Ruckus in New Mexico over a statue

[LittleLebowski]

I'm not sure if Tom Jones needs bail or not.

https://www.foxnews.com/us/man-shot-new-mexico-protest-spanish-conquerors-statue


A man was shot Monday after gunfire erupted at a demonstration in New Mexico, where protesters attempted to topple a bronze conquistador's statue outside an Albuquerque museum, authorities said.

The man was taken to a local hospital where he was listed in critical but stable condition, police said.

“The shooting tonight was a tragic, outrageous and unacceptable act of violence and it has no place in our city,” Albuquerque Mayor Tim Keller said in a statement.

[Tackleberry40sw]

I'm not sure if Tom Jones needs bail or not.

https://www.foxnews.com/us/man-shot-new-mexico-protest-spanish-conquerors-statue

The shooting was unnecessary but, the removal of a conquistadors status on private property was? :confused:

[johnson]

Here's one angle if the shooting.
https://twitter.com/MarkDice/status/1272761044792832001

[5pins]

This is what happens when the law is not enforced as it should be. When a shot is fired the police are all over it like stink on crap (as they should be) but do nothing to stop the "peaceful protesters" from illegally tearing down a statue.

[trailrunner]

The guy being arrested is supposedly from the New Mexico Civil Guard. What is around his neck? A roll of TP encased in duct tape?

55974

[Borderland]

I thought ABQ was a nice quite little village on the Rio Grande.:rolleyes:



https://youtu.be/hEJzXbqyU8A

[Borderland]

The guy being arrested is supposedly from the New Mexico Civil Guard. What is around his neck? A roll of TP encased in duct tape?

55974

I guess the AK was just a prop.

[TDA]

The guy being arrested is supposedly from the New Mexico Civil Guard. What is around his neck? A roll of TP encased in duct tape?

55974

That really is the main question I want answered here. What's up with that chain? Maybe it has something to do with 5G?

[JodyH]

I always tell people that you cannot fuck around in New Mexico, this state shoots people.
That stupid "He will not divide us!" web camera lasted about 24 hours in Albuquerque before there was a shooting being streamed out live.

I don't know why the "right" decided to get involved over this particular statue anyway.
This was pretty much communist versus Hispanic supremacists (aka leftists versus far left leftists).
The commies were trying to tear down a Conquistador statue.
The smart thing to do would be to let the white ANTIFA commies destroy a monument to Hispanic culture while the white mayor of a majority Hispanic city makes the cops stand by and watch.
Perfect opportunity to turn the old school land grant Hispanics against the new wave of far left communists (like Mayor Keller and Gov. Grisham).

People have to start playing chess instead of pigeon checkers.

btw: as to the shooting, from all the video I've seen (about 20 minutes worth) it was completely justified but he's still going to get run through the wringer for political points. One thing the shooter does have in his favor is his last name is Baca and the leakin commie is white and the video is pretty damn cut and dry that it was almost textbook self-defense.

[wvincent]

JodyH, what is this "Civil Guard"?
Is is state maintained/controlled?
Or more "Redneck Militia"?

[JodyH]

JodyH, what is this "Civil Guard"?
Is is state maintained/controlled?
Or more "Redneck Militia"?
redneck militia

[Grey]

Looked like the shooter was leaving and was attacked by multiple people. Looked like a good shoot from my layman perspective.

Sent from my SM-G950U1 using Tapatalk

[UNM1136]

redneck militia

Yup.

A couple of detectives I work with watched the footage and declared a righteous shoot. The shooter was charged with Agg Batt...not Agg Batt resulting in GBH. Just Agg Batt...politics anyone? I charge Agg Batt if the victim needs stitches. Have since 1999. Being hospitalized in serious/guarded condition? GBH.


And a protest that results in folks trying to destroy city property is NOT A PEACEFUL PROTEST, no mater what the mayor or governor say...

pat

[LittleLebowski]

Yup.

A couple of detectives I work with watched the footage and declared a righteous shoot. The shooter was charged with Agg Batt...not Agg Batt resulting in GBH. Just Agg Batt...politics anyone? I charge Agg Batt if the victim needs stitches. Have since 1999. Being hospitalized in serious/guarded condition? GBH.


And a protest that results in folks trying to destroy city property is NOT A PEACEFUL PROTEST, no mater what the mayor or governor say...

pat

Frustratingly enough, that sounds like a political charge. Is your DA a piece of shit?

[UNM1136]

Frustratingly enough, that sounds like a political charge. Is your DA a piece of shit?

No comment, because he is still the DA I have drawn. And I have to work rather closely with his wife. Despite being a Fed, I am sure you have the picture now....:p

pat

[5pins]

Looks perfectly justified to me. Of course, some dem will ask why he brought a gun in the first place. To them, I would say "to protect himself from skater boy" because the left is intolerant of opposing opinion and acts with violence to suppress it.

[JRB]

JodyH nailed it on the head about the background politics, and that NM is not a place to screw around.

Naturally, as clear-cut as the video shows it, that hasn't stopped our Gov and other folks from immediately tweeting off like some innocent kid got executed for protesting.
I've also had to explain to a few people that a skateboard used wheels-first to the head and upper body is absolutely NOT the same as throwing a punch or swinging a purse.

[SCCY Marshal]

Too soon?

https://youtu.be/xTAHeCEDX-s

[5pins]

@JodyH (https://pistol-forum.com/member.php?u=157) nailed it on the head about the background politics, and that NM is not a place to screw around.

Naturally, as clear-cut as the video shows it, that hasn't stopped our Gov and other folks from immediately tweeting off like some innocent kid got executed for protesting.
I've also had to explain to a few people that a skateboard used wheels-first to the head and upper body is absolutely NOT the same as throwing a punch or swinging a purse.

Not to mention the fact that he was trying to leave and was chased down by several people and taken down to the ground. He could have taken a beating and went to the hospital and nothing would have happened to the persons responsible.

[JRB]

Not to mention the fact that he was trying to leave and was chased down by several people and taken down to the ground. He could have taken a beating and went to the hospital and nothing would have happened to the persons responsible.

That's reality these days. My hat's off to ABQ PD, The county Sheriff's deputies, and the misc other LE agencies that are in our area.
They are truly doing a thankless job for civilian leadership that rarely if ever shows a shred of understanding or appreciation for the job they do. Specifically, being a border state with relative driving proximity to LA, Las Vegas, Dallas, Denver, and Phoenix, we get some true heavyweight-class dirtbags setting up shop and doing evil shit in this area.

But as a regular lawful working stiff, short of my being murdered I don't expect them to be able to do anything for me besides taking a report.

House robbed? It's all gone and there's never going to be an arrest, let alone a conviction.
Car stolen? Pffft. GONE! Conviction? LOL.
Four dudes beat the shit out of you and stole your wallet? Maybe there's a camera, oh wait, yep, there was. And it was four dudes beating the shit out of you that got into a common car with plates that show it was stolen. Next time just avoid places with four dudes.

I've been trying to vote out the judges in this area that seem to love turning total dirtbags loose. But it seems to be a losing battle.

Hell, they just paroled one of the three unbelievably depraved pieces of shit that drugged, raped, murdered, and dismembered a 9 year old girl a few years back. You literally can't make this shit up.

[HCountyGuy]

Guy throws woman to ground

https://mobile.twitter.com/stillgray/status/1272915414008258562

Crowd chases guy over it, one idiot whacks him with a skateboard and gets an immediate response

https://www.facebook.com/bnorberto/videos/10157549880544353/?d=n

[UNM1136]

Yeah, prosecutorial standards are a little....tired. Junkie beats the shit out of someone in the process of robbing or burglarizing them? They have a substance abuse problem and need treatment, not jail. Depspite the fact that their victim now needs physical care and physical threapy for a few weeks,

One of my best friends works for a judge with one of the worst records of confining dangerous people to jail. We don't talk about it much. But his bosses' interpretation on a fairly recent bail reform bill is that people need to go free unless a DA can hang a convincing threat, real, and to the public on a specific person at a specific time and place. The dude that allegedly dismembered Victoria Martins is waiting for a hearing to determine if he violated his conditions of release by getting evicted from his home by arguing with his landlord. And, oh, he was alone with the children of his current girlfriend for a while, in violation for of his conditions of release. I have heard of vagrants paying bond for their various misdemeanors to the tune of $8.40, because it was what they had available to them...

Counting the months to retirement...

pat

[JodyH]

That was a sweet soccer flop from the girl.
Not good enough for a red card, but yellow worthy even after video review.

Btw: that was the second whack from the skateboard, the first whack is immediately after the girl pushdown.
Shooter backs away after that whack, retreats quite a ways down the block and is then charged and taken down by skaterboy and friends.
The "Dude we're going to kill you!" being yelled out while on the ground fighting multiple attackers including one striking him with a blunt force deadly weapon while more hostiles are heading his way will look good on the big screen in front of a jury.
Only putting rounds into the guy wielding the skateboard plays into his self-defense claim as well.

My prediction.
Battery for pushing down the soccer flop girl.
Self-defense, no charges for the shooting.
No jail time.

[JodyH]

Anyone else have flashbacks to watching/participating in ECQC 2v1 evolutions?
:cool:

[HCountyGuy]

Longer video, different angle.

https://mobile.twitter.com/meganrabundis/status/1272735796949213184

[Hambo]

Perfect opportunity to turn the old school land grant Hispanics against the new wave of far left communists (like Mayor Keller and Gov. Grisham).

People have to start playing chess instead of pigeon checkers.



I'm just fascinated by the statue thing. Given NM's history, who hasn't oppressed somebody there? What statue would be OK?

[blues]

I'm just fascinated by the statue thing. Given NM's history, who hasn't oppressed somebody there? What statue would be OK?

https://www.roadsideamerica.com/attract/images/nm/NMLCRchili_hayden.jpg

[JodyH]

https://www.roadsideamerica.com/attract/images/nm/NMLCRchili_hayden.jpg

green chili lives matter...

[JodyH]

For all the redneck militia hysteria surrounding this shooting... those guys didn't swing a club or fire a shot (shooter wasn't one of them), they immediately rendered aid to the leakin commie (probably saved his life) and prevented more bloodshed by keeping the mob away from the shooter.

And they're the ones arrested when the cops finally arrive.

Fucking clown world.

[wvincent]

When the Governor and the Mayor are "in on it", and they are based on the press releases, the outcome is gonna be tough to bet on.

How do you counter "Alt right gunman shoots child skateboarder and assaults young girl at festival".
I mean, that is basically going to be the narrative they spin.

Facts? Schmacts, we don't need facts when we have EMOTION!

[JodyH]

When the Governor and the Mayor are "in on it", and they are based on the press releases, the outcome is gonna be tough to bet on.

How do you counter "Alt right gunman shoots child skateboarder and assaults young girl at festival".
I mean, that is basically going to be the narrative they spin.

Facts? Schmacts, we don't need facts when we have EMOTION!

possible change of venue to any courthouse outside of Abq. or Santa Fe (to be honest, average people in Abq. and SF are sick of this shit too. It's only the hardcore progressive divorced California Karens that are the problem and they won't be on a jury).
play video for jury
acquittal

Not a chance in hell a jury of working class Hispanic Democrats would convict a guy named Baca for shooting a white dude attacking him with a skateboard.

[Half Moon]

Hell, they just paroled one of the three unbelievably depraved pieces of shit that drugged, raped, murdered, and dismembered a 9 year old girl a few years back. You literally can't make this shit up.

Good lord, they paroled one of them?!? Don't know how I missed that. I'm usually ambivalent about the death penalty but all three of them should have hung by the neck till dead, dead, dead.

[JRB]

Good lord, they paroled one of them?!? Don't know how I missed that. I'm usually ambivalent about the death penalty but all three of them should have hung by the neck till dead, dead, dead.

Yep, and a LOT of people are pissed off about it.

[Nephrology]

Yep, and a LOT of people are pissed off about it.

Jesus Christ. I thought it was bad that CT refused to execute the Cheshire (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cheshire,_Connecticut,_home_invasion_murders) home invaders.

[HCountyGuy]

Jesus Christ. I thought it was bad that CT refused to execute the Cheshire (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cheshire,_Connecticut,_home_invasion_murders) home invaders.

This is why I have a problem with the rebuttal of “All Lives Matter” to “Black Lives Matter”. Words meaning things, “all” means “all“ and monsters like that are included in “all”. Their lives do not matter. They should have been summarily executed for that horrifically depraved act.

[Half Moon]

Jesus Christ. I thought it was bad that CT refused to execute the Cheshire (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cheshire,_Connecticut,_home_invasion_murders) home invaders.

Link for a link:

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Death_of_Victoria_Martens

Don't read if you are not up to dealing with truly sick stuff today.

[ssb]

My thought is that even if he hit some people in the crowd, the facts that he was plainly retreating, apparently managed to deploy pepper spray before shooting (per the Fox article citing the complaint), and was pursued by somebody using lethal force are going to be very favorable to him, regardless of stand your ground (I'm unfamiliar with New Mexico law). In general, you do not have a right to defend yourself when you are the initial aggressor; breaking off that action and retreating, however, usually gets you out of that box. My state's statute specifies "abandoning the encounter," or communicating one's intent to do so as ways to get back into self defense land.

[Nephrology]

This is why I have a problem with the rebuttal of “All Lives Matter” to “Black Lives Matter”. Words meaning things, “all” means “all“ and monsters like that are included in “all”. Their lives do not matter. They should have been summarily executed for that horrifically depraved act.



Link for a link:

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Death_of_Victoria_Martens

Don't read if you are not up to dealing with truly sick stuff today.

Yeah, some people are a waste of a jail cell.

[JM Campbell]

So is he retreating with the pistol drawn or is that a can of oc in his right hand before he gets tackled and hit again with the skateboard? The video is pretty jumpy and I can’t tell.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[SCCY Marshal]

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Death_of_Victoria_Martens

Don't read if you are not up to dealing with truly sick stuff today.

"...one count of child abuse resulting in death...it is possible she could have her sentence cut in half since the charge is not classified as a serious violent offense..."

I almost chipped a tooth grating my teeth at the bolded bit.

[LittleLebowski]

Good angle on this video, apologies if it’s been already posted.

1272962710989307909

[03RN]

I think that he had more patience then i would have. That being said, i wouldn't have been there.

Im so sick of rioters beating down people with no recourse this was a breath of fresh air. What was this guy doing there?


https://youtu.be/DwoSY5r7j7A

[LittleLebowski]

The rush to scapegoat the militia group is nauseating. They weren’t instigating acts of violence against cops and other protesters.

[El Cid]

The guy being arrested is supposedly from the New Mexico Civil Guard. What is around his neck? A roll of TP encased in duct tape?

55974

Is it just me or does TP Necklace guy resemble Val Kilmer?? And Val lives in NM. Does he have adult kids?

[LittleLebowski]

I have one easy trick that negates the risk of me having to shoot a “protester” and me being put in jail by a liberal DA...

[Casual Friday]

The rush to scapegoat the militia group is nauseating. They weren’t instigating acts of violence against cops and other protesters.

Yep. The shooter wasn't even part of their group according to a statement I read earlier, they shielded him waiting for the cops to arrive and allowed themselves to be arrested/detained while the details were sorted out.

[BehindBlueI's]

https://www.roadsideamerica.com/attract/images/nm/NMLCRchili_hayden.jpg

I have been oppressed from the inside, and a certain portion of my outside, by that cruel monster.

[BehindBlueI's]

Yep. The shooter wasn't even part of their group according to a statement I read earlier, they shielded him waiting for the cops to arrive and allowed themselves to be arrested/detained while the details were sorted out.

FWIW, that's exactly what police are trained to do if in plain clothes/off-duty.

And I still want to know what the TP-esque medallion thing is.

[Casual Friday]

FWIW, that's exactly what police are trained to do if in plain clothes/off-duty.

And I still want to know what the TP-esque medallion thing is.

Did I miss something? The militia dudes are off duty/plain clothes cops?

[BehindBlueI's]

Did I miss something? The militia dudes are off duty/plain clothes cops?

No, just commenting on "to arrive and allowed themselves to be arrested/detained while the details were sorted out" being what off duty officers are trained to do as well to prevent blue on blue shootings. Just a general "best practices" comment, not that the guys themselves were officers. Or aren't. I don't know any of them.

[Casual Friday]

No, just commenting on "to arrive and allowed themselves to be arrested/detained while the details were sorted out" being what off duty officers are trained to do as well to prevent blue on blue shootings. Just a general "best practices" comment, not that the guys themselves were officers. Or aren't. I don't know any of them.

Gotcha, having been in handcuffs before while details get sorted out, I'm aware of the policy.;)

ETA: It wasn't because of a shooting.

[LittleLebowski]

Good angle on this video, apologies if it’s been already posted.

1272962710989307909


Let’s see here, he looked to have been retreating and being chased. Three people assaulting him, someone yells “I’m going to fucking kill you!” and then black clad guy swings a skateboard at his head, he draws his gun, fires three rounds. Is that about right?

[Beat Trash]

Let’s see here, he looked to have been retreating and being chased. Three people assaulting him, someone yells “I’m going to fucking kill you!” and then black clad guy swings a skateboard at his head, he draws his gun, fires three rounds. Is that about right?

Yep, that’s about right...

[HCountyGuy]

Let’s see here, he looked to have been retreating and being chased. Three people assaulting him, someone yells “I’m going to fucking kill you!” and then black clad guy swings a skateboard at his head, he draws his gun, fires three rounds. Is that about right?

I counted four but I could be hearing things

[El Cid]

Let’s see here, he looked to have been retreating and being chased. Three people assaulting him, someone yells “I’m going to fucking kill you!” and then black clad guy swings a skateboard at his head, he draws his gun, fires three rounds. Is that about right?

I hear 4 shots. Almost looks like he gave the first shot to the attacker at his left and then 3 to the other attacker we see drop.

[JodyH]

So is he retreating with the pistol drawn or is that a can of oc in his right hand before he gets tackled and hit again with the skateboard? The video is pretty jumpy and I can’t tell.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
From what I've been able to piece together that was either his phone or OC in his hand.
To me it looks like a phone and the way he's holding it looks like the way you'd hold a phone.
Supposedly he drew his handgun while either on the ground or while getting back up.
I have also heard that his shirt rode up and exposed his holstered handgun somewhere around the soccer flop or first skateboard whack to the head timeframe.
On one of the videos you can hear someone say "he has a gun" but he does not have a gun in his hand when that's said.

[JodyH]

I hear 4 shots. Almost looks like he gave the first shot to the attacker at his left and then 3 to the other attacker we see drop.

At 6 seconds he points the gun at the black hoodie w/green backpack but at 7 seconds in the video you can hear the first shot and see the gun recoil and it's pointed at the black hooded skateboard swinger.
I think he was looking for the skateboard threat.
I counted four shots all at the same target.
I think the hoodie/green backpack was a "psychological stop", he turned and jerked away/fell down from the muzzle blast.

Looks to me like the guy has some training of some kind.
He had enough brainpower to discriminate between two hoodie wearing attackers and choose the one with the weapon.
Gun came up to eye level and he worked himself into a decent looking grip and stance by shots 3 and 4.
I've seen way worse shooting than that out of untrained people in CCW quals. on a flat stress free range.

[JodyH]

What's up with Millennials?
I'm GenX and my phone is a few years old and records in UHD 3840x2160 60fps.
This video is about 320xPotato at 45rpm.

These fuckups can't even competently record their stupidity.

:p

[El Cid]

What's up with Millenials?
I'm GenX and my phone is a few years old and records in UHD 3840x2160 60fps.
This video is about 320xPotato at 45rpm.

These fuckups can't even competently record their stupidity.

:p

Maybe they are bringing crappy burners to avoid being placed at the scene? Which to me smells like premeditation if that’s the reason.

[HCountyGuy]

Someone with a good eye caught this:

56002

I thought it might’ve been edited but after several reviews of the video I was able to make it out for myself

56003

[wvincent]

Okay, knife left hand?
What is in his right?

[JodyH]

Someone with a good eye caught this:

56002

I thought it might’ve been edited but after several reviews of the video I was able to make it out for myself

56003
Excellent catch.

$100 PF dollars says that the shooter is a "shooter".
That still shot is of a guy who's put in some reps on the range with fighting in mind.
His overall posture says controlled aggression to me.
He looks like an off-duty Brazilian cop...

[JodyH]

Okay, knife left hand?
What is in his right?
I wonder if its a sheath with duct tape on it that he pulled off the skateboard?
I'll have to go back and watch some of the other videos to see if I can make out anything taped to the bottom of the deck.

[Casual Friday]

Pistol and training>some Saul Alinsky books and a skateboard

[TAZ]

The only thing that is still a question is why was he there? Did he get surprised by a spontaneous protest? Did he go there with the intent to cause trouble? If he has anything on his social media about going to get some skulls or kick some ANTIFA ass... he is toast.

Reason #1208590898870683024 to stay the hell away from these events like they are the plague. Shit goes sideways fast enough during normal times. Add the mob into the mix and its like playing with fire while doused in gasoline. Just not a good idea.

[HCM]

The only thing that is still a question is why was he there? Did he get surprised by a spontaneous protest? Did he go there with the intent to cause trouble? If he has anything on his social media about going to get some skulls or kick some ANTIFA ass... he is toast.

Reason #1208590898870683024 to stay the hell away from these events like they are the plague. Shit goes sideways fast enough during normal times. Add the mob into the mix and its like playing with fire while doused in gasoline. Just not a good idea.

The latest version of the Fox News story on this incident identifies Baca as a former candidate for city council who was there to defend the statue. That does not, necessarily mean he was there with the militia group and is it not uncommon for multiple groups from both sides to show up at these sorts of things.

[Borderland]

I have one easy trick that negates the risk of me having to shoot a “protester” and me being put in jail by a liberal DA...

Any advice on toenail fungus or cheaters?

[Borderland]

I have been oppressed from the inside, and a certain portion of my outside, by that cruel monster.

You aren't genetically immune or maybe you are and your immune system isn't working properly.:D

[Borderland]

Gotcha, having been in handcuffs before while details get sorted out, I'm aware of the policy.;)

ETA: It wasn't because of a shooting.

You were the result of a disturbance call maybe?

[Borderland]

Okay, knife left hand?
What is in his right?

That's going to end any question in my mind right there about self defense.

I have a feeling that because the guy was trying his best to exit the confrontation he has justification to defend himself. He was assaulted by numerous people.

How much more does anyone need to figure this out?

Yep, he has a gun and anyone stupid enough to assault him might get shot. Protester 101 does and do not's.

I have a relative in ABQ who is a prof at some unnamed university. Maybe i'll call him up and see if he will proffer a class for these idiots. You know, just to save emergency response and hospital costs.

[BehindBlueI's]

Someone with a good eye caught this:

56002

I thought it might’ve been edited but after several reviews of the video I was able to make it out for myself

56003

I fail to see how this isn't self-defense, but "charge first, ask questions later" seems to be a national mantra at the moment.

[UNM1136]

I fail to see how this isn't self-defense, but "charge first, ask questions later" seems to be a national mantra at the moment.

Scuttlebutt in the detectives office this morning said skateboarder dude had 2 knives. I believe you can see the one in his right hand go bouncing on the street as he falls.

pat

[JodyH]

I'm sure the Mayor and Governor will be chastising the young leakin commie for bringing weapons to a peaceful protest.
Off to Twitter to wait on their corrections and vocal desires for justice to be done by dropping all charges against Baca in what's now obviously self-defense.



Yea... I'll be waiting a loooong time.

[fixer]

Charge first, ask questions later for sure. This story out of Virginia is a similar-eque vein:

https://www.cbsnews.com/news/sheriff-apologizes-black-pastor-arrest-5-white-people-hate-crime-charges-woodstock-virginia/

Pastor(who happens to be black) confronts some book-of-eli looking white people running off with a refrigerator. Group comes back with reinforcements. Threatens to kill, head butts, and pastor retrieves handgun. They back off. No shots fired. White people learn a lesson. Pastor lives with bruises. 2A win.

Pastor gets arrested for brandishing. lol. likely because his adversaries went and cried " MWAG!" to nearby police.

fucking clown world.

[BehindBlueI's]

Pastor(who happens to be black) confronts some book-of-eli looking white people running off with a refrigerator.

Actually they were bringing a refrigerator. Illegal dumping (in a dumpster).


man and a woman dragging a refrigerator from another property into his dumpster,

Seems like an odd thing to get in a physical altercation over, but since I've seen Murder over who gets to use the good X-box controller nothing much surprises me.

Of course the other side's attorney has a different version:


Attorney Bradley G. Pollock, representing Sharp, told The Washington Post that his client and Amanda Salyers assumed they had permission to dump the refrigerator in McCray's dumpster, and returned it to their own property after McCray confronted them

[fixer]

correction noted.

[LittleLebowski]

Scuttlebutt in the detectives office this morning said skateboarder dude had 2 knives. I believe you can see the one in his right hand go bouncing on the street as he falls.

pat

Scroll up, top post by BBIs on this page.

[Casual Friday]

You were the result of a disturbance call maybe?

No not exactly. Summer of 1999, a couple of my buddies were renting a house in an area of town where the rent was cheap and I hung out there with them most evenings. Their neighbors were a family who operated a chop shop and sold stolen stereo equipment. We didn't know exactly what they were into, but we knew they were up to no good. Still we tried to remain friendly with them, and often chatted with them over beers in the front yard. We were doing just that when the cops and feds rolled in. They cuffed us and took our ID's. IIRC, it was 20 or 30 minutes max until they confirmed we were just the neighbors. 21 years later, that row of houses no longer exists, they were bulldozed and a 4 unit apartment complex was put on each lot. A street that once housed 8 families now houses 32.

One of the unlicensed car dealers that lived there went on to shoot a cop in the face a few years ago.

[BehindBlueI's]

Scroll up, top post by BBIs on this page.

HCountyGuy deserves the credit, I just quoted him and added my (mostly useless) commentary.

[ASH556]

This deal we're (the entire world it seems) all stuck on lately of making complete judgement calls based on a 30 sec (or less) video clip has got to stop. We also have to make decisions based on truth and integrity of the entire situation, not just the part that agrees with "our side." This appears to be the same blue shirt guy shooter at the same event a few minutes prior to the shooting throwing a female to the ground. I don't know (because I still haven't seen a top-to-bottom, un-edited video of the entire event), but it appears this event/attack may have been the catalyst that led to the counter-attack that led to the shooting.

https://www.instagram.com/p/CBhS277lkQajp5ELgR9sNeF2I-g1QYH1JEQsmU0/

[BehindBlueI's]

This deal we're (the entire world it seems) all stuck on lately of making complete judgement calls based on a 30 sec (or less) video clip has got to stop. We also have to make decisions based on truth and integrity of the entire situation, not just the part that agrees with "our side." This appears to be the same blue shirt guy shooter at the same event a few minutes prior to the shooting throwing a female to the ground. I don't know (because I still haven't seen a top-to-bottom, un-edited video of the entire event), but it appears this event/attack may have been the catalyst that led to the counter-attack that led to the shooting.

https://www.instagram.com/p/CBhS277lkQajp5ELgR9sNeF2I-g1QYH1JEQsmU0/

HCountyGuy posted that way up thread : https://pistol-forum.com/showthread.php?43041-Ruckus-in-New-Mexico-over-a-statue&p=1067607&viewfull=1#post1067607

I think the general consensus here is that he's probably guilty of battery there, but once he disengaged and tried to flee he is confronted by deadly force. I doubt NM allows for deadly force to be used to affect a citizen's arrest for a simple battery (or state equivalent) and he therefore has the right to self-defense. At least that's how it would work here. You can't stab somebody for throwing somebody down then fleeing.

[WobblyPossum]

This deal we're (the entire world it seems) all stuck on lately of making complete judgement calls based on a 30 sec (or less) video clip has got to stop. We also have to make decisions based on truth and integrity of the entire situation, not just the part that agrees with "our side." This appears to be the same blue shirt guy shooter at the same event a few minutes prior to the shooting throwing a female to the ground. I don't know (because I still haven't seen a top-to-bottom, un-edited video of the entire event), but it appears this event/attack may have been the catalyst that led to the counter-attack that led to the shooting.

https://www.instagram.com/p/CBhS277lkQajp5ELgR9sNeF2I-g1QYH1JEQsmU0/

This was posted up thread earlier. Blue shirt then retreats a distance that looks to be about a city block after being struck by skateboard/knife guy. I’d say that regains his innocence for the purposes of self defense. Skateboard/knife guy and others continue pursuing blue shirt with people yelling “kill him” and “I’m going to kill you dude.” Skateboard/knife dude continues to pursue while attacking blue shirt with two different types of deadly weapons. No one is saying blue shirt made good decisions throughout the events but the self defense argument sure seems to be on solid legal footing.

[ASH556]

This was posted up thread earlier. Blue shirt then retreats a distance that looks to be about a city block after being struck by skateboard/knife guy. I’d say that regains his innocence for the purposes of self defense. Skateboard/knife guy and others continue pursuing blue shirt with people yelling “kill him” and “I’m going to kill you dude.” Skateboard/knife dude continues to pursue while attacking blue shirt with two different types of deadly weapons. No one is saying blue shirt made good decisions throughout the events but the self defense argument sure seems to be on solid legal footing.

I agree with this. My point is simply that if we want to effect change and bring peace and understanding (at least at some level greater than it currently is) in our nation, we cannot gloss over
No one is saying blue shirt made good decisions throughout the events to just focus on
the self defense argument sure seems to be on solid legal footing. because it fits our narrative. I'm not saying that's what you specifically are doing. Just using your quotes as a good synopsis of the situation.

Watch the video again. It's not the attacker yelling, "I'm gonna fking kill you." It's a bystander who at the point blue shirt guy draws yells to the skateboard/knife attacker, "He's gonna fking kill you." Prior to that point in the video, they're yelling, "follow him" and "get his license plate" presumably because he just assaulted the female.

Stupid games and stupid prizes on both sides of this one. I certainly wouldn't want to hang my hat and my hopes of lawful self defense using this case as an example. We ALL need to be honest and "police our own" and denounce those who make poor choices regardless of which "side" they're on.

[WobblyPossum]

I agree with this. My point is simply that if we want to effect change and bring peace and understanding (at least at some level greater than it currently is) in our nation, we cannot gloss over to just focus on because it fits our narrative. I'm not saying that's what you specifically are doing. Just using your quotes as a good synopsis of the situation.

Watch the video again. It's not the attacker yelling, "I'm gonna fking kill you." It's a bystander who at the point blue shirt guy draws yells to the skateboard/knife attacker, "He's gonna fking kill you." Prior to that point in the video, they're yelling, "follow him" and "get his license plate" presumably because he just assaulted the female.

Stupid games and stupid prizes on both sides of this one. I certainly wouldn't want to hang my hat and my hopes of lawful self defense using this case as an example. We ALL need to be honest and "police our own" and denounce those who make poor choices regardless of which "side" they're on.

What’s the narrative and who are these people in our group we need to be policing? I don’t think I have a side here so which of the people in the video are on my side? I don’t know anyone involved in this incident and, from seeing the decision making in the video, don’t consider it a great loss in my life. I’m strictly looking at this from a legal perspective. Guy started a fight. Guy then made absolutely clear his desire to retreat and stop the conflict. Guy was pursued and attacked with deadly force. Guy employed deadly force to defend himself. If you look at the screen shots a little bit up thread, skateboard/knife guy has a knife in each hand and is closing distance with blue shirt before blue shirt draws his gun. What does skateboard/knife guy need all the knives for if he’s just trying to get blue shirt’s license plate? Was he going to carve the plate number into his forearm so he didn’t forget it?

[HCountyGuy]

I agree with this. My point is simply that if we want to effect change and bring peace and understanding (at least at some level greater than it currently is) in our nation, we cannot gloss over to just focus on because it fits our narrative. I'm not saying that's what you specifically are doing. Just using your quotes as a good synopsis of the situation.

Watch the video again. It's not the attacker yelling, "I'm gonna fking kill you." It's a bystander who at the point blue shirt guy draws yells to the skateboard/knife attacker, "He's gonna fking kill you." Prior to that point in the video, they're yelling, "follow him" and "get his license plate" presumably because he just assaulted the female.

Stupid games and stupid prizes on both sides of this one. I certainly wouldn't want to hang my hat and my hopes of lawful self defense using this case as an example. We ALL need to be honest and "police our own" and denounce those who make poor choices regardless of which "side" they're on.

I don’t think anyone has condoned blue shirt guy being there and to a degree “bringing this on himself”. Many have expressed that the better solution would’ve been to not have been there in the first place and he wouldn’t have wound up needing to defend himself from serious bodily injury.

Yeah he threw a female to the ground as she continued to press herself in to him while blocking him. That could honestly rise to simple battery and even false imprisonment by confining his movement. Not saying blue shirt may not have been a little heavy handed (hey wait, I thought the left was about equality including gender equality?) but once he began retreating and retreated for a significant distance only to be maliciously assaulted by a crowd, one of whom had a skateboard and a knife and utilized the former and seemed like he may have tried to utilize the latter, he seems to have a reasonable case of self defense.

Stupid decisions all around for sure.

[Seven_Sicks_Two]

I don’t think anyone has condoned blue shirt guy being there and to a degree “bringing this on himself”. Many have expressed that the better solution would’ve been to not have been there in the first place and he wouldn’t have wound up needing to defend himself from serious bodily injury.

Yeah he threw a female to the ground as she continued to press herself in to him while blocking him. That could honestly rise to simple battery and even false imprisonment by confining his movement. Not saying blue shirt may not have been a little heavy handed (hey wait, I thought the left was about equality including gender equality?) but once he began retreating and retreated for a significant distance only to be maliciously assaulted by a crowd, one of whom had a skateboard and a knife and utilized the former and seemed like he may have tried to utilize the latter, he seems to have a reasonable case of self defense.

Stupid decisions all around for sure.

It sounds like everyone involved has learned some valuable lessons the hard way.

[Tamara]

I don’t think anyone has condoned blue shirt guy being there and to a degree “bringing this on himself”. Many have expressed that the better solution would’ve been to not have been there in the first place and he wouldn’t have wound up needing to defend himself from serious bodily injury.

^^^This right here.

The shooting itself would appear legal, but it was his dumbass actions that put him in a situation where he needed to shoot someone. That doesn't make him a criminal, just dumb.

I don't even have a problem with the idea of him going to a demonstration or counterprotest while armed. Your Second Amendment rights don't negate your First Amendment ones, after all. But laying hands on someone in that volatile situation while you are going heeled? That's just asking for trouble. And in this case, he got some.

(Also, once he decided to leave, he needed to leave, not back away slowly while staying verbally engaged. If you're gonna beat feat, beat feet.)

[ASH556]

^^^This right here.

The shooting itself would appear legal, but it was his dumbass actions that put him in a situation where he needed to shoot someone. That doesn't make him a criminal, just dumb.

I don't even have a problem with the idea of him going to a demonstration or counterprotest while armed. Your Second Amendment rights don't negate your First Amendment ones, after all. But laying hands on someone in that volatile situation while you are going heeled? That's just asking for trouble. And in this case, he got some.

(Also, once he decided to leave, he needed to leave, not back away slowly while staying verbally engaged. If you're gonna beat feat, beat feet.)

This right here. I'm not so good with words.

[Borderland]

Something like this happened here.

https://komonews.com/news/local/jury-may-be-deadlocked-in-uw-protest-shooting-trial

Antifa jackass gets shot by a woman who said he attacked her husband with a knife. Hung jury and mistrial. No knife was ever produced and no witnesses saw a knife. Antifa jackass wouldn't testify.:rolleyes:

I thought for sure she was going down but I guess there were enough level headed people on the jury to keep her from being convicted.

If Baca is charged the prosecutor is just wasting the tax payers money for a trial.

[BehindBlueI's]

Yeah he threw a female to the ground as she continued to press herself in to him while blocking him. That could honestly rise to simple battery and even false imprisonment by confining his movement.

I came here to post that after thinking about this more while out for a walk today. I'd originally said the shooter was likely guilty of simple battery, but after thinking it through she was also committing battery and criminal confinement (or state equivalent) and at least here the confinement would be a felony. Then it just becomes a matter of was his reaction within the realm of "reasonable" and can the prosecutor get beyond a reasonable doubt with a jury considering that. So my initial reaction was wrong on how likely he is to be guilty of the battery. He may be guilty of nothing but being an active participant in a event with potential to go sideways. Which, of course, can be equally said about the woman thrown to the ground or the guy who caught some bullets.

[JRB]

I agree with this. My point is simply that if we want to effect change and bring peace and understanding (at least at some level greater than it currently is) in our nation, we cannot gloss over to just focus on because it fits our narrative. I'm not saying that's what you specifically are doing. Just using your quotes as a good synopsis of the situation.

Watch the video again. It's not the attacker yelling, "I'm gonna fking kill you." It's a bystander who at the point blue shirt guy draws yells to the skateboard/knife attacker, "He's gonna fking kill you." Prior to that point in the video, they're yelling, "follow him" and "get his license plate" presumably because he just assaulted the female.

Stupid games and stupid prizes on both sides of this one. I certainly wouldn't want to hang my hat and my hopes of lawful self defense using this case as an example. We ALL need to be honest and "police our own" and denounce those who make poor choices regardless of which "side" they're on.

Real life is muddy and ugly. Real people are imperfect and routinely don't do everything perfectly. So I don't want to hang my hat on requiring/demanding perfection to have a right to defend myself.
Demanding perfect crystal-clear performance from a legal standpoint in order to justly defend yourself does nothing but hang out a noose for all of us regular knuckle-dragging imperfect people.

Yes, this whole situation fails the 'stupid places/times/people' test.
I'm also struggling to see a time when any meaningful civic participation these days wouldn't also fail the 'stupid places/times/people' test, especially with how inflammatory things are getting across the board.

Truth be told, I hear you Ash and intellectually I agree somewhat. But the rest of me is so fucking fed up with how one side can *routinely* get away with aggravated assault and battery, criminal damage to property, etc with nary a bad word in the press let alone actual charges - my compassion for the female 'victim' and her ilk in that situation is negligible.
As others have articulated, she was playing stupid games. If you're physically involving yourself in a stupid game, you should expect other people to get physically involved too. It's not like she was just holding up a sign and saying her piece.

To your point of self-policing, I see no 'self-policing' on their side. I don't see anyone's mind changing toward 'our side' because we're self-policing or accountable etc. I see people's minds changing because they are utterly sick of this reason-free virtue signaling garbage paired with an unchecked sense of entitlement rooted so deep, that this female thought she could go play physically stupid games without anyone else returning the favor.

So, frankly, based on what's known now and posted in this thread, I don't see any reason to criticize any of blue shirt's actions at all. I sincerely hope he's acquitted of all charges.

[JodyH]

He may be guilty of nothing but being an active participant in a event with potential to go sideways. Which, of course, can be equally said about the woman thrown to the ground or the guy who caught some bullets.
Let's just call it "mutual combat" and everyone goes home with the prizes they collected at the time of the combat.
Soccer flop bitch keeps her dirtier clothing and maybe a few new bruises to go along with her heroin tracks.
Blue shirt has a few new lumps and bruises a ripped shirt and is out $2 worth of ammo.
Leakin Commie has some new scars which would have given him some street cred if he wasn't photographed flat on his back in tight purple chonies.

[BehindBlueI's]

Let's just call it "mutual combat" and everyone goes home with the prizes they collected at the time of the combat.
Soccer flop bitch keeps her dirtier clothing and maybe a few new bruises to go along with her heroin tracks.
Blue shirt has a few new lumps and bruises a ripped shirt and is out $2 worth of ammo.
Leakin Commie has some new scars which would have given him some street cred if he wasn't photographed flat on his back in tight purple chonies.

Only if they all get together for some overly hopped beer and talk it out.

Overly hopped beer is it's own punishment.

[JodyH]

Cops should have started investigating this incident by collecting and running the ID of everyone within eyesight of the shooting. I guarantee 80% had active arrestable warrants...

[JRB]

Cops should have started investigating this incident by collecting and running the ID of everyone within eyesight of the shooting. I guarantee 80% had active arrestable warrants...

Rumor has it that many, if not most APD officers are simply letting those failure to appear warrants go on their way, telling them to get their tickets taken care of. Too many bigger problems and not enough officers to waste one hooking a guy up and dragging him to jail over a speeding ticket.

Though I'm sure a solid 20% of that crowd had warrants for actual crimes. Not that our local judges would have done a god damn thing.

[JodyH]

Too many bigger problems and not enough officers
20 of them standing around the Bearcat in full Gucci gear watching two packs of feral humans fight and vandalize property for a few hours while not doing a damn thing says otherwise.
Shit I'd rather stand around at the jail intake instead of standing around kitted up in 100 degree heat, might as well snatch up some petty scofflaw and enjoy a Coke and AC if you're not going to do any real Police work.

[BehindBlueI's]

Rumor has it that many, if not most APD officers are simply letting those failure to appear warrants go on their way, telling them to get their tickets taken care of. Too many bigger problems and not enough officers to waste one hooking a guy up and dragging him to jail over a speeding ticket.

Though I'm sure a solid 20% of that crowd had warrants for actual crimes. Not that our local judges would have done a god damn thing.

We were on that plan with COVID and surrounding counties not accepting transfers for anything other than felonies.

[JRB]

20 of them standing around the Bearcat in full Gucci gear watching two packs of feral humans fight and vandalize property for a few hours while not doing a damn thing says otherwise.
Shit I'd rather stand around at the jail intake instead of standing around kitted up in 100 degree heat, might as well snatch up some petty scofflaw and enjoy a Coke and AC if you're not going to do any real Police work.

I should have been more clear - I'm talking regular patrol and bike Officers on the day to day, not the Guccibois with their Ranger Green Gen IV IOTV's and all that spiffy shit.

That said, I'm sure that those kitted-up dudes would much rather have been allowed to do something. But after the DOJ got done skull-dragging all of APD a couple years back, and our current leadership told them to do nothing scary ever, arresting a few scumbags to dump them in a turnstyle justice system probably wasn't worth risking their careers, and I can't blame them.

Otherwise, yeah, in a just world I'd 100% follow your lead on the above.

[JodyH]

I should have been more clear - I'm talking regular patrol and bike Officers on the day to day, not the Guccibois with their Ranger Green Gen IV IOTV's and all that spiffy shit.

That said, I'm sure that those kitted-up dudes would much rather have been allowed to do something. But after the DOJ got done skull-dragging all of APD a couple years back, and our current leadership told them to do nothing scary ever, arresting a few scumbags to dump them in a turnstyle justice system probably wasn't worth risking their careers, and I can't blame them.

Otherwise, yeah, in a just world I'd 100% follow your lead on the above.

I understand, my local PD was under a DOJ (Bill Clintons DOJ) consent decree for about 10 years after shooting a POS felon who was swinging a 2"x4"x6' at them... and was black (being black is obviously the most important part of the whole incident).

[Kanye Wyoming]

One of my legit proud commie lawyer FB friends whom I’ve jabbed a bit recently over antifa posted this today:


Friends of yours?

https://www.theguardian.com/us-news/2020/jun/17/armed-vigilantes-under-scrutiny-after-statue-protester-shot-new-mexico

My response was:


No, but probably a good shoot. While shooter was retreating from the ruckus, he was being pursued, shot dude was hitting him with a skateboard and had a knife in his hand, and others close by were yelling kill him. If you happen to know any lawyers, you could ask about the law of self defense.

The only grey area I see as of now is that it appears the shooter may have instigated some of the initial drama, and the general rule is if you instigate you can’t then escalate to deadly force unless you have first broken it off and retreated, and it is the other guy who re-initiates. Here, though, it seems like he did break it off cleanly.

To put it in a context a commie can understand:

You go armed to a MAGA rally and start yelling “f*ck you you racist p*ssies, I’ll kick all of your asses.” Your wish for a dustup is obliged, blows are exchanged, you feel your life is endangered and you pull out what you call your fully automatic AK-47 (but which educated people call a semiautomatic pistol) and start blasting. Your claim of self defense is likely to fail.

If on the other hand, after riling the MAGA people up as intended, you wisely say to yourself feet don’t fail me now and skedaddle out of there with alacrity while shouting sorry folks, I’m outta here, and the MAGA folks nevertheless chase you while brandishing MAGA-emblazoned skateboards and knives, yell “kill that commie m*therf*cker,” get close enough to whack you and stab you and attempt to do so, and THEN you shoot, your claim of self defense is likely to avail itself.

Was I on track?

[BehindBlueI's]

Was I on track?

Well, you were on Facebook so...

[Lex Luthier]

One of my legit proud commie lawyer FB friends whom I’ve jabbed a bit recently over antifa posted this today:



My response was:



Was I on track?

Did their head 'asplode?

If so, yes, you managed to separate the streams of cognitive dissonance.

[DDTSGM]

Did their head 'asplode?

If so, yes, you managed to separate the streams of cognitive dissonance.

I thought it was you didn't want to cross the streams?

https://memegenerator.net/img/instances/64675235/dont-cross-the-streams.jpg

[HCountyGuy]

Well I’ll be, there may be hope this turns out better than we expected.

Shooting charge dropped against Baca (https://www.reuters.com/article/us-new-mexico-protest-idUSKBN23P08W)

[Yung]

Torrez filed four new charges against Baca for unlawful carrying of a firearm and battery for allegedly assaulting three women before the shooting.

[JodyH]

unlawful carry = petty misdemeanor
I bet the battery charges get dropped/reduced (or the "women" get charged with battery as well) once ALL the video is out there.

[JM Campbell]

unlawful carry = petty misdemeanor
I bet the battery charges get dropped/reduced (or the "women" get charged with battery as well) once ALL the video is out there.

Honest question...what constitutes unlawful carry in NM? Did he not have a CHL/CCW or is it the fact he was at a protest?


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[JodyH]

btw: I bet the unlawful carry charge is due to the stupid 2 year refresher requirement on NM CCW permits. My guess is he has a CCW but he didn't do the online Powerpoint PDF/test at the 2 year (mid-point of the licensure period). It's 100% on the permittee to remember this date because the state does not give you a reminder and does not send you any notification that your permit is no longer valid if you miss the date.
It's a "gotcha" Easter egg in our retarded licensing system.
As a former NM CCW Instructor I'll bet that 75% of the people who got their license forgot the refresher requirement and have invalid permits after 2 years.

Reminder to NM peeps... do the damn refresher!
Link to refresher ---> NM DPS CCW Refresher course (https://www.dps.nm.gov/images/ConcealCarry/2-Year-PowerPoint-updates-as-of-Nov-2019.pdf) <---
Hint, leave the PDF open in one window and open the test in another.
:cool:

[blues]

Depending on state law, some states do not allow permit holders to carry at certain types of public gatherings...parades, picket lines etc., unless they are exempt under various exclusions.

[JodyH]

Depending on state law, some states do not allow permit holders to carry at certain types of public gatherings...parades, picket lines etc., unless they are exempt under various exclusions.
Pretty much the only "no go" areas in NM are posted locations, schools, some Gov buildings, tribal lands and places that serve alcohol for consumption on premises.
Our carry laws and penalties for illegal carry are actually pretty relaxed, it's our permitting system that's Byzantine (some of that Spanish love of bureaucracy).
NM is the Wild West with Old World charm.
:p

[Tamara]

Pretty much the only "no go" areas in NM are posted locations, schools, some Gov buildings, tribal lands and places that serve alcohol for consumption on premises.
Our carry laws and penalties for illegal carry are actually pretty relaxed, it's our permitting system that's Byzantine (some of that Spanish love of bureaucracy).
NM is the Wild West with Old World charm.
:p

NM is the only place I open carry since they don't recognize my Hoosier toter's permit.

Of course, aa a middle aged cracker chick who's generally fairly polite and mild-mannered, my odds of running into trouble with the po-po while toting are approaching zero.

[HCountyGuy]

Of course, aa a middle aged cracker chick who's generally fairly polite and mild-mannered, my odds of running into trouble with the po-po while toting are approaching zero.

Ah hah! Flaunting your white privilege, eh?

56063

[FrankinCA]

Depending on state law, some states do not allow permit holders to carry at certain types of public gatherings...parades, picket lines etc., unless they are exempt under various exclusions.

California CCW has that stipulation..no CCW at political rallies

[Tamara]

Ah hah! Flaunting your white privilege, eh?

Pretty much literally, yeah.

That's what that is, yes. *shrug*

[UNM1136]

Update: DA is seriously backtracking. Agg Batt DW dropped untill the investigation is finished. (Ya think?) Felony Agg Batt x3 counts dismissed until victims can be identified and interviewed Imagine that! Based on the video, even felony Agg Batt is a reach. Misdemeanor Agg Batt is likely a better charge, but not even knowing who the victim is?

pat

[Glenn E. Meyer]

Baca video showing some of the before shooting action. https://youtu.be/XuEUvzMv7Hc

You can debate the legality of the charges but he certainly was a rocket scientist. Or maybe not.

[Borderland]

Pretty much the only "no go" areas in NM are posted locations, schools, some Gov buildings, tribal lands and places that serve alcohol for consumption on premises.
Our carry laws and penalties for illegal carry are actually pretty relaxed, it's our permitting system that's Byzantine (some of that Spanish love of bureaucracy).
NM is the Wild West with Old World charm.
:p


Old habits die hard. NM and AZ always has been a hard-scrabbled place. Range wars, cattle rustlers, Mexican revolutionaries, raiding Apaches, invading Texans (civil war) to name a few. Now they have BLM protests. Seems likely a few people will get shot. They always do.

[LittleLebowski]

Update: DA is seriously backtracking. Agg Batt DW dropped untill the investigation is finished. (Ya think?) Felony Agg Batt x3 counts dismissed until victims can be identified and interviewed Imagine that! Based on the video, even felony Agg Batt is a reach. Misdemeanor Agg Batt is likely a better charge, but not even knowing who the victim is?

pat

That's fine by me.

[DDTSGM]

Update: DA is seriously backtracking. Agg Batt DW dropped untill the investigation is finished. (Ya think?) Felony Agg Batt x3 counts dismissed until victims can be identified and interviewed Imagine that! Based on the video, even felony Agg Batt is a reach. Misdemeanor Agg Batt is likely a better charge, but not even knowing who the victim is?

pat

Does NM have misdemeanor agg battery? In most places that would be simple battery absent the death or great bodily harm language.

[UNM1136]

30-3-4. Battery.
Battery is the unlawful, intentional touching or application of force to the person of another, when done in a rude, insolent or angry manner.

Whoever commits battery is guilty of a petty misdemeanor.

History: 1953 Comp., § 40A-3-4, enacted by Laws 1963, ch. 303, § 3-4.

30-3-5. Aggravated battery.
A. Aggravated battery consists of the unlawful touching or application of force to the person of another with intent to injure that person or another.

B. Whoever commits aggravated battery, inflicting an injury to the person which is not likely to cause death or great bodily harm, but does cause painful temporary disfigurement or temporary loss or impairment of the functions of any member or organ of the body, is guilty of a misdemeanor.

C. Whoever commits aggravated battery inflicting great bodily harm or does so with a deadly weapon or does so in any manner whereby great bodily harm or death can be inflicted is guilty of a third degree felony.

History: 1953 Comp., § 40A-3-5, enacted by Laws 1963, ch. 303, § 3-5; 1969, ch. 137, § 1.



Been a few years since I have charged it, the felony is a serious reach, Misdemeanor Agg Batt, looks like it is still a reach. Based on the video alone, Simple Battery is what I would likely charge, you know, if I had a victim that wanted to cooperate.


pat

[JodyH]

Based on the video alone, Simple Battery is what I would likely charge, you know, if I had a victim that wanted to cooperate.
I bet the "victim" has at least one warrant for her arrest and she's probably a paid agitator from out of state.
No way she's going to crawl out from under whatever refrigerator she's shooting heroin under right now, especially since she's committing battery on video as well.

Chalk it up to just another round of A'quirky 'Tard jousting and stop wasting LE time and my tax money.

[JRB]

Charges refiled against Mr Baca. They re-upped the shooting charge and then dropped it almost as quickly. Still facing 3 counts of agg battery w/GBH on the female.

https://www.abqjournal.com/1475487/charges-refiled-against-baca-in-protest-shooting.html



Charge refiled against Baca in protest shooting

Second Judicial District Attorney Raúl Torrez announced his decision to resurrect the shooting charge at a news conference Monday afternoon. He also announced his office has filed a civil suit asking a judge to prohibit the New Mexico Civil Guard, a heavily armed civilian militia group, from “organizing and operating in public as a military unit independent of New Mexico’s civil authority” and from “assuming law enforcement functions by using or projecting the ability to use organized force in response to perceived threats at protests, demonstrations, or public gatherings.”

https://www.krqe.com/news/crime/man-arrested-for-shooting-at-onate-statue-protest-facing-new-charges/



ALBUQUERQUE, N.M. (KRQE) – The District Attorney announced Wednesday it’s dropping the shooting charge against 31-year-old Steven Baca, the man who shot another at a protest in Old Town Monday.

District Attorney Raul Torrez says they simply don’t have all the facts right now in a news conference Wednesday. He also says they’ve called on New Mexico State Police to conduct an investigation.

...

Baca is now being charged with three counts of aggravated battery with great bodily harm for pulling a woman to the ground and injuring other protesters. All of this was caught on video.


I'm really not seeing how they're going to make aggravated battery with great bodily harm stick. Also interesting to see how the suit against the 'NM Civil Guard' will play out.

I'm getting very, very tired of such interesting times.

[Totem Polar]

I'm getting very, very tired of such interesting times.

Indeed. If the next-gen days of ragers succeed in dragging us into further conflict and fucking up what has generally been a pretty great—if imperfect—thing at the apex of civilization, Imma gonna be pissed.

[Malamute]

Baca is now being charged with three counts of aggravated battery with great bodily harm for pulling a woman to the ground and injuring other protesters. All of this was caught on video.

That same video caught several people assaulting Baca with a skateboard and knives, so are they proceeding with charges on those individuals also? Seems pretty clear cut. Caught on video and all. Seems reasonable to expect.

[blues]

That same video caught several people assaulting Baca with a skateboard and knives, o are they rpoceeding with charges on those individuals also? Seems pretty clear cut. Caught on video and all. Seems reasonable to expect.

I heard they may skate. But it's cutting it close.

(Okay, okay...I apologize.)

[JodyH]

"After the first felony, the rest are free".
The state needs to tread very lightly lest this not work out like they think it will.
Someone who knows the deck is stacked against them is not only less likely to hang around after a incident they also might decide that being arrested and thrown into a New Mexico prison isn't going to happen either.

[Borderland]

Everyone left the scene, and probably the state, except the shooter and the guy who got shot because he couldn't leave. My guess he gets charged also.

Classic.

[UNM1136]

Everyone left the scene, and probably the state, except the shooter and the guy who got shot because he couldn't leave. My guess he gets charged also.

Classic.

In this state current thinking is you can have one victim or more victims, and one suspect or more suspects, but the same situation the same person cannot be a suspecr and a victim, public affray being an exception. Prosecutors want us to figure out who is the primary aggressor and charge them, so they don't get an alleged victim on the stand who takes the Fifth during testimony to keep from incriminating themselves during a separate trial over the same incident where they are the accused. Their testimony as a victim can be used in a separate trial over the same incident.

Juries like victims just walking down the street minding their own business, rather than people engaged in an alleged criminal act who then became an alleged victim a moment later. It can and has happpened, but it is not clean and clear cut. For a couple of decades now our legal advice on mutual combat domestics has been to keep looking until you can find articulable facts that make one or the other the primary aggressor. Dual charging leads to a lot of dismissals. Ther are some nuances that allow it t oll happen, but again, it is less clear cut.

pat