SafeLife Defense FRAS

[witchking777]

Hi,I was curious what the consensus on this new armor is. I see that it supposedly meets Lvl3 NIJ 06 standards, however it doesn't list it being tested with. 308 fmj rounds. It also states "stops 7.62x39" and yet doesn't list a test for that either. It has a stated weight of 16 lbs. Thoughts? My brother is a city officer and was interested in this,he currently uses Safariland Hardwire soft armor for patrol. Thanks!

[Erick Gelhaus]

I looked at it & tried it on at SHOT. It is noticeably heavier and less flexible than a conventional concealed vest.

Looking at photos of it with a cover but not in a carrier reminds me of DragonSkin. There were significant ballistic issues with that design but the two gentlemen in the SafeLife booth insist it is different.

I would want to see independent testing with 5.56mm (M193 & M855), 7.62x39 (softcore & steel core), as well as .308 and .270.

[txdpd]

Is he already wearing 10x12 plates under his shirt. Because if he was serious about rifle protection he’d already be sucking it up and making it happen. If he’s not it’ll amount to a 16 pound novelty that gets worn for two weeks.

[paherne]

Google the company's address. Do street view and ask yourself if that address inspires confidence in the product. The video that shows the vest being shot shows 5.56 shots and 7.62x51 shots and THEN the spokesperson states, "It even stops AK-47 rounds." I would want to know who actually manufactures the ballistic materials and what of what materials they are constructed. One of my FIs saw the product and noted that many, many Feds have purchased this and it's the new hotness. I pointed out that DragonSkin was purchased by a number of USG entities who later wound up with egg on their face. To properly manufacture body armor, IMO, requires more than a small-business footprint with rigorous independent testing and quality control, not some guy who believes an AK round penetrates more than a 5.56 round.

Defense Lawyers
Real Estate Agents
Used Car Salesmen
Unlicensed Street-Corner XANAX Dealers
Body Armor Industry

That's the order of credibility, in my experience, from top to bottom, that you can assign to claims about their products or services. There is no trust when it comes to body armor manufacturer claims by large, well-established makers like Safariland and Point Blank. Some guy with and address of Unit #4 might have discovered the Holy Grail of body armor that will revolutionize the industry and I might run a marathon this year or get elected President.

[Wondering Beard]

Defense Lawyers
Real Estate Agents
Used Car Salesmen
Unlicensed Street-Corner XANAX Dealers
Body Armor Industry

That's the order of credibility, ...

Err, you forgot congress and the media.

[blues]

...or get elected President.

I can promise you one vote.

[paherne]

I can promise you one vote.

I'm counting on all the Bernie Bros after the DNC shanks him, again.

[blues]

I'm counting on all the Bernie Bros after the DNC shanks him, again.

You'll have AOC going for you, which is nice. :rolleyes:

[TGS]

Google the company's address. Do street view and ask yourself if that address inspires confidence in the product. The video that shows the vest being shot shows 5.56 shots and 7.62x51 shots and THEN the spokesperson states, "It even stops AK-47 rounds." I would want to know who actually manufactures the ballistic materials and what of what materials they are constructed. One of my FIs saw the product and noted that many, many Feds have purchased this and it's the new hotness. I pointed out that DragonSkin was purchased by a number of USG entities who later wound up with egg on their face. To properly manufacture body armor, IMO, requires more than a small-business footprint with rigorous independent testing and quality control, not some guy who believes an AK round penetrates more than a 5.56 round.

Defense Lawyers
Real Estate Agents
Used Car Salesmen
Unlicensed Street-Corner XANAX Dealers
Body Armor Industry

That's the order of credibility, in my experience, from top to bottom, that you can assign to claims about their products or services. There is no trust when it comes to body armor manufacturer claims by large, well-established makers like Safariland and Point Blank. Some guy with and address of Unit #4 might have discovered the Holy Grail of body armor that will revolutionize the industry and I might run a marathon this year or get elected President.

I'm not understanding the dig on their address.

SafeLife:
48179

Crye Precision:
48180

Why would the address reflect anything on the capabilities of the company? Their armor probably isn't made there....probably isn't even made by them. Like almost every other armor company in the US, they're probably a reseller of armor made to their specifications by one of the few companies in the US that actually make armor (similar to AR15s, really). Their "corporate address" is just for office space, and in their case since they're a smaller business also most likely where they are shipping from.

With that said, I have a huge problem with the armor not being independently tested and the results very clearly published. Even if it's a special threat rating and not NIJ, there needs to be some assurance other than the incredibly ambiguous claim to stop .223/5.56. They don't even specify what type 223/5.56 rounds it stops.

What feds are buying this armor?

[LittleLebowski]

DocGKR

[DocGKR]

I suggest we all re-read what Erick G and paherne wrote above....

[LittleLebowski]

What feds are buying this armor?

[A.T.Mahan]

Hi,I was curious what the consensus on this new armor is. I see that it supposedly meets Lvl3 NIJ 06 standards, however it doesn't list it being tested with. 308 fmj rounds. It also states "stops 7.62x39" and yet doesn't list a test for that either. It has a stated weight of 16 lbs. Thoughts? My brother is a city officer and was interested in this,he currently uses Safariland Hardwire soft armor for patrol. Thanks!

First, Safariland Hardwire is probably the best soft armor on the market at present. Hardwire 68, the thinner of the two variations, has been demonstrated to meet NIJ backface deformation requirements against 300gn .50AE at 1517fps, while being 0.18" thick and 0.68lb/ft^2. Hardwire 74 is slightly thicker and heavier, and even more protective. Your brother has extremely good soft armor and should keep using it.

Second, SafeLife's demonstrated knowledge of their marketspace is deeply concerning, their product is made in China (I've tracked down their suppliers, which are linked below), their products are excessively thick, heavy, and inflexible for their given protection, which is dubious due to the lack of NIJ listing, and their marketing statements are not realistically believable.

Also, the FRAS doesn't bend enough to actually provide NIJ-spec overlap. https://youtu.be/LOPFRY_ZFvk?t=59

Safelife's components are made in china:

SafeLife Concealable Armor Carrier (https://safelifedefense.com/product/multi-threat-vest/)

Chinese concealed vest (https://www.alibaba.com/product-detail/China-Xinxing-NIJ-IIIA-concealed-ballistic_60739889480.html)

SafeLife Armor panels (https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/558105015676567552/660624522415964160/safelife2.png)

China Xingxing Armor Panel (https://sc02.alicdn.com/kf/HTB1ycf3XQY2gK0jSZFgq6A5OFXae/220851578/HTB1ycf3XQY2gK0jSZFgq6A5OFXae.jpg)

SafeLife FRC (https://safelifedefense.com/product/first-response-carrier/)

Alibaba supplier for SafeLife FRC (https://www.alibaba.com/product-detail/Army-tactical-vest-body-armor-military_62011606284.html)

SafeLife MOLLE outer carrier (https://safelifedefense.com/product/tactical-carrier/)

Alibaba supplier for that carrier (https://www.alibaba.com/product-detail/outdoor-proof-police-body-armor-military_62011495422.html)

[LittleLebowski]

First, Safariland Hardwire is probably the best soft armor on the market at present. Hardwire 68, the thinner of the two variations, has been demonstrated to meet NIJ backface deformation requirements against 300gn .50AE at 1517fps, while being 0.18" thick and 0.68lb/ft^2. Hardwire 74 is slightly thicker and heavier, and even more protective. Your brother has extremely good soft armor and should keep using it.

Second, SafeLife's demonstrated knowledge of their marketspace is deeply concerning, their product is made in China (I've tracked down their suppliers, which are linked below), their products are excessively thick, heavy, and inflexible for their given protection, which is dubious due to the lack of NIJ listing, and their marketing statements are not realistically believable.

Also, the FRAS doesn't bend enough to actually provide NIJ-spec overlap. https://youtu.be/LOPFRY_ZFvk?t=59

Safelife's components are made in china:

SafeLife Concealable Armor Carrier (https://safelifedefense.com/product/multi-threat-vest/)

Chinese concealed vest (https://www.alibaba.com/product-detail/China-Xinxing-NIJ-IIIA-concealed-ballistic_60739889480.html)

SafeLife Armor panels (https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/558105015676567552/660624522415964160/safelife2.png)

China Xingxing Armor Panel (https://sc02.alicdn.com/kf/HTB1ycf3XQY2gK0jSZFgq6A5OFXae/220851578/HTB1ycf3XQY2gK0jSZFgq6A5OFXae.jpg)

SafeLife FRC (https://safelifedefense.com/product/first-response-carrier/)

Alibaba supplier for SafeLife FRC (https://www.alibaba.com/product-detail/Army-tactical-vest-body-armor-military_62011606284.html)

SafeLife MOLLE outer carrier (https://safelifedefense.com/product/tactical-carrier/)

Alibaba supplier for that carrier (https://www.alibaba.com/product-detail/outdoor-proof-police-body-armor-military_62011495422.html)

Excellent post, thank you!

DocGKR

[witchking777]

After showing him this thread he has decided to stay with his Hardwire armor. I did however find some Lvl3+ ICW Hardwire hard plates that stop m193,m855,and 7.62x39. It shows stopping m855a1 on one part of their site,and m855 on another. Does anyone know if m855a1 can legitimately be stopped by this? I'm not too worried about a perp having this,seeing as how hard it is to get,I'd just like to be 100% sure before I recommend it to him. Here's a link,thanks!

https://hardwirellc.com/products/multi-curve-plate-level-3plus-icw

[Erick Gelhaus]

Does anyone know if m855a1 can legitimately be stopped by this? I'm not too worried about a perp having this, seeing as how hard it is to get, I'd just like to be 100% sure before I recommend it to him. Here's a link, thanks!

You'll only know for sure if it has been tested against that load. And you can get the documentation of the testing.

While it probably isn't terribly common, I'd imagine the closer you are to a military installation the greater the likelihood of encountering M855A1 would be.

Knowing what my old org was and wasn't seizing in terms of calibers, and specific loads within those, did have an impact on my hard armor decisions and recommendation.

[TGS]

After showing him this thread he has decided to stay with his Hardwire armor. I did however find some Lvl3+ ICW Hardwire hard plates that stop m193,m855,and 7.62x39. It shows stopping m855a1 on one part of their site,and m855 on another. Does anyone know if m855a1 can legitimately be stopped by this? I'm not too worried about a perp having this,seeing as how hard it is to get,I'd just like to be 100% sure before I recommend it to him. Here's a link,thanks!

https://hardwirellc.com/products/multi-curve-plate-level-3plus-icw

M855A1 isn't listed in the test document, so I wouldn't depend on it to stop M855A1.

There are plates that can stop M855A1, such as the Velocity Systems PBZ (or any of the same base material plates made by Tencate), but I think they're about a pound heavier per plate than what you linked here.

[paherne]

Looks like I was correct. Unit #4 is an unlucky number; they should have picked Unit #8 when importing Chinesium excrementa.

[witchking777]

Thank you everyone for your help,I was wrong,the ICW plate shows m855a1 on Safariland's website. I won't count on that round being stopped.