New Mexico Reciprocity Issues

[Jakus]

Saw this on another forum. Thought I'd get some opinions from the NM guys here.

http://www.dps.nm.org/index.php/nm-concealed-carry/reciprocity-agreements/

Looks like NM is dropping lots of reciprocity agreements using the "similar requirements" language. In turn, states NM drops are dropping their reciprocity agreements as well.

I can't confirm it anywhere else, but according to the NM state link on http://www.handgunlaw.us/ Texas will be ending their agreement in response.

I end up in Albuquerque several times a year on business, and this would really tick me off if it doesn't get fixed. Why all the sudden changes? New guy at the state department causing trouble?

[gringop]

"generally found six things that make a state substantially different from New Mexico, and therefore would disqualify that state from being recognized:

Permits issued locally rather than by the state;
No fingerprint-based background check;
Permits issued to persons under 21 years of age;
Permits issued to resident aliens;
No classroom (static) training required;
No live-fire (dynamic) training required."

I'm not sure what NM doesn't like about Texas CHL regs, maybe the resident alien thing or permits issued to 18 year old MIL members. Texas had CHL in 1995, with some of the most stringent restrictions in US. If NM thinks that Texas CHL laws are too lax, they are smoking crack. I will continue to legally carry on my bike when I haul ass through NM to vacation in CO.

Gringop

[LHS]

Saw this on another forum. Thought I'd get some opinions from the NM guys here.

http://www.dps.nm.org/index.php/nm-concealed-carry/reciprocity-agreements/

Looks like NM is dropping lots of reciprocity agreements using the "similar requirements" language. In turn, states NM drops are dropping their reciprocity agreements as well.

I can't confirm it anywhere else, but according to the NM state link on http://www.handgunlaw.us/ Texas will be ending their agreement in response.

I end up in Albuquerque several times a year on business, and this would really tick me off if it doesn't get fixed. Why all the sudden changes? New guy at the state department causing trouble?

Son of a...

Arizona has ended their reciprocity. Why are we 'substantially different'? AZ permits have all the same requirements as NM, we just have 'constitutional carry' for people who don't want to get a permit. I can see NM not accepting that, but an AZ permit is issued by the state, still requires fingerprint background checks, classroom and live fire training, and being 21. I wonder if it's the 'resident alien' thing?

So much for my green chile fix...

[JDM]

Son of a bitch.

[F-Trooper05]

Alaska meets all of those requirements. I'd love to know what "substantially similar" is. I'm just glad Alaska recognizes all citizens' rights to defend themselves regardless of where they come from (including Canadians). The whole tit for tat thing (IE: Texas) is rediculous. New Mexican tourists shouldn't be punished just because their politicians are retards.

[ToddG]

So which states retain reciprocity with NM, and does NM have a non-resident permit?

[Jakus]

So which states retain reciprocity with NM, and does NM have a non-resident permit?

I typically use http://www.handgunlaw.us/ to research states for travel. It may not be 100% correct, but I have found it to be relatively accurate. If you click on a state it will give you a pdf summary of state law.

According to the site New Mexico does not issue non-resident permits

Also, here are the supposed changes in questions. I copied and pasted the from their New Mexico specific pdf

3/23/12 – New Mexico no Longer Honors Virginia and Florida. VA Will still honor NM but FL Will no Longer Honor NM.
4/4/12 – Warning on who NM Honors added to top of page.
4/6/12 – New Mexico No Longer Honors Alaska, Kentucky, Montana, South Carolina and Wyoming.
4/27/12 – NM No Longer Honors Arizona.
4/30/12 – New Mexico has dropped Arkansas, Colorado, Delaware, Kansas, Louisiana, Michigan, Ohio, Tennessee, Texas & West Virginia from the list of states they honor. Arkansas, Colorado, Delaware, Louisiana Ohio, Texas & West Virginia will drop New Mexico.

[JDM]

So which states retain reciprocity with NM, and does NM have a non-resident permit?

No Non-res permits.

Oklahoma, Nebraska, Arkansas, North Carolina, and Missouri are the only states recognized by NM now.

With North Dakota pending apparently.

**CENSORED**

[SamuelBLong]

The handgun laws in this state... if you only knew...We seem to be regressing in the progress made just a few short years ago. I'll be contacting the Gov. Martinez... she's pro gun and shot a perfect score on her permit test last year. I'm making sure to bring up the issue to all state reps running for office.

National Concealed Carry Reciprocity. We need it signed.

Todd, I'm not sure you could even get one if you're an approved CCW instructor from out of state. Jody may know a bit more as he is an approved NM instructor and I think knows a couple guys at DPS.

Since it is in such a constant state of flux, check your reciprocity here (the OP's link):
NM DPS CC Reciprocity Info (http://www.dps.nm.org/index.php/nm-concealed-carry/reciprocity-agreements/)

[JodyH]

New head of the DPS CCW unit is flexing his anti gun muscle.
He will be shut down by Gov. Martinez.
Hopefully before he screws things up even worse.
Hes already set us back several years.

Sent from my MB860 using Tapatalk 2

[RoyGBiv]

Edited to add cross post with permission from OP...
Call-to-action request from TexasCHL Forum...
The site owner is the OP of this LINKED thread (http://texaschlforum.com/viewtopic.php?f=9&t=54787).
Mr. Cotton is a former LEO, currently he's a Lawyer as well as a member of the NRA Board of Directors.


It's unusual to put out a call-to-action outside a Texas legislative session, but we need to let the New Mexico Governor, Attorney General and Dept. of Public Safety know the unwarranted cancellation of reciprocity with Texas is not setting well with Texans who now have to change their vacation/travel plans and not enter New Mexico. Texas and New Mexico have enjoyed reciprocity for seven years without any problems to justify this change. There is no legitimate rationale for this action and we are hearing only excuses. New Mexico officials have stated that the only reason they cancelled reciprocity with Texas is because we do not require U.S. Citizenship, but denying a license to a legal resident alien (Green Card alien) is probably unconstitutional. This position was stated by a New Mexico DPS official and no mention was made of issuing CHL's to persons under age 21.

New Mexico's House and Senate have a Democrat majority, as well as a very strange committee/committee referral system for bills. A legislative fix is highly unlikely, so we must put pressure on administrative bureaucrats to reverse this ill-advised action. Unless the message comes through loud and clear that this arbitrary act is going to cost New Mexico in terms of tourism, we will not see reciprocity with New Mexico in the foreseeable future.

Please call each of the offices listed below. As always, be polite and respectful and let them know you will not visit New Mexico until they reestablish reciprocity with Texas.

Thanks,
Chas.

New Mexico DPS 505-841-8053
Governor's office 505-476-2200
Attorney General's office 505-827-6000
New Mexico Dept of Tourism 505-827-7400

Be polite, but don't be shy.

If anyone has any relevant email addresses, please post them.

[JDM]

New head of the DPS CCW unit is flexing his anti gun muscle.
He will be shut down by Gov. Martinez.
Hopefully before he screws things up even worse.
Hes already set us back several years.

Sent from my MB860 using Tapatalk 2

What are the chances of this getting "un-done?"

[JFK]

New head of the DPS CCW unit is flexing his anti gun muscle.
He will be shut down by Gov. Martinez.
Hopefully before he screws things up even worse.
Hes already set us back several years.

Sent from my MB860 using Tapatalk 2

Unfortunately he is within the law. It would have to be changed to stop him, or he would have to go back on it. If your scrutinize the statue we should not have reciprocity with any of the states because as far as I know we are the only CCW Permit that has a "caliber qualification" If you come from another state how do we know what caliber you qualified with? Not trying to give them any more ideas, but or CCW laws are written by half wits anyway and are full of "similar requirements" holes. Same thing with the revolver / auto designation.

[JodyH]

Unfortunately he is within the law. It would have to be changed to stop him, or he would have to go back on it.
He is appointed to his position and serves in that position at the pleasure of the Governor.
With enough pressure on the Gov. and other elected legislators his arbitrary decisions will be rescinded or he'll be demoted and his replacement will reverse the course until we can get legislative guidelines for reciprocity.


Sent from my MB860 using Tapatalk 2

[JFK]

He is appointed to his position and serves in that position at the pleasure of the Governor.
With enough pressure on the Gov. and other elected legislators his arbitrary decisions will be rescinded or he'll be demoted and his replacement will reverse the course until we can get legislative guidelines for reciprocity.


Sent from my MB860 using Tapatalk 2

Legislation clarity would be best. There is some really silly language that can get people in to trouble. I.E. only one concealed weapon. That pocket knife you carry everywhere could become a felony with an over zealous DA.

[JodyH]

http://www.dps.nm.org/index.php/nm-concealed-carry/reciprocity-agreements/
The DPS is showing signs of caving to public pressure.
Calls and emails to the DPS CC Unit and the Governors office are appreciated.
I called earlier and spoke to one of my contacts and he said they have been slammed with angry permit holders all day.
Time to turn the volume knob to 11.
I have my state rep mad as hell (she took her permit class from me).
We will get this hammered down until we can get legislative clarification.

Sent from my GT-P7510 using Tapatalk 2

[JDM]

They seem to be back pedaling pretty frantically now. Good.

[F-Trooper05]

http://www.dps.nm.org/index.php/nm-concealed-carry/reciprocity-agreements/
The DPS is showing signs of caving to public pressure.
Calls and emails to the DPS CC Unit and the Governors office are appreciated.
I called earlier and spoke to one of my contacts and he said they have been slammed with angry permit holders all day.
Time to turn the volume knob to 11.
I have my state rep mad as hell (she took her permit class from me).
We will get this hammered down until we can get legislative clarification.

Sent from my GT-P7510 using Tapatalk 2

Hmm, looks like the State of Alaska needs to update it's website. It says we have resiprocity in NM...

http://www.dps.state.ak.us/Statewide/PermitsLicensing/reciprocity.aspx

[Shellback]

If your scrutinize the statue we should not have reciprocity with any of the states because as far as I know we are the only CCW Permit that has a "caliber qualification" If you come from another state how do we know what caliber you qualified with? Not trying to give them any more ideas, but or CCW laws are written by half wits anyway and are full of "similar requirements" holes. Same thing with the revolver / auto designation.

Nevada had the same requirements with caliber and auto/revolver until about 6 months ago. NM doesn't allow Nevada residents to carry there but they can here as far as I know.

[LHS]

Wow, that was fast. They've already said that AZ permits are good there again, but AZ's website doesn't reflect the change yet. It stands to reason, since NM's website changed sometime this afternoon.

[RoyGBiv]

http://www.dps.nm.org/index.php/nm-concealed-carry/reciprocity-agreements/
As of this morning.....


First, it is important to note that the Department of Public Safety has not made final decisions to change reciprocity agreements or recognition of other states, but rather DPS is conducting an audit of those statutes to ensure compliance with New Mexico state law.

The information on this web page differentiates those states that have concealed carry laws that are substantially similar to New Mexico’s law (or more stringent) from those that do not. For those states that have had reciprocity agreements with New Mexico, but do not now have a similar law to ours, NM DPS will contact those states to clarify which permit holders from that state are not allowed to carry a concealed weapon in New Mexico. This will not affect the vast majority of permit holders in states with current reciprocity agreements.

<snip>

As we continue our audit and make changes accordingly, this page will be updated to reflect the most current information. This information is current as of May 1, 2012

New Mexico currently recognizes concealed carry permits from or has reciprocal agreements with the following states: Arizona, Arkansas, Colorado, Delaware, Florida, Kansas, Louisiana, Michigan, Mississippi, Missouri, Nebraska, North Carolina, North Dakota, Ohio, Oklahoma, Tennessee, Texas, Virginia and West Virginia.Emphasis added.

That's a huge rollback from the day before. :cool:

In TX we issue carry permits to resident aliens (green card holders) and military members and veterans age 18 and older. I would like to see these groups protected, but it looks like, for now, NM will try to carve them out of the reciprocity agreement. FYI, GC holders (under Federal law) have the same rights as US Citizens except the right to vote.... I suspect GC holders have some grounds for a suit if NM sticks with this carve-out, but, IANAL.

[fixer]

Glad it looks like NM authorities are clarifying, if not re-thinking, things.

I really wish Nevada would allow more reciprocity with other states. It really sucks not carrying when I travel to Nevada.

[Ray Keith]

There have been some well placed "questions" to key people in New Mexico in the last couple of days from important folks in the State regarding this issue. There is some back pedaling going on, let's hope it sticks.