DoubleTap 38 Special 148gr Hardcast Wadcutter

[4given]

Anybody try these and/or use these? They are available at my local LGS. Wondering if this is good quality ammo with decent QC.

[JodyH]

Doubletap has always been decent quality but they have done a few things that keep me away from them.
They have a habit of way overstating velocities.
They also have a habit of swapping bullet suppliers with no notice, so a round that performs great today might not be the same round you get in your next order of supposedly the exact same SKU.

I think that Underwood and Buffalo Bore are better boutique manufacturers.

If these wadcutters are a one and done purchase so you can have something to shoot or carry until you find something else, it's a pretty safe buy.
If you plan on building an ammo stash around this particular load, wait until you find some Black Hills or Buffalo Bore.
IMO

[mtnbkr]

I ran a box through my LCR a while back. It wasn't particularly memorable. A bit dirty and slightly more expensive for 50 than Federal Match Wadcutters.

Chris

[Navin Johnson]

What Military or LEO organization uses Double tap?

What Military or LEO agency uses Black Hills?

[Nightvisionary]

They are the manufacturer of the Colt Defense and Colt National Match Ammunition lines. Other than that I don't know.

[mtnbkr]

What Military or LEO organization uses Double tap?

What Military or LEO agency uses Black Hills?

What military or leo agency uses 38 special wadcutters?

Not sure what your criteria is meant to imply...

Chris

[4given]

I ran a box through my LCR a while back. It wasn't particularly memorable. A bit dirty and slightly more expensive for 50 than Federal Match Wadcutters.

Chris

I like the idea that the wadcutters used are hard cast. I looked into the Federal Gold Match but I would have to order them in but the price + shipping makes them a little pricey just to try a few. I can get the Doubletap at the LGS for about $30 for a box of 50 including tax. Did they seem to be loaded a little hotter than some?

[4given]

Doubletap has always been decent quality but they have done a few things that keep me away from them.
They have a habit of way overstating velocities.
They also have a habit of swapping bullet suppliers with no notice, so a round that performs great today might not be the same round you get in your next order of supposedly the exact same SKU.

I think that Underwood and Buffalo Bore are better boutique manufacturers.

If these wadcutters are a one and done purchase so you can have something to shoot or carry until you find something else, it's a pretty safe buy.
If you plan on building an ammo stash around this particular load, wait until you find some Black Hills or Buffalo Bore.
IMO

Thanks for your input.

I would buy one box and test them in my wife's M638. If all is good I would probably but one more box for stash and reload a duplicate for her practice loads.

[Navin Johnson]

What military or leo agency uses 38 special wadcutters?

Not sure what your criteria is meant to imply...

Chris

It is about QC. Black Hills should not be used in the same sentence as DT, Underwood, BB, Cor-Bon etc. Those companies market to Unicorn chasers (nothing against a company for understanding the average inter-web ammo forum reader).

[BehindBlueI's]

What Military or LEO organization uses Double tap?

What Military or LEO agency uses Black Hills?

The US Military uses Black Hills for certain applications: https://www.shootingtimes.com/editorial/special-forces-to-civilians-black-hills-mk-262-mod-1-review/99098

I don't know anyone using Double Tap.

[mtnbkr]

Did they seem to be loaded a little hotter than some?
Not that I noticed, but I was shooting them side-by-side with BB wadcutters and Speer 135gr Short Barrel Gold Dot.

Chris

[mtnbkr]

It is about QC. Black Hills should not be used in the same sentence as DT, Underwood, BB, Cor-Bon etc. Those companies market to Unicorn chasers (nothing against a company for understanding the average inter-web ammo forum reader).

First, he's talking about one of the lowest tech loads around, the 38 Special lead wadcutter. It's hardly a unicorn load or even particularly remarkable. Second, the companies mentioned aren't fly-by-night reloaders. While they're not necessarily top tier brands (though the BB stuff does have its applications), they shouldn't be considered untrustworthy. Finally, I assume this means you've never had a bad round from one of the vendors who sell to Military and LEO organizations? I haven't, but I've seen examples where others have.

Considering we're talking about 38 Special wadcutter loads presumably for recreational or target shooting, I'd have no concerns about any nationally known and sold brand. Self-defense-oriented loads using boutique hollow points? Sure. Let's stick to what DocGKR has proven to be good.

Chris

[Navin Johnson]

First, he's talking about one of the lowest tech loads around, the 38 Special lead wadcutter. It's hardly a unicorn load or even particularly remarkable. Second, the companies mentioned aren't fly-by-night reloaders. While they're not necessarily top tier brands (though the BB stuff does have its applications), they shouldn't be considered untrustworthy. Finally, I assume this means you've never had a bad round from one of the vendors who sell to Military and LEO organizations? I haven't, but I've seen examples where others have.

Considering we're talking about 38 Special wadcutter loads presumably for recreational or target shooting, I'd have no concerns about any nationally known and sold brand. Self-defense-oriented loads using boutique hollow points? Sure. Let's stick to what DocGKR has proven to be good.

Chris

Sorry my mistake,. I didn't realize from reading the original post that he was talking about Target or recreational shooting.

Many people on this forum carry full wad cutters in their J frames for protection..... Where the highest quality control and consistency would be desirable.

To the OP..... I find federal and Winchester match wad cutters to be very accurate from my J frames and hit two point of aim. Avoid any wadcutter above 650 FPS to 700 FPS out of a 15 oz or lighter revolver as they are not pleasant. You can find the above online for reasonable prices.

As always when looking for a accurate recreational load probably best to buy multiple brands of ammunition and see what works best in your gun.

[4given]

Sorry my mistake,. I didn't realize from reading the original post that he was talking about Target or recreational shooting.

Many people on this forum carry full wad cutters in their J frames for protection..... Where the highest quality control and consistency would be desirable.

To the OP..... I find federal and Winchester match wad cutters to be very accurate from my J frames and hit two point of aim. Avoid any wadcutter above 650 FPS to 700 FPS out of a 15 oz or lighter revolver as they are not pleasant. You can find the above online for reasonable prices.

As always when looking for a accurate recreational load probably best to buy multiple brands of ammunition and see what works best in your gun.

Actually I am considering it for use in my wife's J frame for protection. I am considering it due to the following:

1. It utilizes a hard cast full wadcutter.
2. It is locally available at an OK price
3. It is factory produced ammo. (I could handload hard cast wadcutters to my own specification with all the superior QA/QC my 50+ years of precision reloading experience could provide and be perfectly confident and comfortable with the result but I take the advice of the experts and only use factory ammo for SD for legal reasons)

I just want to know if I can expect decent QA/QC from the DoubleTap loading and if anybody has any actual experience with this load or DoubleTap in general.

[mtnbkr]

Actually I am considering it for use in my wife's J frame for protection. I am considering it due to the following:

1. It utilizes a hard cast full wadcutter.
2. It is locally available at an OK price
3. It is factory produced ammo. (I could handload hard cast wadcutters to my own specification with all the superior QA/QC my 50+ years of precision reloading experience could provide and be perfectly confident and comfortable with the result but I take the advice of the experts and only use factory ammo for SD for legal reasons)

I just want to know if I can expect decent QA/QC from the DoubleTap loading and if anybody has any actual experience with this load or DoubleTap in general.

My sample of 1 box seemed fine. Shot like any other factory wadcutter. Beyond that, I have no experience with Doubletap. It appears to be bog standard SAAMI spec full wadcutter ammo. No frills, nothing unusual, no outrageous claims. That said, the one box I bought wasn't that much cheaper than Federal's wadcutter load that's vetted and trusted around here.

Chris

[JodyH]

Actually I am considering it for use in my wife's J frame for protection. I am considering it due to the following:

1. It utilizes a hard cast full wadcutter.
2. It is locally available at an OK price
3. It is factory produced ammo. (I could handload hard cast wadcutters to my own specification with all the superior QA/QC my 50+ years of precision reloading experience could provide and be perfectly confident and comfortable with the result but I take the advice of the experts and only use factory ammo for SD for legal reasons)

I just want to know if I can expect decent QA/QC from the DoubleTap loading and if anybody has any actual experience with this load or DoubleTap in general.

That particular DoubleTap load will suit your purposes just fine.
Buy, shoot and carry with confidence.

DoubleTap has never been known for poor quality, they just have a reputation for selling the sizzle instead of the steak (especially in calibers that tend to attract people who like style over substance. Like 10mm and 357Sig "fans").

[jtcarm]

The Federal GMM wadcutter consistently penetrates to 16” from a 2” barrel in whatever you call the jello.

I see absolutely no need for greater BH or velocity.

[Lester Polfus]

The Federal GMM wadcutter consistently penetrates to 16” from a 2” barrel in whatever you call the jello.

I see absolutely no need for greater BH or velocity.

That's kind of the conclusion I've come to as well.

Theoretically, the harder faster wadcutter might offer better intermediate barrier penetration, but I've never seen that idea validated by somebody that knows what they are doing, and if you are worried about intermediate barrier penetration, you should choose something other than a .38 Special wadcutter.

[4given]

From the good Doctor's sticky "BUG's: .380 ACP vs. .38 Sp"

"Target wadcutters offer good penetration, cut tissue efficiently, and have relatively mild recoil. With wadcutters harder alloys and sharper leading edges are the way to go. Wadcutters perform exactly the same in both bare and 4 layer denim covered gel when fired from a 2" J-frame.

When faced with too little penetration, as is common with lightweight .38 Sp JHP loads or too much penetration like with the wadcutters, then go with penetration. Agencies around here have used the Winchester 148 gr standard pressure lead target wadcutter (X38SMRP), as well as the Federal (GM38A) version--both work. A sharper edged wadcutter would even be better... Dr. Fackler has written in Fackler ML: "The Full Wadcutter--An Extremely Effective Bullet Design", Wound Ballistics Review. 4(2):6-7, Fall 1999)"

Since I can't find any Federal GM38A anywhere right now that is not $45 - $50 for one box shipped, I'm going to go ahead and buy a box of the DoubleTap and give them a try. I've got some Speer 135gr +P on the way too. It will be interesting to see how the compare in recoil and POA/POI.

[Navin Johnson]

From the good Doctor's sticky "BUG's: .380 ACP vs. .38 Sp"

"Target wadcutters offer good penetration, cut tissue efficiently, and have relatively mild recoil. With wadcutters harder alloys and sharper leading edges are the way to go. Wadcutters perform exactly the same in both bare and 4 layer denim covered gel when fired from a 2" J-frame.

When faced with too little penetration, as is common with lightweight .38 Sp JHP loads or too much penetration like with the wadcutters, then go with penetration. Agencies around here have used the Winchester 148 gr standard pressure lead target wadcutter (X38SMRP), as well as the Federal (GM38A) version--both work. A sharper edged wadcutter would even be better... Dr. Fackler has written in Fackler ML: "The Full Wadcutter--An Extremely Effective Bullet Design", Wound Ballistics Review. 4(2):6-7, Fall 1999)"

Since I can't find any Federal GM38A anywhere right now that is not $45 - $50 for one box shipped, I'm going to go ahead and buy a box of the DoubleTap and give them a try. I've got some Speer 135gr +P on the way too. It will be interesting to see how the compare in recoil and POA/POI.

Winchester super match 148 WC work also....especially as the last time I bought 4 boxes for like $90 shipped. I trust Federal more and will buy those when i find a good price. The Winchester have been accurate and reliable for me.

[4given]

Winchester super match 148 WC work also....especially as the last time I bought 4 boxes for like $90 shipped. I trust Federal more and will buy those when i find a good price. The Winchester have been accurate and reliable for me.

Thanks for the tip. I seem to recall that several folks on this board have reported a decline in the reliability of Winchester ammo lately.

[4given]

Well I went to the LGS and they only had one box or the DoubleTap left so I snagged it.

Using the time honored "fingernail test" I couldn't dent or scratch the surface of the bullet. (the manufacturer claims a 21BHN hardness) The top of the bullet is completely flat and appears to be a full wadcutter with sharp leading edge. I will most likely pull the bullet on one of them to get a better look.

Just for fun here are some pictures of the box I bought:

https://i.imgur.com/8xN9Hqk.jpg

https://i.imgur.com/F3puhCA.jpg

https://i.imgur.com/VTAjL0d.jpg

https://i.imgur.com/wGot9Q7.jpg

[Navin Johnson]

Thanks for the tip. I seem to recall that several folks on this board have reported a decline in the reliability of Winchester ammo lately.

My reason for looking for Federal next.....

[the Schwartz]

Well I went to the LGS and they only had one box or the DoubleTap left so I snagged it.

Using the time honored "fingernail test" I couldn't dent or scratch the surface of the bullet. (the manufacturer claims a 21BHN hardness) The top of the bullet is completely flat and appears to be a full wadcutter with sharp leading edge. I will most likely pull the bullet on one of them to get a better look.

Just for fun here are some pictures of the box I bought:

https://i.imgur.com/8xN9Hqk.jpg

https://i.imgur.com/F3puhCA.jpg

https://i.imgur.com/VTAjL0d.jpg

https://i.imgur.com/wGot9Q7.jpg

4given-

I hope that these work out for you and your wife. I recommended them in the other thread running in the Ammunition sub-forum with the thought that the 21BHN hardness of the DT wadcutter would help to mitigate profile deformation of the projectile after passing through intermediate barriers so that whatever "sharpness" or definition of the leading edge of the wadcutter exists mighy be preserved for any terminal effect that it might offer.

[4given]

My reason for looking for Federal next.....


Yeah the Federals are as scarce as hen's teeth right now

[4given]

4given-

I hope that these work out for you and your wife. I recommended them in the other thread running in the Ammunition sub-forum with the thought that the 21BHN hardness of the DT wadcutter would help to mitigate profile deformation of the projectile after passing through intermediate barriers so that whatever "sharpness" or definition of the leading edge of the wadcutter exists mighy be preserved for any terminal effect that it might offer.

Thanks Charles. As long as the recoil isn't too bad they should work out fine. I'll try to throw a few over my chronograph and report here for reference.

[the Schwartz]

Thanks Charles. As long as the recoil isn't too bad they should work out fine. I'll try to throw a few over my chronograph and report here for reference.

Thanks, I'd enjoy seeing how fast they are out of your 638. Just make sure to save enough for your future needs.

[4given]

Thanks, I'd enjoy seeing how fast they are out of your 638. Just make sure to save enough for your future needs.

Will do. I found another box online so I ordered it this morning. Even these seem to be getting scarce.