12ga Slug Damage

[Bob Hostetter]

12 ga Winchester full power slug fired at 10 feet into one of our personal soft ballistic shields. Slug was fully contained in the panel. It would have probably hurt but you would have walked away without the soft tissue and related injury's associated with standard body armor. During the same test session we also fired Winchester 127 +P+ 9mm, 180gr Gold Dot 40cal, Winchester 230gr +P Ranger 45acp, and the new 5.7 round, none of which defeated the panel. Just thought I would share. http://i64.photobucket.com/albums/h198/BobHostetter/MasMAG80PHXClass060.jpg

[TGS]

Bob,

What panel is it?

What 5.7 round did you test? There's a huge difference in AP capabilities between the various 5.7 rounds. I've personally witnessed a Level II vest stop 197SR on the last two layers, whereas SS192 zipped through 48 layers of the same vest (vest folded over onto fresh patches). And that's not even getting into the rounds that are actually purposed to penetrate body armor (this vest was also shot with various legacy rounds and performed to NIJ specs, so it wasn't a junker). I also witnessed some ballistic tiles (not sure the name/material, something similar feeling to fiberglass) get shot with SS192 and 197SR...the 1/2" tile was supposedly rated up to .44 Mag and stopped 197SR, but 192 zipped right through the 9/16" tile. Not trying to start a 5.7 argument, just pointing out that even within the sporting rounds there's HUGE variations in the AP capability, so it's important to note which round was fired.

[Bob Hostetter]

It's a panel that we market thru Trolgar, Inc based in Riverside California. Sorry not sure which 5.7 round was used,we test fired it after the rest of the testing was done just to see the result. All I know is that it was a JHP design.

[DocGKR]

It would help to know what the armor panel was made of (ie. Kevlar, Twaron, Dyneema, Goldflex, etc...) as well as what test protocol was being used (NIJ 0101.06, FBI, DEA, mil, etc...).

[GJM]

I would love to see a Brenneke Classic Magnum tested as well. If you have the opportunity to test it, I would be happy to send you a few.

[Bob Hostetter]

The offical testing was performed by "White Labs" in accordance with NIJ standards and the shield was awarded a IIIA rating. The material is a HSHM-PE and while I will need to double check with the engineers I believe it is marketed under the name "Dyneema". The picture is from an informal test session at the end of a recent class where the students wanted to actually test their personal ammo against the shield. The shield was draped over a wooden frame/barricade and was shot from 10 feet. The picture was/is offered only from the perpective on being interesting and not to imply some unspoken claim.

[45lefty]

Bob,

What panel is it?

What 5.7 round did you test? There's a huge difference in AP capabilities between the various 5.7 rounds. I've personally witnessed a Level II vest stop 197SR on the last two layers, whereas SS192 zipped through 48 layers of the same vest (vest folded over onto fresh patches). And that's not even getting into the rounds that are actually purposed to penetrate body armor (this vest was also shot with various legacy rounds and performed to NIJ specs, so it wasn't a junker). I also witnessed some ballistic tiles (not sure the name/material, something similar feeling to fiberglass) get shot with SS192 and 197SR...the 1/2" tile was supposedly rated up to .44 Mag and stopped 197SR, but 192 zipped right through the 9/16" tile. Not trying to start a 5.7 argument, just pointing out that even within the sporting rounds there's HUGE variations in the AP capability, so it's important to note which round was fired.

the 5.7 ap round is restricted for military use only. us civilians can only use the ss197sr round.

[Wes Peart]

the 5.7 ap round is restricted for military use only. us civilians can only use the ss197sr round.

SS192 and the other early imported variations are perfectly legal (except for SS190), FN just voluntarily stopped importing them as a matter of policy. If you have the cash you can buy all the SS192 you want on gunbroker...

[TGS]

the 5.7 ap round is restricted for military use only. us civilians can only use the ss197sr round.

Actually, there's a few rounds besides SS197sr that you can buy.

I never said anything about SS190 in my post being available to civilians, anyway. Actually, I didn't even write SS190 in my post at all, so I'm not sure what you're trying to address. I spoke only to the AP capabilities of the civilian rounds.