Curious about a couple points re Gold Dot and Ranger ammo

[jd950]

Just a couple of questions for those who might know:

1. Standard velocity 124gr 9mm Gold Dot is not on "the list." My assumption is/has been that it simply hasn't been tested due to the popularity of the +p version for agency use. Is my assumption correct or is there some other reason? (I feel like I saw something about this once, but I tried a search and failed to find the answer)

2. I have read many times about the QC problems with Winchester handgun ammo, or at least LE ammo. Is/was that reputation deserved and have things changed recently or is it still suspect? Most of the comments I have seen about this are from a few years back and/or involved the "Z" ammo that is periodically available.

Just curious.

[blues]

Just a couple of questions for those who might know:

1. Standard velocity 124gr 9mm Gold Dot is not on "the list." My assumption is/has been that it simply hasn't been tested due to the popularity of the +p version for agency use. Is my assumption correct or is there some other reason? (I feel like I saw something about this once, but I tried a search and failed to find the answer)

2. I have read many times about the QC problems with Winchester handgun ammo, or at least LE ammo. Is/was that reputation deserved and have things changed recently or is it still suspect? Most of the comments I have seen about this are from a few years back and/or involved the "Z" ammo that is periodically available.

Just curious.

I conferred with Doc Roberts via PM specifically about the standard pressure 124 grain Gold Dots a year or two back and he pronounced them good to go. Good enough for me.

Re: Winchester...I do carry the Winchester Ranger RA38B in my J frame. I have not had any issues out of the case I have...and have seen none of the issues which were brought up in regard to them. I can't speak for their 9mm ammo.

[RJ]

I conferred with Doc Roberts via PM specifically about the standard pressure 124 grain Gold Dots a year or two back and he pronounced them good to go. Good enough for me.



I have a memory of a post here by Doc, to the effect that the standard GD is good, but the +p is more gooder, hence why the +p is on the list.

Edit - The +p is 1,220 fps and the regular is 1,150.

https://www.speer.com/compare?pid0=19-23618GD&pid1=19-23617GD&cgid=gold-dot&backUrl=

[blues]

I have a memory of a post here by Doc, to the effect that the standard GD is good, but the +p is more gooder, hence why the +p is on the list.

Edit - The +p is 1,220 fps and the regular is 1,150.

https://www.speer.com/compare?pid0=19-23618GD&pid1=19-23617GD&cgid=gold-dot&backUrl=


Both the standard pressure 124 gr GD and HST work fine.

https://pistol-forum.com/showthread.php?11626-9mm-ammo-147gr-Gold-Dot-vs-HST&p=291086#post291086


Prdator--much like with the 124 gr GD, both the standard pressure and +P 124 gr HST work, the +P is a just a bit better for LE duty use and neither are as good as the 147 gr HST. And before you ask, the 147 gr +P HST is not quite as ideal as the standard pressure 147 gr HST.

https://pistol-forum.com/showthread.php?20650-9-mm-147-gr-duty-load-testing&p=456624#post456624

[jd950]

https://pistol-forum.com/showthread.php?11626-9mm-ammo-147gr-Gold-Dot-vs-HST&p=291086#post291086



https://pistol-forum.com/showthread.php?20650-9-mm-147-gr-duty-load-testing&p=456624#post456624

My search skills clearly need improvement...

[blues]

My search skills clearly need improvement...

Nah. I had bookmarked Doc GKR's comments in the thread because at the time I was researching what rounds I wanted to test and carry for defensive use in my Glocks.

[jd950]

Nah. I had bookmarked Doc GKR's comments in the thread because at the time I was researching what rounds I wanted to test and carry for defensive use in my Glocks.

That helps, but I still should have found it.

I remain a 147gr devotee, but like to keep informed. My son just graduated from the academy and his agency issues 124+p ranger, and we were talking ammo and that sparked my curiosity about a few things.

[blues]

That helps, but I still should have found it.

I remain a 147gr devotee, but like to keep informed. My son just graduated from the academy and his agency issues 124+p ranger, and we were talking ammo and that sparked my curiosity about a few things.

Congratulations to both you and your son. I hope he has a great career.

[jd950]

Congratulations to both you and your son. I hope he has a great career.

Thank you. I have mixed emotions, especially now. Still, I am proud and on the one hand feel he is an idiot for doing this now, and on the other hand respect his commitment.

I was given the honor of pinning on his badge on him at the graduation. Sort of a "blue bloods" moment.

[deputyG23]

We have issued Ranger T and its SXT predecessor for the last thirty years pretty much constantly except for a cost cutting fling with low tech Remington Express ammo for duty use during the Great Recession.
I am not aware of any failures to fire or defective rounds reported.
This has been .40 since 1994. No shootings to report since our last OIS was in 1980.

[Beat Trash]

We’ve issued Ranger T 147 gr 9mm sine 2011. No issues noted and works as designed during OIS incidents.

[Duelist]

I became a 124 grain standard pressure Gold Dot devotee many years ago, and though my G26 is currently loaded exclusively with 147gr HST, I would go back to carrying the 124gr Gold Dot tomorrow without a second thought.

I shot a car-crippled deer with it from a 3" barreled pocket pistol. It was on the side of the road, right after a deer season in which I lost the deer I shot twice with a .50 muzzleloader. The cripple dropped instantly, and convinced me thoroughly that (1) hitting the right spot counts for more than anything, and (2) the Gold Dot works.

Anecdote is anecdote, but it puts info in your own hands.

As a service round, I defer to DocGKR, who I remember stating it was an acceptable load.

[RJ]

Edit - The +p is 1,220 fps and the regular is 1,150.



Just a subjective observation: I shot a Mag of my newly arrived shipment of +p 124 GD yesterday through my P365XL. I have been using 147 HST mostly lately. That +p sure does pop right smartly. I don’t recall the standard pressure 124 GD feeling quite that way. Probably just me, but the small increase in velocity might be underestimating the perceived recoil of the +p.

[Robert Mitchum]

We’ve issued Ranger T 147 gr 9mm sine 2011. No issues noted and works as designed during OIS incidents.

I have 500 Rounds of it and can get it at a good price.
Good to know that it's GTG !

[Wondering Beard]

Just a subjective observation: I shot a Mag of my newly arrived shipment of +p 124 GD yesterday through my P365XL. I have been using 147 HST mostly lately. That +p sure does pop right smartly. I don’t recall the standard pressure 124 GD feeling quite that way. Probably just me, but the small increase in velocity might be underestimating the perceived recoil of the +p.

It's a personal fit thing, plus the lighter gun can make some small differences stand out more.

For me, out of Glocks (including the G26), in order of felt recoil from high to low: 124gr +P HST, then 147gr HST, 124gr +P GS and 124gr+P GD (recoil the same), then 147gr GD, 147gr GS and M882 124gr FMJ recoil the same, then 124gr FMJ AE and Lawman recoil the same, then any 115gr regular pressure. I haven't shot 115gr +P+ HPs or Winchester 127gr +P+ in a real long time, so I can't compare them.

The difference between all them isn't much at all, but for some reason the 124gr +P HSTs really stand out for me recoil, flash and noise wise.

[JBP55]

The 124gr. AE has approximately 11% more energy and 5% more velocity than 124gr. LM.