Your current choice for rifle, zero magnification red dot?

[fatdog]

I am a fan of LPVO's on rifles, love my Steiner and my Accupoint, but I don't plan to run one on my registered SBR. My current military grade red dots are somewhat aged. and a couple of generations behind I suspect, all Aimpoint Comp C, M, or ML2 in 15+ year old GG&G mounts.

I have a Sig Romeo 5 and a comparable Vortex unit. Those are bright, clear, and I love the "wake up" feature on that Romeo 5. However those currently live on uppers I consider range toys. I am not sure how durable/reliable those scopes really are, although that distrust may not be justified.

Just seeking opinions here. If you were to go out and buy a "serious" non-magnified 4 moa or 2 moa red dot for a registered 11.5 AR SBR (e.g. Colt 6933) what would your first choice be today and why?

thanks

[TCB]

I’ve been using the Aimpoint micros for quite a while. Can’t get any more simple, put dot on thing, press trigger, no extraneous visual information. The H-1 on my work gun has been abused for the last 6 years daily, is beat to crap and works just fine. If you will be carrying your rifle from daylight to nighttime conditions or vice versa managing the dots brightness is much easier than with optics that use push button brightness settings. I use 10 for daylight and 8 for after dark with a 1500 WML, I can just reach over with the rifle still racked and move the brightness knob 2 clicks when it starts getting dark. Between the 2 & 4 MOA dots on my personal T-1s I prefer the 2 as it is a little cleaner to my eyes and gives a finer aiming point for distance and cleans up better for me when I use my 3x. I have found that during days with full value sunlight here in AZ I sometimes put the 2moa dot on 11 for close in targets but 10 works just fine. I hear the T-2 has some upgrades over the T-1 but to my eyes they look the same...YRMV

[GJM]

An Aimpoint Micro and a SBR/AR pistol go together like a Bozone Amber and .... well, almost anything.

[CleverNickname]

I recently bought new optics for a couple of my rifles, and I chose the Aimpoint Pro in a Scalarworks LEAP/02 mount. Scalarworks bundles their mounts with Aimpoint Pros for a pretty decent price, considering the mount alone is $200, MSRP on the Aimpoint is $495, but you get the mount and Aimpoint for $520.

https://scalarworks.com/shop/quick-detach-mounts/leap-02/

The mount is pretty lightweight, and has the best attachment method of all the Aimpoint mounts I've used (ADM, Larue, Aimpoint factory, and GG&G).

I like the larger window on the Aimpoint Pro vs the T1/T2, but you really can't go wrong with either one.

[Shades]

I have Aimpoint H-1/4MOAs on both of my 6920s. I have an Aimpoint PRO on a 16" .300 BLK carbine. I'm just a guy, no professional responsibilities involving guns. I like the compactness and light weight of the Micros and I think that would be even more advantageous on an SBR. I prefer the 4MOA dot, as I find it easily visible even with the brightness reduced to 7-8 in full daylight. The PRO is a nice sight, but if I had to choose one, it'd be the Micro. I change batteries every 2 years, but I've never had a battery die.

[dontshakepandas]

Aimpoint Comp M5 on a Unity Tactical mount.

[Guerrero]

I'm really interested in the Shield Sights SIS (https://www.shieldpsd.com/portfolio-posts/switchable-interface-sight) (Brownell's has it (https://www.brownells.com/optics-mounting/electronic-sights/red-dot-sights/sis-center-dot-red-dot-sight-prod82465.aspx))

Maple Syrup Actual did a torture test of it, and had good things to say

[STI]

My vote here and in real life is a CompM5. Printed a 2.5moa 5 round group at 200yd with 11.5 Sionics barrel and factory 64 Gold Dot loads

[Clusterfrack]

Trijicon MRO on a Geissele mount.

https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20200701/366db9c2896faa2eecc3aa38ee203607.jpg

[rob_s]

Unless I'm specifically trying to shave weight, I still like the larger tube of the 30mm Aimpoints. It helps that I dont have to then pay the $700+ for a "micro".

Aimpoint PRO Red Dot Reflex Sight with QRP2 Mount and Spacer - 2 MOA - 12841 - $445 (https://www.amazon.com/Aimpoint-PRO-Patrol-Rifle-Optic/dp/B007GDR0I4)

[blues]

Aimpoint Micro H2, 2 MOA, 100 yard zero

[texasaggie2005]

2moa MRO on a Geissele 1.93", 100yds zero with 64gr Fusion.

https://i.imgur.com/TSfY14u.jpg

[BWT]

Aimpoint Micro H2, 2 MOA, 100 yard zero

Same.

Mines in a scalar works mount.

I went from a Comp ML3 in a Bobro mount to this. It’s light weight and works great. Also, does well with my astigmatism.

[blues]

Same.

Mines in a scalar works mount.

I went from a Comp ML3 in a Bobro mount to this. It’s light weight and works great. Also, does well with my astigmatism.

Mine as well. I get a bit of starburst effect but it doesn't hurt anything.

[Gater]

Saving myself some money by passing this on to you suckers instead of acting on it myself:

SKD Tactical is running a 15% off special for the 4th TODAY. I'm guessing it is only on in-stock stuff, and they are out of stock on the Aimpoint Micro T-2 and the PRO (I got mine from them on a similar sale a couple years ago). They do have at least one of the H-2 2 MOA Micros (without a mount) in stock. I put one in a cart and it comes out to $622.20 pre-tax/shipping. Their flat rate shipping a very reasonable $5.

https://www.skdtac.com/

ETA: They also have Comp M5 in stock--$746 after discount.

[SeriousStudent]

If Aimpoint is a possibility, then Aimpoint is the answer.

Are you going to run a magnifier behind the RDS? If so, I'd pick the T-2 all day long. If not, a Pro runs great. I really like the Midwest Industries mount for it. Scalar is also great, but I like the cost efficiency of the MI.

I have three H-1's on shotguns, three Pro's on carbines, and another pair of T-1's on AR pistols.

And an ACRO on a G45 pistol that is on Lend-Lease to my favorite knifemaker.

You may want to seek out Wayne Dobbs - he's sorta familiar with Aimpoint optics.

[opmike]

For a basic bitch red dot, I see absolutely no reason to get anything other than an Aimpoint. It's a no nonsense optic with an unrivaled track record. Personally, I like the larger tubes, and picked up a LNIB M4s on eBay for about the price of a PRO.

My degrading vision has me eyeing EOTechs, however, as they don't give me the diffraction spikes/startburst of LED based optics.

[cornstalker]

Trijicon MRO here.

[TGS]

Aimpoint Comp H-2 or CompM5s...if you want cheaper and size isn't an issue, the Aimpoint PRO.

I see no reason to buy new literally anything else on the market.

[OlongJohnson]

Spent some time this weekend playing around with a few different prism scopes, a traditional 1x muzzle loader scope, and an Aimpoint H1.

I do get a bit of starburst with the dot, enough to be annoying, but the view through the Aimpoint is a crystal clear 1x and it provides a perfectly clear target view with both eyes open. With target focus, the starburst is small enough to still provide a good aiming point.

The scopes all worked great, with nice, clear reticles when I closed the eye that was not aligned with them. However, I also had issues with lack of clarity to varying degrees with all of them when using both eyes open. The muzzle loader 1x is pretty darn close to a true 1x if it isn't actually 1x. Just holding it and moving it into my field of view, it seemed to be the best. The prism scopes are all <1x, which creates enough difference in the images between the eye looking through them and the other eye that I end up with two fairly distinct images of the target side by side when my brain aligns the scenes outside the objective view. Right eye is dominant. In general, the reticle would be aligned correctly with the image on the right, but occasionally, I found I had aligned it with the image on the left, which meant it was set up for a bad miss. If I worked on it, I could have varying degrees of success getting the images to merge at the aiming point, but then the reticle was no longer clear. The same was true with the muzzle loader scope, although less severe, once I rotated them all onto a firearm and tried them from a target acquisition position.

The worst of the prisms was the Bushnell BT71XPS LIL P 1X. https://www.bushnell.com/red-dots/tac-optics/lil-p-1x-prism-tac-optics-red-dot-sight/BU-BT71XPS.html
That was disappointing, as I've thought for several years that it would be good for someone to make an Aimpoint Micro-ish-sized prism scope. Bushnell did just that, so I had to try it, but in reality, the Aimpoint smokes it even with my level of astigmatism.

I still need to do a lot more work, but I think where it's heading is Aimpoint when the capability of both eyes open is desired, as a situation where stuff can be happening fast and close may be expected. And keep the scope-type optics for times when the limited field of view and reduced speed of closing an eye is more acceptable. In which case, an LPVO may be significantly preferable to a <1x prism scope, in spite of the larger size.

[mmc45414]

I have a couple EOTECH 516s, a discontinued model that takes two CR123s. I have always really liked the reticle and always thought the auto shutdown hate was a bit over rated, but I have been getting back into more organized competition and last month shot 3gun for the first time and laying in a case on a bench waiting on the next stage was long enough for the damn thing to shut off. I have a couple of Romeo5s (that shake awake) and have started to think my love for the big red donut was maybe over rated, and maybe the single dot is just fine. And after using the SIG on a couple of guns the EOTECH starts to look kinda clunky, even if that is just perception. But damn the H-2 is ~$750, and the PRO takes a battery that nothing else I am going to have takes.

I am glad I caught this thread because I was overlooking the MRO until:

Trijicon MRO on a Geissele mount.

2moa MRO on a Geissele 1.93"

Trijicon MRO here.
So I know everyone loves the Aimpoint Micros, but is there a downside to the MRO? Part of what I like about my EOTECH is they run on the same batteries as all of the flashlights I have (including some that might be mounted on the gun) but at this point the 2032s are common enough also.


It helps that I don't have to then pay the $700+ for a "micro".
And yeah, an MRO without mount being $420 and a H-2 being $732 without mount is part of why I am asking.

I also like the notion that the dial is more accessible to my off hand. It is not as svelte as the H-2, but not as portly as what I am used to.

[texasaggie2005]

So I know everyone loves the Aimpoint Micros, but is there a downside to the MRO?

Some people will bring up the supposed fisheye / magnification issues, but I haven't found those to be any hindrance in my uses. Having previously owned an H1, T2, CompM5, pre-89k MROs and now two newer MRO's, I don't see a major downside of the MRO. It's 95% of the T2 for 50% the cost.

[ST911]

I won't upgrade a T1 to a T2, not enough gain.
New buys: T2, if not an LPV.
I'd upgrade a M2/M3/PRO to a T1 or T2, but usually those just get put on lesser used guns.
T1/T2 has an H1/H2 companion if you want to save ~$50.
Nothing against the M5, just haven't gotten there in a meaningful way yet and I like the smaller T2. M5S is available.

[dontshakepandas]

So I know everyone loves the Aimpoint Micros, but is there a downside to the MRO? Part of what I like about my EOTECH is they run on the same batteries as all of the flashlights I have (including some that might be mounted on the gun) but at this point the 2032s are common enough also.

In my opinion, the only real downside to the MRO at this point is the increase in parallax compared to the Aimpoint Micros. I'm not sure if it is because of the larger objective lens or something specific to the internals of that optic, but the difference is pretty significant in the video Aaron Cowan did.


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TUBcewtUBpQ

Depending on your intended use, that may not matter to you at all though. I have an MRO on my CZ Scorpion where the parallax isn't as much of a concern to me, but still run Aimpoints on anything I may shoot further than 50 yards.

[Wake27]

I still prefer the EXPS dots. I have one Aimpoint on the HD gun but have no plans to buy another since they’re overpriced AF. A new T2 or COMP M5 is almost as much as a used Razor 1-6. That’s ridiculous for something that’s just one red dot.


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[Clusterfrack]

In my opinion, the only real downside to the MRO at this point is the increase in parallax compared to the Aimpoint Micros. I'm not sure if it is because of the larger objective lens or something specific to the internals of that optic, but the difference is pretty significant in the video Aaron Cowan did.
Depending on your intended use, that may not matter to you at all though. I have an MRO on my CZ Scorpion where the parallax isn't as much of a concern to me, but still run Aimpoints on anything I may shoot further than 50 yards.

I've run my MROs on very "practical" courses with A-zone sized steel at ranges out to 300 yds. I don't think the parallax is a significant concern, and suspect that the difference is mainly in the larger objective. I prefer the MRO to the Aimpoint T1. The T2 is really nice—noticeably better optics, and I’d like to have one at some point.

[PearTree]

I have an h2 because of the LE discount. If that wasn’t available I would have no problems running an mro. They seem to be durable from secondhand accounts and have a larger window if that matters.

[TGS]

Spent some time this weekend playing around with a few different prism scopes, a traditional 1x muzzle loader scope, and an Aimpoint H1.

I do get a bit of starburst with the dot, enough to be annoying, but the view through the Aimpoint is a crystal clear 1x and it provides a perfectly clear target view with both eyes open. With target focus, the starburst is small enough to still provide a good aiming point.


Check out the 2nd generation Micros (H-2, T-2, CompM5) if you're buying "fresh". While the juice might not be worth the squeeze to upgrade for someone who already owns a T-1/H-1, the 2nd gen micros have better red dot clarity for astigmatism. Some people get a pretty good improvement in red dot clarity over the older Aimpoints.


Part of what I like about my EOTECH is they run on the same batteries as all of the flashlights I have (including some that might be mounted on the gun) but at this point the 2032s are common enough also.

Keep in mind that unlike the Eotech and its shit battery life, the battery life of the Aimpoint means that battery commonality isn't an issue to begin with since you only need to change them once every few years.

[Darth_Uno]

I have 4 MRO’s, so that tells you how I feel. If you liked Eotechs, you can get the MRO with a circle/dot reticle.


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[Kram]

I needed another RDS for a rifle and purchased the Scalarworks Pro combo. I couldn't be happier. I prefer the larger window and the Pro has the best looking dot for my eyes. The Scalarworks mount is awesome and a huge improvement over the factory mount. Only negative is the oddball battery but I found and added a factory extended battery cap to keep me covered for years.

[Wake27]

Check out the 2nd generation Micros (H-2, T-2, CompM5) if you're buying "fresh". While the juice might not be worth the squeeze to upgrade for someone who already owns a T-1/H-1, the 2nd gen micros have better red dot clarity for astigmatism. Some people get a pretty good improvement in red dot clarity over the older Aimpoints.



Keep in mind that unlike the Eotech and its shit battery life, the battery life of the Aimpoint means that battery commonality isn't an issue to begin with since you only need to change them once every few years.

I honestly believe Aimpoint’s battery life thing is one of the most overhyped selling points in the gun industry. The brightness that nets the magical 50k hour battery life is barely useable in daylight or when using a light. Everyone loves WMLs with all the lumens but my 500 lumen scout light almost washes out that dot and every higher setting drastically reduces the battery life. The ideal brightness for all around use gives me something like a seven month battery life IIRC. I’ve picked up more dead Aimpoints than any other optics. Plus there are $150 optics that now match the battery life so it’s not even like they’re the only game in town anymore.


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[blues]

I'm not on patrol, but I'm in the fourth year of use on my H2's battery...(I wanted to see how long it will go), and I have an 800 lumen light on my rifle and can see the dot with the light and outdoors. I want to say I have it set around 6 or 7 but I'd have to check to be sure. No higher.

[SeriousStudent]

I'm not on patrol, but I'm in the fourth year of use on my H2's battery...(I wanted to see how long it will go), and I have an 800 lumen light on my rifle and can see the dot with the light and outdoors. I want to say I have it set around 6 or 7 but I'd have to check to be sure. No higher.

I have a habit of changing every single battery in the house on New Year's Day. Smoke detectors, CO2 detectors, weapon lights, RDS, optics, rangefinders, flashlights, TV remotes, etc.

It works out fairly well, since Battery Junction always has a good sale on Black Friday.

[blues]

I have a habit of changing every single battery in the house on New Year's Day. Smoke detectors, CO2 detectors, weapon lights, RDS, optics, rangefinders, flashlights, TV remotes, etc.

It works out fairly well, since Battery Junction always has a good sale on Black Friday.

I have the batteries...I just wanted to see how long it would last.

[TGS]

I honestly believe Aimpoint’s battery life thing is one of the most overhyped selling points in the gun industry. The brightness that nets the magical 50k hour battery life is barely useable in daylight or when using a light. Everyone loves WMLs with all the lumens but my 500 lumen scout light almost washes out that dot and every higher setting drastically reduces the battery life. The ideal brightness for all around use gives me something like a seven month battery life IIRC. I’ve picked up more dead Aimpoints than any other optics. Plus there are $150 optics that now match the battery life so it’s not even like they’re the only game in town anymore.


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You're comparing apples to oranges. It's still better than similarly unusable brightness level used for battery rating of an Eotech that, at most, only lasts a few thousand hours, and at useable levels in daytime light need to be replaced every week compared to your 7 months for the Aimpoint.

The thread topic was about duty-grade optics, AFAIK, so I didn't think we were talking about $150 optics.

[mmc45414]

the battery life of the Aimpoint means that battery commonality isn't an issue to begin with since you only need to change them once every few years.
Yeah, but when you need one you need the one that fits, and would rather not have one thing that requires one thing that uses a thing nothing else does, rather than just get something else that uses the 2032 (ETA: Including even the car key fobs).

[Wake27]

You're comparing apples to oranges. It's still better than similarly unusable brightness level used for battery rating of an Eotech that, at most, only lasts a few thousand hours, and at useable levels in daytime light need to be replaced every week compared to your 7 months for the Aimpoint.

The thread topic was about duty-grade optics, AFAIK, so I didn't think we were talking about $150 optics.

It may be better than a similar brightness from EOTech but if I have to adjust the brightness when picking up the gun it’s really no different than turning the optic on so it’s not really that different. The question to me is whether or not it’s usable when picking up the gun, regardless of environment and without any manipulation.

And I believe there are a number of big names stating that Holosuns are solid including Yeti, Aaron from Sage, John Lovell, etc.

I’m not saying that the advantage isn’t there, it is and that’s why I have a T2. But it’s not nearly the advantage that the internet has made it out to be. Brightness level six or whatever it is that has the 50k hour battery life isn’t completely worthless, but if I have to use it in a life threatening scenario, I don’t want barely adequate illumination, especially from a $700 red dot. That’s even more true when my wife is the one using the gun.


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[TGS]

I don't think I understand what you're on about.

I set mine at a higher, useable level.

That's not 50,000 hours of battery life anymore, but it's still significantly longer than an EoTech at a similar intensity level.

There's no reason that you have to keep the Aimpoint on at a lower level, and adjust it up when you grab the gun.

[FNFAN]

I have a H1 on an ADM mount. The iron sights are always in place and when the dot is on it sits on the front sight post of the 6920. I like it and don't find it annoying even with a certain amount of astigmatism. Historically I seem to run about 200-300 rounds through the gun yearly and it's not a work gun.

[TCB]

I currently have a 1500 lumen Fury DF on my work gun and run my H-1 at level 8 at night (10 during the day)...it does not get washed out. I use level 8 instead of 7 because on 8 with the 1500 lumens I can still see the dot on the white door of my Patrol vehicle when I’m standing 3-5’ away from it, 7 washes out inside of 5’ but is fine outside of that...I’ve had to hold people at gunpoint in vehicles in that range so 8 it is. I don’t see how 500 lumens could wash out any of the Aimpoint micros. My H-1 is beat to shit and is on 9-10 hours a day 5 days a week, I think I’ve changed the battery on it once or twice just for kicks in the last 6-7 years...

The eotech auto off thing and battery life is not blown out of proportion...it sucks, out loud. I know of one shooting it played a part in (squared away Officer put up his irons and handled business) and I’ve gotten into a couple foot pursuits while dicking with one that had shut off during a long shift, luckily when I had one issued before getting my H-1 I always checked it when I deployed with a long gun and didn’t need to go loud. I will never use an electronic optic with an auto shut off on a duty weapon. Ever.

[rob_s]

It may be better than a similar brightness from EOTech but if I have to adjust the brightness when picking up the gun it’s really no different than turning the optic on so it’s not really that different. The question to me is whether or not it’s usable when picking up the gun, regardless of environment and without any manipulation.


You’re doing it wrong.

[Wake27]

That's not 50,000 hours of battery life anymore, but it's still significantly longer than an EoTech at a similar intensity level.

Yeah I agreed to that point above, the problem is that for every setting above eight, you’re literally cutting the battery life in half. Everyone uses 50k/multiple years of battery life as a selling point, but at setting 10 it’s less than two years according to Aimpoint. And that’s not even in their manual, I had to email them to get those numbers. Again, the battery life is an advantage over Eotech, but not to the extent everyone makes it out to be.


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[Wake27]

You’re doing it wrong.

That’s not how I do it, I just leave it on a brighter setting and change the battery more often. But since everyone makes it seem like they’ll run forever and only the 50k battery life in setting eight was in the manual when I got mine, I picked up my gun a few times and found that the dot was dead because I had it on a higher setting and had no way of knowing what to expect out of the battery.


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[TGS]

Yeah I agreed to that point above, the problem is that for every setting above eight, you’re literally cutting the battery life in half. Everyone uses 50k/multiple years of battery life as a selling point, but at setting 10 it’s less than two years according to Aimpoint. And that’s not even in their manual, I had to email them to get those numbers. Again, the battery life is an advantage over Eotech, but not to the extent everyone makes it out to be.


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You're right, 17,500 hours isn't appreciably different from ~200-300.

[Wake27]

You're right, 17,500 hours isn't appreciably different from ~200-300.

It’s actually 12,500 which is barely “years” and that was my point, regardless of an EOTech’s battery life.


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[WobblyPossum]

Is this an issue considering it sounds like most people here are changing batteries annually? I’d still prefer to change the battery once a year instead of once a month or two.

It’s been discussed here before but EoTechs and Aimpoints serve different roles. EoTechs are great for proactive missions such as pre-planned military and LE CQB in a team environment. You just got a warno that your team is hitting a house in two hours and you expect the entire operation to last no more than three hours? Your employer provides a limitless supply of batteries and it’s your SOP to pop in a fresh one for every mission? EoTech rocks for that. The automatic shut off doesn’t matter. The battery life doesn’t matter. The heavier weight doesn’t matter.

Aimpoints are better for reactive missions such as private citizen home defense and LE use as a patrol carbine. The dot on the rifle needs to stay on all the time because you never know when you’ll need to use it. Someone kicked your front door in and your alarm is ringing? You grab your rifle, which you likely keep cruiser ready, and rack a round in. Maybe you have time to turn on the dot. Maybe you don’t. You’re a patrol officer riding around in a patrol car for 8-12 hours at a time and don’t pull your rifle out at every call? When you run into a situation where you need your rifle, the dot better be on already. Active shooter? Reported in progress bank robbery? Perimeter setup or tracking for an armed, violent subject? I wouldn’t want to have to mess with my optic on top of everything else going on.

[Wake27]

Is this an issue considering it sounds like most people here are changing batteries annually? I’d still prefer to change the battery once a year instead of once a month or two.

It’s been discussed here before but EoTechs and Aimpoints serve different roles. EoTechs are great for proactive missions such as pre-planned military and LE CQB in a team environment. You just got a warno that your team is hitting a house in two hours and you expect the entire operation to last no more than three hours? Your employer provides a limitless supply of batteries and it’s your SOP to pop in a fresh one for every mission? EoTech rocks for that. The automatic shut off doesn’t matter. The battery life doesn’t matter. The heavier weight doesn’t matter.

Aimpoints are better for reactive missions such as private citizen home defense and LE use as a patrol carbine. The dot on the rifle needs to stay on all the time because you never know when you’ll need to use it. Someone kicked your front door in and your alarm is ringing? You grab your rifle, which you likely keep cruiser ready, and rack a round in. Maybe you have time to turn on the dot. Maybe you don’t. You’re a patrol officer riding around in a patrol car for 8-12 hours at a time and don’t pull your rifle out at every call? When you run into a situation where you need your rifle, the dot better be on already. Active shooter? Reported in progress bank robbery? Perimeter setup or tracking for an armed, violent subject? I wouldn’t want to have to mess with my optic on top of everything else going on.

Again. My point is that the battery likely won’t last for as many years as is commonly believed, REGARDLESS OF WHAT EOTECH OR ANY OTHER OPTIC DOES. If you replace batteries annually, it may not be a problem, but if you leave it on setting 11, it won’t even last a year.


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[StraitR]

The logic behind my choices basically aligns with what @DanM (https://pistol-forum.com/member.php?u=518) laid out above.

For the HD/bag gun defensive 300blk PDW, I use a Aimpoint T-2. Being in a defensive role, deployment would almost certainly be reactive. Key factors for choice: reliable dot, on 24/7. I change the battery yearly.

For a 11.5" 5.56 pistol, I use an EoTech EXPS3-0. It's something I would go get if I knew trouble was coming. Deployment would almost certainly be proactive. Key factors for choice: increased SA from big clear window and reticle that's friendly to my aging eyes. I change batteries when the reticle starts flashing.

Tried not to make it too complicated. Chose optics that best suit those roles for me.

[HCM]

I currently have a 1500 lumen Fury DF on my work gun and run my H-1 at level 8 at night (10 during the day)...it does not get washed out. I use level 8 instead of 7 because on 8 with the 1500 lumens I can still see the dot on the white door of my Patrol vehicle when I’m standing 3-5’ away from it, 7 washes out inside of 5’ but is fine outside of that...I’ve had to hold people at gunpoint in vehicles in that range so 8 it is. I don’t see how 500 lumens could wash out any of the Aimpoint micros. My H-1 is beat to shit and is on 9-10 hours a day 5 days a week, I think I’ve changed the battery on it once or twice just for kicks in the last 6-7 years...

The eotech auto off thing and battery life is not blown out of proportion...it sucks, out loud. I know of one shooting it played a part in (squared away Officer put up his irons and handled business) and I’ve gotten into a couple foot pursuits while dicking with one that had shut off during a long shift, luckily when I had one issued before getting my H-1 I always checked it when I deployed with a long gun and didn’t need to go loud. I will never use an electronic optic with an auto shut off on a duty weapon. Ever.

This ^^^.

I say this having been responsible for over 100 M4s with EoTechs which now all wear H-1s.

DanM's reactive vs proactive analogy is spot on.

I leave my work H-1 on 8 as a default and change the battery annually.

That is still 10k to 12k hours vs 1200 hours out of even the best of the EOTechs. More importantly, for my uses, unlike the EoTech I don't have to turn it on every time I need it and it doesn't intentionally turn itself off if I'm sitting in a car for 12 hours pissing in a gatorade bottle waiting for someone who merits an M-4 level attention.

Heat kills batteries, like when they spend most of their time in vehicles in Texas heat... hence annual battery changes on the H-1s.. However that affects EoTech Batteries too.

We've had a handful of H-1's and LRP mounts fail but 3/4 of the H-1 issues we've seen are user induced via failure to fully tighten the battery cap or failure to change the battery annually.

[rob_s]

everyone makes it seem like they’ll run forever


I’ve never seen anyone write that, or heard anyone say it.

The battery life, when referenced, is ALWAYS in relationship to the competition. And no matter how you slice it, the Aimpoint battery life is exponentially better than the competition. And, at just about any realistic “leave it on” setting, the Aimpoint will last long enough, left on, that you can measure the battery life with a calendar not a stopwatch.

I’m getting kinda old. I know what rum I like (zacapa for ice, brugal for coke), what beer I like (PBR), what cigars I like (Liga Pravda no 9)... and I don’t really have time for things other than Colt ARs, Glock handguns, beretta shotguns, Aimpoint optics, and Surefire lights. I can Dick around with something like a PSA 9mm upper with a holosun optic on it for my PCC matches, but even that’s already become tiresome after one match full of malfunctions (the upper, not the optic, yet).

[Casual Friday]

Aimpoint H1/T1, zeroed at 100. The H1 is a few months old, and is on my HD/backpack AR pistol. I keep it on setting 8 at home for indoors, setting 10 if I'm leaving the house with it in my Vertx bag. Prior experience with Aimpoint Micros has shown me that under that type of use the battery will last much more than a year, but I'll swap batteries annually because they're cheap.

My T1 is several years old. It's on my training 11.5" AR. I think the battery in it is 3 years old, I'll run it until it dies and replace it.

As far as the dot washing out indoors with a WML, I don't have that issue on setting 8.

Both my Micros are on LaRue LT660 mounts, which allow you to store two spare batteries inside the mount if you want, as shown in this video, if you don't want to fork over the coin for the KAC battery cover.


https://youtu.be/OWEWxF5G1-A

[blues]

Cool. I have the H2 on the same mount. Never knew about that little trick. Though I do have some stuff in the grip.

I imagine some plastic (Saran) wrap would work just as well as the plastic he melts to secure the battery.

[mmc45414]

I imagine some plastic (Saran) wrap would work just as well as the plastic he melts to secure the battery.
Maybe the corners of the next Amazon bubble wrap envelope that hits the porch...

[Redhat]

I like the Comp M2...mostly due to familiarity and a 100m zero

[mmc45414]

Both my Micros are on LaRue LT660 mounts, which allow you to store two spare batteries inside the mount if you want, as shown in this video

https://youtu.be/OWEWxF5G1-A

I just took a plunge on the MRO. Because of this post I went looking at the LaRue options and it look like his MRO mount has the same kind of relief holes under it (the one looks like it might even be bigger):
57708

And when I went there looking for the mount it turns out they have a pretty good deal on the MRO, basically the same price as the Trijicon co-witness mount (plus most places are out of stock on the sight):
https://www.larue.com/products/trijicon-mro-qd-mount-combo/

I also went for their scope mount to experiment with putting a scope on the same upper:
https://www.larue.com/products/lt204/

I didn't buy the hat, I already have a couple from back when they were free :cool:

[mmc45414]

And when I went there looking for the mount it turns out they have a pretty good deal on the MRO, basically the same price as the Trijicon co-witness mount (plus most places are out of stock on the sight):
https://www.larue.com/products/trijicon-mro-qd-mount-combo/

Update on this:
I just casually went and checked the order status, because it sure seemed to me like all of the stuff was in stock, but now without any other communication the whole order is just listed as Backordered. Not trying to go all Karen about it, just heads up if anybody else was thinking about it. This stuff is clearly in the desire category, not like I actually need it for anything, just that the way their site works I ASSumed it to be in stock.

[RancidSumo]

What is the best place to buy a H2 or T2 these days? Seems like the best price by far is to buy through the mount company, but I already have a mount.

[Casual Friday]

What is the best place to buy a H2 or T2 these days? Seems like the best price by far is to buy through the mount company, but I already have a mount.

Check with forum sponsor CS Tactical first. I was in the same boat and picked up an H1 from them several months back with no mount. He also went above and beyond what I would have considered fair after a small error on their end.

[CS Tactical]

What is the best place to buy a H2 or T2 these days? Seems like the best price by far is to buy through the mount company, but I already have a mount.

We're expecting to have some Aimpoint T2's shipping to us in the next week or so and we have Scalarwork Lower 1/3 mounts in stock :)

[Nephrology]

Unless I'm specifically trying to shave weight, I still like the larger tube of the 30mm Aimpoints. It helps that I dont have to then pay the $700+ for a "micro".

Aimpoint PRO Red Dot Reflex Sight with QRP2 Mount and Spacer - 2 MOA - 12841 - $445 (https://www.amazon.com/Aimpoint-PRO-Patrol-Rifle-Optic/dp/B007GDR0I4)

Same. Eventually I'd like to replace these with H2/T2s, but so far just hasn't felt worthwhile yet. Would be interested if the dot really is clearer in the T2s. I figure if I trawl ARFcom for long enough I'll find good deals on a couple used ones eventually.

https://i.imgur.com/8gNiiMK.jpg

[pastaslinger]

I feel this continually gets asked, but if given the choice, would people prefer a PRO, T2, or Comp M5 for a 14.5"-16" carbine? Let's assume they all would sit in a Scalarworks mount so nothing is over 10 oz.

[Wheeler]

I'm a bit of a luddite when it comes to ARs and all the stuff that goes with them. My FrankenTroy has an Aimpoint Comp M4s on top. This is a classic case of I got it, liked it, and it works for me out to 200 yards without magnification. I've given some serious thought to an LPVO or a 3X magnifier. I'm currently leaning towards the magnifier as a detachable alternative I can use as a field expedient monocular without pointing my rifle at things that don't need a rifle pointed at them. I have to give full attribution to jlw for that thought.

[secondstoryguy]

I have had everything and any of the big names work. I like the Aimpoint tho. Yes, battery life is grossly exaggerated per spec (worst in the ACRO) but I still get a very long time on the micros we run our work guns (our whole team and department run aimpoints on all longguns). I have only seen one fail and aside from bad batteries they are very durable. The T1 on my workgun is a testament to how strong they are. I was on a flightline getting ferried to the helo by a MULE type off road vehicle and had my weapon slung sitting on the left side of the vehicle when my sling swivel failed. The gun hit the concrete flightline at 30-40mph hitting directly on the T-1. It ground most of the top adjustment cap off. I immediately took it to the range and guess what...it held zero. That was a year ago and I'm still using the same optic. I also have an old old T-1 on another rifle that just keeps chugging along...I trust it so much it's fixing to get repurposed to an offset mounting on work-precision AR.

Don't trust batteries. Even the best brands can be inconsistent as far as their lifespan and you rarely get a warning before they shit the bed. With the price of batteries being what they are buy in bulk and change often. On pre-planned ops I often (not every time if they are close together) just throw a new battery in everything to be sure. Oh, and run irons and know how to use them (good for rain/cold too!).

[UNM1136]

I didn't know about the MRO being available with the circle dot reticle. I loved my issued Eotech, when there was nothing else available other than the 2nd gen Aimpoints. Even SWAT was Irons only at the time. When I upgrade my Work LE6920 (almost 14 years old) with a LaRue SURRG I am seriously looking at replacing my 14 year old Comp ML3 with a micro or a LPVO. I have even toyed with the idea of the Acro or an RMR. MRO is now on the list.

Anyway, call me a fanboi, but any rifle with a Pic rail for optics gets LaRue mounts. I like the adjustable lever mount, the return to zero, and the battery storage. This kept me from the PRO with the integrated mount and more common battery that the agency buys and issues to my shooters (not my choice, but not a bad one to issue to cops). I have lost track of the number of times I have given my spare battery to another shooter in a class or even my cops, who should know better on duty or during a qual. I also run a Vltor clubfoot stock, with 2 more 1/3Ns and 4x CR123s in the stock tubes.

I was taught to replace batterys once a year, or as needed (got some truly shitty 1/3Ns in a four pack from Mr. Bezos one year, the local Battery Junction has been my go-to for a decade now, and not let me down), and have a spare in the mount, and check dot brightness (and lithium flashlight brightness) every day. I adjust my dot as necessary, but only turn the sight off when it physically comes off the gun (the local agency I help teach for requires a second, 8 hour class for optics after a 32 hour iron sighted rifle course).

It never occurred to me to care about whether an Aimpoint would hit the 50k hours mark, or how different setting reduce it. It fits my needs and my uses. I do, however, understand the point.

pat

[maximus83]

Aimpoint T1 and T2 in AD mounts, zeroed to 100. Tried other options recently but came back to Aimpoint. Simplicity and bomb-proof reliability are hard to beat.

[John Hearne]

To me, the Aimpoint PRO is the point of diminishing returns. I don't think the extra money for a Micro of the M4 buys you much. I maintain a preference for a 30 mm tube as I like the bigger, more forgiving window.

[98z28]

I know it's sacrilegious in some circles, but I've been buying Primary Arms red dots for my serious-use guns the last couple of years. They've been working fine for me. The last Aimpoint I bought was an H-1, which is still going strong though.

I also prefer 30mm tubes to the micros, though I am playing with the SLx MD-25. It's compatible with micro mounts (I have it on a Large 660), is close to micro weight, takes 2032 batteries, has "50k hours" of battery life (though I leave it on setting 8, so I'll replace the battery every year), and has a larger 25mm tube. So far, it's a good compromise between the larger 30mm units and the micros. I'm really digging it.

https://www.primaryarms.com/primary-arms-slx-rotary-knob-25mm-microdot-with-2-moa-dot-reticle .

ETA: I recently switched to a 100 yard zero. I've used 50/200 for a while, but find the zeroing process a bit simpler at 100, mostly because I don't own a spotting scope.

Sent from my SM-N950U1 using Tapatalk

[Bucky]

I had struggled for years with my so called competition rifle. Prior to my last match, I decided to leave it behind and grabbed my defense use AR which currently has an Aimpoint Pro (https://www.amazon.com/Aimpoint-Reflex-Sight-Mount-Spacer/dp/B08C36T45W/) on it. It was the best rifle work I’ve ever done, and I’ve become a huge fan of that sight.

[stomridertx]

I can attest to what several others have said, there is something to the larger 30mm tube with red dots. I like the H1/T1 form factor just fine, but I really like the large TV like screen of the Holosun HS510C. Since rifles offer a cheek weld index point, it's not a huge advantage over the micro dots, but it's there. I find the HS510C to be my favorite red dot I've ever used on a carbine, and I'm satisfied with the durability for my use. I also have come to believe that the open emitter style is better on astigmatism than tube style enclosed dots just from observation and several others noticing the same thing. It requires more study to become a statement of fact. I think it might be the led reflecting off a single pane of glass instead of two. China is asshoe.

[mmc45414]

And when I went there looking for the mount it turns out they have a pretty good deal on the MRO, basically the same price as the Trijicon co-witness mount (plus most places are out of stock on the sight):
https://www.larue.com/products/trijicon-mro-qd-mount-combo/

Update on this:
I just casually went and checked the order status, because it sure seemed to me like all of the stuff was in stock, but now without any other communication the whole order is just listed as Backordered.
Got a shipment email a bit ago. Dunno if that means they have inventory now or not, but they still show the MRO on the mount for $460.

[CS Tactical]

I have Aimpoint T2's and Scalarwork mounts in stock right now if anyone is interested, please call me at 916-670-1103x2 :)

[Seven_Sicks_Two]

For the guys using PROs or other non-Micro Aimpoints, has anyone tried the SKD riser for the QRP2 mount?

https://www.skdtac.com/SKD-Aimpoint-QRP2-Riser-PRO-COMP-M4-p/skd.840.htm

The "not quite absolute, not quite lower 1/3" height of the factory mount has always bugged me. I figured this might be an easier / cheaper solution than an entirely new mount.

[John Hearne]

For the guys using PROs or other non-Micro Aimpoints, has anyone tried the SKD riser for the QRP2 mount?

https://www.skdtac.com/SKD-Aimpoint-QRP2-Riser-PRO-COMP-M4-p/skd.840.htm

The "not quite absolute, not quite lower 1/3" height of the factory mount has always bugged me. I figured this might be an easier / cheaper solution than an entirely new mount.

I'm a luddite. I still prefer absolute co-witness.....

[knownothing]

I currently have the SKD 1.93" riser on my QRP mount for my Aimpoint Pro. The riser itself is a quality piece of anodized aluminum which installs quickly and easily. I haven't had an issue with the riser coming loose in the 500~ rounds that I have used the riser. The QRP mount isn't my favorite with the large knob on the side but for 40 bucks I can't think of a more practical solution for changing the height of the Aimpoint Pro.

[rob_s]

For the guys using PROs or other non-Micro Aimpoints, has anyone tried the SKD riser for the QRP2 mount?

https://www.skdtac.com/SKD-Aimpoint-QRP2-Riser-PRO-COMP-M4-p/skd.840.htm

The "not quite absolute, not quite lower 1/3" height of the factory mount has always bugged me. I figured this might be an easier / cheaper solution than an entirely new mount.


I'm a luddite. I still prefer absolute co-witness.....


I currently have the SKD 1.93" riser on my QRP mount for my Aimpoint Pro. The riser itself is a quality piece of anodized aluminum which installs quickly and easily. I haven't had an issue with the riser coming loose in the 500~ rounds that I have used the riser. The QRP mount isn't my favorite with the large knob on the side but for 40 bucks I can't think of a more practical solution for changing the height of the Aimpoint Pro.

Speaking of, are there options available for replacing that knob? Even if it means losing the “quick” part of the name?

[Wake27]

Speaking of, are there options available for replacing that knob? Even if it means losing the “quick” part of the name?

Could swap the whole mount to something like Scalarworks. They're expensive but machined art.

[Seven_Sicks_Two]

Speaking of, are there options available for replacing that knob? Even if it means losing the “quick” part of the name?

I’ve seen a few photos with the base flipped around when used in conjunction with the SKD riser. The giant knob is still there, but faces the opposite side of the rifle making it theoretically less likely to snag on gear.

[Whiskey_Bravo]

I’ve seen a few photos with the base flipped around when used in conjunction with the SKD riser. The giant knob is still there, but faces the opposite side of the rifle making it theoretically less likely to snag on gear.

I did this with a Comp M4S with the 2.26" height riser. The riser is of absolutely solid quality construction. The low cost and variety of mounting heights is really genius. I went with the 2.26" height to experiment with a Unity FAST height concept before going all in. The factory Aimpoint QRP2 is incapable of being flipped to put the release knob on the right side of the rifle due to the factory spacer design. The SKD mount allows this to work. This is a very nice added bonus for right handed shooters.

Aimpoint does offer a lever lock base for the QRP2 mount as well as a tensioned nut version. But if you didn't buy a PRO already with the lever lock base, I don't think it is worth the ~$120 it costs to buy one, plus a riser.