M&P Core

[GJM]

How many inch-lbs was the torque? Two different break types it looks like in the picture. Sorry to see that, a good machine shop will have you back up in no time!

It has been a while since I installed this, and I can’t remember exact torque values.



Is your OEM plate plastic? If so, what does it (specifically the bosses) look like?

It is plastic, and the front bosses look a bit buggered. Not sure if that was ongoing or happened as the optic was getting ready to depart.

Just this past week I was ready to proclaim the CORE OEM system brilliant as it doesn’t have a mid plate separately screwed down, eliminating one failure point.

[BobM]

YVK asked me the same thing, and my best guess is 5-10K, but I can’t be certain as I have four of them. This is my main match pistol. I frequently check the screws for tightness, and did before and after the match last weekend. Guess I get to see how Smith handles this — not sure if they will drill out the sheared screws, provide a new slide, or tell me to go pound sand.

Now I wonder how well my CORE in .40 will hold up.

[GJM]

Now I wonder how well my CORE in .40 will hold up.

What plate are you using — OEM or C&H?

[SoCalDep]

It has been a while since I installed this, and I can’t remember exact torque values.




It is plastic, and the front bosses look a bit buggered. Not sure if that was ongoing or happened as the optic was getting ready to depart.

Just this past week I was ready to proclaim the CORE OEM system brilliant as it doesn’t have a mid plate separately screwed down, eliminating one failure point.

I’m with you about not having optic to plate and plate to slide screws. I’ve seen more issues with the Glock MOS but the CORE is not immune.

So here’s my plastic plate story. We tested the SRO on a CORE. The test is 10,000 rounds of 124gr FMJ Speer Clean Fire Ammo. Every 2,000 rounds the optic gets racked 20 times by hand and 5 times of rigid wood objects (barricades, benches, tables, etc) and then submerged for 30 seconds.

It was our first official pistol optic test so we got after it. Most shooting sessions involved multiple people loading and shooting and a thousand rounds being shot in 20 minutes happened a few times. Our last shooting session to hit 10k was a bit much. We shot just under 2,000 rounds in about thirty minutes. Happy we were finished as shot the final accuracy test and noticed a distinct shift in zero. Closer examination revealed the torque seal was broken on one screw. Turned out both had come loose. The obvious one started to turn but then broke even with the slide similar to your pics. The second, which was a little loose, came out fine.

The plastic plate showed a significant deformation on the side that was obviously loose. I’m not positive but I surmise that as the screws either come loose and allow movement - or more disturbingly as the plastic plate allows movement and the screws come loose, the plastic plate, being less rigid than metal deforms and allows increased movement and ultimate shearing.

Let’s say I’m not a fan of plastic plates and that’s why I asked. The big question is what comes first - the chicken or the egg. Does a loose screw allow deformation of the plastic plate or does some aspect of the plastic plate (elasticity, less friction, etc) allow movement that either causes shearing of tight screws or causes screws to come loose and shear?

My personal CORE pistols have the old metal plates but at this point if I bought a new one I’d avoid the OEM plastic and get a C&H plate or something. I wrote our issue off to the fact we shot a ridiculous number of rounds in a short time, but especially after seeing this I’d be hesitant to use the plastic when other options are available.

[BobM]

What plate are you using — OEM or C&H?

I’ll have an Aimpoint plate with an ACRO. We’ll also have one with an RMR with the S&W plate.

[SoCalDep]

I’ll have an Aimpoint plate with an ACRO. We’ll also have one with an RMR with the S&W plate.

With the RMR you’re probably good with the OEM plate if it’s metal. If not... CHPWS.

For the ACRO... mine was on a Glock with a Tango Down plate (I recommend) and now on a Unity Tactical G17 slide. A buddy of mine who is one hell of a shooter has used the Aimpoint ACRO plates on a CORE and had issues with two or three plates. They may have fixed it by now but I’d check for looseness on a regular basis. I’d like C&H to offer something.

[GJM]

My OEM RMR plate is plastic. My other RMR/SRO/Holosun plates are C&H, and that is what I will be using in the future. I would also like a bunch of extra screws, so I can put them on a PM schedule. I have an Acro plate inbound, and will watch it carefully. I assume what comes loose is the screws holding the plate down and not the Acro part. Can’t wait for C&H to have Acro and 509T CORE plates.

[SoCalDep]

My OEM RMR plate is plastic. My other RMR/SRO/Holosun plates are C&H, and that is what I will be using in the future. I would also like a bunch of extra screws, so I can put them on a PM schedule. I have an Acro plate inbound, and will watch it carefully. I assume what comes loose is the screws holding the plate down and not the Acro part. Can’t wait for C&H to have Acro and 509T CORE plates.

PM inbound re: screws.

[ranger]

Am revisiting the idea again:
https://www.primaryarms.com/smith-and-wesson-mp9-ported-slide-assembly-5in

I previously abandoned the idea when the kits were $340 and new M&Ps were $410 and milling was $160, but now the CORE guns are $700 and this kit could drop onto the M&P40 that already has a Apex trigger. Does anybody have any experience with them? I guess it would be a 1.0 9mm, I cannot really speak to any prior experience with 1.0 9mm (in?)accuracy because before I shot mine much it got an Apex barrel. I know if I actually do the math the $700 gun is a great deal, but I already have the M&P40 sitting here, and a buttload of magazines and several thousand rounds of ammo that I could save for a rainy day.

Just running this up the flagpole to see if anybody else has any knowledge, cause like Emil Faber said, Knowledge Is Good.

I have great results with my Gen 1 CORE "optics ready" upper on my old M&P Gen 1 5 inch 40. I have been shooting M&Ps for a long time. Found a deal on a M&P Gen 1 5 inch 40 S&W. Immediately swapped factory 40 barrel for a Storm Lake 40-9. Have never shot a round through the 40 barrel. Shot many rounds through the 40-9 converted M&P 5 inch for years. Got the RDS bug so I bought one of the factory M&P Gen 1 40 S&W conversion complete top ends - bought the 40 top end as I planned on using the Storm Lake 40-9 barrel. Got a SRO and installed it using the S&W supplied metal plates for RMR. It is now my primary range pistol (carry M&P Gen 2 Compact 9mm). Shot many rounds no issues. Posting some pictures plus a target rested on sandbag at 25 yards with my 9mm reloads on 115FMJ (pulls) over 5.1 WSF mixed brass on Dillon 550.

6381963820

[GJM]

2.0 plates are no longer metal.

[OldRunner/CSAT Neighbor]

2.0 plates are no longer metal.

So the OEM gen. 1 CORE plates were metal & the gen. 2 are now plastic?

Until the C&H plates are available can folks use the gen. 1 plates in a gen. 2?

[GJM]

So the OEM gen. 1 CORE plates were metal & the gen. 2 are now plastic?

Until the C&H plates are available can folks use the gen. 1 plates in a gen. 2?

Different dimension.

[mmc45414]

I have great results with my Gen 1 CORE "optics ready" upper on my old M&P Gen 1 5 inch 40.
Thank you very much for this feedback, I went ahead and snagged one, ended up going for lockedloaded.com for $348 shipped insured (https://lockedloaded.com/product/smith--wesson-11872-performance-center-slide-kit-nms-9mm-5-adjustable-black-amornite). I have been circling the drain, wanting an optic gun without the $700 entry cost. This way I get something out of what is just holding down a shelf in the safe as bonus!

But wow, pricing seems to be dynamic on these, when I logged back in to get the link the price had been changed!! They were up to $399 on Primary Arms.

Now the trolling for the RMR starts...

[GJM]

Am I remembering correctly that the 2.0 40 pistols have a thicker slide and won’t fit 9mm holsters?

[mmc45414]

Am I remembering correctly that the 2.0 40 pistols have a thicker slide and won’t fit 9mm holsters?
I do not think so, it has always been my understanding that the M&P was configured to be big enough for 40, and at least all of my 1.0 guns (9/40/45) all fit the same holster (I would order 4.5" 45 holsters that would accommodate the whole gang).

But if you are referencing my purchase, that PC slide is all 1.0 stuff anyway.

ETA: If there are any issues with accuracy I will do the Apex barrel, I have fitted one in one of my other pistols.

[BobM]

Am I remembering correctly that the 2.0 40 pistols have a thicker slide and won’t fit 9mm holsters?

You are correct. I have 2.0 COREs in both calibers. When I couldn’t fit the 40 into the Safariland duty holster I used for the 9, I took a dial caliper to the slides. The 40 slide is thicker. There are some ribs in the holster that I’m going to try to remove.
I do have a JMCK IWB with a RDS cut that will fit both.

[mmc45414]

You are correct. ... The 40 slide is thicker. ... I do have a JMCK IWB with a RDS cut that will fit both.
Learn something every day... Almost all me gear is JMCK and it all fit, so I never had a reason to measure...

[ranger]

Am I remembering correctly that the 2.0 40 pistols have a thicker slide and won’t fit 9mm holsters?

No issues with M&P Gen 1 5 inch 40 slides in multiple different M&P long slide "9"holsters. Of course, if there were, all mine are old school kydex and I have a heat gun.

[HCM]

You are correct. I have 2.0 COREs in both calibers. When I couldn’t fit the 40 into the Safariland duty holster I used for the 9, I took a dial caliper to the slides. The 40 slide is thicker. There are some ribs in the holster that I’m going to try to remove.
I do have a JMCK IWB with a RDS cut that will fit both.

So I picked up my 4.25" PC CORE .40.ported it fits my Safariland 6390 RDS though it is tighter than with the 320. I don't have a 9mm M&P to compare it to.

Maybe the PC slides are thinner but I have another theory.

How old is you Safariland holster ? Safariland originally made two different RDS duty holsters for M&P and SIGs.

About two years ago there was a Safariland "drought" where RDS duty holsters were unavailable for about 6 to 9 months. When I finally got the SIG RDS duty holster I ordered via an LE dealer, the bag said it was for the SIG but the Holster said it was for S&W...

I called the dealer, who called Safariland. TLDR Safariland had fit issues with the early / separate S&W and SIG RDS holsters. Their solution was to engineer a new holster which fit both.

[BobM]

So I picked up my 4.25" PC CORE .40.ported it fits my Safariland 6390 RDS though it is tighter than with the 320. I don't have a 9mm M&P to compare it to.

Maybe the PC slides are thinner but I have another theory.

How old is you Safariland holster ? Safariland originally made two different RDS duty holsters for M&P and SIGs.

About two years ago there was a Safariland "drought" where RDS duty holsters were unavailable for about 6 to 9 months. When I finally got the SIG RDS duty holster I ordered via an LE dealer, the bag said it was for the SIG but the Holster said it was for S&W...

I called the dealer, who called Safariland. TLDR Safariland had fit issues with the early / separate S&W and SIG RDS holsters. Their solution was to engineer a new holster which fit both.

We got them in the spring.

[MD7305]

YVK asked me the same thing, and my best guess is 5-10K, but I can’t be certain as I have four of them. This is my main match pistol. I frequently check the screws for tightness, and did before and after the match last weekend. Guess I get to see how Smith handles this — not sure if they will drill out the sheared screws, provide a new slide, or tell me to go pound sand.

Any update from S&W on this? I had a screw shear today and I'm trying to decide where to go from here.
I received a CHPWS plate and was using the hardware from McMaster to install everything. The left screw felt "tight" and instead of halting like I should've I ended up with one sheared screw. I suspect an issue with the threading on that particular hole, the other side threads perfectly. It wasn't noticeable when I was using shorter screws to initially install my RDS.

[GJM]

We got them in the spring.

My Safariland RDS a holster for the CORE is so tight, I can get the pistol out without a struggle. Will call Safariland CS.


Any update from S&W on this? I had a screw shear today and I'm trying to decide where to go from here.
I received a CHPWS plate and was using the hardware from McMaster to install everything. The left screw felt "tight" and instead of halting like I should've I ended up with one sheared screw. I suspect an issue with the threading on that particular hole, the other side threads perfectly. It wasn't noticeable when I was using shorter screws to initially install my RDS.

I called S&W CS, was on hold less than a minute, and got a return shipping label from them — they said they would repair or replace the slide. Wanted the whole pistol since the slide is not serialized and said that was the only way they could track it in their system. By comparison, I was on hold thirty minutes with Sig CS, and never reached a person.

[maximus83]

^@GJM same type of question with my new M2 compact. Which as you mentioned earlier in thread about the CORE models, also uses the 2.0 plastic base plates for RMR/SRO and other optic types.

Wondering if we could get any general guidance from S&W on avoiding the issue you ran into. So obviously some combo of the following:
* Run the metal CHPWS 2.0 plate (https://chpws.com/product/sw-core-2-0-1-975) which looks like it's still on backorder. Would this substantially help with the issue of the screws shearing off?
* Torque screws to certain inch-pounds.
* Like you said: rotate mounting screws as maintenance?

Interested to hear where you land on this, kinda' hoping to avoid that issue too. :cool:

[rca90gsx]

I am not GJM and just putting in what I intend to do now. Good quality screws, 10 in lbs of torque on the screws, blue 243 loctite (it has a primer in it). Currently deciding about rotating screws out, maybe every 6 months or something along those lines to start.



^@GJM same type of question with my new M2 compact. Which as you mentioned earlier in thread about the CORE models, also uses the 2.0 plastic base plates for RMR/SRO and other optic types.

Wondering if we could get any general guidance from S&W on avoiding the issue you ran into. So obviously some combo of the following:
* Run the metal CHPWS 2.0 plate (https://chpws.com/product/sw-core-2-0-1-975) which looks like it's still on backorder. Would this substantially help with the issue of the screws shearing off?
* Torque screws to certain inch-pounds.
* Like you said: rotate mounting screws as maintenance?

Interested to hear where you land on this, kinda' hoping to avoid that issue too. :cool:

[GJM]

I am not GJM and just putting in what I intend to do now. Good quality screws, 10 in lbs of torque on the screws, blue 243 loctite (it has a primer in it). Currently deciding about rotating screws out, maybe every 6 months or something along those lines to start.

Yes, what he said.

[maximus83]

I am not GJM and just putting in what I intend to do now. Good quality screws, 10 in lbs of torque on the screws, blue 243 loctite (it has a primer in it). Currently deciding about rotating screws out, maybe every 6 months or something along those lines to start.

Seems like a reasonable plan until more is known. Definitely makes you wonder if these will hold up under high round counts. It would be a hassle if it turns out the only long-term solution is to keep rotating your optic mount screws. :D

[rca90gsx]

I think their are several USPSA participants out their with high round counts, no failures. Seems like not over torquing and loctite with proper cleaning before assembly is all we can hope for!



Seems like a reasonable plan until more is known. Definitely makes you wonder if these will hold up under high round counts. It would be a hassle if it turns out the only long-term solution is to keep rotating your optic mount screws. :D

[SoCalDep]

Don’t guess.

There’s lots of engineering experience with screws and before one jumps into making recommendations they should probably understand what’s going on with the parts and the metal. If one is making torque recommendations and doesn’t understand ductility vs brittleness and tensile, compression, torsion, and shear stresses or how G-Force and vibration can affect those factors, and how threadlockers work (and why) then they should probably rethink that advice.

The C&H torque specs assume their plates with their components and their tolerances. If you’re not using their plates and you’re doing 10 in/lbs (say on an MOS plate) you may be disappointed.

We teach that one must first decide what components they need (sealing plate, aftermarket plate, aftermarket screws, etc). Then they need to prep the surfaces by degreasing. This includes threads in slides, plates, and the screws themselves. After that threadlocker should be applied. I hear people say they didn’t use it and it worked. Friction is cool but threadlocker is insurance and I’m about redundancy. I like loctite 248 and have used it on dozens of optics with good results. How it’s applied is important. Same goes for other threadlockers...especially Vibratite.

Then install the optic using the threadlocker applied screws. Once resistance is felt alternate bit by bit and use a torque driver to ensure proper torque is applied evenly. Torque applied should be the lowest specifications listed for any of the interacting components.

Indicator markings help identify a loose optic before shear stresses cause the screws to shear. Poor quality screws will perform poorly compared to better quality screws. Shear strength is not the same as tensile strength but depending on what engineering formula is used (which depends largely on the ductility of the metal) shear strength has a direct ratio to tensile strength (about 57%-60% or so). To me that means a crappy screw comes loose and may break really quick. A good screw gives more warning.

Coming loose sucks to begin with and when mating a metal optic to a metal slide the “torque”, as long as it’s enough to prevent all movement between components, is less important than the threadlocker since the torque values are pretty low compared to the forces applied. The goal isn’t to discover a loose screw early but to not have the screw come loose. With most decent screws, if they stay tight and prevent movement there will never be a problem.

[rca90gsx]

Well said.



Don’t guess.

There’s lots of engineering experience with screws and before one jumps into making recommendations they should probably understand what’s going on with the parts and the metal. If one is making torque recommendations and doesn’t understand ductility vs brittleness and tensile, compression, torsion, and shear stresses or how G-Force and vibration can affect those factors, and how threadlockers work (and why) then they should probably rethink that advice.

The C&H torque specs assume their plates with their components and their tolerances. If you’re not using their plates and you’re doing 10 in/lbs (say on an MOS plate) you may be disappointed.

We teach that one must first decide what components they need (sealing plate, aftermarket plate, aftermarket screws, etc). Then they need to prep the surfaces by degreasing. This includes threads in slides, plates, and the screws themselves. After that threadlocker should be applied. I hear people say they didn’t use it and it worked. Friction is cool but threadlocker is insurance and I’m about redundancy. I like loctite 248 and have used it on dozens of optics with good results. How it’s applied is important. Same goes for other threadlockers...especially Vibratite.

Then install the optic using the threadlocker applied screws. Once resistance is felt alternate bit by bit and use a torque driver to ensure proper torque is applied evenly. Torque applied should be the lowest specifications listed for any of the interacting components.

Indicator markings help identify a loose optic before shear stresses cause the screws to shear. Poor quality screws will perform poorly compared to better quality screws. Shear strength is not the same as tensile strength but depending on what engineering formula is used (which depends largely on the ductility of the metal) shear strength has a direct ratio to tensile strength (about 57%-60% or so). To me that means a crappy screw comes loose and may break really quick. A good screw gives more warning.

Coming loose sucks to begin with and when mating a metal optic to a metal slide the “torque”, as long as it’s enough to prevent all movement between components, is less important than the threadlocker since the torque values are pretty low compared to the forces applied. The goal isn’t to discover a loose screw early but to not have the screw come loose. With most decent screws, if they stay tight and prevent movement there will never be a problem.

[GJM]

I received two new CORE 5 inch pistols today. On one of them, my preferred M/L grip piece in the box was so deformed it would not go on the pistol. On the other one, the overtravel stop was misssing, and the hole was not even drilled. Suggests that Smith is rushing to get product out the door.

[flyrodr]

I received two new CORE 5 inch pistols today. On one of them, my preferred M/L grip piece in the box was so deformed it would not go on the pistol. On the other one, the overtravel stop was misssing, and the hole was not even drilled. Suggests that Smith is rushing to get product out the door.

If I "Like" this, it might appear I am chuckling at GJM's problems. So I'll just say I unlike it to indicate that I sympathize with his receipt of less-than-satisfactory products.

Now that that's clear . . .

[GJM]

If I "Like" this, it might appear I am chuckling at GJM's problems. So I'll just say I unlike it to indicate that I sympathize with his receipt of less-than-satisfactory products.

Now that that's clear . . .

The defects are merely amusing — the 2.0 pistols are orders of magnitude better than the 1.0 pistols.

[flyrodr]

The defects are merely amusing — the 2.0 pistols are orders of magnitude better than the 1.0 pistols.

Yeah . . . I was afraid you were going to say that. I shot the 1.0 M&Ps for a number of years, and although I liked the feel, and how they pointed (more like the 1911s than others, to me anyway), but after a few problems (inconsistent accuracy, "dead" trigger, etc), I went mostly to Glocks. They've run fine, but are a bit fat for my stubby hands, although I shoot them OK (for me).

But, with what you said, I'm thinking I ought to give the M&Ps another try. Thanks for that (seriously).

[GJM]

64519

[flyrodr]

GJM - - - You are clearly clouding my normally insanely rational thinking (as evidenced by my oxymoronic English)

[98z28]

I received two new CORE 5 inch pistols today. On one of them, my preferred M/L grip piece in the box was so deformed it would not go on the pistol. On the other one, the overtravel stop was misssing, and the hole was not even drilled. Suggests that Smith is rushing to get product out the door.

That’s been my experience with S&W from the 2.0’s beginning. Very poor QC on random things. But at least the guns will group consistently...

They seem to be running well for folks now, too.

[sickeness]

SoCalDep
What are you guys using for holsters on SRO equipped guns?
I am trying to find one for a 5" M&P and they seem to not exist.
The M&Ps lock up differently than a Glock MOS in a 6360RDS and it is impossible to remove enough material for the ALS to lock without seriously compromising the part.

[SoCalDep]

SoCalDep
What are you guys using for holsters on SRO equipped guns?
I am trying to find one for a 5" M&P and they seem to not exist.
The M&Ps lock up differently than a Glock MOS in a 6360RDS and it is impossible to remove enough material for the ALS to lock without seriously compromising the part.

The CORE with an SRO will fit in a 6360 series holster but as you said, the ALS will not function, which means a “no go” for duty use. My samples are both for Glocks but both the Blackhawk T-Series and US Duty Gear will take SROs so I’m hopeful the M&P versions will also.

Short answer right now is that on my department one can’t carry a COR/SRO in the field in patrol right now.

[GJM]

From C&H, the Boom squad on a plate for the 509T for the CORE:

We'll have a batch of them done the end of this week / mid part of next week. You'll need to have your slide modified by us to add two new M3 mounting screw holes.

[SoCalDep]

From C&H, the Boom squad on a plate for the 509T for the CORE:

We'll have a batch of them done the end of this week / mid part of next week. You'll need to have your slide modified by us to add two new M3 mounting screw holes.

That sucks. As much as I’ve tried my department will not allow any modification to the pistol.

[mmc45414]

I have great results with my Gen 1 CORE "optics ready" upper on my old M&P Gen 1 5 inch 40.

Thank you very much for this feedback, I went ahead and snagged one
65010

This came last week and I shot it for the first time Sunday, and can say I am very happy to have an optics ready pistol for $348 in the current market. We only shot plates Sunday and I didn't shoot it on paper for any kind of accuracy but I was hitting all of the same plates I can hit with my 5" 2.0 that has better Dawson sights on it. It never missed a beat.

We have been going through money like shit through a goose lately (Christmas, heat pump, bedroom furniture, going out to eat a bunch while leaving big tips like we have been doing since the CV has screwed all the people in the food service industry) so might need to lay low on jumping on the RMR until next month sometime.

I didn't think to try it side by side with my unported gun, maybe that will be next week.

Also now I can take the slide and all of the 40S&W mags (I have a bunch..) and stash them in the ammo can with the 2k-3k reloads and save them for a rainy day.

If I end up shooting this a lot and liking the dot maybe someday I will still get a 2.0 CORE gun, but who knows exactly what the future might hold.

Thanks again for the coaching and confirmation of the validity of this approach.

[ranger]

I am pleasantly surprised with my Swampfox Justice if you wish to continue your "budget" build

[mmc45414]

I am pleasantly surprised with my Swampfox Justice if you wish to continue your "budget" build
Yes, and friends are also having good things to say about the Holosun. I think I want to hold out for an RMR (or maybe SRO...) on the premise that if I like it I will probably want at least the one RMR/SRO or if I hate it I will have something that can move someplace else (offset 45deg AR mount?) or sell for just a small cost of ownership. I am patient. Kinda...

Because looking at those Swampfox units they look more and more tasty... :cool:

[GJM]

https://chpws.com/product/swmp-509t-sw-m2-0-c-o-r-e-holosun-509t-plate-slide-upgrade-combo

[NickDrak]

https://chpws.com/product/swmp-509t-sw-m2-0-c-o-r-e-holosun-509t-plate-slide-upgrade-combo

Sent my 5” 2.0 Optics Ready slide in last week for the Holosun 509T mod. Looking forward to getting it back.

[JM Campbell]

Sent my 5” 2.0 Optics Ready slide in last week for the Holosun 509T mod. Looking forward to getting it back.

Seriously thinking about doing this as well.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[GJM]

Seriously thinking about doing this as well.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

I plan to send a 4 inch 2.0 CORE in the next week or so.

[newyork]

Just curious, does the ACRO work on the 2.0 M&P with rear sight?

[GJM]

Just curious, does the ACRO work on the 2.0 M&P with rear sight?

Primary offers that option.

https://primarymachine.com/m-p-optic-milling/

[newyork]

If Aimpoint would increase battery life that could be interesting. Rmr will be fine though.

[GJM]

Anyone have experience with KKM barrels in a 2.0?

[45dotACP]

Anyone have experience with KKM barrels in a 2.0?My only experience is with a 1.0 with a thumb safety that was stippled and grip chopped.

The gun was devastatingly accurate.

Come to think of it, I don't know why I don't carry that gun more.

Sent from my moto g(6) using Tapatalk

[GJM]

I had a few of these with a 5 inch CORE today, shooting PMC 115. Doesn’t happen with higher power factor ammo or other optics.

65898

[ranger]

I had a few of these with a 5 inch CORE today, shooting PMC 115. Doesn’t happen with higher power factor ammo or other optics.

65898

I wonder if S&W optimizes the recoil spring weight on the 9mm M&Ps. Seems like they use the same recoil spring weight for 9 and 40 M&Ps which implies to me may be too heavy for 9mm if ok for 40. I went to a slightly lower recoil spring weight on my gamer M&P with no issues with my 125+ PF 9mm reloads with 115 FMJs.

[OldRunner/CSAT Neighbor]

I wonder if S&W optimizes the recoil spring weight on the 9mm M&Ps. Seems like they use the same recoil spring weight for 9 and 40 M&Ps which implies to me may be too heavy for 9mm if ok for 40. I went to a slightly lower recoil spring weight on my gamer M&P with no issues with my 125+ PF 9mm reloads with 115 FMJs.

Ranger what weight recoil spring did you go to & where did you source it?

[ranger]

Ranger what weight recoil spring did you go to & where did you source it?

Frank Proctor used to be a M&P fan but I think he has moved onto the Staccato train. He used to sell replacement M&P guide rods and springs on his web page. I "think" the springs were 13lbs. I have found that Glock replacement stainless steel guide rods and recoil springs often fit in the M&Ps (and because they are even more available the Glock rods/springs may be cheaper).

[mmc45414]

I am pleasantly surprised with my Swampfox Justice if you wish to continue your "budget" build

Because looking at those Swampfox units they look more and more tasty... :cool:
Swampfox did a sale for $175 and I caved for a Liberty. What screws did you use? Not sure about what I have on hand...

ETA: I think I found some with the M&P slide kit.

[ranger]

Swampfox did a sale for $175 and I caved for a Liberty. What screws did you use? Not sure about what I have on hand...

ETA: I think I found some with the M&P slide kit.

I think I used screws that came with my Swampfox Justice

[mmc45414]

Swampfox did a sale for $175 and I caved for a Liberty.

I would say the first outing was a great success!
My Sunday routine is to gather with a bunch of friends that have access to some private land where we can do pretty much what we want. We setup a bunch of steel and some cardboard and informally time each other through scenario sequences we just make up from our own suggestions, some logical, all fun.

I had bore sighted the Swampfox and out of the gate set fast time of the group on the first string, and went on to have a great day. My one day assessment is if you find the dot it is smoking fast, and if not, not. One thing I wanted to do was to migrate to a pistol with a dot that was consistent with what I have been shooting weekly for the last two years, and I am glad I did.

Here is a photo of the M&P-40 with the Apex Duty/Carry kit and plastic trigger, with the Performance Center 5" 9mm ported slide with the Swampfox Liberty, thanks to ranger and others that helped in the decision:

65997

[mmc45414]

I just ordered three JMCK holsters with the optic cut.

I am incorrigible...

Sent from my SM-G892A using Tapatalk

[JHC]

Edit: wrong quote, meant to quote GJM


way back in 2010 when I ran 2100 rounds through a 5" Pro Center gun in slow fire I'd occassionally get a case that would just clear the port and land upright on the case and just stay there balanced like I'd placed it there.

I loved that pistol for awhile until dead trigger and of course soccer ball sized groups at 25 yards. I could really get my blaze on with it though.

[JM Campbell]

Got a text from HCM last night with a link to our lgs web site, M&P9 compact 2.0 with optic cut. Had him text his owner buddy and reserved it for me. I was in line to get in at 9:30am this morning before their 10:00am open. I was originally planing on picking up the pistol and maybe a cz 527 300blk rifle they have on the rack for a while...but they had two sequential serial number compacts in the case. Now I need two more red dots.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[HCM]

Got a text from HCM last night with a link to our lgs web site, M&P9 compact 2.0 with optic cut. Had him text his owner buddy and reserved it for me. I was in line to get in at 9:30am this morning before their 10:00am open. I was originally planing on picking up the pistol and maybe a cz 527 300blk rifle they have on the rack for a while...but they had two sequential serial number compacts in the case. Now I need two more red dots.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

66632

[JM Campbell]

I think I used screws that came with my Swampfox Justice

How are you liking the swampfox? Like wise to anyone else that has one.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[ranger]

First impressions of Swampfox Justice on M&P 2.0 FS 9mm CORE still positive. Do not have a lot of rounds through it yet - been focusing on PRS rifle. Impressed enough to order some Swampfox Kingslayers on a sale opportunity to also try.

[mmc45414]

How are you liking the swampfox? Like wise to anyone else that has one.


Sent from my iPhone using TapatalkPlanning to shoot it again tomorrow, stay tuned...

Sent from my SM-G892A using Tapatalk

[mmc45414]

Planning to shoot it again tomorrow, stay tuned..
Another good outing.
I am very glad that i have attempted the transition with the exact same configuration as i have been shooting iron sights with for the past two years

As far as the Swampfox, sure seems like a sweet deal. I will still want a RMR, but this sure is working nicely. I have not carried it yet, but it is doing what it is supposed to do.



Sent from my SM-G892A using Tapatalk

[GJM]

Not a CORE, but I just got a 2.0 Compact. Installed Ameriglo sights and it shoots POA/POI and is a delight to shoot. It is G26 size.

I am completely satisfied with every 2.0 I have gotten and I have a dozen of them now. These pistols are real sleepers.

67053

[GJM]

Not a CORE, but I just got a 2.0 Compact. Installed Ameriglo sights and it shoots POA/POI and is a delight to shoot. It is G26 size.

I am completely satisfied with every 2.0 I have gotten and I have a dozen of them now. These pistols are real sleepers.

67053

Maybe it is their sub compact — I can’t keep the various little ones straight, as they have three variants.

[JM Campbell]

Maybe it is their sub compact — I can’t keep the various little ones straight, as they have three variants.

That’s the sub compact, the compact is g19 size and I lucked into 2 core compacts last month. Very happy about that as I’ve been trying to hunt them down for quite some time.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[MD7305]

I lucked up on a LE model sub-compact that has front serrations, it's one of my favorite M&Ps. It replaced my wife's Shield and she enjoys shooting it much more but I have to admit I carry it more than she does.

[newyork]

Sold my g19 to buy a 2.0 compact and couldn’t be happier. Just needs upgraded sights eventually. Considering selling my G48 for sights, a 2nd holster (owb/x300) and assorted other things Or...another M&P 2.0.

Great gun.

[JM Campbell]

Sold my g19 to buy a 2.0 compact and couldn’t be happier. Just needs upgraded sights eventually. Considering selling my G48 for sights, a 2nd holster (owb/x300) and assorted other things Or...another M&P 2.0.

Great gun.

2 is 1, 1 is none.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[GJM]

2 is 1, 1 is none.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

Or in my case, 12 is 3.

New topic, best shooting slimline pistol I have tried.

67135

[JM Campbell]

Or in my case, 12 is 3.

New topic, best shooting slimline pistol I have tried.

67135

Now your just flexing.

ETA: I just noticed that’s a 4” shield? I did a quick look and thought you put the comped 5” slide on the compact.

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[mmc45414]

Or in my case, 12 is 3.

I have like seven, but it took me a bit longer!



Sent from my SM-G892A using Tapatalk

[GJM]

67254

[JM Campbell]

67254

Did CHPWS do the modifications to mount that? I’ve been flip flopping between the Acro/509T/508T just can’t make up my mind on what to run.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[GJM]

Did CHPWS do the modifications to mount that? I’ve been flip flopping between the Acro/509T/508T just can’t make up my mind on what to run.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

No, I just bought the OEM Acro plate. I have a Compact CORE slide with C&H now for the mod and plate to mount a 509T.

[JM Campbell]

No, I just bought the OEM Acro plate. I have a Compact CORE slide with C&H now for the mod and plate to mount a 509T.

Love to see the comparison when you have it back. I assume the chwps plate will be lower/thinner then the acro factory plate.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[MK11]

Or in my case, 12 is 3.

New topic, best shooting slimline pistol I have tried.

67135

GJM, I'd like to hear more about this when you have time. Particularly how it stacks up against the 365XL in your experience. Thanks!

[noguns]

Gjm,

Did you just replace all your gen 5 glocks with 2.0 m&p?

[GJM]

GJM, I'd like to hear more about this when you have time. Particularly how it stacks up against the 365XL in your experience. Thanks!


Gjm,

Did you just replace all your gen 5 glocks with 2.0 m&p?

I have kept all my Gen 5 (and nearly every previous Gen) Glock pistols. I can shoot a Glock and M&P interchangeably. I believe I am shooting the Shield 4 inch better than any other slimline pistol (43X/48/365/XL). Not sure whether it is because of shooting a 2.0 M&P as my gaming gun or something else.

[GJM]

Or in my case, 12 is 3.

New topic, best shooting slimline pistol I have tried.

67135

Since I sent this one to Primary for a RMSc direct mill, I got a replacement. Shot it for the first time. This is ten shots at 30 yards with the iron sights as they came adjusted by the factory.

67678

[EricM]

Since I sent this one to Primary for a RMSc direct mill, I got a replacement. Shot it for the first time. This is ten shots at 30 yards with the iron sights as they came adjusted by the factory.

67678

Geez, now the Shields are keyholing, hope S&W takes care of you. :p

[revchuck38]

Ratzelfraggin' young punks who can actually see that far...

[98z28]

Since I sent this one to Primary for a RMSc direct mill, I got a replacement. Shot it for the first time. This is ten shots at 30 yards with the iron sights as they came adjusted by the factory.

67678

What happened with that high round out of the black, man? ;):cool:

Seriously, that's impressive, especially with stock iron sights. While I can shoot the 365 well enough, I have to work pretty hard to do it compared to the 320. You're going to tempt into testing yet another small gun for days when I have to dress like an adult, dammit...

[Quantrill]

I just bought a 1.0 PC core slide and a Leupy DPP. Unfortunately I didn’t do enough research on that combo and I had to get the leupold adapter plate to mount the optic. The plate is thick and wedge shaped and it makes for a different presentation compared to my rmr gun. Has anyone had a 1.0 core milled to take 2.0 plates? I can’t believe I’m a “plate guy” now. Jeez.

[HCM]

I just bought a 1.0 PC core slide and a Leupy DPP. Unfortunately I didn’t do enough research on that combo and I had to get the leupold adapter plate to mount the optic. The plate is thick and wedge shaped and it makes for a different presentation compared to my rmr gun. Has anyone had a 1.0 core milled to take 2.0 plates? I can’t believe I’m a “plate guy” now. Jeez.

Look at the C&H precision plate.

They can also do the milling if you go that route.

[GJM]

C&H called to say my CORE Compact modified with the new C&H plate for the 509T is headed back to me.

[GJM]

Since it is “M&P ready,” I was thinking about the new Leupold micro for another CO pistol. You never know when you might have to shoot through a knot hole in a fence.

67764

Then I said, what the heck, let’s go for all the help available.

67765

67766

[Quantrill]

Look at the C&H precision plate.

They can also do the milling if you go that route.

Thanks. I see the diagram of the 1.0 vs 2.0 plates but I don’t see where the 1.0 is for sale. Do you know the part number?

[HCM]

Thanks. I see the diagram of the 1.0 vs 2.0 plates but I don’t see where the 1.0 is for sale. Do you know the part number?

I would call them.

[GJM]

I can’t wait to get my four inch PC Shield back from Primary Machine with the RMSc. Earlier today, I did a run on three USPSA targets and an eight inch steel at 15 yards with my iron sight Shield — it is a joy to shoot and feels like such a capable slimline pistol.


https://youtu.be/8wvyBktc3zw

[mmc45414]

Am trying to navigate the S&W www site to figure out what exact SKU I should be trolling for. Seems like I keep getting tossed into this "builder" page:
https://www.smith-wesson.com/product/mp-9-m20-performance-center?sku=12470
And it doesn't seem to show what I think they have.

What I want is a CORE twin to my #11989, like this:
https://www.smith-wesson.com/product/mp-m20?sku=11989

I don't care if it is black or brown, and would prefer it to not be ported. Am not worried about Performance Center extra features, if I want enhancements I would probably go down the Apex path I have traveled before. But I am so far happy enough with my 1.0 with the PC kit that I am starting to think about the next thing, seems like I always need a carrot on a stick :cool:

Is there a basic model like I am looking for and cannot find?

[GJM]

My Compact CORE came back from CHPWS with the mod so the 509T works. Will shoot it later.

68212

The iron sights, front and rear, were nearly out of the dovetails. Can’t imagine I sent them that way, but since I have a MGW Pro, no harm no foul.

68213

[MD7305]

GJM, what kind of cowitness does that setup give you?

[bwswanson]

Am trying to navigate the S&W www site to figure out what exact SKU I should be trolling for. Seems like I keep getting tossed into this "builder" page:
https://www.smith-wesson.com/product/mp-9-m20-performance-center?sku=12470
And it doesn't seem to show what I think they have.

What I want is a CORE twin to my #11989, like this:
https://www.smith-wesson.com/product/mp-m20?sku=11989

I don't care if it is black or brown, and would prefer it to not be ported. Am not worried about Performance Center extra features, if I want enhancements I would probably go down the Apex path I have traveled before. But I am so far happy enough with my 1.0 with the PC kit that I am starting to think about the next thing, seems like I always need a carrot on a stick :cool:

Is there a basic model like I am looking for and cannot find?

5in CORE is 11828

[GJM]

I went to the range to zero the 509T on the new plate installed by CHPWS, and fifteen rounds into the session, my zero started wandering. I checked the slide, and the plate had come loose. Disappointing, as I heard one previous mention of a similar thing happening via PM from another PF member.

I contacted CHPWS, and after multiple people, got a person that said they had been having issues with this, and for me to send the slide back. I asked for a return label and she agreed to send me one. Several minutes later, she called back to say that I should send it back with the optic, and if their engineer determined their product was at fault, they would reimburse my shipping cost. I elevated it up the chain of command, and spoke with Will, who asked me to send a video for him to evaluate. I have sent that video and am waiting for his reply.

Here is what it looks like, and it is clearly the plate to the slide and not the optic to plate fit.


https://youtu.be/22SU-v45eJA

[GJM]

GJM, what kind of cowitness does that setup give you?

Haven’t gotten that far, but the CORE BUIS are just visible at the bottom of the 509T display.

[flyrodr]

I went to the range to zero the 509T on the new plate installed by CHPWS, and fifteen rounds into the session, my zero started wandering. I checked the slide, and the plate had come loose. Disappointing, as I heard one previous mention of a similar thing happening via PM from another PF member.

I contacted CHPWS,etc. . . .

Disappointing, i.e., the loosening. Further disappointing that, seemingly, "proof" was asked for.

(Perhaps they are not aware that you hold a GM ranking in red dot torture.)

Can't sort out myself whether I intended "GM" to refer to George M. or to Grand Master. ;)

[GJM]

CHPWS sent me a label and the slide is headed back to them later today. I can see where their witness marks show the right screw already loosened.

68227

[JM Campbell]

CHPWS sent me a label and the slide is headed back to them later today. I can see where their witness marks show the right screw already loosened.

68227

CHPWS installed the plate after their screw hole location mod? Wonder if they even put vibra tite on the screws.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[mmc45414]

5in CORE is 11828
Thank You.

[noguns]

I had chpws mill a slide for holosun 407. Botched the first one so they gave me a new glock slide.

My screws had also come loose. I just backed them out and applied some blue threadlock. I figured it was a fluke that mine had backed out. Maybe the same person at chpws is not tightening enough? Miscalibrated torque wrench?

[guymontag]

GJM
Duke

Any comparisons or thoughts of the CORE vs. the VP9 or even the CZ Shadow/P10 offerings? I read the entirety of the thread and am open to adding a polymer striker to my metal framed CZ collection (I was considering milling my Shadow but the cost and wait time involved... ) especially if it’s a great polymer striker with a dot.

[GJM]

I stopped by and had a brief visit with Randy and Scott from Apex Tactical. They and Apex are such a class act and use their expertise to provide so many great products for enthusiast shooters. Randy fitted three barrels for me.

68620

[mmc45414]

I stopped by and had a brief visit with Randy and Scott from Apex Tactical.

Couple a cool guys.

Sent from my SM-G892A using Tapatalk

[Quantrill]

I have 4 apex barrels, several sears and triggers. I had one barrel slightly out of spec once. Apex customer service was top notch, Randy ended calling me to get the matter resolved. I’m a big fan

[GJM]

I got to shoot one of my CORE 5 inch pistols with the gunsmith barrel fit by Randy Lee. Here is five shots of 150 Syntech at 20 yards. Looking forward to having time to work with the other two pistols.

68750

[YVK]

Looking forward to seeing how you gonna be torn between new Walther and fully Apexed M&P. That's one tight group.

[Kirk]

I got to shoot one of my CORE 5 inch pistols with the gunsmith barrel fit by Randy Lee. Here is five shots of 150 Syntech at 20 yards. Looking forward to having time to work with the other two pistols.

68750

That's fantastic! I had the drop-in Apex barrel in my M&P Core 1.0 that shot 6" groups from the factory. It ended up shooting 2" with almost anything. Obviously from that photo the gunsmith fit is even better

[mmc45414]

Here is five shots of 150 Syntech at 20 yards.

I had the drop-in Apex barrel in my M&P Core 1.0 that shot 6" groups from the factory. It ended up shooting 2" with almost anything.
I have a 4.25" 1.0 that I did the semi drop-in myself. I have never really shot a group with it, because my eyes are the limiting factor. I bought one of those cheesy scope mounts that clamps onto the light rail, I need to put a dot on it and do some load testing.

I am happy with my converted gun, but I am getting motivated to get a 2.0 5" gun and maybe do this again...

[45dotACP]

The Apex and KKM barrels have astounded me as far as accuracy goes in the gen 1 M&Ps. Especially the hard fit apex barrels.


Sent from my moto g(6) using Tapatalk

[mmc45414]

Here is five shots of 150 Syntech at 20 yards.
Don't want to hijack this too far, but I have been loading some coated (Blue Bullets) 147g, did you choose the Syntech because you had it on hand or specifically for the accuracy potential?

[GJM]

Don't want to hijack this too far, but I have been loading some coated (Blue Bullets) 147g, did you choose the Syntech because you had it on hand or specifically for the accuracy potential?

Syntech 150 has been my match load since last summer. It is clean, shoots soft in the relatively lightweight polymer pistols I have been shooting, and is deemed to make power factor.

[GJM]

69600

[JM Campbell]

CHPWS sent me a label and the slide is headed back to them later today. I can see where their witness marks show the right screw already loosened.

68227

Any update on this issue? I’ve got 3 core 2.0 I’m looking to upgrade.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[GJM]

Any update on this issue? I’ve got 3 core 2.0 I’m looking to upgrade.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

Nothing

[Adam]

Great thread guys. Looking for some input:

I’ve mostly been a Glock guy since the early 2000s. I bought a 2.0 when they first came out but were only available in a full-size gun. I mostly like G19 sized guns so I traded it off for another Glock. I now have a 19 with an RMR and Forward Controls plate as my first red dot pistol and am interested in exploring the MRDS road. I also have a Holosun 507c on the way and am really tempted to try the 2.0 compact optics ready with 4” barrel as a G19 competitor and the test bed for the Holosun. I feel a bit myopic always coming back to a G19 which isn’t perfect, but nothing else has drawn me away yet.

GJM push me off the ledge? 😀

[GJM]

Great thread guys. Looking for some input:

I’ve mostly been a Glock guy since the early 2000s. I bought a 2.0 when they first came out but were only available in a full-size gun. I mostly like G19 sized guns so I traded it off for another Glock. I now have a 19 with an RMR and Forward Controls plate as my first red dot pistol and am interested in exploring the MRDS road. I also have a Holosun 507c on the way and am really tempted to try the 2.0 compact optics ready with 4” barrel as a G19 competitor and the test bed for the Holosun. I feel a bit myopic always coming back to a G19 which isn’t perfect, but nothing else has drawn me away yet.

GJM push me off the ledge? 😀

Four inch CORE, chip wiz plate and extra screws as spec’d by SoCalDep, with your Holosun of choice. The alternative would be to have a slide direct milled for your optic and avoid the plate.

[GJM]

Something that bugs me about the Compact CORE, is how tall and sharp the rear sight is. I decided to send a non CORE slide to Primary and have them direct mill a 508T with the back up rear sight in front of the optic. I like this SO much better, as the back of the slide is no longer digging in to me.

69804

69805

[SoCalDep]

Really good observation from a carry perspective!

I haven't noticed an issue from my Glock MOS/ Ameriglo GL-429 sights, but I can see the taller supressor sights being an issue and irons in front can certainly help with that. Both of my iron-front guns (Agency G34 with 509T and Unity ATOM with an ACRO) are not carry guns so it's not something I've considered. Very cool.

[GJM]

Two updates.

1) I have had multiple range sessions with my M&P CORE five inch that Randy Lee personally fit a gunsmith barrel to. Using a variety of ammo, but mostly with 150 Syntech and 147 reloads, it shoots crazy small groups. Going back and forth with a stock five inch, the level of precision with the Apex barrel is remarkable.

2) my CORE four inch slide came back from CHPWS, where they were addressing their initial installation of a custom plate for the 509T. First time, the plate came loose in 15 rounds. After a month back for rework, it now made 30 rounds before the plate started coming loose, so I guess we are making progress. Will be in touch with them in the morning.

[Adam]

Two updates.

1) I have had multiple range sessions with my M&P CORE five inch that Randy Lee personally fit a gunsmith barrel to. Using a variety of ammo, but mostly with 150 Syntech and 147 reloads, it shoots crazy small groups. Going back and forth with a stock five inch, the level of precision with the Apex barrel is remarkable.

2) my CORE four inch slide came back from CHPWS, where they were addressing their initial installation of a custom plate for the 509T. First time, the plate came loose in 15 rounds. After a month back for rework, it now made 30 rounds before the plate started coming loose, so I guess we are making progress. Will be in touch with them in the morning.

GJM in the words of Frank Constanza: “SERENITY NOW!” I hear lots of folks say CHPWS peeps walk on water and others not so much. I’m sending good vibes in to the universe (or whatever) that they get you squared away ASAP.

If it is any consolation, I took your recommendation and ordered my 4” optic ready. Got to the FFL all excited, flipped open the box and...

70121

Wrong gun. Paperwork correct, just wrong gun. Where is mine? Great question. Whose is this? Great question.

[45dotACP]

Two updates.

1) I have had multiple range sessions with my M&P CORE five inch that Randy Lee personally fit a gunsmith barrel to. Using a variety of ammo, but mostly with 150 Syntech and 147 reloads, it shoots crazy small groups. Going back and forth with a stock five inch, the level of precision with the Apex barrel is remarkable.

2) my CORE four inch slide came back from CHPWS, where they were addressing their initial installation of a custom plate for the 509T. First time, the plate came loose in 15 rounds. After a month back for rework, it now made 30 rounds before the plate started coming loose, so I guess we are making progress. Will be in touch with them in the morning.I've been beating the Apex hard fit barrel M&P drum for as long as I've had mine. I'm nowhere near as good a shot as you are and it makes me look like a stud at the range.

It's truly silly how accurate these guns are. They can give most custom shop 1911s a run for their money and I'm not even sort of joking about that.

Sent from my moto g(6) using Tapatalk

[newyork]

An the 509T be milked on to the M&P9 compact non optics ready?

[revchuck38]

An the 509T be milked on to the M&P9 compact non optics ready?

Huh?

[newyork]

Huh?

I meant, “can” not An, sorry. With a loaded chamber indicator, can the 509 be milled to a m&P 9 compact? It’s not an optics ready model. Also meant milled not milked. Dang phone.

[revchuck38]

I think I end up typing twice as much on my phone as I do on my laptop due to the phone's "auto-corrupt" feature. :)

[newyork]

I assume it’s not compatible. Does everyone charge extra if your M&P has the LCI? Does it change what optic fits if you mount the rear sight forward?

[Adam]

I assume it’s not compatible. Does everyone charge extra if your M&P has the LCI? Does it change what optic fits if you mount the rear sight forward?

Check with Doug at ATEI.

[newyork]

I just found out tonight that Floyd’s Custom Shop does the 509/M&P but will only leave stock M&P sights. They say the optic will sit low enough to be seen through the window for back ups.

[professor]

I just found out tonight that Floyd’s Custom Shop does the 509/M&P but will only leave stock M&P sights. They say the optic will sit low enough to be seen through the window for back ups.

I have one there waiting to be milled for a 509 now. Here are some pictures I saved they have posted. My slide is wearing an Ameriglo set that is basically stock height. There should not be any reason a Dawson rear could not be easily added to being it up a bit higher if needed. But I think I’ll be happy with the height as pictured.


https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20210421/83634b9b880777398771b891925e0d7a.jpg
https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20210421/6d31b58d09ad1ea2848aa38ec43d35a2.jpg
https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20210421/cf5090e3cd5d6b68c758bc50acdf68a5.jpg

[newyork]

Excellent!!!!

[newyork]

Looks perfect.

[andre3k]

I just ordered a 5" 2.0 optics ready model (sku# 12661). Does anyone know if Safariland makes a 6360RDS that fits the 5 inch pistols?

Sent from my SM-G965U using Tapatalk

[MD7305]

I just ordered a 5" 2.0 optics ready model (sku# 12661). Does anyone know if Safariland makes a 6360RDS that fits the 5 inch pistols?

Sent from my SM-G965U using Tapatalk

Yes, search for 6360RDS-8192. '8192' denotes 5" guns and 2192 is for 4.25" guns.

[andre3k]

Yes, search for 6360RDS-8192. '8192' denotes 5" guns and 2192 is for 4.25" guns.Great. Thanks.

Sent from my SM-G965U using Tapatalk

[sickeness]

Yes, search for 6360RDS-8192. '8192' denotes 5" guns and 2192 is for 4.25" guns.

8192 is the number for a 1.0 5" CORE.
You want a 8182 for a 2.0 5" CORE.

The 8192 will NOT fit the 2.0 longslide as the slide is thicker than the 1.0

[newyork]

Ignore.

[Rotundra]

I just ordered a 5" 2.0 optics ready model (sku# 12661). Does anyone know if Safariland makes a 6360RDS that fits the 5 inch pistols?

Sent from my SM-G965U using Tapatalk

Hopefully S&W rolls the other optic ready (not CORE) models out to civilian sales, like they did the compact 4”. I’d love to get my hands on that exact model..

[MD7305]

8192 is the number for a 1.0 5" CORE.
You want a 8182 for a 2.0 5" CORE.

The 8192 will NOT fit the 2.0 longslide as the slide is thicker than the 1.0

My mistake

[Quantrill]

I just got my 1.0 PC core slide back from c&h. I had them mill the pocket out to 2.0 spec and I bought a DPP plate. Took 7 weeks door to door. Communication wasn’t great but the work looks fine. As far as milling goes this is about as simple as it gets but I don’t know that a lot of shops are offering it.

[professor]

My 2.0 slide came back today. I’m very happy with it.


I’m going to put a set of Dawson sights on it. These are Ameriglo I-Dots.

https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20210423/62608d6c2ed68777e6a64b6b9fe340fe.jpg
https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20210423/e0568c8859f2089a2f197d5e3db64188.jpg

[professor]

https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20210423/93c21127d54062e8abd537afad95e898.jpg

[professor]

https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20210423/1f755a7ecde9b23fb7a62f4e7805942b.jpg
https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20210423/47ee2e17e528cb69d4c36130554aa8fc.jpg

[JM Campbell]

https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20210423/1f755a7ecde9b23fb7a62f4e7805942b.jpg
https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20210423/47ee2e17e528cb69d4c36130554aa8fc.jpg

That’s Hot. Unfortunately I can’t do that to my core models and I’m not liking GJMs results from cwhp 509 mod.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[Brianjkeene]

https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20210423/1f755a7ecde9b23fb7a62f4e7805942b.jpg
https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20210423/47ee2e17e528cb69d4c36130554aa8fc.jpg

What was turn around time like? This could be the best possible optic option for an M&p now. I may have to send a couple off to them.

[GJM]

I think a direct milled installation on a M&P 2.0 is preferable to the CORE factory solution — especially if you move the optic rearward and put the rear sight in front of the optic. Obviously this doesn’t work with the SRO.

[professor]

What was turn around time like? This could be the best possible optic option for an M&p now. I may have to send a couple off to them.

9 days from the day I shipped it to the day I received it.

They must have received it as they were starting a batch or something. I think they were quoting 2 weeks. I was shocked when the package arrived.

[newyork]

Anyone mill a compact 2.0 for an SRO? Any issues? Is the SRO tough enough for general use like ccw and HD? Is it a lint and rain collector or gtg?

[SoCalDep]

The SRO is a good optic for duty, CCW, home defense, or fun. It has advantages (big clear window, top load battery) and disadvantages (lower battery life, not as durable as an RMR, higher profile, and in my opinion worse brightness settings).

Some people rate an optic’s “duty worthiness” on the single criteria of being able to survive a specific height drop while ignoring other attributes. I feel that is flawed thinking and I believe the SRO is not only good to go, but is one of the best optics out there right now.

[newyork]

Worse brightening meaning it isn’t bright enough in super bright sun, or not a lot of setting range? Do you appendix carry yours?

[SoCalDep]

Worse brightening meaning it isn’t bright enough in super bright sun, or not a lot of setting range? Do you appendix carry yours?

The brightness in sunlight is fine. My gripe is primarily with the top three settings. I like to set the brightness to a single setting for both day and night/low light. Going from full brightness to the “down one” level on my 1.0 MOA SRO is almost no difference at all, and the “down two” level is lower than I’d like... I wish the “down one” was more in between the two levels. It’s better on my 2.5 MOA version, but the brightness on my ACRO, 509Ts, and RMRs gets way more Goldilocks for me compared to the SRO. So... not really an objective failure but a personal opinion.

That said, it’s a minor drawback for me and the SRO is my favorite optic for sheer shooting performance.

I haven’t carried the SRO off duty, but a couple of my partners do and they have had no issues. The window will gather skin, lint, hair, and all the other fun stuff we all shed throughout the day (gross), but so does the RMR. My carry gun is a Glock 19MOS with a 1.0 MOA RMR and I have a lens pen in a drawer and I use the brush to clean the window every day or so. My partners do the same with their SROs. We all appendix carry.

While my carry gun has an RMR, it will probably be switched out for a 509T at some point unless something new comes along. My current duty gun has a 509T, and I’ll be setting up a second one with an ACRO once I pick up another. Both of the guns I use the most in training have SROs. One of those was my duty gun for a while before I set up my current one.

[newyork]

The brightness in sunlight is fine. My gripe is primarily with the top three settings. I like to set the brightness to a single setting for both day and night/low light. Going from full brightness to the “down one” level on my 1.0 MOA SRO is almost no difference at all, and the “down two” level is lower than I’d like... I wish the “down one” was more in between the two levels. It’s better on my 2.5 MOA version, but the brightness on my ACRO, 509Ts, and RMRs gets way more Goldilocks for me compared to the SRO. So... not really an objective failure but a personal opinion.

That said, it’s a minor drawback for me and the SRO is my favorite optic for sheer shooting performance.

I haven’t carried the SRO off duty, but a couple of my partners do and they have had no issues. The window will gather skin, lint, hair, and all the other fun stuff we all shed throughout the day (gross), but so does the RMR. My carry gun is a Glock 19MOS with a 1.0 MOA RMR and I have a lens pen in a drawer and I use the brush to clean the window every day or so. My partners do the same with their SROs. We all appendix carry.

While my carry gun has an RMR, it will probably be switched out for a 509T at some point unless something new comes along. My current duty gun has a 509T, and I’ll be setting up a second one with an ACRO once I pick up another. Both of the guns I use the most in training have SROs. One of those was my duty gun for a while before I set up my current one.

Glad you mentioned 509T, as that was my choice initially but I heard some rave reviews of the SRO from a friend so I asked. I imagine it’s a little nicer to use with that big round window and he says the housing just disappears in use but the 509t seems maintenance free and bomb proof.

I get how the 509 would be a little less quick at first with the looking through a longer housing factor. But I like it being a beast. I like the made in USA factor of Trijicon and this being a first dot, the SRO seems from what I hear, easy to learn on.

[psalms144.1]

A good friend of mine just got an SRO mounted on his Roland Special, and it's a FANTASTIC sight to run on the range. That huge window with a fairly thin housing really keeps the focus on the target, where it belongs when shooting an RDS. Having shot quite a bit with other optics, I can say the SRO is the most "shooting friendly" optic I've seen.

On the other hand, I'm not sure the SRO is sturdy enough even for concealed carry. That huge polymer frame doesn't look like it would stand up to much, if any abuse. On the opposite extreme, the 509T looks bullet proof, at the obvious cost of having a lot more metal in your field of view, and a smaller piece of glass to look through.

Were I in the market for a carry optic right now for actual SD or duty use, I'd almost certainly go for the 509T, unless Aimpoint somehow poops an Acro with more reasonable battery life.

[SoCalDep]

The SRO body is not polymer. It’s 7075 aluminum. I have an SRO sitting on my desk at work with a shattered window but with a working and visible dot that remained zeroed after three drops. The 509T housing survived two drops with only a crack in the rear glass but the zero shifted drastically and could no longer be adjusted after the third drop. The DeltaPoint Pro window completely shattered and broke away from the optic on the second drop and zero shifted significantly when I finally found the dot on a small sliver of glass that remained in the bottom right corner of the window.

The best of all the optics we tested (the other department we partnered with tested several others and did so very thoroughly so no reason to redo what they did) was the Old cheap Holosun 407A which survived four drops (the first five foot drop landed just barely with the front sight prior to the optic so we did it again) and is now mounted on another test gun evaluating the durability of aftermarket stainless steel screws.

Our protocol is a drop from three feet directly on the optic, followed by zero confirmation and a “box test” (adjusting 20-30 clicks up, left, down, right to see if it returns to zero). This is then repeated with a four foot and then five foot drop if the optic survives. The test is not pass/fail and meant for comparison and information regarding performance.

[newyork]

So much better looking through the SRO/507/rmr than through an Acro/509T? I keep imagining the closed ones to be like looking through a tunnel. A square one anyway.

[GJM]

So much better looking through the SRO/507/rmr than through an Acro/509T? I keep imagining the closed ones to be like looking through a tunnel. A square one anyway.

You need to figure out whether a closed emitter is important for your use, because SRO to a closed emitter is not an apples to apples comparison.

[newyork]

I’m overthinking as usual. It’d just be ccw, range and hd. I’m a civilian and I hate maintenance lol.

[newyork]

Stopped in the gun store to look at one. Of course they were closing. They were out of Trijicon’s and the 509 but had a 507c X2. Fit and finish looked good. Looked at it for literally 5secs through the glass. No batteries installed so it was on solar power only. Circle dot looked blurry but I think it’s because I threw it up in front of me quick and handed it back.
$320

[SoCalDep]

I have a 507C X2 and I really like it. Like GJM said, you need to decide what your needs are and whether an enclosed emitter is for you. For shooting in competition, or even concealed carry, I’d say an enclosed emitter isn’t really “necessary”. It’s convenient for CCW...I carried my Glock 45 with a 509T for a while after I’d used my G19/RMR for a concealed carry class until I was un-lazy enough to clean it. As for maintaining an optic for CCW, I think the “exposed” emitters are fine and easy to deal with but the 509T warmed my lazy heart being able to just wipe the rear window and go.

On the range, the big window of the SRO is meaningless for marksmanship but comes into its own for fast shooting. The dot is much more likely to stay in the window or track consistently. I’ve heard a lot of people talk about how the dot should stay in the window or you have a bad grip. Ugh....h.....h.....

A bad grip is defined in my world as a gun that moves in the grip. There are better grips and great grips, but if the gun moves in your hands it’s a bad grip. So we need to not have a bad grip. Once that’s been done, then we can look at how much the dot moves. (There are lots of training theory and technique for grip and I won’t go into it here)

So now we have a good grip and as we shoot we see the dot do things. Maybe it rises and falls within the window. That’s awesome. Maybe it tracks straight up and down or up and to the left (very common), leaving the window. That’s totally cool too as long as it does it consistently. If it’s all over the place, not coming back consistently, or you can’t find it in recoil we have a big problem. That needs training or serious introspection and practice.

In my mind the advantage of the SRO is how much you see of the dot. People talk about RMRs and ACROs small windows for “finding” the dot. That’s JV stuff. It’s about seeing what the dot does as you shoot... tracking it... and being confident it will be and do what you want. The SRO gives you that like no other optic, and it helps you diagnose inconsistencies and it accounts for some inconsistencies.

So like I said before, the SRO helps you shoot as well as you can, and it can be a crutch (big window) or a learning tool (big window and diagnosing dot movement).

Then we go into the enclosed emitter thing. It took a while but I’m all about the enclosed emitter for duty use in law enforcement and potentially military (out of my lane). The ability to deal with being exposed in a duty holster (as opposed to CCW), different environmental conditions such as condensational fogging and exposure to water, debris, and that barbecue sauce that spilled from the Carl’s Junior #3, and I think the enclosed emitter is the future of serious law enforcement and military pistol optics.

As I said in the beginning of this post, I don’t think an enclosed emitter is “necessary” for CCW, and that makes what GJM said so true that comparing the SRO to enclosed emitters is apples and oranges until there’s an enclosed emitter SRO.

Look at the benefits and drawbacks of the various optics, coupled with your needs and skill, and I’m confident that what you choose will serve you well.

[newyork]

Thank you! Well written. To me it sounds like the SRO would make for a great 1st dot. Maybe the 507 if my budget can’t arrest him. I don’t get to shoot a lot. Only a couple thousand rounds a year as I work 6 days and have 2 small kids. Begs the question, should I dot at all with that being said?
I have lots of dry fire time at night and some during the day.

Does the rmr tend to lose zero when the battery is changed?

[SoCalDep]

I have lots of dry fire time at night and some during the day.

This is the way.

You can do most of the learning on a dot in dry-fire. It’s a learning curve when you’re used to iron sights, but it’s doable and I think it’s a better way.

1. Focus on the target and not the dot. Let the dot be there but you are LOOKING at the target. Ignore the iron sights.
2. Mistakes and failures are your best learning tools... but they are the devil if you let them become the consistency. Diagnose your failures/mistakes and then slow down and be deliberate to reduce them. Make perfect your consistency and never be satisfied with perfect. Fail often and learn from it.
3. If you don’t find the dot (stealing from Brandon Wright of Wright Shooting and S&W) move the front sight in a consistent, known direction - UP... until you see it, and then bring it down... either the dot will come into view or you can align the iron sights.

[SoCalDep]

Does the rmr tend to lose zero when the battery is changed?

In my experience it holds zero more often than not, but one must confirm it. I noticed when changing the battery on my G19 in late December that the after re-mounting the dot was slightly higher than where it was prior to the battery change and I had to put in a very small elevation adjustment. I’ve had a couple battery changes on an older type-1 RMR where it returned to zero perfectly (never should have sold that gun/optic).

I’m less concerned with the re-zeroing than I am with the potential for the mounted optic to come loose. This potential exists each time the optic is mounted so an optic that doesn’t require re-mounting to change batteries is a huge plus in my book.

[GJM]

A dot is not a budget friendly solution for basic defensive use. They cost money, require back-up guns with another dot, and take many rounds of live fire to do what you can do with iron sights with a fraction of those live fire rounds. However, they allow me to do things I can't do with iron sights, and also transform short sight radius slimline pistols into incredibly capable pistols.

I agree with SoCal that the SRO is certainly the best dot that crosses between defense and competition oriented shooting. For pure competition, I find the Sig Romeo 3 Max and XL to be top of the heap, for slimline pistols I prefer the 507K, and for EDC like the 508T/509T.

[professor]

Thank you! Well written. To me it sounds like the SRO would make for a great 1st dot. Maybe the 507 if my budget can’t arrest him. I don’t get to shoot a lot. Only a couple thousand rounds a year as I work 6 days and have 2 small kids. Begs the question, should I dot at all with that being said?
I have lots of dry fire time at night and some during the day.

Does the rmr tend to lose zero when the battery is changed?

I changed batteries 3 times in a RMR and the zero did not change.

I had problems with a 1st generation RMR and likely had it off 8-10 times and zero was always spot on.

[newyork]

Who is the go to Trijicon dealer?

[GJM]

Who is the go to Trijicon dealer?

The SRO is basically unobtanium lately, so wherever you can find one is where you buy it.

[newyork]

Ok thanks George!

GJM, just found a 1.0, 2.5 and 5 MOA. $503.99.

[newyork]

Does anyone know the proper sights I need (manufacturer and part no if possible) for back up sights on an M&P 2.0 compact milled for the SRO?

[Quantrill]

Does anyone know the proper sights I need (manufacturer and part no if possible) for back up sights on an M&P 2.0 compact milled for the SRO?

I don’t know part numbers but my front is .320 and rear is .394 per Mark Housel when he milled my 4.25”. They are barely visible above my SRO deck.

Hopes this helps

[mmc45414]

Does anyone know the proper sights I need (manufacturer and part no if possible) for back up sights on an M&P 2.0 compact milled for the SRO?
You might call Dawson and chat with them. They have a metric buttload of options and the guy I have dealt with there (Jay, I think) is very knowledgeable and has been very helpful. It took three tries to get the rear sight for my Ruger SR1911 Target, so I sorta got to know Jay...

They also have a deal where they will sent you a second front sight no charge if what they recommended didn't zero for elevation.

[newyork]

Thank you! Just emailed their tech guy a few minutes ago.

[GJM]

I have had terrible luck with the CORE 509T installation and plate from CHPWS. Just came back for the third time, due to the plate coming loose, and this time the plate came loose again after just a few magazines. After three times back to them, I am kind of done with this, and am waiting to hear from them as to a resolution.

[SoCalDep]

I have had terrible luck with the CORE 509T installation and plate from CHPWS. Just came back for the third time, due to the plate coming loose, and this time the plate came loose again after just a few magazines. After three times back to them, I am kind of done with this, and am waiting to hear from them as to a resolution.

I won’t like it, but that sucks. Sorry to hear.

[Adam]

I have had terrible luck with the CORE 509T installation and plate from CHPWS. Just came back for the third time, due to the plate coming loose, and this time the plate came loose again after just a few magazines. After three times back to them, I am kind of done with this, and am waiting to hear from them as to a resolution.

My gosh man, you're getting a real test in patience, other people's errors and auditing customer service. I have been on a pretty good run with that myself. Stay on the gas with CHPWS until they get you taken care of in whatever way you prefer. I mean at this point it has to be a new slide, right? Hang in there George, keep going!

[GJM]

When I removed the 509T, you can see how the screws moved from the witness marks put on by CHPWS.

71473

[OldRunner/CSAT Neighbor]

Slight swerve but can anyone provide sources for in stock 17rd M&P mags?

[Trukinjp13]

I have had terrible luck with the CORE 509T installation and plate from CHPWS. Just came back for the third time, due to the plate coming loose, and this time the plate came loose again after just a few magazines. After three times back to them, I am kind of done with this, and am waiting to hear from them as to a resolution.

Jb weld or loctite er on there...

Seriously though. This is not the first I have heard reports like this. Seems like most end up full circle back to direct mill setups.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[DpdG]

Had an ugly match with my 320/509t using a custom CHPWS plate mounted by them. At first I thought it was me, but this thread made me want to check the plate mounting screws. I knew my shot calling wasn’t perfect, but a number of mikes on tuxedos were called hits....
71612


EDIT- no visible thread locker residue and screw spun out freely. Other screw felt barely more than finger tight.

[GJM]

Those witness marks look familiar. Houston, we have a problem.

[DpdG]

Just waiting on Loctite 248 for the Amazon fairy and I cleaned the threads with acetone. I’m hoping for success following mounting instructions from SoCalDep

[Adam]

Had an ugly match with my 320/509t using a custom CHPWS plate mounted by them. At first I thought it was me, but this thread made me want to check the plate mounting screws. I knew my shot calling wasn’t perfect, but a number of mikes on tuxedos were called hits....
71612


EDIT- no visible thread locker residue and screw spun out freely. Other screw felt barely more than finger tight.

Do you guys think it is their 10 in/lbs torque recommendation and lack of proper thread locker or what? I got their plate for my 4" compact, saw 10 in/lbs and thought "nahhhh".

[DpdG]

I'm guessing all of the above, but honestly I don't know. I'm going to use 248 and 15-20 in-lb and see what happens. Considering it took 5 months for CHPWS to produce/deliver the plate once they had my slide, it isn't going back to them.

[pew_pew]

Hey guys. Handled a 2.0 compact optics ready gun today. Seems nice and I want to try it out. Is it better to get a regular compact and mill it though?

I shoot glocks and know it’s much preferred to mill those but not sure if it’s the same with M&p’ sorry not?

[GJM]

Hey guys. Handled a 2.0 compact optics ready gun today. Seems nice and I want to try it out. Is it better to get a regular compact and mill it though?

I shoot glocks and know it’s much preferred to mill those but not sure if it’s the same with M&p’ sorry not?

The optics ready pistol is less costly to complete and gives you flexibility to switch optics. However I am not in love with the CORE system and the rear BUIS is like a knife.

My favorite Compact was direct milled for the RMR footprint with the rear BUIS in front of the optic.

71898

[Quantrill]

Hey guys. Handled a 2.0 compact optics ready gun today. Seems nice and I want to try it out. Is it better to get a regular compact and mill it though?

I shoot glocks and know it’s much preferred to mill those but not sure if it’s the same with M&p’ sorry not?

I just bought my first CORE, mostly because I wanted to try a DPP which was my first non trijicon dot. It is working fine so far after a few practices & one match. It’s mounted with the Chpws plate.

If doing it all over I’d just mill, slides don’t cost that much and I kind of view them like brake pads.

[pew_pew]

I’m kinda torn. I know milling is the better option. But my dealer has the optics ready compact in stock as well has a 507C that I’d want to put on there. I can walk in there today and have it ready to go for like less than a grand.

Then, if I like it, I could get a regular 2.0 and have it milled. But I like how fast, easy, and cheap I could get set up with an M&p and optic to try out.

And then on a completely different idea I’ve been wanting a Staccato C2 optics ready but wait time is 3-4 months. I know of a retailer with the iron sighted C2 in stock so thought about getting that and then having it milled for the Chambers plate.

[Quantrill]

I’m kinda torn. I know milling is the better option. But my dealer has the optics ready compact in stock as well has a 507C that I’d want to put on there. I can walk in there today and have it ready to go for like less than a grand.

Then, if I like it, I could get a regular 2.0 and have it milled. But I like how fast, easy, and cheap I could get set up with an M&p and optic to try out.

And then on a completely different idea I’ve been wanting a Staccato C2 optics ready but wait time is 3-4 months. I know of a retailer with the iron sighted C2 in stock so thought about getting that and then having it milled for the Chambers plate.

CORE is probably the way for you to go

[Adam]

GJM has a solution been worked out with CHPWS for your 509T work?

[GJM]

GJM has a solution been worked out with CHPWS for your 509T work?

Good timing. Buck from Chip Wiz called me today and said he had my pistol, and the plate was warped. Said he was installing a new proper plate and would test fire it tomorrow. Good response so far.

[Adam]

Good timing. Buck from Chip Wiz called me today and said he had my pistol, and the plate was warped. Said he was installing a new proper plate and would test fire it tomorrow. Good response so far.

Good stuff, hopefully that gets it done! We’re you having to send the whole gun in? Hopefully on their dime!

[GJM]

Good stuff, hopefully that gets it done! We’re you having to send the whole gun in? Hopefully on their dime!

Yes and yes!

[Trukinjp13]

Does anyone have a pic of the factory optics cut in the slide? Is there any sort of recoil bosses for the plate to set in? Or just flat with screw holes in slide.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[SoCalDep]

72885
Does anyone have a pic of the factory optics cut in the slide? Is there any sort of recoil bosses for the plate to set in? Or just flat with screw holes in slide.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

The core uses two raised bosses that mate to circular cuts in the optic plate. Not ideal but when done right I like it better than the MOS. In the pic you may notice the sheared screw still threaded into the hole. That’s what happens when you shoot 1,985 rounds in around 20 minutes, dipping the gun in water when it’s too hot to hold. I don’t recommend doing that.

[Trukinjp13]

72885

The core uses two raised bosses that mate to circular cuts in the optic plate. Not ideal but when done right I like it better than the MOS. In the pic you may notice the sheared screw still threaded into the hole. That’s what happens when you shoot 1,985 rounds in around 20 minutes, dipping the gun in water when it’s too hot to hold. I don’t recommend doing that.

Thank you. That is good that it has lugs. And yikes!


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[wmu12071]

Ok, bringing this one back. Is the CORE system working well for people or has everyone dropped the CORE and moved on? I think I may want a CORE 4" with a thumb safety but I don't want to deal with optics and plates coming loose all the time.

[GJM]

Ok, bringing this one back. Is the CORE system working well for people or has everyone dropped the CORE and moved on? I think I may want a CORE 4" with a thumb safety but I don't want to deal with optics and plates coming loose all the time.

I have shot CORE pistols for 12 months. I had a screw shear on one slide and Smith replaced it. No other failures, excepting the 509T issues which was a Chip Wiz issue. I have been using OEM, Chip Wiz and C More plates.

[wmu12071]

I have shot CORE pistols for 12 months. I had a screw shear on one slide and Smith replaced it. No other failures, excepting the 509T issues which was a Chip Wiz issue. I have been using OEM, Chip Wiz and C More plates.

Thanks for the info.

[Quantrill]

I’ve been shooting a 1.0 core milled to 2.0 dimensions, with a chpws plate and revised DPP since spring. Probably 8 matches and weekly practice. No issues.

[MikeyCNY]

GJM Any updates on your CHPWS 509t plate loosening issues? (too many posts to choose which one to quote)

I had my CH plate come loose on my 2.0 Compact OR (509t) - https://pistol-forum.com/showthread.php?49439-Department-Issue-Authorized-RDS&p=1265954&viewfull=1#post1265954 (I also almost send SoCalDep off the deep end)

I've since removed all screws, soaked in acetone and re-torqued with Loctite 248 Stick; also torqued a little higher (12-13 inch-lbs). This is with their newer 509t plate that just came out last month. Here's a picture from before my first range trip -

77211

(I know I need a thinner marker) When I removed the optic I forgot to look at the witness marks but the left screw was definitely loose. Probably won't get to the range again until early next month - hoping the Loctite fixes the issue.

[GJM]

No update, I haven't shot it in months.

[newyork]

Just to clarify gentlemen;

This is only happening with the 509t on the core with chpws? Is it happening with the rmr/SRO plates too by chpws or are they gtg?

[OldRunner/CSAT Neighbor]

Re. gen2 CHPWS's for SRO's, my 2 have been GTG on two gen2 CORE's w/ 1000+ down range.

[GJM]

Just to clarify gentlemen;

This is only happening with the 509t on the core with chpws? Is it happening with the rmr/SRO plates too by chpws or are they gtg?

Just a 509T issue.

[newyork]

Thank you guys!

[backtrail540]

Maple leaf is now cutting M&P's for the 509t. That makes three to my knowledge - ATEI, Floyd's, and now Maple Leaf doing direct mounts.

https://www.mapleleaffirearms.com/mp509t

[GJM]

Maple leaf is now cutting M&P's for the 509t. That makes three to my knowledge - ATEI, Floyd's, and now Maple Leaf doing direct mounts.

https://www.mapleleaffirearms.com/mp509t

Have they also started doing an Acro cut?

[backtrail540]

Have they also started doing an Acro cut?

Only ATEI, to my knowledge.

[newyork]

Have they also started doing an Acro cut?

Maple won’t do an acro cut on an m&P

[newyork]

I’m currently looking for a 5 moa SRO for my new 5” core. I see none anywhere. I honestly don’t see 1 or 2.5 moa either.
Starting to consider going with an rmr again (compact has a 3.25moa rmr on it) but maybe a 6.5 moa rmr. This gun will be for the range/competition (starting soon)/war belt and if need be as a hD/carry back up to my compact.

Wait for a SRO 5 moa vs getting a currently available and cheaper rmr 6.5moa

[KevH]

I’m currently looking for a 5 moa SRO for my new 5” core. I see none anywhere. I honestly don’t see 1 or 2.5 moa either.
Starting to consider going with an rmr again (compact has a 3.25moa rmr on it) but maybe a 6.5 moa rmr. This gun will be for the range/competition (starting soon)/war belt and if need be as a hD/carry back up to my compact.

Wait for a SRO 5 moa vs getting a currently available and cheaper rmr 6.5moa

I talked to Trijicon on the phone yesterday (I have 2.5 MOA SRO on order through their LE instructor program) and was told they have been having supply chain problems they have almost worked out and that the SRO's will likely have more availability "very soon."

[newyork]

Hmm. Wonder how long. From what I hear it’d be a “better” option for a 5” core mostly range gun. Bigger window etc. impatience makes me want to just grab another rmr but maybe that’s not wise.

[crosseyedshooter]

5.0 MOA in stock here (https://gunzonedeals.com/product/trijicon-2500003-sro3-1x-5-moa-dot-red-cr2032-lithium-1) for $494 plus shipping.
2.5 MOA in stock here (https://www.gunbuyer.com/trijicon-sro-adj-led-2-5-red-d-tri2500002-d.html) for $550 plus shipping.

[newyork]

5.0 MOA in stock here (https://gunzonedeals.com/product/trijicon-2500003-sro3-1x-5-moa-dot-red-cr2032-lithium-1) for $494 plus shipping.
2.5 MOA in stock here (https://www.gunbuyer.com/trijicon-sro-adj-led-2-5-red-d-tri2500002-d.html) for $550 plus shipping.

Thank you!!!

[g4pi09]

What screws are you guys using with holosun 507/508 and factory plastic plates? I’ve currently got it mounted with the holosun screws but there doesn’t t seem to be a lot of thread engagement with them. I also noticed the provided screws that come with the pistol for other optics seem to be quite a bit longer than the holosun screws. Thanks

[GJM]

What screws are you guys using with holosun 507/508 and factory plastic plates? I’ve currently got it mounted with the holosun screws but there doesn’t t seem to be a lot of thread engagement with them. I also noticed the provided screws that come with the pistol for other optics seem to be quite a bit longer than the holosun screws. Thanks

See post #1:

https://pistol-forum.com/showthread.php?45645-Red-dot-screw-part-numbers-and-ordering-info

[g4pi09]

Awesome, thank you!

[backtrail540]

I have one there waiting to be milled for a 509 now. Here are some pictures I saved they have posted. My slide is wearing an Ameriglo set that is basically stock height. There should not be any reason a Dawson rear could not be easily added to being it up a bit higher if needed. But I think I’ll be happy with the height as pictured.


https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20210421/83634b9b880777398771b891925e0d7a.jpg
https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20210421/6d31b58d09ad1ea2848aa38ec43d35a2.jpg
https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20210421/cf5090e3cd5d6b68c758bc50acdf68a5.jpg


A few questions...

Have you got this back and had a chance to run it so as to report some impression of the work? Also, did you have to send your optic in with the slide? I'm getting ready to send one in and have an inquiry in at Floyd's but a little redundancy never hurts.

[professor]

A few questions...

Have you got this back and had a chance to run it so as to report some impression of the work? Also, did you have to send your optic in with the slide? I'm getting ready to send one in and have an inquiry in at Floyd's but a little redundancy never hurts.

I got it back on less than 14 days from the day I shipped it. It runs great. I’ve put a couple of thousand rounds through it. I’m very happy with it. I did not send an optic with it. The only thing that would have been better, is if they had an option to nitride the slide. I just left it unfinished since it is stainless.


https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20211010/564a14e0084e7c39f1f4bc92236c5f5a.jpg



https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20211010/ab56ac0453169941657128c268042713.jpg
https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20211010/79cca03012bf362c95d6dd5a8b8b9c79.jpg

[MikeyCNY]

That looks very sharp with the low-pro sights, compared to the taller sights on my Optics Ready model.

78330

I said on another board, I'm only 300 rounds in, but if I had to do it over again... I'd probably just get a regular 2.0 Compact and have it direct milled, with the rear sight in front of the optic. I like how that looks. Wouldn't have to mess with plates and it be an overall "tighter" package.




I got it back on less than 14 days from the day I shipped it. It runs great. I’ve put a couple of thousand rounds through it. I’m very happy with it. I did not send an optic with it. The only thing that would have been better, is if they had an option to nitride the slide. I just left it unfinished since it is stainless.


https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20211010/564a14e0084e7c39f1f4bc92236c5f5a.jpg



https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20211010/ab56ac0453169941657128c268042713.jpg
https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20211010/79cca03012bf362c95d6dd5a8b8b9c79.jpg

[professor]

That looks very sharp with the low-pro sights, compared to the taller sights on my Optics Ready model.

78330

I said on another board, I'm only 300 rounds in, but if I had to do it over again... I'd probably just get a regular 2.0 Compact and have it direct milled, with the rear sight in front of the optic. I like how that looks. Wouldn't have to mess with plates and it be an overall "tighter" package.

Mine is actually a compact slide one a full size frame. I had an extra compact in the safe. I almost had them put the rear sight in front of the optic. But, I have a few competition guns that I can’t change and I wanted to keep as much commonality as I can across the platforms I shoot often. I still may send another to experiment with the optic to the rear though.

[backtrail540]

I got it back on less than 14 days from the day I shipped it. It runs great. I’ve put a couple of thousand rounds through it. I’m very happy with it. I did not send an optic with it. The only thing that would have been better, is if they had an option to nitride the slide. I just left it unfinished since it is stainless.


https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20211010/564a14e0084e7c39f1f4bc92236c5f5a.jpg



https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20211010/ab56ac0453169941657128c268042713.jpg
https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20211010/79cca03012bf362c95d6dd5a8b8b9c79.jpg

Great, thanks for the info. I heard back from Floyd's and they confirmed the same. Sending in my slide today.

[backtrail540]

Impressed with Floyd's service so far. They received my slide Monday and i received a shipping notice today. If the work is good, i don't see a reason to go elsewhere for m&p work at the moment. I'll report after i get the optic mounted and 1k or so through it

[backtrail540]

I received the slide back from Ffloyds today. Certainly dig the painless mounting via the direct milled crossbolt dot. I hope all dots go this way.

78855

78856

78857

[MD7305]

That's exactly what I'm looking for. Would you mind to post a picture of how those factory sights cowitness through the optic?

[backtrail540]

That's exactly what I'm looking for. Would you mind to post a picture of how those factory sights cowitness through the optic?

Best I've got at hand. If i remember I'll grab one in better light at the range.

78865

[GJM]

79954

[backtrail540]

Referencing the end result in trigger travel in the chart above, does anyone know the trigger travel/pre travel distances for other popular striker guns for comparison? ie glock, walther, vp9 et al?

[Bergeron]

I apologize if I missed this, but are any shops modifying CORE slides into direct-mill 509T, or is a CHPWS plate the solution?

[backtrail540]

p/CWnvcUML3r9

Now with flat triggers! :cool:

[newyork]

p/CWnvcUML3r9

Now with flat triggers! :cool:

Wish I could buy one right now. The acro milled one is super tempting too.

[rca90gsx]

Now to find the 4.25" CORE in stock!



Wish I could buy one right now. The acro milled one is super tempting too.

[HCM]

Now to find the 4.25" CORE in stock!

Read the actual announcement from S&W. They didn’t just switch triggers. Going forward the CORE will be the standard configuration.

[rca90gsx]

Either way, i've just been wanting a 4.25 optic ready option lol, so i'm happy with that, as i'm sure some will still prefer irons only



Read the actual announcement from S&W. They didn’t just switch triggers. Going forward the CORE will be the standard configuration.

[OldRunner/CSAT Neighbor]

Read the actual announcement from S&W. They didn’t just switch triggers. Going forward the CORE will be the standard configuration.

Good to hear & after picking up two 4.25” gen 2 CORE’s this yr. & dropping APEX’s in them I’ll X that mod off my to do list next time.

[hfrog355]

I just bought my first CORE, mostly because I wanted to try a DPP which was my first non trijicon dot. It is working fine so far after a few practices & one match. It’s mounted with the Chpws plate.

If doing it all over I’d just mill, slides don’t cost that much and I kind of view them like brake pads.

The only place I know of to find OEM S&W slides is Ed Brown (Currently on sale for $199, so think I'm gonna grab one just cause). Where are you sourcing slides?

[hfrog355]

Maple won’t do an acro cut on an m&P

Curious if you remember why.

[newyork]

Think it had to do with how deep it had to be milled

[Quantrill]

The only place I know of to find OEM S&W slides is Ed Brown (Currently on sale for $199, so think I'm gonna grab one just cause). Where are you sourcing slides?

I bought 2 5” slides at speed shooter specialties for $165 ea, a 4.25” at Midwest Gun works for $140, and another at Midway for $200. I just kept an eye out and bought them when I saw them. Speed Shooters is out of business now I think.

[hfrog355]

I bought 2 5” slides at speed shooter specialties for $165 ea, a 4.25” at Midwest Gun works for $140, and another at Midway for $200. I just kept an eye out and bought them when I saw them. Speed Shooters is out of business now I think.

Yeah, I was waiting for SS to restock some of their guide rods and I think the company folded.

Looks like everything is OOS now. Picking up an extra from EB makes sense given that they're not readily available.

Thanks

[Gray01]

I have a 507C X2 and I really like it. Like GJM said, you need to decide what your needs are and whether an enclosed emitter is for you. For shooting in competition, or even concealed carry, I’d say an enclosed emitter isn’t really “necessary”. It’s convenient for CCW...I carried my Glock 45 with a 509T for a while after I’d used my G19/RMR for a concealed carry class until I was un-lazy enough to clean it. As for maintaining an optic for CCW, I think the “exposed” emitters are fine and easy to deal with but the 509T warmed my lazy heart being able to just wipe the rear window and go.

On the range, the big window of the SRO is meaningless for marksmanship but comes into its own for fast shooting. The dot is much more likely to stay in the window or track consistently. I’ve heard a lot of people talk about how the dot should stay in the window or you have a bad grip. Ugh....h.....h.....

A bad grip is defined in my world as a gun that moves in the grip. There are better grips and great grips, but if the gun moves in your hands it’s a bad grip. So we need to not have a bad grip. Once that’s been done, then we can look at how much the dot moves. (There are lots of training theory and technique for grip and I won’t go into it here)

So now we have a good grip and as we shoot we see the dot do things. Maybe it rises and falls within the window. That’s awesome. Maybe it tracks straight up and down or up and to the left (very common), leaving the window. That’s totally cool too as long as it does it consistently. If it’s all over the place, not coming back consistently, or you can’t find it in recoil we have a big problem. That needs training or serious introspection and practice.

In my mind the advantage of the SRO is how much you see of the dot. People talk about RMRs and ACROs small windows for “finding” the dot. That’s JV stuff. It’s about seeing what the dot does as you shoot... tracking it... and being confident it will be and do what you want. The SRO gives you that like no other optic, and it helps you diagnose inconsistencies and it accounts for some inconsistencies.

So like I said before, the SRO helps you shoot as well as you can, and it can be a crutch (big window) or a learning tool (big window and diagnosing dot movement).

Then we go into the enclosed emitter thing. It took a while but I’m all about the enclosed emitter for duty use in law enforcement and potentially military (out of my lane). The ability to deal with being exposed in a duty holster (as opposed to CCW), different environmental conditions such as condensational fogging and exposure to water, debris, and that barbecue sauce that spilled from the Carl’s Junior #3, and I think the enclosed emitter is the future of serious law enforcement and military pistol optics.

As I said in the beginning of this post, I don’t think an enclosed emitter is “necessary” for CCW, and that makes what GJM said so true that comparing the SRO to enclosed emitters is apples and oranges until there’s an enclosed emitter SRO.

Look at the benefits and drawbacks of the various optics, coupled with your needs and skill, and I’m confident that what you choose will serve you well.

Does the presence of the ACCS-Vulcan reticle modify your opinion of a RDO for red dot novices?

[SoCalDep]

Does the presence of the ACCS-Vulcan reticle modify your opinion of a RDO for red dot novices?

Not really. The two people I know who have used them ended up turning the circle off after a little while. In the very minimal amount of shooting I did with one both the circle and the chevron reticle seemed distracting. Most people I know who go with the standard Holosun circle-dot (32MOA circle/2MOA dot) end up turning the circle off as well.

I like dots and I like the 8MOA 407CO ring (with corrected vision). I've also had good results with the Holosun circle-only reticle, especially to mitigate glare, but shooting one-handed it was way to busy in movement.

As to directly answering what you asked regarding novices, I think reticle training wheels may help in the beginning, but encourage a "visual" presentation rather than a kinesthetic presentation. I want my vision on the target/threat - not trying to find a reticle or a map to where the reticle is (the ACSS).

[Gray01]

Thank you sir.

I am breaking into this genre of optics as a septuagenarian former military (RVN) and (long retired) 32 year LEO. I am familiar with rifle/carbine mounted RDO's, starting with the Armson OEG all the way to current products.

I recently acquired the S&W M&P 9 M2.0 Compact 13568 after using Glocks since about 1984-85. (1st Gen Austrians). I will probably go to a Holosun 507 variant, and the 99.9% use will be CCW.

I am thankful for the erudition and body of knowledge that you and others provide on this forum.

[GJM]

As to directly answering what you asked regarding novices, I think reticle training wheels may help in the beginning, but encourage a "visual" presentation rather than a kinesthetic presentation. I want my vision on the target/threat - not trying to find a reticle or a map to where the reticle is (the ACSS).

This is 180 degrees from a press out, where you try to get the sights/dot into your vision as early as possible, and drive the dot to the target. You are advocating looking at a spot on the target, and using your index to present the pistol, at which point the dot appears on the spot on the target.

[SoCalDep]

This is 180 degrees from a press out, where you try to get the sights/dot into your vision as early as possible, and drive the dot to the target. You are advocating looking at a spot on the target, and using your index to present the pistol, at which point the dot appears on the spot on the target.

Absolutely. I know a lot of people advocate the press-out, but it's unnecessary with good technique and it encourages a gun/dot focus and not a target focus. It's not "horrible" or "wrong", but I'm not a fan.

You've described what I advocate probably better than I can.

[Gray01]

It is readily apparent that both of you are emblematic of the development of this system that has gone from a potential to ubiquity in a about a 5 year time frame.

Thanks again for the subject matter expertise.

[SoCalDep]

Thank you sir.

I am breaking into this genre of optics as a septuagenarian former military (RVN) and (long retired) 32 year LEO. I am familiar with rifle/carbine mounted RDO's, starting with the Armson OEG all the way to current products.

I recently acquired the S&W M&P 9 M2.0 Compact 13568 after using Glocks since about 1984-85. (1st Gen Austrians). I will probably go to a Holosun 507 variant, and the 99.9% use will be CCW.

I am thankful for the erudition and body of knowledge that you and others provide on this forum.

I am impressed when I have to look up at least three words in your last two posts. The 507 of whatever flavor you choose will serve you well.