Sawing off your own shotgun - ATF Forms/steps

[critter]

I would like to transform a shotgun I inherited from my dad into an SBS. It's an old pump 12ga from the 50's which isn't worth the cost of the stamp, however, it has sentimental value so I'd like to make it something I'll actually shoot/use rather than admire it from time to time.

Is the ATF Form 1 - Application to Make and Register a Firearm the correct form for doing this, and if so, is this the only document I need to submit?

[fatdog]

Yes, and don't do anything until the approved Form 1 complete with stamp is back in your hands.

Then you have to engrave the receiver per the instructions and then you are free to cut the barrel or take just the barrel to a gunsmith and have them cut it. I have done several. I did Form 1 through electronic submission with my NFA Trust several years ago and it was a relatively painless process, even paid my $200 with my credit card. I am told that they are much faster now but I have not been through it in a few years.

My form 1 was sent back through the ATF portal as a PDF, never received a physical copy, just a color PDF, that is how they do it. The paper process worked the same way but just took a lot longer when I did mine.

One of mine was a worthy project....this gun is a blast to shoot...with the friction ring in the rear position it even runs the Federal Tactical low recoil buckshot.

50313

[SeriousStudent]

I would recommend reviewing these two threads. I found them useful a few years back when I did a Form 1 to make an SBS.

https://www.m4carbine.net/showthread.php?186089-Work-In-Progress-new-F1-F4-guide-for-41F-submissions

https://www.m4carbine.net/showthread.php?147975-Visual-guide-How-to-fill-out-a-Form-1-using-EFORMS

You'll need a set of passport photos (easily done with a phone app) and a set of fingerprints. You can order the cards and ink pads off Amazon.

I would always get a prepaid Visa debit card at Kroger and use that for the $200 payment. Made it easy to check the balances.

Hope that helps. I do like an SBS, they are a good deal of fun.

[SeriousStudent]

Yes, and don't do anything until the approved Form 1 complete with stamp is back in your hands.

Then you have to engrave the receiver per the instructions and then you are free to cut the barrel or take just the barrel to a gunsmith and have them cut it. I have done several. I did Form 1 through electronic submission with my NFA Trust several years ago and it was a relatively painless process, even paid my $200 with my credit card. I am told that they are much faster now but I have not been through it in a few years.

Yep, a Form 1 through e-file was running around 30 days. I have no idea what COVID will do to that time frame, but I cannot envision is getting shorter.

I just did two more Form 1's for a pair of SBR's last week, I'll let you know when they come back.

fatdog's caution about not altering stuff is a wise one until approval is granted is a wise one. I never alter a barrel until I have the approved form back in the mail and in my hands, and have verified all it's details.

[Poconnor]

Fat dog- Tell us more about that auto-5? It looks really sweet

[fatdog]

Fat dog- Tell us more about that auto-5? It looks really sweet

Belgian, early 60's mfg I think, found in a LGS used rack for about $300, original wood was nothing but a collection of splinters, cracks on stock and fore-end. Finish was 60% gone from the whole gun with absolutely horrible pitting. Your classic Alabama farm shotgun that somebody never took care of. Threw it in the bed of the truck, never cleaned, etc. But mechanically near perfect. So I knew it was a near perfect project gun.

Had it refinished in Duracoat after I filed the Form 1 and engraved it, replaced the springs, cut to 14" per the form 1, added the XS front sight (glued on top of bead version with JB Weld).

Synthetic stock was generic, I don't even remember what brand, but I shortened it to 12.5" LOP including a Pachmyr decelerator. The Nordic components guys make a magazine extension for the A5 and it turns out that their +0 end cap can be screwed in and backed out a few twists to yield 5 rounds in the standard mag tube so I have a very reliable 5+1 configuration.

The A5 Friction ring of course fits in two positions, the forward position for heavy loads, but I put mine in the rear position for lighter loads. I can blast my way through regular birdshot loads to my heart's content. While I don't think of this as a primary defensive firearm, I have Benelli's and 870's for that, it would suffice. I ran about half a sleeve of Federal Tactical Flight Control Low Recoil #1B (https://pistol-forum.com/usertag.php?do=list&action=hash&hash=1B) back when I built it and that stuff was plentiful. Nary a bobble with any load I have put in it. In fact I have not had a jam of any kind since the SBR conversion.

Oh yeah, a 3-gungear 5 shell side saddle on the other side of the receiver...

Every time I drag it to the range everybody wants to shoot it, and it is fun because it will run as fast as you can snap the trigger, and nobody can put it down without a big grin on their face. I seem to never leave the range with a single loaded shell.

And yes that is a copy of the form 1 plastered to the stock with shipping tape....

[Hambo]

I would like to transform a shotgun I inherited from my dad into an SBS. It's an old pump 12ga from the 50's which isn't worth the cost of the stamp,

Just because I've got a soft spot for '50's shotguns, tell me what you're going to hack.

[critter]

One of mine was a worthy project....this gun is a blast to shoot...with the friction ring in the rear position it even runs the Federal Tactical low recoil buckshot.



Damn, that is sweet. I didn't see that the first time around. Someone must have paid you to sneak it in later so I wouldn't be coveting yet another firearm. ;)

[critter]

Just because I've got a soft spot for '50's shotguns, tell me what you're going to hack.

50557

50558

50559

Ward's Western Field Model-30. That end of that fiber optic clip is about where the cut will be at 15.5 inches. It's currently 29.5.


more info (https://www.guns.com/news/review/montgomery-wards-western-field)



...the Montgomery Wards’ “Western Fields” brand was stamped on guns made by some of the biggest names in the U.S. firearm industry – Savage, Mossberg and Marlin to *name a few. These are budget guns of old...

The Model 30 and 31 were actually the Savage Stevens 520/620 pump action shotgun was designed by John M. Browning. They were first introduced in 1904 and were sold with the Stevens name and also rebranded for the major catalog retailers like Montgomery Ward’s Western Field line...



BTW for convenience for anyone else passing by... here is the necessary ATF Form 1 (https://www.atf.gov/firearms/docs/form/form-1-application-make-and-register-firearm-atf-form-53201)

[Cory]

Big fan of the Western Field brand. My family were pretty much poor farmers for a long time, and several of my family heirlooms are Western Field brand. Mostly bolt action shotguns and some 22LRs.

-Cory

[fatdog]

That is actually a Stevens 520-30 takedown that they rebranded. Lots of those 520's got to be trenchguns in U.S. Military service or got "drafted" in WW II by the DSC and issued to prisons and police forces during the war.

It is one of those guns that can be "slamfired" by holding the trigger back and just working the action.

[critter]

That is actually a Stevens 520-30 takedown that they rebranded. Lots of those 520's got to be trenchguns in U.S. Military service or got "drafted" in WW II by the DSC and issued to prisons and police forces during the war.

It is one of those guns that can be "slamfired" by holding the trigger back and just working the action.

Well.. whaddya know. Indeed it is.

50576

I never knew that... or better put, Dad never showed me that particularly convenient feature.

Thanks for that bit of highly useful information! this will become a highly portable package.

[Paul D]

What is the proper technique for cutting a barrel? Put in a vise; measure to length; cut perpendicular with a hacksaw; file smooth and blue?

[Hambo]

That is actually a Stevens 520-30 takedown that they rebranded. Lots of those 520's got to be trenchguns in U.S. Military service or got "drafted" in WW II by the DSC and issued to prisons and police forces during the war.


The military bought non-trench guns for gunnery training. Skip to 6:40 for a brief scene of such training.


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Ts5gsZy8JH0

[CleverNickname]

What is the proper technique for cutting a barrel? Put in a vise; measure to length; cut perpendicular with a hacksaw; file smooth and blue?

I've not done it myself, but I've heard a pipe cutter works great for shotgun barrels.

[critter]

I've not done it myself, but I've heard a pipe cutter works great for shotgun barrels.

I've seen some vids of people attempting that and it doesn't appear to work all that well. The blades flatten out well before the barrel is cut, plus it takes a loooong time to get through the hardened steel. Perhaps an industrial grade pipe cutter with super hardened blades.

The most successful DIY method I've seen so far seems to be taping the barrel, and then using a hose clamp, positioning the wider base/screw at the bottom, for a straight edge and then cut down to almost through, remover the hose clamp and finish. Then file, sand, etc.

Honestly, this is new to me so I really have very little knowledge and only some vague idea.

I may try taking this one down to 18.5 (down an inch or two at a time until I develop a consistent technique) as practice and then decide whether the results are good enough to want to do the finished SBS myself after approval or just pay to have it done by a pro.

[CleverNickname]

just pay to have it done by a pro.
That's what I did when I form 1'ed my 870 SBS. I needed to have a gunsmith put a new front sight on the barrel anyways, so I had him cut it down too.

[SeriousStudent]

I had a machinist cut mine, AFTER I had the approved Form 1 with stamp in hand, and he cut it in my presence. Whilst I held the paperwork, and giggled like a little schoolgirl.

It's a 12.5" 870 Wingmaster, and runs like a scalded dog.

The second one I used a pipe cutter to score the barrel, then used a vise and hacksaw to finish. I finished the barrel with some files from Brownells, then used some Insta-Rust to refinish the exposed muzzle.

[Joshmill]

Well.. whaddya know. Indeed it is.

50576

I never knew that... or better put, Dad never showed me that particularly convenient feature.

Thanks for that bit of highly useful information! this will become a highly portable package.


So I just looked it up in my old Blue Book of Gun Values from 2003 so adjust accordingly. A Stevens branded 520-30 Long Barrel comes up as:

98% $500
95% $400
90% $225
80% $175

It's not entirely valueless and is still a cool piece of history especially with sentimental value. Not telling you not to do it, but it might be something to think about before you F1 it which is the way to go if you decide to do it. I have a lathe, that is the correct way to shorten it. If I was closer to GA I would do it for splitting a six pack and a pepperoni pizza. Make friends with somebody who has a lathe. Another option would be to find an old Trench Gun barrel or just shorten it to trench gun size (if that's over 18"). I don't know if you hunt but if you have kids or grandkids who will hunt it might be a great heirloom to be able to pass down.

My advice that you didn't ask for would be to throw it in the safe and just buy yourself a new gun instead. That's what I would do!! :D:D:D:D

JMO