Hilton Yam Talks P320

[Tokarev]

A few weeks old now but I didn't see anyone mentioning it:


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vXtIo4qPphs

[GJM]

Can you provide a synopsis.

[Tokarev]

Can you provide a synopsis.

He likes the Gray Guns trigger

He likes the modularity

He likes the Wilson grip module

He doesn't like the DeltaPoint (https://www.amazon.com/Leupold-DeltaPoint-Pro-Reflex-Sight/dp/B00NWIYAD0/ref=sr_1_1?crid=D4L6PSFSVRNG&dchild=1&keywords=leupold+deltapoint+pro&qid=1597930764&sprefix=eltapoint+p%2Caps%2C148&sr=8-1)

He likes the gun overall

[Tokarev]

An option for Yam and others who might not want to run the DPP (https://www.amazon.com/Leupold-DeltaPoint-Pro-Reflex-Sight/dp/B00NWIYAD0/ref=sr_1_1?crid=D4L6PSFSVRNG&dchild=1&keywords=leupold+deltapoint+pro&qid=1597930764&sprefix=eltapoint+p%2Caps%2C148&sr=8-1):

http://www.bobroengineering.com/SIG-320-M17-RMR-MOUNT-WINTEGRATED-REAR-SIGHT_p_51.html

[Archer1440]

Well, if they come up with a version of that suitable for the original Romeo-1 slides, they will probably sell a boatload.

[HeavyDuty]

An option for Yam and others who might not want to run the DPP (https://www.amazon.com/Leupold-DeltaPoint-Pro-Reflex-Sight/dp/B00NWIYAD0/ref=sr_1_1?crid=D4L6PSFSVRNG&dchild=1&keywords=leupold+deltapoint+pro&qid=1597930764&sprefix=eltapoint+p%2Caps%2C148&sr=8-1):

http://www.bobroengineering.com/SIG-320-M17-RMR-MOUNT-WINTEGRATED-REAR-SIGHT_p_51.html

Thanks for that - I’d really like to try a P320, and it would probably be RDS equipped.

[cheby]

I was told by some employee of the major gun manufacturer that pretty much everything that you read in a major gun publication is paid for. Similarly it's impossible to imagine that any big names would provide a negative opinion about the major gun company. I am not necessarily saying that Hilton Yam video is a promotion of some sort but I'd love to see a discussion about the safety issue of this gun.

[Tokarev]

I was told by some employee of the major gun manufacturer that pretty much everything that you read in a major gun publication is paid for. Similarly it's impossible to imagine that any big names would provide a negative opinion about the major gun company. I am not necessarily saying that Hilton Yam video is a promotion of some sort but I'd love to see a discussion about the safety issue of this gun.

You're assuming Yam is glossing over a perceived safety issue because he's an industry shill? Maybe that's not your intention and I apologize if I'm wrong. Also Yam may not even know about the lawsuit(s) etc depending on how well he follows this stuff. It isn't like SIG is posting legal updates on the company website or social media page.

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[HCM]

I was told by some employee of the major gun manufacturer that pretty much everything that you read in a major gun publication is paid for. Similarly it's impossible to imagine that any big names would provide a negative opinion about the major gun company. I am not necessarily saying that Hilton Yam video is a promotion of some sort but I'd love to see a discussion about the safety issue of this gun.

Gun companies paid to run ads in print publications. Did you see any SIG commercials in the video? Nor is he sponsored by SIG.

Gun companies sometimes provide loaner guns and / or ammo for gun reviews but ethical reviewers usually disclose this. Garand Thumb being an example of this.

We have multiple threads here about safety issues with the P320.

Given the multiple lawsuits against SIG why would a YouTuber want to get dragged into them ?

[shane45]

I believe he said in his video, IIRC, that he really didnt plan on getting involved with the 320. But clearly its become populer and adopted so he is. Makes sense to me as it would be smart business for his aftermarket pursuits. Of which i comented in his thread to make a 1911-esk usable thumb safety for the m17/18.

[HCM]

I believe he said in his video, IIRC, that he really didnt plan on getting involved with the 320. But clearly its become populer and adopted so he is. Makes sense to me as it would be smart business for his aftermarket pursuits. Of which i comented in his thread to make a 1911-esk usable thumb safety for the m17/18.

I take that to mean he has institutional (LE/GOV) training clients who are issued M17/18 or P320 variants.

[HCM]

I was told by some employee of the major gun manufacturer that pretty much everything that you read in a major gun publication is paid for. Similarly it's impossible to imagine that any big names would provide a negative opinion about the major gun company. I am not necessarily saying that Hilton Yam video is a promotion of some sort but I'd love to see a discussion about the safety issue of this gun.

P320 safety discussion- https://pistol-forum.com/showthread.php?43653-New-2-July-2020-SIG-P320-Lawsuit-and-P320-Concerns/page15

[HeavyDuty]

I believe he said in his video, IIRC, that he really didnt plan on getting involved with the 320. But clearly its become populer and adopted so he is. Makes sense to me as it would be smart business for his aftermarket pursuits. Of which i comented in his thread to make a 1911-esk usable thumb safety for the m17/18.
You must be like the only other person on the continent that prefers a thumb safety for reholstering reasons. For me it goes back to early training when I was beaten about the head and shoulders if I didn’t properly thumb the hammer down on reholstering my revolver. Glocks with SCDs get a pass.

If I ever try a P320 (pretty likely,) it will be a MS version.

[Tokarev]

You must be like the only other person on the continent that prefers a thumb safety for reholstering reasons. For me it goes back to early training when I was beaten about the head and shoulders if I didn’t properly thumb the hammer down on reholstering my revolver. Glocks with SCDs get a pass.

If I ever try a P320 (pretty likely,) it will be a MS version.

I like a thumb safety on an auto. Pistols without thumb safeties kind of make me nervous. But I started shooting 1911's as a kid.

[1911Nut]

I like a thumb safety on an auto. Pistols without thumb safeties kind of make me nervous. But I started shooting 1911's as a kid.

You're not the only other person on the continent that prefers thumb safeties.

And while I am on this subject . . . . I don't think there is a simpler mechanical device than a safety on a 1911 or a CZ 75.

But that simple mechanical device seems to overwhelm the capacity of many, many shooters. I was initially trained on a 1911 at Gunsite by Jeff Cooper and Clint Smith in 1981. By noon in TD1, I was comfortable with the correct usage of a thumb safety, and don't recall any of the other students encountering major obstacles with theirs, either.

But over the years of other pistol training and lots and lots of pistol competition, I still see many, many shooters (many of them highly skilled and proficient at shooting) that haven't a clue on how to properly operate a thumb safety, and a large majority of them still seem to think that it requires two hands to operate.

I am a very average shooter and seldom, if ever offer tips or pointers to other shooters, sometimes even when I am asked. But I have reached out to several shooters over the years offering some advice and pointers on the correct usage of the thumb safety on their pistols, and in almost every instance, they look at me like I am from another planet.

Then they return to their bumbling, clusterfuck, two-handed usage of the device.

It just amazes me. It ain't rocket science or quantum physics, folks.

NOTE: I have also seen pistols other than 1911's and CZ 75's that have thumb safeties that aren't so user-friendly. But that doesn't mean that a properly designed one cannot be easily managed.

[GJM]

I watch through about 11 minutes, where Hilton explains the DeltaPoint pro and what is a dealbreaker with it. His comment is that you can’t change direction and intensity without going to the full end of the range. Apparently he has never read the instruction manual which explains how if you hold the button down for a few seconds it changes direction. Other than that, it seemed like a reasonable video through that point.

[Tokarev]

I watch through about 11 minutes, where Hilton explains the DeltaPoint pro and what is a dealbreaker with it. His comment is that you can’t change direction and intensity without going to the full end of the range. Apparently he has never read the instruction manual which explains how if you hold the button down for a few seconds it changes direction. Other than that, it seemed like a reasonable video through that point.He's not alone in that regard.

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[GJM]

He's not alone in that regard.

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If you press and hold the button for two seconds, it changes direction.

59088

[Greg]

I think he wants to sell parts to 320 buyers. Nothing wrong with that.

10-8 went big into M&Ps. Before the COVID panic I saw M&P 2.0s on sale for 299 - which leads me to believe they aren't selling all that well (pre-COVID asswipe and gun panic hysteria)

[call_me_ski]

If you press and hold the button for two seconds, it changes direction.

59088

I hate having to learn Morse code to manipulate electronics. Especially since every manufacturer uses a different system.

[GJM]

I think he wants to sell parts to 320 buyers. Nothing wrong with that.

10-8 went big into M&Ps. Before the COVID panic I saw M&P 2.0s on sale for 299 - which leads me to believe they aren't selling all that well (pre-COVID asswipe and gun panic hysteria)

Yes, but that was apparently before they hired Duke to be an influencer, and now the things are selling for over retail.

[JonInWA]

If you press and hold the button for two seconds, it changes direction.

59088

I really like that low battery indicator feature. On my Romeo1, I just ran my initial OEM (Renata) battery to exhaustion in 10 months of use, mostly at the low intermediate dot brightness setting (i.e., the first "brighter" setting above the low-light dim settings). The replacement 1632 is an Energizer lithium, which I'll also run to exhaustion to establish a "best practices" replcement interval limit. I suspect that I'll simply establish a set replacement interval of every 6-8 months.

That low life indicator is nice though-especially since it signifies that you still have an hour or so of viable life left.

Best, Jon

[GJM]

I hate having to learn Morse code to manipulate electronics. Especially since every manufacturer uses a different system.

Frankly, I am not a fan of one multi function button, that turns the unit on and off, changes intensity, and changes direction of intensity based on different amounts of time you push the button. However, it doesn’t infringe on Trijicon’s patent, and it keeps the optic intensity from accidentally being adjusted. As a practical matter, I stay on max intensity most times outside, and only adjust down in reduced light. That means, since you are on max intensity, the button is configured to reduce intensity without changing direction. I have observed people become confused at matches, when the dot is at lower intensity and they think it is off, and/or the button is non responsive when it is cycling ever dimmer. Also, your thumb on the button makes it harder to see through the lens to check what is happening.

[Eyesquared]

The DPP button does suck but honestly who cares? In my opinion anyone who considers it a dealbreaker is probably missing the forest for the trees. Window size, long-term durability, optical distortion (or lack thereof), low sun angle performance, ability to change batteries without losing zero, etc. are all far more important to me in a pistol RDS.

[GJM]

The DPP button does suck but honestly who cares? In my opinion anyone who considers it a dealbreaker is probably missing the forest for the trees. Window size, long-term durability, optical distortion (or lack thereof), low sun angle performance, ability to change batteries without losing zero, etc. are all far more important to me in a pistol RDS.

I would add one thing, which is an issue with the DP Pro, and that is how it plays with BUIS, which have to be TALL.

[Tokarev]

If you press and hold the button for two seconds, it changes direction.


Yes. Or turns the dot off if you hold it just a bit too long.

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