Bites

[03RN]

Always feed the bite. Push harder untill they lose their appetite.
Tonight
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A while back
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[HCM]

I don’t miss that shit ... at .. all.

[Coyotesfan97]

Just like Motors say it’s not if you crash but when K9 says if you play with dogs you’re gonna get bit...

[LittleLebowski]

I feel like I’m missing some context.

[03RN]

I feel like I’m missing some context.

Just a pretty messy restraint last night

[Duelist]

Man. I really felt a sense of mission/purpose when I worked psych, but I do not miss this stuff. When I got my counseling degree, I picked schools to specialize in b/c I knew that, at least in the short term, I have no desire to go back to a clinical setting.

[03RN]

I dont blame you. To much behaviour stuff that im getting burnt out on.

I would like to find an at home job. Like insurance claims or chart audits so i can build a tree house and stay away from people.

[45dotACP]

As far as nursing jobs that I've got the utmost respect for, inpatient psych is right up at the top.

Stay safe. And healthy. [emoji106]

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[Mister X]

That’s pretty rough. Back in 93 Psychologist Bill Damueller offered me a job at the Chester mental health faculty in Illinois. It sounded great until we got into the issue of spitting and biting. I just couldn’t get past it.

[Wingate's Hairbrush]

Back when getting bit containing folk was a potential part of my work day, I kept a small bottle of bleach to throw on the wound as soon as circumstance allowed, to reduce possible transfer of Hep and HIV.

Doctor recommended. Only had to do it twice. Glad it was there when I needed it.

Also, consider an off-the-record chat with the client's onsite shrink or someone in nursing to see if they're aware of any potential health risks specific to the biter. Technically a HIPPA violation, but if you and someone with access to health records are simpatico, they'll understand and discretely assist.

[03RN]

Back when getting bit containing folk was a potential part of my work day, I kept a small bottle of bleach to throw on the wound as soon as circumstance allowed, to reduce possible transfer of Hep and HIV.

Doctor recommended. Only had to do it twice. Glad it was there when I needed it.

Also, consider an off-the-record chat with the client's onsite shrink or someone in nursing to see if they're aware of any potential health risks specific to the biter. Technically a HIPPA violation, but if you and someone with access to health records are simpatico, they'll understand and discretely assist.

I am the nurse;)

[Wingate's Hairbrush]

I am the nurse;)Well, hopefully you're on good terms with yourself. ;)

[Rick R]

Went to a Domestic call one night, guy is buck nekkid with a young lady when his estranged wife broke in and tried to assault the new object of his attentions. While he was trying to put pants on and wrestle her out the door the soon to be Ex latched on to his side below his right nipple. It literally looked like something out of Jaws. Wife went to jail, he went for stitches.

Ironically the Rookie I was training that night had a mental patient latch on to his hand a few years later and that resulted in surgery to fix.

I’ve seen more damage from people bites than dog bites over the years.

[gkieser92]

When I was working in psychiatric day treatment with elementary age kids, biting was an extremely common occurrence, at least 2-3 times a week. A nine year old knows he can't punch hard enough to injure a grown man, but he can bite hard enough. I got really good at both deflecting and gaining release from bite attacks. Loose sleeves are also great, since the teeth slide off your forearm and onto the fabric.

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[Clusterfrack]

When I was working in psychiatric day treatment with elementary age kids, biting was an extremely common occurrence, at least 2-3 times a week. A nine year old knows he can't punch hard enough to injure a grown man, but he can bite hard enough. I got really good at both deflecting and gaining release from bite attacks. Loose sleeves are also great, since the teeth slide off your forearm and onto the fabric.


Our older daughter had a little friend (boy) that was a biter. When they were around 5, this kid ran up to me while I was on the couch and bit me on the inner thigh, just missing my nutsack. It very painful and surprising, and in a sensitive area--I reacted without thinking and yanked the kid off me so hard he left the ground and fell a couple feet away. The mom wasn't happy, but knew her kid had serious issues.

Biting kids should have to wear muzzles.

[HCM]

Our older daughter had a little friend (boy) that was a biter. When they were around 5, this kid ran up to me while I was on the couch and bit me on the inner thigh, just missing my nutsack. It very painful and surprising, and in a sensitive area--I reacted without thinking and yanked the kid off me so hard he left the ground and fell a couple feet away. The mom wasn't happy, but knew her kid had serious issues.

Biting kids should have to wear muzzles.

Common issue.


https://youtu.be/U6UWNA-WQgI

Surprised it took this long for this to be posted.

[Clusterfrack]

https://youtu.be/SvIQaIgKiO4

[willie]

Mike Tyson bit Evander Holyfield during a 1997 match. I observed that in my inner city school, biting occurred during fights. In corrections I observed biting to be a common practice in juvenile centers. In my samples females used the tactic more. Female employees were frequently bit on a nipple during which time the offender wrapped arms and legs around the employee and followed her to the ground. The best tool for "breaking a bite" is an electric cattle prod. Threat of using it most often resolves the issue. If not, a quick jolt effects release without causing sprains or joint damage or other injuries seen in applying physical force to idiots. The idea is highly unattractive, and past abuse of electric prods has removed them from facilities.

[JHC]

Always feed the bite. Push harder untill they lose their appetite.


So is this a rule of thumb regarding all creatures that bite or something? Or is it just pertaining to gonzo people?

[Wingate's Hairbrush]

So is this a rule of thumb regarding all creatures that bite or something? Or is it just pertaining to gonzo people?It's a good rule of, er, thumb across mammals. It's physiology: "feeding" the bite -- meaning applying force toward it with the limb or digit being bit, causes the jaw to open wider, thus less biting force can be applied, and pushed far enough inward induces a sense of gagging and choking that often "breaks" the bite just long enough to quickly withdraw from it.

Instinct when being bitten is to immediately pull away, which usually is least effective.

[Keith E.]

It's a good rule of, er, thumb across mammals. It's physiology: "feeding" the bite -- meaning applying force toward it with the limb or digit being bit, causes the jaw to open wider, thus less biting force can be applied, and pushed far enough inward induces a sense of gagging and choking that often "breaks" the bite just long enough to quickly withdraw from it.

Instinct when being bitten is to immediately pull away, which usually is least effective.


Wouldn't the biter have more leverage closer to the hinge point of the jaw assembly? This is, of course, without initiating the gag reflex of the attacker.

Keith

[Wingate's Hairbrush]

Wouldn't the biter have more leverage closer to the hinge point of the jaw assembly? This is, of course, without initiating the gag reflex of the attacker.

KeithI don't believe so -- greatest strength is in the middle of an arc, not the start or finish. Furthermore, the biter's jaw muscles are being forced to extend when they're trying to contract -- this increases the effort required to clamp down (and so diminishes clamping power) and increases energy expended in the effort.

[Clusterfrack]

RevolverRob, some biology help?

This gets complicated. Mechanical advantage and the force-length curve of muscles typically peak near the same range of joint angles, and where the joint typically operates, but not always. Active lengthening (forcing jaw open when it’s trying to close) will almost always result in the greatest force at any velocity.

But all the theory aside, I’d go with experts who’ve dealt with biting animals.

[RevolverRob]

Took me a minute to catch up.

There is certainly a limit to 'gape' (the amount the jaw can open) at which both the teeth can engage AND the muscle can contract with sufficient force to produce crushing and/or shear.

The classic cited examples of evolutionary tradeoffs are something like this:

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Where the size/roundness of the prey object exceeds the gape of the predator (here right at the limit).

The force across the arc of the jaw closing is more or less constant, until you get closer to the fulcrum point (jaw hinge) at which point it increases (think logically, do you crack hard food with your incisors or molars?). It's also not a simple 1:1 situation, the size, shape, and position of teeth makes a huge difference. Opening, I don't know if it matters much? I guess I only think of the jaw opening from the perspective of things getting ready to bite.

Of course as Cluster alludes to - Force is also largely dependent on the insertion of the muscles on both the mandible and the skull. Humans don't have particularly long or robust masseter (primary cheek) muscles for our body sizes (compare ours to other 200-pound animals, basically). So while we generate a lot of force it isn't really comparable to what other animals might generate. If you want to get really freaked out go look at the jaws of bone cracking hyenas.

RE: Tearing/Bruising - what's more effective to defeat a bite - Once both sets of teeth are set in, forcing the jaw open by attempting to shove something soft (tissue) into the mouth, probably isn't going to work, it's actually pretty hard to force the mouth open if the teeth have the tissue held. Imagine if you will, taking a clamp, and clamping a napkin inside of it. Then try shoving the napkin more through the clamp. The tighter the clamp, the harder this is to accomplish.

That said, getting bit on thick tissue areas, like that which covers most humans, will typically not let extreme prognathics (short 'muzzled' animals like humans) get a great "clamp" on - imagine over stuffing that clamp above and trying to close it. Ever notice the most effective bites come on the extremities or things like the ears? Plenty of ability to clamp down and then do nasty things like torque. Even things like K9s are trained to go for the extremities the arms and legs, being places they can get a firm hold on. Dogs also have advantage of having a relatively long snout and thus can be more teeth on things.

The more wide open and full the mouth is, the harder it is to generate shearing forces, leading to more likely ending up with crushing (bruising) damage.

"Feeding" the bite might be difficult, but I guess it's worth a shot, because chances are if you can force in, instead of trying to pull out of the bite, you'll limit the biters 'clamping' ability and thus defeat the bite easier.

[03RN]

It's a good rule of, er, thumb across mammals. It's physiology: "feeding" the bite -- meaning applying force toward it with the limb or digit being bit, causes the jaw to open wider, thus less biting force can be applied, and pushed far enough inward induces a sense of gagging and choking that often "breaks" the bite just long enough to quickly withdraw from it.

Instinct when being bitten is to immediately pull away, which usually is least effective.

I would agree. Ive only been bit by one Rottweiler that lost his appetite after a punch to his face though