safety" factor in a longer trigger pull and in some cases, a visible hammer, can be important when holstering, unholstering, grabbing a gun off of the nightstand or dresser, shoving it in a lockbox, etc.

I carry a DAK on duty and off duty it is either a DAK or a Kahr. I don't care much about the two different reset points and varying trigger weights of the DAK, I just view it as a DAO trigger. Before that I carried one or another S&W 3rd gen DAO and before that, revolvers (Geez, I am getting old). If I were new on the job, I wold not be permitted to carry what I do, and I suspect that the day when I have to change is not far off.

If you watch this video from 1:08 to 1:14, Ernest Langdon pretty much nails my feelings on the subject, although he is talking about TDA.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1lZHzyW_A4g

Bedtime now.

[backtrail540]

I received my 92x plastic conversion grips from mgw last night. The texture is very good for plastic grips - reminiscent of a taller rtf2 texture. Initially I didn't think it mimicked the original 92 shape well but when comparing to a brig tac, I couldn't find a noticeable enough difference other than the conversion grips are thinner than the wilson grips but the angle felt similar enough. I'll hopefully get a chance to dry practice this week and should certainly get some live fire this weekend. If these help with the low grip issues I sometimes get with the vertec but nearly never with the normal 92's then I'll keep them on.

The grips are aggressive enough on initial inspection that I don't see a need to get g10, at the moment anyway. If you dislike the vertec then these are not a bad option at a seemingly decent price, when you find them anyway. More impressions later in the week after dry/live practice.

[CraigS]

I am one of a tiny minority of gun folks who believes strongly in either DAO or TDA for LEO/defensive use, and with the exception of Kahr pistols and the Walther P99 AS, I don't include SFA guns in that category....

If you watch this video from 1:08 to 1:14, Ernest Langdon pretty much nails my feelings on the subject, although he is talking about TDA.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1lZHzyW_A4g

Bedtime now.
I agree completely. We got a pistol 20+ yrs ago after one too many rapes in a nearby town and some co-workers recommended a decock only Ruger. For some reason wife and I were never happy w/ our shooting that gun so I kept renting a gun each range trip. I liked the decock only action so usually rented similar guns. One day it was an old B92 and bam, hit what I aimed at. Got the wife to go with me the next weekend and same for her. That range had some police tradein 92f so a couple weeks later I bought one. We have been shooting 92s since. Of course then I started reading everything I could on 92s and saw an article on the Elite IIs. A year after the 92f I traded that Ruger on an EII. A while later Md started some more restrictive gun laws so I told me wife she needed an EII in case they became unavailable. Went to the store, I gave them a deposit because we had to wait 10 days to pick it up. Went to pick it up and my wife says, I hope this won't be a problem but I want my name as the owner and I will pay the balance myself. Now she carries a G19 and I carry and M&P9c and I have actually made the triggers on both heavier (especially the pre-travel) than they came from the factory. We force ourselves once in a while at the range to shoot our carry guns. Usually my wife says, I know I should but is that enough w/ the Glock, I want to shoot my Beretta now.

[WobblyPossum]

I picked mine up from my FFL and am quite pleased. My front sight and dovetail appear to be perfectly level. The trigger pull is a little heavier than I’d like but it’s very smooth. I don’t feel any grittiness or uneveness in the trigger pull aside from the mild stacking that’s present in every Beretta 92 when the firing pin block lifts. I’ve got the Wilson Combat tuning kit coming and look forward to seeing what the trigger pull feels like with the Wilson trigger bar and a 12# hammer spring installed. I was considering getting a steel trigger and steel guide rod as well. I might hold off for a bit on the trigger. I wasn’t expecting the trigger pull to be this smooth with the plastic trigger. I still want to get the steel guide rod just because I don’t fully trust the plastic ones after having one break on me within 200 rounds on an M9A3 I used to own.

I’m still not sold on the Vertec frame and will likely get the G10 wraparound grip once Beretta gets more in stock. The hump on the standard 92 frame seems to help lock my hand in as high as I can grip and allows for my trigger finger to pull straight back. I have a harder time locking in a high grip with the Vertec.

The only other Beretta 92 I own is an LTT Elite. I forgot how sharp the edges of the trigger guard and beaver tail are on a non-LTT frame from the factory. I would have absolutely loved an LTT frame in place of the 92X frame but that would be way too much to ask for what these guns were selling for. If anyone would like to trade an LTT Elite frame for this 92X frame, let me know. You’ll be my best friend.

[feudist]

I picked mine up from my FFL and am quite pleased. My front sight and dovetail appear to be perfectly level. The trigger pull is a little heavier than I’d like but it’s very smooth. I don’t feel any grittiness or uneveness in the trigger pull aside from the mild stacking that’s present in every Beretta 92 when the firing pin block lifts. I’ve got the Wilson Combat tuning kit coming and look forward to seeing what the trigger pull feels like with the Wilson trigger bar and a 12# hammer spring installed. I was considering getting a steel trigger and steel guide rod as well. I might hold off for a bit on the trigger. I wasn’t expecting the trigger pull to be this smooth with the plastic trigger. I still want to get the steel guide rod just because I don’t fully trust the plastic ones after having one break on me within 200 rounds on an M9A3 I used to own.

I’m still not sold on the Vertec frame and will likely get the G10 wraparound grip once Beretta gets more in stock. The hump on the standard 92 frame seems to help lock my hand in as high as I can grip and allows for my trigger finger to pull straight back. I have a harder time locking in a high grip with the Vertec.

The only other Beretta 92 I own is an LTT Elite. I forgot how sharp the edges of the trigger guard and beaver tail are on a non-LTT frame from the factory. I would have absolutely loved an LTT frame in place of the 92X frame but that would be way too much to ask for what these guns were selling for. If anyone would like to trade an LTT Elite frame for this 92X frame, let me know. You’ll be my best friend.

Can you swap uppers? Have a LTT Elite D?

[Rev579]

Can you swap uppers? Have a LTT Elite D?

Yes, you can.

[feudist]

Yes, you can.

https://media1.tenor.com/images/5f58979ca3b1dc1770adb2aa52fc47ed/tenor.gif?itemid=4858779

[WobblyPossum]

Can you swap uppers? Have a LTT Elite D?


Yes, you can.

What you end up with after combining the LTT frame with the 92D slide is a DA/SA Beretta without a decocking lever because the LTT frame still has the sear parts. My LTT has the NP3 Trigger Job in a Bag using the Wilson trigger bar. This did allow me to get something close to what the 92D will feel like after swapping the trigger bar and a couple of springs. Definitely a lighter DA pull than stock.

[Hizzie]

p/CG3cpLmpA_J

[Rev579]

What you end up with after combining the LTT frame with the 92D slide is a DA/SA Beretta without a decocking lever because the LTT frame still has the sear parts. My LTT has the NP3 Trigger Job in a Bag using the Wilson trigger bar. This did allow me to get something close to what the 92D will feel like after swapping the trigger bar and a couple of springs. Definitely a lighter DA pull than stock.

Or...you can remove the sear parts, use the LTT NP3 TJIAB and go DAO, with or without the spurless hammer. But, if you have the NP3 goodies, you'll likely have an NP3'd hammer-which I would keep. But to get the real advantage of the DAO setup, get rid of the sear.

[revchuck38]

I'm not sure if this has been mentioned...folks have been talking about G10 and plastic conversion grips being unavailable. Beretta has rubber conversion grips in both black and FDE in stock according to their website. Some folks don't like them, but they could be used as a placeholder until the other materials become available again.

[WobblyPossum]

Or...you can remove the sear parts, use the LTT NP3 TJIAB and go DAO, with or without the spurless hammer. But, if you have the NP3 goodies, you'll likely have an NP3'd hammer-which I would keep. But to get the real advantage of the DAO setup, get rid of the sear.

I like my LTT Elite too much in its DA/SA form to convert it into a DAO, as tempting as it would be to have a 92D with the best frame Beretta has ever produced. Maybe one day I’ll find someone who would prefer a 92X frame to the one that came with their LTT Elite.

[Rev579]

I like my LTT Elite too much in its DA/SA form to convert it into a DAO, as tempting as it would be to have a 92D with the best frame Beretta has ever produced. Maybe one day I’ll find someone who would prefer a 92X frame to the one that came with their LTT Elite.

Legit reasoning. I practice my DAO Trigger control with a Ciener .22 Conversion Kit, but my best triggers are DA/SA(2 were early jobs done by LTT & 1 by D. Ohlasso)

[backtrail540]

I like my LTT Elite too much in its DA/SA form to convert it into a DAO, as tempting as it would be to have a 92D with the best frame Beretta has ever produced. Maybe one day I’ll find someone who would prefer a 92X frame to the one that came with their LTT Elite.

Pre covid/ panic/ riot/ armageddon there were ltt frames on gunbroker for just under $500. Probably worth watching on occasion if that's what you want.

[Doc_Glock]

I received and installed the Beretta plastic overwrap grips from Midwest Gun Works today and I have to say they really transformed my experience shooting this pistol. They are pretty aggressive and uncomfortable for carry, but the profile is just what I needed to grip this gun.
6236262361

I think the over grip adjusts the grip angle just a bit to the Glock side which I also like.

I put 383 rounds through today without any fatigue or real hot spots. the upper edge of the grip is a little sharp on the web and I sanded it down just a bit.

I had zero FTLBEs, and zero double clutch issues with the larger grip. It pretty much solved my annoyances with the gun from my first outing.

Adjusting the sights to the center of the dovetails front and back has made the gun shoot now. For me it hits top of front sight at 25 and drive the dot from 15 in with 115 grain ammo.

Started with Dot Torture at 7 yds and did a very decent 48.

62355


500 aggregate at 25 yards: Freestyle: 93, 5 in 20s: 91, 5 in 10s:61-2, SHO: 64-2, WHO: 69-3, Total: Pretty dismal 378-7 Lots of misses after a decent start.

62360

Advanced Supertest:
First time I broke out the stages:
15 yard: 10.9s, 0.80s splits, 86
10 yard: 7.35s, 0.52s splits, 97 This is essentially "The Test"

62359

5 yard: 4.77s, 0.30s splits, 98

62358

Second run: 258 in 8.5s, 7.5s, 4.86s
Slowed it down for Third run: 286 in 13.1s, 9.45s, 5.38s

62357

Worked Garcia Dots at 7 yards and noticed that I immediately went to and preferred a target focus for this exercise. Not that it helped. Times from 7.5-5.5s after warm up. I think I could possibly clean this if the dots were 4" instead of 2"

Worked doubles to see how fast I could get myself working this trigger: Never really got faster than 0.30s. But I also notice that at that pace I am not having to muscle the gun all over, it just settles back in to place and I fire again and it all seems to happen at about the speed I can work the trigger. It's a kind of low stress kind of feeling and I like it.

Slowed down for some marksmanship worked singles, doubles, triples and quads on Finding Your Level. Untimed, just tried to try to make all the hits without stressing too much about the clock.

62356

So for me this grip is a total win. I hope the Hogue overgrip has the same or even bigger circumference. Loving this gun now.

I checked the trigger weight after 500 rounds and at least 1000 dry pulls and it is still around 9.5lbs. My Langdon M9 came with a D spring and measures 7.5 after break in. I don't think this DXR is coming from the factory with a D spring. I had a bag with some PX4 D springs in it. They measured the same length as the spring that came out of the gun so I tried one and the trigger came down to 8lbs and feels identical to my old Police trade in D models and the M9.

[oregon45]

How do the Lok grips compare in terms of thickness to the VZ 92 grips?

[backtrail540]

But I also notice that at that pace I am not having to muscle the gun all over, it just settles back in to place and I fire again and it all seems to happen at about the speed I can work the trigger. It's a kind of low stress kind of feeling and I like it.



My sentiments exactly!

[CraigS]

Doc you have to try a 12 or 13# spring. I am not sure how the bobbed hammer compares to a skeleton hammer but I have never had a failure to fire w/ a 12 and skeleton.

[Doc_Glock]

Doc you have to try a 12 or 13# spring. I am not sure how the bobbed hammer compares to a skeleton hammer but I have never had a failure to fire w/ a 12 and skeleton.

I used a 13# in a Centurion Tactical and had some failures to light euro ammo. Went to D spring and have never had an issue since. Supposedly it will work better with the solid firing pin but who knows.
e_stern do you know which hammer spring the 92DXR ships with?

[e_stern]

I used a 13# in a Centurion Tactical and had some failures to light euro ammo. Went to D spring and have never had an issue since. Supposedly it will work better with the solid firing pin but who knows.
e_stern do you know which hammer spring the 92DXR ships with?

They are receiving the standard 92D spring.

[Doc_Glock]

I just want to drop this summary here in case anyone cares:

Beretta 92 Hammer Springs:

Factory stock: 20#
D Spring: 16# Stock in LTT Elite, Langdon M9 and D models
14#: should be pretty reliable
13# Reliable except occasional hard NATO primers ~7.5#DA
12# competition only ~6.5#DA
11# Federal Primers only 5.5#DA

PX4 D spring is not the same as a 92 D spring and is about equivalent to a 12# 92 spring.


Reference:


https://youtu.be/nUoIC4w2rcI

[Doc_Glock]

More updates:

I received the Hogue Wrap around grips today super fast from Hogue direct.

The Good: They fit amazingly well, and really fill the hand. The measure about the same size as the Beretta plastic grip.

The Bad: I didn't read the fine print and ordered the smooth version of this grip. And, let me tell you it is smooth. Not enough texture to grip. I called Hogue and they were super helpful, directing me to the checkered version, and offering to swap mine out provided I ship them back and pay the difference. Done.

For reference, this is the smooth: https://www.hogueinc.com/grips/beretta-grips/92-m9a3-vertec/beretta-m9a3-vertec-wrap-around-backstrap-smooth-g10-g-mascus-dark-earth

This is the textured: https://www.hogueinc.com/grips/beretta-grips/92-m9a3-vertec/beretta-m9a3-vertec-wrap-around-backstrap-checkered-g10-g-mascus-dark-earth

They also both come in boring black. Order with confidence that they will transform the Vertec into a standard Beretta grip.

No photos sorry, they don't even have them on their website.

I also installed various hammer springs and measured the pull on my digital gauge:

Factory D spring: 9#DA
13#: 8lb DA
PX4D: 7.25lb DA

Of note, the D hammer spring in my old police trade in 92D and Langdon M9 settled in to 7.75# on each. The PX4 D spring settled in to 7.5# on the Cent Tac. No idea why pulls are so much higher on this particular DXR.

[Doc_Glock]

I also installed various hammer springs and measured the pull on my digital gauge:

Factory D spring: 9#DA
13#: 8lb DA
PX4D: 7.25lb DA

Of note, the D hammer spring in my old police trade in 92D and Langdon M9 settled in to 7.75# on each. The PX4 D spring settled in to 7.5# on the Cent Tac. No idea why pulls are so much higher on this particular DXR.

Late Edit: the PX4 D spring settled in to 6.5# pull on the Cent Tac.

[Bigghoss]

Beretta 92 Hammer Springs:

Factory stock: 20#
D Spring: 16# Stock in LTT Elite, Langdon M9 and D models
14#: should be pretty reliable
13# Reliable except occasional hard NATO primers ~7.5#DA
12# competition only ~6.5#DA
11# Federal Primers only 5.5#DA


FWIW for anyone looking for data points, I ran about 500 rounds through a 92A1 with a 12# spring and never had a light strike. Hammer spring was the only thing not stock on that gun. Mostly, if not all, Winchester Forged ammo.

[Doc_Glock]

FWIW for anyone looking for data points, I ran about 500 rounds through a 92A1 with a 12# spring and never had a light strike. Hammer spring was the only thing not stock on that gun. Mostly, if not all, Winchester Forged ammo.

I just realized I ran 1600 rounds through a Cent Tac with PX4 D spring (equivalent to a 12# Beretta 92 spring) without issues and a lot was euro ammo. I thought it was a 92 D spring when I installed it, but the trigger is simply to light for that to be true.

[Viperm]

I received mine last week and shot it this weekend. The rear sight walked off the slide during the second magazine. Sight was super loose in the dovetail.

[Hizzie]

They did require minor fitting around the trigger bar.

p/CG-Qqq3JWm9

[oregon45]

They did require minor fitting around the trigger bar.

p/CG-Qqq3JWm9

Very cool, how do they compare to VZ’s thin Beretta grips in terms of thickness?

[Hizzie]

Very cool, how do they compare to VZ’s thin Beretta grips in terms of thickness?

The Lok Grips are the same thickness as the factory grips. I’m not sure what that is compared to VZ’s. These are less expensive than the VZ’s and have far more color/texture options.

[oregon45]

Thanks Hizzie, I showed my wife the Lok grips website and now we've got a pair of purple Bogie grips on the way :D

[Hizzie]

Thanks Hizzie, I showed my wife the Lok grips website and now we've got a pair of purple Bogie grips on the way :D

I almost went purple. They also do Veloce and Full Checker on request for the Vertec style.

[Willard]

I bought one for AIWB for obvious reasons. I may be defaulting to early years of training (revolver) as I age, but recently I've been very concerned of negligent discharge with striker fire pistols. I don't know if this is subconscious reaction to all the internet posts about 320 and other striker fire failures or something else. Regardless, this has a trigger comparable to a revolver (needs some breaking in though) and I will feel less concerned about negligent discharge in general or unintended discharge during threat management situation. Obviously, this is a personal hang up and others may think I am well off the mark.

ETA: I bought a Keeper's Concealment Keeper to go with it. I have some good AIWBs and IWBs, but there is something about the way this one fits from the factory without adjustment that I really like. Little print and very comfortable. Spendy compared to some other options but I believe it is going to be money well spent barring any issues down the road.

[Doc_Glock]

I received mine last week and shot it this weekend. The rear sight walked off the slide during the second magazine. Sight was super loose in the dovetail.


Yikes. The sight issues with these pistols are concerning.

[Doc_Glock]

They did require minor fitting around the trigger bar.

p/CG-Qqq3JWm9


Those look amazing.

[Doc_Glock]

Received my second 92 DXR from Cove Creek outfitters today.

Sights are centered this time. No cant. The front is weakly staked but at least this time the staking touches the frame.

Trigger 8lb 2oz right out of the box and very smooth. No idea why my first example is 9.5# but I suspect I got the wrong hammer spring.

All in all these are great guns but the little inconsistencies we see reported lead me to believe QC is not that great at Gallatin.

[backtrail540]

Wore mine for 12 hours helping tear off and reshingle a roof. The only hotspot was the rear sight and where the light was packing into my thigh. I was using a phlster floodlight so no sight protection because of rds cut and it had a tlr1 attached.

Since i can't get this cut for the rdo I'll get something dedicated and with sight protection. But i have to say the slick beretta's carry well

[WobblyPossum]

I put 70 rounds through mine today. By the end, the trigger felt a little lighter than when I started. I found that when I throw a shot with this gun, it almost always goes high. I had very few low-left misses and a few good on elevation but a little left. I attempted the DOTW 10 Round Assault three times and ended up throwing five rounds into the face of the IDPA target the B8 was mounted on, most likely during the 25y portion but possibly also in the 15y. Here are two 25y B8 attempts showing the trend of sending misses high:
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I found that the left edge of the beaver tail digs into the base of my strong hand thumb while shooting slowly for accuracy. I don’t tend to feel it at all when shooting quickly or more dynamically. I shot the LTT alongside the 92D and was reminded how much I like the radiused beaver tail but I only noticed the difference during slow fire. I shot a 25y B8 all DA using the LTT and did much better than with the 92D. I believe it was the combination of the thinner FO front sight and the lighter DA pull from the TJIAB. Overall I enjoyed shooting the 92D. I’m looking forward to installing the Wilson trigger bar kit. My LTT has a 13# hammer spring and had no problems cracking the primers on 50 rounds of S&B ammo. That leaves me hopeful that the 92D will function with a 12# spring.

[Doc_Glock]

92D Another 300+ rounds:

At the 25 line, 500 aggregate:
Freestyle:93-2x,

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5 in 20:70-1,
5 in 10: 88,
SHO: 81,
WHO: 84

Total: 416-1 Good start but sub 90s for the timed and single handed portions does not a good score make. It hits right to sights when I do my job.

Advanced Supertest: 275, 275, 283. I am finishing the 5 yard portion from concealment in 4.7-4.8s now consistently and very consistent 0.3s splits.

Spent time SHO and WHO at 10 and 15 yards.

Put up a bigger IDPA target and did failure drills. So satisfying to go bang, bang, bang all about even splits, two body, one head. It is not the typical bang bang......bang I see with other guns. I like the 0.3s rhythm for some reason.

I had a few interesting malfunctions: One fail to Extract with 147 Blazer Brass. Looks like it got hung up on the round below it.

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Twice in one magazine the trigger would not reset. Dead trigger. I got it to reset one time by chamber checking about halfway and the second it sort of reset itself after a second. I suspect something was holding the trigger bar down (grip?). It resolved itself and went hundreds of rounds no issue right afterwords. When I got home I took off grip and inspected the trigger bar and found nothing to note.

Also at home, it seems the front sight has drifted a little to the left. Hmm. Gonna leave and watch for now but if my groups head left will put it straight and figure out a way to stake it.

I took some sandpaper to the Beretta Plastic over grip to soften up the ridges a bit and my fleshy tummy it happier for it. Didn't notice any difficulty with grip during the session.

[Doc_Glock]

Another 200 rounds all steel Wolf Polyformance.

Good news: I saw 0.27, 0.28, 0.29 splits for the first time on the 5 yard supertest. Also saw 0.22 one time doing doubles. Most were 0.26 plus.

Bad news: one primer didn’t light but did in second strike. Decent 0.5% success with the 13# spring.

Had the trigger return/reset issue again. Four times. This time I slowed down and looked at what was happening. Essentially under slower fire I was not resetting aggressively and the trigger bar seems to be dragging on something enough that the spring doesn’t get it fully forward. Pulling the finger off quickly or pushing behind the trigger resets.


https://youtu.be/K6Iv4tgsS4E

It could be a weak TRS. I pulled it apart and TRS is in proper position. I think it is the trigger bar hanging up on grip:

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I relieved that area with a pocket knife and we will see if it helps. The problem got worse as the gun got dirtier.

[Rev579]

Another 200 rounds all steel Wolf Polyformance.

Good news: I saw 0.27, 0.28, 0.29 splits for the first time on the 5 yard supertest. Also saw 0.22 one time doing doubles. Most were 0.26 plus.

Bad news: one primer didn’t light but did in second strike. Decent 0.5% success with the 13# spring.

Had the trigger return/reset issue again. Four times. This time I slowed down and looked at what was happening. Essentially under slower fire I was not resetting aggressively and the trigger bar seems to be dragging on something enough that the spring doesn’t get it fully forward. Pulling the finger off quickly or pushing behind the trigger resets.

It could be a weak TRS. I pulled it apart and TRS is in proper position. I think it is the trigger bar hanging up on grip:

I relieved that area with a pocket knife and we will see if it helps. The problem got worse as the gun got dirtier.

The trigger bar catching on the hammer seems to be a recurring issue on recent 92's. It's a tolerance thing. I also have noticed that it happens when the slide is OFF the frame. Without bringing the hammer back just a fraction, you might find the hammer and trigger bar will fail to engage. It will engage when you push the trigger bar up just a bit. It was not an issue with the TB Spring-it's new. It also happens when the grip is off.

I find it completely frustrating. Beretta listened to folks screaming about tighter tolerances...and here we seem to be. These were meant to function when the gun got dirtier.

[WobblyPossum]

The trigger bar catching on the hammer seems to be a recurring issue on recent 92's. It's a tolerance thing. I also have noticed that it happens when the slide is OFF the frame. Without bringing the hammer back just a fraction, you might find the hammer and trigger bar will fail to engage. It will engage when you push the trigger bar up just a bit. It was not an issue with the TB Spring-it's new. It also happens when the grip is off.

I find it completely frustrating. Beretta listened to folks screaming about tighter tolerances...and here we seem to be. These were meant to function when the gun got dirtier.

Interesting. My example also displays this. With the slide off the frame, pulling the trigger does not engage the hammer. Is this likely to affect the reliability of the pistol during operation?

[Jared]

Interesting. My example also displays this. With the slide off the frame, pulling the trigger does not engage the hammer. Is this likely to affect the reliability of the pistol during operation?

I’ve got a few Italian models and Maryland models that won’t engage the hammer with the slide off for some reason or another. I’ve notice the trigger bar doesn’t pop all the way up and if I push it up then the hammer gets engaged. They’ve run perfectly for years, so I think that particular thing may just be a peculiarity of the design rather than a QC issue.

[Rev579]

Interesting. My example also displays this. With the slide off the frame, pulling the trigger does not engage the hammer. Is this likely to affect the reliability of the pistol during operation?

When the slide is off the frame, the hammer comes to rest a bit more forward than on any other 92 frame I have looked at. For the record, I compared a few(5 total) different 92X runs(SPEC0666A, SPEC0668A, & 92X) to a recent 92FS Compact from IT, 1999 Centurion, EII(x3), Elite, 92G, and Type M(x2). Each of the 92X frames had this issue. It didn't matter what hammer I used. The trigger bar was not the issue either. This means it is a frame tolerance issue.


I’ve got a few Italian models and Maryland models that won’t engage the hammer with the slide off for some reason or another. I’ve notice the trigger bar doesn’t pop all the way up and if I push it up then the hammer gets engaged. They’ve run perfectly for years, so I think that particular thing may just be a peculiarity of the design rather than a QC issue.
It can also happen when the slide is on the frame. I agree, it is a peculiarity of the frame, but it isn't a good one.

This is so foolish. Let's shave off a nano-second off our return time and pray the trigger engages.

[Hizzie]

Eh. Things are so uncertain right now I just ordered another.

[Doc_Glock]

I finally received my exchanged Hogue grip. It’s amazing.

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But it is not amazing enough that if you are happy with the plastic that it is worth $40 more.

They are very similar feeling. The plastic over grip is slightly more svelte, kind of like Langdon thin grips.

The Hogue feels more like a medium Wilson thickness and I really like it. They are 2mm wider and have a more 2X4 profile. Works out to 5mm more circumference for the gripping fingers with the trigger reach staying the same.

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